GIAC X chip

[2.0Tonic]

I just had my car flashed with the GIAC X chip yesterday. Damn it pulls hard!

I've now driven it stock, GIAC sport, and GIAC X.

1) Stock- the 2.0t is a nice motor in its stock form. It has enough power to get the job done, but not with any real excitement.

2) GIAC Sport- the sport software was definitley better than stock, but just did not wow me. It was better, but just not enough.

3) GIAC X- Night and day difference from stock. When the car hits about 2800rpm it really pulls hard. It feels factory smooth, but just moves with more urgency. It is what I had expected from GIAC and I am very happy.

I've only had it on the car since yesterday and am really looking forward to driving it more[:D]

[Fobia]

congratz what do they crank the boost up to in GIAC x software and what octane?

[2.0Tonic]

I believe it is 1.35 bar or about 19.5 PSI. I do not have vagcom or a boost guage to confrim what my car is actually making. I'm in California and so is GIAC so the program is for 91 octane.

I have not had it on a dyno, but there is a guy on another audi forum that has posted dyno results of the new software and it looks pretty good.

[parks853]

Originally posted by 2.0Tonic
I believe it is 1.35 bar or about 19.5 PSI. I do not have vagcom or a boost guage to confrim what my car is actually making. I'm in California and so is GIAC so the program is for 91 octane.

I have not had it on a dyno, but there is a guy on another audi forum that has posted dyno results of the new software and it looks pretty good.

GIAC uses the same program for 91 and 93.

[DanFromPA]

I thought they had a concern over FP on B7A4..... Yet, they've increase max boost to 19.5PSI... Maybe I am missing something... no wonder why it shows a little more torque on the dyno than others... Either way, I hope it works well on crappy 91 OCT in CA....

BTW, if you ever get dynoed or have VAGCOM, post some AFR readings along with timing please.............


Originally posted by 2.0Tonic
I believe it is 1.35 bar or about 19.5 PSI. I do not have vagcom or a boost guage to confrim what my car is actually making. I'm in California and so is GIAC so the program is for 91 octane.

I have not had it on a dyno, but there is a guy on another audi forum that has posted dyno results of the new software and it looks pretty good.

[RE5PECT]

thats so wierd that they came out with 2 different types of software for the 2.0T....or am i missing somehting?

[parks853]

Originally posted by DanFromPA
I thought they had a concern over FP on B7A4..... Yet, they've increase max boost to 19.5PSI... Maybe I am missing something... no wonder why it shows a little more torque on the dyno than others... Either way, I hope it works well on crappy 91 OCT in CA....

BTW, if you ever get dynoed or have VAGCOM, post some AFR readings along with timing please.............

A reliable source tells me that they are not running 10.5:1. He would not say what they are running but it is more lean.

[parks853]

Originally posted by RE5PECT
thats so wierd that they came out with 2 different types of software for the 2.0T....or am i missing somehting?

you are right.. that is weird. They claim the less agressive file is for people that have a CVT or just dont want a lot of power. Who would buy that.. noone.

[bhford70]

19.5 boost with GIAC.
What is the stock boost max?

[Fobia]

Originally posted by parks853
you are right.. that is weird. They claim the less agressive file is for people that have a CVT or just dont want a lot of power. Who would buy that.. noone.


yeah that is messed up.

[parks853]

Originally posted by bhford70
19.5 boost with GIAC.
What is the stock boost max?

it is usually around 12.

[LAS]

not sure if anyone else reads the 2.0T forum on vwvortex.

nice #s on them gti's : >>> LINK <<< (http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=2498510)

[lubbgod2G]

Originally posted by parks853
you are right.. that is weird. They claim the less agressive file is for people that have a CVT or just dont want a lot of power. Who would buy that.. noone.
Yeah, wierd. Even the auto guys aren't gonna be able to choke on that.....

[Hondakiller]

so what does apr boost at?

[Hondakiller]

93 octane program

[parks853]

Originally posted by Hondakiller
93 octane program

I am thinking around 18.5.

[wsy78]

Any more info on Giac "X", I heard they have the highest whp among all chips, is this true? I can't seem to find any more info on this. Anyone with 1st hand experience?

GIAC didn't post any numbers on their site:

http://www.giacusa.com/news1.php?newsid=43

[killahb36]

so 2.0tonic is your car a tip and your able to run both programs on with the giac chip i plan on getting the chip and wanted to know i am tiptronic

[Quattro]

do you think the giac chip X is good for regular driving, or is this X for like race?

[lokeh]

do you think the giac chip X is good for regular driving, or is this X for like race?

it is for whatever driving you want it to be! :)

it would be street driving for me, but if you can't handle it on the street; then you maybe you should only use it on the track. ;)

[pcdrj]

I believe based on other posts he's a Tiptronic. Confirm?

[SickAvant]

Does anyone know a dealer in the Los Angeles Area where I can get the GIAC X chip done?

[Alipor]

Isn't the Torque Factory in LA? Check there, or Page Jeff Moss on AW he will be able to help ya.

[Coker Rat]

there's gotta be a catch

can you switch program with you cruise control stock like with apr?

[audimeister]

there's gotta be a catch

can you switch program with you cruise control stock like with apr?

No, you buy a small switcher (called "Flashloader") that plugs into the OBD port under the dash. It then reads what programs you have and allows you to select between them. All in, with all the programs and the ability to switch between them, both APR and GIAC cost about $1,000.

[audimeister]

The lower power GIAC program was developed with the earlier fuel rail pump that was weaker. The X program is for the later pump. If you have the earlier pump and don't want to spend hundreds on upgrading to the later one, you can use the more mild program.

Therefore, if you have an early B7 and run higher boost you could have a dangerously lean condition.

AWE has a decent explanation of this on their site.

[2.0Tonic]

so 2.0tonic is your car a tip and your able to run both programs on with the giac chip i plan on getting the chip and wanted to know i am tiptronic


My car is a tip. I have no problems running the x chip. I have run both programs, but I do not have a flashloader to switch back and forth. I had the giac dealer flash me from the sport to the x. I am going to buy the flashloader soon so I can switch back to stock before going in for service (might not be necessary, but if I need a warranty repair I don't want the dealer to blame it on software).

[2.0Tonic]

do you think the giac chip X is good for regular driving, or is this X for like race?


The x chip is great for both street and track. More power and more torque works good on both[up] I run the car on the street and ocasionally on the track.

[Coker Rat]

anyone ever heard of shops who deal both giac and APR letting you try both programs?

[bhvrdr]

The lower power GIAC program was developed with the earlier fuel rail pump that was weaker. The X program is for the later pump. If you have the earlier pump and don't want to spend hundreds on upgrading to the later one, you can use the more mild program.

Therefore, if you have an early B7 and run higher boost you could have a dangerously lean condition.

AWE has a decent explanation of this on their site.

Hi there,
Both pumps actually have identical flow as per the Hitachi specs. This is why plenty of people who have the B bump have run this program. The Audi will NOT run lean due to fuel pressure. It has safeties that will cut power instead and if needed will trigger a safety limp mode. Even the new F pump has been now superceeded by the H pump. For a truly upgraded pump we will have to wait for APR and VF Engineering (who works with GIAC) who have them in development.

cheers! Mike

[BenGieCruz]

any idea on how much is the flashloader is cost???

[audimeister]

~$150

[audimeister]

Hi there,
Both pumps actually have identical flow as per the Hitachi specs. This is why plenty of people who have the B bump have run this program. The Audi will NOT run lean due to fuel pressure. It has safeties that will cut power instead and if needed will trigger a safety limp mode. Even the new F pump has been now superceeded by the H pump. For a truly upgraded pump we will have to wait for APR and VF Engineering (who works with GIAC) who have them in development.

cheers! Mike

This explanation is true, but it doesn't go far enough. The "specs" are for a certain pressure at a certain flow rate, which are within the normal operating parameters of the stock engine. When the pulse width of the injectors is increased, (like you need to when increasing boost) you increase the flow rate, making it harder for the pump to maintain the prescribed pressure. The later designs work better when pushed to their design limits.

It's like the old discussion about why 20 psi is different from a GT28RS vs. 20 psi from a K04.

[SickAvant]

This maybe a stupid question but I will ask anyways. How do I know what pump my Audi has? it's a 2007 Audi Avant

[LAS]

go to page 2:
http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php?t=75120&highlight=fuel+pump

[bhvrdr]

I have tested the F pump and my buddy has tested three programs on the B pump. A very aggressive program, a moderately aggressive program, and a very toned down program. He had no problems with any of them. Ive invoked fuel cut on an F pump car too. They both hold up very similarly bad or good depending on mods. The pumps have a flow rate. Like a 380cc injector has a flow rate. YOu may have to keep an injector open longer to get your desired fuel but you arent getting it to flow any more than it's rating. The B and F are identical in flow rating. They do have different bleeders on them though. A k04 and a gt28r to not have the same flow rate so it isnt the same at all. FWIW, there are plenty of folks, PLENTY who are driving around on the GIAC X program with B pumps. If you call up distributors they will not require a pump change. In fact they recommended that program to my buddy with the B pump before he was done with testing.

cheers! Mike

[bhvrdr]

go to page 2:
http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php?t=75120&highlight=fuel+pump

Unfotunately they did not have access to the Hitachi specs that were provided to them by another company on a forum who was working on an upgraded pump. Since that time GIAC and VF are also working on their own upgraded pump...not the F pump which has since actually been superceeded by an H pump anyways.

Street logs of pumps are not very accurate at all for comparison testing. You want to actually flow test the pumps themselves. You can get variance from one run to another on the same pump as I have.

Here are the actual pump specs.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v714/bhvrdr/06F127025B_flow.gif

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v714/bhvrdr/06F127025F_flow.gif

[Sharpointer]

those are weird numbers you guys said before. I was told by a pretty reliable source that the stock psi of the b7 is about 8psi. With APR it increases it up to 14.5psi.
I find it hard to believe that the GIAC chip will increase the psi to 19. thats a lot....

If my numbers are wrong please correct me.

[Ohio B7]

I run 20.5 psi in all gears but 1st with GIAC X 93. and with their stock program, 9 psi.

[SickAvant]

would you guys suggest I get a boost gauge first, just so that I can see the diffrence? When I do get the APR X?

[Spidee]

Good move 2.0tonic. I've had GIAC in my last two cars. I decided to go with APR this time around. Mostly because of being able to swap programs at any time from the cruise control stalk. It came in handy when I took the car in for service and realized right there and then I needed to be in stock mode.

If it helps any of you that haven't been chipped yet to see a comparison between GIAC and APR, I propose that 2.0tonic and I get dynoed. I plan to call Streetwerke sometime soon. I'd also like to see how these programs differ. I'm also tiptronic. [;)]

[bhvrdr]

The stock 2.0T FSI is rated at 12psi. It can spike as much as 14psi on occasion or as low as 10psi depending on ambients, etc. But it generally peaks about 12psi as Audi specs it. APR runs about 17-20psi depending on version, ambients etc. GIAC about 18-21psi depending on the same and Revo is adjustable but usually programmed for similar boost as well. Most of the chip companies are probably putting out similar numbers now in their latest versions. How they go about making the power are where slight differences in tuning philosophies or skill is seen from logs.

cheers! Mike

[Coker Rat]

I think this calls for someone to do a sticky thread with dyno compairisons between otherwise stock A4's...

So do you need anything else for this GIAC X flash like new fuel pumps and stuff or can you just flash and go?

[bhvrdr]

I think this calls for someone to do a sticky thread with dyno compairisons between otherwise stock A4's...

So do you need anything else for this GIAC X flash like new fuel pumps and stuff or can you just flash and go?

Just contact your local GIAC distributor. They will flash you and you'll be on your way.

cheers! Mike

[teaberry]

My car is a tip. I have no problems running the x chip. I have run both programs, but I do not have a flashloader to switch back and forth. I had the giac dealer flash me from the sport to the x. I am going to buy the flashloader soon so I can switch back to stock before going in for service (might not be necessary, but if I need a warranty repair I don't want the dealer to blame it on software).

I'm in the same situation. Do you know how much is the flashloader? Please let me know when you get one. Thanks.

[slimmj0k3r]

some logs would be great. what kind of hp gains are we supposed to expect with the giac x?

[audimeister]

See what happens when I go to sleep?

Wow, Mike. It looks like you've really done some research. My explanation was somewhat oversimplified for the forum, but I stand by what I said.

I'd like to understand your test data better. At 3,000 cam RPM, what is the engine crank RPM?

[BenGieCruz]

lets say i get GIAC X, would i still be able to use the same software if i get the VF big turbo that's still on development (whenever it comes out of course) or would i need newer software for the BT???

[audimeister]

lets say i get GIAC X, would i still be able to use the same software if i get the VF big turbo that's still on development (whenever it comes out of course) or would i need newer software for the BT???

Totally different, but I am checking into whether they will rebate existing GIAC users.

BTW, VF are beta testing their BT kits, and are just beginning limited release to certain shops for these purposes. I wouldn't expect real kits for sale until summer/fall...

[Alipor]

I'm in the same situation. Do you know how much is the flashloader? Please let me know when you get one. Thanks.

If you have a vag-com or similar you can load GIAC switching software on your computer and switch that way. The software is free.

[BenGieCruz]

Totally different, but I am checking into whether they will rebate existing GIAC users.

BTW, VF are beta testing their BT kits, and are just beginning limited release to certain shops for these purposes. I wouldn't expect real kits for sale until summer/fall...

here i'll be waiting [drive]

[Dangler]

yeah im completely stock, and i have a boost gauge....depending on the situation, i've peaked as low as 10psi, and as high as 15psi, more likely 14psi, i just think the needle had some momentum. and most of the time its 12psi

[A4TuNeD]

It for whatever u feel like doin lol, it definetly gives it a good little kick in the pants for sure

[2.0Tonic]

Good move 2.0tonic. I've had GIAC in my last two cars. I decided to go with APR this time around. Mostly because of being able to swap programs at any time from the cruise control stalk. It came in handy when I took the car in for service and realized right there and then I needed to be in stock mode.

If it helps any of you that haven't been chipped yet to see a comparison between GIAC and APR, I propose that 2.0tonic and I get dynoed. I plan to call Streetwerke sometime soon. I'd also like to see how these programs differ. I'm also tiptronic. [;)]


That would be fun, but I don't want to fire up some type of "my chip is better than your chip" pissing contest. I think GIAC and APR both make good software. I buy GIAC because until a few years ago I lived in SoCal and know Garret from GIAC. I know first hand that he knows his stuff and that if something ever goes wrong with my car I can call the guy the wrote the software and get answers [az]

[matttl16]

ok... my question is that i am currently flasheg with the GIAC software and i had it doen at Evolution motorsports here in phoenix... i ask them about the x-chip and they say its not for my car so i contacted GIAC via email and this is what they said:

Dear Matthew,

Thank you for your email. If you have had your car flashed recently, there are only 2 programs available for your ECU. One is the 91 octane x-plus program and the other is the 93 octane x-plus program. We have in the past offered a sport chip, but I don't show that it is available for your particular ECU. And as far as the 91 and 93 octane program goes, you would need to contact EVO to see which you were flashed with, because I don't have that information here. I hope that has answered your question. Please feel free to contact us with any other questions.

now im really confused can anyone help clairfy???

[A4 Joe]

Lean condition is a concern or is the car going to cut out under heavy load at speeds above 95 mph. I had that condition on my B6 and had to have my chip detuned a bit.

[bhvrdr]

ok... my question is that i am currently flasheg with the GIAC software and i had it doen at Evolution motorsports here in phoenix... i ask them about the x-chip and they say its not for my car so i contacted GIAC via email and this is what they said:

Dear Matthew,

Thank you for your email. If you have had your car flashed recently, there are only 2 programs available for your ECU. One is the 91 octane x-plus program and the other is the 93 octane x-plus program. We have in the past offered a sport chip, but I don't show that it is available for your particular ECU. And as far as the 91 and 93 octane program goes, you would need to contact EVO to see which you were flashed with, because I don't have that information here. I hope that has answered your question. Please feel free to contact us with any other questions.

now im really confused can anyone help clairfy???

Don't be confused. As I posted, they realized the B and F pumps flow identically and now both pumps are superceeded. Although they dont want to admit it, the X-chips are the only one they are flashing anyways. Forget the sport chip. It was made for one ecu box and it didnt make power and i'm not sure anyone has purchased it since. It's all the x chip now.

cheers! Mike

[killahb36]

so Mike your saying its only the x-chip even for us with tip : )

[2.0Tonic]

ok... my question is that i am currently flasheg with the GIAC software and i had it doen at Evolution motorsports here in phoenix... i ask them about the x-chip and they say its not for my car so i contacted GIAC via email and this is what they said:

Dear Matthew,

Thank you for your email. If you have had your car flashed recently, there are only 2 programs available for your ECU. One is the 91 octane x-plus program and the other is the 93 octane x-plus program. We have in the past offered a sport chip, but I don't show that it is available for your particular ECU. And as far as the 91 and 93 octane program goes, you would need to contact EVO to see which you were flashed with, because I don't have that information here. I hope that has answered your question. Please feel free to contact us with any other questions.

now im really confused can anyone help clairfy???


I can tell you with certainty that even if it was available for your car you do not want the sport chip. I had the sport software before the x software and it was total weak sauce. The sport software was a very mild improvement over stock, but the x is a very noticable difference from stock.

By the way my car is a tip tranny as well. If you search you will see the info I posted on the tip tranny that was given to my directly from zf (the co. that makes our transmissions). It looks to me that all of the software upgrades on the market right now are well within the stated guidelines for the tiptronic transmission.

[matttl16]

ok thanks for clearing that up for me b/c i thougth they said that they flashed me w/ the sport chip and if so i wanted the x-chip... oh and i have a 6speed fwd (i wish it was quattro though)