Throwin' Codes at 9900 miles - 2008 RS4

[bryzf1]

Here's the deal... MIL came on yesterday. I couldn't get my Vag-com work to save my life for some reason so I decided to run down the street to Auto Zone tonight and have them scan it for me. So they pull up codes 300, 301, 302. Misfires on cylinders 2, 3, 4. On top of this BS, the nearest Audi dealer to me is 275 miles away! Sucks living in the middle of nowhere. Anyway, it appears that I most likely have the carbon buildup already just before I hit 10k miles. I've had the car about 6mos w/ problem free ownership until this. I seriously think i'm just gonna take it to the dealer, have them fix it (hopefully have them take off the manifold while there God willing) and just sell the damn thing. I don't want to be dealing w/ this crap every 10k miles or less. So anyone wanna buy a clean ass 08 RS4 w/ carbon buildup!?!? I'll throw in a token pic as threads w/o pics suck!

Oh and btw... is it safe to drive the car 275 miles up to the dealer w/ this going on?

[dparm]

Yes. If the misfires are really that serious and happening all the time, the car would drive like shit. I would certainly take it easy until you can get it there.

In the meantime, pull the plugs (all of them) and inspect for obvious fouling.

[bryzf1]

The weird thing is, the car is not driving like shit though. I haven't been getting on it either since the light came on.

[RS4POWER]

Your misfires are caused by dirty/clogged injectors. Run some techron fuel additive and take the car out for a spirited drive, hold it at 5k rpms for a few stretches. CB on your IV's would have nothing to do with misfires, those occur in the CC's.

I had misfires early on. The CEL's corrected themselves in a day or so of driving. I would call the dealer and see what the advise you. Save the codes, run the additive, BG and if CEL's keep occurring then run it up to dealer.

That might help until its time to remove the IM for the scrub job

On a side note... How often do you change your oil?

275 miles?? gtfo

[bryzf1]

Your misfires are caused by dirty/clogged injectors. Run some techron fuel additive and take the car out for a spirited drive, hold it at 5k rpms for a few stretches. CB on your IV's would have nothing to do with misfires, those occur in the CC's.

I had misfires early on. The CEL's corrected themselves in a day or so of driving. I would call the dealer and see what the advise you. Save the codes, run the additive, BG and if CEL's keep occurring then run it up to dealer.

That might help until its time to remove the IM for the scrub job

On a side note... How often do you change your oil?

275 miles?? gtfo

Thanks for the info... i'll do this and see how it goes. And yes 275 miles. I live in the southeast corner of NM about 15 miles from the Texas border. The 2 nearest dealers to me are in ABQ (275 miles) and Austin, TX (~350). Oil was just changed the last time I was up in ABQ at the dealer about 500 miles ago.

BTW, what is BG?

[RS4POWER]

That is a crazy distance to travel and get the run around from the dealer on the CB saga. Which oil do you use and what is your OCI?

I use the RLI fuel additive. Car starts and idles as smooth as new.

[bryzf1]

Mobil 1 synthetic and every 5k miles... where do you purchase the RLI fuel additive?

[RS4POWER]

http://www.renewablelube.com/order.htm

Bottom right of the page.

A bunch of RS4's get their oil as well. 5k on mobil one seems a little too long for this motor. I would keep it under 3k or get an oil with a higher flash point.

If you want more info hit me a PM.

[bryzf1]

PM Sent

[ArthurPE]

have you had the coil recall done?

[bryzf1]

have you had the coil recall done?

I knew there was a recall on the coil packs for my allroad, but was unaware that there was a recall for the RS4.

[theedge111]

I knew there was a recall on the coil packs for my allroad, but was unaware that there was a recall for the RS4.

There isn't a recall for your 08 rs4...2007-2008 S4 and 2008 RS4 got the new coilpacks from the factory.

[JimmyBones]

I knew there was a recall on the coil packs for my allroad, but was unaware that there was a recall for the RS4.

I didn't think the RS4s needed coils because they are the newer style. PM me your Vin and I can check real fast for you.

Also BG is a company that makes additives and products to make your car last longer and run better. RS4POWER was probably recommending a can of BG's 44k fuel additive because it helps and it is a very aggressive fuel system cleaner. Here is a link to BG's website: http://www.bgprod.com/home.html

[RS4POWER]

I didn't think the RS4s needed coils because they are the newer style. PM me your Vin and I can check real fast for you.

Also BG is a company that makes additives and products to make your car last longer and run better. RS4POWER was probably recommending a can of BG's 44k fuel additive because it helps and it is a very aggressive fuel system cleaner. Here is a link to BG's website: http://www.bgprod.com/home.html

Jimmy shed some light on what you believe is causing this CB saga.

The BG treatment I am talking about is both the fuel additive and by chemical induction. I doubt induction does anything for IV's that are already built with carbon. However it might help as a preventative measure for new cars or those that had the IM removed and the valves scrubbed.

[ArthurPE]

go to Audi USA
owners
check to see if it is subject
mine is 2007 RS4 supposed to get the letter this month

[FarmerBob]

Sorry to hear about your CEL's, and the 275 mile drive. Having had bad experiences with Audi dealerships, I guess I would call them first and see if they can vouch for you doing the fuel additive thing and driving it at 5K rpms. If they do, get a name and then try it. If they say bring it in, then I'd tow it in, instead of running the risk that you don't fix it with your fuel additive thing, and then they blame you for making it worse and deny your warranty repair. I don't trust dealerships, based on personal experience.

[RS4POWER]

FarmerBob,

I echo your concerns and your advice is sound. FWIW the fuel additive and 5k rpm "remedy" is what the techs do when you take your car in the first time for misfire related issues/cel's.
This seems to be the first of many steps your car must go through before they run out of excuses and open your IM. Some dealers are more cooperative than others.

Oh and now they have a ecu update which increases the tolerance for CEL's due to misfires.

[bryzf1]

Thanks for the info guys... i'll be on the phone w/ the dealer first thing on monday and see what they have to say.

[Tooney]

if you just sell the damn thing, i wanna just buy the damn thing

[bryzf1]

if you just sell the damn thing, i wanna just buy the damn thing

make me an offer

[dparm]

Tree-fiddy

[JimmyBones]

Jimmy shed some light on what you believe is causing this CB saga.

The BG treatment I am talking about is both the fuel additive and by chemical induction. I doubt induction does anything for IV's that are already built with carbon. However it might help as a preventative measure for new cars or those that had the IM removed and the valves scrubbed.

Here is what I posted on a thread in the B8 S4 board and I must warn you it uses a lot of technical terms:

As far as carbon build up goes my understanding of the cause has more to do with the internal EGR (exhaust gas recirculation) function of the variable valve timing that the engine uses during low and light load settings like highway cruising. Don't quote me (because only I can do that - like in this situation) on this but the explanation that I received was the the FSI engines push a portion of the old burnt junk (or carbon and other crap) back from the last combustion cycle into the intake manifold during the internal EGR (exhaust gas recirculation) function, using the valve overlap from the variable valve timing, to help cool the combustion chamber during very lean driving conditions that way reducing oxides of nitrogen emissions and increasing highway fuel economy. - If was way to geeky and over your heads I am sorry but it is what I remember of the guy explaining it to me. The short and sweet explanation is that the carbon build up is a unfortunate normal byproduct of their design and they have not found a good way to fix it yet.

There is also three parts to that BG induction service that we do at my shop. We add the 44k fuel additive to the gas, run a very harsh fuel cleaner through the fuel rail and injectors (but we are not currently set up to do FSI engines due to the very high pressure), and use a intake cleaner that sprays through the intake manifold and over the intake valves. I personally have had a lot of luck with that service on both customers' cars and my car with carbon build up because even the older non-FSI engines build up carbon from the PCV system. For example one of my customer's with a 3.0 V6 had a issue with the check engine light flashing and misfiring after putting new coils and a new catalytic converter in, which was caused by carbon build up in the intake manifold and bad spark plugs. I did the BG induction service and changed the plugs and have not heard back from her yet.

On a side note, I do feel bad for you RS4 guys because it is such a nice car but the issues that happen with it suck. One of my RS4 customers is waiting on me to finish up his DRC shocks, upper control arms, and four tires with an alignment at 27K miles, right now. He also babies the car so I will probably see this car back for the misfire and carbon build up issue in ten thousand more miles for the second time because he had me pull the intake manifold and clean the valves at his 15k service.

[SoCalS4Avant]

Damn, Bryan, I"m really bummed to hear about this.

Unfortunately, it seems that until Audi has a permanent fix for CB, you'll be doing a CB cleaning every so often anyway. Even if this is not CB-related, it's still a pain in the ass to have to get to a dealer. I'd say definitely clarify with the shop on the "ok to drive or not" issue. Hate to pay for a 275 mile tow if you didn't have to.

Keep us updated.

[bryzf1]

Here is what I posted on a thread in the B8 S4 board and I must warn you it uses a lot of technical terms:



There is also three parts to that BG induction service that we do at my shop. We add the 44k fuel additive to the gas, run a very harsh fuel cleaner through the fuel rail and injectors (but we are not currently set up to do FSI engines due to the very high pressure), and use a intake cleaner that sprays through the intake manifold and over the intake valves. I personally have had a lot of luck with that service on both customers' cars and my car with carbon build up because even the older non-FSI engines build up carbon from the PCV system. For example one of my customer's with a 3.0 V6 had a issue with the check engine light flashing and misfiring after putting new coils and a new catalytic converter in, which was caused by carbon build up in the intake manifold and bad spark plugs. I did the BG induction service and changed the plugs and have not heard back from her yet.

On a side note, I do feel bad for you RS4 guys because it is such a nice car but the issues that happen with it suck. One of my RS4 customers is waiting on me to finish up his DRC shocks, upper control arms, and four tires with an alignment at 27K miles, right now. He also babies the car so I will probably see this car back for the misfire and carbon build up issue in ten thousand more miles for the second time because he had me pull the intake manifold and clean the valves at his 15k service.

Thanks for the detailed response! This being the case, I have no desire to deal w/ this throughout the life of the vehicle. This is my own fault for not thinking it was that big of an issue and researching it enough prior to purchasing the car. My wife and I had a long hard discussion about the situation today and we're just gonna take it to dealer this week, "fix" the issue at hand, sell it, and buy a car w/o a direct injection motor. I'm leaning towards buying a E63 AMG wagon... anyone know of any issues w/ that car of the top of their head aside from going thru rear tires every 5k miles? Maybe even a a6 or a4 avant which would be difficult downgrading in terms of performance though. But I do have my 700hp allroad to keep me entertained which is almost done being built.

Damn, Bryan, I"m really bummed to hear about this.

Unfortunately, it seems that until Audi has a permanent fix for CB, you'll be doing a CB cleaning every so often anyway. Even if this is not CB-related, it's still a pain in the ass to have to get to a dealer. I'd say definitely clarify with the shop on the "ok to drive or not" issue. Hate to pay for a 275 mile tow if you didn't have to.

Keep us updated.

I'll update this thread after I take the car in on friday of this week for sure!

[JimmyBones]

Thanks for the detailed response! This being the case, I have no desire to deal w/ this throughout the life of the vehicle. This is my own fault for not thinking it was that big of an issue and researching it enough prior to purchasing the car. My wife and I had a long hard discussion about the situation today and we're just gonna take it to dealer this week, "fix" the issue at hand, sell it, and buy a car w/o a direct injection motor. I'm leaning towards buying a E63 AMG wagon... anyone know of any issues w/ that car of the top of their head aside from going thru rear tires every 5k miles? Maybe even a a6 or a4 avant which would be difficult downgrading in terms of performance though. But I do have my 700hp allroad to keep me entertained which is almost done being built.

Owning a RS4 is not for everyone and it is your choice but my customers that push their cars and drive them hard do not usually have very many issues other than normal maintenance. I kid you not one of them has never had a CEL/MIL flash for a misfire but he listened to me when I did his 5k service so he lets his car heat up to operating temperature with some slow/low rpm driving and then hammers on it a couple times. Though that guy also scares the crap out of me with his driving but that is a personal choice and I make sure that I put on my seat belt when I go on test drives with him.

The RS6s are the same way with how they should be driven and my Master Guild team leader has the most problems with the RS6s that come in and the owner babies it. If you RS4 guys think repairs are expensive then try owning a RS6 with service position being the engine and transmission removed.

[mattlqx]

Thanks for the detailed response! This being the case, I have no desire to deal w/ this throughout the life of the vehicle. This is my own fault for not thinking it was that big of an issue and researching it enough prior to purchasing the car. My wife and I had a long hard discussion about the situation today and we're just gonna take it to dealer this week, "fix" the issue at hand, sell it, and buy a car w/o a direct injection motor. I'm leaning towards buying a E63 AMG wagon... anyone know of any issues w/ that car of the top of their head aside from going thru rear tires every 5k miles? Maybe even a a6 or a4 avant which would be difficult downgrading in terms of performance though. But I do have my 700hp allroad to keep me entertained which is almost done being built.

I'll update this thread after I take the car in on friday of this week for sure!

Ditto, same boat here pretty much. My decision is just also being pushed along by a baby coming.

I will say that after the carbon cleaning the engine behaves differently for the better. If you've had it from new, you might not have noticed the slow degradation these engines have but driven back-to-back, you will notice it. Good luck!

[bryzf1]

Owning a RS4 is not for everyone and it is your choice but my customers that push their cars and drive them hard do not usually have very many issues other than normal maintenance. I kid you not one of them has never had a CEL/MIL flash for a misfire but he listened to me when I did his 5k service so he lets his car heat up to operating temperature with some slow/low rpm driving and then hammers on it a couple times. Though that guy also scares the crap out of me with his driving but that is a personal choice and I make sure that I put on my seat belt when I go on test drives with him.

The RS6s are the same way with how they should be driven and my Master Guild team leader has the most problems with the RS6s that come in and the owner babies it. If you RS4 guys think repairs are expensive then try owning a RS6 with service position being the engine and transmission removed.

I drive my car hard quite often... I do some in town driving as well which does not afford me the ability to get on it every day. The cost of the repairs themselves is not what concerns me, it's the simple fact that it's a complete pain in the ass and I have no desire for it. I have no problem shelling about 1k every year and a half or less for a carbon cleaning, but considering the fact that I live where I do and I'll have to be driving about 4 hrs to get the work done is the hassle especially when I can buy a E63 or comparable car w/o direct injection and be just as happy.

[bryzf1]

Well i've got a quick update in case anyone is interested.

Drove up to the dealer on Thursday morning and put in a bottle of Techron fuel system cleaner in the car before I made the trek up to the dealer. On a side note, I did put another bottle of Techron in the car last Sunday as well and put some miles on the car and the MIL did not go away. I decided to throw another bottle in the car for my 275 mile drive and then topped the car off w/ gas. By the time I got into town, the MIL was still there but I did not notice any misfiring on the cold start that morning.

The dealer had the car for a majority of the day on Thursday and 1/2 day on Friday and the car did not misfire once. They put the Audi fuel system cleaner in there and gave me the typical response from what i've read in other threads. "Put the Audi cleaner in, drive it for 60miles, let sit over night and see if there is any misfiring on cold start" Well no misfiring on cold start yesterday, they cleared the MIL, gave me another bottle of Audi cleaner to add in 3k miles and send me on my merry way. :/ I assume that I must have just had some bad gas on that prior fill up to cause the misfiring... I don't know.

I personally did not pull the plugs. I asked them to, but they said since it did not misfire at all and the car ran just fine for them that they couldn't justify doing it. So do you guys think that it may have just been bad gas?