[OFFICIAL LW PULLEY THREAD (ECS vs OEM) PICS-BWW]

[MiniRS4]

hey yall, its been a hot minute since ive posted. i got a few things done. i had the time to weigh out the crank and power steering ECS LWP against the OEM. ill get to the alternator pulley soon enough. here's what iv got.

OEM

ECS

Power Steering Pulley (PS)

OEM Crank Pulley









PS PULLEY
328.3
-311.0
------
17.3 grams

Crank PULLEY*
i couldnt even weigh this out on my digi. it was too heavy. but apparently frimmel claims that the OEM is 74 oz. sounds about right. anyhow, continuing on...
74oz = 74*28grams = 2072 grams

2072
-686.4
-------
1385.6 grams /28 = 49oz /16 = ~3lbs

also, ASP's is supposed to be 24oz, compared w ECS 49oz, and OEM 74oz.
crank assembly should be rebalanced after install to ensure precision and true spin.

finally, if anyone has anything positive and productive, share, etc. please do so, otherwise, ZIP IT.

that is all.

[jibberjive]

Double dog dare you to do before and after dynos

[BlackS4TT(Josh)]

The stock PS pulley is aluminum and is very light from the factory. Im assuming you didnt know this. Waste of money to invest in a lightweight PS pulley.

[S4M3]

hey yall, its been a hot minute since ive posted. i got a few things done. i had the time to weigh out the crank and power steering ECS LWP against the OEM. ill get to the alternator pulley soon enough. here's what iv got.

PS PULLEY
328.3
-311.0
------
17.3 grams

Crank PULLEY*
i couldnt even weigh this out on my digi. it was too heavy. but apparently frimmel claims that the OEM is 74 oz. sounds about right. anyhow, continuing on...
74oz = 74*28grams = 2072 grams

2072
-686.4
-------
1385.6 grams /28 = 49oz /16 = ~3lbs

also, ASP's is supposed to be 24oz, compared w ECS 49oz, and OEM 74oz.
crank assembly should be rebalanced after install to ensure precision and true spin.

finally, if anyone has anything positive and productive, share, etc. please do so, otherwise, ZIP IT.

that is all.

Nice... thanks for u time :) it should rev up a little bit quicker..

[Charlie]

I'm Pretty pissed i didnt get these when I had my car ripped apart, ehh ill get it this winter when everything is ripped apart again

[NastyNogaro]

Nice... thanks for u time :) it should rev up a little bit quicker..

thank u for quoting the entire thread just to say that

[MiniRS4]

The stock PS pulley is aluminum and is very light from the factory. Im assuming you didnt know this. Waste of money to invest in a lightweight PS pulley.

not sure if you are being a dick or not... but anyways...

i knew it was light, but didnt know by how much. since i am rebuilding the whole motor, i figured wtf, why not...

if this type of info was available to me, i would only have gotten the crank pulley. but since im goin all out, i just went w the whole kit, and ECS gave me the ill hookup.

i dont want to get into a huge debate on whether these work or not. i know they wont give me much, but im just chasing the "every lil bit helps" dilly.

thanks for sharing ... that is all.

[JaredVL]

No alt. pulley?

[MiniRS4]

No alt. pulley?

hold your horses Mr. Imperial Gaurd... alt pulley to come, must remove pulley first, etc. its only gonna be a few grams at best. but i will post pics when i get around to it.

btw, is there a best way to install the alt pulley? like re-balance or have the machine shop install it in some sort of special way so that its spins true-er?

[JayyyyyC]

Mini, thanks for this thread. Now I know I should get the crank pulley. However, are there any downsides to having a lightened crank pulley? I've heard that light pulleys like these can cause issues within the engine due to it not being "balanced" with the other components and shit. I don't know though. If these are safe to run, and yield modest gains or have other good benefits, I'll get these the next time the engine is out.

[hdiaS4]

are you going to remove the clutch fan?

[DAP]

Mini, thanks for this thread. Now I know I should get the crank pulley. However, are there any downsides to having a lightened crank pulley? I've heard that light pulleys like these can cause issues within the engine due to it not being "balanced" with the other components and shit. I don't know though. If these are safe to run, and yield modest gains or have other good benefits, I'll get these the next time the engine is out.

The stock crank pulley is as heavy as it is to balance out the rotating assembly (crankshaft, flywheel, clutch disc, pressure plate). It is a bad idea to install a lighter crank pulley without precision balancing the whole rotating assembly, IMO.

[MiniRS4]

Mini, thanks for this thread. Now I know I should get the crank pulley. However, are there any downsides to having a lightened crank pulley? I've heard that light pulleys like these can cause issues within the engine due to it not being "balanced" with the other components and shit. I don't know though. If these are safe to run, and yield modest gains or have other good benefits, I'll get these the next time the engine is out.

no doubt. my pleasure dude.

regarding the downsides etc... many will say dont bother. its not worth the $$$, etc. it wont spin right. it makes no gains etc. well, i too used to follow that school of thought...

but in light of my recent findings (and sine i am doing a FULL engine overhaul), i say F-that. every lil bit helps. the more you can remove from the rotating assembly the free-er it spins, and the better and more efficient you should spool etc.

to do it right and ensure no problems, you should rebalance the crank, pistons, rods, flywheel and crank pulley.

for those who are bolder and more serious about performance returns, go w LW pulleys, lose the AC, and get a serpentine belt for no AC. that is where its at. anyhow... hope that helps... bc that is all. =)

[highPSI-S4]

Mini, thanks for this thread. Now I know I should get the crank pulley. However, are there any downsides to having a lightened crank pulley? I've heard that light pulleys like these can cause issues within the engine due to it not being "balanced" with the other components and shit. I don't know though. If these are safe to run, and yield modest gains or have other good benefits, I'll get these the next time the engine is out.

Due to these pullies i haven't had any issue with drivablity on the car. I got the ECS tuning Crank& power steering pulleys. There may not be huge gains but i believe in every little bit helps, i did notice alittle increase in low end torque. Pulley's were done around 80,000 miles iam now at 109,00

[MiniRS4]

The stock crank pulley is as heavy as it is to balance out the rotating assembly (crankshaft, flywheel, clutch disc, pressure plate). It is a bad idea to install a lighter crank pulley without precision balancing the whole rotating assembly, IMO.

everybody boo this man! ha, JK... ;-)

DAP is right on the money. rebalance the WHOLE ROTATING ASSEMBLY to ensure precision.

are you going to remove the clutch fan?

looooong gone.

Due to these pullies i haven't had any issue with drivablity on the car. I got the ECS tuning Crank& power steering pulleys. There may not be huge gains but i believe in every little bit helps, i did notice alittle increase in low end torque. Pulley's were done around 80,000 miles iam now at 109,00

thanks for the review. that is whats up! btw, did u rebalance etc? or did you just throw them on? also, any strange noises etc after the change?

[JayyyyyC]

Well I do have the Vast LWFW going in next week. So in the end though, I will see no damage done to my engine with the use of the lightened crank pulley?

[highPSI-S4]

thanks for the review. that is whats up! btw, did u rebalance etc? or did you just throw them on? also, any strange noises etc after the change?[/QUOTE]

Not sure if it was rebalanced or not, Had it done when it was time for my timing belt to be replaced. But haven't heard any noises and or issue's since.
had it Done @ INDUKTION MOTORSPORTS in Maryland so i assume they knew what they were doing, and like i said i've had no issue's.

Here's a thread from AUDIWORLD http://forums.audiworld.com/s4/msgs/2547468.phtml

[Bimmer2Audi]

iirc You couldn't run a LW crank pulley with a LW flywheel, correct?

[hyperlight944]

hmm idk about the s4 guy above me but your refering to the m3's reving to fast with both of those mods on it but as i said before im not sure you cant run both on an s4

[Europowerhaus]

gotta rebalance the crank to balance a rotating assembly (crank, pistons, rods, etc...)

[RolledMySTi]

I put the ECS pulley kit on my car when I did my tb. I've had them on the car for about 9k miles now. I did them with some other mods so I can't say what effect the pulleys have by themselves. I just slapped them on there, nothing was rebalanced. I have a lw flywheel as well.

I have had zero issues with the pulleys. The car idles perfectly and there were no vibration increases. The worry about the pulleys seems to be more of an old wives tale than any real problems. I have never heard of anyone having actual problems with them.

[Cole]

I've had the ECS pullies on my car for about 40K. No issues.

The stock power steering pulley on my car was bent. Cost less at the time to buy the ECS pullies than to buy another stock one.


Some motors, mostly in the old days, were EXTERNALLY balanced with the flywheel/flexplate and the "harmonic/balancer". MOST engines are internally balanced so changing the flywheel/balancer combo should not effect them. (great example is every small block chevy except the 400cid is internally balanced, 400cid is externally balanced. So it is the only one you can't change your flywheel/balancer on)


I find it interesting that everyone complains about the light crank pulley but says nothing about light weight flywheels. A lighter flywheel takes MUCH more weight off one end of the crankshaft. When you think about it, teh effective lever arm on the crank pulley changes a lot just by turning on and off the A/C compressor.

I'm sure there are motors and cases where the pulley weight makes more of a critical difference. I just can't see it on this motor.

[saucys4]

I find it interesting that everyone complains about the light crank pulley but says nothing about light weight flywheels. A lighter flywheel takes MUCH more weight off one end of the crankshaft. When you think about it, teh effective lever arm on the crank pulley changes a lot just by turning on and off the A/C compressor.

Exactly what I was thinking. How is a lightweight flywheel any different than a lightweight crank pulley as far as crankshaft balancing.

[Bimmer2Audi]

I just went through my Auto Tech school notes and it says that light weight flywheels with light weight crank pulleys are a no-no? It just says it will ruin the balance of the crank..

[MiniRS4]

I've had the ECS pullies on my car for about 40K. No issues.

The stock power steering pulley on my car was bent. Cost less at the time to buy the ECS pullies than to buy another stock one.


Some motors, mostly in the old days, were EXTERNALLY balanced with the flywheel/flexplate and the "harmonic/balancer". MOST engines are internally balanced so changing the flywheel/balancer combo should not effect them. (great example is every small block chevy except the 400cid is internally balanced, 400cid is externally balanced. So it is the only one you can't change your flywheel/balancer on)


I find it interesting that everyone complains about the light crank pulley but says nothing about light weight flywheels. A lighter flywheel takes MUCH more weight off one end of the crankshaft. When you think about it, teh effective lever arm on the crank pulley changes a lot just by turning on and off the A/C compressor.

I'm sure there are motors and cases where the pulley weight makes more of a critical difference. I just can't see it on this motor.

great points... that being said... w both a LWFW and LW pulleys, lighter rods as well... they should all be re-balanced together, no? and can they be re-balanced if balanced "internally."