Didn't use my blinker to change into a off-ramp, didnt cross any lines though.

[4A Play]

So basically a local cop was following me waiting for me to make a mistake. It about 11pm last monday night on the empty high-way. Just me and the cop, he was directly behind me, close enough for me to see the lights on the roof of his car in my mirrors. I knew he was there.

So Im doing the speed limit, minding my own business when my exit comes up, I make sure to slow my speed and I merged onto the off-ramp. I get to the bottom of the ramp and stop at the light and notice the cop is still behind me. I flick on my blinker, wait for the light, and make my turn when it turns green. After I make my turn the cop turns on his lights and I pull right over, I kind of expected it.

So he walks up to the car and tells me I didnt use my blinker for the off-ramp. "Sorry officer, I was just on my way home from the hospital and might have forgotten to use it." Ok, whatever, maybe hes right. I told him that I dont know why I wouldnt have used my blinker for the off-ramp but then would remember to use it at the stop light. I honestly do not remember if I used it.

So he walks to his car and comes back 15 minutes later. By this time two more police cars have rolled up and are now parking me in with their lights all flashing. :bs: When he gets back to the car he tells me hes going to cut me a break, im getting a ticket for no blinker, but hes going to excuse my registration card being signed in pencil!

No biggie, I just sit there and ask him how much, $108. Then I ask if there are any points on it. He tells me "Not that I know of, but thats for PennDot to decide." I knew that was bull****. So instead of giving me a ticket for the pencil signed registration thats no points, he wrtes me up for a moving violation.

So I tell my dad a few days later and he freaks the hell out. "Why the hell would some dick cop follow you for no reason and then give you a bull**** ticket?"

My dad was mad, He was yelling about how he cant believe there are 5 bars within 6 miles that serve under-age and they are busting his sons balls driving home from work, to put himself through med-school whose never been in trouble ever before. Blah blah blah.

So he tells me that there is no way I am paying that ticket and its a load of ****, etc., etc.

I went and took the same exit off of 222 lastnight and noticed something, there are no pavement markings denoting a lane change. The shoulder white line just stops where the off -ramp is. And then starts again after the off-ramp lane. Other off-ramps are a broken white shoulder line. So Do I actually have any hope in front of a judge saying that I was just getting my balls busted and that I never crossed a lane of traffic or into someone elses plain of travel to make my exit from the high-way? I checked the PA DMV codes 3334 SubSec 9 which was cited on the ticket and there is no mention of needing a blinker unless a new lane is clearly indicated or If I intend to change Directions. As my dad puts it, "You were just staying in the Right-most lane you possibly could have."

He fully plans to rip the cop a new one when we get in court. Do I need to stop him from making himself look like an ass? Hes just upset that I've never gotten in trouble and there are a lot better things for the cops to be doing on a monday night on christmas vacation.

PS, I have been driving for 5 years, Not a single ticket.

Ill upload a paint shop pic to show what Im talking about.

[B6JoeS4]

Here in illinois, cops get paid for working overtime. he was probably just desperate to ruin someones day. I would say definitely fight that in court. drive that cop to the ground to make sure he never does it again. thats my $0.02

[sean1.8t]

here in utah, crossing lanes or not, if you change from one lane to another. you must indicate it with the blinker.

not sure on your states laws, but here and most other states, you'd be in the wrong, and he'd be in the right.

and im sure that cop was not there "just to ruin someone's day". you did something wrong, and you got caught.

on a side note, i HATE people that don't use their blinkers

[Seerlah]

I was told before that if a police officer follows you for a certain amount of time and does not pull you over, it is a form of harrassment. This is just what I was told or heard before. Might want to research the validity of that to maybe help you in your case, as I am more than sure you are going to plead not-guilty.

[sean1.8t]

I was told before that if a police officer follows you for a certain amount of time and does not pull you over, it is a form of harrassment. This is just what I was told or heard before. Might want to research the validity of that to maybe help you in your case, as I am more than sure you are going to plead not-guilty.

if the cop was cop was following him around many turns and miles around town then i would consider that harassment. but not following for x miles on the freeway.

i follow people for 10,20,100 miles on the freeway. i wouldn't exactly call that harassment

[Seerlah]

^ Good point.

[geeky]

have you ever thought of maybe just stopping your father and taking a differal on the case?

[ShawFM]

...

i follow people for 10,20,100 miles on the freeway. i wouldn't exactly call that harassment

More like stalking

[S E B]

It's $108 pay the ticket, move on with your life, chances are you'll never see that dickhead cop again.

Court fees would cost you more...

[ShawFM]

It's $108 pay the ticket, move on with your life, chances are you'll never see that dickhead cop again.

Court fees would cost you more...

In Illinois 3 moving violations in 12 months results in a suspended license.
Depending on the laws where he is at I would fight it or go to the driving school option if offered.

[4A Play]

I 100% agree that it is a change in direction. But why then do some ramps have a dotted white shoulder lines which you would be forced to cross if you were exiting the high-way and others like the ramp I took which the shoulder line just stops.

I would be willing to bet I did use my blinker, I always use my blinker, its one of my pet pevs. Why wouldnt I use my blinker when exiting but then use it when stopped at the stop light? Especially when I knew the cop was following me, I was just trying to give him the benefit of the doubt.

I mailed in my $50 retainer and plead NOT GUILTY. We'll see how it goes.

[Kyle H]

I posted this in a "ask a cop" thread on another forum, I'll let you know when it gets a response.

[sean1.8t]

More like stalking

if it's a hot blonde, i consider it courting

[4A Play]

I posted this in a "ask a cop" thread on another forum, I'll let you know when it gets a response.

Thanks!

Directly from the DMV's Codes .pdf.



To me, if there was no markings seperating the lanes, How was I making a lane change? (A)

I 100% agree that I should have used the blinker just to be safe. But I would bet I DID use it and now Im looking to avoid the wrath of a dick cop move. Not trying to dodge my responsibilities.

[slideitsidewayz]

I'm pretty sure we have all been followed by a cop for an "x" amount of miles and we've all had that gut feeling that we were going to be pulled over. Usually when you're being followed by a cop...and know you are being followed by a cop...and have heard about cops looking for you to make the smallest mistake...then usually you take great precautions and use your blinker for turns you normally would for example.

If i am understanding your story and your picture correctly and that you actually did NOT use your blinker when turning off the freeway i would believe that it was a valid mistake for the cop to give you a ticket, sorry to say.

There can also be other reasons why the cop would have been following you. For example, if you were the only one on the freeway then he was allowed to follow you to the limits of his jurisdiction for make sure you were obeying the law fully and if not then he is allowed to fine you. Another example would be if your car isnt a sleeper car...meaning that it sounds tuned so it would give the cop something to be interested in, usually cars that sound, look, or seem worked get pulled over more often then stock/sleeper cars. If your car does sound tuned it would give the cop another reason to pull you over and look for something you have done wrong, even if you are already pulled over the cop can still inspect your car to make sure that there is nothing else inviolation of the law, like a broken headlight or something.

Before i bought my A4 i had a jeep grand charokee and a 1990 nissan 300zx. I drove the 300zx for one summer before it broke and is now sitting in my driveway still being worked on...anyway...i drove the 300zx for 3 months...i was pulled over 5 times and ticketed once for not having my license plate mounted to my front bumper just after installing a new bumper and getting the car repainted...that was in 2007. I have been driving the jeep as a daily drive since 2006 and i have never been pulled over, stopped or recieved a ticket, and i had a failed inspection sticker on the jeep for 2 years lol and still never got pulled over. My point is, a cop will pull over someone in a tuned car more often then a stock car.

I'm truely sorry to hear about your experience, but if you did something wrong and knew it then you deserved the ticket especially since you were aware that there was a cop behind you. But if you were unaware that you needed to signal on that exit then you can claim "mistake of law" which just means that you were unaware of the law and that you mistook the law. If you provide a valid arguement and claim "mistake of law" and can honestly prove that you mistook the law then you should have not problem getting the ticket dropped. Just DO NOT let your dad run his mouth or let lose in the courtroom, that looks bad for you and will not help you at all, in fact that will actually hurt your chances of getting the ticket dropped. you need to go in the courtroom and be honest, noble, knowledgeable, clam, and respectful. Do Not lose your cool. the more professional you act in your hearing the better the chance you have of winning your case.

Best of Luck Bro!

Happy Holidays!

[sean1.8t]

I 100% agree that it is a change in direction. But why then do some ramps have a dotted white shoulder lines which you would be forced to cross if you were exiting the high-way and others like the ramp I took which the shoulder line just stops.

I would be willing to bet I did use my blinker, I always use my blinker, its one of my pet pevs. Why wouldnt I use my blinker when exiting but then use it when stopped at the stop light? Especially when I knew the cop was following me, I was just trying to give him the benefit of the doubt.

I mailed in my $50 retainer and plead NOT GUILTY. We'll see how it goes.

when you are going to make a left hand turn at an intersection you change lanes from the left lane/only lane to the turning lane. and you do it when the yellow solid line to the left of your car stops and there is an open gap for a few car lengths then a solid white line up until the intersection.

do you have to use your blinker to change into that lane even though you move into the turning lane through the gap.........

[the city's] case and point.

[4A Play]

Best of Luck Bro!

Happy Holidays!

^Thank you sir.

That makes perfect sense. I do plan to make the plea that I mistook the law. It just doesnt make sense to me that off-ramp lanes are marked differently ever other off-ramp. If there is no difference between the off-ramps then why are the road markings not all the same.

Im pretty sure any logically thinking judge will see in my favor.

Thanks guys for all of the help!

[4A Play]

when you are going to make a left hand turn at an intersection you change lanes from the left lane/only lane to the turning lane. and you do it when the yellow solid line to the left of your car stops and there is an open gap for a few car lengths then a solid white line up until the intersection.

do you have to use your blinker to change into that lane even though you move into the turning lane through the gap.........

[the city's] case and point.

Um yes, because you are entering the on-coming lanes traffic pattern. You are crossing their right of way which has been interuptted by your right of way given by the signal light.

I never crossed any traffic patterns right of way. I just drifted into the lane bearing right, never crossing a specified range of which to operate my vehicle on the provided road-way. If I would have crossed a dotted white shoulder line then yes, I have deviated from my traffic pattern and entered a new one.

[Hamann]

cops are stupid

[Insomniac]

caught this thread in The Car Lounge. Even though you are probably guilty of not using a signal when needed. The cop in question is an ass. Go to court and ask for a break. Its only a turn signal, and no accident was caused by you NOT using it.

[4A Play]

The code clearly states that blinkers are needed to show intent to enter a traffic pattern. If I was following my lane which split in two and there were no posted markings to indicate that it was a traffic pattern shift how am I at fault for not signaling?

If the off-ramp had been marked with a dotted white line signalling where the ramp started, and where the highway kept course I would agree I am just bitching and wining. But seeing as the off-ramps all differ I dont think it is unreasonable to ask a judge what the deal is with road markings which are not coherent. Seriously guys, take a look at a few off-ramps next time you're on the highway. I bet all of you would be saying the same exact stuff I am.

[Insomniac]

I see what you're saying about there not being any road markings that you crossed, so there's no need to signal. But coming from the Judge's point of view: I think he/she will say you changed direction to exit the highway. Exiting is to go away or out; depart... Which usually is initiated with a change in direction.

I still think you can "fight it", and get a break. No points/lower fine.

[sean1.8t]

Um yes, because you are entering the on-coming lanes traffic pattern. You are crossing their right of way which has been interuptted by your right of way given by the signal light.

I never crossed any traffic patterns right of way. I just drifted into the lane bearing right, never crossing a specified range of which to operate my vehicle on the provided road-way. If I would have crossed a dotted white shoulder line then yes, I have deviated from my traffic pattern and entered a new one.

no, i wasn't pointing out that you use your signal when you actually turn left through the intersection.

i was showing you that when you change over from your lane to the turning lane through that little gap in the lines on your left, you must use your blinker to do so. you aren't crossing over any lines, but you are changing your lane.

which you went from a freeway lane, to an offramp lane.

[willowtreexx]

I say fight it and prove the cop wrong. first of all if anyone of us were to follow that close to someone else, we would get a tailgating ticket. Some cops are just dicks and need to be choped at their ego. yesterday some cop drove down the street when i was walking and threw her mcdonalds bag out the window!!

[Kyle H]

Here's a police officers response to your post 4A Play

To Kyle:

The purpose of signaling is to warn any other drivers in your immediate vicinity of your pending turning movement. In order to beat it, you would have to prove there were no cars near enough to cause a potential hazardous event if you did not signal. From what you have posted it sounds like the cop was indeed close enough to warrant a signal.

The cop was following you for a reason, he wanted to pull you over and do an investigatory stop to see what he could dig up. Maybe a DUI or a dope arrest, or perhaps a warrant, it could be lots of things. We do it all the time.

He found probable cause to stop you with the signal. Is it ticky tac? Yes, and I prob would not have written it, but is it legal? Yep, and there is not much that can be done about it.

Being proactive in police work means finding legal reasons to make contact with persons and then finding out if they are behaving in an illegal manner. It is a great tool for making our lives and communities safe. Literally in my career I have found everything from murders and bank robbers, to guys like you. It is unfortunate that you were stopped, but the bottom line is you just got a minor infraction and were inconvenienced for a short time.

Your dad is right, there are lots of people out there to stop, and each and every one of them, if they are guilty of something or not feel just like you. It has happened to me too, I know how it is.

My advice, pay the ticket and move on with your fine life. Or go to traffic school to keep it off your record. You obviously are a good person, and it will be the rare day when you encounter a cop again I am sure.

[B5A4Kevin]

in FL, its even legal to change lanes without a turn signal (in the FL DMV drivers handbook). but it is mandatory if you are turning. i think you are right, especially since the ramp didnt have broken lines in it. its just like a freeway or interstate that splits. if you were in the center lane where it splits, it would be perfectly acceptable to use either ramp without a turn signal.

in all reality however, even if you did use the turn signal, the cop still would have pulled you over for something else.

[slideitsidewayz]

Here's a police officers response to your post 4A Play

Yeah, honestly bro, i would say pay the ticket. i know it sucks...the ticket for my license plate was $55 and that sucked. You should try to get it dropped just by stating mistake of law and that your intent was not to break the law.

This cops explanation does make alot of sense and if the cop was following you really close like you said you can see his roof lights, then i too would say that would call for the use of a blinker. It doesnt matter if you were shifting lanes or taking an off ramp, the cop was close enough that you technically should have signaled.

Try to fight it to get it dropped, but if you cannot then i am sorry. Listen to everyone's replies and make up your own mind on what you think you should do. If you think its worth fighting...then fight it. But if you have a feeling that with everything everyone else has said that you might lose, then just pay the ticket, and save yourself the time and hassel.

Sorry again...and good luck...drive safe

[4A Play]

Here's a police officers response to your post 4A Play

Thanks!
lol ^ a very good point.

Here's a police officers response to your post 4A Play

Thanks!

I agree that he was close to me as well, but do you guys realize how close someone has to be for their headlight to be covered by your trunk deck when you look in your mirror in order for you to see the lights on the roof of his car? Whats the rule, something like 1 car length for every 10 miles per hour is the safe driving speed? Im sure the judge will reduce the ticket.

[Hamann]

Bottom Line...I understand the theory of "looking for something small to find something big" but, seriously...at the point when the asshole realized this kid was innocent of anything "big" he should have let him go.

Give me a break...so many asshole cops that could care less about making our community safe....rather, they need to continually feed their ego's by putting others in a bind.

What a joke.

[slideitsidewayz]

Thanks!

I agree that he was close to me as well, but do you guys realize how close someone has to be for their headlight to be covered by your trunk deck when you look in your mirror in order for you to see the lights on the roof of his car? Whats the rule, something like 1 car length for every 10 miles per hour is the safe driving speed? Im sure the judge will reduce the ticket.

Well you didnt say he was that close...shit! lol

Well i guess if he was seriously that close and you can PROVE that then the judge should decrease the fine if not drop it if you provide a valid case. But it is your word agaisnt a cops...so you'll need some luck with that.

Since it was on the freeway im guess the speed limit was between 55-65mph? you didnt mention how fast you were going...but yes the length rule is 1 car length for every 10mph or you can go by the 2 second rule. but either way if the cop was on your ass so close at 65mph that you couldnt see his lights then im sure there is probably a danger factor that lies within that. If the cop was 70-100 feet behind you then i would believe that you did nothing wrong by not signaling. that distance is more than enough to be called a "safe following distance" and by not signaling a lane change at 65mph with the cop 70+ feet behind you then there was no need to signal because there would have been no poteintial hazardous event.

So the cop would be wrong by following you so closely and making driving conditions hazardous for himself by doing so, but if he was truely that close to you, then you should have signaled. Only if he was far enough away then you would have had no need to signal.

[biketsai]

If it doesnt hurt to fight it/money out of your pocket, then go ahead and present him what you have concluded. Worse case, you just pay the ticket or take a class.

I actually dont even mind cops pulling me over for something like that because there are tons of bad guys out there that should be pulled over. However, IMHO, I dont think you deserve that ticket.

[InTTruder]

I was told before that if a police officer follows you for a certain amount of time and does not pull you over, it is a form of harrassment. This is just what I was told or heard before. Might want to research the validity of that to maybe help you in your case, as I am more than sure you are going to plead not-guilty.

BS- no intelligence from which comes. Back away from the internet.

[InTTruder]

cops are stupid

YOU are stoopid. Cops are underpaid, overworked, and generally normal like you and me. Except YOU are STOOPID.

[onemoremile]

You left your lane. Therefore you changed lanes. The lines don't matter in any way whatsoever. You went from a lane to a ramp and therefore changed direction too.

While it may seem like a nuisance ticket because you only technically broke the law, you still broke it. It may be petty but it is what it is.