Schrubbe8210's B5 A4 track car project!

[Schrubbe8210]

So I had a b6 S4 cabrio that I loved driving. I found out I could track it, then I loved driving it more. I became sick and tired of being scared after every track day of a catastrophe and not having a car for work on monday. Also it is a heavy pig and really hard on the car and consumables. I did a bunch of research, and decided that the 1.8t is a nice blend of good power potential and the ability to work on it without having to pull the motor. Also, B5 A4's are a dime a dozen. I posted on the midwest for sale forum for anyone looking to unload a b5 a4 cheap, and low and behold, after a few weeks, someone messaged me. It was a really cool kid out of Orland Park, IL, who had a 1997 AEB B5 A4 he wanted to get rid of, cause it needed more work than he wanted to do. I am in milwaukee. He tells me, I can have the whole car, minus the center console, ecu, and seats for 300$. Yes, that is not a typo, 300$. So I promptly rented a trailer and drove down and bought it. He was kind enough to spray paint it flat black for me as well. LOL

Instead of posting all the pictures, I will link to the photobucket, and post the main ones.



then the sunroof was broken, so i welded it shut




Next I disassembled the whole thing, gutted the interior, and started getting parts together for a 6-speed 01e swap. I do not have a ton of pictures of this stuff, but there are a few in the photobucket.


I was able to get a trans and linkages from minnesota, and the rest of the parts i needed i pieced together on carpart.com.

I bought a multitude of 034 stuff,
Solid front and rear subframe mounts
billet diff carrier
rear sway bar with subframe supports
diff mount
solid trans mounts.
AWE DTS
JHM shifter trio





and started piecing the whole driveline together. I had the S4 brakes powdercoated, replaced all the seals, bought carbotech pads and new rotors, and also swapped in the s4 suspension. I bought all new control arms up front as well.

once the chassis was basically done and I could move it easily, I began working on the motor.


However, before I did, I found a little gem. I guy in campbellsport,wi sold me the remnants of his project, and I took all the panels off of it, and swapped them on to my car, cause you know, mine was spray painted. I sold a lot of unneeded parts, and also got a spare set of wheels out of the deal. used all the body panels to pretty me car up a bit.



As far as the motor, because this car came with 250k on it, I basically started from scratch:

bought and ABA crank and had the block bored to 83mm, so its now a 2008cc motor
IE tuscan rods

JE 8.5:1 pistons

ARP main studs
had the crank pulley dowel pinned
ARP crank bolt
visit to the machine shop for new bearings, and all appropriate machining




for the head i did
IE springs and retainers,
Ferrea valves all around,
ARP head studs
ARP cam bolt and IE friction disk thingy
IE manual timing belt tensioner kit



Every gasket, and oring were replaced.



once all this was put together, mated it to an aasco flywheel with a CM fx400 6 puck clutch, and dropped it in the car.

Bought a CTS turbo gtx3071r kit with 630cc injectors, and a FMIC to match.
Tuned by United Motorsports, Stage 4 AEB tune with ProMaf.




Everything went together pretty well. I had to get the exhaust refitted, because I had a 6-speed and the downpipe was made for a 5 speed. However, Jon with O2 Induction did an incredible job mating my CTS downpipe to the ebay catback I bought. it looks incredible.

I am sure there is a ton of little stuff I missed, but I didnt want to have one of those threads going that takes forever. I figured when I turned the key and it ran I would post.

Tonight was the night. Fired her up, had a little scare with it running like crap, turned out coilpacks are a big deal. swapped in 4 new R8 red ones, and it fired right up.

This has been a long road and I learned a lot from the people out here and the forum as a whole. If anyone is doing anything similar and they have questions, ask away, I might know.
I bought all the parts and used Frank at European Performance Group endlessly for help and guidance, and I can't say enough about how knowledgeable he is and how lucky we are to have him in the Milwaukee area.

I suppose this is a good start. (pardon my lame commentary in the vid)
http://vid1341.photobucket.com/album...pspadm0x9m.mp4

The pictures make it seem like it happened way faster than it did. I bought the black car in october 2013. so a year and a half.

Thanks for looking!

[Nollywood]

What an epic journey!

You really scored a top deal buying the facelift yellow car. Your '97 looks great. A few questions though:

Is the car FWD or Quattro? You might have mentioned it already, and I missed it somehow, if so, I apologise.

You also mentioned some S4 parts (brakes?). Did these come off your B6 S4 Cabrio? Is the S4 still in daily use?

What sort of power does your set up yield?

Again, awesome project, and thanks for sharing.

[Schrubbe8210]

Its Quattro for sure. I swapped the whole driveline from a b5 s4 into it, mainly for the 6 speed01e, but thats where the brakes came from. The cabrio unfortunately had to be sold cause i had a baby in december, and the wife needed an suv. As far as power, i havent fully broken in the motor or dynoed it yet, but the tuner tells me the software is good for mid 400s.

[Nollywood]

^^^ Awesome. I bet you can't wait to do your running-in miles. It sucks keeping a light foot, but soon you're gonna have a grin a mile wide.

[Schrubbe8210]

Yes, it will be hard to not pound on it, but i think ill make it.

[Seerlah]

Awesome build. Two thing:

-run the 01a for better gearing on the small displacement
-You will eventually want to ditch that manifold. It's restrictive if chasing more than 375whp and runs hot. I used to run that manifold (psi concept original)

[Schrubbe8210]

The 01a that was in the car was wrecked. Literally had teeth busted off he input shaft. As far as the manifold, ill see how things ggo, but i dont want to have to redo all the plumbing and whatnot just yet. Have a little fun first i suppose and see how it does. Thanks for the insight, got any good manifold suggestions?

[Seerlah]

What size turbo you running?

[Schrubbe8210]

Gtx3071r

[redline380]

How does an AEG crank work with an 058 block? Which crank gear did you use?

[Schrubbe8210]

Crap, my bad. Its been so long since i bought the crank. I looked it up, it was an ABA. Basically just has a 92.8mm stroke instead of 86.4 or something. Sorry.

[Seerlah]

Gtx3071r

My friend runs that with stock displacement, not sure what cr pistons, meth, pag parts mani, maestro, 058, and 400+whp.

[redline380]

Crap, my bad. Its been so long since i bought the crank. I looked it up, it was an ABA. Basically just has a 92.8mm stroke instead of 86.4 or something. Sorry.

No big deal. I just wanted to make sure you were using the right crank. It would be pretty awful to get where you are and find out the crank is the wrong one

[Schrubbe8210]

LOL thanks man. current problem is that the damn headlights and turn signals of all things dont work. brake lights are fine. I got a feeling its because the guy I bought the car from ripped apart the center console before I got it, and I dont have the hazard switch that has the turn signal relay in it. no turn signals makes me a little nervous about driving around town and trying to break it in. My pops is out of town til wednesday, maybe this week when he is back we will team up and drive around and try and break the motor in. if anyone has any ideas with the headlights im all ears. I do not thing the turn signal relay would stop the headlights from working, do you guys? I may just tap into the wires on the headlight switch and make some switches to turn the headlights on manually. high beams work fine, however.

[Schrubbe8210]

rewired back in the hazard switch/turn relay I inadvertently cut out, and now the hazards work. I bought a new ignition switch to see if that fixes the no headlights/no turn signal problem.

[M-Hood]

You might want to consider swapping to a 01E out of a 3.0, it has shorter 3rd-6th gear then the B5 01E. Other thing you might find is that exhaust manifold is going to be restrictive and cause high manifold pressure and higher then normal EGT's, it just can't seem to handle the flow of a 3071r or larger turbo.


So are you running a 228mm or 240mm setup? The 228mm FX400 just doesn't have enough hold for a well running car with that size turbo pushing a good amount of boost.
Based on your picture it looks like you are running a 228mm which is flat on the outer edge and the 240mm has a lip at the top.

Torque ratings
228mm FX400 = 445 ft lbs at the crank
240mm FX400 = 675 ft lbs at the crank

[Schrubbe8210]

Yeah, Mike, I have had a couple of people tell me that about the manifold, it came with the kit I bought. leaves room for future improvement, right now I am chomping at the bit to run it a little and have some fun. Also, interesting tidbid about the gearing differences, I did not know they were different based on the vehicle. I think my trans came out of a 2.7tt a6, cause it has about 90k on it, has never been rebuilt, and shifts like a dream. Lets be honest, if it was in an s4, someone would have shredded it and 1-2 would be tough.

i right now have a 228mm flywheel, and the reason I did that is because most people i asked did not think I would exceeed the fx400's torque on it, and also because the donor car came with a single mass steel flywheel, and all I needed to get it going was a new friction surface for 75$. it was an aasco or something like that. I didnt feel like dumping more money into a new flywheel until I had to, but when the clutch is done, I probably will go up to a 240mm.

Thanks for the info! if you have any manifold Ideas that would bolt right on I am all ears, but I dont think I am that lucky.

[M-Hood]

Yeah, Mike, I have had a couple of people tell me that about the manifold, it came with the kit I bought. leaves room for future improvement, right now I am chomping at the bit to run it a little and have some fun. Also, interesting tidbid about the gearing differences, I did not know they were different based on the vehicle. I think my trans came out of a 2.7tt a6, cause it has about 90k on it, has never been rebuilt, and shifts like a dream. Lets be honest, if it was in an s4, someone would have shredded it and 1-2 would be tough.

i right now have a 228mm flywheel, and the reason I did that is because most people i asked did not think I would exceeed the fx400's torque on it, and also because the donor car came with a single mass steel flywheel, and all I needed to get it going was a new friction surface for 75$. it was an aasco or something like that. I didnt feel like dumping more money into a new flywheel until I had to, but when the clutch is done, I probably will go up to a 240mm.

Thanks for the info! if you have any manifold Ideas that would bolt right on I am all ears, but I dont think I am that lucky.

That turbo would have to be run at pretty low boost to not over power that clutch, but you have to take into account that the torque rating of the clutch is while the car is rolling at speed. The torque increases as the load increases.


Problem is that each manifold will put the turbo in a sightly different location which means having to modify the down pipe a bit.

[Schrubbe8210]

I have a guy local who is an awesome welder so downpipe modifications are not a big deal. he is also really reasonable. so Ill take manifold suggestions. If it requires minor adjustments, Im not worried about it. I would love a tubular bottom mount manifold.

[ray4624]

awesome looking build man!

i am in the progress of building a stroker as well with the UM stage 4 tune.

How do you like that tune so far?

[Schrubbe8210]

Ray, I havent really beaten on it yet with the tune. For break in, it seems to be really good, idles a little rich, my afr gauge reads about 11.2 when its warm, driving around is pretty close to 14.7. I am going to go out and beat on it on friday a bit, but so far it seems to run pretty well. One thing I will tell you is this, I did a bunch of mods to the wiring harness to delete the ICM, and use the new style coil push down coil packs. I initally used the black coil packs, and could not get the car to start and idle. if i pumped the throttle, it would run for like 5 seconds. Swapped the black packs out with red R8 TSI ones, that were taller and needed spacers, and it fired up and idled on the first crank. I think the UM tune is good. I run 8.5:1 compression and so its a bit of a dog before boost hits. Overall the tune seems to be good.

[ray4624]

im already on the r8 coils so im set there.
Im only running a 2871r elim for now so boost onset shouldnt be terrible.
I am also at 9.5:1 so that should help the off boost power a bit.
Hopefully my bay be as clean as yours.
Now youve just got to get rid of all that evap garbage.

[Schrubbe8210]

I would love to nuke the evap garbage, but the dudes at um and 034 told me thEy have seen horror stories of gas tanks exploding cause of no pressure relief on the tank. I left all the lines after that. Also, one less thing to do before my first track day with her on june 20

[ray4624]

ha hope my car doesnt blow up!

ive gotta find a track close to me. It looks like something i would love to get into

[cavekidd]

I would love to nuke the evap garbage, but the dudes at um and 034 told me thEy have seen horror stories of gas tanks exploding cause of no pressure relief on the tank. I left all the lines after that. Also, one less thing to do before my first track day with her on june 20

I'd like to disassemble my engine blocks and clean out the chambers, pistons, valves, new gaskets, all my self.
is it a hard or confusion job?

[rockbeau25]

Interesting build! When we going to see this car at Road America?

[Schrubbe8210]

June 20th, man. Northwoods Shelby Club Road America track weekend. You gonna be there?

[M-Hood]

I have a guy local who is an awesome welder so downpipe modifications are not a big deal. he is also really reasonable. so Ill take manifold suggestions. If it requires minor adjustments, Im not worried about it. I would love a tubular bottom mount manifold.

A top mount tube manifold makes working on the turbo so much easier.


If you are looking for a better flowing log manifold you might want to consider the Treadstone T3 manifold side mount manifold which has the EWG on the top.


JDL Auto Design offers a bottom mount tube manifold but it is for the FSI/TSI transverse, not sure if they would be willing to make it with a 1.8t flange or if it would even fit on a A4 1.8t because of the tight fit between the block and frame rail.

[Schrubbe8210]

This winter ill buy a tubular top mount manifold. Itll make for a nice project

[M-Hood]

This winter ill buy a tubular top mount manifold. Itll make for a nice project

I have a friend that is going with the JDL Auto Design T4 twin scroll for his S300 62mm FMW, he wants more top end power that he can't seem to get with his log manifold.

[Schrubbe8210]

Once I get a few track days under my belt, and see how fast/how much power this pig really is, I'll decide if i need more. the last car I tracked was a 2004 s4 cabrio, and that was darn quick for me. I think this once might be faster, but saturday will tell. GoPro is all charged up!

[rockbeau25]

I should be there actually, not with my car but I'll be at RA!

[Schrubbe8210]

saturday ill be there

[rockbeau25]

Should be there Saturday too, that's the plan. Kart race

[Schrubbe8210]

Well, unfortunately, after the track inspection and brake bleed, the shop tells me there is no power, and I, having never really gotten on the throttle, agree. So hopefully, tomorrow, we can figure out why on gods green earth the tune isnt cooperating. when you stand on it, it gets super lean (afr of like 15.5-16.5) and there is no boost building, and certainly no power. I hope its something minor, I really want to drive it on saturday. Im open to suggestions. The only thing I really want to confirm is the ProMaf wiring, as I never got a diagram initially on how to wire it up. We shall see. again I am trying to run the United Motorsports Stage 4 AEB tune.

[rockbeau25]

Unfortunately for us, we're in Wisconsin so there's really no Audi specialists, at least that I know of. As for getting ready, do you have a different ecu you could put in just to get the car going and get track time?

[ray4624]

Well, unfortunately, after the track inspection and brake bleed, the shop tells me there is no power, and I, having never really gotten on the throttle, agree. So hopefully, tomorrow, we can figure out why on gods green earth the tune isnt cooperating. when you stand on it, it gets super lean (afr of like 15.5-16.5) and there is no boost building, and certainly no power. I hope its something minor, I really want to drive it on saturday. Im open to suggestions. The only thing I really want to confirm is the ProMaf wiring, as I never got a diagram initially on how to wire it up. We shall see. again I am trying to run the United Motorsports Stage 4 AEB tune.

vac leak?
could also be fuel pump

[ray4624]

double post idc


i will take a pic of my promaf wiring when i get home.

[Seerlah]

Maybe ecu has to adjust and learn the car? I have to do this every time I flash a new tune on my eurodyne suite. Will drive like straight poop till the ecu learns the car, which can take up to two 30 minute drives. Can't boost till things are kosher, or I run dumb lean.

[A4Rob]

Unfortunately for us, we're in Wisconsin so there's really no Audi specialists, at least that I know of. As for getting ready, do you have a different ecu you could put in just to get the car going and get track time?

When I tracked at Road America my power steering rack decided to blow. Nearest place to even buy parts was VW dealer in Sheboygan.