Has Audi made a crappier car?

[e.van]

I would hope that everyone agrees with me when I say that the 12V was a mistake Audi should have never made. I can't even get wiring diagrams for the damn thing.

I bought a Haynes manual today ("1998-2001 VW Passat & 1996-2001 Audi A4"), but there is NO INFORMATION whatsoever on wiring for a '96 or '97. My "AFC" motor isn't mentioned anywhere in the manual. The earliest A4 they have is the 1998, which was a 30V and had/has a completely different ECM.

My friend's dad told me that if I write to Audi they will send me a complete manual on everything for the car. Is this true? He said it would cost money, but when he did it with GM, they sent him a 5" thick book on the car.

[voltronb5]

its worth a try... just tell them how disappointed you are.. hopefully some service manager gets the letter and sends you a book?

let us know if u get a free book.

[shehatezme]

That's why I sold mine. Never looked back.

[DDQ]

Why does Audi suck if Haynes makes crappy manuals? They're unrelated.

You may want to order the Bentley manual from www.bimmerzone.com

[e.van]

Originally posted by DDQ
Why does Audi suck if Haynes makes crappy manuals? They're unrelated.

I wasn't trying to compare the two. I was simply stating that the 12v is such a shitty car that nothing can be looked up on it. I've checked various audi sites, search engines, magazines, chilton and haynes manuals, and forums for ecm diagrams on a '96 A4, but no results come back for my car in regards to electrical or engine maintenance.

$73 is a lot of money to spend on a BOOK to hook up one thing to my car, but it looks like it might have what I need. I would like it if there were single wiring diagrams for the ECM that I could use without emptying my pockets.

[DRA4]

Get a 30V engine.

[e.van]

Do the trannys bolt right on to the 30V's? And how much is a new ECU and the rest of the crap I would need to go with it? What would be the total price on a new motor?

[DRA4]

You can get one for like 2gs, i know a friend that bought one.

[SoleMate]

Sell the car, don't do an engine swap. NOT WORTH IT!

[e.van]

It wouldn't be worth it to sell the car. I've put so much money into it, and taken it so far already that it would be ridiculous to start all over right now. I wouldn't lose any money, in fact I would still make money on the overall investment of the car, but it is just too much of a hassle. I almost sold it two weeks ago and bought a BMW 528i. I chose not to because of how far this car has come.

[SoleMate]

Well, no offense, but you haven't put that much into it mods wise. The mods you have done can be removed and sold or removed and transfered onto a 30V. Unless you can throw in the engine yourself it will be VERY pricey. My previous car was a MB 300E which I did an engine swap with, nothing but a pain. Even did it @ home w/ help of my dad whos done many engine swaps and it was a long and expensive ordeal.

[e.van]

Well, no offense, but you haven't put that much into it mods wise.

TRUE. But, I've put a lot more into it than mods.

I'd have to BUY stock-size tires to replace the snow tires on my stock rims. I'd have to take off my ASA's and replace them with the stock rims. I'd have to remove the exhaust I haven't put on yet because it's coming Tuesday. I'd have to BUY stock springs to replace the H&R's I have on it. It would be very much a pain in the ass to sell. I would also have to buy a new (stock) shift knob.. The shifter might be alright, I cut it down 1" and also reduced the throw by shifting the hole at the linkage down a quarter inch or so.

Not to mention all the money I've spent making the car STOCK before I started modding. New front bumper, new emblems, new grill, painted: front bumper, left front fender (twice - accident < not my fault), left rear fender, trunklid, rear bumper, and right rear fender up to the door. In all reality, the WHOLE car needs to be stripped and painted again.. It needed new taillights so I opted for the MY98 style ones. The exhaust I just bought is replacing the stock one that rattles, clanks, and leaks. It's the most embarassing thing in the world when you're driving a good-looking (is it?) car down the road. People look like "Whoa that's bad!" then they hear the exhaust and laugh. I've had people stare because of the noise, laugh, point, and make fun of it. New shift knob, boot, needs a steering wheel, center armrest, and front lower grill. One of the headlight washers doesn't work because it's bent from when I bought the car. I as well had to replace the driver's headlight as it was held on with only the bottom screw, and the windshield needed to be replaced.

There's also no way to justify, to my friends OR family, buying another A4 after selling this one. Just saying it's a piece of crap doesn't do it for them. And I know that it's my decision if I wanted to do that, but what's the point? And the modding angle, my parents don't know about a few things, and they wouldn't want to know (given they wouldn't be mad, but they don't like me "wasting" my money on a car)...

These pictures are from the night I bought it:

[SoleMate]

LOL I totally know what you mean about the bad exhaust. My benz had an exhaust leak in the center muffler, rattled, and sounded like hell! Luckily I always had the huge system I put in on full blast so they couldn't hear it.

I feel you about the parents issue. I'm you same age and they absolutely hate it! I just got the A4 a few days ago and I think I'm going to have to do lots of this stuff in secret!

Had no idea what you started with, it's sure come a long way!

[e.van]

Originally posted by SoleMate
had an exhaust leak in the center muffler, rattled, and sounded like hell!

Exactly why I can't wait until Tuesday, LOL.

Supersprint catback... mmmmm

[euromotorsports]

Supersprint made a catback for the 12V? RPi equipped had one listed that fit a 12V but it was really a 1.8T mid pipe. Where did you get it and how much? Also if you lookin for engine and wireing help you should try thr 12V forum URS4 is probably the most knowledgable guy on the 12V stuff. You should check out his engine parts he sells I currently run quite a few of his parts and thinking of getting the lightweight cams and lifters he is selling, it's pricey but his stuff is top notch but also he's one of the only people that have things for the 12V

[e.van]

Yea, we (my work) ordered a cat-back exhaust from Supersprint/BMP Design the other day. It was $571.08 or something plus shipping. They had exhausts for each model year specifically (ie. 1996-1997 2.8, 1997 1.8, 1998-2001 1.8 & 2.8). I'll let you (all) know how it goes with it and how it sounds (probably take a video of it on the lift...

Here's the pdf. Listed on page 3 ("Full System") as "2.8i V6 --> '97".

http://www.supersprintna.com/catalog...print-Audi.pdf

[nizmosx]

can u pm me the results of your new exhaust when you put it on, my brother has been wanting to get an exhaust for his 12v.

[MR VTEC]

Originally posted by e.van
It wouldn't be worth it to sell the car. I've put so much money into it, and taken it so far already that it would be ridiculous to start all over right now. I wouldn't lose any money, in fact I would still make money on the overall investment of the car, but it is just too much of a hassle. I almost sold it two weeks ago and bought a BMW 528i. I chose not to because of how far this car has come.

HUWHAT!
is it a 97 or better bimmer and you fronted

[A4 in SC]

Um, yeah, it was the Audi FOX. Not a very reliable car, to say the least. There's less performance stuff for them than there is for your 12V. Of course, there's a reason for it too...

[joeya103]

Originally posted by e.van
It wouldn't be worth it to sell the car. I've put so much money into it, and taken it so far already that it would be ridiculous to start all over right now. I wouldn't lose any money, in fact I would still make money on the overall investment of the car, but it is just too much of a hassle. I almost sold it two weeks ago and bought a BMW 528i. I chose not to because of how far this car has come.

Economists have a word/phrase for this...

SUNK COST

Look it up, then sell your car for a 1.8T ;)

Just kidding do what you wanna do, but just think about that sunk cost thing...applies to everything in life.

[e.van]

Well I've only invested about a grand total of $6,000, which includes the car ($3,400 after tax and title) and all the "mods" so far. So it's not really a "sunk cost," as I would still be making a profit on selling it. It's more of a hassle.

[A4-Vblack]

From what you said about family and such I imagine that you are a young guy (high school?) riding around in a pimped out A4 that you brought back from the dead. Good for you!

I'd rather see younger car owners have to put some work into what they are driving instead of mommy buying them something worth 40K that they have no apprecitation for.

As for the quality of the car - I'm sure that it was hot s*** when it came off of the line in 1996. Enjoy what you have and down the road you can drop te money into something hot - and new.

[e.van]

Yes, I just graduated high school. I feel the same way about acquiring cars, especially the expensive freaking cars that they're just going to wreck. I love the car just fine, it's the motor that I really dislike, actually, more the ecu than the motor. It's just so hard to do anything (mod-wise) to a 12v with no aftermarket parts. I was a little frustrated with it.

I sold the S-AFC II that I was going to install to my friend for $210 (not much of a profit, but he's my friend) and we installed it in his car today. It turned out to be pretty awesome (and we found out it was the limited edition version too ).

On another note, my exhaust is supposed to arrive today (Tuesday), so that might cheer me up some. We'll see how that goes and I'll make a new post for it, with pictures and/or videos.