Question on Turbo set ups.

[tshay1]

hey guys looking for some advice, i just bought a 2001 1.8t awd a4. i enjoy modifying my cars for performance before looks. the car is already in amazing condition and fast but i want faster. But I don't wanna go crazy. So I was thinking a k04 with a fmic and a apr ecu. however i also know that the car is Maf and not map. i would like to have a bov. so my question is if i move the MAF to the throttle body side of the engine. then i would put the bov before the MAF so that the MAF will compensate for the release of air into the atmosphere, but will the maf be able to handle the boost or will i need to upgrade the MAF. If I have stated anything wrong please let me know. i had a turbo maxima but recently sold it. i had a simular set up as i decribed and i had to upgrade the MAF to that off a Land Rover Discovery.

[a408]

blank?

[GR-RALLYE]

your 01 so your able to run mafless, because you do have a map sensor.

as for the bov do a search on it there's a lot of bov vs dv threads, get the forge hybrid one or recirculate the bov. audis dont like bov's

[a408]

if you jump into a stock turbo (k03) with just bolt ons like chip exhaust, then you hop into a k04 car with the right tune, injectors and tune, you will notice the difference is pretty minimal, but it is much less of a headache than bigger setups. IMO i would get the flash, exhaust, and the FMIC, then do some research on bigger turbo setups. everyone is going to tell you to skip the k04 and go BT (gt28xx +)

[myb5quattro]

if you DO end up going BT, I'll buy your turbo!

[champion]

your 01 so your able to run mafless, because you do have a map sensor.

audis dont like bov's

I had an hks bov on my 01 a4 and i never had any CEL's or any codes from the bov. Ppl need to stop spreading the AUDI/BOV rumor around

[Seerlah]

The 01 (AWM) engine has both a map and MAF sensor. And you can't move the MAF to the other side of the engine and expect your car to run properly (I really don't know what would happen if you did that, or even know why anyone would attempt such a task). The MAF is located on the throttle inlet to the turbo and measure the amount of air it takes into the intake. You need this there for your ECU to have proper readings of air to fuel ratio.

The MAF can't and won't compensate for anything (other than it's original purpose). It is simply there to read how much air you are taking into your system. It's just a sensor, but an important one. What you can do, is move the the by pass valve (diverter valve/blow off valve) to the cold side of your intercooler piping. It is supposed to grant better throttle reponse when coming on and off the throttle quickly, due to the blow back having less travel (so, what I was told). And it is in an easier location for service, removal, and so forth. But none of this will grant you any more hp/tq than what you already have. You need to do actual mods to achieve this, and not just move things around.

Adding an larger turbo will grant you more hp/tq obviously, and that seems like what you want to do. I would personally suggest you stay away from the k04-15 turbo, and look for something larger. With an ECU flash for the stock turbo, the AWM (01 motor) will have maybe 25chp less power than that of the k04-15. But there is a substantial torque difference. I would suggest you look into the Eliminator setups, if not going full frame custom. Clicky Click. With the AWM, you have the option of going MAFless. Meaning you can remove the throttole inlet pipe, things associated with it, and just slap on a filter onto the compressor inlet. This is due to the fact that you have a wideband primary 02 sensor (only in the 01 for the B5 A4) and a map sensor. The drawback is, you will not have precise load calculations at idle. But while cruising, things are all the same (or maybe cruising load differs also???). So, you won't have a clean calm idle. You will also need to do something about your pcv system. Then other things associated with it stays the same, such as tune, larger injectors, different fpr, upgraded clutch, different intercooler setup, etc. Or you can get a tune which requires a MAF and do it just like how all the other B5 A4 guys do it.

My suggestion is to learn more about your vehicle before you jump into modding it. And welcome to Audizine!

[CrtchRktRcr]

really seerlah? you had to type a book when i'm this hungover!? i'm just gonna assume you told him no bov, that it's quattro, he can go mafless and talk to ctapp about that, to get a tune now and save for big turbo after running a compression test etc?

[GetBoosted84]

I had an hks bov on my 01 a4 and i never had any CEL's or any codes from the bov. Ppl need to stop spreading the AUDI/BOV rumor around

Did you recirc the bov? That's normally the issue that people with a maf run into since you're working on metered air. I tuned my car to be mafless so I run a synapse bov vented to atmosphere but I am ignoring the maf.

[champion]

Did you recirc the bov? That's normally the issue that people with a maf run into since you're working on metered air. I tuned my car to be mafless so I run a synapse bov vented to atmosphere but I am ignoring the maf.

No recirc. Straight to the atmosphere. That's why I don't understand why so many ppl will say it throws CEL's.

[GetBoosted84]

No recirc. Straight to the atmosphere. That's why I don't understand why so many ppl will say it throws CEL's.

When I did that back when I still ran an n75 valve, the computer was correcting for the missing input since my Maf readings were 0 cfm. Never got a cel though.

[dcampana]

DAMN Seerlah!!! you went for it with that.

skip the little setups and go at minimum of GT28..... best bang for your buck.

However if you think the car is fast stock, well my friend find someone that is local (in regional forums) and see if you can go for a ride in a BT car. the stock A4 is pig slow...

[bob12312357]

your 01 so your able to run mafless, because you do have a map sensor.

as for the bov do a search on it there's a lot of bov vs dv threads, get the forge hybrid one or recirculate the bov. audis dont like bov's

Bullshit.I have a BOV straight to atmosphere and there are no CELS or problems at all. Car is exactly the same as b4 when I had the bailys DV.

[Dynamite]

BOVs don't always cause a CEL what they will do is slightly increase lag because the DV forces the air which has no where to go from the intake after the turbo into the intake before the turbo when the throttle is closed, this causes there to be more air already in the intake just before the turbo for the turbo to compress it rather than it having to suck air in from outside the car like it dose with a BOV. It will also make the car run slightly rich when the DV would normally be venting into the intake and instead the BOV is venting into the atmosphere. The ecu assumes that the car is using a completely closed system which means it thinks that the air you BOV just vented is in the intake when its not. I dont see why you would want to run a BOV but if you insist get a hybrid one that will vent some back into the intake. I have never used a BOV so I cant say I know what the difference would be, but I wouldn't think it would be noticeable at all. and you power will be exactly the same.
If you want a to do a turbo upgrade go with a gt28xx, probably an elim, they dont cost much more than a K04 and produce much more power and torque, and you can still use stock internals. the only upgrade you wont get away with for as long without is the clutch, the rest you need on a k04 with PC16 tune as well, and there is no point going with any less.
I have not seen a maf moved to the compressed side of the intake system, but I dont think it would work at all. by moving it to the compressed side then it is trying to measure the flow of compressed air rather than air at atmospheric pressure so it will not give correct readings as the ecu will think that the readings it is getting are for the intake air velocity at atmospheric pressure not at 1 bar of boost or what ever your tune happens to run. this will cause it to think that there is a lot less air in the system than there actually is making the engine run lean and possibly go boom. Although the MAP may cause it to realize something is wrong. The ecu uses the velocity measured by the maf to estimate the amount of air going into the engine to add the correct amount of fuel, the MAF dose not measure the amount of air directly on the velocity.
Do research before you start modding, these are not jap cars you cant just slap shit on and expect them to go better. Start with a chip, FMIC, n710 or forge DV/hybrid and a 2.75inch exhaust system.
then start looking at bigger turbos suspension brakes etc.

[QuattrOZZy]

first thing to do is look up your local APR or GIAC dealer, get in your car, drive there as fast as posible(i mean seriously drive it like you stole it). tell them to chip it imediately. get back in your car and drive home. jiz in your pants.

after that everything else is cents on the dollar, untill you go BT :)

[bob12312357]

BOVs don't always cause a CEL what they will do is slightly increase lag because the DV forces the air which has no where to go from the intake after the turbo into the intake before the turbo when the throttle is closed, this causes there to be more air already in the intake just before the turbo for the turbo to compress it rather than it having to suck air in from outside the car like it dose with a BOV. It will also make the car run slightly rich when the DV would normally be venting into the intake and instead the BOV is venting into the atmosphere. The ecu assumes that the car is using a completely closed system which means it thinks that the air you BOV just vented is in the intake when its not. I dont see why you would want to run a BOV but if you insist get a hybrid one that will vent some back into the intake. I have never used a BOV so I cant say I know what the difference would be, but I wouldn't think it would be noticeable at all. and you power will be exactly the same.
If you want a to do a turbo upgrade go with a gt28xx, probably an elim, they dont cost much more than a K04 and produce much more power and torque, and you can still use stock internals. the only upgrade you wont get away with for as long without is the clutch, the rest you need on a k04 with PC16 tune as well, and there is no point going with any less.
I have not seen a maf moved to the compressed side of the intake system, but I dont think it would work at all. by moving it to the compressed side then it is trying to measure the flow of compressed air rather than air at atmospheric pressure so it will not give correct readings as the ecu will think that the readings it is getting are for the intake air velocity at atmospheric pressure not at 1 bar of boost or what ever your tune happens to run. this will cause it to think that there is a lot less air in the system than there actually is making the engine run lean and possibly go boom. Although the MAP may cause it to realize something is wrong. The ecu uses the velocity measured by the maf to estimate the amount of air going into the engine to add the correct amount of fuel, the MAF dose not measure the amount of air directly on the velocity.
Do research before you start modding, these are not jap cars you cant just slap shit on and expect them to go better. Start with a chip, FMIC, n710 or forge DV/hybrid and a 2.75inch exhaust system.
then start looking at bigger turbos suspension brakes etc.

Lag is exactly the same ... If your talking about 10 micro seconds I could careless. Theres no perceptibale diffrence what so ever.

[champion]

Lag is exactly the same ... If your talking about 10 micro seconds I could careless. Theres no perceptibale diffrence what so ever.

x2
i run bov and always will

[terraflata]

If you are mafless the BOV wont throw a code or cause issues because the MAF is what causes issues on car with BOVs. (Venting metered air)

[stevejones19]

BOVs don't always cause a CEL what they will do is slightly increase lag because the DV forces the air which has no where to go from the intake after the turbo into the intake before the turbo when the throttle is closed, this causes there to be more air already in the intake just before the turbo for the turbo to compress it rather than it having to suck air in from outside the car like it dose with a BOV. It will also make the car run slightly rich when the DV would normally be venting into the intake and instead the BOV is venting into the atmosphere. The ecu assumes that the car is using a completely closed system which means it thinks that the air you BOV just vented is in the intake when its not. I dont see why you would want to run a BOV but if you insist get a hybrid one that will vent some back into the intake. I have never used a BOV so I cant say I know what the difference would be, but I wouldn't think it would be noticeable at all. and you power will be exactly the same.
If you want a to do a turbo upgrade go with a gt28xx, probably an elim, they dont cost much more than a K04 and produce much more power and torque, and you can still use stock internals. the only upgrade you wont get away with for as long without is the clutch, the rest you need on a k04 with PC16 tune as well, and there is no point going with any less.
I have not seen a maf moved to the compressed side of the intake system, but I dont think it would work at all. by moving it to the compressed side then it is trying to measure the flow of compressed air rather than air at atmospheric pressure so it will not give correct readings as the ecu will think that the readings it is getting are for the intake air velocity at atmospheric pressure not at 1 bar of boost or what ever your tune happens to run. this will cause it to think that there is a lot less air in the system than there actually is making the engine run lean and possibly go boom. Although the MAP may cause it to realize something is wrong. The ecu uses the velocity measured by the maf to estimate the amount of air going into the engine to add the correct amount of fuel, the MAF dose not measure the amount of air directly on the velocity.
Do research before you start modding, these are not jap cars you cant just slap shit on and expect them to go better. Start with a chip, FMIC, n710 or forge DV/hybrid and a 2.75inch exhaust system.
then start looking at bigger turbos suspension brakes etc.

I wish when people would type out a lot of info like this, paragraphs were used more. I would like to read that, but its just too much. lol

[SpoolinPelican]

I ran a BOV for a long time and never had any "issues" or CEL. After I went back to a DV however, I noticed that driveability is 50 times better. FWIW, I am still running the DV.