Audi is a 2nd tier luxury car maker? Lmao!

[agent47]

Flipping through flipboard this morning when bored. Saw an article about Hyundai discontinuing everything Genesis from under them and launching it as a stand alone brand with G90 as their flagship. Article goes on to state that MB, BMW and Lexus being top tier are out of reach for Genesis at this point so it would take baby steps and challenge 2nd tier luxury car makers like Audi. Could not read the article anymore. Too much bs early in the morning pollutes the whole day.lol. ffs who would cross shop Audi and Genesis.. I am throwing up!

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[DecadenceFTW]

Hey, we can't all be top tier like MB and BMW. Haha *rolls eyes* And really? Lexus is now like MB and BMW? I really don't think anyone (at least anyone south of 40, no offense people over 40) is cross shopping a Lexus with a BMW, but maybe I'm wrong. I can see cross-shopping an Audi with a MB...but not likely a Lexus with a BMW. Lexus is not attractive to most young people...unless you're talking the IS-F or RC-F or LFA. Which, let's be honest...isn't a large segment of their customer base. Some of the weirdest, simplest cabins I've ever seen find their ways into Lexus. I doubt anyone under the age of 40 would choose a Lexus over a BMW or MB or Audi, other than for sheer reliability. Go fast, interiors and tech matter to us young folk (and some older peeps as well)...and that's what the big 3 have going for them. Speed, and amazing interiors with lots of tech. And yes, the big 3 is Audi, BMW, and MB. That article was probably written by my dad; who, besides being dead and unable to write, probably would have based his opinion of Audi on his understanding of the brand back in the 60's. :D

[moyenecorniche]

I'm over 40 and I wouldn't consider Lexus anything more than a cosmetically massaged Toyota ...

[SpectreGadget]

I'm over 40 and I wouldn't consider Lexus anything more than a cosmetically massaged Toyota ...

I'm with you (both over 40 and opinion of Toyota), and frankly can't stand the 'styling' that Lexus has devolved into.

[Merlin_AZ]

I'm also over 40 and LOVE my Audi.
Sorry. I'm not insulted by ignorance. I just walk away from it.

[SunDevil]

I'm over 40 and I wouldn't consider Lexus anything more than a cosmetically massaged Toyota ...

Exactly. Lexus to me is just a rebadged Toyota.

Mercedes have neat interiors, but I just can't warm up to their external styling.

BMW is nice.

Audi is a mature, under-stated luxury car.

[bonafyd]

I guess i'm the only one who finds Lexus attractive having owned almost every model of Lexus they're cars as recent as the 14 LS460 they are very reliable and have really nice tech features and awesome cabins.. with that being said i do not care for the newer models with the rectangular/squared noses.. Yes i'm south of 40.

[MRANT212]

Over 40 here and wouldn't consider Lexus. To me Lexus is a perfected Buick. I don't mean that in a bad way..its just besides their performance line up their cars are to soft and polished for me as of now. I do like the LS sedan but would chose an A8 before as of now. They are bulletproof when it comes to reliability.

[moyenecorniche]

We've come to appreciate Audi after a full year of seasonal changes and everything that nature can throw at you. Quattro ability to get you anywhere anytime is just a small part. I've owned Honda, Ford, Pontiac, Saab, Volvo... None equal the interior material quality or fit. After 100,000+ miles and 10+ years I have rarely seen a Japanese brand that did not reflect all those hard earned miles. As for the driving, I'll stack up a well equipped properly tuned S or RS model against anything with the Toy marque .. ;-)

[bonafyd]

As for the driving, I'll stack up a well equipped properly tuned S or RS model against anything with the Toy marque .. ;-)

I'm still pretty new to Audi but a properly tuned Toyota Supra with the 2JZGTE is nothing to sneeze at..

[luv2sleep]

I personally don't care what people think and what some of these idiot editors write. 2nd, 3rd, 4th tier....whatever, to each his own. Bimmers are great driving cars but I've never cared for their looks. They are a true dime in a dozen in my neck of the woods. As for Toyota/Lexus, they are exceptional cars (though a bit boring for my taste) but radiation exposure must've gotten to their designers & engineers because most of their cars look like the Transformers. MBs are luxurious but again, a bit boring for my taste. I only buy MB because my wife likes them.
Audi used to build some of the crappiest cars when I was growing up but that changed just over a decade ago, IMO. Yeah, I'm over 40 and damn proud of it! I feel like I'm finally starting to grow up.[:D] I bought my first Audi back in 2012, a Q5. I'm on my 3rd Audi now. Let's just say that I've never owned a same brand car twice or more, except MB because of my wife. I'm not one of those brand loyalists but Audi has me hooked for the time being so they must be doing something right.

[luv2sleep]

I'm still pretty new to Audi but a properly tuned Toyota Supra with the 2JZGTE is nothing to sneeze at..

Oh, I drool whenever I see a 4th gen Supra. What a beautiful car! My first "nice" car was a '87 Supra. It was a bit on the heavy side but it had nice torque.

[AY6NYC]

I'm under 30 and I cross shopped with a gs350f, the interior and infotainment was very nice. the front seat was just too low, too narrow and visibility wasn't great. I only considered it because the lease deals were great on that car. but overall I don't see how someone can get a Lexus, genesis or Infiniti over anything from Germany

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[Q5 Bob]

I want to know who is in charge of assigning tier #'s to cars. Strictly n the eye of the beholder. What I consider tier 1 the next person might consider 2. In most cases it makes no difference.

IMO Lexus has earned its reputation and for the most part has separated itself from Toyota. I've read a lot of comments about Audi being an upscale VW. I don't buy it, but talk/comparisoons like this go on all of the time.

[jorgemachete]

Audi is definitely not 2nd tier but a number of people still associate Audi with the brands previous technical/mechanical prone issues. I remember having a discussion with a body shop owner and him basically saying how impressed he was with how far Audi has come. My father also mentioned his issues with Audi when I first expressed interest in the A7 since he owned an Audi many years ago. But as we all know and the numbers have shown, Audi has worked hard to overcome that image. I personally was a Mercedes fan boy for many years. I was dead set on getting a CLS550 until I learned about the A7 refresh. Looking at the two, I felt the A7 was far more beautiful and eye catching. I truly think the A7 has the potential to be a future classic given its unique hatchback design and aggressive lines. The CLS interior, at the time, was incredibly boring though I liked the exterior. With regards to BMW, i've talked to many die hard fans who now have transitioned elsewhere because they say the quality of service has diminished. There are also a few articles out there that talk about it. Now lexus i'm sure we can all agree is a great car company. Definitely an incredibly reliable vehicle choice. My family owns a 2002 LS430 that has been running well for years and still is a comfortable ride. My girlfriend always comments on the comfort of the interior/leather and how she believes its best in the car industry. And ironically, I actually got about a grand off msrp because my family owns a lexus but being under 30 , the model lineup just doesn't do much for me. My only quarrel with Audi right now is with regards to the Audi exclusive design selection. I've been back on the market for another A7 because my 2016 flooded out last year. So this time around I was thinking I'd go 17 S7. My thing is I've always admired the peanut butter interior of cars and so when it came time to get my A7 I went nougat brown. Well nougat brown isn't offered in the S7 so I thought to solve this issue I'd do a Audi design selection color like cognac brown. Well my SA informed me the other day that such an option actually isn't possible and that the only exclusive color interior are available on the S7 is arras red. All other interior color options are only available on base model a7's. I created a thread to confirm this and it sounds like hes right. One of the gentlemen on the forum mentioned that its an operating cost issue. While that's somewhat understandable I believe any of the other brand vehicles mentioned here without a doubt, minus Lexus maybe, would offer exclusive color options with any of its top tier models. If your willing to pay for it, they're willing to get it done. So that's my knock on Audi as a luxury brand. That being said I'm now having to decide whether I want to go with another base A7 since I'm not willing to budge on interior color or whether I want to check out the CLS550 again or even the upcoming panamera model. But ultimately I know either of those choices will cost me considerably more than going Audi again. I was just hoping to get some more horses under the hood [:(] . But anyway, I'm off my soap box. Concluding remarks, Audi has definitely proven itself as top-tier. The numbers reflect that. But given its troubling history technically/mechanically in the past, they've had to prove themselves but are doing an exceptional job.

[_SILENCER]

Maybach, Rolls and Bentley - okay that's top tier if you go Full Monty.

But Audi being somehow beneath BMW and especially Lexus is absurd. I had a Lexus for a few years before I switched to Audi in 2008. It was fantastically trouble free, but friends and neighbors, it was NO Audi, I can tell you that.

[VVG]

Audi IS second tier. Not in terms of the quality of their products, but in terms of overall US presence, popularity and sales. Audi has itself to blame to a certain degree. It has to do with how aggressively you market your product to a given population. Audi has never made the US a top priority. They don't design cars with the US market in mind, they don't bring all their best products to the US, and products are often delayed. Look at the halo RS line, and what a poor presence they have in the US compared to M and AMG. Audi should have an RS3, RS4, RS5, RS6, RS7, RSQ5, RSQ7, all available at all times. Audi has no flagship high performance SUV, when virtually EVERY other premium German brand does. Their online configurator also sucks, and their dealership numbers are well below MB, BMW, Lexus.

Another company in the same boat is Infiniti. Compared to their main rival, Lexus, I actually think they make better, and more interesting products, but the presence, marketing and product development simply is not in the same league. Lexus and Infiniti both entered the US market around 1990 IIRC, but Lexus took off in a way that Infiniti never did.

So yes, from the US business perspective, Audi is second tier, and I think this is what is being referred to. I don't think the are referring to the performance, design, or build quality of the cars themselves.

[texasnoiz]

Audi IS second tier. Not in terms of the quality of their products, but in terms of overall US presence, popularity and sales. Audi has itself to blame to a certain degree. It has to do with how aggressively you market your product to a given population. Audi has never made the US a top priority. They don't design cars with the US market in mind, they don't bring all their best products to the US, and products are often delayed. Look at the halo RS line, and what a poor presence they have in the US compared to M and AMG. Audi should have an RS3, RS4, RS5, RS6, RS7, RSQ5, RSQ7, all available at all times. Audi has no flagship high performance SUV, when virtually EVERY other premium German brand does. Their online configurator also sucks, and their dealership numbers are well below MB, BMW, Lexus.

Another company in the same boat is Infiniti. Compared to their main rival, Lexus, I actually think they make better, and more interesting products, but the presence, marketing and product development simply is not in the same league. Lexus and Infiniti both entered the US market around 1990 IIRC, but Lexus took off in a way that Infiniti never did.

So yes, from the US business perspective, Audi is second tier, and I think this is what is being referred to. I don't think the are referring to the performance, design, or build quality of the cars themselves.

Agree with business aspect of discussion - yes Audi is second tier in some aspects, but we know S and RS customer looking to buy and tune their Audi is not cross shopping any Hyundai product.

Had 06 V10 M5, 09 M3 sedan - both were good to me for 50-60,000mi - these days, aside from M3 sedan and M6 GC - BMW has lost reliability and edge; just terrible friends' stories about their late model BMWs.

Lexus is buyer is looking for comfort and reliability - true performance customer is not in that showroom. IS-F may be plenty of performance for some, but if you are used to 600-800 hp, Lexus is the wrong answer.

MBenz has really stepped up performance AND luxury game in some of their models - turbo motors offer tuners the ability to liven things up which some of us need.

Audi is similar to MBenz with perf and lux - actually went with a used S6 for the extreme value it is plus it is 'different' from all the other cars in the doctor parking lots wherever I go which are typically littered with Lexus MBenz and some BMW products.

Audi S6 tricked daily, CTS-V wagon 720 whp, Hellcat.

[VVG]

Agree with business aspect of discussion - yes Audi is second tier in some aspects, but we know S and RS customer looking to buy and tune their Audi is not cross shopping any Hyundai product.

Had 06 V10 M5, 09 M3 sedan - both were good to me for 50-60,000mi - these days, aside from M3 sedan and M6 GC - BMW has lost reliability and edge; just terrible friends' stories about their late model BMWs.

Lexus is buyer is looking for comfort and reliability - true performance customer is not in that showroom. IS-F may be plenty of performance for some, but if you are used to 600-800 hp, Lexus is the wrong answer.

MBenz has really stepped up performance AND luxury game in some of their models - turbo motors offer tuners the ability to liven things up which some of us need.

Audi is similar to MBenz with perf and lux - actually went with a used S6 for the extreme value it is plus it is 'different' from all the other cars in the doctor parking lots wherever I go which are typically littered with Lexus MBenz and some BMW products.

Audi S6 tricked daily, CTS-V wagon 720 whp, Hellcat.

Well there was a time when Lexus was a "Toyota" product. The LFA is a "Toyota" product. What was Nissan before the GTR? I will reserve judgement until I have seen how the Genesis brand evolves over the next few years.

[Island Maser]

One thing about Lexus there service experience is the best in the business. No one can dispute that and I have never heard anyone speak bad about how they were treated by the dealership.
I can not say the same for Audi. The service is 2nd string at best! My example. I have 2 homes and move cars around based on the season. When I bought my Audi I asked about service and I was told you are buying an S6 you always get a service loaner, blah,blah blah. 6 month later I am up north and the car needs it first free service. I was told since I did not buy the car from them no loaner. The is Larson Audi on Fife WA. 80K car and I am waiting around like I have Yugo or I can take the shuttle bus. Really? They lost there fucking minds if you ask me. I will tell you were Audi can put there S6. I went to Audi of Seattle and the service was great. I bought my last Audi. Until Audi decides they want to a luxury brand I am out. Left a very bad taste in my mouth. I could be driving a Maserati for half the money and they will pick up the car at my house with a flat bed if I ask. Second tier at best in my opinion. Until they deal with there lame dealer network I will spend my money elsewhere. I figured Porsche was next but I have had enough of the German experience. Nice cars right up until you have to deal with the master race to have them serviced.

[agent47]

One thing about Lexus there service experience is the best in the business. No one can dispute that and I have never heard anyone speak bad about how they were treated by the dealership.
I can not say the same for Audi. The service is 2nd string at best! My example. I have 2 homes and move cars around based on the season. When I bought my Audi I asked about service and I was told you are buying an S6 you always get a service loaner, blah,blah blah. 6 month later I am up north and the car needs it first free service. I was told since I did not buy the car from them no loaner. The is Larson Audi on Fife WA. 80K car and I am waiting around like I have Yugo or I can take the shuttle bus. Really? They lost there fucking minds if you ask me. I will tell you were Audi can put there S6. I went to Audi of Seattle and the service was great. I bought my last Audi. Until Audi decides they want to a luxury brand I am out. Left a very bad taste in my mouth. I could be driving a Maserati for half the money and they will pick up the car at my house with a flat bed if I ask. Second tier at best in my opinion. Until they deal with there lame dealer network I will spend my money elsewhere. I figured Porsche was next but I have had enough of the German experience. Nice cars right up until you have to deal with the master race to have them serviced.
Well I have a Dr in my office who whined constantly about how bad they treated the customers at the Lexus dealership here so its not a green patch on the other side always. Audi- I had a shitty experience at one dealership here after the ownership changed to Autonation. Before the ownership change, they were great. The other 2 dealerships I have dealt with, amazing people - sales to service- everybody is great. They pick my car up from my clinic, leave a loaner and bring it back. Add to it that I only allow one guy at the dealership to work on my car, so some times its quite a while that my car is with them. They have never blinked an eye. It just depends on the dealership and what the work ethic is out there. I have dealt with great Porsche and MB dealers the same time as I talked to complete dbags. If a dealership is a POS, there is always another option.

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[goliath1]

One thing about Lexus there service experience is the best in the business. No one can dispute that and I have never heard anyone speak bad about how they were treated by the dealership.
I can not say the same for Audi. The service is 2nd string at best! My example. I have 2 homes and move cars around based on the season. When I bought my Audi I asked about service and I was told you are buying an S6 you always get a service loaner, blah,blah blah. 6 month later I am up north and the car needs it first free service. I was told since I did not buy the car from them no loaner. The is Larson Audi on Fife WA. 80K car and I am waiting around like I have Yugo or I can take the shuttle bus. Really? They lost there fucking minds if you ask
me. I will tell you were Audi can put there S6. I went to Audi of Seattle and the service was great. I bought my last Audi. Until Audi decides they want to a luxury brand I am out. Left a very bad taste in my mouth. I could be driving a Maserati for half the money and they will pick up the car at my house with a flat bed if I ask. Second tier at best in my opinion. Until they deal with there lame dealer network I will spend my money elsewhere. I figured Porsche was next but I have had enough of the German experience. Nice cars right up until you have to deal with the master race to have them serviced.

I call B.S. On this one. I bought my CPO Audi from a dealer 100 miles distant and service it at my local dealer. I get loaners...rides to the office...all without question. Maybe you have a bad apple/dealer?

[agent47]

I call B.S. On this one. I bought my CPO Audi from a dealer 100 miles distant and service it at my local dealer. I get loaners...rides to the office...all without question. Maybe you have a bad apple/dealer?
Yup. I bought my A4 in TX, drove it to NY for a little 4month gig, it was serviced at Palisades Audi, I was given a loaner. Same when I came back to TX and bought my A6 from 1 dealer, had it serviced at another.
Also, segregation into tiers based on dealership experiences is funny. That way BMW won't even be 2nd tier. Lol

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[Kirks5oh]

2nd tier, 3rd tier, 4th tier, who gives a shit?? if you buy a 15 year old mercedes c class for $7k, does that mean you own a top tier luxury car?? no, it means you own a piece of shit, but get to tell everyone you own a mercedes. the only people who care about that shit are people i don't care to associate with. i buy the car i want based primarily on how it drives, performance, potential for modification, and ability to fit my kids in it. secondarily unique-ness, looks, and resale, factor into the equation. if i like how a chevy cobalt performs, i will buy it without a second thought as to what some d-bag reporter says.

[VVG]

2nd tier, 3rd tier, 4th tier, who gives a shit?? if you buy a 15 year old mercedes c class for $7k, does that mean you own a top tier luxury car?? no, it means you own a piece of shit, but get to tell everyone you own a mercedes. the only people who care about that shit are people i don't care to associate with. i buy the car i want based primarily on how it drives, performance, potential for modification, and ability to fit my kids in it. secondarily unique-ness, looks, and resale, factor into the equation. if i like how a chevy cobalt performs, i will buy it without a second thought as to what some d-bag reporter says.

You are missing the point of the discussion. The issue at hand is why Audi is being called a second rate luxury brand.

[Kirks5oh]

You are missing the point of the discussion. The issue at hand is why Audi is being called a second rate luxury brand.


I can answer that question for you. It's ONE columnist exercising their right to type whatever they want as long as it's not slanderous.

If I tell you your favorite restaurant is a second tier restaurant are you going to stop going?? Or even care what I think?? Reporters are free to report how they like, and make comments like this. You can either write it off as ignorance/incorrect/silly, or you can get butthurt about it and self conscious when you pull up next to your neighbor's certified-pre-owned 3 year old 328 they just bought.

[levigarrett]

I call B.S. On this one. I bought my CPO Audi from a dealer 100 miles distant and service it at my local dealer. I get loaners...rides to the office...all without question. Maybe you have a bad apple/dealer?

I bought my car in Florida and live in California. I get Audi loaners every single time I'm there for service or repair. No questions asked.