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View Full Version : Will this crank work in my 2.0l 058 build!!



Swainey97
11-19-2018, 02:52 PM
Help me please am trying to do a build and canít seem to find a Aba crank anywhere.. with this tfsi crank work.. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181119/5aa92d1efccd3777518d959451afc7e1.jpg


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A1 A2 German
11-19-2018, 02:58 PM
Do not build up your 058, get a 06A block, and slap your AEB head on it.

Swainey97
11-19-2018, 03:00 PM
Iíve been searching and have found nothing cheap. I have 4 spare ajl/aeb motors laying around why not build one


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Avant Nate
11-19-2018, 03:06 PM
no that crank will not work

Swainey97
11-19-2018, 03:07 PM
From what 034 have said is the tfsi crank is a direct drop in?


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Blazius
11-19-2018, 03:10 PM
Isnt the sensor wheel different on that crank than 058 one and some other things most likely , right ?

Swainey97
11-19-2018, 03:12 PM
I was just going off what 034 said. As I canít find a aba crank anywhere they said the tfsi was stronger than the aba anyways. I donít know hence why Iím asking hah


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A1 A2 German
11-19-2018, 03:15 PM
Sell your 058's, buy 06A~$320 on Ebay.

I shipped a full top and bottom motor, plus transmission, plus all the goodies attached to it to Australia before on a pallet...wasn't a crazy cost considering "freight" goes there anyways.

Your coin, if you're gonna spend the time, money, energy move to an 06A which will also make it more lucrative if you part ways...people want a built 06A and very important..expands your market as VW owners can not use a 058. It's otherwise a paperweight aside by the luck of finding another person driving 20+ year Audi...between the years 1996 and ~98.

Swainey97
11-19-2018, 03:16 PM
So what cranks gonna be best for an 06a block


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Blazius
11-19-2018, 03:28 PM
Can you not look around if u can find a crank that works in 058 at junkyards/ de-parted cars etc. ?

Swainey97
11-19-2018, 03:36 PM
Finding a crank for the 058 isnít a big worry just was wondering what one manly. But everyone is saying not to build the 058


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Fasterd
11-19-2018, 03:43 PM
They are fan boys.

The 058 is a pimp in it's own right, you run into rpm limits quicker with an 058 set up but I dont think in your case it will matter.

A1 A2 German
11-19-2018, 03:59 PM
You continue to use the 06A crank (knife edge and balance if you want). You upgrade the rods, and bore for 2.0

2.0T FSI crankshafts are modified with a specialty oil pump drive gear, as otherwise not "drop in" if adding to an 06A

Fasterd
11-19-2018, 04:02 PM
^^^^ this

An ABA isn't "drop in" either, as oil squirter#4 must be spaced off, and some shaving of the intermediate shaft and bottom of cylinders to make it all clear (I know i know it can be optional depending on cylinder # but why wouldn't you at this point?)

Swainey97
11-19-2018, 07:05 PM
So Iím going 800+hp.. and your telling me to use the stock crank? I was under the impression that I would need a 92mm Stoke?


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Swainey97
11-19-2018, 07:06 PM
Can get a 06a block delivered for around $500. So im gonna start there have already got rods..


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Swainey97
11-19-2018, 07:11 PM
So itís a avj motor 19mm wrist pins can I change it to 20mm see now Iím going into a territory I donít know


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Fasterd
11-19-2018, 08:25 PM
800hp 1.8t? Have you owned an 800 hp car ever?
Not being a dick, but there are very few who actually want that....and everything it comes with.

A1 A2 German
11-19-2018, 11:20 PM
A) Wasn't aware of the 800hp
B) Someone's done 800hp on an 06A crank w/o failure
C) Never heard of the crank going, as it's a bearing, or rod, etc that goes first.
D) You have the option of going to a drop in....forged crank from a direct injection or maybe it was a tdi crank...that's ~bullet proof and/or there's never been a documented case of failure. However, that crank itself is more then an entire assembled block...so people do not see the worth as an 06A doesn't generally or ever fail.

But E..

E) 800hp! That's ambitious...I mean great if you can get there. I mean..that territory you'd want balancing, weight reduction, knife edging and/or a dry sump system.

I mean...that's seriousness...a lot of serious B5 S4's builds don't get there.

Swainey97
11-19-2018, 11:35 PM
Well Iím putting 900 compatible internals so when I want to up the boost I will do so on a 35/40 will be a long build ainít about to rush it as I still has a motor in my car as a daily and am gonna have one to slowly build. But 06a is definitely what Iím going with now. Might post a thread once I have all my parts..


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Fasterd
11-20-2018, 03:51 AM
Well then sir, you deserve a trophy (if) you make it, as there are few who succeed and I hate to tell you, those cars aren't setup for fun street use.

Avant Nate
11-20-2018, 09:29 AM
Please correct me if I'm wrong, but isnt this what you want, not sure if forged or not.
https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/DQ03-CRANKSHAFT-1995-VOLKSWAGEN-JETTA-2-0/182898664012?hash=item2a959c224c:g:QxEAAOSw401aChF S:rk:35:pf:0&LH_ItemCondition=4#shpCntId

thedanplasse
11-20-2018, 09:48 AM
Knife edging is mostly used for Big v8's because it brings revs up faster. And mainly because the crank cuts through the oil in the pan. The smaller turbo engines dont need that...mainly because our cranks dont cut through the oil in the pan.

Easier ways to cut weight from the rotating assembly is to run a LWFW since youre planning to put down an obscene amout of power. You were going to upgrade to a gnarly clutch anyway. Once you do that you'll need a Fluidampr.

You can stroke a 058 using an ABA crank IIRC. I believe the FSI cranks are for the 06A bottom ends.

I thought my 6oohp was ambitious... I'm curious to see how this goes. Mike Hood from ringer racing knows his shit about the 1.8t and big power. Might want to start there.

Fasterd
11-20-2018, 10:00 AM
Knife edging is mostly used for Big v8's because it brings revs up faster. And mainly because the crank cuts through the oil in the pan. The smaller turbo engines dont need that...mainly because our cranks dont cut through the oil in the pan.

Easier ways to cut weight from the rotating assembly is to run a LWFW since youre planning to put down an obscene amout of power. You were going to upgrade to a gnarly clutch anyway. Once you do that you'll need a Fluidampr.

You can stroke a 058 using an ABA crank IIRC. I believe the FSI cranks are for the 06A bottom ends.

I thought my 6oohp was ambitious... I'm curious to see how this goes. Mike Hood from ringer racing knows his shit about the 1.8t and big power. Might want to start there.

My thoughts exactly....



400WHP is a barrier few have crossed so.....Unless you are of world class builder/knowledge perhaps its time to rethink ....

https://memegenerator.net/img/instances/58786801.jpg

nunya
11-20-2018, 12:44 PM
Finding a crank for the 058 isnít a big worry just was wondering what one manly. But everyone is saying not to build the 058


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ABA crank is what you need.

--dillon

Fasterd
11-20-2018, 12:53 PM
ABA crank is what you need.

--dillon

Hey op, look at the link in this dude's thread.... and he isn't breaking 500chp.


http://selfunification.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/Check-thine-self.jpg

nunya
11-20-2018, 02:07 PM
Hey op, look at the link in this dude's thread.... and he isn't breaking 500chp.


http://selfunification.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/Check-thine-self.jpg

Note mine is with street fueling (91 octane). 800 would be an absolute feat with any gas. With race gas i could maybe do 400 and change on 034's mustang.

--dillon

Swainey97
11-20-2018, 02:23 PM
Have actually already spoken to mike as thatís who both my last clutches have come through.. am already on 400hp on stock internals... she has been tuned by Quattro motor sports to bring the revs down to 6 so it donít blow and to run e85


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Swainey97
11-20-2018, 02:25 PM
So is that crank an aba crank. Thought anything older than 98 wasnít forged


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Fasterd
11-20-2018, 02:30 PM
400 wheel or crank?

And the argument isn't if you have access to people who can make that happen, its whether you have any idea what the time and money commitment is to make such an exceptional car out of 2 liters considering youre asking us which crank fits....

garytightpants
11-21-2018, 05:23 AM
Well Iím putting 900 compatible internals so when I want to up the boost I will do so on a 35/40 will be a long build ainít about to rush it as I still has a motor in my car as a daily and am gonna have one to slowly build. But 06a is definitely what Iím going with now. Might post a thread once I have all my parts..


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LOL do you plan on running those Maxpeedingrods to 900hp or....what?


My thoughts exactly....



400WHP is a barrier few have crossed so.....Unless you are of world class builder/knowledge perhaps its time to rethink ....

https://memegenerator.net/img/instances/58786801.jpg


Tons of people cross the 400 wheel mark, its not hard to do, or overly expensive. hell, I make 355 wheel with a JB 57trim. A bigger snail or non-stock head, or even just more boost could get there. 400 wheel isn't a huge milestone.

Fasterd
11-21-2018, 06:54 AM
it aint cheap, and you have to know how to assemble a motor correctly (if you want the shit to last).

how many 500whp are there....thats a much smaller number...(leaving another 158chp until the 800 mark op speaks of)

Blazius
11-21-2018, 03:55 PM
Why dont you just bore to 1.9 L if you are on 058, its easier than stroking. Also if I am right? there are other engine codes where u can pull the ABA(92/93mm stroke) crank from like 2E, ADY etc. I am not sure if guys got them in NA tho

Also as it was said pre OBD2 ABA cranks are forged, newers are cast, but I have never heard of a crank failing unless u really push ridicolous power over it, which you probably wont.

Swainey97
11-21-2018, 08:14 PM
Yo shoutout to everyone on this page. For being shit ****s and killing my vibe ha


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Blazius
11-21-2018, 09:18 PM
Lol why, get an ABA / ADF / 2e with adapter or etc crank , shave the squirter and the walls and boom bore the engine and you are done . Even better if you get a pre 1996 one.

Swainey97
11-21-2018, 09:42 PM
See your a legend. Why was that so hard thatís all I wanted from the start.. people just making out. I donít care if I reach 800 or not Iíve said a big goal so I never get bored! . Cheers mate. Am gonna try and come across a crank


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Swainey97
11-21-2018, 09:52 PM
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181122/6a822903d0a1d0ad0f8fbe57f87dd4fc.jpg


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V70R
11-21-2018, 10:46 PM
034 apparently has no clue what OBD1 ABA cranks are capable of. OBD1 ABA cranks have been used for over ten years in many competitive VW drag cars without any failure related to a crankshaft. I have two friends that have had well over 400whp in their ABA 16V turbo setups in older VWs without issues for almost 8 years, and both have seen daily use. The transaxles wonít make it past ~300whp, but thatís a different subject. Both are stock blocks and internals, and running fairly large turbochargers with 60mm incudcers on the compressor side. I doubt you will have any problems with a forged ABA crank.

Avant Nate
11-22-2018, 01:23 AM
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181122/6a822903d0a1d0ad0f8fbe57f87dd4fc.jpg


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Scroll down that thread just a couple more lines.
https://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php/443921-aba-97-jetta-crankshaft?highlight=aba+crank

Blazius
11-22-2018, 08:41 AM
Can anyone confirm that you can use an ABF, AEG /AGG ,AZG, or a 2E with an adapter for bearing ( automatic crank) ? Would be interested for a future plan , and I'd like to be sure if somebody used them before :P.

Also there is a vid of an AZG crankshaft that broke in half @ 600 hp.. because it was bent once already , and a machine shop fked it up even more apparently, and its a cast crank, so do not worry about a cast crank.

garytightpants
11-23-2018, 06:00 AM
it aint cheap, and you have to know how to assemble a motor correctly (if you want the shit to last).

how many 500whp are there....thats a much smaller number...(leaving another 158chp until the 800 mark op speaks of)

I didn't say it was cheap.

I said its not overly expensive on the scale of modifying cars as a hobby. people spend more on a set of wheels than it took for me to build my setup (2 liter 058 stroker) and I've beaten on it every day and put almost 30k miles on it in the past 4 months. I'm saying people like to over-complicate things.

RENOxDECEPTION
11-23-2018, 06:29 AM
034 apparently has no clue what OBD1 ABA cranks are capable of. OBD1 ABA cranks have been used for over ten years in many competitive VW drag cars without any failure related to a crankshaft. I have two friends that have had well over 400whp in their ABA 16V turbo setups in older VWs without issues for almost 8 years, and both have seen daily use. The transaxles wonít make it past ~300whp, but thatís a different subject. Both are stock blocks and internals, and running fairly large turbochargers with 60mm incudcers on the compressor side. I doubt you will have any problems with a forged ABA crank.

Some ABA cranks are even forged.

Swainey97
11-23-2018, 03:28 PM
Gary mind sending me a message about how and what you used.


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Blazius
11-23-2018, 04:11 PM
Gary mind sending me a message about how and what you used.


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Could post it here too, people are interested , me included :P

garytightpants
11-24-2018, 07:11 AM
Gary mind sending me a message about how and what you used.


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Could post it here too, people are interested , me included :P

This is in my 2001 chassis
The basics:
ABA crank (with proper clearance-ing performed)
058 block w/ 83mm bore
SCAT rods
JE custom spec'd 9:1 83mm stroker pistons
ARP head studs, main studs and rod bolts
SPA knockoff mani, TIAL wg
Garrett t3/t4e 57trim (wheels measure 58mm comp and turbine)
siemens deka 80lb inj (running at 4bar pressure, so ~970cc-ish flow)
Walbro 455 in the tank.
big FMIC
2' long fender exit exhaust

I have lots of other little things to help longevity and reduce failure points since I really like seat time, like deleting all of the pcv system, emissions, SAI etc, as well as deleting the factory oil cooler and running a thermostatic external cooler.
Running on AWM management, Maestro tuned by me. It has plenty more left in it, seeing as it's just a 20psi 93oct street tune, no meth or other additives, stock head, stock intake mani, stock throttle body.

proof, just for the sake of transparency. The clamp on the rpm pickup wasnt working well, so this was the only run that day that read any sort of torque reading. I only rev the car to 7100-7200, but i think he let out closer to 7500-7600.
https://i.imgur.com/U0UCrd5.jpg
348/307 that pull.

There are other, cheaper, simpler ways to achieve these numbers as well. buddy of mine puts down 492rwhp out of his A4 with just drop-in rods, stock AEB head and a HE341 at 35psi at colorado elevation. It doesnt have to be expensive to make power.

Blazius
11-24-2018, 07:36 AM
This is in my 2001 chassis
The basics:
ABA crank (with proper clearance-ing performed)
058 block w/ 83mm bore
SCAT rods
JE custom spec'd 9:1 83mm stroker pistons
ARP head studs, main studs and rod bolts
SPA knockoff mani, TIAL wg
Garrett t3/t4e 57trim (wheels measure 58mm comp and turbine)
siemens deka 80lb inj (running at 4bar pressure, so ~970cc-ish flow)
Walbro 455 in the tank.
big FMIC
2' long fender exit exhaust

I have lots of other little things to help longevity and reduce failure points since I really like seat time, like deleting all of the pcv system, emissions, SAI etc, as well as deleting the factory oil cooler and running a thermostatic external cooler.
Running on AWM management, Maestro tuned by me. It has plenty more left in it, seeing as it's just a 20psi 93oct street tune, no meth or other additives, stock head, stock intake mani, stock throttle body.

proof, just for the sake of transparency. The clamp on the rpm pickup wasnt working well, so this was the only run that day that read any sort of torque reading. I only rev the car to 7100-7200, but i think he let out closer to 7500-7600.
https://i.imgur.com/U0UCrd5.jpg
348/307 that pull.

There are other, cheaper, simpler ways to achieve these numbers as well. buddy of mine puts down 492rwhp out of his A4 with just drop-in rods, stock AEB head and a HE341 at 35psi at colorado elevation. It doesnt have to be expensive to make power.

Nice one, yes there are other ways to make higher power cheaper, but a stroker + a 058 is an interesting, and unique thing in my opinion. Not everybody has that, and you know you made it yourself , that is if you like engine building : and tuning.

Btw ur ABA is pre 96 then aka forged or cast ?

Fasterd
11-24-2018, 09:17 AM
Still a long way to 800....


Just saying

garytightpants
11-24-2018, 09:27 AM
Still a long way to 800....


Just saying

But you made 400 sound like some crazy hard number to hit...

I also doubt OP will get anywhere close to 400, given that he is shopping for maxpeedingrods internals.

Swainey97
11-27-2018, 05:13 PM
I looked into the rods haha never said I was gonna go with them was gonna see if they were okay. And 400? Iím already on 400 with just bolt ons and a tunes? Yíall make it sound so hard aha maybe some of us are actually good with our hands and can get shit done without any excuses? If you got negative stuff to say then beat it. No ones got time for negativity mate.


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Fasterd
11-27-2018, 05:21 PM
You make 400whp on a stock block? What compressor you using and how many miles do you have at said power?

I call your bullshit.

Swainey97
11-27-2018, 05:31 PM
Hahaha I call no bullshit hence why Iím getting this build done for when she lets go.

Gtx3071
Stainless tubular manifold
FMIC
3 inch turbo back off an rs2 with 2 inch screamer
Apr race snub mount
034 street density engine and gearbox mounts
Single mass 240mm flywheel conversion with arp bolts
Fx 400
340lp/e85
1000cc injectors
Innovate lc-2 wideband
034 Tfsi coil conversion
And tuned by Quattro motorsports for e85 20 psi but tuned my revs down so she down blow..



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Fasterd
11-27-2018, 06:04 PM
What are your plans on the new setup

Swainey97
11-27-2018, 06:19 PM
Well Iíve ordered scat rods.
J. E pistons 9.25.1 83mm
and a 1990/93 aba crank.
All bearing, studs/bolts
Next Iím going to get some valves/springs and some oem lifters. Also need to replace all my timing gear.. need a bigger fuel pump and injectors and yeah just need all my gaskets and what not. Am taking it to jhh performance here in aus to get it shaved and what not.

Swainey97
11-27-2018, 06:21 PM
But probably just keep it with the 3071 go get a haltech or link and use its full potential as there is heaps more left in it..


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Fasterd
11-27-2018, 06:46 PM
Heaps more in that 3071?

When you tune it please post dyno.

Blazius
11-27-2018, 07:09 PM
Bigger injectors ? 1000 cc is good for 600-7000 hp easily no ?

Swainey97
11-27-2018, 07:22 PM
According to the internet and I.E this is how it works..


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalkhttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181128/65a868e24babfe61b13800f721af304c.jpg

Swainey97
11-27-2018, 07:22 PM
Is a gtx should easily get 550 out of it on e85


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Swainey97
11-27-2018, 07:23 PM
Will post my whole build once all my parts have arrived..


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nunya
11-27-2018, 08:50 PM
Oh man, there is so much wrong in this thread.

Swainey97
11-27-2018, 09:04 PM
Well clear the air as Iím going off what Iím being told her and the internet so. Just trying to do a build without any hassle to much to ask?


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Fasterd
11-28-2018, 03:59 AM
Have you sourced your 01E swap so you can put all that power to the ground?

thedanplasse
11-28-2018, 05:27 AM
Did you get the journals, and cylinders measured?

or

Did you just buy what you hope you need?

It'd be a shame to have to re-buy all that stuff if your tolerances are off...

Swainey97
11-28-2018, 05:29 AM
Went bigger valves and what not chill guys.


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garytightpants
11-28-2018, 06:08 AM
Did you get the journals, and cylinders measured?

or

Did you just buy what you hope you need?

It'd be a shame to have to re-buy all that stuff if your tolerances are off...

sometimes i wish there was a "like" button on here

thedanplasse
11-28-2018, 06:16 AM
It's fine because +1mm exhaust valves...

I'm just looking out. Build the bottom end the right way if you're going to do it.

You need to get everything measured before buying parts.

Blazius
11-28-2018, 09:40 AM
So what did u get total then ? ABA '93 crank (forged) , supertech valves ? new bearings, headgasket, je pistons what else ?

Swainey97
11-28-2018, 05:18 PM
Still need to get bolts and studs. All oem parts lifters timing ect. Still needing bigger injectors and fuel pump. Cams retainers and springs. Few more little bits and pieces


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chris164935
11-30-2018, 01:22 PM
According to the internet and I.E this is how it works..


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalkhttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181128/65a868e24babfe61b13800f721af304c.jpg

LOL@BSFC on a 1.8t being .9
We're lucky if we get .6 out of a 1.8t.

My advice: Find someone that does balancing and weight shaving on your motor's intermediate shaft if you plan to make 800hp.

Fasterd
11-30-2018, 01:36 PM
the 06A oil pump design is more reliable for max hp/high rpm setups IMO