World's fastest B6/B7 S4 Avant?

[Todeshandler]

Well in an effort to get you guys some of the data you've been asking (demanding!) for I took my car to the Las Vegas Motor Speedway last night for the final Midnight Mayhem (http://www.lvms.com/news/strip_news/529856.html) of the year. Let me start this out by saying that I am VERY pleased with the results considering the weight of this pig and how brutal this track is on the ego!

Let's get to the facts.

Track
Track Elevation: 2,028 feet above sea level
Air Temp: 46 degrees F
Barometric Pressure: 29.56 inches Hg
Relative Humidity: 54%
Resulting Density Altitude: 2,139 feet above sea level

Car as ran
Year: 2008
Model: S4 Avant 6 speed
Mods: VF Engineering Beta Supercharger, STaSIS Cat-Back Exhaust, STaSIS Ohlins SL (otherwise 100% stock)
Miles: 3,126
Gas: 6 Gallons of 91 octane 3 Gallons of 100 octane
Weight: Full weight including spare. Just under 3/4 tank gas. (4,101 curb weight + 206lbs driver).
Boost: around 4psi (no boost gauge but based on elevation and boost of under 5.5psi at sea level)

Results
[email protected] with slipping clutch

Verdict
Stock clutch will NOT hold up to the s/c power levels in a full weight car if you plan on drag racing the car! The car is an easy mid 12@110+ at sea level with a mediocre driver like myself. Everyone at the track was very impressed with the car. I really wish I would have been able to make a few more passes but if I had I may have not been able to drive the car home. The clutch is slipping at WOT around 4krpms even on the street.

What's Next
Gutting the pre-cats on stock DPs, cutting some holes in the bottom of the stock airbox, and new clutch then take her back to the track in January (I'll return to LVMS in hopes of a 12 sec pass at 2k feet) then I'll make the haul out to Cali and get some sea level times. I wish we had some of the tracks you guys have out east!

And finally the slip
I was in the right lane (car 136) and in the left lane was a ASP stg3 B5 S4 on 109/100 mix and race gas program (Silence's car). He was having a hell of a time getting that car off the line but his trap gives you an idea of how brutal this track can be. For reference to you B5 guys his car ran a 3.3-3.4 FATs on the way to the track.



Notes
I hope you guys are happy. I didn't much want to run my car at the strip with stock clutch as I knew what was going to happen but in an attempt to please you guys I decided to have some fun. Just to give you guys an idea of comparo the best time any B6/B7 S4 has ever ran at this track was a 13.8-9@??? by 05blacks4 (with full exhaust, revo chip and intake) but that was a unicorn pass. 14.0-14.1 is what is to be expected of bolt on 4.2s at this track. My buddies stock e46 M3 was running 14.7s last night. Hopefully my clutch is just glazed not totally burnt so I'm going to drive her normal for the next few days with no WOT and see if I can limp around on the stock clutch until the 1st of the year when I'll have time to put something else in.

Questions
What's a good clutch for these cars? I don't want a light switch. I don't mind a heavy pedal feel but it needs to have nice engagement. I had a SACHS Motorsports 4 puck unsprung clutch in my B5 S4 and I will NEVER put something that agressive in one of my cars again.

[Mello]

Awesome!

Thanks for posting the info!

[sakimano]

awesome indeed

how many miles are on your car? Maybe your clutch was getting long in the tooth with or without the S/C? Lotsa B6 guys have been needing new clutches at 50,000 miles.

[Todeshandler]

As above - Miles: 3,126

So def not long in the tooth

[bsrpilot44]

Thanks Mr. Death Dealer! Which clutch are you going with next?

-B

[Todeshandler]

Why does everyone think my name is Todd? FYI my name is Brian and Todeshandler=Death Dealer in german according to altavista

[bsrpilot44]

Why does everyone think my name is Todd? FYI my name is Brian and Todeshandler=Death Dealer in german according to altavista

AHAHA thanks Brian. I'm Brandon. Nice to meet ya.

Now answer my question lawl.

[Todeshandler]

I have no idea on clutch yet. Probably go with a clutch masters just don't know which stage.

[iconoclast]

Why does everyone think my name is Todd? FYI my name is Brian and Todeshandler=Death Dealer in german according to altavista

lol, thats funny i thought your name was Todd E. Shandler.

[joeycuccaro]

Very impressive... Thanks for sharing the info!

[DLSJ5]

Good stuff Bri, considering that track and at that boost level, that is a decent time and trap, especially in comparison to D's ASP Stage 3. Let's plan on hitting Famoso or Sacramento soon.

[Audi05s4]

yea your 60 foot time is way off what it should be

[DLSJ5]

yea your 60 foot time is way off what it should be

A 1.9 isn't all that bad, lol. The Stage 3 S4's 60' is way off, I believe that's what you meant.

[Todeshandler]

Like I said I am no Vin Diesel This is probably my 5th or 6th time down the 1/4 mile total between several different cars. David was having major issues getting that thing off the line. 1 pass he dry hopped like crazy then this run he spun out pretty bad.

I think the traps are a pretty good comparo tho. 107 (93-94 octane on pump file) vs 112 (103-104 octane on race gas file) that's what it is like on the highway as well. We are pretty close until the top end and he start pulling some. And his car was running 3.3-3.4 fats so we know it's healthy, his car is damn fast... faster than my B5 (AWE stg3) was here in Vegas for sure. I think it will be a damn good race pump vs pump at sea level.

[ginkof]

I have no idea on clutch yet. Probably go with a clutch masters just don't know which stage.

get a stage 3. I have one in my car and its awesome. It bites a little at engagement but my 80 year old father moved my car out of his driveway a week ago and he didn't say a thing. Thats a man who noticed my car was an inch lower when i had my coilovers put on.

[bigredx24x]

great info! thanks for the post! your cars a beast!

[VelocityS4]

I have no idea on clutch yet. Probably go with a clutch masters just don't know which stage.

I don't think Clutchmasters makes anything for the B6/B7..

lol, thats funny i thought your name was Todd E. Shandler.

x2, LOL.

[ieatfishburitos]

I have no idea on clutch yet. Probably go with a clutch masters just don't know which stage.

I HIGHLY recommend southbend. I'm very happy with my stg 3 from them.

Edited: I haven't heard much about clutchmasters, most of the horror stories were mainly from SPEC clutches.

I'd stick with OEM for now. I've just heard too many horror stories about the spec clutch...

http://forums.audiworld.com/rockymtn/msgs/78091.phtml

http://forums.audiworld.com/a4/msgs/2149514.phtml

http://forums.audiworld.com/s4b6/msgs/363873.phtml

http://forums.audiworld.com/s4/msgs/2406071.phtml

http://forums.audiworld.com/s4b6/msgs/351105.phtml

http://forums.audiworld.com/s4/msgs/2221514.phtml

http://forums.audiworld.com/s4/msgs/2210853.phtml

http://forums.audiworld.com/s4/msgs/2193058.phtml

http://forums.audiworld.com/s4/msgs/2149022.phtml

http://forums.audiworld.com/s4/msgs/2137578.phtml

http://forums.audiworld.com/qclubflo...gs/56035.phtml

and on and on and on...

[Todeshandler]

I've got a few PMs asking if I made more passes. Unfortunately as I stated I didn't make anymore runs due to the clutch and couldn't anyways as the track was closing. But earlier I was only able to make 1 other pass 2 hours earlier so please see pics below. Few comments first.

A. My first time on the 1/4 mile with this car.
B. I didn't launch it. I just let the clutch out around 1200-1500 rpms and went WOT.
C. My car was heatsoaked from waiting in line for 1+ hours sitting there with the motor running because it was 45 degrees outside so I needed the heater. The intake manifold was incredibly hot to the touch. MUCH cooler on the 2nd run.
D. For comparo purposes the 1st run (car 151) was a modded C6 Vet.



And here is a pic I just took with the numbers still on it from last night.

[Silence]

Like I said I am no Vin Diesel This is probably my 5th or 6th time down the 1/4 mile total between several different cars. David was having major issues getting that thing off the line. 1 pass he dry hopped like crazy then this run he spun out pretty bad.

I think the traps are a pretty good comparo tho. 107 (93-94 octane on pump file) vs 112 (103-104 octane on race gas file) that's what it is like on the highway as well. We are pretty close until the top end and he start pulling some. And his car was running 3.3-3.4 fats so we know it's healthy, his car is damn fast... faster than my B5 (AWE stg3) was here in Vegas for sure. I think it will be a damn good race pump vs pump at sea level.

Word. I got a great view of your last run being my car decided to launch sideways.

I know your car definitely has a 12 in it next time we go. Between the temps, the head wind, and 2 hours of waiting between runs, it was hard to get anything good going.I could definitely tell the difference with that lil bit of 100 octane in the tank. Car seemed to be stronger on top end.

My launches killed my runs, as did all the idling between our runs, but I say I have low 12 in it, and you have mid 12s in yours. We'll have to hit the track again soon. This time without wind hopefully.

Oh, and FWIW, I was running only 101 octane.

[Justincredible]

Why does everyone think my name is Todd? FYI my name is Brian and Todeshandler=Death Dealer in german according to altavista

Well I might have issues with spelling and grammar but at lest I knew that.
todeshandler is death handler or dealer you would not really say dealer in German but any way.

As for the clutch def listen to Ieatfish. SPEC is not something I would put on my car too many issues.

These are great results for what you have done. Stock Dp's stock SS and not a track DOG like so many. LOW boost and heat soak from the car both sitting in the pits and iddling before making a pass. All this with a weak clutch. Not bad not bad at all.
Im going to get you on the list later today

Great work GREAT info share

[Silence]

Btw.. you need a race file. Tell Garrett to get on it.

[Todeshandler]

Hopefully the week before Christmas brutha. Already sent him an email. There is a TON of room for more timing on race gas Need to gut these extra DPs too!

[Silence]

Hopefully the week before Christmas brutha. Already sent him an email. There is a TON of room for more timing on race gas Need to gut these extra DPs too!

For real. Piggie pipes FTW. 11x traps, here ya come. Oh wait, every S4 does that.

[drew]

not bad. what did the stock m3 and the bolt-on s4 trap?

[Todeshandler]

90s

[drew]

90s

not bad at all...

[rsquattro]

Incredible, man!! I went with a South Bend stage 3, it's getting installed next month (albeit, no S/C)...had the best reviews from what I've read. Congrats again.

[cam]

brian, call up southbend, they have a new setup for the 4.2's clutch and flywheel. from what i understand teh flywheel is roughly half the weight of the stock unit and is a single mass unit, and the clutch is rated upwards of 550 lbft.

or you can go the other route and have them do a clutch disk for you with the feramic material. and run a stock pressure plate, that setup is equavilant to a stg 3 clutch.

[DapperD]

brian, call up southbend, they have a new setup for the 4.2's clutch and flywheel. from what i understand teh flywheel is roughly half the weight of the stock unit and is a single mass unit, and the clutch is rated upwards of 550 lbft.

or you can go the other route and have them do a clutch disk for you with the feramic material. and run a stock pressure plate, that setup is equavilant to a stg 3 clutch.

That's the set-up I went with. I really like it because it retains the stock pressure plate which helps out if you daily drive your S4 IMHO. I'm running a Milltek CB w/ stock DPs (need to get those Piggies from VAST apparently) and a K&N drop in filter.

If I wasn't saving up for a house right now, my car would be in line for a SC.

Thanks for all the information!

[b00st]

results seem inline with what i thought considering everything.

i'd go South Bend without a doubt!!!!

[1FastS4.Com]

Brian.... Southbend for sure no question. Sorry I did not make it to the track.

[Auditude2.0T]

Nice for getting the car on a track finally. Now for all the people who said the Supercharged S4 would walk RS4's i don't really think that's the case. My dad ran his RS4 in middle of August with more than a half a tank of 93 within the first month of owning the car and ran a 12.8 bone stock. My stock turbo A4 is running sub 1.8 60' times

[ieatfishburitos]

Nice for getting the car on a track finally. Now for all the people who said the Supercharged S4 would walk RS4's i don't really think that's the case. My dad ran his RS4 in middle of August with more than a half a tank of 93 within the first month of owning the car and ran a 12.8 bone stock. My stock turbo A4 is running sub 1.8 60' times

Top notch opinion, but wrong. Last I checked we werent comparing 60' times, but 1/4Mi times. So what does your A4 run in the 1/4Mi at the vegas track?

Pretty damn hard to compare 1/4Mi times when he has clutch problems.

[Todeshandler]

IMO 60' time has nothing to do with the car... it's the driver and a good drag racer I am not. The was my first 2 times launching the car...

And for your rs4 comment I should have mentioned there was a rs4 with full exhaust running 14.1s @ 101 the same night.. As well as an e55 with kleeman chip running slow as well. New skyline gtr was running 12s. LVMS is a very slow track.

[ieatfishburitos]

Can I keep calling you toadhandler? :P

[Auditude2.0T]

IMO 60' time has nothing to do with the car... it's the driver and a good drag racer I am not. The was my first 2 time launching this car...

And for your rs4 comment I should have mentioned there was a rs4 with full exhaust running 14.1s @ 101 the same night.. As well as an e55 with kleeman chip running slow as well. New skyline gtr was running 12s. LVMS is a very slow track.

was the RS4 launching out of 3rd gear. My car runs high 13's low 14's and the RS4 eats my out of 2nd gear.

[Todeshandler]

As long as I can call you Ilikefishtacos.

[ieatfishburitos]

was the RS4 launching out of 3rd gear. My car runs high 13's low 14's and the RS4 eats my out of 2nd gear.

Ok here we go... So what was the altitude, humidity, temperature, octane rating, etc on your A4/RS4 runs?

[ieatfishburitos]

As long as I can call you Ilikefishtacos.

It's a deal!