Audizine - An Automotive Enthusiast Community

Results 1 to 24 of 24
  1. #1
    Established Member Two Rings dachmt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 10 2014
    AZ Member #
    138634
    Location
    San Francisco, CA

    Check engine errors P0010 P0012 and vibration

    Guest-only advertisement. Register or Log In now!
    So I got 2 errors from my OBD-2 right now:
    • P0010: "A" Camshaft position actuator circuit/open (bank 1)
    • P0012: "A" Camshaft position - timing over-retarded (bank 1)


    It seems that when colder it vibrates more. When I push the car a bit it gets better. When driving, no vibrations felt, it's mostly when stopped (automatic transmission). When in neutral, it doesn't vibrate much either. The car handles great in general, easy to start, no idling or anything like that. Just like normal, but vibrate slightly more and have the light on.

    For P0012, I've not really either of this symptoms then http://www.obd-codes.com/p0012

    Any lead on how to investigate that? Any ideas? I've never put my hands into engines yet, so I'm a newbie but want to learn (like I did with the suspensions).

    PS: the timing belt and water pump have been changed a month and half ago.

    Thanks,

  2. #2
    Veteran Member Four Rings SJorge3442's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 27 2013
    AZ Member #
    121842
    Location
    Philly

    the p0010 is probably causing the P0012. Get yourself a new camshaft position sensor.
    2017 A4 6 Speed - Sport Plus - Mythos Black
    2018 Q5 - Prestige - Manhattan Grey

  3. #3
    Veteran Member Four Rings texasboy21's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 01 2007
    AZ Member #
    16891
    My Garage
    1983 Chevy Silverado
    Location
    houston texas

    Quote Originally Posted by SJorge3442 View Post
    the p0010 is probably causing the P0012. Get yourself a new camshaft position sensor.
    I had the same code. Replace the camshaft position sensor and you should be good to go. Its under the timing belt cover and a ten minute swap.
    2019 SQ5 Prestige
    2016 S3 Prestige - Eurodyne Maestro ECU + TCU, REVO downpipe, air box mods, Bilstein B12 w/ EuroSport camber kit, 034 RCO + RSB
    2005.5 A4 2.0t "Stage 3" - Pag Parts rods/inlet pipe/FMIC/manifold/downpipe + Borg Warner EFR 6758 + Stasis cup kit + StopTech 332mm BBK + Eurodyne Maestro + Eurodyne Boost Manager Plus

  4. #4
    Established Member Two Rings dachmt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 10 2014
    AZ Member #
    138634
    Location
    San Francisco, CA

    I found this one, fast shipping in Prime and cheap: http://amzn.com/B0011ADEYM

    Do you guys know is bank 1 on 2003 A4 B6 is driver or passenger side? And there is one sensor only right?

  5. #5
    Veteran Member Four Rings old guy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 28 2006
    AZ Member #
    14483
    My Garage
    '13 A5, '24 Tiguan SEL R-Line
    Location
    Western Maryland

    Quote Originally Posted by dachmt View Post
    I found this one, fast shipping in Prime and cheap: http://amzn.com/B0011ADEYM

    Do you guys know is bank 1 on 2003 A4 B6 is driver or passenger side? And there is one sensor only right?
    The 1.8T only has one exhaust line and one catalytic converter. Consequently it only has one bank.

    The catalytic converter is controlled by two O2 sensors (B1S1 and B1S2) or bank one sensor one and bank one sensor two. B1S1 is the front wideband sensor that controls the A/F mix and B1S2 is the rear sensor that monitors the catalytic converter.

    The 1.8T only has one intake cam so it only has one intake cam sensor.

    A 3.0 has two exhaust lines and two cats so it has a B1S1 / B1S2 one one side and a B2S1 / B2S2 on the other side.

  6. #6
    Established Member Two Rings dachmt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 10 2014
    AZ Member #
    138634
    Location
    San Francisco, CA

    Thanks for the explanation old guy. I've been reading a bit and understand better now.

    As far as my errors, I'm receiving my new sensor today, so just wanted to know if you guys can tell me where that sensor is located in a A4 B6 1.8T? Is it under the timing belt cover? I found a tutorial here http://www.pelicanparts.com/techarti...eplacement.htm but it is for a B5, not a B6, so I wonder if the process is the same (location and tools needed), if so that would be awesome I would just need to follow. Even tho I would not move the radiator support panel like if his DIY, so it might be trickier.

  7. #7
    Veteran Member Four Rings PreciseD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 05 2014
    AZ Member #
    143391
    Location
    USA

    Quote Originally Posted by dachmt View Post
    Thanks for the explanation old guy. I've been reading a bit and understand better now.

    As far as my errors, I'm receiving my new sensor today, so just wanted to know if you guys can tell me where that sensor is located in a A4 B6 1.8T? Is it under the timing belt cover? I found a tutorial here http://www.pelicanparts.com/techarti...eplacement.htm but it is for a B5, not a B6, so I wonder if the process is the same (location and tools needed), if so that would be awesome I would just need to follow. Even tho I would not move the radiator support panel like if his DIY, so it might be trickier.
    Here

    And HERE

  8. #8
    Established Member Two Rings dachmt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 10 2014
    AZ Member #
    138634
    Location
    San Francisco, CA

    Cool, that confirms what I was thinking. Just need to buy some tools and I'll do the job hopefully tonight on my work parking lot :)

  9. #9
    Established Member Two Rings dachmt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 10 2014
    AZ Member #
    138634
    Location
    San Francisco, CA

    Alright, I think that's my last DIY. Everything went well at the beginning and seemed easy, found where things were.

    Then...

    I remove the connector, I lost the clip in the engine. Any idea what is the part number for that one? How to get a new one?
    Worse then happened. I removed the first bolt with the ratchet and 10mm socket, it went "ok" and I did that with both. Then I removed the sensor, and I thought it was all good. What I didn't realized is that both bolts broke, and so there is no way to remove the remaining part inside. So I cannot put back any of my sensor (old or new).

    So now I have to broken bolts, one connector clip gone, and a car out of service.

    Please help me, part numbers and what's best to do? I guess I have no other options than to tow the car and bring it to a shop at that point.

    AAAAAAAAAHHHH

  10. #10
    Veteran Member Four Rings walky_talky20's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 30 2008
    AZ Member #
    30427
    Location
    Erie, Pennsylvania

    Quote Originally Posted by PreciseD View Post
    • P0010: "A" Camshaft position actuator circuit/open (bank 1)
    • P0012: "A" Camshaft position - timing over-retarded (bank 1)
    Quote Originally Posted by SJorge3442 View Post
    the p0010 is probably causing the P0012. Get yourself a new camshaft position sensor.
    Quote Originally Posted by texasboy21 View Post
    I had the same code. Replace the camshaft position sensor and you should be good to go. Its under the timing belt cover and a ten minute swap.
    Not to add insult to injury here, but I would be remiss if I did not point out that neither of those codes is generally caused by a faulty Camshaft Position Sensor.

    SJorge was correct in saying that "p0010 is probably causing the p0012". But let's take another look at the codes here:

    "Camshaft Position Actuator circuit open - Bank 1" is the code. This has a very specific meaning. Namely that there is a circuit fault (in this case an OPEN) on the circuit for the Camshaft Position Actuator. Pretty simple.

    Let's take note that it does not refer to a sensor (something that "senses"), rather it refers to an actuator. Actuator: A device that is responsible for moving or controlling a mechanism or system. In this case it is controlling Camshaft "A" - the intake camshaft.

    In the Audi 1.8 Liter Turbocharged engine, the intake camshaft position is variable across a range of approximately 22 degrees. This variable movement is controlled by an actuator known as the Camshaft Chain Adjuster, sometimes referred to as the Camshaft Chain Tensioner - as it is also responsible for tensioning the chain.

    The actuator itself is not continuously variable, but rather an on/off affair based on applied oil pressure. This oil pressure is controlled by an electrical solenoid mounted directly on the Camshaft Chain Adjuster. This solenoid is how the ECU is able to control the variable movement of the camshaft between it's 2 extreme positions. It is controlled via the electrical circuit to the solenoid integral to the Adjuster.

    It is a fault within the electrical circuit to this solenoid which is the cause of code P0010. The most common causes for an "open circuit" code would be that the solenoid itself is unplugged from it's electrical connector, or the fuse is blown for the circuit. The solenoid does happen to have it's very own fuse. In the case of a blown fuse, this will disrupt nothing else other than Camshaft Position Actuation.

    Once the fuse is blown (or the circuit is otherwise opened), the Camshaft Chain Adjuster is no longer able to actuate, and thus defaults to the fully retarded position. Commands from the ECU to "Advance" the camshaft by 22 degrees will be futile as the solenoid simply will not energize. This will result in code P0012 - "Intake camshaft timing over-retarded (advance setpoint not reached)".

    Because the feedback loop for intake Camshaft Advance is via the Camshaft Position Sensor, the presence of these 2 codes actually reinforce that the sensor is working properly, not that it has failed.

    It would be my recommendation to reinstall the cam position sensor and it's connector, and proceed with checking the connector and fuse for the Camshaft Chain Adjuster control solenoid circuit. The Bentley manual lays out a simple procedure for checking all aspects of the solenoid control circuit using an LED test light.
    ^Don't listen to this guy, he's not even a mechanic.
    2001 Laser Red A4 1.8TQM, 5-Speed Swapped, 4.11 Final Drive, APR 93, 2.5" Exhaust, ST Coilovers, 034 RSB, A8 Brakes Front & Rear
    2006 Passion Red Volvo V50 T5 AWD 6MT
    2000 Satin Silver Passat 1.8T FWD Wagon, Slippy Tiptronic, 15" Hubcaps
    2001 Aluminum Silver Metallic A4 Avant 1.8TQM (winter sled)

  11. #11
    Established Member Two Rings dachmt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 10 2014
    AZ Member #
    138634
    Location
    San Francisco, CA

    Quote Originally Posted by walky_talky20 View Post
    It would be my recommendation to reinstall the cam position sensor and it's connector, and proceed with checking the connector and fuse for the Camshaft Chain Adjuster control solenoid circuit. The Bentley manual lays out a simple procedure for checking all aspects of the solenoid control circuit using an LED test light.
    Thanks for the info. I think like I said I'll let the pro do their job and I'll do mine, but stop trying to be too curious. It's on its way to the shop, they'll charge me a ton load of money but at least I won't worry, my error codes will be gone and I'll stop breaking things and end-up in annoying situations.

    I'll stay curious tho, but will think more about doing it at the shop than doing it myself now, that's my lesson of the day.

  12. #12
    Veteran Member Four Rings walky_talky20's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 30 2008
    AZ Member #
    30427
    Location
    Erie, Pennsylvania

    To save you a bit of money, the car should still run fine - even with the camshaft position sensor uninstalled. You can drive it in for repair.

    Just be absolutely sure you didn't drop anything down the belt cover (like your missing clip) - and the broken halves of the bolts have no chance of vibrating out and falling into the belt path.
    ^Don't listen to this guy, he's not even a mechanic.
    2001 Laser Red A4 1.8TQM, 5-Speed Swapped, 4.11 Final Drive, APR 93, 2.5" Exhaust, ST Coilovers, 034 RSB, A8 Brakes Front & Rear
    2006 Passion Red Volvo V50 T5 AWD 6MT
    2000 Satin Silver Passat 1.8T FWD Wagon, Slippy Tiptronic, 15" Hubcaps
    2001 Aluminum Silver Metallic A4 Avant 1.8TQM (winter sled)

  13. #13
    Established Member Two Rings dachmt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 10 2014
    AZ Member #
    138634
    Location
    San Francisco, CA

    So I decided to have it all checked and repaired by the "best" Audi garage in town, and turns out I have $2200 dollars less on my bank account, here's the description of the work and issues:
    https://db.tt/EUJi0bV4

    Today I've done a check with my OBD-2, and I still have P0010 (Intake camshaft position actuator circuit / open (bank 1)), P0012 (intake camshaft position timing - over-retarded Bank 1)) and a new one P0171 (System too lean (bank 1)). Can P0010 and P0012 be due to the wiring issue cited at the bottom (wiring harness)? If yes, I'd understand to have them still here if the harness is brittle like said, if not I'd be really upset.

    Can you guys tell me with the description of the repairs and that I still have my light on what's going on? Did I get rip off? Did they repair maybe something not necessary (like the timing chain tensioner?), things that don't seem right to you in general?

    I just really have a bad feeling with these guys, I'm ok paying expensive for people working great, but when I see that I always have to come back to do "further checks", always have issues and my previous issues are still here I don't think that's right.

    Please let me know, thanks!

  14. #14
    Senior Member Two Rings AlyAudi03's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 10 2012
    AZ Member #
    102008
    Location
    Waco, TX

    So did they actually replace the solenoid, or just suggest it? I don't remember seeing it as a repair on the invoice. Also, what's that charge on the timing chain tensioner? Timing Belt tensioner??? Did they not replace the tensioner when you had the belt done originally. Sorry I saw that and got really confused. . .

    Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk
    Last edited by AlyAudi03; 04-30-2014 at 07:45 PM.

  15. #15
    Veteran Member Four Rings walky_talky20's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 30 2008
    AZ Member #
    30427
    Location
    Erie, Pennsylvania

    Holy crap. $827 for the tensioner (is where all your moneys went). Craziness. Especially when the tensioner wasn't the problem, just the solenoid - which takes 10 minutes to change and can be had for nearly free. You had better have gotten a genuine Audi tensioner for that price.

    And $67 for the Suction Jet Pump? The car legitimately doesn't even need that item.

    I'm so glad I do my own work and am not at the mercy of repair shops.
    ^Don't listen to this guy, he's not even a mechanic.
    2001 Laser Red A4 1.8TQM, 5-Speed Swapped, 4.11 Final Drive, APR 93, 2.5" Exhaust, ST Coilovers, 034 RSB, A8 Brakes Front & Rear
    2006 Passion Red Volvo V50 T5 AWD 6MT
    2000 Satin Silver Passat 1.8T FWD Wagon, Slippy Tiptronic, 15" Hubcaps
    2001 Aluminum Silver Metallic A4 Avant 1.8TQM (winter sled)

  16. #16
    Veteran Member Four Rings customa4's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 07 2011
    AZ Member #
    73592
    My Garage
    02 A4 1.8T CVT, 02 A4 1.8TQ 5spd, 92 Geo Prizm
    Location
    CT

    Quote Originally Posted by dachmt View Post
    So I decided to have it all checked and repaired by the "best" Audi garage in town, and turns out I have $2200 dollars less on my bank account, here's the description of the work and issues:
    https://db.tt/EUJi0bV4

    Today I've done a check with my OBD-2, and I still have P0010 (Intake camshaft position actuator circuit / open (bank 1)), P0012 (intake camshaft position timing - over-retarded Bank 1)) and a new one P0171 (System too lean (bank 1)). Can P0010 and P0012 be due to the wiring issue cited at the bottom (wiring harness)? If yes, I'd understand to have them still here if the harness is brittle like said, if not I'd be really upset.

    Can you guys tell me with the description of the repairs and that I still have my light on what's going on? Did I get rip off? Did they repair maybe something not necessary (like the timing chain tensioner?), things that don't seem right to you in general?

    I just really have a bad feeling with these guys, I'm ok paying expensive for people working great, but when I see that I always have to come back to do "further checks", always have issues and my previous issues are still here I don't think that's right.

    Please let me know, thanks!
    If you still have the same problems, you drive the car back to their shop and tell them to fix it or return your money. Don't make any changes or clear any codes on your own. If they don't make an effort to make it right it's probably time to get law enforcement involved, sounds like you've been robbed sir.
    K&N-Milltek HFC-Magnaflow Catback-APR snub mount-ER Sport FMIC-Forge TIP-Forge DV-Podi-034 Motor Mounts-034 Rear Sway/End Links-STaSIS Street Sport Coils-Bentley Manual

  17. #17
    Senior Member Two Rings AlyAudi03's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 10 2012
    AZ Member #
    102008
    Location
    Waco, TX

    I'm still scratching my head...op did they charge you for a cam chain tensioner and a timing chain tensioner??? Am I the only one seeing that? I second Customa^^^

    Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

  18. #18
    Established Member Two Rings dachmt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 10 2014
    AZ Member #
    138634
    Location
    San Francisco, CA

    Quote Originally Posted by customa4 View Post
    If you still have the same problems, you drive the car back to their shop and tell them to fix it or return your money. Don't make any changes or clear any codes on your own. If they don't make an effort to make it right it's probably time to get law enforcement involved, sounds like you've been robbed sir.
    How can I get law enforcement involved? I don't know much about what I'm talking about, so I can't say "this is wrong" or "this is right". What I can say I that I went there to get my car fixed and told them 2 errors codes (P0010 and P0012), and I got out with the same codes and $2200 bill. Let me know and I would do it, I went once to that shop and they tried to charge me $1500 for replacing 4 sensors for the gasoline gauge not working when I told them I thought it was a battery issue (dead at the time). Results, battery was changed and my gas gauge worked again.

    This time, I paid and don't want to let them just screw me just like that.

  19. #19
    Established Member Two Rings dachmt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 10 2014
    AZ Member #
    138634
    Location
    San Francisco, CA

    Also, what they called the Timing Chain Tensioner and that costs $827 is actually this one when looking by part #: http://www.ecstuning.com/ES258757/
    And here, they say it is called a Camshaft Chain Tensioner, which seems right. Am I right?

    My main question is can P0010 and P0012 be due to the wiring harness issue? Because that's why I came there (my OBD-2 was only seeing these), and it's still here. At that point, if no, I would have a good reason to go back, otherwise I don't know how I can prove things. Or ask them to do a test in front of me and if all the brake booster vacuum, the solenoid and P0010/P0012 are still there then I can tell them they just screw me good.

    Thoughts?

  20. #20
    Senior Member Two Rings AlyAudi03's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 10 2012
    AZ Member #
    102008
    Location
    Waco, TX

    Yes I just realized the left Side was for labor. My bad. Not sure why that was 827. Insane....I personally think the issue is with your solenoid just because a similar scenario (first visit and all) yielded the solenoid at fault with my friends car. Hers was over advanced though. Anyway, I don't know if I'd rule out the wiring being the issue. it would be hard for me to trust the original testing they did, after I dropped that much money and it didn't fix the problem :/ sorry I can't help much

    Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

  21. #21
    Senior Member Two Rings junxing's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 12 2010
    AZ Member #
    58920
    Location
    Chesapeake, VA

    when the timing belt was changed are you sure it was done properly?
    2003 Audi A4 3.0 Avant quattro Atlas Gray/Platinum Gray/6SPD
    -VAG-COM available in the Hampton Roads area

  22. #22
    Veteran Member Four Rings walky_talky20's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 30 2008
    AZ Member #
    30427
    Location
    Erie, Pennsylvania

    Indeed. Checking the belt timing takes like 10 minutes and should always be done whenever chasing timing codes of any kind.
    ^Don't listen to this guy, he's not even a mechanic.
    2001 Laser Red A4 1.8TQM, 5-Speed Swapped, 4.11 Final Drive, APR 93, 2.5" Exhaust, ST Coilovers, 034 RSB, A8 Brakes Front & Rear
    2006 Passion Red Volvo V50 T5 AWD 6MT
    2000 Satin Silver Passat 1.8T FWD Wagon, Slippy Tiptronic, 15" Hubcaps
    2001 Aluminum Silver Metallic A4 Avant 1.8TQM (winter sled)

  23. #23
    Established Member Two Rings dachmt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 10 2014
    AZ Member #
    138634
    Location
    San Francisco, CA

    Quote Originally Posted by junxing View Post
    when the timing belt was changed are you sure it was done properly?
    It's been done like 2 months ago, when the water pump let me go. I expect Audi specialist to do the job properly yes, and I'm not expert enough to know if it's alright or not. So if they did a bad job, then I got ripped off another time. I'll bring the car to a mechanic I trust here, recommendation from a friend and fair garage. I'll go for another high bill but this guy will fix things properly, and I'll get out without errors. I'm so tired of all that.

  24. #24
    Established Member Two Rings dachmt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 10 2014
    AZ Member #
    138634
    Location
    San Francisco, CA

    Just a quick update, as I still have my errors, but only the P0010.

    Everything has been done, changed the camshaft position sensor, camshaft chain tensioner, timing belt is good, 3 shops and 1 says it's because of the coil pack harness cables that are too worn and needs to be replaced. Other than that, still carrying the engine light on for several months and it's making me insane. Going back to the last shop so they can investigate more on Monday.

    Do you think the harness could be a potential candidate to resolve the P0010? (and misfires - I think there are some, but my OBD-2 isn't like the Audi scanning tool, so I see some errors but not all)

    AAAAhahahahahhahaahAHHAHAHAHA

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  


    © 2001-2025 Audizine, Audizine.com, and Driverzines.com
    Audizine is an independently owned and operated automotive enthusiast community and news website.
    Audi and the Audi logo(s) are copyright/trademark Audi AG. Audizine is not endorsed by or affiliated with Audi AG.