Why does it seem used S4s are a few thousand more than a BMW 335xi?

[Misterjim]

I've been cross shopping used 335 x-drives and S4s. Although I'd be happy with either car I prefer the S4. What I've noticed that after looking at dozens of cars it seems S4s are usually 2-3k more for the same year/mileage. Why is this? Was the new car price higher for S4s or is there less depreciation?

[seandon_792]

The s4 initially costs 3-4K more for the cheapest trim level. Also 335 is more common than an s4 which also contributes to the price difference.


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[nicknice91303]

I own a E69 07 525xi bmw and I am also in the market for a S4. I first started looking at the 335i and 535i msport but I really want the S4. I'm looking to spend between 30-38k for 2013-2016 but having ALOT of trouble finding one with the sport rear differential in the color I want.... been looking 500 miles around. Don't mind having it shipped ether.

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[theweebabyseamus]

I own a E69 07 525xi bmw and I am also in the market for a S4. I first started looking at the 335i and 535i msport but I really want the S4. I'm looking to spend between 30-38k for 2013-2016 but having ALOT of trouble finding one with the sport rear differential in the color I want.... been looking 500 miles around. Don't mind having it shipped ether.

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To beat my own dead horse "Having come from a 335 to a B8 S4, the S4 is a substantially better car".

Elaborating on that, the S4 is more reliable and you could easily spend 2k just on fixing the massive amount of common issues those BMWs have whereas the S4 is a lot more reliable overall. Granted, they got better as the years went along, but I still wouldn't own another. Also, the AWD in the S4 is a more performance oriented than the XI. Would the S4 do better on a track with both cars prepped for the task? Maybe, maybe not. Also the interior in the S4 is light years ahead of the 335. I didn't notice it until I got the S4, but looking back the 335 seems really cheap inside.

To the XI's credit, if you can get one that doesn't give you a lot of problems or has had them resolved, they can make a lot more power cheaply. The N54's can get to S4 Stage 1 power smoothly with a simple used Cobb unit, all while getting better mpg. Throw a used intercooler and downpipes on and youre probably 350-380whp for around 1000-1200 in parts.

[Brother Owl]

Because they're better

[Misterjim]

Because they're better

Agreed! One thing I really don't like about the x-drive is that it only comes with the non-sport suspension and it's terrible. It's very "un-BMW like"! [;)] But the N55 is a masterpiece.

[whts4]

I own a E69 07 525xi bmw and I am also in the market for a S4. I first started looking at the 335i and 535i msport but I really want the S4. I'm looking to spend between 30-38k for 2013-2016 but having ALOT of trouble finding one with the sport rear differential in the color I want.... been looking 500 miles around. Don't mind having it shipped ether.

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I had the same issue, but once I expanded my search to S FL I found a lot of low mileage S4. You'll have a better chance of finding a Sport diff in a 2015/2016 vs earlier cars. Six months ago I found a 2015 S4 Premium+ , 9800 mi including DSG and sport dif and other options at a dealer for $39k. Replaced my totaled 2012 S4 wo/sport dif and would NOT own another one without it!

[850tgul]

Long time BMW driver here.... It’s because the S4 is just flat out better.

[nicknice91303]

To beat my own dead horse "Having come from a 335 to a B8 S4, the S4 is a substantially better car".

Elaborating on that, the S4 is more reliable and you could easily spend 2k just on fixing the massive amount of common issues those BMWs have whereas the S4 is a lot more reliable overall. Granted, they got better as the years went along, but I still wouldn't own another. Also, the AWD in the S4 is a more performance oriented than the XI. Would the S4 do better on a track with both cars prepped for the task? Maybe, maybe not. Also the interior in the S4 is light years ahead of the 335. I didn't notice it until I got the S4, but looking back the 335 seems really cheap inside.

To the XI's credit, if you can get one that doesn't give you a lot of problems or has had them resolved, they can make a lot more power cheaply. The N54's can get to S4 Stage 1 power smoothly with a simple used Cobb unit, all while getting better mpg. Throw a used intercooler and downpipes on and youre probably 350-380whp for around 1000-1200 in parts.Lol well I have to agree on the parts lol. I'm actually in the process of redoing my front suspension. And with it sitting for the next few months because of a recall and bmw giving me a rental car I have the time now. But I have noticed just from the 1 S4 I have looked at the interior is much more advanced. I'm looking to add mods and that is where I'm stuck. The 535i I was gonna do down pipes exhaust intercooler charge pipes and bov. The S4 I'm looking to do a tune ( not sure what one yet) both crank pully and charger pully, intake and exhaust and suspension. And I see I can get more out of the S4 for around the same amount. Plus it does seem more "sportier" them the 2014 535i msport. I just hope I can find a decent one with LOW miles and the way I want the looks. Everything else I can do. I want a unmolested S4 lol..

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[nicknice91303]

I had the same issue, but once I expanded my search to S FL I found a lot of low mileage S4. You'll have a better chance of finding a Sport diff in a 2015/2016 vs earlier cars. Six months ago I found a 2015 S4 Premium+ , 9800 mi including DSG and sport dif and other options at a dealer for $39k. Replaced my totaled 2012 S4 wo/sport dif and would NOT own another one without it!It really makes that much of a difference? And I started looking in FL aswell now. A flight down there and a nice drive back to Connecticut in the spring wouldn't be a bad thing lol...

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[nicknice91303]

Long time BMW driver here.... It’s because the S4 is just flat out better.Well a 2015 or 2016 S4 with the right price and what I want with it is the winner.. I have heard many people other then ones here talking about how the S4 B8.5 is just a all over better car then the bmw. Well back to looking. Like I said I'm looking for around 40 grand to spend. I just want to buy it out but not sure if I should find a CPO or just wing it and do what I want with mods right off the rip?? What's the thoughts of a out of state CPO purchase?

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[Misterjim]

Well a 2015 or 2016 S4 with the right price and what I want with it is the winner.. I have heard many people other then ones here talking about how the S4 B8.5 is just a all over better car then the bmw. Well back to looking. Like I said I'm looking for around 40 grand to spend. I just want to buy it out but not sure if I should find a CPO or just wing it and do what I want with mods right off the rip?? What's the thoughts of a out of state CPO purchase?

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I bought my CPO BMW convertible out of state (wanted a manual tranny in red or blue - very hard to find) a few years back. I negotiated pricing back and forth via e-mail and eventually got to a very good place. They held the car with a fully refundable deposit and I booked a one way flight (about 300 miles - so only about a 45 min flight) for a week later. The dealership picked me up at the airport. I had also made a reservation for a one way rental car that was near the dealership just in case I wanted to back out (I suppose I could have bought a two way ticket but I was cheap). Well the car was great and I drove it home that afternoon and arrived in the evening so the whole thing only took the better part of a day. I still have the car and love it and it's driven only in the summer.

Fast forward to now and I was also considering buying out of state though I wasn't sure I wanted to do the travel thing again. I was thinking of using one of those inspection services such as Car Chex or lemon squad: http://topconsumerreviews.com/vehicle-inspections/detailed-reviews.php and then have the car shipped.

In any case, as it would turn out, my local Audi dealer just got in a CPO 2014 S4 with a manual tranny in a color I like and with a sport diff. I'm going to check it out tomorrow so we'll see...I may not have to buy out of state after all but I would do it again for the right car at the right price.

[wt219200]

Well a 2015 or 2016 S4 with the right price and what I want with it is the winner.. I have heard many people other then ones here talking about how the S4 B8.5 is just a all over better car then the bmw. Well back to looking. Like I said I'm looking for around 40 grand to spend. I just want to buy it out but not sure if I should find a CPO or just wing it and do what I want with mods right off the rip?? What's the thoughts of a out of state CPO purchase?

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You’ll probably still be under the original warranty with those years so I don’t think CPO is a must.

[Audi_Andrew19]

I don't think a 335i comes close to an S4 in terms of really anything performance or usability-wise. Possibly aftermarket potential but even then it's a mixed bag. The S4 has it all going for it, AWD, Sport-Diff, practical, etc.

[MrFunk]

S4>335

I'd say an S4 is more "sought after" than a 335.

[khj677turbo]

Well a 2015 or 2016 S4 with the right price and what I want with it is the winner.. I have heard many people other then ones here talking about how the S4 B8.5 is just a all over better car then the bmw. Well back to looking. Like I said I'm looking for around 40 grand to spend. I just want to buy it out but not sure if I should find a CPO or just wing it and do what I want with mods right off the rip?? What's the thoughts of a out of state CPO purchase?

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Drove this one last week. Basically brand new.
https://www.crownaudi.com/certified/Audi/2016-Audi-S4-2cbb9ba30a0e0ae778da996f58d73abc.htm

[whts4]

Well a 2015 or 2016 S4 with the right price and what I want with it is the winner.. I have heard many people other then ones here talking about how the S4 B8.5 is just a all over better car then the bmw. Well back to looking. Like I said I'm looking for around 40 grand to spend. I just want to buy it out but not sure if I should find a CPO or just wing it and do what I want with mods right off the rip?? What's the thoughts of a out of state CPO purchase?

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I looked for CPO when I was out of state shopping but found one wo/CPO that was nearly perfect, but bc it had aftermarket wheels they couldnt CPO it. Instead they got me an even more inclusive aftmkt extended warranty for under $1.9k plus factory warranty still had 18 mos left. The dealer offered a good deal so I jumped on it...Sepang Blue with ALU option looks stunning.

[BB6-B6]

An n54 335 is a better option if your looking to get more power cheaper. You can easily hit 420hp to the wheels with just bolt ons and e85. With upgraded turbos you can safely push 700hp with stock internals


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[jygesq]

As a long time owner of 2 bmws, the S4,is just a better car.IMHO.

[850tgul]

An n54 335 is a better option if your looking to get more power cheaper. You can easily hit 420hp to the wheels with just bolt ons and e85. With upgraded turbos you can safely push 700hp with stock internals


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“Safely” though? Having owned a 1 series and lived on 1addicts for a few years which is almost exclusively populated by 135 owners pushing the limits I would say that the N54 is a bit of a headache. While it does have stout intervals there are so many other components that are weak and prone to failure. The 3.0T is so just much more reliable, stock or tuned. Better, more linear, power delivery imo as well.

[dave1078]

“Safely” though? Having owned a 1 series and lived on 1addicts for a few years which is almost exclusively populated by 135 owners pushing the limits I would say that the N54 is a bit of a headache. While it does have stout intervals there are so many other components that are weak and prone to failure. The 3.0T is so just much more reliable, stock or tuned. Better, more linear, power delivery imo as well.

I'd agree with that -- the n54 internals are stout, but the rest of the components don't seem to hold up well to even normal use. Vacuum lines, valve cover, coils, water pump, vanos solenoids, etc. I needed walnut blasting on the intake side at 35k miles too.

So I'd say the lower used pricing is a factor of cost of upkeep too.

[theweebabyseamus]

“Safely” though? Having owned a 1 series and lived on 1addicts for a few years which is almost exclusively populated by 135 owners pushing the limits I would say that the N54 is a bit of a headache. While it does have stout intervals there are so many other components that are weak and prone to failure. The 3.0T is so just much more reliable, stock or tuned. Better, more linear, power delivery imo as well.

Like the gentleman under you pointed out, the ENGINE is stout. Like a buddy of mine put it...the N54 is a better engine than the N55.....everything bolted to the N55 is better though.

[jonwoods]

I drove bmws for decades. The Audi is a better car all around and I’m sure the relative rarity is reflected in the resale value and depreciation. But The S4 handles (and sounds) like shit in comparison to a RWD 3 series. Especially at the limit. If you need AWD, do the occasional straight line sprint and want a comfy ride to work then the Audi is my choice. If you can live with only rwd and love to go out hooning, then Bmw has the edge. They can both cost you a fortune in repairs.

[850tgul]

If everything bolted to an engine is unreliable, then the drivetrain is unreliable. It’s like “hey, my hpfp, vanos, water pump, coils, injectors, and plugs all crapped out and my turbos wastegates rattle like crazy and my power steering pump went out twice but who cares my internals are forged.” Again, I love BMW (have owned 4 of them and will own more in the future) but you can’t deny the N54 has a checkered reliability record. It certainly does have big power potential (unlike the N55) but seriously what is more reliable a 450 hp stage 2 S4 or a 450 hp N54?

[850tgul]

I drove bmws for decades. The Audi is a better car all around and I’m sure the relative rarity is reflected in the resale value and depreciation. But The S4 handles (and sounds) like shit in comparison to a RWD 3 series. Especially at the limit. If you need AWD, do the occasional straight line sprint and want a comfy ride to work then the Audi is my choice. If you can live with only rwd and love to go out hooning, then Bmw has the edge. They can both cost you a fortune in repairs.

Agree that he rwd BMW chassis is better but the op asked about the 335xi and my feeling is that I always like to stick to a manufactures strong suit. If I wanted a rwd sports sedan, I’m getting a Bimmer. If I want an awd sports sedan, I’m getting one from those people in Ingolstadt who have been making them for decades upon decades.

[theweebabyseamus]

If everything bolted to an engine is unreliable, then the drivetrain is unreliable. It’s like “hey, my hpfp, vanos, water pump, coils, injectors, and plugs all crapped out and my turbos wastegates rattle like crazy and my power steering pump went out twice but who cares my internals are forged.” Again, I love BMW (have owned 4 of them and will own more in the future) but you can’t deny the N54 has a checkered reliability record. It certainly does have big power potential (unlike the N55) but seriously what is more reliable a 450 hp stage 2 S4 or a 450 hp N54?

Oh I agree the powertrain can be awful, but the parts failure is just from poor design and has little to do with power levels. So stock or modded, you'll still have the ancillary equipment failures. We're making the same argument from different angles.

[doug97gxe]

It really makes that much of a difference? And I started looking in FL aswell now. A flight down there and a nice drive back to Connecticut in the spring wouldn't be a bad thing lol...

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NO

[whts4]

It really makes that much of a difference? And I started looking in FL aswell now. A flight down there and a nice drive back to Connecticut in the spring wouldn't be a bad thing lol...

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How much difference the sport dif makes solely depends on use. If you only drive in city or hwy, no difference. If you like sporting drives on twist backroads the answer is a qualified yes. If you like aggressive street driving and/mtn/backroads then the aggressivenswer is yes.

If you want upgrade a stock B8/8.5 wo/sport dif, adding a set of Eurocode swaybars and an ALK will improve cornering and turn in for less than $1k and retains nearly stock ride quality.

In general a car with a sport dif vs one without resell for the same price. But if you can't find one do this upgrade.

[nicknice91303]

How much difference the sport dif makes solely depends on use. If you only drive in city or hwy, no difference. If you like sporting drives on twist backroads the answer is a qualified yes. If you like aggressive street driving and/mtn/backroads then the aggressivenswer is yes.

If you want upgrade a stock B8/8.5 wo/sport dif, adding a set of Eurocode swaybars and an ALK will improve cornering and turn in for less than $1k and retains nearly stock ride quality.

In general a car with a sport dif vs one without resell for the same price. But if you can't find one do this upgrade.I love back roads and twists. Thank you for that upgrade hint. Might have to look into that if I can't find exactly what I'm looking for.. There are times I like to just relax and drive but then there are them times like everyone we push our cars to the limit just to feel that rush. And that's what I like to do

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[doug97gxe]

I love back roads and twists. Thank you for that upgrade hint. Might have to look into that if I can't find exactly what I'm looking for.. There are times I like to just relax and drive but then there are them times like everyone we push our cars to the limit just to feel that rush. And that's what I like to do

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he is talking canyon roads like the dragon or mountains of California ... IMO sports diff isn't enjoyable as a RWD car or a motorcycle .. my 350z and GSXR-1000 was fun on RT8 .. my S5 was not

[nicknice91303]

he is talking canyon roads like the dragon or mountains of California ... IMO sports diff isn't enjoyable as a RWD car or a motorcycle .. my 350z and GSXR-1000 was fun on RT8 .. my S5 was notAny bike is fun on RT8 lol. Just gotta watch them other drivers and dam pot holes this GREAT lmao state has.... this is how I spend my weekend lol... I wish we had canyon type roads here in CT. And the valley doesn't count hahahahttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171209/7f7bc4d7e1c79655c569b986ad2bdd01.jpg

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[doug97gxe]

Any bike is fun on RT8 lol. Just gotta watch them other drivers and dam pot holes this GREAT lmao state has.... this is how I spend my weekend lol... I wish we had canyon type roads here in CT. And the valley doesn't count hahahahttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171209/7f7bc4d7e1c79655c569b986ad2bdd01.jpg

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is that a wrangler on I-91 x15?

[nicknice91303]

is that a wrangler on I-91 x15?Lol no wrangler. But yes was around X15 Wallingford. I handle 91 north and south Wallingford and north haven. My home town. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171209/984c5b116dac5a3dda5e2f08096e9e10.jpg

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[doug97gxe]

Lol no wrangler. But yes was around X15 Wallingford. I handle 91 north and south Wallingford and north haven. My home town. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171209/984c5b116dac5a3dda5e2f08096e9e10.jpg

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oh wow.. appreciate the work that you do to keep us safe.. yes i'm familiar with the area .. i used to live on Qunnipiac ave in new haven (exit 8)

[Dr GP]

Its all about supply and demand and what the market will support. And Yes, the S4 is a better car and the public has shown a willingness to spend more to get it. I believe the production numbers would be lower than a 335xi as well. These cars are in somewhat limited supply and in high demand. Factoring in that it is a better car, it warrants a higher retail price. BTW, Audi have become the new BMW for a status symbol as well. Those that don't really know the difference just buy a BMW because of the perceived status and perception of buying the "Ultimate driving machine" . Those that buy the Audi generally know what they are getting . In most cases,it is better than a comparable BMW with exceptions. Seeing so many more Audis on the road these days.

[nicknice91303]

oh wow.. appreciate the work that you do to keep us safe.. yes i'm familiar with the area .. i used to live on Qunnipiac ave in new haven (exit 8)Well thank you very much. I'm VERY familure with that area.

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[grovlet]

@nicknice91303:
Have you checked out NorthBayImports.com (http://www.northbayimports.com/used-inventory/index.htm) (located in E. Windsor CT)

They typically have 6-8 S4s in stock at all times - and specialize in Audis - they also service them so if you find any issues they can take are of them pre-purchase....

That's where I purchased my car and get almost all service work done there - super easy to deal with at all levels.

[Misterjim]

I drove bmws for decades. The Audi is a better car all around and I’m sure the relative rarity is reflected in the resale value and depreciation. But The S4 handles (and sounds) like shit in comparison to a RWD 3 series. Especially at the limit. If you need AWD, do the occasional straight line sprint and want a comfy ride to work then the Audi is my choice. If you can live with only rwd and love to go out hooning, then Bmw has the edge. They can both cost you a fortune in repairs.

I think it depends on the generation of BMW. I have a e93 and a e46. I bought the e46 new in 1999 and still drive it. But it's getting long in the tooth and the S4 will replace the e46. Yes a RWD F30 handles better than the AWD version but I find the F30 a disappointment (at least in terms of handling) compared to the earlier gens. Still though, if there was a local 335 with manual I would consider it but right now I'm focused on a S4 and I think on balance it's a better overall sport sedan.

[doug97gxe]

being that you are in NY you should prob watch this


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NRpDBzFFI1g

[doughboy17]

Because they're better

This.

[doughboy17]

I own a E69 07 525xi bmw and I am also in the market for a S4. I first started looking at the 335i and 535i msport but I really want the S4. I'm looking to spend between 30-38k for 2013-2016 but having ALOT of trouble finding one with the sport rear differential in the color I want.... been looking 500 miles around. Don't mind having it shipped ether.

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In reality for whatever reason, the availability of A4s and S4s -- the only Audi's I have purchased -- goes down Oct. - Feb./Mar. I speculate due to the winter season. Regardless, what you're looking for should be available as long as you are willing to accept 25K - 45K miles (minus 10K miles if you don't need CPO). Expand your search nationwide and decide on colors you will not accept. Unless you are looking for something relatively rare, like Estriol Blue, Yellow, etc., it should be available; however, the inventory should increase around April.

I just purchased my S4, which was within your parameters, in late June and flew to Greenwich to drive it back. The cost to ship it was a wash for my son and me to fly out and collect it.

[Spacegrau]

All good points here. Having come from an N54 335i to the S4 I can see why the S4 is priced higher and retains value better.

1) S4 is simply is a pricer car to start with, it slots in between the 335i and the M3 I would say.
2) Well documented relaiabliity issues with the 335i, parts on the BMW are often more expensive as well. Ie waterpump for the S4 is $50, on the 335i is $500
3) Outside of some M vehicles, xDrive in the BMWs is typically oritented towards comfort, not performance. This is a problem for cars like 335i which are supposed to be targeted at the enthusiast market.
4) Supply and demand. BMW leasing is so aggressive you see 5 335is for every S4 out there. S4 is just more rare especially with the goods like sport diff.

I don't agree S4 is better in every way. I had a RWD 335i so not exaclty a fair comparison but the 335i is lighter and handles better in the dry, it also is much cheaper to make good power with it (not sure why Audi tuners charge so much). You also can't beat RWD fun to drive, nevertheless I chose grip this time around and no regrets :)

[whts4]

Owned 2 M3s, 1 M5, 1 M235 and for Audi 2 S4s, 1 A6, and 2 5000 turbo. The RWD BMWs, we're obviously rear drive and a blast to drive but pretty tough to drive in snow, even on snow tires. So they were really 3 season cars, at least for me. The S4 gives up the edge to RWD in dry/warm weather and is really more of a sports sedan vs a sports car. In the winter, inclement or marginal conditions it is a more confidence inspiring and better all around car. I feel it is better made and prefer the interior size, overall feel and engineering. BMW used to have much better steering and handling...that advantage is either minimal or gone all together. Prefer the DSG vs the SMG for 90% of my driving. Since they're both German, parts cost and maintenance is similar but varies from item to item. It is harder to find competent Audi oriented/skilled Indy shops, at least outside of the NE.

I actually like the older BMWs, E36,E46, and E39 much better than their newer models....the reverse is true for Audi.

[Misterjim]

being that you are in NY you should prob watch this

Pretty good. Quattro is the king!

[jimrobbington]

The s4 initially costs 3-4K more for the cheapest trim level. Also 335 is more common than an s4 which also contributes to the price difference.


Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkYou can also lease a brand new 335 in the trim of your choice for a few hundred less than you can buy a 2 year old used S4.

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