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  1. #1
    Veteran Member Four Rings
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    How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

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    --
    EDIT 9/10/12: This is no longer as accurate as I'd like it to be. Will be updating it over the next few days. See this post for now: http://msruns.com/viewtopic.php?f=87&t=22556
    --



    What it is:
    • Full standalone engine management

    What it isn't:
    • Plug & play (edit 9/10/12 - you can make it plug n play, if you have a spare/broken stock ECU you can remove the connector from. documentation forthcoming)
    • Backed by a company. If you have problems, you need to troubleshoot them yourself, or go to the message boards. If you want support, I'd suggest going with Autronic, AEM EMS or Lugtronic.


    The hardware/software used in this how to:


    Some basics:
    • can use the stock coolant & inlet air temp sensors, stock TPS, stock VR sensor, stock hall sensor (not needed unless you want to do sequential coil on plug or better control over semi-sequential fuel injection - adding the hall sensor requires more hardware mods to the MS PCB)
    • In order to keep the tacho working, you'll need to keep the stock ECU in the car, and split the VR sensor into two connections, one going to the stock ECU and the other to the MegaSquirt. If you want to get rid of the stock ECU, you could buy a tacho output kit for the MegaSquirt. I've never tried that though.
    • you'll get rid of your mass airflow sensor, but need to run a vacuum line to the ECU's map sensor.
    • MS2/Extra supports closed loop boost control using a valve like the N75 but I have not got around to that yet and won't.


    Fuel:

    This is a batch fire system. That means that there are two injector outputs on the ECU, and each one drives a pair of injectors.

    I recommend going with 2 squirts / alternating, and wiring output 1 to injectors 1/3 and output 2 to injectors 2/4.


    Ignition:
    You'll be using a wasted spark ignition, so you'll need to buy these three things:

    *You can use just about any 4-cylinder wasted spark coil pack & plug wires, I just like the 034 because they sell the matching plug wires and adapters...and we know what dwell it's good for (up to 4ms according to Javad)
    **MS2/Extra does support sequential coil on plug ignition using stock AEB coil packs, but at this time it causes the amount of cranking time required to start the car to go way up, so I'd stay away from it for now. It also requires additional hardware mods (2 more ignition drivers, and an input circuit for the hall sensor.)

    The important stuff!

    Here is a great page with the sensor pinouts and calibration values


    *the required fuel value shown here is for a 2.0l engine with 630cc injectors running at 4 bar fuel pressure. yours will likely be different.


    Update: correct trigger angle is 78 degrees.

    Here's a timing map to get you started:
    Code:
    260	9	9	9	9	8	6	6	6	6	6	6	6
    230	9	8.8	8	8	8	7.5	7.5	8	8	8	8	8
    200	12	12	12	12	12	11	11	11	11.5	11.5	11.5	11.5
    150	10	10.8	16	16	16	16	16	16	16	16	16	16
    100	10	10.8	20	20	20	20	20	28	28	28	28	28
    80	10	16	28	28	28	28	28	35	35	35	35	35
    70	10	16	28	28	28	28	28	35	35	35	35	35
    60	10	16	28	28	28	28	28	35	35	35	35	35
    50	10	16	28	28	28	28	28	35	35	35	35	35
    40	10	15	28	28	28	28	28	35	35	35	35	35
    30	10	15	28	28	28	28	28	35	35	35	35	35
    20	10	15	28	28	28	28	28	35	35	35	35	35
    	700	800	1000	1500	2000	2500	3000	4000	4500	5000	6000	7000
    Caveats:
    • Just like any other standalone, it won't work on a DBW car unless you convert it to cable-throttle
    • You won't be able to use your air conditioning (edit 9/10/12 - this might not be completely true, more research needs to be done but I already removed the AC from my car, so someone else would have to figure ito ut.)
    • Your car will not pass OBD-II inspection
    • Doesn't seem to support the stock throttle body's built in idle control.
    • Lack of a good knock detection solution. (edit 9/10/12 - there is now a dual channel knock module avaliable for MS3)
    Last edited by pac1085; 09-10-2012 at 07:09 AM.

  2. #2
    Veteran Member Four Rings
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    reserving this post

  3. #3
    Veteran Member Four Rings
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    and this one

  4. #4
    Veteran Member Four Rings Don Supreme's Avatar
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    very good info PAC!

  5. #5
    Senior Member Three Rings JK35's Avatar
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    AWESOME! you're the man, Pac

  6. #6
    Senior Member Three Rings b5a4gt28's Avatar
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    Wow, that is some crazy stuff...
    A4-Full-race mani, HTA 30R, Built 2.0L, AEB head, 034 IIc, 3658's, ID1000's, JM fabrications, etc...
    S4-034 tuned, 034x intake, BW K04's, OEM RS4 Goodies, EV14's, APR bi-pipe, Apikol mounts, AWE everything else.

  7. #7
    Veteran Member Four Rings arorem's Avatar
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    AWESOME!!!!!!!! my cousin is running mega squirt on his mav. I have always wanted to do it on the audi.

  8. #8
    Senior Member Two Rings NK2007's Avatar
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    you are a good man!

    Its about time someone took the leap!
    |00 A4 TQM|K04|Revolver Cams|Greddy FMIC|Custom GIAC|Full Custom Exhaust|OEM RS4|S4 Rear|S4 Interior|HID|

    More to come!

    F.S. Rieger Side Skirts in Silver- will trade for S4

  9. #9
    Veteran Member Four Rings andyrew's Avatar
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    I was surprized that none of you BT guys dont use the new Megasquirt system...

  10. #10
    Account Terminated Four Rings
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    This would be great here in the UK, a lot of the VW Golf II / III boys run MS with their 1,8T conversions.

    My questions are:

    1) How do you get your car through emissions?
    2) Is there any way to retain your DIS (Driver Information System) if fitted?

  11. #11
    Veteran Member Four Rings
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    Quote Originally Posted by Siena View Post
    1) How do you get your car through emissions?
    2) Is there any way to retain your DIS (Driver Information System) if fitted?
    1) just like any other standalone. I'm not sure how it works in the UK, but if all they do is a tail pipe sniffer, you CAN tune it to pass. However, if they require an OBD-II readiness check, you're out of luck.

    Personally, I re-install my stock injectors, maf, etc, and run the car off the stock computer for a week to pass the OBD-II inspection. They don't do the sniffer here (yet!)

    2) No clue, I don't have one in my 97. Highly doubt it can be made to work though.
    Last edited by pac1085; 12-29-2008 at 05:17 AM.

  12. #12
    Account Terminated Four Rings
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    Just the tailpipe sniffer test here.

    I'm going to be running my S8 4,2L V8 in my '96 B5 QS, but using VEMS.

    I might be able to find a way to keep the stock V6 ECU with certain parts of the original sensors hooked up to maintain the DIS function.

    We'll see.

  13. #13
    Veteran Member Two Rings
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    Great job on the Howto. Just did a second standalone install myself. Wondering how you checked timing on your car, did you use the marks on the crank pulley or the cam timing marks? If you used the crank pulley, did you do this with the frontend in the service position. I cant seem to read off the crank pulley because of the space constraints.

    Thanks.
    2001.5 A4 1.8tqms
    Pectel SQ6 ECU
    2.0 built motor w/ AEB head
    GT3071r w/ Full-Race Manifold
    725cc Injector Dynamics
    Startup Racing Contest Suspension 600/700

  14. #14
    Veteran Member Four Rings
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    Quote Originally Posted by Enclave View Post
    Great job on the Howto. Just did a second standalone install myself. Wondering how you checked timing on your car, did you use the marks on the crank pulley or the cam timing marks? If you used the crank pulley, did you do this with the frontend in the service position. I cant seem to read off the crank pulley because of the space constraints.

    Thanks.
    I had originally used the mark on the cam gear which gave me a 1st tooth angle of 78 degrees but the car never felt 'right'.

    After I built my new engine and saw the marks on the crank pulley and the plastic cover, I decided to check those with the timing light - lo and behold I was off. I then found the correct 1st tooth angle to be 80 degrees, and the car has been running great ever since.

    If it's clean down there (no gunk on the plastic cover) then you can check it without having to put the car in service position. I also don't have an AC belt so if you do that might make it harder.
    Last edited by pac1085; 12-29-2008 at 07:41 AM.

  15. #15
    Veteran Member Four Rings Don Supreme's Avatar
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    PAC,

    Do you have a recommendation for a good VEMS forum or website?

  16. #16
    Veteran Member Three Rings 1NaudiA4's Avatar
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    You could definitely tune it to pass the sniffer. I passed Illinois emissions running a 3" exhaust with no cat on my IIC. I just retarded the timing at idle a few degrees and leaned it out. Would be even easier if you have a cat.

  17. #17
    Veteran Member Four Rings
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    Quote Originally Posted by Don Supreme View Post
    PAC,

    Do you have a recommendation for a good VEMS forum or website?
    VEMS Wiki

    That's really the only place I know where to get info on VEMS. It's very weird and hard to navigate at first but once you start to understand how it works, you'll find that there is tons of info there. There's a ton of info applicable to other standalones there, too.

  18. #18
    Veteran Member Four Rings Don Supreme's Avatar
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    Quote Originally Posted by pac1085 View Post
    VEMS Wiki

    That's really the only place I know where to get info on VEMS. It's very weird and hard to navigate at first but once you start to understand how it works, you'll find that there is tons of info there. There's a ton of info applicable to other standalones there, too.
    Exactly what I was looking for... I kept ignoring the site due to the .hu domain.

  19. #19
    Registered Member Three Rings
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    VEMS is a lot of work to configure the firmware and such for. In the interest of spending less time compiling / configuring and more time driving, I would pay the extra for one from Kevin.

    The VEMS ecu is a LOT more ecu then the megasquirt though, and the real automotive connectors are really nice to have. Plus, IIRC they are surface mount components right? Vibration + non surface mount stuff isn't a great combination.
    Integrated Engineering LLC
    Your source for fine quality VW/Audi Connecting rods and engine hard parts. Applications including: 1.8t, 8v, 10v, 20v, V6 and V8...

    www.intengineering.com

  20. #20
    Veteran Member Four Rings Beemer832's Avatar
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    i have been going bakc and forth with kevin at lugtronics. His product/software looks very promising. I won't be pulling the trigger on a SEMS for quite some time but I figure mgiht as well start investigating now.

    Thanks for all the help so far guys. Good luck with your projects!

    -josh
    -josh

    98 AEB 1.8t Laser Red
    EFR 6758 with VEMS standalone in the works.

  21. #21
    Senior Member Three Rings JK35's Avatar
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    whoa! Pac, I just caught something in the "Caveats"
    You said "you cant use your A/C" ?????

    please tell me this isn't absolutely concrete, absolute, 100% for certain

    If there is no way around this, I'll be listing a full and I mean FULL Megasquirt system for sale very soon. (and by "complete" I mean every thing you could possibly buy from DIY Autotune except for the digital display kit...


    I live in Florida, and further, I just spent $$$$$ converting my A/C to Aeroquip nylon lined aerospace (braided stainless AN) lines and fittings. I GOTS ta have A/C. not even an option down here...

    What makes it so you simply CAN'T have your A/C???

  22. #22
    Registered Member One Ring
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    A few questions for you. First when you used the factory temp sensors did you disconnect them from the factory ecu or just splice into them, was not sure if the gauges would still work if they were disconnected. I am using GM sensor but would like to simplify my set up. Also do you have a nsg avaliable. Have been using the Megasquirt V3 for about six months on a 97 AEB, fuel only and a remapped factory ECU. Will be adding spark soon. It runs fair but acc enrichment is not purfect nor is starting enrichment. One really odd thing is that at idle on the fuel map is around 60 and full boost (15) is around 35, have know idea why but the A/F is around 12 a WOT. Does your fuel map look like this? Thanks

  23. #23
    Registered Member One Ring
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    Hey JK35, the ac will work just fine as long as you leave the factory ECU inplace. Mine work fine with megasquirt.

  24. #24
    Veteran Member Four Rings
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    Quote Originally Posted by yellowbird911 View Post
    A few questions for you. First when you used the factory temp sensors did you disconnect them from the factory ecu or just splice into them, was not sure if the gauges would still work if they were disconnected. I am using GM sensor but would like to simplify my set up. Also do you have a nsg avaliable. Have been using the Megasquirt V3 for about six months on a 97 AEB, fuel only and a remapped factory ECU. Will be adding spark soon. It runs fair but acc enrichment is not purfect nor is starting enrichment. One really odd thing is that at idle on the fuel map is around 60 and full boost (15) is around 35, have know idea why but the A/F is around 12 a WOT. Does your fuel map look like this? Thanks
    I installed a second coolant temp sensor, so I have one plugged into MS and one plugged into the stock computer (there's an extra port on the cylinder head coolant flange that you can install a second sensor in) I did not connect the MAT sensor back to the stock ECU, no need to.

    I'll have to post a MSQ some time...need to bust out the laptop and figure out where to host the file.

    Not sure about your fuel map, that doesn't seem right.

  25. #25
    Veteran Member Two Rings
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    Quote Originally Posted by yellowbird911 View Post
    Hey JK35, the ac will work just fine as long as you leave the factory ECU inplace. Mine work fine with megasquirt.
    Actually if you look at your pinouts, the stock ecu talks to the climate control head (depending on the year of your car). For my 2001.5, I actually had to disconnect this wire and the A/C works fine now. Only problem is that the idle control is not 100% so I can stall the car if I turn it on in stop and go traffic.
    2001.5 A4 1.8tqms
    Pectel SQ6 ECU
    2.0 built motor w/ AEB head
    GT3071r w/ Full-Race Manifold
    725cc Injector Dynamics
    Startup Racing Contest Suspension 600/700

  26. #26
    Veteran Member Four Rings
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    On my 97, the AC would only partially function(wouldn't work at idle/low load, would only come on above certain RPM's, very unpredictable) without the throttle body being plugged into the stock ECU. It worked fine when the car was running on MS as long as the throttle body was plugged into the stock ECU, but I couldn't run the car like that since I needed a TPS for MS. (and you can't splice into the TPS wires since the stock ECU is 5v closed-0v open and MS requires 0v closed-5V open)

  27. #27
    Veteran Member Two Rings
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    Mine didn't work at all until I plugged in my DBW TB. However once I disconnected the ecu from the climate control head, it worked fine. If you want to do a little experiment, try disconnecting the A/C control head from the stock ecu. Looks like pin 8,10 on your 1997 A4 ecu pinout.
    2001.5 A4 1.8tqms
    Pectel SQ6 ECU
    2.0 built motor w/ AEB head
    GT3071r w/ Full-Race Manifold
    725cc Injector Dynamics
    Startup Racing Contest Suspension 600/700

  28. #28
    Veteran Member Four Rings
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    Unfortunately I can't, since I removed the AC when I installed the built motor. Thanks for posting that though, may help some other people.

    BTW, what are you doing to make sure the AC compressor turns off at WOT? (that's why it normally needs a TPS signal, so it can shut off if you go WOT, incase you didn't know)

  29. #29
    Veteran Member Two Rings
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    Right now, I barely use the AC so I havnt thought of that. That is somewhat simple though. You could use 1 digital input and 1 pwm channel. I'm not sure how many I/O megasquirt, so you might not want to waste them on this.

    Have the A/C comp relay be controlled by the standalone and have the relay signal from the A/C control head go to your standalone. Basically like how the stock ecu is setup.

    I'm not sure if megasquirt has a dedicated a/c control setup in the software but on mine I can define the PWM as being A/C control and there are maps to turn it off based on DPS, speed, coolant temp etc...
    2001.5 A4 1.8tqms
    Pectel SQ6 ECU
    2.0 built motor w/ AEB head
    GT3071r w/ Full-Race Manifold
    725cc Injector Dynamics
    Startup Racing Contest Suspension 600/700

  30. #30
    Registered Member One Ring
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    My 98 A4 AEB is entirely stock and I have had MS installed for over two years, though I've never been able to make it run stable enough to trust. Following your how-to I've re-re-reached the I-can-idle-but-can't-drive stage because the fuel VE tables are way off. Will you be able to post an msq or fuel VE chart?

    Thanks again for the info.

  31. #31
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    i am incredibly interested in this. Keep the info coming. My goal right now is to get a mega-squirt setup and running on a stock engine so that others have a fuel map to start with and possibly lead in to true plug and play MS setups.

  32. #32
    Veteran Member Four Rings onemoremile's Avatar
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    I'm moving this to the projects subforum where it won't get lost and will reach it's intended audience.

    Excellent thread!
    Jim

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  33. #33
    Veteran Member Four Rings
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    Thanks! I'll try to update it some time.

    I can post my config file for anyone that wants it - any idea where to host the file?

  34. #34
    Senior Member Two Rings Maki's Avatar
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    Awesome project! Will be great help when I'm installing MS in my A4 this winter.
    //Marcus
    My Project

  35. #35
    Senior Member Two Rings Side-Step's Avatar
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    Just wanted to add that I have a Lugtronic PNP on my wife's Avant.

    I've been thinking of removing the OE TB and going with a non-intergrated idle curcuit and use the older IAC valve. I'm in the process of gathering parts and will post up any updates.

  36. #36
    Veteran Member Four Rings biketsai's Avatar
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    Quote Originally Posted by Side-Step View Post
    Just wanted to add that I have a Lugtronic PNP on my wife's Avant.

    I've been thinking of removing the OE TB and going with a non-intergrated idle curcuit and use the older IAC valve. I'm in the process of gathering parts and will post up any updates.
    Let us know how that goes!
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  37. #37
    Active Member Four Rings schmally's Avatar
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    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    Quote Originally Posted by JK35 View Post
    whoa! Pac, I just caught something in the "Caveats"
    You said "you cant use your A/C" ?????

    please tell me this isn't absolutely concrete, absolute, 100% for certain

    If there is no way around this, I'll be listing a full and I mean FULL Megasquirt system for sale very soon. (and by "complete" I mean every thing you could possibly buy from DIY Autotune except for the digital display kit...


    I live in Florida, and further, I just spent $$$$$ converting my A/C to Aeroquip nylon lined aerospace (braided stainless AN) lines and fittings. I GOTS ta have A/C. not even an option down here...

    What makes it so you simply CAN'T have your A/C???
    yes sir hot and muggy as balls!!!!!!!!!!!!
    Gcc's blacksheep

  38. #38
    Registered Member One Ring
    Join Date
    Jun 20 2009
    AZ Member #
    44001
    Location
    Huddersfield, UK

    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    Hi guys,
    Just started the conversion of an AEB motor to megasquirt injection as it has found it's way into the engine bay of my mk2 Golf!
    Interesting thread you have going here I can host the file for you if you want to mail me it to monza20vt AT hdvag.co.uk :)
    I have a couple of base maps for the 1.8t engines and will keep updating this thread as I progress over the next few weeks/months :)
    The only thing I am unsure on at the moment is the ignition side of things as the coil on plug setup looks a bit tricky but I think I have that sorted now have to use wasted spark and treat each COP as a seperate coil.
    Will keep an eye on this thread, any wiring info you have greatly received. :)

  39. #39
    Registered Member One Ring
    Join Date
    May 17 2008
    AZ Member #
    28885
    My Garage
    AEB quattro
    Location
    Bulgaria

    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    Quote Originally Posted by Side-Step View Post
    Just wanted to add that I have a Lugtronic PNP on my wife's Avant.

    I've been thinking of removing the OE TB and going with a non-intergrated idle curcuit and use the older IAC valve. I'm in the process of gathering parts and will post up any updates.
    Why do you want to do that? Is the Idle motor not doing the job properly?
    I installed my lugtronic today and the idle is not bad even with his basic settings.
    Last edited by yanmar; 06-29-2009 at 02:42 PM.

  40. #40
    Senior Member Two Rings Side-Step's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 05 2007
    AZ Member #
    16141
    My Garage
    Wife's 99.5 Avant,99 Dodge CTD,Wife's 05 S4 Avant
    Location
    Charleston, SC, East coast

    Re: How to - MegaSquirt on the 1.8t

    For the A/C.

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