Putting the engine back together

[[email protected]]

So after waiting a few weeks for the parts to come in it is finally time to put it all back together again.

Here are the new custom JE 83.0mm JE pistons 8.75:1 CR with coated skirts and dome





After rings were gapped and installed they were put into the block




The new rebuilt head with Supertech valves, springs and retainers





Powdercoated AGN cover



And some bling hardware

[FromS60toB61.8t]

cant wait for the fire up

[Maverick]

wow, nice work!
Winston, did you get my pm ?

[absolutegtr]

Looks great!

The few engines I have rebuilt I have SMOTHERED the camshaft(s) in Moly lube, lol

[Overboostin]

well done good sir

[sean1.8t]

i was gone for a bit. but why is your engine apart? what happened?

im searching

alright, found that you had pretty bad pressure leakage. but what was the main problem of this? did you indeed bend a valve(s)? or was it your rings?

[ibdeediddy]

now thats how to build a motor!!!!!!

[dougyfresh]

So you did go with head studs?

Still the 86.4mm AMB crank?

Looks good Winston!

[Don Supreme]

From bent exhaust valve to complete rebuild?

[sean1.8t]

So you did go with head studs?

umm.... looks like it to me

[dougyfresh]

From bent exhaust valve to complete rebuild?

I believe the valves damaged the tops of the pistons beyond repairable.

umm.... looks like it to me

Thanks Sean. Maybe I did point out the obvious about the studs but I recall reading a few threads he made here and on vortex about studs. My consensus was you don't need 'em..

[dirtybrd]

Lets hope this one stays together! What exactly happened to the last one?

[HIERLEVELZ]

Supertech makes really good valvetrain parts. Had it in my Honda and i use to rev the piss out of that car never dropped a valve.

[mtbrider]

very nice

[mike-2ptzero]

My consensus was you don't need 'em..

Correct, the stock head bolts are good for well over 800hp and even pushing 32psi on a 8.5:1 CR.


Winston make sure to check your CR once your car is running, I would expect the pistons to have a dish being 83mm and 8.75:1 CR. Even my JE's have some dish and they are 83.5mm 8.5:1. Nearly everyone that got flat top JE's like that said they were 9.5:1.

[AudiA4_20T]

Lets hope this one stays together! What exactly happened to the last one?

OEM exhaust valves

[dirtybrd]

Winston, I assume you fully built the head this time so it can be ran up to 8500rpm and take full advantage of the turbo? Please say you did!

[A4ringedONE8T]

Is this build on the shops wallet or yours?

[[email protected]]

i was gone for a bit. but why is your engine apart? what happened?

im searching

alright, found that you had pretty bad pressure leakage. but what was the main problem of this? did you indeed bend a valve(s)? or was it your rings?

What happened? Well grab a seat and here we go...

About 8 weeks ago we were tuning the car and adjusting the settings of the new Profec EBC I installed. We dialled the EBC to hit 26psi and the Avant was just flying down the highway. Did a few VAG logs to make sure everything looked good and it did, AFR was at 11.9 at max boost.

When the car reached 26psi for the 3rd time it threw a CEL and an audible rattle started. When we VAG the car there was about 10 codes and one of them was for the cam chain tenstioner failing so we thought it was the chain itself rattling against the cover.

So we replaced that with a spare unit from my old head and the rattle was still there. So we decided to replace the lifters but the noise was still there.

We had a dyno day set the next week so we took the car to Rocket Rally and set it up but we didn't like what we were seeing and hearing. There was just monsterous venting from the catch can so we decided to shut it all down and limp the car back to the shop. That is when we did a leakdown test and found cylinder 4 to be losing 70% and there was hissing out of the exhaust side. So that pointed towards damaged valves... so I ordered the Supertech parts. When the parts arrived we pulled the head off and this is what we saw in cylinder 4







This is how it looked new



Now before anyone starts up with any conspiracy theories let me state that there were 3 of us in the car that day when we were doing the tuning. One person was on the VAG, one person was adjusting the EBC and monitoring the AFR and I was driving. The car pulled like a bat out of hell and there were no audible noises, no pinging, nothing heard by any of us that would have indicated that something like this was going to happen

So what exactly caused that chunk of the piston to blast off? No idea. Could have been detonation, could have been a manufacturer defect, the piston might have been dropped by the person I bought them from. No idea.

There was no damage at all to the cylinder #4 wall, a tiny bit of marking of the head and a bunch of burned exhaust valves. There was no damage to the other pistons or the turbo blades.

So to fix the marks on the head Bob decided to smooth things out a bit



So I ordered a new set of pistons made to the same size specifications as the old set but with a modified valve relief design, lower compression ratio and the dome coating as you see now.

It's been 5 weeks of downtime now since dyno day with 4 weeks of that waiting for parts to arrive. Car will be back on the road next week and I start breaking the new rings in again.

[CO AVANT]

WORD WINSTON!!! I'm stoked for you. Hope all goes well. How are you gonna break it in?

[[email protected]]

So you did go with head studs?

Still the 86.4mm AMB crank?

Looks good Winston!

I went with the Raceware head studs the first time around.

Still the 86.4mm crank. Decided to leave the setup at 1.9L as pulling out the engine to do all the work to go 2.0L just wasn't cost effective at this point in time.

[[email protected]]

Correct, the stock head bolts are good for well over 800hp and even pushing 32psi on a 8.5:1 CR.


Winston make sure to check your CR once your car is running, I would expect the pistons to have a dish being 83mm and 8.75:1 CR. Even my JE's have some dish and they are 83.5mm 8.5:1. Nearly everyone that got flat top JE's like that said they were 9.5:1.

Well there is some dish to the dome, it is just hard to photograph with my crappy cell phone at the time.

I'll have them check the CR when it is all buttoned up to confirm that everything is correct.

[[email protected]]

Winston, I assume you fully built the head this time so it can be ran up to 8500rpm and take full advantage of the turbo? Please say you did!

Head is fully built at this time to take advantage of the 8500rpm file or upgraded CAMs in the future.

Is this build on the shops wallet or yours?

I really shouldn't have called it a build but the part replacement is on my dollar.

[CO AVANT]

Piston design is just one factor in determining true mechanical compression ratio.

[[email protected]]

WORD WINSTON!!! I'm stoked for you. Hope all goes well. How are you gonna break it in?

How? Driving like a granny and keeping it out of high boost for 1000km to seat the rings.

I have VAG logs of the old setup so I'm going to do the same runs with the new setup and see of any of the CF change due to the dome coating and smoothing out of the head.

[CO AVANT]

Check this thread on engine break-in Winston...
http://www.audigeeks.com/forums/index.php?topic=1785.0

[[email protected]]

Thanks for the info and I read that thread when I broke the rings in the first time.

I do plan to break it in the same way the second time, vary the RPM levels, blip it every so often to speed it up, use a bit of engine braking to slow the car down and I'm told this, etc. as advised in the writeup.

Guess my version of Granny driving is different than yours.

[dirtybrd]

What octane do you have up there, 98 correct? I'm thinking 26psi. on pump might be to much and burned the valves/piston. During tuning I've burned 2 spark plugs, that might have been valves if they weren't Ferrera's.

[A4ringedONE8T]

The TT we just delivered today we setup for 25psi on pump gas, no meth, using Tapp software. Ran great CF's in the 5-6 range. On T4 or T5 26psi should have been fine with the REVO

[[IX]]

That is sick MC nice job

[[email protected]]

What octane do you have up there, 98 correct? I'm thinking 26psi. on pump might be to much and burned the valves/piston. During tuning I've burned 2 spark plugs, that might have been valves if they weren't Ferrera's.

We have 94 octane here but from what I am told it's crap compared to the gas on the East Coast.

What happened at 26psi last time I do not know. I'm hoping to do better this second time around.

[Wizard-of-OD]

Nice valve cover Winston.

[dirtybrd]

I can only run 25psi on T5 on 93 w/WI. I was 22psi before the cams, so I think you're running to much boost.

[A4ringedONE8T]

I can only run 25psi on T5 on 93 w/WI. I was 22psi before the cams, so I think you're running to much boost.

That doesnt make sense, I run 27 on T6 with 93 and meth everyday and dont get above 4-5 CF's

[mike-2ptzero]

That doesnt make sense, I run 27 on T6 with 93 and meth everyday and dont get above 4-5 CF's

IIRC you also run a 90% meth mix, correct? So why try to even compare that to people running a normal meth mix?

[A4ringedONE8T]

IIRC you also run a 90% meth mix, correct? So why try to even compare that to people running a normal meth mix?

Was for a bit but been back to the straight blue stuff for awhile now. The meth held up for about 3 weeks then I got sick of having to go pick it up. Ran the same shit with either though, the meth just dropped my CF's to 1-2's rather than 4-5's

Messing with a C6 Z06 on the highway yesterday, about 92 degrees out, straight blue washer fluid 1.19/gallon from Walmart was peaking 27.8psi and running strong

[RLB6]

Messing with a C6 Z06 on the highway yesterday, about 92 degrees out, straight blue washer fluid 1.19/gallon from Walmart was peaking 27.8psi and running strong

What were the results messing with that Z06. Just curious.

[mike-2ptzero]

Was for a bit but been back to the straight blue stuff for awhile now. The meth held up for about 3 weeks then I got sick of having to go pick it up. Ran the same shit with either though, the meth just dropped my CF's to 1-2's rather than 4-5's

Messing with a C6 Z06 on the highway yesterday, about 92 degrees out, straight blue washer fluid 1.19/gallon from Walmart was peaking 27.8psi and running strong

What were you running at the track for those 14's?


What does your CF's look like pushing that much boost without the meth?

[dirtybrd]

That doesnt make sense, I run 27 on T6 with 93 and meth everyday and dont get above 4-5 CF's

I run straight water and at the track I ran 27psi and T6 and got audible detenation at the top end of the track. So I stay 25psi and T5 just to be safe.

[A4ringedONE8T]

What were you running at the track for those 14's?

What does your CF's look like pushing that much boost without the meth?

Blue stuff at the track too, the meth is always on so I couldnt tell you what it would do without it. Definitely wouldnt be able to run that much boost on straight 93 without high CF's and timing pull