Engine Strengthening by a4darkness

[tapA4]

yes:

FYI, do NOT try and do what I did there with the heater hose. The angles don't work. I kinked the shit out of that hose when I tried it.

Thank man! Yeah, I tried to do use heater hose on some other spots where angled hoses were used...didn't turn out too good lol

[tapA4]

Ok, so I just searched for the WTF valve....couldn't find anything...does anyone have a link where I can buy one of those WTF hoses?

[a4darkness]

Props to you both for testing a verifying that heater hose (in that location) is not applicable.

Related note, just got an email that my parts have shipped from GAP!

US Plastics order as of 9am yesterday was in HODGKINS, IL, US
Verocious MS Vac Line as of 9am yesterday was in LAUREL, MD, US

I'm thinking the GAP parts will still win the race but who knows?

[a4darkness]

Ok, so I just searched for the WTF valve....couldn't find anything...does anyone have a link where I can buy one of those WTF hoses?

Certainly.

ECS
http://www.ecstuning.com/Audi-B6_A4-...ch/06a133528d/

GAP
http://genuineaudiparts.com/
(enter the number 06a133528d w/out spaces)

[spector]

Verocious was quick to send me hoses. I'm pretty sure they launched them out of a cannon.

In my experience, GAP took a while, but I think they are out in California, and I'm all the way in FL.... GAP is a great source if you're nearby. Prices are quite epic.

[a4darkness]

Oh yeah, I was just bored and posting.

GAP is actually Miramar Audi in San Diego. And when they're not slammed do ship pretty quickly. I can certainly wait three days to save almost $100 in parts, but most of the time they've shipped to me fairly quickly.

Verocious was quick to send me hoses. I'm pretty sure they launched them out of a cannon.

In my experience, GAP took a while, but I think they are out in California, and I'm all the way in FL.... GAP is a great source if you're nearby. Prices are quite epic.

Speaking of the hoses, I'm really curious to see the condition of what's under my hood right now. Can't be too good!

[tapA4]

Certainly.

ECS
http://www.ecstuning.com/Audi-B6_A4-...ch/06a133528d/

GAP
http://genuineaudiparts.com/
(enter the number 06a133528d w/out spaces)

Much appreciated!!

[a4darkness]

Looks like my order from GAP should be here tomorrow. So excited.

[PDX04a4]

man, great thread guys. i think next spring im going to take out my intake mani and go over all these stupid damn hoses and check valves. i replaced all the check valves (except the WTF check valve) last year so hopefully they are all still good. i also need to check that T, perhaps with a brass one like you have ordered, i didnt bother to check that thing it may be a source of slightly low vacuum and rough idle im experiencing right now.

the hose maze in our engine bays is ridiculous to say the least. i am not sure if you guys know about this website, but i have used it in the past for ETKA diagrams and part numbers, plus they have a small forum section as well with some tips.

www.vagcat.com
you have to sign up to access the "catalog" (the ETKA diagrams), but its easy and they dont bug you. they have diagrams for TONS of audi's, i highly recommend it for you guys if you are having problems. if you need help figuring out how to use the site, ill respond here for everyone.

one last thing, earlier this year i was having some funky readings on my boost gauge and poor performance in general and it was vacuum related (i was getting an unmetered air fault code), well turns out one hose has crumbling to pieces and it was impossible to tell. on the LEFT of your engine block is a hard pipe that runs from the pancake valve (in my case, if your pancake valve is next to your TIP than the hard pipe connects straight to your valve cover) to the front of the engine and then is connected to a elbow/bend hose that is DIRECTLY over the turbo and hooks up to the TIP. well the back side of this bend hose was completely crumbled down to the braids and had some holes in it, i dont know what prompted me to feel the hose, i think i accidentally grabbed it when i was replacing my rear coolant flange and felt the thing crumble. when i looked at the hose from the top/front it looked perfectly normal and not damaged. anyways, it was like a $10 hose and very easy to replace and fixed my engine code and helped performance. #15 in this image, part number 06B103493M

there are hoses all over the engine bay that can give you problems and they all will crack and fall apart over time.

[a4darkness]

Yeah, with 1+ you're obviously not only running higher boost but also creating a lot more heat in the engine bay.

Thanks for your contribution. Once I get this first round of parts in, I'll start going hose by hose. But maybe I'll check this one sooner than later.

Excellent call on VagCat. Used that for a few years and finally got around to getting an Intel Mac so now I can run ETKA in Parallels. It's pretty sweet. If anyone is reading this and interested in learning more, take PDX's advice and get registered over there. It's a bit wonky but surprisingly easy once you've got it figured out.

[BASARAB]

instead of using vag-cat u can also download ETKA to your computer

[Hamotee]

instead of using vag-cat u can also download ETKA to your computer

links to a download?

[a4darkness]

^^ lets keep that to PMs please. TIA fellas.

[tapA4]

man, great thread guys. i think next spring im going to take out my intake mani and go over all these stupid damn hoses and check valves. i replaced all the check valves (except the WTF check valve) last year so hopefully they are all still good. i also need to check that T, perhaps with a brass one like you have ordered, i didnt bother to check that thing it may be a source of slightly low vacuum and rough idle im experiencing right now.

the hose maze in our engine bays is ridiculous to say the least. i am not sure if you guys know about this website, but i have used it in the past for ETKA diagrams and part numbers, plus they have a small forum section as well with some tips.

www.vagcat.com
you have to sign up to access the "catalog" (the ETKA diagrams), but its easy and they dont bug you. they have diagrams for TONS of audi's, i highly recommend it for you guys if you are having problems. if you need help figuring out how to use the site, ill respond here for everyone.

one last thing, earlier this year i was having some funky readings on my boost gauge and poor performance in general and it was vacuum related (i was getting an unmetered air fault code), well turns out one hose has crumbling to pieces and it was impossible to tell. on the LEFT of your engine block is a hard pipe that runs from the pancake valve (in my case, if your pancake valve is next to your TIP than the hard pipe connects straight to your valve cover) to the front of the engine and then is connected to a elbow/bend hose that is DIRECTLY over the turbo and hooks up to the TIP. well the back side of this bend hose was completely crumbled down to the braids and had some holes in it, i dont know what prompted me to feel the hose, i think i accidentally grabbed it when i was replacing my rear coolant flange and felt the thing crumble. when i looked at the hose from the top/front it looked perfectly normal and not damaged. anyways, it was like a $10 hose and very easy to replace and fixed my engine code and helped performance. #15 in this image, part number 06B103493M

there are hoses all over the engine bay that can give you problems and they all will crack and fall apart over time.

I will say this! Number 2, 5, and 6 were all ABSOLUTELY REDIC to replace! Especially number 2

[dougyfresh]

Has this turned into the new 'how do I remove my vacuum line hoses' thread?


really?

[a4darkness]

I was shooting for something a bit more robust than that.

[tapA4]

Has this turned into the new 'how do I remove my vacuum line hoses' thread?


really?

I think it's turned into a jumald of information! hah (that has helped me a lot!)

[dougyfresh]

I was shooting for something a bit more robust than that.

Sorry. Its not working.

"engine strengthening" does not = new vacuum lines and other b/s.

'engine strengthening' does = http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php/282397

in my eyes

[PDX04a4]

I will say this! Number 2, 5, and 6 were all ABSOLUTELY REDIC to replace! Especially number 2

yes, you really need to be careful when replacing it as well, that hose tends to break and crumble (happened to me at the connection between 2 and 5 thankfully) and chunks of plastic can fall into the oil filter housing and cause problems. you have to be careful that nothing falls in there while you are replacing that elbow hose, thats why its better to actually remove the intake mani to get to those hoses. i tried reaching my arms and hands in there to change/fix the hose, ending up saying screw it and took it to my local audi indy shop. at that point i didnt have much experience in the engine bay, now i would pull the intake mani and do it all myself.

[Dan[FN]6262]

ya

[tapA4]

yes, you really need to be careful when replacing it as well, that hose tends to break and crumble (happened to me at the connection between 2 and 5 thankfully) and chunks of plastic can fall into the oil filter housing and cause problems. you have to be careful that nothing falls in there while you are replacing that elbow hose, thats why its better to actually remove the intake mani to get to those hoses. i tried reaching my arms and hands in there to change/fix the hose, ending up saying screw it and took it to my local audi indy shop. at that point i didnt have much experience in the engine bay, now i would pull the intake mani and do it all myself.

Thankfully, nothing fell in. I wasn't very experienced when changing it too. I had 3 engine diagrams while changing it. Took me 7 hours..but once I got rolling things came together.

[PDX04a4]

Sorry. Its not working.

"engine strengthening" does not = new vacuum lines and other b/s.

'engine strengthening' does = http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php/282397

in my eyes

there is some useful info in here for people who need/want to maintain their OEM vacuum system (and as old guy has explained in prior threads, it DOES serve a purpose other than continually being a source of headaches). there are quite a few vacuum system/hose threads but the main central one is about removing all that shit and not replacing it. plus there arent any real P/N's in there or places where you can order the stuff like there is in this thread. its helpful for people looking for this stuff and needing those P/N's. also the pictures are helpful visualizing diagrams and getting your hands in there.

sometimes i dont think people realize how much money they can save by just popping the hood and pulling out a hose yourself and replacing it. some of these things are in hard to reach places and a major PITA to fix, a lot arent and can be easily changed. dont be afraid to get in there and get your hands dirty and bloody (lord knows you'll get scrapes and cuts trying to squeeze your hands into those tight spaces). i have saved hundreds of dollars doing just basic engine maintenance like this.

one last thing: fuck those goddamn one time use hose clamps.

[a4darkness]

Wow dude. Harsh.

Threads like this will keep noobs from asking ridiculous questions in threads just like the one below, hence why I started this. And since I have asked many a ridiculous question, it seemed a fitting project for myself as a Stage II Noob. Okay, maybe Stage II+... when my vac lines and other b/s are working properly.

Sorry. Its not working.

"engine strengthening" does not = new vacuum lines and other b/s.

'engine strengthening' does = http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php/282397

in my eyes

[a4darkness]

Thankfully, nothing fell in. I wasn't very experienced when changing it too. I had 3 engine diagrams while changing it. Took me 7 hours..but once I got rolling things came together.

That one freaks me out a bit cause of the 'stuff falling in' part. Should be interesting once I make it there.

[a4darkness]

there is some useful info in here...

Thank you. Will continue my thread in the same manner.

one last thing: fuck those goddamn one time use hose clamps.

Yes, damn them all to hell.

[spector]

Wow dude. Harsh.

Threads like this will keep noobs from asking ridiculous questions in threads just like the one below, hence why I started this. And since I have asked many a ridiculous question, it seemed a fitting project for myself as a Stage II Noob. Okay, maybe Stage II+... when my vac lines and other b/s are working properly.

True story. Perhaps "increasing engine reliability while preserving arguably important components" would be a better title? I envision this thread to turn into more of a parts shopping list than a how-to. As others have remarked, those diagrams are a clusterfuck at best, and finding part numbers can be impossible for parts you can't see or identify. Also, improving plastic components with metal ones, and finding cheaper/newer/better versions of OEM components (check valves, suction jet pump, etc) will help a noob figure out exactly what he needs to do to replace those components.

My thoughts these days are that we should assume that 6-7 years represents the time to failure for many parts of the vac system. If you know what the total cost of all the parts is and can source it cheaply (looks like maybe $200-300 total, if you're patient) then just changing the WHOLE SYSTEM as preventative maintenance is probably a good idea. even if you paid a shop a few hours of labor to do it all for you, you're looking at $400-600 for something that eliminates what is arguably one of the most frustrating sources of problems for our cars. That's a good investment, imo.

[spector]

FWIW, I grab the rounded ends of the one time hose clamps with needle nose pliers and twist them until the thing unravels. It's a fitting end for such a bastardy piece of hardware.

[a4darkness]

True story...

Title = fixed

And there's gonna be some how-to in here, just gotta get mai parts yo! lol Granted some of this stuff is basic swapping of hoses and whatnot but if there's anything notable I'll be sure to mention it.

[spector]

Title = fixed

And there's gonna be some how-to in here, just gotta get mai parts yo! lol Granted some of this stuff is basic swapping of hoses and whatnot but if there's anything notable I'll be sure to mention it.

Haha, yeah that's what I figured. Im just noticing that a few people are liking the part number and identification steps. swapping is certainly its own battle. To try to create a comprehensive guide to the vac system and how to replace it and make it better than oem, you have your work cut out for yourself.

I 'llwork on the spreadsheet some more later, let me know if I can help with anything else.

[a4darkness]

Good call. My plan was to keep the thread running and then set up links and or something first few posts. But a a comprehensive guide sounds like a far better idea. Thanks for keeping the spreadsheet updated too.

Also, just went and picked up 40 hose clamps.

[a4darkness]

turns out one hose was crumbling to pieces #15 in this image, part number 06B103493M

Went and took a look at mine, she's okay. But considering it's location, I can see how this hose could be in poor shape. Lots of heat being generated in there. Check your hoses fellas!

[dougyfresh]

one last thing: fuck those goddamn one time use hose clamps.

McMaster Carr sells them and they also sell a tool to remove them. The clamps are clean looking (compared to a regular hose clamp) and are inexpensive to replace when buying in bulk from McMaster Carr. They are relatively easy to remove with a screwdriver.

Search vacuum lines and my screen name and you'll find a few posts of mine from a few years ago where I list out the p/n and show the tools McMaster Carr sells.

[spector]

McMaster Carr sells them and they also sell a tool to remove them. The clamps are clean looking (compared to a regular hose clamp) and are inexpensive to replace when buying in bulk from McMaster Carr. They are relatively easy to remove with a screwdriver.

Search vacuum lines and my screen name and you'll find a few posts of mine from a few years ago where I list out the p/n and show the tools McMaster Carr sells.

http://www.mcmaster.com/#pinch-clamps/=8zjkri

[a4darkness]

Spector-K, you fully jinxed my vac line delivery. Only thing that didn't show up. lol Oh, and right now it's in San Pablo (by Richmond) which is not a nice neighborhood. I hope it's safe. If not, it's on you.

Since everything else showed up I wasn't about to wait for the vac line so after it cooled down a bit (out of no where, 94deg!) I got to work.



Successfully got Regions 1 and 2 taken care of and am happy to report that my car is running quite well. The idle has ever been this quiet and smooth. Took her for a quick flogging and all is well and good. Tomorrow I'll reset the throttle body before I head out and hopefully the ECU will start to adjust. Perhaps I'll get a tad more pep. She's been running really rich of late, the fuel smell has been omnipresent. So I'm hoping there will be some adjustment. Seems like the Revo software adapts accordingly. But that's just speculation.

I know this isn't rocket science and really just replacing hoses and valves... not overly complex stuff. So, I documented what I perceived would be helpful to someone who doesn't spend a lot of time wrenching. Took a bunch of pics and whatnot, will get it organized and post accordingly.

[unkn0wnmonkey]

have everything on order (due to arrive soon) and decided to do a quick search only to find this golden thread. PURE GOLD. subscribing now ;)
great work guys!

[jonan]

how much did all that stuff cost you?

[a4darkness]

how much did all that stuff cost you?

Just realized I never posted costs. I'll use the by source breakout:

GAP
http://genuineaudiparts.com/
# 19: 058 133 753 D (Suction Pump) -> use OEM
# 21: 058 133 784 AF (3-Way Angled Hose) -> use OEM
# 22: 07C 133 529 A (3-Way Check Valve) -> use OEM
# 23: 058 133 394 D (2-Way Angled Hose) -> 90 deg bend, is inexpensive, use OEM
# 55: 8E0 133 784 B (Angled Hose, "Y" style) -> use OEM
# 58: 058 133 394 F (hose, right angled, crank case breather) -> use OEM
# 67: 06A 133 528 D (non return / crankcase vent valve) aka 'large check valve' -> use OEM
# 67: 06A 133 528 D (non return / crankcase vent valve) aka 'WTF check valve' -> use OEM
# 68: 06B 103 493 C (vent hose) -> use OEM
# 24: 06B 103 493 D (Breather Hose) -> use OEM
Items Total: $175.59
Shipping: $14.94
Tax: $0.00
Total: $190.53


# 50: 058 905 291 K (2-Way Check Valve) -> use US Plastics
x8 (buying an extra set just in case)
US Plastic 1/4" Kynar® Standard Check Valves, Item #: 64174
http://www.usplastic.com/catalog/ite...2234&catid=489
Item Total: 8 x $1.43 = $11.44
Shipping: $4.99
Tax: $0.00
Total: $16.40


Tee Fitting x1
ATP Turbo "1/4" Hose Tee, Brass 3 Way" Code: MIA-VCM-002
http://www.atpturbo.com/mm5/merchant...egory_Code=VCM
Item Total: $4.00
Shipping:$11.50
Tax: $0.37
Total: $15.87


Silicone Vac Line x10ft
# 64: 058 133 784 (Reducer Hose) -> use HH or Vac Line depending on diameter
Verocious Vacuum Hose, Platinum Cured Silicone
http://www.verociousmotorsports.com/...Cured-Silicone
Item Total: 10 x $0.94 = $9.40
Shipping: $9.00
Tax: $0.00
Total: $18.40


Hose Clamps (from OSH)
x30 (3/8-5/8) = $25.50
x10 (9/16-1 1/16) = $9.70
Total: $35.20

Grand Total: $276.40



To add a little perspective, consider this. To solve my original problem of a split Jet Suction Pump at my local dealership:

Suction Jet Pump: $53
Associated hardware: ~$3
Hourly Labor Rate: $115 (unsure if it would be just this or w/a diag fee)
Total: $171


DIY FTMFW

[jonan]

^ nice writeup, def gonna do this...my hoses are like 7 years old now =(

[BASARAB]

Links for parts do not work

[a4darkness]

Links for parts do not work

Always forget you can't cut n paste links off an AZ post. My bad. Fixed.