Forge? evo? with which intake?

**R3DL3TR5** · 08-13-2004 02:46 AM

Hey, I'm looking into replacing my stock DV with either a Forge or an evo. I've been reading up on both and they both seem to be equally as effective, however, i'm just looking for a suggestion from you guys. Which one would you recommend? Also, I want to put an intake on. (probly warm air because i need to use it in the snow and winter). I was looking at the evo, and i really like it's setup but it seems kind of pricey. I'm looking for the best sound and best performance gains. Also, what kind of performance gains can i anticipate by changing these (DV and intake). What are my other options and what all would you recomend? Thanks!
-wes m.

**littlewhite** · 08-13-2004 03:00 AM

007 is good. Heard from many with intake and the Evo BPV, the pssh sound is pretty loud. Intake i got the Evo one a long time ago and did alot of heatshielding and boxing the arae in. Alot of ppl here will just tell u to leave the intake idea out on the 1.8T b/c of alot of warm air generated in the engine, turbo, cat area. You dont make additional power with DV.

**skene** · 08-13-2004 05:13 AM

If you are going to pick up the Evo intake might as well have them throw in the BPV.

Saves time and hassle.

**EVIL-AUDI** · 08-13-2004 05:15 AM

EVO BPV is nice

**skene** · 08-13-2004 05:16 AM

lol...

that's it?

**98a4** · 08-13-2004 08:15 AM

EVO. Internally lubed with redline oil

**Steve** · 08-13-2004 08:18 AM

where do you buy the evo intake and bpv?

**DDQ** · 08-13-2004 08:24 AM

http://www.evoms.com/

I would suggest you look in the classifieds if you want an intake kit. Usually people sell them shortly after they install them and realize what a waste of money they are.

**Steve** · 08-13-2004 08:25 AM

wholy shit no kidding for 270! geez

**DDQ** · 08-13-2004 08:27 AM

Originally posted by Steve
wholy shit no kidding for 270! geez

If they were $27 they would still be overpriced.

**skene** · 08-13-2004 08:37 AM

DDQ.. then you make a product and market it.

Sell it off to the public.

And whatever product you spend hours and hours on developing.. sell it for $.00000027

Cause thats how much your comments are worth.

**DDQ** · 08-13-2004 08:43 AM

Originally posted by skene
DDQ.. then you make a product and market it.

Sell it off to the public.

And whatever product you spend hours and hours on developing.. sell it for $.00000027

Cause thats how much your comments are worth.

Huh? So if a company works really hard on a product that does not add any performance to your car, you think it's justifiable to charge a lot for it? I don't get your logic.

You seem to misinterprete much of what I say. I never said anything bad about the company. I'm just saying I think it's a worthless mod.

**skene** · 08-13-2004 08:55 AM

ok fine then you think it is a worthless mod... but must you continuously state that... just because you feel that it is.. someone may your interpret your opinion for fact. The fact of the matter is.. unless you can prove that it doesnt make any HP.. you shouldnt make any false claims.

**Steve** · 08-13-2004 09:00 AM

very true....

Originally posted by skene
ok fine then you think it is a worthless mod... but must you continuously state that... just because you feel that it is.. someone may your interpret your opinion for fact. The fact of the matter is.. unless you can prove that it doesnt make any HP.. you shouldnt make any false claims.

**Silvant** · 08-13-2004 10:07 AM

Originally posted by skene
ok fine then you think it is a worthless mod... but must you continuously state that... just because you feel that it is.. someone may your interpret your opinion for fact. The fact of the matter is.. unless you can prove that it doesnt make any HP.. you shouldnt make any false claims.

yes, its obvious that he MUST have to continuosly state it because there is always gonna be a weekely tool that asks about this pointless bullshit.
blah, blah, blah... get a k&n, drop it in and drive away.

**skene** · 08-13-2004 10:21 AM

There will always be someone thats going to ask it... but dont state your opinion of not liking it... as fact.

State your reason.. or if not tell the n00b to search.
Let him decide if he wants it or not.

Silvant if you are going to get into the simple fact of a drop in K&N.. why dont you also state that "well K&Ns suck because they blow out your MAF sensor..." blah blah blah.
stick with OEM...... etc etc etc..

Cmon now.

End of story.

**MR VTEC** · 08-13-2004 10:42 AM

the k&n filter doesnt blow your maf sensor the recharging oil blows it!

**littlewhite** · 08-13-2004 01:08 PM

Originally posted by MR VTEC
the k&n filter doesnt blow your maf sensor the recharging oil blows it!

lol ! Yea, some ppl cant wait to put them back off b4 is all dried and done and clean.

**JMG** · 08-13-2004 01:21 PM

Originally posted by skene
ok fine then you think it is a worthless mod... but must you continuously state that... just because you feel that it is.. someone may your interpret your opinion for fact. The fact of the matter is.. unless you can prove that it doesnt make any HP.. you shouldnt make any false claims.

Would you rather he lie and tell someone that "sure its going to add HP!!" when he thinks it doesn't?

Its a forum, and we need both sides of the story. That's DDQ's opinion (and I tend to agree). EVOMS hadsn't backed up this product with numbers. Logic and simple physics says it doesn't do squat but sound different and look nice. We should presume all products don't do anything until they are tested and backed up with actual real world numbers and experiences... unless you like throwing money away. Fact is, alot of people have sold their kit because they realize it doesn't do anything. Some people have kept their kits because they think it does. LEts hear from both sides. R3DL3TR5 can make his decision off that.

**JMG** · 08-13-2004 01:24 PM

Originally posted by skene
someone may your interpret your opinion for fact.

lol, i get what you are saying, but must we cater to the weak of mind so much? This is a common reason given for book banning/burning and censorship.

"People are too stupid to know better."

If I took what everyone and anyone posted on the forums as FACT my head would explode.

**JMG** · 08-13-2004 01:39 PM

Originally posted by R3DL3TR5
Hey, I'm looking into replacing my stock DV with either a Forge or an evo. I've been reading up on both and they both seem to be equally as effective, however, i'm just looking for a suggestion from you guys. Which one would you recommend? Also, I want to put an intake on. (probly warm air because i need to use it in the snow and winter). I was looking at the evo, and i really like it's setup but it seems kind of pricey. I'm looking for the best sound and best performance gains. Also, what kind of performance gains can i anticipate by changing these (DV and intake). What are my other options and what all would you recomend? Thanks!
-wes m.

back on the subject... These are my opinions, all of which I believe to be true. You may take these as "fact" if you wish, or not, it's up to you.

I don't think a "warm air intake" would be worth it, even in the snow. Once the enien warms up, your going to have a hard time getting the volume of air into the engine for optimal performace... hot air is less dense, therefore you have to flow more air to get the same amount of oxygen. Besides, once the engine is warm, it WANTS cold air.

There are very little performance gains with the CAI, as DDQ stated. The OEM setup has excellent heat shielding for a small 1.8t.

Performance gains from a BPV are barely noticable unless something is already wrong. There are several reasons to get a BPV.

1) Holds more boost - if you are chipped or going above the stock 7 psi, a stronger valve will last longer and eliminate surging. Surging happens when a weak BPV can't hold the boost and leaks some of it to the intake return.

2) metal BPVs last longer. Some are servicable so you don't have to replace them, just lube them.

3) sound - BOV deliver in this category, but if you do a search you will find out that its generally not recommended to use one in our cars unless you run a recirculation kit, which = $$$$. Metal BPVs combined with CAIs don't sound as loud as BOVs.

**R3DL3TR5** · 08-13-2004 05:07 PM

thanks guys for the info. I understand that the intake hasn't been proven and I know from experience that tiny little breathing mods do close to nothing on smaller engines. I'm not looking too much for horsepower at this point as much as i'm looking for a clean, aggresive sound. I'm going to go with the EVO diverter valve for when i get a chip. I'm really not sure if I should touch the airbox though....it already has a k&n in it. But anyway, I am new on THIS forum and I'm new to Audi, but by no stretch am I new to cars and performance. It's like i have to relearn all the manufactruers and parts for a turbo charged motor with an audi emblem up front. But i appreciate all your help and I think i've found a new home for research on my new car! Thanks guys! Keep it up!
-wes m.

**BoostAddict** · 08-13-2004 05:23 PM

Hey skene, if thats you in that picture you look like David Copperfeild. And may I ask why your bashing DDQ? He's just letting him know of the facts, so he does not buy a part that serves no purpose but burns a hole in his pocket. He's just helping out, he's helped me out many times..Thanks

**EVIL-AUDI** · 08-13-2004 05:33 PM

Skene is also just trying to help out.

**Mike~p** · 08-13-2004 05:42 PM

hmmmm....is this really necessary? there shudnt be hate in here and definitly not personal disses....this is an audi forum and we talk bout audis not what others look like.... R3DL3TR5 knows that what ddq said bout the induction kit was his opinion an it shud end at that

whyyyy canttt weee beee frienddddsss?

**skene** · 08-13-2004 05:53 PM

Open element filters are known to produce HP. What don't you all understand.. albeit it may not be mind blowing HP.. but it is HP none the less.

Do you put in a K&N filter for the simple fact that it collects dirt and dust elements better than the stock airfilter?

No you install a K&N because it does allow more air into the system. Do you believe that the K&N filter does increase HP? Yes it actually does make an improvement on N/A vehicles.
Does it make a difference on a turbo vehicle... you bet it does. However you do not feel it in the sense of HP because of the simple fact that you are running on a forced induction engine. With this being said... Since the air is not directly forced into the intake manifold from the intake system and the air is compressed by the turbosystem then you will feel a better throttle response. Now this better throttle response is unquestionably HP/TQ. Although it is only a small amount it would not be seen on a dynometer.

The same way an open element intake will make an improvement on the breathing of a vehicle.

Here's the facts... now you can correct me anywhere you feel I am wrong.

**JMG** · 08-13-2004 06:39 PM

Originally posted by skene
Open element filters are known to produce HP. What don't you all understand.. albeit it may not be mind blowing HP.. but it is HP none the less.

Do you put in a K&N filter for the simple fact that it collects dirt and dust elements better than the stock airfilter?

No you install a K&N because it does allow more air into the system. Do you believe that the K&N filter does increase HP? Yes it actually does make an improvement on N/A vehicles.
Does it make a difference on a turbo vehicle... you bet it does. However you do not feel it in the sense of HP because of the simple fact that you are running on a forced induction engine. With this being said... Since the air is not directly forced into the intake manifold from the intake system and the air is compressed by the turbosystem then you will feel a better throttle response. Now this better throttle response is unquestionably HP/TQ. Although it is only a small amount it would not be seen on a dynometer.

The same way an open element intake will make an improvement on the breathing of a vehicle.

Here's the facts... now you can correct me anywhere you feel I am wrong.

By open element intake I take it you mean a cone or mushroom filter right? Well here is the problem. Take a look at the space you have to work with and the orientation of the cone filter once installed in the A4 engine bay. Then consider heat shielding. Most CAI kits don't have adequate heat shielding. What happens to air as it is ehated? It expands. That means you have to flow MORE air to get the same amount of OXYGEN through your intake. You need OXYGEN, not just air. The change in oxygen flow supercedes the supposed increase in airflow that aftermarket CAIs claim. In a nutshell the aftermarket CAIs can't flow enough air to supply an equal or increased amount of oxygen supply versus the stock setup. So there is no gain.

so..

1) CAIs don't flow cold air like they claim in our cars

Wait there is more... the small 1.8t engine doesn't need the same amount of air as a V8. The stock airbox provies ample supply AND has excellent heatshielding and isolation from hot engine air. So where is the point of a CAI?

so...

2) The OEM airbox is already delivering the right amount of cool air.

Where is the gain from a $200 CAI? Looks and sound. That's it.

Keep in mind that CAIs need extensive custom heatshielding and routing to be more effective than OEM. I'm talkign about CAIs out of the box.

ALSO take into account that this is a small engine.

**skene** · 08-13-2004 06:47 PM

Well then just tell me when is the only time that a heat shield will be taking in hot air? At idle?

Other than that when you are moving the intake is receiving cooler ambient air temps from vehicle motion.

The heat shield is more than enough if installed correctly.

if you tell me that you lose HP at idle then I have just proved my comment correct.

If you have ever opened up a stock airbox you will also notice that right where the MAF is positioned the amount of air that can travel to the MAF is placed in a \l position.. that means that you are not receiving excessive amounts of air after the filter.

**JMG** · 08-13-2004 07:02 PM

Originally posted by skene
Well then just tell me when is the only time that a heat shield will be taking in hot air? At idle?

Other than that when you are moving the intake is receiving cooler ambient air temps from vehicle motion.

ALL THE TIME.

1) Aftermarket CAIs are exposed to hot engien bay air... the heat sheild that comes with them allow the infussion of hot air right after the air inlet from the front of the car... so you are already taking in hot air

2) Air gets hot VERY FAST. If you heat the CAI piping the air inside is almost instantly changed. OEM heatshielding is better at this. Why do you think SMICs and FMIC's work so well? THey are made of metal, which changed temperature easily... from the cooler air outside. Imagine if you heat it.

**JMG** · 08-13-2004 07:08 PM

**skene** · 08-13-2004 07:09 PM

that means nothing.

**JMG** · 08-13-2004 07:14 PM

Originally posted by skene
that means nothing.

fine...

**skene** · 08-13-2004 07:16 PM

I mean seriously.. what is that supposed to prove?

Nothing.

It means that they may have easily been swayed by people that state their opinion of a product as fact.

Which goes back to my original point.

**JMG** · 08-13-2004 07:31 PM

Originally posted by skene
I mean seriously.. what is that supposed to prove?

Nothing.

It means that they may have easily been swayed by people that state their opinion of a product as fact.

Which goes back to my original point.

okay fine... but I posted an actual respose to your post..

**Mike~p** · 08-13-2004 07:43 PM

im not takin sides but as u can tell i do own the evo intake but i just came across this an thought it wud suit the occasion

http://www.evoms.com/MaxPowerPage2a.htm

**Burntaudi** · 08-13-2004 08:38 PM

Wow this thread starting to get a little out of hand. Anyhow I have the EVOMS intake and it's my opinion that it works. Iv'e had the intake in and out of the car a few times and honestly don't like the way it drive's without it. Is it a hugh gain with it no but I can definetly tell a difference in throttle response. As far as the arguement I hear that you can't see any gains on a dyno I don't expect you would. I don't think your gonna find a dyno that can truly simulate hwy speed...so no your not gonna get cool air in the intake on a dyno...hense no gains on the dyno.

This is just my opinion take it how you like.

**Silvant** · 08-13-2004 11:58 PM

so as long as you arent on the highway you're screwin yourself? ha. this is hilarious.. hot air no good. it has been proven time and time again that it is pointless to run a cone on our cars.. ESPECIALLY with a ko3 which runs hotter than a big turbo. there are a few that are being designed currently that will most likely work ok and more like an actual CAI.
but skene, seriously.. bow out, you are playing yourself. also, copperfields a ******.

**skene** · 08-14-2004 11:35 AM

How do you figure bow out?

I'm stating valid facts. If you dont like it you don't have to answer to it. But what difference does the small turbo mean? Cause you are still compressing the air...?

Point still being... when you are driving around the intake will not be ingesting hot air as all hot air does get pushed back to the firewall and out of the car. What is so difficult to understand there Silvant?

So do you believe that when you drive the flow of air in front and around the car while in motion is non existant? So the intake ingests the hot air constantly coming from a turbo...

Wow...

C'mon now.

**Silvant** · 08-14-2004 04:43 PM

you are f'ing hilarious.. anybody care to step in on this stale subject? cuz im done with it.
also, what i was saying about a smaller turbo i.e. k03 is that it gererates more heat than say, a gt25, t28 or gt28.
buhbye..

**DDQ** · 08-15-2004 10:04 AM

Originally posted by Silvant
you are f'ing hilarious.. anybody care to step in on this stale subject? cuz im done with it.
also, what i was saying about a smaller turbo i.e. k03 is that it gererates more heat than say, a gt25, t28 or gt28.
buhbye..

Ok, I made the post that set this thread off, but then I went away for the weekend, so I just caught up. I'm sick of this debate too, it's pointless. We're arguing over 1-2hp that may or may not exist. Bottom line is it's a waste of money and likely hurts performance. End of story.

My point-of-view in more detail on this is found in many many threads here. I'm sick of repeating it, so here's a couple.

http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...&threadid=1718

http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...ghlight=intake

BTW - I used to have a cone kit, so I'm speaking from experience.

Thread: Forge? evo? with which intake?

Thread Tools

Display

Forge? evo? with which intake?

Re: Forge? evo? with which intake?

Bookmarks

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions