Fastest AUTO B6 S4? 107mph from a B6 S4??

[Justincredible]

In the past I have talked about testing chips, Dp's and catback designs for the best results. I keep talking about the Formula. I thought it would be important to show my actual 1/4 mile times and the results before I keep on telling people you should try this and you should look at that.

In all the testing I have done, it is about the FORMULA of parts not just the parts that give you the performance.

From time to time I see people passing on there emotional feelings about a company and not the actual performance products from that company. Then there are the People that think if you are passing on REAL information (good or bad) about a product that company X sells, that you are some how attacking that company. Not that your just passing on info.

So after asking that people show proof of there claims. I thought it was a little hypocritical that I was not doing the same. This post is about the formula of parts and the results. This is not about the companies that make the parts I have on my car but the results I got from them.

I will say I do have a chip
I have catless 2.5in Dp's
A full 2.5 in exhaust WITH X PIPE THIS IS SUPER IMPORTANT
sport brakes
Sport rims
Air box mod

My car is a Automatic
Keep in mind that a Auto has A gear ratio of 3.55 and the Manual has a gear ratio of 3.83. So if my car had a better gear ratio I would have had a better time

Keeping to the rules we set up for the 1/4 mile info I have 2 slips and a Video. The video I felt was necessary due to the MPH and the fact that it is a automatic

Time slip one



Time slip 2



Video I have several but here is the fastest one

first 13.3 @ 107MPH for a N/A B6 S4 that I know of

In the end this comes down to the right Formula for the parts to all work together.

Now I do have a custom chip. But it once again comes back to the parts. EVEN on a stock ECU I was able to get 102-103 MPH from the car. The chip DEFINITELY helped with the other 4MPH and the TQ down low..

The whole point Im tring to make here is we debate over exhaust systems and other performance parts all the time.

Some say oh if you do that you will loose Tq down low...But where is the proof of why you will loose that Tq down low. If you put a big exhaust on you will loose Tq down low but WHY. Well you need a X pipe...well why do you need a X pipe? I will post my findings on that as well. but for now lets get back to the point.

The point is there is clearly a formula. If you have a 6 speed Manual. You the driver are a biggest part of the formula. With a Automatic 80% of the driver issue is out the window. All I have to do is hit the gas and hold it to the floor for about 13.3sec.

So with this new example lets not just put parts on our cars. lets know what parts work and what ones don't. But most important what parts work best with each other I would say that this clearly shows what is working.

As a last point. The exhaust system is very important for power. You can loose power if not done correctly. I didn't just go out and throw parts at it. Before I even built the system. I called flowmaster (and a few other companies) and asked if they could help me with the proper lay out of the system. In return I would get as many products from them as I could. Bottom line they took time to explain Why I needed section parts and where they NEEDED to go. IMHO there is more to exhaust systems then just getting the biggest pipes you can on the car. It starts with the Dp's all the parts from the manifold back need to be working with each other not fighting each other

[drew]

nice trap.

who tuned your car?

[V8S4Fun]

Nice job...score one for the Tips!

[cabracco85]

Good job justin

[Captain Insano]

That is impressive as hell in my opinion. I honestly never thought a tip would run that quick with simple bolt-ons. Also true that with the tip the driver is not so much of a factor. So no props to your driving skills... But some very serious and bigger props to your tuning and mods on your car.

Excellent job man.

And as part of the forum, I think all the research you have done and provided info on is a HUGE benefit to this community. That is the reason I come on the forum, to learn more about performance and modifications that are proven and truly work. And I believe the B6 S4 can be a very decent sports car. I know it's heavy. But most cars are heavy nowadays. The new GTR is like 3800 lbs. And it is already starting to put up some very serious numbers (yes, I know it's turbo and a different animal - my point is heavy cars can be made to perform). These cars aren't helpless like alot of people would have you believe. I think we are just seeing the tip of the iceburg here. It's not a 10 second car with bolt-ons. But it can easily be made alot quicker than a mid to high 13s car. For sure. I mean we have guys that are basically bone stock (panel filter) running 13.4 ETs now (cabracco85) with excellent launch/driving on the 6-speeds. This car is no slouch with proper driving.

I see 12s in our near future.

And I do agree whole heartedly. It's the sum of the parts on the car that make or break true performance. You can buy top of the line stuff but if they aren't made to integrate with each other or don't work in harmony it's not going to help much. And can actually be counter productive in many cases. I've seen this so many times with aftermarket mods. If you are going for true performance you must very carefully consider each mod and how it will integrate with everything else.

[ieatfishburitos]

Can you explain your exhaust more thoroughly? maybe you've done it before and I missed it. Where is your x pipe located, what mufflers, diameter, etc... Thanks and nice job! Video sounded great.

[B6_Rakete]

Wow, I never would have thought a tip car would turn in those sorts of numbers.

How much weight do you figure you dropped with the new brakes, new rims, and exhaust?

[esfo]

That's a pretty amazing time for a tip. Would love to see more details about the tuning and who did it and also pics of the exhaust system and who did that. TIA!

[Bpitz15]

awesome job!!
makes me want to switch from an H-pipe to X-pipe but w/ the FI catback that would require a lot of hacking.
Love what your doing with your car by the way. The research and ingenuity is really paying off !!

[ieatfishburitos]

Why don't we ask Fast Intentions to make an X pipe?

[RudeBwoi]

You have to respect the "measure twice, cut once" approach he takes with modding his vehicle. Its definately and change of speed in comparison to what was generally happening before, purchasing exhausts based off how it sounds...

[D.K]

Tip or not, your car is picking up 25 MPH on the back end, and that is extremely impressive!

[BrianSteuerwald]

Wow!!!! The best I have gotten out of my bone stock 2004 TIP S4 sedan is a 14.22 at 98+ MPH. I even took the spare tire/tools out and only had a 1/4 tank of gas. My car is a pig. I'm not too concerned as I have another car for going really fast in a straight line. But I would like to hang a little better with my buddy's lightly modded E46 M3.

I have several questions:

1) As you said the tranny removes almost all of the driver factor. But getting this heavy car moving out of the hole is very important. I was curious if you have a specific technique for launching the car? Additionally do you just put the car in Sport mode and let it do its thing or do you paddle shift?

2) Do you recall the atmospheric conditions when those passes were made? Was this at Joliet? Any idea about DA?

3) Echoing the post above, when you say sport wheels and sport brakes do you mean aftermarket? If so, any ideas of the weight savings. Weight reduction is good but the reduction of unsprung weight on these cars is exponentially better.

Again, well done!!!

[b00st]

bout time you posted this JUSTIN!

[JetBlue]

Awesome numbers. Attention to detail pays off.

[Shomegrown]

...

[rnr1702]

I'm looking to chip my '04 S4...got any suggestions... looking for any help on the best way to spend my money...

[Justincredible]

Thanks guys for all the kind words.

First because I don't want to do so with out asking first. Dose anyone have an issue with me putting this time on the 1/4 mile data we have

I wanted to post back response to all the questions but I wanted to make sure it was ok to release the info.

The exhaust is long and alot to explain what and why I did what I did to the car. So I have a write up on all the different combination of Dp's I have tried and how and why I have the cat back I do.

The Dp's are Catless Piggies from Vastperformance. 450$ for Dp's you can't go wrong.

OK the Rotors are JHM rotors. they weigh just under 15 lbs that is a 10lb savings from stock (front rotors only). They have more mounting points for the HAT and they were like 100$ less then ECS rotors so with more mounting points for strength and 100$ less I got the JHM.

I first found this to be a good Idea after seeing that Brvrdr or Dr mike. Had put a performance brake kit on the car. I saw there was a weight savings with it. But I didn't have the 4000$ for the big brake kit so this to me was the best of both worlds. Definitely a good mod

The rims weigh in at 17lbs for each rim and the tires weigh 27. So a total of about 44-45 on the scale. That is another 10lbs off each corner. For some reason I didn't see the performance difference in the rims as I did with the rotors.

The tune was a JHM tune as well. Like I said I removed the tune and put in my stock ECU to compare against I found the 4-5 MPH jump with the tune Vs. the stock ECU

I also did the flapper mod and a K&N

Other then no spare rim the rest of the car was stock full weight and almost 3/4 tank of gas

Let me say this.
If you are looking for a good tune Get Dp's. All tho the tune REALLY helped. Performance doesn't start with the tune it ends with the Tune. If you get a chip before you have all the other supporting mods you probably are not getting the most of ANY chip

[ieatfishburitos]

I've been thinking lately that the light weight brake kits will net a difference. I'm due for a replacement set soon and may also go in that direction.

Post it!

[S4J]

Dam. Awesome time...tip too .

[b00st]

i need new rotors and pads....i don't see JHM rotors on his site. did you PM him and he has them? i'm thinking either PBR pads or Hawk...but no ceramic....prolly time for brake fluid swap out too...something with a higher boiling point...but no ATE blue. i think i ran motul last time.

[jaybquick@JHM]

i need new rotors and pads....i don't see JHM rotors on his site. did you PM him and he has them? i'm thinking either PBR pads or Hawk...but no ceramic....prolly time for brake fluid swap out too...something with a higher boiling point...but no ATE blue. i think i ran motul last time.

Thanks for the PM as well.

We are actually starting production of our first batch this week and were planning on doing a pre sale really soon as our coming party for sponsoring this forum.

We will probably intro them at $550. If you are interested email me at [email protected] that way you can lock in one of the first sets. Anyone who orders soon should get them by Christmas as long everything continues going smooth like it has. The next step for us is to get them on the site. You guys get the first crack at them.

We worked closely with a race brake manufacturer that supplies many NASCAR racers and a couple major brake kit companies. They are building us the rings to our specs to fit the B6-B7 S4 (so we can have good high quality rings) and we are building the hats in house to their specs(to bring the cost down and make them available to you at only $550) The rings we went with have similar specs as some of their Corvette offerings.

We also thought this would be a great alternative since the stock B6-B7 S4 rotor is already a pretty stout 345mm (13.6") and most may not want to spend $2,000 plus for a full big brake kit. We basically brought the same high performance great cooling designed rotor to these drop in (fit like stock) front rotors and at a 1/4 of the price or less of a full BBK.


We will be a Hawk dealer shortly among other products to compliment these rotors.


Here are some pics.

[b00st]

nice! we will be in contact jay!!!!!!!!!
i will need some pads too. something street. no track use. low dust...that kind of thing.
prolly would like to swap brake fluid out for something better too.

[oatzel]

very nice. lots of great info in this post

[b00st]

Thanks for the PM as well.

We are actually starting production of our first batch this week and were planning on doing a pre sale really soon as our coming party for sponsoring this forum.

We will probably intro them at $550. If you are interested email me at [email protected] that way you can lock in one of the first sets. Anyone who orders soon should get them by Christmas as long everything continues going smooth like it has. The next step for us is to get them on the site. You guys get the first crack at them.

We worked closely with a race brake manufacturer that supplies many NASCAR racers and a couple major brake kit companies. They are building us the rings to our specs to fit the B6-B7 S4 (so we can have good high quality rings) and we are building the hats in house to their specs(to bring the cost down and make them available to you at only $550) The rings we went with have similar specs as some of their Corvette offerings.

We also thought this would be a great alternative since the stock B6-B7 S4 rotor is already a pretty stout 345mm (13.6") and most may not want to spend $2,000 plus for a full big brake kit. We basically brought the same high performance great cooling designed rotor to these drop in (fit like stock) front rotors and at a 1/4 of the price or less of a full BBK.


We will be a Hawk dealer shortly among other products to compliment these rotors.


Here are some pics.

i noticed the side walls are much thinner. which i'm assuming is where we can shave weight. however, how often will this result in chaning out rotors?
doesn't look like there is much material and i would be going through these much faster than a stock. jay any insight on that part?

[B18b1ex]

Any plans for lighter rears and or bigger rears?

[b00st]

jay sent you an email on them and some other stuff.
my bro wants in too.

kevin

[Justincredible]

B00st

On the Rotors. My stockers were worn to all hell. I got down to the last bit of life on the pads. You could see the amount of material that was worn off the stock rotor. So I don't see any reason that the LWR would not be able to have the same life span (other then the fact you might not be able to turn them as many times as the stock ones)

I have to say I put My rotors threw there paces pretty good at the 1/4 mile track a few weeks back and at the Road coarse we had last weekend (open road) My worry was that there might be a chance that they would not hold up to the constant beating. After what I have saw. I would say that there is no reason these wouldn't have the same life as the stockers. They definitely held up strong.

The best part is when it dose come time to change the rotors again. You only need to get the ring. At that point it will be cheaper then getting a replacement OEM rotor. So basically after you have the rotors the replacement cost in the future cheaper then stock. But the good thing is they look like with the added cooling fins and area they are going to last a good long time

[ChronicTeutonic]

Justin, this such great news for us Tip owners that seem to always take a beating from the MT guys. Thanks for sharing!

[b00st]

don't worry i'll do my job at beating TIPs down.
i love a good challenge.

and if i mod DPs, CB, JHM tune....look out.

[b00st]

B00st

On the Rotors. My stockers were worn to all hell. I got down to the last bit of life on the pads. You could see the amount of material that was worn off the stock rotor. So I don't see any reason that the LWR would not be able to have the same life span (other then the fact you might not be able to turn them as many times as the stock ones)

I have to say I put My rotors threw there paces pretty good at the 1/4 mile track a few weeks back and at the Road coarse we had last weekend (open road) My worry was that there might be a chance that they would not hold up to the constant beating. After what I have saw. I would say that there is no reason these wouldn't have the same life as the stockers. They definitely held up strong.

The best part is when it dose come time to change the rotors again. You only need to get the ring. At that point it will be cheaper then getting a replacement OEM rotor. So basically after you have the rotors the replacement cost in the future cheaper then stock. But the good thing is they look like with the added cooling fins and area they are going to last a good long time

cool...my stockers are trashed. i believed i glazed my pads when running MLR for all the runs during testing my car vs his. i had some serious brake fade going on after a while of running and then braking to slow down only to do another run. hot laps sucked for my brakes.

so new pads, rotors, lines. i would like something for the rear...but doesn't look like it will happen.

[turbo4s]

Im going to get a tune. last time I was at the track I ran a 13.8 at 101.2mpg. Does the tune help the Tip achieve a more aggressive shift or is it just a tune for the engine. I really love take my tip down the track as well. I never have to wory about my clutch like I do with My GLI or when I had my A4. to each is own.

[blur510]

B00st
The best part is when it dose come time to change the rotors again. You only need to get the ring. At that point it will be cheaper then getting a replacement OEM rotor. So basically after you have the rotors the replacement cost in the future cheaper then stock. But the good thing is they look like with the added cooling fins and area they are going to last a good long time

Do you have a price for the replacement rotor? I assume the mounting hat is reusable..

[Justincredible]

Im going to get a tune. last time I was at the track I ran a 13.8 at 101.2mpg. Does the tune help the Tip achieve a more aggressive shift or is it just a tune for the engine. I really love take my tip down the track as well. I never have to worry about my clutch like I do with My GLI or when I had my A4. to each is own.

What I noticed with the JHM tune the added 4-5mph was from just over all better Tq and Hp delivery. The car will jump out of the hole now as opposed to just kinda limping out before the chip. It helped with the shifting RPM slightly and the shifts are better. J said he is working on trans files for the car. But due to the fact that the TCU is in the transmission it self. This is going to take a long time to develop. The trans shifting was the weak link. You can hear the slip between 1st and 2nd.

But let me say again. If you don't have a good exhaust system. The tune is not going to help. The best chip is a good set of Dp's

Do you have a price for the replacement rotor? I assume the mounting hat is reusable..

The hat is reusable so you only need to have the ring replacement. The exact price of the ring you would have to ask J. But I do remember it being less then the OEM replacement Rotor. So definitely a big money savings there with the added performance

[jaybquick@JHM]

First off, thanks for the help Justing and sorry for the thread jacking.

i noticed the side walls are much thinner. which i'm assuming is where we can shave weight. however, how often will this result in chaning out rotors?
doesn't look like there is much material and i would be going through these much faster than a stock. jay any insight on that part?

Depending on your driving style and habbits you should be fine using them for 1 to 3 pad sets depending like I said how they are treated. If they are beat to hell and road raced with race only pads that will eat into them, then yeah maybe only 1 set of pads. But with some street/street performance pads they should be fine for the life of several sets of pads. If anyone ever needed the outer rings I would supply them for only $150 (not much over cost) to better serve our customers. I think a new OEM one is about the same price. So realistically once you have the Hats you are good to go.

Any plans for lighter rears and or bigger rears?

Possibly. The rears are already quite large already at 300mm. So just an improved fin design and larger air gap they will be better. Plus you don't need massive rear brakes since 80% of your stopping power is from the fronts. Based on my calculations and research there is probably only 1lb of loss per side on the rears. But I would imagine some may want them for the better cooling and looks. Email me if you are interested in the rears, it may help expedite me building some. [email protected]

jay sent you an email on them and some other stuff.
my bro wants in too.

kevin

Got the email. I am finally getting caught up from the holiday, I will get back to you hopefully today. I am starting with the oldest email and working forward.

Do you have a price for the replacement rotor? I assume the mounting hat is reusable..

If anyone ever needed the outer rings I would supply them for only $150 (not much over cost) to better serve our customers. I think a new OEM one is about the same price. So realistically once you have the Hats you are good to go.

[b00st]

thanks jay look forward to your email. i'm strictly a street guy. daily driven. no auto-x or anything...an occassional run done here or there. but nothing crazy 99% of my driving is just normal easy driving.

i'm ready for a set when your ready

kevin