just went stg3, thinking of going GT 3.0

[volks88]

i have another engine so im thinking of building it and getting the gt's at the same time. i'll sell off the k04's,dp's,motor and anything misc i dont need to recoup some cash. few questions... what do you think the short block will run me assuming everything is done right with the right parts? and will ER sidemounts do the job? im assuming i can have epl write me a file, can i use my current fueling set up(stock airbox, 60lb injectors )?? do you think its unrealistic to think i can do this for $10 g's + the cash i make back. so maybe like $14 to $15g's ???

[ThirdStrike]

just be happy with k04's. theres still more power to be made from an OTS stage 3 setup..

[highPSI-S4]

Do what you like, i thought about GT's myself but i don't need all that power and don't have the money to do all that so K04's will do for me. You may have decided you want more , it's your call. You know what they say change is good, if you can get the cash to do it then i would. don't follow the norm we need this GT exposure for are cars.

P.S. if you do decide to do it and i haven't gone stage3 yet i call dibs on your turbo's

[volks88]

ive been stg3 for like 2 months lol. i just landed a big job (tile contractor) so im thinking of treating myself to this.

[GURUMAN]

do it man, ther is not enough gt around...

[highPSI-S4]

ive been stg3 for like 2 months lol. i just landed a big job (tile contractor) so im thinking of treating myself to this.

Congats on that, speaking of that i also have a new job and make alot more money. but were i live, with my girlfriend, and tying to buy a house= no GT kit for me. hope it all works out

[GURUMAN]

heres to help you

[generationjdm]

Go GT, there's a turbo setup for anyone from stock motor to fully built from road racing to drag racing... Heres some pics of whats going on my car...

[FrimmelNoJerz]

hahaha this car that is never built....god...so many projects come and go and yours is always in the works.

[Das General]

at least he has a car...

[updaboost]

ive been stg3 for like 2 months lol. i just landed a big job (tile contractor) so im thinking of treating myself to this.

Save your money....

[volks88]

Congats on that, speaking of that i also have a new job and make alot more money. but were i live, with my girlfriend, and tying to buy a house= no GT kit for me. hope it all works out

thanx man, i really do appreciate that. congrats yourself

Save your money....

what fun would that be? the whole point is to use this cash that is totally disposable on something just for me. i like having fast cars so its a small price to pay

hey genjdm, will my 3" exhaust be ok? send me prices to please. i think im doin it

[FrimmelNoJerz]

at least he has a car...

actually we both have a shell that doesnt run. the difference is that at the end of this month ill have a shell and another car.

[Dr. Jekyll]

You're probably looking at 10-15g's for a 3.0L build alone. And that doesn't include the cost of turbos and fueling.

[YMJ]

actually we both have a shell that doesnt run. the difference is that at the end of this month ill have a shell and another car.

why u being bitter towards him??

so what if its taking long!! no need to be bitter!

[volks88]

You're probably looking at 10-15g's for a 3.0L

how is that possible?

[Das General]

You're probably looking at 10-15g's for a 3.0L build alone. And that doesn't include the cost of turbos and fueling.

No way. You can buy fully built 3.0 engines for 6-7k...

[Dr. Jekyll]

I'm sure it can be built on the cheap. But if you're shelling out that kind of cash, I'd want new everything, and I would want to be using a quality engine builder. The shortblock alone (with labor) is probably going to run you 6k +.

[Das General]

No... they sell short blocks and long blocks 3.0 brand new, with rods and pistons of your choice...compression of your choice. All for 7k

[volks88]

No way. You can buy fully built 3.0 engines for 6-7k...

thats what i thought. i was figuring $7500 and another $7500 for the rest

[Dr. Jekyll]

Who is "they"?

[Das General]

I am trying to dig up one of the sites. But it doesn't really matter who they are...what matters is that it can be accomplished.


You could piece together a full kit for 15k. Engine, turbos, downpipes, and fueling...

[Dr. Jekyll]

Yes it does matter who "they" are. And it depends on the parts "they" use. If it's eurospec you are referring to... have fun. Let me know how that works out for you.

[Das General]

Like I said, you can pick and choose what you want in your car. At the end of the day you can do at a lot cheaper cost then what you stated.

[Dr. Jekyll]

Saw the edit: Yes it does matter how it's accomplished. He said he wants to do it right. Why go through the effort, money and time of building up an engine and reusing a lot of old parts and using someone who doesn't know what they are doing.

A set of Rosten or Pauter Rods is going to run you 1000. I've seen a good set up 3.0l pistons (at gb pricing) going for around 1300-1400. Then you have to factor in the cost of the 3.0l crank. That will probably run you 500-1000, assuming you can find someone selling one and don't have to by a 3.0l engine from the junk yard to strip. So right there you have around $3500 for just a few major components. THen factor in the labor cost of a good engine builder boring out block, clearancing for the 3.0l crank and balancing everything. Don't forget all the little shit you might/will need, like head studs, rings, bearings etc. Just for the assembly of the block + the little things you're easily looking at 2-3k.

So there is your short block. Then on to the heads, intake manifold, turbos, fueling, intercoolers, downpipes and clutch.

[Das General]

I know people that have gotten their motors bored out another .2 liters for 500...fully balanced.

and take a look at the kits that are being pieced together these days...6-7k for a full gt kit is becoming more reasonable. not everyone has to spend their life savings on an EPL or ASP tune and GT kit.

[generationjdm]

hahaha this car that is never built....god...so many projects come and go and yours is always in the works.

Please show me one GT car thats came and went, last I checked there still being built?

If your speaking about me let me say "I'm not use to slapping garbage together" maybe you are..

I'm building several kits where everything is built from scratch and is not as easy as you may think, for one getting factories to bend pipes isn't easy and takes time.

My car being finished isn't important at this time seeings it's been used for fitting and testing parts. I also have a life, family,job and business.. Your car on the other hand has been, well everyone already knows.. Last I check your car has been incomplete and running like shit for a real long time from what you keep saying, so is yours really done?

[Dr. Jekyll]

You "know people". Nice evidence to back up your position. But even going by that "estimate"; that's just boring. How about fitting a different crank? How about the actual parts you'll need? It adds up quick. And no I'm not going any company's quote. This is simply being realistic about a proper build. It's going to cost a lot if you want to build a 3.0l properly.

And speaking of EPL, since he's going to want a tune from them, it's going to cost a lot more since they don't have a base map for 3.0L GT cars. So that's going to be a lot of dyno time.

[Das General]

You "know people". Nice evidence to back up your position. But even going by that "estimate"; that's just boring. How about fitting a different crank? How about the actual parts you'll need? It adds up quick. And no I'm not going any company's quote. This is simply being realistic about a proper build. It's going to cost a lot if you want to build a 3.0l properly.

And speaking of EPL, since he's going to want a tune from them, it's going to cost a lot more since they don't have a base map for 3.0L GT cars. So that's going to be a lot of dyno time.

Jesus guy, give it up. I am not going to go into every single detail, mostly due to the fact that I don't have every single detail to who did the work.. What matters is you can get it done for a lot cheaper than what you said. Just because you were wrong about your prices doesn't mean you need to get all fussy...

Besides some people have connections.

I would agree that the most expensive aspect would be tuning, especially running standalone.

[AB18]

Maybe its just me, and my cash flow isn't of others. But throwing 15k in a S4 on a non proven GT setup is just not a very good idea. Yes, these gts makes tons of power, but when are we going to see it on the track? Asp 750awhp gt is STILL running mid to low 11s, and its a shop car, that is if it makes it down the track. Being you already have a stage 3 car, id put your extra cash into more tuning. Id get ahold of jason at jhm and work with him to make a file that will be much more aggressive then ots software. Again, just my 02.

[Das General]

True.

I have yet to see a really well running GT that is consistent. Until they are proven like the K04 cars then I'd wait. BUT it seems like we are gonna see some good GT cars come out this summer, so it should be interesting to see!

[Dr. Jekyll]

The OP wanted an estimate of the cost of getting the engine built right. Meaning it's going to be using quality parts and replacing anything and everything that might or should be replaced. And he never once mentioned connections. If you can get a 3.0l crank for a 30 pack, well good for you. If you "know someone" who will do the labor, then by all means. BUT that is not a realistic estimate for everyone.

What if the OP were to take your bro deal estimate and start building an engine. But comes to find, his prices are a lot different from yours? But then he's stuck with $7k worth of parts and no 3.0l.

Is it possible to do it for 6k? Probably. Is it possible, or even advisable for everyone to get it done for that price... probably not. Hell I saw a stock rebuilt long block being sold by WMS (notoriously low prices) going for $5k. Going by that and simply the cost of the parts required it's going to realistically cost 10-15k. If you can get bro deals, it will be less. But I wouldn't assume everyone can get labor and parts cheap.

Oh and I'm just questioning your facts. You told me I was wrong and provided absolutely no support or personal knowledge for your statement other than "I know people". Not very convincing.

[Das General]

How would you like me to provide evidence for a shop that doesnt have a Web site?

If someone get their engine bored and balanced for $500 then I am sure you could find a similar deal somewhere else. That is a ballpark figure... meaning you can expect to pay about that cost.

It's gonna cost less than your 10-15k price..

[AB18]

True.

I have yet to see a really well running GT that is consistent. Until they are proven like the K04 cars then I'd wait. BUT it seems like we are gonna see some good GT cars come out this summer, so it should be interesting to see!

There are alot of GT cars coming out this summer with some good quality,second to none hardware.. Whos going to be tuning them all? Unitronics? vag? If frank at Asp can't tune one to run the numbers it should for the power it makes, then there not either. Obvisouly there are alot of factors and im to tired to break it down, but its just some food for thought.

[jibberjive]

To the OP, do it!

[GURUMAN]

If frank at Asp can't tune one to run the numbers it should for the power it makes, then there not either.

Frank is a god

as for me, 034 standalone tuned on unitronics dyno... They felt violated at first but now likes the idea...

mike chipped my 2 previous cars...

[GURUMAN]

As for a 2.8L engine:

rods: 1000$
2.8L 82.5mm JE pistons: 1350$
rod bearings:135$
main and trust bearings:160$
oilpump:150$
rear main seal:140$
front crank seal:5$
polishing crank:60$
boring of cylinders: 25$ each
balancing of the rotating assembly:175$
assembly labor:150$

Total about 3500$ for short block

All you need is timing belt kit and head gaskets and head bolts to make em long block.

But once there, you try finding nice decent 2.8 heads.

Heads: 200$ each ( I paid 250$ for the pair from a local guy)
You can keep 2.8 cams or swap your s4 in.
Rs4 cams:500$
You can swap your s4 exhaust valves
2.7t & 1.8t exhaust valves sodium filled: 60$ each
titanium retainers and supertech valve springs: 795$
seals and timing ajuster seals: 25$
assembly labor:400$

Total for heads: around 2000$

So it is fair to say that you can have a built engine for around 5 to 7k

The labor for removing the engine from the car and disasembling in pieces is not included witch counts a lot.

[generationjdm]

Theres dozens of GT cars running that you will never here about, there not people that race there cars..

The more hp you make the harder it becomes to run a consistent number or plant the car. It's kinda of funny how many people think running a high hp car down the track is easy..

If all that matters is 1/4 mile times then I guess Marc has the right idea, but we know most people don't build S4ss for 1/4 mile times including myself.

If garrett turbos aren't proven then what turbos are? Every serious turbo car at the track runs garrett, I personally never seen a kkk on a race car.

There should be some really nice cars running this summer and fall.

[Dr. Jekyll]

As for a 2.8L engine:

rods: 1000$
2.8L 82.5mm JE pistons: 1350$
rod bearings:135$
main and trust bearings:160$
oilpump:150$
rear main seal:140$
front crank seal:5$
polishing crank:60$
boring of cylinders: 25$ each
balancing of the rotating assembly:175$
assembly labor:150$

Total about 3500$ for short block

All you need is timing belt kit and head gaskets and head bolts to make em long block.

But once there, you try finding nice decent 2.8 heads.

Heads: 200$ each ( I paid 250$ for the pair from a local guy)
You can keep 2.8 cams or swap your s4 in.
Rs4 cams:500$
You can swap your s4 exhaust valves
2.7t & 1.8t exhaust valves sodium filled: 60$ each
titanium retainers and supertech valve springs: 795$
seals and timing ajuster seals: 25$
assembly labor:400$

Total for heads: around 2000$

So it is fair to say that you can have a built engine for around 5 to 7k

The labor for removing the engine from the car and disasembling in pieces is not included witch counts a lot.

Good break down. For a 3.0l you have to factor in another ~1000 for the 3.0l crank and that's assuming you don't have to buy a 3.0l short block from the junkyard. And the crank isn't just bolt in. There are clearance issues. Don't forget the RS4 intake mani which then requires a bigger TB and the RS4 fuel rail. For the Intake mani and fuel rail that's 1200 right there.

So only an hour and half shop time to assemble an engine? Please tell me where these shops are located. I've seen people spend $7k+ in parts alone for a 2.8l build. Then factor in the cost of pulling, disassembling, reassembling and reinstalling the engine. And assuming you don't get bro deals on any of this. Easily in the 5 figures by that point.

[AudiA4_20T]

Theres dozens of GT cars running that you will never here about, there not people that race there cars..

The more hp you make the harder it becomes to run a consistent number or plant the car. It's kinda of funny how many people think running a high hp car down the track is easy..

If all that matters is 1/4 mile times then I guess Marc has the right idea, but we know most people don't build S4ss for 1/4 mile times including myself.

If garrett turbos aren't proven then what turbos are? Every serious turbo car at the track runs garrett, I personally never seen a kkk on a race car.

There should be some really nice cars running this summer and fall.

there are a bunch... Check out the Audi S1, MONSTER

and you can EASILY build a 3.0 for less thank 7k, you just need patience to get the parts you need at the right prices

o, and for those of you saying that GT S4s arent reliable, thats the attitude that never pushes the limits, we wouldnt have K04 cars if that was always the attitude