PDA

View Full Version : Upgraded SMIC? Opinions & Input? Any1 have 1? Know some1 that has one? Good or Bad?



ICEBIRGSLIM
10-13-2006, 08:29 AM
Basically i saw the TyrolSport Upgraded SMIC for Audi B5 A4 1.8T http://www.tyrolsport.com/audiperformance.htm and was wondering does anybody have one or know somebody with one. Looks like a decent alternative to the FMIC without having to hack up my bumper. From what i read it seems like a good alternative for the daily driver who has an upgraded turbo and a few mods in connection with it (chip & exhaust) to get the most out of everything and still keep the car low key and reliable. Any Info appreciated!

just trying to get a guage on what i want to do for my own lil k04 setup!

i need some good input people!

MR VTEC
10-13-2006, 09:31 AM
This is the thread i was talking about on AG (http://audizine.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=64715&highlight=IAT+FMIC)

ICEBIRGSLIM
10-13-2006, 01:26 PM
damn people knowone else has heard of this!

fred2ka4
10-13-2006, 01:34 PM
I have never heard of it, but that doesn't mean a thing, (because there are a lot of things I haven't heard of) For the price you are paying for that side mount, you could get or make a nice fmic without having to hack up your bumper support at all, if that's your only concern.

MR VTEC
10-13-2006, 01:37 PM
it's only been a few hours since you have posted this...
Then your gonna get hit with "why spend that bank on an "upgraded" smic when direct air flow is block unless you make bigger slits in the wheel lining"

If you are going for the sleeper look then i would suggest getting the core and the piping anodized black or sprayed with radiator paint.

94jedi
10-13-2006, 01:56 PM
Originally posted by MR VTEC
it's only been a few hours since you have posted this...
Then your gonna get hit with "why spend that bank on an "upgraded" smic when direct air flow is block unless you make bigger slits in the wheel lining"

If you are going for the sleeper look then i would suggest getting the core and the piping anodized black or sprayed with radiator paint.

I kind of agree, the whole point of a FMIC is to maximize airflow over the fins but even an upgraded smic still has to have air going through the stock shroud. for the $750 you can piece together your own nice FMIC kit or even find a nice used FMIC kit. Or heck for a little more, get a nice new fmic.

onemoremile
10-13-2006, 06:33 PM
the biggest issue with this intercooler is the amount of air you can get to it. the bumper opening that feeds it just isn't very big. the center opening has much more area. i have though about using the tyrol smic with methanol injection to further cool the intake charge and prevent detonation. the tyrol smic would present much less of a restriction than the stock smic and i wouldn't have to deal with piping or bumper modifications for a fmic.


a couple options on the methanol setup:
1) run a single nozzle just in front of or behind the throttle body.
2) run a single throttle body nozzle with a supplemental nozzle spraying the front of the intercooler.
3) run a smaller nozzle in each intake manifold runner.
4) run a smaller nozzle in each intake manifold runner and an intercooler sprayer.

i like option 4 the best but it is also the most expensive and time consuming to install. it would require careful balancing of the nozzle sizes to get the most out of the system. it would use the windshield washer reservoir as it's fluid vessel since it holds a gallon and has a warning light when dropping below about 1/4 of it's capacity.
http://www.audizine.com/gallery/data/500/1174IMG_1963_small.jpg

bitterchild
10-13-2006, 08:59 PM
as far as I am aware, Tyrolsport never got the longitudinal smic to show any gains. Last time I checked was early summer though. I didn't hear anything from them at Waterfest either.

onemoremile
10-13-2006, 10:23 PM
last i heard was a long time ago. the transverse unit showed promise but the passat version wasn't so great.

hey4
10-13-2006, 11:28 PM
you can also get those for $500. There is a guy on vwvortex that sells them. He did a lot of stuff on my car and I got to admit the quality of the sidemounds it top notch. If you don't plan going all out gtrs or bigger I'd say sidemount should be enough depending on where you live.

ICEBIRGSLIM
10-14-2006, 06:43 AM
sorry for the impatience fellas i guess i was more bored then i thought at work.

I figure this will bring light to another option some don't know about who were maybe considering it but unsure if it is worth it.

this is some good input keep it coming! Thanks!

scirocco78
10-14-2006, 03:19 PM
I've had one for year with a GIAC PC-16 setup. I hit 17 auto-x's this year and never had an issue.

onemoremile
10-15-2006, 08:05 AM
a 55 second autocross and a 20 minute track session are two entirely different things.

scirocco78
10-15-2006, 05:30 PM
Yeah, a 20 minute track session actually gets air to flow through the intercooler.

onemoremile
10-16-2006, 08:35 AM
yup. that means that an intercooler with less cooling air flow will be at a disadvantage. even with proper ducting you just can't get a lot of air through that bumper opening. that is why S4, RS4, Cayenne Turbo, 911 Turbo, etc. have such large bumper openings to feed their SMICs.

again, a chemical intercooler could help make up the difference or actually improve performance vs. a front mount alone.

autocross does get some air to flow. it doesn't take more than 10-20 mph to get air through there. even on our tightest 40 second courses i hit 40-55 mph. i've hit the limiter in 2nd several times. one thing you won't do in an autocross is overheat the turbo and charge air temps like on a track. i've run more than 10 fun runs back to back without the tb getting very hot. i still made full boost. after 10 minutes on the track i'm down to 5-10 psi max.

scirocco78
10-16-2006, 04:16 PM
5-10 psi !!!! Are you still running the stock intercooler ? Rev limiter, what software are you running ?

Anyways, the original post asked for street driving with a KO4 and the Tyrolsport is more than capable of that. I would lose boost on the autocross course about 3/4 of the way around in 80+ degree weather before the Tyrolsport.

UCFQuattroguy
10-19-2006, 11:50 AM
I'm running stock SMIC with APR Stage 1 for my auto-x days. Here in Florida the summer heat is BRUTAL for my setup. If it's a layout that's any longer than about 45seconds, I'll be quite a bit slower down the straights to the ole butt dyno.

TyrolSport
10-19-2006, 12:29 PM
Originally posted by bitterchild
as far as I am aware, Tyrolsport never got the longitudinal smic to show any gains. Last time I checked was early summer though. I didn't hear anything from them at Waterfest either.

This is not true. On average, we have seen between 15-30degC drop in IATs on B5 chassis cars, depending on the turbo and boost levels. Unchipped ko3 cars would be on the small end of that scale, with ko4 and GT28R/RS being on the larger end.

We have unfortunately not been able to produce dyno results for the AZ community, and for that we are sorry. Tony at European Performance Labs in CT can vouch for the impressive results of our SMIC upgrades, and might even have some before and after dynos to post.

If anyone has any questions, feel free to email us, as we only have so much time to visit the boards. [race]

MR VTEC
10-19-2006, 02:29 PM
they (ep or anyone else) didnt post it on vortex when i asked like 5 months ago... [:(][=(]

(not to be a dick)
But you don't have a vag and a back road in queens where you can run a few logs for us...
to see the variant in temp and how high the iat gets too?

BoostFrenzy
10-19-2006, 10:48 PM
isn't the IAT mounted on the maf sensor housing? if it is whatever they "dropped" to has nothing to do with the efficiency of the intercooler, however, in my expierence having owned many stock mount upgrade / front mount intercoolers... it's not about what you "gain" it's what you "dont' lose" under repeated hard driving... and it allows you to tune a little more aggressively because the charg temps are cooler, if it's a nice design with less pressure drop the turbo will also have less work to do to sustain the requested boost level, which also decreases charge temperature...

the only way to REALLY compare an IC for out-of-the-box gains is to run both setups at the same ambient temperature and making sure neither is heatsoaked, then measure the temperature with a thermister at the inlet and the outlet of both units, same conditions, same gear pull and then measure the delta inbetween... but most likely you're going to find the sceneario in my first paragraph

TyrolSport
10-20-2006, 05:28 AM
Posting some VAGCOM logs is on our agenda....it's been an incredibly busy year, with a host of new product introductions, and the purchase of a larger shop(which we are in the midst of completely renovating). We've definitely dropped the ball on SMIC testing for the B5 and B6 chassis. The core size, shape, and construction on the B5 and B6 TyrolSport UG SMIC is actually more efficient than the one used for the GTI/Jetta(more charge rows, endtanks with better flow characteristics, etc) so the results posted on our website can be used as a good barometer of performance gains. In either case, we recently acquired an '01 1.8T A4 for testing, which will help us immensely in proving the worth of this product to skeptics. [:)]

MR VTEC
10-20-2006, 06:51 AM
if you need a 98.5 for testing holla...
teehee...