Question about Fuel Pump w/ Revo

[darmz]

Hi guys, I'm currently running a Revo Stg 2 with TP.
I'm looking forward to get a fuel pump and I have done some research on them. Found out that there are about 3 possible options for the fuel pump(APR, Autotech, and KMD).

My questions are..
- Did Revo really come out with TP/FP software yet?
- What do you guys think about Autotech and KMD fuel pumps? (are they inferior to APR fuel pump? cuz they are way cheaper.)
- Which would be more compatible with Revo, Autotech or KMD?

[cam]

apr's unit is way overpriced, the kmd unit and the autotech unit appear to be very similar.

[AudiWxGuy]

Say what you want about APR...it's the only one that is fully tested and built the best. It's so expensive b/c all the R&D that went into this has to be paid for somehow. (Custom, in house built equipment and electronics)

You can have your own pump rebuilt by APR for $600...well worth it IMO.

Those other pumps all seem a little sketchy to me. Remember, you have an Audi now, treat it like one.

[Mike@APR]

apr's unit is way overpriced, the kmd unit and the autotech unit appear to be very similar.

Someone said this once before, although in more colorful language, and here's some info I provided them concerning what goes into every APR FSI Fuel pump...

http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php?t=202646

Ultimately, the choice is yours but I am just providing this info so that you can make an informed decision about the APR Fuel Pump.

[cam]

Someone said this once before, although in more colorful language, and here's some info I provided them concerning what goes into every APR FSI Fuel pump...

http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php?t=202646

Ultimately, the choice is yours but I am just providing this info so that you can make an informed decision about the APR Fuel Pump.

was there really any need to post that?

at the end of the day the choice is with the consumer. apr isnt the only company that offers the rebuild service, autotech also offers the rebuild service and if i remember correctly its $50, and im sure if you call kmd, they can take care of you as well.

that argument about having to pay for r&d is bs, autotech and kmd will not put a product on the market that has not been tested and retested for performance and quality. Apr's products are expensive and imho overpriced and they will always be that way.

i just dont see the logic in spending 650 for a rebuild or 1050 for a new unit. when you can purchase the kmd fueling kit for 1000, which includes high flow fsi injectors, i havent seen apr offer the injectors to the public as of yet.

Apr products are quality, i had one of their first 3inch turbo back exhausts on my mk5 gti, although i had some issues which went unresolved by apr, i was happy with the products performance. and i wouldn't have had the exhaust if i hadn't gotten a ridiculous deal on it

if it was me and i was planning on going bt in the future, i would purchase the kmd fueling setup, and have my pump rebuilt by kmd. and keep the injectors for when you do the turbo upgrade.

[Mike@APR]

was there really any need to post that?

at the end of the day the choice is with the consumer. apr isnt the only company that offers the rebuild service, autotech also offers the rebuild service and if i remember correctly its $50, and im sure if you call kmd, they can take care of you as well.

that argument about having to pay for r&d is bs, autotech and kmd will not put a product on the market that has not been tested and retested for performance and quality. Apr's products are expensive and imho overpriced and they will always be that way.

i just dont see the logic in spending 650 for a rebuild or 1050 for a new unit. when you can purchase the kmd fueling kit for 1000, which includes high flow fsi injectors, i havent seen apr offer the injectors to the public as of yet.

Apr products are quality, i had one of their first 3inch turbo back exhausts on my mk5 gti, although i had some issues which went unresolved by apr, i was happy with the products performance. and i wouldn't have had the exhaust if i hadn't gotten a ridiculous deal on it

if it was me and i was planning on going bt in the future, i would purchase the kmd fueling setup, and have my pump rebuilt by kmd. and keep the injectors for when you do the turbo upgrade.

I honestly meant no harm but posting a link to that thread. There was plenty of informative technical information in that thread about the pump and maybe I should have retyped it instead of being lazy and posting that link. However, whether you like the thread or not, the technical data still stands. The single purpose for me posting in this thread, as I stated previously, was to provide the consumer with some information about our pump. I am not here to bash anyone else's products and I said that multiple times in the other post.

And who cares about paying for R&D? When you pay for our pump, you are paying for some very high-quality components and they cost money. I only wish I could tell you just how expensive those pump parts really are due to all the steps they go through to be validated for the sole purpose of protecting your automotive investment. I will be the first to admit that we are not the cheapest product on the block, but by using words like "overpriced", you are saying that we charge more than the parts are worth and that is simply not true.

As far as the fueling products from the competition, I have yet to see you quote any data (except price) that helped you make the decision to go with your brand of choice? This was the entire point of me posting that link. I always hear about price but I seldom get any technical argument from anyone about why they make their choices on parts. However, people are always quick to assume that we are "overpriced" and are giving customers way less than what they pay for.

The logic for paying $650 for a pump rebuild or paying $1000 for a new unit is simple...(1) You are getting an OEM quality product that is individually tested and verified to do exactly what we have designed it to do; (2) We take every possible step to ensure that these parts are working properly in order to drastically minimize the risk to your expensive automobile while providing you all of the power and performance you expect; (3) We believe our process steps are the ONLY way to do this pump correctly. All of the technical reasons behind these three points were explained in the link I posted.

Honestly, we get chewed out for the price of our products all the time. But it's surprising how few people actually engage us in a discussion about what they are really paying for. They just see the price and go nuts. At the end of the day, I want to be price competitive but I don't want to sacrifice quality or performance to do so. And the FSI Fuel Pump is a place where these sacrifices are NOT an option. It’s funny to hear people who drive Audis flame us for being "overpriced".

As far as our high-flow FSI injectors, like those used for Stage 3, we haven't released them separately because we are concerned about the consumer not having access to the proper tuning needed to properly run these injectors with whatever other hardware they decide to put together. You see, these injectors are unique to APR and we have made specific changes in the engine management in order to run them properly with the Stage 3 setup since we know ALL of the characteristics of our injectors. If we just give you the injectors and let whoever tune your car, there is no guarantee that the tuning will be appropriate for the hardware combination. And then what do we have? An unhappy customer with a poorly running car. That's why we only sell the injectors within the confines of the Stage 3 kit (which will be available for the Longitudinal 2.0TFSI).

I agree with you that the choice is the consumer's. That's the way it should be. I am only here to educate about our products. Instead of talking price, I would rather discuss with you any technical questions/performance you may have about our products and the 2.0T FSI engine.

For example: for those folks who are having fuel cuts that are thinking about buying an upgraded pump...DO YOU KNOW WHY YOU ARE HAVING FUEL CUTS? This is an important question before you purchase any pump. We have learned a lot over the past year about all the different fueling failure modes in the 2.0T FSI and using our FSI Fuel Pump Tester (flow bench) for the pump rebuild program was a great contributor to this knowledge base. Care to discuss?

I know that tone is hard to read on the internet so please understand that my tone is simply that of a discussion and is not meant to sound argumentative.

Best Regards,

Mike

[AudiWxGuy]

Hey Mike,

I was flashed with APR back in October. I had the software for almost a month. I found that I did have fule cut issues, especially while in 3rd gear at the higher RPM's. It wasn't terrible, but I definitley noticed it. This was just as the new fuel pump was being released. i didn't have the money to buy a new one(fuel pump), so I got flashed back to stock, got a refund and bought an exhuast instead. I figured that some software may be in order at a later date. At that point, I was not sure who to go with as I wasn't in love with the fuel cut issues and wanted to maintain a stock-like, smooth driveability.


From what I've read on the forum about individuals who have bought the new pump, it sounds like it does some amazing things; Great, smooth power. In short, I'm pretty much sold that when I do decide to get flashed again, I'm going to go with APR, but I'll make sure to get a new pump as well.

I was also up at Jim Ellis Audi in ATL this past weekend and got to talking with one of the salesmen who told me that you guys have bought several cars from them. Including an R8? Awesome!

Also...I'm pretty sure I've got one of the only B7 A4's in my area of Georgia (Macon)...If you would like to have APR represent around here, I'd love to help out any way I can!

Look forward to doing business with you.

Eddie

[B7!]

i have the pump along with every other apr add on i can get for my B7 and i am still having problems with my programs.... at the moment i still have hesitations sometimes and most of the time my car is at half throttle... every time i get on the gas and then i put the clutch in and rev it is very hard to pass 3000rpm and when i take off it just kick in like its supposed to.... this problem has only accored when i had my car reflashed with updated software... been trying to get if fixed with apr but they are always too busy for me..

[Mike@APR]

For the two guys who have asked me questions about their specific setup or issues (AudiWxGuy and B7!), I am going to spend some time later answering your questions by private message as this is a thread about Revo software and aftermarket fuel pumps and I don't want to change the topic.

My question about "Do you know why you have fuel cuts?" is something I am going to try and help you answer. And here's a little tidbit of info for everyone, the problem is not always the software. I'll talk to you two by PM.

[davis449]

For the two guys who have asked me questions about their specific setup or issues (AudiWxGuy and B7!), I am going to spend some time later answering your questions by private message as this is a thread about Revo software and aftermarket fuel pumps and I don't want to change the topic.

My question about "Do you know why you have fuel cuts?" is something I am going to try and help you answer. And here's a little tidbit of info for everyone, the problem is not always the software. I'll talk to you two by PM.

Screw that, I would actually like to know what APR has found out about this. I am considering the pump as a part of my Stage II upgrade coming soon.

[Widget]

Take the APR talk here.

http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...10#post2500610

[VZWalex]

was there really any need to post that?

at the end of the day the choice is with the consumer. apr isnt the only company that offers the rebuild service, autotech also offers the rebuild service and if i remember correctly its $50, and im sure if you call kmd, they can take care of you as well.

that argument about having to pay for r&d is bs, autotech and kmd will not put a product on the market that has not been tested and retested for performance and quality. Apr's products are expensive and imho overpriced and they will always be that way.

i just dont see the logic in spending 650 for a rebuild or 1050 for a new unit. when you can purchase the kmd fueling kit for 1000, which includes high flow fsi injectors, i havent seen apr offer the injectors to the public as of yet.

Apr products are quality, i had one of their first 3inch turbo back exhausts on my mk5 gti, although i had some issues which went unresolved by apr, i was happy with the products performance. and i wouldn't have had the exhaust if i hadn't gotten a ridiculous deal on it

if it was me and i was planning on going bt in the future, i would purchase the kmd fueling setup, and have my pump rebuilt by kmd. and keep the injectors for when you do the turbo upgrade.

omg.... please go buy a civic

Thanks !

[Auditude2.0T]

APR is the real deal and i have nothing but praise to say about them. They are just great to deal with and there product is quality. Just because one fuel pump is cheaper it doesn't mean there the same. Its like saying the new Honda Accord is 20k and has 260hp, yea the Audi and Honda maybe both cars but one of them is of better quality. You get what you pay for, and with APR you get the best.

[quattrosaint]

i have the pump along with every other apr add on i can get for my B7 and i am still having problems with my programs.... at the moment i still have hesitations sometimes and most of the time my car is at half throttle... every time i get on the gas and then i put the clutch in and rev it is very hard to pass 3000rpm and when i take off it just kick in like its supposed to.... this problem has only accored when i had my car reflashed with updated software... been trying to get if fixed with apr but they are always too busy for me..

Same problem, they are working with me. Loaded a new program today but still have "fuel cut" issues, the hesitation is completly gone though. APR are great guys. My local shop Eurosport has been very, VERY helpful. You may want to ask APR to load the file that they did on my car today. Its definately a step in the right direction.

[acbrooks2]

I am seriously getting f*cked off with the fact that my car has been at the dealer for the past 3 days and having had fuel sensor replaced, fuel pump replaced, fuel filter replaced and it is still throwing the fuel sensor CEL. I set the Revo back to stock before taking to the dealer, but it has to be related to that - right REVO?

[Sanjman]

Say what you want about APR...it's the only one that is fully tested and built the best. It's so expensive b/c all the R&D that went into this has to be paid for somehow. (Custom, in house built equipment and electronics)

You can have your own pump rebuilt by APR for $600...well worth it IMO.

Those other pumps all seem a little sketchy to me. Remember, you have an Audi now, treat it like one.

just because APR fully tests doesn't mean Autotech and KMD don't test. No reason for anyone to bash on any company that offers alternatives to a pricey product. I have not heard any complaints about autotech or KMD... so what justification is there to say APR is the best?

Overall, it's true that the price of the product includes the cost of R&D, testing, but can also be inflated because they have already built a trust with the customers they already have. Keep in mind that R&D, testing, etc. can be factored not just by how "good" the engineers are but where they are, how much their salaries are, cost of equipment, time, overheads, etc.,etc.

It's all on you on what to choose...

random thought:
Tommy: Let's think about this for a sec, Ted, why do they put a guarantee on a box? Hmm, very interesting.
Ted: I'm listening.
Tommy: Here's how I see it. A guy puts a guarantee on the box 'cause he wants you to fell all warm and toasty inside.
Ted: Yeah, makes a man feel good.
Tommy: 'Course it does. Ya think if you leave that box under your pillow at night, the Guarantee Fairy might come by and leave a quarter.
Ted: What's your point?
Tommy: The point is, how do you know the Guarantee Fairy isn't a crazy glue sniffer? "Building model airplanes" says the little fairy, but we're not buying it. Next thing you know, there's money missing off the dresser and your daughter's knocked up, I seen it a hundred times.
Ted: But why do they put a guarantee on the box then?
Tommy: Because they know all they solda ya was a guaranteed piece of shit. That's all it is. Hey, if you want me to take a dump in a box and mark it guaranteed, I will. I got spare time. But for right now, for your sake, for your daughter's sake, ya might wanna think about buying a quality item from me.
Ted: Hmm. Okay, I'll buy from you.
Tommy: Well I... What?

[RedS-line]

acbrooks- maybe the problem has to do with your cams? cam lobe wear, etc. i think someone else wrote about this..

[Doctor]

Buy an AutoTech one.
So many people have it here in Greece, no problems at all. Plus the cost is certainly superb for what you get.

I mean hello....The R&D yes ok I get it, but if a company makes a product that works excellent, no problems, and is cheaper, give me a break...Y NOT buy it...Give me one good reason...
And its not like u'll be the first one...Lots of other have done it a long time ago...

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[AudiWxGuy]

AWE is about to release a fuel pump as well. Will be a little more expensive than the autotoech. The cost is ~$400 for the fuel pump, plus injectors.

[acbrooks2]

acbrooks- maybe the problem has to do with your cams? cam lobe wear, etc. i think someone else wrote about this..

That is what I said to the dealer, but they have to follow whatever Audi says (so they get paid). They asked me today if the car had been chipped (of course not) and are checking the cams.

Best

[darmz]

AWE is about to release a fuel pump as well. Will be a little more expensive than the autotoech. The cost is ~$400 for the fuel pump, plus injectors.

Where can I find more info about this?
I'd love to go with AWE.

[Sal_B7]

Hi guys, I'm currently running a Revo Stg 2 with TP.
I'm looking forward to get a fuel pump and I have done some research on them. Found out that there are about 3 possible options for the fuel pump(APR, Autotech, and KMD).

My questions are..
- Did Revo really come out with TP/FP software yet?
- What do you guys think about Autotech and KMD fuel pumps? (are they inferior to APR fuel pump? cuz they are way cheaper.)
- Which would be more compatible with Revo, Autotech or KMD?

I just installed my autotech fuel pump and i noticed a big difference!! Im getting chipped by REVO on Sat. hopefully. This shop over in Mission Viejo. I pretty much have a stage 2 set up, with IC and ill be running Meth. So im looking forward to the upgrade!!

[Geoffafa]

iim gonna lay it down nice and simple, and end this process right now

i have the autotech fuel pump, i have revo
the autotech fuel pump does any and everything the APR pump does, for a far better price, also, with revo once you have a fuel pump, you can get stage 2+. with that file (which i also have) you have one of the nicest running a4's on this forum. hands down


/thread

[06B7audiA4]

Autotech, KMD, APR(full oem pump w/ upgrade) and now AWE

Might lead towards the AWE now since KMD is slowly but surely getting there parts in stock. Guy from KMD said they have itleast 50 pump upgrades come in a week, and they are sold before hand on a waiting list.

[juggernaut201]

i got the revo program and the kmd pump you wont regret it