2.7T block building

[02alltoad]

has anyone "O" ringed there block

[MiniRS4]

heh?

[GURUMAN]

I think Wicked motorsports did in his beast.

All the high HP S4 arent from what I've seen.

[Europowerhaus]

dont need to, the fire ring on the head gasket will crush and do the job just fine

[red4kq]

dont need to, the fire ring on the head gasket will crush and do the job just fine

yeah no real need to unless you plan on exceeding ~800whp

[02alltoad]

i just dont want any problems (ha ha) could it be a bad thing to do?

[NYCVR6]

heh?

HAha, dont know what oringing a block is huh?

Mike at wicked did oring his block, i did it on my turbo ver6 block i built. It isnt needed unless you want to make over 600-700 whp in my opinion. Traditionally oringed blocks are used with copper head gaskets, mike from wicked said he just used regular head gaskets though.

No it cant be a bad thing, but it sure can be unnecessary.

[1997gtx]

Wasted time IMO.
--Adam

[Wizard-of-OD]

Wasted time IMO.
--Adam

Depends on what you define as wasted...
On a K03...yes.On a Twin GT2871R,I dont think so.

[mike-2ptzero]

I dont think it is needed unless someone is going to be running 40psi. Plenty of GT S4's running 32psi without it.

[02alltoad]

well im looking to use the rs6 turbos and run 9.5:1 compression pistons

[mike-2ptzero]

well im looking to use the rs6 turbos and run 9.5:1 compression pistons

But how much boost? I dont think your going to be able to run high enough boost to really need to do an oring setup.

[1997gtx]

Okay, so let's say no current S4 -- outside of perhaps the polish one -- would need this. It's fair to say since no one has ever come on this forum with a set-up that would need this, that we can safely assume it's not needed
--Adam

[NYCVR6]

When i oringed my vr block it was more for piece of mind than anything. I ran up to 35-36 psi from a 42r and made just under 700 wheel. Im debating oringing my block when i send it to the machine shop myself actually.

[generationjdm]

Theres no point of O ringing the block for rs6ss you wouldn't do it for rs4 turbos and your talking maybe 50-70 more hp at max between the 2... If the tune is nailed your fine, but I wouldn't even considered it on the rs6ss... maybe on a large gt car running 30+lbs then maybe

[mike-2ptzero]

Theres no point of O ringing the block for rs6ss you wouldn't do it for rs4 turbos and your talking maybe 50-70 more hp at max between the 2... If the tune is nailed your fine, but I wouldn't even considered it on the rs6ss... maybe on a large gt car running 30+lbs then maybe

Yeah maybe on a twin GT3071/76r setup pushing 35+psi.

[1997gtx]

Perhaps the discussion should be what's the downside?
--Adam

[mike-2ptzero]

Most likely none other then it just moves the weak spot somewhere else.

[02alltoad]

why would it cause a weak spot?

[mike-2ptzero]

why would it cause a weak spot?

I didn't say it would cause a weak spot, I said the weakest spot would then be somewhere else since a 0ring setup is not going to blow like the stock gasket will.

[02alltoad]

oh ok i see well im trying to build the block as strong as i can

[Wizard-of-OD]

oh ok i see well im trying to build the block as strong as i can

For what exactly?

[GURUMAN]

even

[Reich]

I would never use o rings. I would prefer an other kind of head gasket instead.
I seen a lot of head gasket failure and the best gasket that can hold pressure and heat is gasket with a crush ring, basicly like the ring between k and exhaust. Our Cummins engines works on a lot more compression ie: 350psi compression test while starting. And our engine runs with 42psi of boost on full load with 100% egr valve opened. I can't see an o ring that could withstand that pressure and heat. The only place we have o rings is between the the sleeve and block near the top of liner which is use to seal coolant.

[GURUMAN]

Ya but your canadian, How would you know ?

canadians dont know how to make power...

[Reich]

Ya but your canadian, How would you know ?

canadians dont know how to make power...

We shall see. I spoke with Mike and had to wait after waterfest before dyno n tune, he was loaded. Last thing i remember your also Canadian. How's going with your project?

[GURUMAN]

Canadian I am...

My project is getting along very good.

Engine done, tranny done, turbo kit assembled.

Mike R. is ready to put in the car this week end.

It's just that I add a lot of thing each time I see him.

He's making a non-ABS conversion...

I'm putting coilovers, new suspension arm all around...

It should start next week

[Wizard-of-OD]

Canadian my ass...LOL

[02alltoad]

For what exactly?

mainly because im going with a slightly higher comp ratio than stock for more bottem end power i can ajust the boost but not the displacement and compression ratio so i want a strong block to be able to take the "tuning" prosses i hope that makes sence

[02alltoad]

I would never use o rings. I would prefer an other kind of head gasket instead.
I seen a lot of head gasket failure and the best gasket that can hold pressure and heat is gasket with a crush ring, basicly like the ring between k and exhaust. Our Cummins engines works on a lot more compression ie: 350psi compression test while starting. And our engine runs with 42psi of boost on full load with 100% egr valve opened. I can't see an o ring that could withstand that pressure and heat. The only place we have o rings is between the the sleeve and block near the top of liner which is use to seal coolant.

from my understanding the oring is not used as a seal it just adds pressure aginst the head gasket to force a tighter seal on the "fire ring"

[NYCVR6]

from my understanding the oring is not used as a seal it just adds pressure aginst the head gasket to force a tighter seal on the "fire ring"

Right.... ideally in my experience you want a groove cut into the block where you place the copper oring, then a receptor goove cut into the head as well.

[02alltoad]

Right.... ideally in my experience you want a groove cut into the block where you place the copper oring, then a receptor goove cut into the head as well.

do your rods have the edm holes or not?

[NYCVR6]

do your rods have the edm holes or not?

No they dont...

[Wizard-of-OD]

do your rods have the edm holes or not?

Not needed.
thats just a sales gimic realistically speaking.

[02alltoad]

Not needed.
thats just a sales gimic realistically speaking.

are the edm holes the same as forced pin oiling?

[317ssayzarc]

Not needed.
thats just a sales gimic realistically speaking.

not needed, but it does have benefits... correct?

when it comes to internals, for me at least, nothing is completely a gimmick if it works even the slightest bit...

[317ssayzarc]

are the edm holes the same as forced pin oiling?

yea id think so...

[mike-2ptzero]

not needed, but it does have benefits... correct?

when it comes to internals, for me at least, nothing is completely a gimmick if it works even the slightest bit...

But what was it designed to do exactly? I have been running pauter rods without that option for 5 years now without any problems.


(added)
I looked it up and it says "pressure-fed oiling to pin". I just dont see how it can be pressure-fed.

[317ssayzarc]

But what was it designed to do exactly? I have been running pauter rods without that option for 5 years now without any problems.


(added)
I looked it up and it says "pressure-fed oiling to pin". I just dont see how it can be pressure-fed.

when the hole on the crank aligns with the hole the the rod bearing, which is permanently aligned to the edm hole, the pin gets a shot of oil... this happens once per revolution of the crankshaft

[Siena]

Wouldn't have thought wire-ringing was needed on the 2,7T block.

Last time I went the wire-ringing route was back in '93, when I built a number of KR 16V turbo motors, for clients.

The fact I was turbocharging blocks not designed for FI, and the metal head gaskets available today didn't exist, decided that for me.

Maybe overkill, but I never had one blow a gasket, even the last 342PS motor I built back in '95.