2013 Steering Issues VAG COM Fix?

**Moxnix** · 03-29-2014 07:04 PM

Originally Posted by tomaszp72

I had the update and imidiatelly dissabled back DSR afterwards. The DSR dissable still makes a difference. The steering wheel now feels almost perfect. I dont really have any complains anymore. Just one perspective.

Hi there, having same issues. 3X at the dealer for module upgrade, bushing and column parts and linkage under Audi internal recall. I was wondering how long this fix has worked for you and are you using your own Vag Com software or is the something your dealer did for you? Very interested in in your response as I believe you are on to something. Apprently the DSR, if i have this right is to compensate for cross winds, road surfaces and such so disabling it makes sense. If I pull over and restart vehicle it sometimes corrects the steering flaws. This is hardly useful in the long run however.
Best

**tomaszp72** · 03-30-2014 08:18 AM

Originally Posted by Moxnix

Hi there, having same issues. 3X at the dealer for module upgrade, bushing and column parts and linkage under Audi internal recall. I was wondering how long this fix has worked for you and are you using your own Vag Com software or is the something your dealer did for you? Very interested in in your response as I believe you are on to something. Apprently the DSR, if i have this right is to compensate for cross winds, road surfaces and such so disabling it makes sense. If I pull over and restart vehicle it sometimes corrects the steering flaws. This is hardly useful in the long run however.
Best

I have 13k on my car, disabled the DSR first time the first week I owned the car. Learned about this trick on this forum. I have my own cable, one dealer didnt want to do it and they tried to put me in touch with somebody who would do but they wanted to charge me the second dealer wanted me to pay for disabling it, since I actually told them how to fix the steering wheel and they had a lot of complains I will never go back to that dealer. I just bought the cable instead. This time after they applied the fix and I disabled it again the steering wheel feels really good. Very uniform across the whole range. Nicely weighted. Dont really have complains anymore.

**Moxnix** · 03-30-2014 09:04 AM

[QUOTE=tomaszp72;9612301]I have 13k on my car, disabled the DSR first time the first week I owned the car. Learned about this trick on this forum. I have my own cable, one dealer didnt want to do
Hey, thanks for posting. When you say you have your own cable does this mean you have the whole package like the Ross scanning tool? Anyway you could post a link to the cable you bought? I am at the point now with the car where it looks like I have to either make the investment in tools or end my relationship with the car if you know what I mean. 10K now and nothing but agida. Without this steering thing the car runs very well. Appreciate your input.

**F40LM** · 03-30-2014 09:07 AM

While my car has been in the dealer I've been driving a 2014 A6. The steering is so much better. I felt one or two notches when it was warming up driving, but beyond that it was perfect and on the highway i didn't have to constantly adjust the wheel to stay straight. Makes me mad that Audi hasn't resolved this.

**tomaszp72** · 03-30-2014 09:26 AM

http://store.ross-tech.com/shop/VCHUC.html

**Moxnix** · 03-30-2014 12:11 PM

Thanks tomaszp72
thats the unit I was looking at. I guess you get a lot of other use out of it as well.

**Moxnix** · 03-30-2014 12:17 PM

Funny, when mine was in I got the same model and year as mine but with auto transmission. It was developing all the same issues as mine with the steering. This is a huge problem for Audi. The loaner had 2800 miles on it. They joked about it when I brought it back. They couldn,t care less. I truly believe that a lot of the client base for these cars have no real interest in how the cars actually perform and have no idea the car is even off. Pity.

**stoked_S4** · 03-30-2014 05:47 PM

I had the 12 o'clock issue mostly during cold winter days temp in the teens(F). Right now car is OK. If it comes back in hot summer days I might ask for a local s4 owner with cable to disable DSR and see how it goes.

I test drove my friend's new '14 X5 and that thing was just horrible constantly between 11-1 clock. I didn't even get on the highway with speeds under 50mph. I did not tell him and ruin his new car feelings. My other friend with a Scion also complains about his electric steering(ES). Maybe in few years they will fix this but for now ES sucks in general.

**Moxnix** · 03-30-2014 08:44 PM

Yep, cold weather def makes a difference. Have a place in the Adirondack mountains which i use this car to go back and forth to. Its not even my daily driver. -10 to -15 or more not uncommon this winter. Steering took a big hit. Trouble is now that its milder here (downstate NY) I still have the steering issue? Even with the software update, steering column bushings and linkage parts they changed still there. i will most likely get the cable tomaszp recommended and disable the software . I don't think i need help with crosswinds and road surfaces. Even at 60 i can still manage. I think they are putting in these systems for the masses and not their original target customer that actually like to drive and take it seriously. Who knows, maybe it helps if you text and drive? Right now its like I'm driving and the car is texting! Good luck. Nice of you to soften the blow for your friend.

**ny tdi** · 04-01-2014 08:39 AM

Originally Posted by drob23

Interesting, as every account I've read from people who did the update (or had car delivered with it) found the DSR disable made no change to their steering. This is good news.

Yeah, disabling the DSR really helped with the tugging sensation, but it does squat for highway behavior. My car still veers left/right when driving on the highway. Can't keep the dang thing straight. Have made an appointment with a dealer who is very open about problems caused by Audi, so I'm sure I'll get the straight scoop!

Just to be clear, I have a 2014 B8.5 with 6MT+Nav

**Moxnix** · 04-01-2014 09:58 AM

That's not good news. I just bought the interface so I can disable the DSR. Well I guess it will help with the rear brakes and a lot of other service jobs. Good luck at your dealer. I have the 2013 A4 with a manual as well. At this point I will take any appreciable improvement to my steering.

**F40LM** · 04-01-2014 10:06 AM

I actually got a ton of notchiness with DSR off then turned it back on and didnt experience it again till I took it to the dealership. We will see when I get it back how it goes. Of course they think its from improper balancing by another dealership or alignment.

**drob23** · 04-01-2014 10:33 AM

I also wonder how the following affect the steering system to lessen/exacerbate problems:

1) lowering springs: changes geometry (slightly though), not sure if benefit or detriment, greater caster should make steering heavier;
2) spacers or aftermarket wheels (with greater than factory offset): enlarging track width will change things, not sure how wrt steering;
3) aftermarket tires: better rubber should increase/change the steering response, will change pneumatic trail and consequently self-aligning torque;
4) Alu Kreuz: should reduce deflection in the subframe and reduce compliance in the steering system;
5) alignment: caster, camber and toe should all affect how darty the car is and how stable it tracks.

I have upgraded all of the above along with disabling DSR, and no 48k8 update. 2013 early build FWIW (not sure of month, but took delivery in Dec 2012). Never had anything in the steering system replaced except for a front CV joint that was ruptured.

The EPS system consists of a lot of feedback control systems that traditionally functioned off hydraulic pumps/valves. Hydraulic systems were tuned by changing the size of springs (they function sort of like bypass valves within the boost pump), pulley's and gearing. Now everything is software, and negates 40 years of evolutionary engineering. I think these steering systems are trying to do too much/too soon, engineers see the ability to implement features like DSR (prevent vehicle from serving during wind gusts), but in the end just make things more dangerous. It's pretty telling how long this has taken Audi to address, because replacing steering racks and columns is not good for their bottom line, despite how some here might argue that only a "minority" have problems. Make sure you open cases with NHTSA if you are truly having problems.

Edit - Just remembered from a vehicle dynamics class I took that one of the most important attributes of the suspension geometry and how it affects the steering system is the scrub radius - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scrub_radius

I believe you change the scrub radius through spacers, lowering springs and alignment changes. Might be interesting to hear what peoples setups are who experience the problem. From the wiki article "When the vehicle has been modified with offset wheels, larger tires, height adjustments and side to side camber differences, the scrub radius will be changed and the handling and stability of the vehicle will be affected."

**Moxnix** · 04-01-2014 11:01 AM

I agree, as does this long term tester from the UK who basically says what you just wrote back in 2009.
"The steering now feels a bit gritty, too, which suggests to me there’s a problem with the electric motor. I’ll certainly ask the dealer to take a look when the S4 goes in for its next service, which another of its onboard computers tells me is due in 2100 miles’ time. Illogical, but it’s left me strangely nostalgic for a good old-fashioned hydraulic servo"

http://www.evo.co.uk/carreviews/evol..._s4_avant.html

**Mbrad** · 04-01-2014 11:39 AM

My Apr/May 2013 build 2013 is in right now having the rack replaced so I guess they are back to that approach.

**Moxnix** · 04-01-2014 12:17 PM

Well if it will help anyone here I will scan and post up the Audi internal paperwork for at least my dealers work concerning the steering issue on my car which was column parts and bushings. I find it somewhat hard to fathom as to how there are so many fixes Audi has come up with and how extensive they are . Some people here have had the rack replaced only to have the issue return. Good luck with your service, lets hope it does it.

**Moxnix** · 04-13-2014 02:49 PM

Anyone out there that can help me figure the 3 digit security code so I can try the DSR disable? Lots of different ideas about this but none seem definitive. Did a full autoscan and car has been to the dealer 2-3 times but there is no ready answer as to the access code in the log as some say there is. Have the VCSD 12.12.2 which is working great but I can't get past the security 0-999 code to "unlearn" this bad boy. There is no longer a "check box" to just disable it, just 2 options for erasing learned behavior? Not sure I taught the car to drive this way but I would like to undo as much as possible. Anyone with some knowledge of the code dealer enters to get in would be optimal.
Thanks

**aka5** · 04-13-2014 02:58 PM

meeting with NE regional engineer on Wednesday for him to feel my steering, he will be the one to approve the steering rack. i better get it approved

**drob23** · 04-13-2014 03:37 PM

Originally Posted by Moxnix

Anyone out there that can help me figure the 3 digit security code so I can try the DSR disable? Lots of different ideas about this but none seem definitive. Did a full autoscan and car has been to the dealer 2-3 times but there is no ready answer as to the access code in the log as some say there is. Have the VCSD 12.12.2 which is working great but I can't get past the security 0-999 code to "unlearn" this bad boy. There is no longer a "check box" to just disable it, just 2 options for erasing learned behavior? Not sure I taught the car to drive this way but I would like to undo as much as possible. Anyone with some knowledge of the code dealer enters to get in would be optimal.
Thanks

Wish I could help, but I completely forget how I did the disable dsr coding. Took a while if I remember correctly, had trouble getting the ECU to accept it.

I don't think the dealer uses vcds, they probably just directly flash the ECU, probably similar to how APR and GIAC flash the engine control module through OBD2.

**Moxnix** · 04-13-2014 05:22 PM

Drob23' thanks for the honest reply, appreciate it. I do have an update, turns out I did not follow tomaszp72
instructions properly, my fault entirely. You do not need the 3 digit code after all and the check box does indeed come up when you follow his lead. It did take a while as you mentioned but after the software change came up with a whole host of error messages when I did exit out it said "code accepted". Wrote down all of the sertings before hand just in case. I can say in all honesty that for my 2013 A4 the disable has made a dramatic difference in my car. I was literally on the verge of putting it on the market as I have never had a car I looked less forward to driving. Many thanks go out to tomaszp72 for his help. I would still like to know about the security code as I did find a few things in the steering module you can change with it. I am hoping that everyone with these steering issues finds some kind of resolution for them. Clearly taking a car known for its handling prowess and degrading it such does not speak well for Audi. Its also unfortunate that they are not open to these everyman fixes such as this one from tomaszp72 to even humour their customers. I will post after a few hundred miles with the new setting.

**Moxnix** · 04-14-2014 07:49 PM

Hi,
I will have to go back out and look again but it was somewhere in that same screen for the 44 module. I would go out now but its late and I had a less than satisfying Monday. I will post up some exact directions tomorrow night. Seems like it was on the way to that disable box but maybe not. Do you have an S4 or A4? Did you get a "code accepted" when you exited?

**boss2k** · 04-14-2014 07:57 PM

After the 48k8 update the difference between auto and comfort mode is very negligible , can anyone confirm that?

**Moxnix** · 04-14-2014 08:13 PM

Originally Posted by boss2k

After the 48k8 update the difference between auto and comfort mode is very negligible , can anyone confirm that?

I am new to the vagcom thing but it seems to me from what I have been reading that the S4 owners are having less success with the disable. Maybe it has to do with the much more complicated software involved with the different settings available to you guys? We just have the one in the A4. I was real interested in the "learned behaviour" options which is why I was looking for the work shop code it asked for. Thing is I believe there is a way to obtain it from the Ross Tech program which is why I will pursue it. I can say for my car there is only a hint of the wheel wanting to stay where it was last corrected to which dissapears after an acceptable 1/2 mile or so. Other than that no more tugging, notchiness and its a tank on the highway. Only drove like that before they did the 48K update. I still have to put some more miles on it and report back.

**badfish** · 04-14-2014 08:20 PM

^^ I dont know about between auto and comfort because Im always in dynamic but I can confirm that after the update there is a lot less difference between dynamic and the other modes.

**caphie** · 04-14-2014 08:22 PM

I can report from trading a 2011 for a 2013 that the single biggest difference I noticed was the steering. I could not keep the 2013 in a straight line at highway speeds. It was as if there was no exact middle when steering. It would either drift left or drift right. Annoying. I hooked up the VAGCOM and disabled DSR. Problem solved. The car now drives "normal." I do not know what software version I have. I have not checked. I just know that I do not want the computer "recommending" anything about how to steer. I can handle it!

**Moxnix** · 04-15-2014 06:15 PM

Originally Posted by christos

I just followed the instructions in this thread and the dsr disable went through without problems but it did not make any difference for me (I have 48k8 update). I am curious about the "2 options for erasing learned behavior" that you mentioned. Where did you find them?

Select module, go to "44" then basic settings 04, "resettings of all adaptations", drop down menu, "resetting of learned values for steering assistance" " 3 digit number is required". Interesting, when I go to "Security" in this pane it asks for a 5 digit code?

**Moxnix** · 04-22-2014 05:42 PM

Originally Posted by aka5

meeting with NE regional engineer on Wednesday for him to feel my steering, he will be the one to approve the steering rack. i better get it approved

Wondering if you got a new steering rack or your issue resolved in any way?

**aka5** · 04-22-2014 05:45 PM

Originally Posted by Moxnix

Wondering if you got a new steering rack or your issue resolved in any way?

Yup! Should be picking it up at the dealer tomrrow with a new rack..

**Moxnix** · 04-22-2014 05:47 PM

Originally Posted by Mbrad

My Apr/May 2013 build 2013 is in right now having the rack replaced so I guess they are back to that approach.

Did you find the rack replacement solved your steering problems?

**Moxnix** · 04-22-2014 05:48 PM

Originally Posted by aka5

Yup! Should be picking it up at the dealer tomrrow with a new rack..

Sweet, keep us updated?

**Lucianoracing** · 07-02-2014 11:16 PM

Security code ??? You have the code ?

Originally Posted by Moxnix

Select module, go to "44" then basic settings 04, "resettings of all adaptations", drop down menu, "resetting of learned values for steering assistance" " 3 digit number is required". Interesting, when I go to "Security" in this pane it asks for a 5 digit code?

**ny tdi** · 07-03-2014 03:37 AM

Originally Posted by drob23

I also wonder how the following affect the steering system to lessen/exacerbate problems:

1) lowering springs: changes geometry (slightly though), not sure if benefit or detriment, greater caster should make steering heavier;
2) spacers or aftermarket wheels (with greater than factory offset): enlarging track width will change things, not sure how wrt steering;
3) aftermarket tires: better rubber should increase/change the steering response, will change pneumatic trail and consequently self-aligning torque;
4) Alu Kreuz: should reduce deflection in the subframe and reduce compliance in the steering system;
5) alignment: caster, camber and toe should all affect how darty the car is and how stable it tracks.

My steering problem is fixed!

Dealer met with Regional Rep
Reagional rep ordered new alignment with different specs than from factory
That didnt work, so Regional Rep approves new rack.
My steering is now perfect.

(NOTE: if you have ANY suspension or steering mods (including wheels and VagCom), Audi will refuse to do an alignment, and will not approve a new rack)

**Moxnix** · 07-05-2014 02:40 PM

[QUOTE=ny tdi;9886811]My steering problem is fixed!

Dealer met with Regional Rep
Reagional rep ordered new alignment with different specs than from factory
That didnt work, so Regional Rep approves new rack.
My steering is now perfect.

(NOTE: if you have ANY suspension or steering mods (including wheels and VagCom), Audi will refuse to do an alignment, and will not approve a new rack)[/QUOTE
Glad to hear that your problem is resolved! Just wondering what the "including wheels and VagCom" means? Does this mean Audi won't repair your car if you have used the software?

**BzzzBom** · 07-05-2014 09:17 PM

[QUOTE=Moxnix;9892740]

Originally Posted by ny tdi

My steering problem is fixed!

Dealer met with Regional Rep
Reagional rep ordered new alignment with different specs than from factory
That didnt work, so Regional Rep approves new rack.
My steering is now perfect.

(NOTE: if you have ANY suspension or steering mods (including wheels and VagCom), Audi will refuse to do an alignment, and will not approve a new rack)[/QUOTE
Glad to hear that your problem is resolved! Just wondering what the "including wheels and VagCom" means? Does this mean Audi won't repair your car if you have used the software?

Actually, my dealer replaced rack while I had rear and front sway bars and endlinks and DSR delete Vag Com mod.

**ny tdi** · 07-06-2014 09:03 AM

That's good to know. My dealer said that the regional rep wouldn't let them touch my car with all the Vag mods I'd done (DSR, ADS, etc).
I had to undo everything before they would work on my car. They also said that if I would've had to put put the car back to stock if I had changes the wheels/suspension bits. I guess every dealership is different. Glad you got the new rack put in.

**CrownSeven** · 07-07-2014 10:20 AM

Just brought in my 2013 for the steering issue. One of the SA's was familiar with the notchiness issue but not the wandering issue. Described the issue to the SA and let him know I was familiar with the Software Update for the steering (which does nothing but make it worse). He said they would start off with an alignment, do a test drive, then the software update if the alignment does not help. Told him the only fix that seems to work is a rack replacement, and he said they would have to exhaust all options (including the software update) before heading in that directions as Audi would require them to do so.

So at least it sounds like they are willing to work with me on the issue. We'll see what they say later today. My guess is they'll do the alignment, then go ahead with the software update. I'm hoping they realize the alignment/software update will not fix the issue and contact Audi at that point for a rack replacement.

The battle begins!

**Moxnix** · 07-09-2014 02:05 PM

My dealer did the update at my first service. They said it was not up to the customer but company policy. My car drove like a bear before the update. After they did it the steering issues arose. I brought it in for the constant correction and nothciness we are all familiar with now. They instead replaced parts for their internal recall intended for parking issues which i did not have at all. It sat in my driveway until I learned about the DSR deactivate. That has solved all of my steering issues without alignment or anything else. i think its the luck of the draw? Good luck with your car. It seems to me that with 15K miles or so that I have my tires would tell me if the aligment was that far off. In my case they are wearing perfectly normal.

**Colozeus** · 07-27-2014 06:58 AM

I just picked up a new 2014 s4 phantom black. And i'm also experiencing these issues, though not as bad as some describe, but i have some slight notchiness around center and it is hard to keep it going straight. Disabling dsr helped slightly. I have an appointment tomorrow at the dealer. Wish me luck.