My first Audi - 2001.5 S4 with Custom Single Turbo setup...

[britishturbo]

How far will you take it on the stock motor?

Consistent 3.0 FATS "was" my goal... lol
I'm at a consistent 3.2 right now with just that one run under 3
I wanted to be at ~450WHP/450WTQ... and not go any higher than that on the stock bottom end... I'm pretty darn close to that right now.

[Don Supreme]

Consistent 3.0 FATS "was" my goal... lol
I'm at a consistent 3.2 right now with just that one run under 3
I wanted to be at ~450WHP/450WTQ... and not go any higher than that on the stock bottom end... I'm pretty darn close to that right now.

The problem with these setups is you know more power can be had with the touch of a key............. Even though you know that you should stop. I hope you draw the line in the sand soon and start focusing on that 3.0.

[SpeedWorksAuto]

Haha yeah that might not be a bad idea... ;-)
Think I should start a new thread there or add to the same one?

I was hoping that us single guys would add to that thread so all the info is in one place.

[britishturbo]

The problem with these setups is you know more power can be had with the touch of a key............. Even though you know that you should stop. I hope you draw the line in the sand soon and start focusing on that 3.0.

Exactly!
That's partly why I turned the boost down from ~25psi that I had it the weekend...
I'm at ~22psi now... I'm concentrating on getting my top end power more consistent... basically still doing lots of experiments and still learning for sure...

[britishturbo]

I was hoping that us single guys would add to that thread so all the info is in one place.

Sounds like a plan!
My ecu file actually started with the one posted in there with the single o2 sensor hack as well so it makes sense.

[SpeedWorksAuto]

I should have my car back togther today, and will be adding to it that thread with new logs. I think I will be starting over on my fueling since I just added in the HPX for blowthru.

[SpeedWorksAuto]

Also, what plugs and gap are you running? My top end falls off also, and I think it is a spark issue. Seems as if I start mis-firing or blowing out spark at around 6k and 20+psi. It seems kind of weird since I am running the "coil pack upgrade" with BKR7E at factory ~.032gap.

[britishturbo]

Also, what plugs and gap are you running? My top end falls off also, and I think it is a spark issue. Seems as if I start mis-firing or blowing out spark at around 6k and 20+psi. It seems kind of weird since I am running the "coil pack upgrade" with BKR7E at factory ~.032gap.

I was having blow out issues once I went up to 20+psi so I put in some NGK BKR7E plugs gapped at ~0.025
I didn't install my coils yet so I'm still on stock 2.7 coils.
Are you sure it's a spark missfire? I was having hesitations up top and I figured out it was Timing Intervention... the indication was big spikes in the timing being used. The "marcellus" file posted on the other place has incorrect values in the KFDMDARO table for ARMD.
I think it was because the xdf table is flipped around relative to the example that nyet put up showing how to disable the timing intervention...
I was planning on posting about it today after I was sure it was fixed in my logs.

[SpeedWorksAuto]

I saw that a while ago. When NYET was posting about his "anti-judder" issues and locations, I used the locations he gave for all the maps and axis. I asked why mine didnt look right, and several other people said the same thing. I have since went in and fixed all the axis, and my timing looks the same.

My timing so far hasnt given me any spiking issues, but there is some kind of intervention going on. Not enough to kill the pulls though. I get maybe 5deg of timing pull from about 4.5k to 6500.

[Monty23]

I think you need gap your plugs a little tighter speedworksauto... I remember Max saying with the 2.0 coil upgrade that he ran his plugs at like .025-.026" iirc....

[SpeedWorksAuto]

I think you need gap your plugs a little tighter speedworksauto... I remember Max saying with the 2.0 coil upgrade that he ran his plugs at like .025-.026" iirc....

Thank you! I just needed a little confirmation. From that thread the guys were claiming a .04" gap. I guess that all depends on what "stage" they are at. I figured .028 - .04.....hell, .032 would be close to splitting the difference.

I will load up a new set of bkr7e's gapped at ~.026

[Monty23]

He might have even said .024, let me search for the thread...

[Monty23]

He might have even said .024, let me search for the thread...

Here is what I could find right now:

Quotes from Max...

Seems some people like this extra large gap, but here @ 034Motorsport we never tested these claims of larger gap equaling higher power. Our primary goal of the kit was to offer something that would lower replacement and maintenance costs in the future, and all of the testing was done on stock Bosch Sidefires F5DPOR. Your exact perfect spark gap will likely vary depending on your cars tuning and individual nuances.

Our FSI kit was tested entirely with Bosch Sidefire F5DPOR plugs. We didn't do any testing with large spark gaps and so we have no comments about increased power from increased gap. Like Notorious said, your gap will largely be dependent on what boost you are running, but if you are running 40psi, you are going to want something under .03 with the FSI coils.

The primary goal for the FSI kit is to replace the expensive-to-maintain factory ignition system, and replacing tired components can breathe new power into the car, but we have never said the FSI coils are any more powerful or capable than good OEM 3-wire coils.

F6DTC are consistently the highest horsepower plug for us.

I run FR5DTC with Hitachi 4-wire bolt down coils. We sell all the components to wire in the connectors yourself if you want to do it that way.

[britishturbo]

I saw that a while ago. When NYET was posting about his "anti-judder" issues and locations, I used the locations he gave for all the maps and axis. I asked why mine didnt look right, and several other people said the same thing. I have since went in and fixed all the axis, and my timing looks the same.

My timing so far hasnt given me any spiking issues, but there is some kind of intervention going on. Not enough to kill the pulls though. I get maybe 5deg of timing pull from about 4.5k to 6500.

Post a plot and I'll take a look at it :-)

[britishturbo]

Thank you! I just needed a little confirmation. From that thread the guys were claiming a .04" gap. I guess that all depends on what "stage" they are at. I figured .028 - .04.....hell, .032 would be close to splitting the difference.

I will load up a new set of bkr7e's gapped at ~.026

He might have even said .024, let me search for the thread...

That's what I love about NGK plugs... gap them to around 0.025 and they will take anything ;-)

[SpeedWorksAuto]

Post a plot and I'll take a look at it :-)

If all goes well, I will have some new logs today. I will post them over yonder.....

[SpeedWorksAuto]

Exactly what I needed to hear Monty. Thanks!

[britishturbo]

Did some tuning today of things and I'm getting consistent 3.0 FATS times at less boost than before, really starting to get things dialed in.
The car feels a lot smoother now as well.
Here's some plots from the way home from work.
Oh and this was on a slight incline as well.

The second plot shows actual Wideand AFR being logged at the same time as all the other data, such a nice feature to have!
You can see it got pretty rich because of the knock, so I am going to dial the knock protection in a little better now.
Once I get the AFR just right I'll throw more timing at it, then more boost.

[britishturbo]

Plenty of fuel left:

[Monty23]

Wow! Your car is getting quick, i think you may be near that line. Be careful!

[Meow]

Can't wait to see you dial in that afr in the mid range. Very fat on the fueling right now. As far as boost and timing go, up them on the top end but avoid 3-4.5k range where that torque hits. You are at the edge of safe now, pushing those rods is risky. Good luck!

[britishturbo]

Wow! Your car is getting quick, i think you may be near that line. Be careful!

It's getting there lol ;-)

Can't wait to see you dial in that afr in the mid range. Very fat on the fueling right now. As far as boost and timing go, up them on the top end but avoid 3-4.5k range where that torque hits. You are at the edge of safe now, pushing those rods is risky. Good luck!

In progress... lol

[britishturbo]

Here's what Virtual Dyno said about my drive to work today after my latest tweaks.
I made sure to use the 1:1 scale factor in Virtual Dyno
I need to work now on stopping the top end from falling off.

[MileMan402]

I think you kind of want to throw a rod lol

[britishturbo]

I think you kind of want to throw a rod lol

Haha no no :-P

[jibberjive]

Said I was going to get this up here earlier...

If you get me 25psi Logs I will update it ;)

Just boost onset, not necessarily torque hit... but you get the idea!

Your boost profile logs are the earliest I see for RS6's, do you have handfuls of logs showing this boost profile in 3rd gear, or just 1 or 2? The majority of the straight RS6 turbo logs I've seen spool much closer to what britishturbo's setup is doing, ~15 psi a little after 3500 RPM.

[Meow]

Your boost profile logs are the earliest I see for RS6's, do you have handfuls of logs showing this boost profile in 3rd gear, or just 1 or 2? The majority of the straight RS6 turbo logs I've seen spool much closer to what britishturbo's setup is doing, ~15 psi a little after 3500 RPM.

It spools real damn fast in the winter. Summer time onset is a bit slower, the log above was done in cold temps, 3rd gear. I ran a 3.2 fats on that run. About 20psi by 3500 rpm.

In my sig there is a link to my thread with a ton of logs. You can see my summertime boost onset was impressive to even Doug from Frakenturbo.

Here is the log thread: http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...RS6-Turbo-logs



Purple line, psi numbers on the right (sorry for the confusion)
Winter 3rd gear


Summer 3rd gear

[britishturbo]

The setup of mine looks a lot laggier than it feels lol, at low boost it feels great, then when the high boost kicks in it hit like a freight train haha :-P
Not that I'm bothered by it but I'm thinking I might implement what I did on one of my DSM builds before for lag... we shall see ;-)

[Monty23]

The setup of mine looks a lot laggier than it feels lol, at low boost it feels great, then when the high boost kicks in it hit like a freight train haha :-P
Not that I'm bothered by it but I'm thinking I might implement what I did on one of my DSM builds before for lag... we shall see ;-)

QSV?

[britishturbo]

QSV?

No that's for a T4 housing, I have a T3... I hear they work really nicely though on a twin scroll setup.
No I'm talking about something quite different... :-P

[Meow]

No that's for a T4 housing, I have a T3... I hear they work really nicely though on a twin scroll setup.
No I'm talking about something quite different... :-P

laughing gas helps. 1/8th npt thread tapper and go at it...

[britishturbo]

laughing gas helps. 1/8th npt thread tapper and go at it...

That's what I'm talking about. Nitrous Antilag. I've used it on my builds before.
It also has the side effect of being Nitrous Intercooling.
It's simply fantastic. lol

[Monty23]

Nice!

How are your IAT's looking with your water-cooler setup?

[Meow]

Also, don't take boost as the end-all-be-all of spool, its just a reference, if my maf was scaled to show normal levels we could compare that. Or we can compare g force calculations if you want... or 3.2 fats time to his 3.0 fats time (clearly faster) :)

[britishturbo]

Nice!

How are your IAT's looking with your water-cooler setup?

Shitty right now... lol I don't have enough reserve in the system, I'm going to fix that shortly.

Also, don't take boost as the end-all-be-all of spool, its just a reference, if my maf was scaled to show normal levels we could compare that. Or we can compare g force calculations if you want... or 3.2 fats time to his 3.0 fats time (clearly faster) :)

Haha yeah there's a lot more to it than just one variable...
Yeah I'm sad when I do a pull now if it's only 3.2 FATS... hehe :-P

[Monty23]

FATS takes spool out of the equation.... unless you have a very laggy setup...

[britishturbo]

FATS takes spool out of the equation.... unless you have a very laggy setup...

Exactly. I'm at full boost at FATS time :-)

Especially in higher gears. 4th is actually fantastic lol.

[Meow]

FATS takes spool out of the equation.... unless you have a very laggy setup...

Exactly, what I am saying is his car makes very comparable power to my setup currently, 3.2 vs 3.0 FATS, and overall similar flow. He spools a bit later, but makes up for it with a slightly meatier midrange 4k-5k, then falls off where mine does not.

I also rev above stock though ;)



Really wish we could compare g/s on the mafs....

[Monty23]

You could just overlay each others acceleration curves....

edit: looks like you already mentioned this above...

[britishturbo]

Exactly, what I am saying is his car makes very comparable power to my setup currently, 3.2 vs 3.0 FATS, and overall similar flow. He spools a bit later, but makes up for it with a slightly meatier midrange 4k-5k, then falls off where mine does not.

I also rev above stock though ;)



Really wish we could compare g/s on the mafs....

MAF numbers mean nothing, we are both underscaled to avoid maxing Load.
G's are easy to compare though, I'll throw your logs data up alongside mine tonight :-)