Grape's 20/20 build thread

[GrapeBandit]

Contents: 20 valve true 2L AEB stroker build
I am going to document build with as much detail as possible and keep it updated as it progresses.

I had no intentions on doing this, but I had some recent carnage
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150201_132601.jpg
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150209_124103.jpg
wiped out all my pistons and all 8 exhaust valves.
so did i smash my pistons with my valves? or did I smash my valves with my pistons? either way, the damage the done.

the culprit: sheared keyway on the crank timing gear
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150209_124144.jpg
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150209_124151.jpg
this is not the first time this happed on a 1.8t I owned, but it will be the last. im going to dowel pin my new crank timing gear into the crank.

before: http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150127_115432.jpg

how it sits now:
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150202_145401.jpg
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150202_164601.jpg
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150202_145348.jpgSince this is a spur of the moment ordeal and a big surprise to me, I really dont have a turbo picked out, so I will run this on a measly K04 for the time being.

parts on the way:
92.8mm forged ABA crankshaft.
83.5mm supertech 8.7:1 pistons.
supertech inconel exhast valves.
144mm scat rods w/20mm wrist pins.
all applicable bearings and a full engine gasket set.

[pbcrazy]

This. I like it.

[GrapeBandit]

This. I like it.
im taking donations towards an EFR[evilsmile]

[xdewaynex]

Sucks that a build had to start the way it did. Ive thought about picking up another complete AEB motor building it and possibly do a Precision 5857 turbo. I would just be upgrading the rods, valves, springs and cams, no stroker kit.

[ray4624]

efr and full-race mani...if only i had the 3k+ that i wanted to dump into a car i dont drive.
Good luck with the build!

[rodgertherabit]

Oh, im just gonna rip this apart!!! Grape style[>_<]

Seriously tho! congrats for taking the plunge! Im thinking about selling the gtx, its no efr but its still nice. ;-P

[GrapeBandit]

Sucks that a build had to start the way it did. Ive thought about picking up another complete AEB motor building it and possibly do a Precision 5857 turbo. I would just be upgrading the rods, valves, springs and cams, no stroker kit.
you aint shitting. I had zero plans on building this, as I have special parts for another build laying around until I had the funds to go crazy. now I have to build this shit, and make it worthy. idk if I want to BT this, or rock the block until I have enough money to finish my "special" build, and sell this block. I dont need or havent planned on having to BT blocks

[GrapeBandit]

efr and full-race mani...if only i had the 3k+ that i wanted to dump into a car i dont drive.
Good luck with the build!
no full race mani, I can get a nice custom one done for around a stack.

Oh, im just gonna rip this apart!!! Grape style[>_<]

Seriously tho! congrats for taking the plunge! Im thinking about selling the gtx, its no efr but its still nice. ;-P
you can rip this apart, idc, I dug deep into many other members. is it my turn now? lol

[coolgraymemo]

I've thought about an 18/18 build.

18 valve true 1.8L AEB build.

[GrapeBandit]

I've thought about an 18/18 build.

18 valve true 1.8L AEB build.

18 valve, huh? lol

[coolgraymemo]

Going to take two out for weight reduction.

[GrapeBandit]

Going to take two out for weight reduction.

thats hot! hopefully they are intakes[:D]

sent my intermediate shaft to FFE today to machine for #4rod clearance and balancing.

[ray4624]

no full race mani, I can get a nice custom one done for around a stack.



the full race is machine welded with a lifetime warranty for $164 more then a stack doe

[MetalMan]

That coolant tank wants to be replaced so it won't look out of place in your white engine bay [:d]
Will be watching this!

[GrapeBandit]

That coolant tank wants to be replaced so it won't look out of place in your white engine bay [:d]
Will be watching this!
ahh shit. I have 3 of these coolant tanks in the garage. im actually going to paint it black instead of buying a new clear one haha

[Seerlah]

Pfffftttt, pnueb [:p]

[GrapeBandit]

Pfffftttt, pnueb [:p]
silly ass! ! !

am I a pneub, noob, or a newb[confused][:p]

[Davdraco1]

the full race is machine welded with a lifetime warranty for $164 more then a stack doe

what is this mani you speak of?

[RoadRage]

I need to find a cheap spare engine. I'd love to build an engine, but I need my car to be running.

This should be good. Subbed.

[GrapeBandit]

what is this mani you speak of?
full-race.com


I need to find a cheap spare engine. I'd love to build an engine, but I need my car to be running.

This should be good. Subbed.
do you have 06a or 058?

[Seerlah]

Just busting chops, Vince [cool]

Waiting to see you get back to something better than your old B5 A4 with the GT35R. What are your HP goals? I know someone selling a brand new (rebuilt) Comp Turbo 5858 triplex for $900 I think, if interested. He has two of them.

[GrapeBandit]

Just busting chops, Vince [cool]

Waiting to see you get back to something better than your old B5 A4 with the GT35R. What are your HP goals? I know someone selling a brand new (rebuilt) Comp Turbo 5858 triplex for $900 I think, if interested. He has two of them.
its hard to outdue a gt35r 2L b5.

I dont have hp goals with this car since tbis build is just happening due to a faulty crank timing gear[headbang]

as for Comp turbo, ill pass. its hit or miss with that company.
I will rock my K04 for now while I decide what I want to do with this engine.

[Seerlah]

And I know you are not a noob. Most likely know more than me (not even joking). But then again, I only know what I know.

[GrapeBandit]

And I know you are not a noob. Most likely know more than me (not even joking).
lol@ninja edit[:D]

I am a complete newb when it comes to the 058 block though. the 2L I built for my last car was 06a, and the few others I helped out were also 06a. this 058 seems like a lot more work and BS to accomplish the same thing you can easily do with 06a, hence my next "special" build has alh(06a block)

[redline380]

hence my next "special" build has alh(06a block)


ooooooooo, awwwwwww.

Sign me up!

[GrapeBandit]

ooooooooo, awwwwwww.

Sign me up!

thats a long way off, its what I have been saving for. now this happened and threw a monkey wrench in the whole program lol

[thedownwardsprl]

Wish i had the bucks for this man great idea though!

[adam044]

Becauseracecar

[Avant Nate]

I want to see a bw 7163.

[RallyeBourne]

That blows big testes. But I'm glad I can watch you do this. I'm going to pull an 06A block from a yard soon and stroke it out to 2L. It'll be nice to watch you do this first.

[redline380]

That blows big testes. But I'm glad I can watch you do this. I'm going to pull an 06A block from a yard soon and stroke it out to 2L. It'll be nice to watch you do this first.

He's stroking an 058, so a little different. The 06a is actually easier and less money involved.

FWIW, the motor in my sedan came out of a junkyard for $200. I love junkyard motor builds.

[RallyeBourne]

Oh, I missed that point. Oh well, still be nice to watch an engine build.

Motors from my local go-to are $287.95, but there is a 50%off sale coming up soon. That's when I'll strike.

[viceprp]

Just do a nice DD, 2.0 GTX2871.

[B5A4coastie]

That suck man, I'm sorry to hear you have to do this work before you're ready. The timing gear key snapped on your other crank as well?

I also have the 058 block that costs an arm and a leg to modify. I understand that you're making this bullet proof, but why swap out your crank if you're not looking to stroke it? Shouldn't the AEB crank handle the added stress? I did some research and saw the size difference and forged, ect that the ABA offers, but is piecing this together really that much cheaper than buying an IE kit? I already have Scat rods, so would larger pistons be adequate if I was to aim for the 2.0?

[GrapeBandit]

Becauseracecar
Becauseshearedkeywayincranktiminggear


I want to see a bw 7163.
haa. im sure everyone wants that turbo, myself included

Just do a nice DD, 2.0 GTX2871.
like i said earlier, i have no clue what im going to do about a turbo. just going to build the block and rock it k04 style. turbo upgrade most likely a few months out.


That suck man, I'm sorry to hear you have to do this work before you're ready. The timing gear key snapped on your other crank as well?Yes, it does suck, very badly, especially since i did a full timing belt service, head gasket, full engine gasket, clutch/pp/flywheel on this car about 10,000 miles ago. everything was still fresh.

the keyway in the crank timing gear had snapped off in one of my other 1.8t's back in like 2008/2009. so needless to say, me and crank timing gears no longer get along, i do not trust them thats why this one will be dowel pinned


I also have the 058 block that costs an arm and a leg to modify. I understand that you're making this bullet proof, but why swap out your crank if you're not looking to stroke it? Shouldn't the AEB crank handle the added stress?
the AEB doesnt really cost an arm and a leg to modify, its actually the cheapest to stroke out. i decided to stroke it because the engine is all apart, so what better time, right? i needed new pistons anyway, so for the additional cost of $135 shipped for the forged ABA crank, and the $75 to get my intermediate shaft machined, it was worth it to pick up an extra 10% displacement over stock.

the stock aeb crank can handle anything you throw at it. i have yet to see anyone break a cast crank on the b5 platform.

I did some research and saw the size difference and forged, ect that the ABA offers, but is piecing this together really that much cheaper than buying an IE kit? I already have Scat rods, so would larger pistons be adequate if I was to aim for the 2.0?
piecing together a kit on your own would save tons of money, not sure how these shops charge as much as they do for shit and get away with it. i didnt see a stroker kit on IE for the 058, just the 06a, but just to give you an example, ill break it down.
Cheapest IE stoker kit, if you want to call it that since it doesnt even come with a crankshaft[facepalm]
$1349.99 for the basic kit which contains: pistons, h-beamrods, crank timing gear dowel pin kit, and crank trigger wheel. great kit, NOT!
http://www.performancebyie.com/integrated-engineering-06a-1-8t-20v-2-1l-2067cc-stroker-engine-kit-8-5-1-cr
if you want to add in a crank from IE, you need $2000 to get the above mentioned w/crank. what a ripoff.

my piece together kit so far: ODBI ABA(forged) crankshaft $135 shipped
New Supertech pistons(83.5mm)/rings
New Scat 144mm h-beam rods w/ARP2000
New Supertech Inconel exhaust valves(8)

if you want to make a 2.0, you would at least need a 92.8mm crank(cast or forged), and at least 83mm pistons

[redline380]

the AEB doesnt really cost an arm and a leg to modify, its actually the cheapest to stroke out.

I disagree with this statement. All an 06a takes is pistons and an AEG crank which can be had for $75 and up. 058 usually need IM shaft machining, making them cost more to stroke.

[GrapeBandit]

I disagree with this statement. All an 06a takes is pistons and an AEG crank which can be had for $75 and up. 058 usually need IM shaft machining, making them cost more to stroke.
true, but you can source a forged crank for the 058 for the price of a cast 06a crank. forged crank is not needed, but its good to have. if you want to use fsi crank for 06a stroker, it will cost more than doing a forged crank 058 stroker

[Avant Nate]

OK, where did you get the Pistons from? Cheapest I found is $550. Any reason 83.5 over 83?

[GrapeBandit]

OK, where did you get the Pistons from? Cheapest I found is $550. Any reason 83.5 over 83?
google my friend lol
Supertech pistons (http://pridemotorsports.com/supertech-performance/supertech-pistons/p4vw18t835n15st/i-1996350.aspx)
Supertech rings (http://pridemotorsports.com/supertech-performance/supertech-piston-rings/gnh8350/i-69141.aspx)

i went with 83.5mm over 83mm for the extra cc's, granted not much, but still bigger

[redline380]

Try that importperformanceparts.net. Looks like they have CP stroker pistons for $510 for a set of 4

[GrapeBandit]

they just called me and said they are getting shipped out to me today, dropped shipped from supertech. they said is the last set on the shelf that are already made lol. so if you need to order them, you are probably looking at like a 3-4 week lead time on them as if you were ordering custom pistons

[viceprp]

Even the forged 06a cranks break. We're also talking about a1000+hp purpose built drag car.

[redline380]

Has anyone (with a streetable car) actually ever broken a crank before? I have never heard of one.

[GrapeBandit]

Even the forged 06a cranks break. We're also talking about a1000+hp purpose built drag car.
i never saw or heard of any of the b5 cranks breaking. care to share a link if possible. my car isnt going to be anywhere near 1000hp, so im not worried. only concern is getting that damn crank gear dowel pinned

[Avant Nate]

google my friend lol
Supertech pistons (http://pridemotorsports.com/supertech-performance/supertech-pistons/p4vw18t835n15st/i-1996350.aspx)
Supertech rings (http://pridemotorsports.com/supertech-performance/supertech-piston-rings/gnh8350/i-69141.aspx)

i went with 83.5mm over 83mm for the extra cc's, granted not much, but still bigger

I don't get it. That says "price per piston" at that site.

[GrapeBandit]

I don't get it. That says "price per piston" at that site.
you know what, i didnt see that[headbang] the guy on the phone said a set of 4. im about to call back and make sure, if not, i need to cancel that order.

[GrapeBandit]

called the place, the owner put me on hold and called supertech, they confirmed they are shipping out a complete set of 4 pistons[evilsmile]

. . .and these just came in[up]
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150210_125847.jpg

[RoadRage]

full-race.com


do you have 06a or 058?

I'm 058.

[GrapeBandit]

I'm 058.
so you can find a cheap blown engine somewhere for like $300. keep it in the garage and build it slowly

[Avant Nate]

I'm putting a head back together that I bought used and I'm trying to figure what Supertech valves I have. Could you look at your valve stems and tell me whats printed on yours? Mine have the supertech logo with KJ printed underneath. I think there just stainless, and the KJ may just be a code for production. Just curious.

[GrapeBandit]

I'm putting a head back together that I bought used and I'm trying to figure what Supertech valves I have. Could you look at your valve stems and tell me whats printed on yours? Mine have the supertech logo with KJ printed underneath. I think there just stainless, and the KJ may just be a code for production. Just curious.
im on my way to work. I get off at 10:30. I can check later when I get home and let you know

[B5A4coastie]

I understand that you're making this bullet proof, but why swap out your crank if you're not looking to stroke it?



if you want to make a 2.0, you would at least need a 92.8mm crank(cast or forged), and at least 83mm pistons

I misunderstood the definition of "stroker" I originally thought it had to do with the length of the rods, but it's the crank (distance traveled from TDC to BDC) that would actually determine the stoke... Every day is a school day.

Now by increasing the stroke would decrease the gap between the piston and valves, how will you combat that? 92.8mm (2.0), 86.4mm (1.8). That's 6.4mm, will a thick head gasket be required?

In order to see the full benefit of the stroker, do you need cams to allow more air movement? What about advancing or retarding the cams since the stroke will change?

Edit: I just found a few answers here: http://www.eaglerod.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=40&Itemid=25 Seems like one hell of a headache.

[Davdraco1]

I always thought you just shortened the rods so they don't hit with the larger crank.

[redline380]

Yes you need a long crank throw to stroke. It is kind of the definition of stoking. A longer throw will yield a longer travel by the piston, meaning the displacement is increased. The more air it draws in (or forced in by the turbo) the more fuel you can mix and thus more power is developed.

Stroking is by definition the power adder; you do not need any extra things likes cams. However, it would be very wise to get cams to help the engine breath better and get more air into the cylinder.

And to answer Coastie's question, a different gasket will not be needed. You see, when you increase the throw of the crank, using the stock piston would slap up against the head (in most cases, at least). That is why you need specific stroker pistons. They are made to allow the longer stroke, but the combustion chamber also has to be altered a lot to cheap compression ratios in check.

Basically, a lot of numbers have to go into developing pistons for stroker motors. If you can't wrap your mind around the concepts involved, you either need to do some more research and learn about engines more, or just ask what you all need to stroke the motor.

[GrapeBandit]

you dont need cams, but they would help. I have cams, but they are for my next build, top aggressive for this build at this point in time.

you dont shorten the rods, you get stroker pistons that have a different compression height where the wrist pin rides. in our stroker builds, the wrist pin sits closer to the deck(top) of the piston

[M-Hood]

you dont need cams, but they would help. I have cams, but they are for my next build, top aggressive for this build at this point in time.

you dont shorten the rods, you get stroker pistons that have a different compression height where the wrist pin rides. in our stroker builds, the wrist pin sits closer to the deck(top) of the piston

Correct, the pin location is moved up higher or basically so the piston drops down further onto the rod allowing the top of the piston to end even with the deck again.


BTW for those that want a EFR but can't afford it BW does have some very nice Journal bearing turbos, even have a S200 57mm FMW that flows the same as a EFR 7670 without the big price tag.

http://www.full-race.com/store/images/full/borgwarner-s200sx-fmw-57mm-turbo-content-14.jpg


BW is coming out with their new lineup this summer and this that will be replaced by the newer version S200SXE which will have a different compressor housing and will be offered in both a 57.15mm and 52.17mm compressor wheel with a 70mm exducer.

[GrapeBandit]

^billet compressor wheel?

[M-Hood]

^billet compressor wheel?

The FMW is the same thing used on the EFR line, FMW stands for Forged Milled Wheel. Basically the S Series FMW is like a base model EFR. lol

[GrapeBandit]

I missed the FMW part, I was skim reading your post while at work lol

[garytightpants]

I like this thread [up]

[GrapeBandit]

anyone know what size drill bit and reamer comes with the IE crank dowel pin kit? I refuse to pay $150 for the kit when I can do this myself for a fraction of the cost. already found 3/16" x .75" alloy steel dowel pins 7200 shear strength for like $14 for a bag of 50. lol

[redline380]

anyone know what size drill bit and reamer comes with the IE crank dowel pin kit? I refuse to pay $150 for the kit when I can do this myself for a fraction of the cost. already found 3/16" x .75" alloy steel dowel pins 7200 shear strength for like $14 for a bag of 50. lol

No idea. just do it with whatever size you can like you mentioned. put 5 in lol

[GrapeBandit]

I planned on using 6 to balance things out[:p]

[redline380]

I planned on using 6 to balance things out[:p]


Hey, 360 can be divided by 5 too!

[RallyeBourne]

Inline 5 Cylinder Engine - Explained: http://youtu.be/VBUyR7xQvhY

[GrapeBandit]

Could you look at your valve stems and tell me whats printed on yours? Mine have the supertech logo with KJ printed underneath. I think there just stainless, and the KJ may just be a code for production. Just curious.
mine have the Supertech emblem near the top of the stem, and directly under it is LL.


Inline 5 Cylinder Engine - Explained: http://youtu.be/VBUyR7xQvhY
so are you saying abandon my 20/20 and go I5? lol how about a vr5 instead?

[viceprp]

Seeing your crank gear reminds me of mine. The last time my block melted, my key way broke off as well and where it was sitting was off by 3 teeth. I'll have to check wget her it was advanced of retarded but either way my valves all stayed together. Was one aspect that I was lucky.
I look forward to the updates.

Also the crank bolt is TTY, so just buy a new one. I would either use 2 or 4 pin and the hole is based off your pins. Want the hole slightly smaller and slam those pins in.

[GrapeBandit]

Seeing your crank gear reminds me of mine. The last time my block melted, my key way broke off as well and where it was sitting was off by 3 teeth. I'll have to check wget her it was advanced of retarded but either way my valves all stayed together. Was one aspect that I was lucky.
I look forward to the updates.

Also the crank bolt is TTY, so just buy a new one. I would either use 2 or 4 pin and the hole is based off your pins. Want the hole slightly smaller and slam those pins in.
lucky for you that you didnt smash your valves, wish i could say the same.

Yes, I know the crank bolt is TTY, will get a new one.

i will probably just use 1 or 2 pins, not going to the extreme, really no need to. lol

[M-Hood]

anyone know what size drill bit and reamer comes with the IE crank dowel pin kit? I refuse to pay $150 for the kit when I can do this myself for a fraction of the cost. already found 3/16" x .75" alloy steel dowel pins 7200 shear strength for like $14 for a bag of 50. lol

IE doesn't even offer the dowel pin gear kit anymore, now they only offer their press on gear.

[GrapeBandit]

IE doesn't even offer the dowel pin gear kit anymore, now they only offer their press on gear.

the dowel pin kit still shows on their site.

what press on gear are you talking about?

[redline380]

He is talking about this but I don't think they offer it for 058

http://www.performancebyie.com/ie-billet-press-fit-timing-belt-drive-gear-for-06a-1-8t-engines

[GrapeBandit]

He is talking about this but I don't think they offer it for 058

http://www.performancebyie.com/ie-billet-press-fit-timing-belt-drive-gear-for-06a-1-8t-engines
oh, gotcha. I can drill, ream, and dowel pin my crank for way cheaper than that. hell, you could bring it to a machine shop and habe it done for less than $200. I think thats ridiculously priced[headbang]

[Avant Nate]

Heres someone dowel pinning a tdi
http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=318602

[Jake@JHM]

Sub'd [up]

[GrapeBandit]

Heres someone dowel pinning a tdi
http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=318602

sweet. bookmarked! ! !

one thing I always wondered about pinning the gear is the chance of throwing off the balance of the engine. you know, drilling holes(removing material), and then inserting dowel pin(s)(adding material). how could this not throw the balance off?

also, theres only one place that I can find that has the intermediate shaft bearings clicky (http://techtonicstuning.com/main/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=1354)

this cant be the only place to sell them

[MetalMan]

one thing I always wondered about pinning the gear is the chance of throwing off the balance of the engine. you know, drilling holes(removing material), and then inserting dowel pin(s)(adding material). how could this not throw the balance off?

Because moment of inertia. (moment of inertia equation: mass * radius^2)
Those pins are located quite close to the axis of rotation, and don't weigh much (factoring in material removed as well).
The crank pulley is much larger diameter, therefore its impact on moment of inertia is huge compared to the dowel pins/drilled holes.
Let's not even talk about clutch/flywheel... the contribution of those to moment of inertia will me MUCH LARGER than even the crank pulley.
Then there's the crank's moment of inertia too...

I'd bet you could do a single dowel pin without any impact on the engine's balance.

[GrapeBandit]

I was kind of thinking the same thing, that the pins are so close to the center of the crank that it might not throw it off at all. either way, im going to pin the crank lol

[RallyeBourne]

God, this all just makes me want to start my build. Keep posting where you're buying shit! Lol.

[GrapeBandit]

Keep posting where you're buying shit! Lol.
lol. will do. scat rods w/arp2000 bolts came from importperformanceparts.net for $312.99, but can also be had on ebay from Titan motorsports(know for supra's) for $322 shipped as long as you are not in FL, otherwise they tack on another $22 for state tax. I already linked the pistons/rings.

supertech inconel exhast valves came from krakenmotorsports for $182 shipped.

various gaskets/seals im ordering from ecs & fcp.

when I search for parts, I figure out what part(s) I want/need, then just google search the part number until I find the cheapest deal. fairly simple.

. . .and ohh, theres a guy on CL selling a stroker 058 block already assembled for $700. check the "craigslist spotted thread" in the b5 a4 chatterbox section.

[chris164935]

I have the IE billet crank gear. It is a nice piece for sure, but it requires a little extra work. The gear itself does not have the notch or whatever that the stock gear has to properly align the crank pulley onto the crank gear so that you can use the markings on the pulley and timing belt cover to find TDC. Just takes a little extra effort (and money if you don't have the necessary tools) to manually clock TDC, which isn't too bad, but for anyone who might have been considering it, this post is just a head's up.

[RallyeBourne]

. . .and ohh, theres a guy on CL selling a stroker 058 block already assembled for $700. check the "craigslist spotted thread" in the b5 a4 chatterbox section.

Good deal, for sure. But I'm more excited for the build than just the extra ponies. I wanna do it my-damn-self.

[ray4624]

I think I'm buying that block. This thread got me excited.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Gaberossi]

Subscribed!

[GrapeBandit]

I think I'm buying that block. This thread got me excited.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
do it. just make sure to check out what I told you[up]

crank will be here tomorrow, and my pistons/rings on Tuesday.
supposedly getting the tracking for my rods tomorrow[headbang]that northeast storm is fucking with my build lol

[ray4624]

will do man. Thanks for the tips.

that northeast storm is fucking with my life...again

[GrapeBandit]

will do man. Thanks for the tips.

that northeast storm is fucking with my life...again
how much snow did you get over the past week?

[ray4624]

Boston had a 30 day snow total of 5 feet. In my area I am right around 4 feet for the month. About 18 inches in the last week.


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[GrapeBandit]

Boston had a 30 day snow total of 5 feet. In my area I am right around 4 feet for the month. About 18 inches in the last week.


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I do not miss the snow lol or the way ppl forget how to drive when it snows[:D]

[GrapeBandit]

a little delivery from Fedex: OBDI ABA
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150212_111120.jpg~original

Anyone know what pilot bearing this thing uses? I cant find it online

[M-Hood]

a little delivery from Fedex: OBDI ABA
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150212_111120.jpg~original

Anyone know what pilot bearing this thing uses? I cant find it online

Should be the exact same thing used on the 1.8t crank if it is a manual ABA crank.

[GrapeBandit]

Should be the exact same thing used on the 1.8t crank if it is a manual ABA crank.
thanks[up] i was thinking the the 1.8t pilot too. i will mic it out when i get a chance to double check, hopefully tomorrow.

OBDI ABA cranks didnt come in manual/automatic, just one style.

[GrapeBandit]

just did a rough measurement with a ruler(i know, ghetto), and it was a kunt hair under 7/8". our 1.8t pilots are 21mm, so it seems to be right on target. Will double check with the micrometer to be safe, but ill lay odds it will fit[wrench]

[M-Hood]

just did a rough measurement with a ruler(i know, ghetto), and it was a kunt hair under 7/8". our 1.8t pilots are 21mm, so it seems to be right on target. Will double check with the micrometer to be safe, but ill lay odds it will fit[wrench]

I use 1.8t pilot bearings on the ABA crank that I have had in my ATW 058 block since 2003.

[GrapeBandit]

I use 1.8t pilot bearings on the ABA crank that I have had in my ATW 058 block since 2003.
[up]correct

[rodgertherabit]

Grape, how much uis the machine shop charging ya???

[S4NIK8]

This reminds me how much I wish I would have just done a 2.0 the first time around. My fault for not bothering to research it and realize the cost would've been the same.

[GrapeBandit]

Grape, how much uis the machine shop charging ya???
FFE Racing said $75 to machine my intermediate shaft, and my local machine shop is charging $140 to hot tank the block, shave a thousandth of an inch(0.001") of the top to make sure its true/flat, and to over-bore to 83.5mm.

hopefully he can get to it in a timely manor, i know hes in the middle of rebuilding a $60,000 air boat engine and the guy is just throwing money at him basically saying hes #1 priority to get his shit done first. must be nice to have money lol. that engine is either a small block or big block twin turbo, and he showed me the $5000 forged crankshaft the thing had. i was like [o_o] thing was knife edged and you could see all the mallory in it to balance it out. the airboat is on the cover of some magazine, he showed me. heres the sad part of the story, the last guy who did the oil change on it, either didnt put the cap back on, or not tight enough. as the guy was driving through the water, he lost all his oil before he could notice and wiped all his bearings out. OUCH. what a costly mistake. id want to kill myself/someone(whoever changed the oil last)


This reminds me how much I wish I would have just done a 2.0 the first time around. My fault for not bothering to research it and realize the cost would've been the same.
pretty much, just a few hundred more considering the crank can be sourced for cheap and the machining to the intermediate shaft

[S4NIK8]

pretty much, just a few hundred more considering the crank can be sourced for cheap and the machining to the intermediate shaft

thankfully I get the machine work for free so that wouldn't have been an issue, sourcing the crank would've been essentially the only additional cost.

[RallyeBourne]

I've got so many cranks at my disposal thanks to the multitude of junk yards near me, it's pathetic. I went to one yard last week, there were literally 6 AEG cars with blocks still intact. (06a uses AEG crank, not ABA)

[S4NIK8]

Maybe I should just pull my engine and do this, it does have ~80k on it...

[rodgertherabit]

FFE Racing said $75 to machine my intermediate shaft, and my local machine shop is charging $140 to hot tank the block, shave a thousandth of an inch(0.001") of the top to make sure its true/flat, and to over-bore to 83.5mm.

Wow, thats really not bad at ALL!.

[GrapeBandit]

thankfully I get the machine work for free so that wouldn't have been an issue, sourcing the crank would've been essentially the only additional cost.
thats cool. do you work in a machine shop, or just have the hook up?


I've got so many cranks at my disposal thanks to the multitude of junk yards near me, it's pathetic. I went to one yard last week, there were literally 6 AEG cars with blocks still intact. (06a uses AEG crank, not ABA)
there anr no junkyards near me, i live in the sticks now[:(]


Maybe I should just pull my engine and do this, it does have ~80k on it...
haha, go for it if you have the time and a few extra bucks to build it[up]


Wow, thats really not bad at ALL!.
Nope! $100 for the bore, $20 for the hot tank, $20 for the shaving

Also, just putting this out for those who are interested. I havent found an ARP crank bolt for the 058, but i found one that will fit perfect:
4G63(M14x1.5x1.525") http://arp-bolts.com/kits/ARPkit-detail.php?RecordID=1244
Stock 058 crank bolt is M14x1.5x39mm(1.535")[cool]

[S4NIK8]

thats cool. do you work in a machine shop, or just have the hook up?

Also, just putting this out for those who are interested. I havent found an ARP crank bolt for the 058, but i found one that will fit perfect:
4G63(M14x1.5x1.525") http://arp-bolts.com/kits/ARPkit-detail.php?RecordID=1244
Stock 058 crank bolt is M14x1.5x39mm(1.535")[cool]

Have access to one (family owned), nice find on the crank bolt! I know what I'm going to be ordering later today.
If I had even a little justification to pull the engine and go through it (using oil, low compression, low oil pressure) I would but everything is good and the cranking comp is within about 5psi of what it was at 1500 miles.

[GrapeBandit]

Have access to one (family owned), nice find on the crank bolt! I know what I'm going to be ordering later today.
If I had even a little justification to pull the engine and go through it (using oil, low compression, low oil pressure) I would but everything is good and the cranking comp is within about 5psi of what it was at 1500 miles.
nice, i wish i had access to a family owned machine shop. it must be nice! where are you? canada? your pro just says "Somewhere Cold" lol

if your engine is running that healthy, dont touch it, or sell it off to somebody[;)] so you can start over with a stroker

[S4NIK8]

nice, i wish i had access to a family owned machine shop. it must be nice! where are you? canada? your pro just says "Somewhere Cold" lol

if your engine is running that healthy, dont touch it, or sell it off to somebody[;)] so you can start over with a stroker

Minnesota, I don't say 'hey buddy' or 'hey guy' enough to be Canadian but I do enjoy poutine eh.

[GrapeBandit]

Minnesota, I don't say 'hey buddy' or 'hey guy' enough to be Canadian but I do enjoy poutine eh.
so you are from Minnesowdaaa ayee!?!?!? lol the VAG scene is huge up there. well the VAG scene near me is, non-existent. but the lifted mud trucks and diesel driving rednecks are plentiful around my way[:D]

[S4NIK8]

where in Florida? have friends in Ft Myers, Ft Lauderdale, and Jacksonville

[GrapeBandit]

where in Florida? have friends in Ft Myers, Ft Lauderdale, and Jacksonville
im not near any of those. im about 1 hr north of Tampa, and about 1 1/2hr west of Orlando

[S4NIK8]

im not near any of those. im about 1 hr north of Tampa, and about 1 1/2hr west of Orlando

That explains the mud trucks and rednecks, I have never ventured much more than a dozen miles inland in Florida but have been told its a strange place. Anyway back to your 2.0 build now that this has gone way off topic!

[GrapeBandit]

That explains the mud trucks and rednecks, I have never ventured much more than a dozen miles inland in Florida but have been told its a strange place. Anyway back to your 2.0 build now that this has gone way off topic!
very strange place indeed haha

but theres not much to update on the build, rods and pistons will be here tuesday, then its off to the machine shop to get the block bored.

[GrapeBandit]

. Anyway back to your 2.0 build now that this has gone way off topic!
heres ypur update. not a big update, but progress. intermediate shaft bearings came in early
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150213_125826.jpg

[GrapeBandit]

whats our options for a T4 manifold besides custom?
any manifolds that we can cut the T3 flange off and weld on a T4?
suggestions?

[ray4624]

T4 twin scroll? Full race :)


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[GrapeBandit]

T4 twin scroll? Full race :)


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yeah. . .no...lol...i can get a local shop to make me a TS mani for about a stack. im looking for something that wont break the bank. this is not an all out build. lol..saving that for my next engine, the one I have preciously stowed away.

I ask this because I can get a good deal on a nice turbo but its a T4 footprint. also, replacing the turbine housing with a T3 is not an option, it only comes in a T4.

I wonder if the treadstone cast 347 stainless can be modified to a T4 footprint[:|]

[ray4624]

A stack is a thousand. The full race is 1100. Does not compute.


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[GrapeBandit]

A stack is a thousand. The full race is 1100. Does not compute.


Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkI know what a stack is. im saying if im going to spend a stack, id get a custom 1 off as opposed to the full-race. im not looking to spend that much right now, trying to find a T4 mani for a reasonable price, or a T3 mani that I can get modified.

[ray4624]

Oh I see. Other then that I don't know of any t4 manifolds.


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[Avant Nate]

what do want a T4 for, 7163?
http://www.full-race.com/store/efr-turbo-manifolds/audi-vw-1-8t-longitudinal-t4-efr-twin-scroll-iwg-turbo-manifold.html
http://www.full-race.com/store/images/full/audi-vw-1-8t-longitudinal-t4-efr-twin-scroll-iwg-turbo-manifold-content-1.jpg

[GrapeBandit]

^I thought about it..lol. but its a non-EFR BW I was looking at. smaller than the EFR7163, but for some strange reason its only available in a T4. retarded

[Avant Nate]

^I thought about it..lol. but its a non-EFR BW I was looking at. smaller than the EFR7163, but for some strange reason its only available in a T4. retarded

I don't know the s300 or whatever your looking at, but the the 7163 only being available in t25 and t4 is annoying. Heres another mani, albeit even more expensive.
http://store.agtronicmotorsport.com/product_info.php?products_id=122

Zimbu's not around here much anyomre, but he built his own.

[GrapeBandit]

not sure why ony T24 and T4, pretty gay that they cut out T3 when thats what most ppl run.

I saw the agtronic manifolds a long time ago, they are tits!

[Avant Nate]

Heres Zimbus build thread http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php/406175-Do-I-smell-a-60-1-build-%28pics%29

[GrapeBandit]

Heres Zimbus build thread http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php/406175-Do-I-smell-a-60-1-build-%28pics%29

nice build thread. I wish I could fab up a damn manifold myself

[Avant Nate]

I can't find either a mild steel v-band or T4 collector.
I like the look of this California Jay mani
http://www.wseng.com/a4/pics/engine/rebuild/manifold-1.jpg

[GrapeBandit]

damn, thats a name I haven't heard in a while. lol...

what you mean you cant find a mild steel v-band? they are everywhere lol

[Avant Nate]

damn, thats a name I haven't heard in a while. lol...

what you mean you cant find a mild steel v-band? they are everywhere lol

mild steel V-band merge collector. I found some but there billet and probably not cheap:
http://elmerracing.com/development/merge-collectors

[GrapeBandit]

mild steel V-band merge collector. I found some but there billet and probably not cheap:
http://elmerracing.com/development/merge-collectors
can i ask why you want mild steel?

[GrapeBandit]

since theres little to no information on the intermediate shaft bearings and Techtonics Tuning (http://techtonicstuning.com/main/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2_11_5_400&products_id=1354) seems to be the only place that advertises to have them . . .
ill leave these part numbers here:
Federal Mogul/Sealed Power 1726M
Clevite SH1209S
ACL 2C1209S
Dura-Bond VWG-1
King Bearings CS230BB

[Avant Nate]

since theres little to no information on the intermediate shaft bearings and Techtonics Tuning (http://techtonicstuning.com/main/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2_11_5_400&products_id=1354) seems to be the only place that advertises to have them . . .
ill leave these part numbers here:
Federal Mogul/Sealed Power 1726M
Clevite SH1209S
ACL 2C1209S
Dura-Bond VWG-1
King Bearings CS230BB

So these? http://www.amazon.com/Sealed-Power-1726M-Auxiliary-Bearing/dp/B000C2515K

[GrapeBandit]

So these? http://www.amazon.com/Sealed-Power-1726M-Auxiliary-Bearing/dp/B000C2515K

yes sir. that them!
the funny thing is that you will never see these listed for our cars, hence the reason they are hard to find, since most ppl search "audi vw 1.8t 058 aeb intermediate shaft bearings"

[M-Hood]

I don't know the s300 or whatever your looking at, but the the 7163 only being available in t25 and t4 is annoying. Heres another mani, albeit even more expensive.
http://store.agtronicmotorsport.com/product_info.php?products_id=122

Zimbu's not around here much anyomre, but he built his own.



7163 is only available in T25 and V-band, the 7064 and 7670 are only available in T3 and T4 but Treadstone does offer a T3 4 bolt discharge housing for those 2.



I can't find either a mild steel v-band or T4 collector.
I like the look of this California Jay mani
http://www.wseng.com/a4/pics/engine/rebuild/manifold-1.jpg

Which happens to look pretty much exactly like the manifold I had Full-Race build on my car back in 2004 and still have on my car right now. After my manifold Full-race started making them for the Tial V-band WG's.

BTW there are a few other manifold shops here in Arizona that make manifolds for the A4, IIRC one of them offers to make them in T3, T4 and V-band.

Here this one is offered in a few different flanges. Have meant to stop off at their shop a few times while I in their area.
http://jdlautodesign.net/shop/vw-1-8t-longitudinal-top-mount/

[GrapeBandit]

^those are some nice manifold too.

i was looking at a Borg Warner S251SX that i can get for real cheap, brand new too. its a T4 footprint so i would need a T4 manifold. im not spending $800+ on a manifold right now, so i either need to find a way to modify an existing T3 manifold to T4, or search for a different turbo. you can buy T3>T4 adapter plates, but not sure how well that would work out. lol.

also i have been looking at the compressor map for it and it looks like id have to push the shit out of it to make decent power. id have to push 40psi in order for it to flow 49lb/min. that will be hard to hit 400awhp on it. so with that said, i will probably looking for a different turbo lol

[Avant Nate]

can i ask why you want mild steel?

Because I don't know how to TIG, but I think I could MIG weld one up. Rust isn't a huge issue where I live.

[GrapeBandit]

Because I don't know how to TIG, but I think I could MIG weld one up. Rust isn't a huge issue where I live.
ohh, you are going to make your own mani? lucky bastard. make me one.

if I had mild steel mani, I would just coat it so it doesnt rust. plus, mild steel looks like complete shit, so it would be an added aesthetic bonus [:D]

[GrapeBandit]

whats the ARP part number for the main studs? i have ARP main studs from my last build(06a) and im trying to see if they will work with my current 058 build. i know 058 bolts are M10x65mm and the 06a is M10x80mm, but i get conflicting information as to whether i can use my pre-existing ARP studs from my 06a build

[GrapeBandit]

nobody knows? lol

[M-Hood]

nobody knows? lol

I don't think they can be mixed between blocks, but pretty sure IE could give you a definite answer.

[GrapeBandit]

I don't think they can be mixed between blocks, but pretty sure IE could give you a definite answer.
I dont think so either. ill bring the ARP studs with me when I go to the machine shop on Wednesday and see if theres enough thread on the stud to get the nut all the way down

[GrapeBandit]

just in! ! !
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150217_115048.jpg~original
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150217_115232.jpg~original
Cometic 85mm MLS head gasket
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150217_120306.jpg~original

just awaiting pistons, hope they come in before i leave for work, im getting all antsy LOL

[M-Hood]

Did you check the Cometic head gasket? I had ordered one and it ended up being 82mm. Odd thing is the 82mm and 85mm gasket from Cometic have the exact same part number, not sure why they did that.

[GrapeBandit]

Did you check the Cometic head gasket? I had ordered one and it ended up being 82mm. Odd thing is the 82mm and 85mm gasket from Cometic have the exact same part number, not sure why they did that.lol@same PN. i dont have a micrometer here at my house, its at my parents, thats where i do all my work. have access to the garage and all the tools.
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150217_120252.jpg~original
just put a ruler to the bore to get an estimate. 3 3/8"(85.725mm)[up]

[ray4624]

Where did you order it from? I will need one as well


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[GrapeBandit]

Where did you order it from? I will need one as well


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http://www.ebay.com/itm/Cometic-Head-Gasket-for-VW-AUDI-1-8L-Turbo-85mm-051-Inch-MLS-C4559-051-/281338351822?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item41811290ce&vxp=mtr
I offered 70, tbey counter offered 90. I then offered 80 and told them I can get it for 80 from importperformanceparts.net and that id rather get it from them since importperformanceparts.net shipping is slow. they counter offered 89 shipped, so I accepted it and told them they drive a hard bargain lol

[ray4624]

Lol nice! I love eBay heckling


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[GrapeBandit]

Lol nice! I love eBay lowballing

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fixed

[ray4624]

I don't disagree with the change


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[M-Hood]

lol@same PN. i dont have a micrometer here at my house, its at my parents, thats where i do all my work. have access to the garage and all the tools.
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150217_120252.jpg~original
just put a ruler to the bore to get an estimate. 3 3/8"(85.725mm)[up]

Yeah I don't know what they were thinking and when we asked them about it they seemed confused as to why that was. The same part number can be ordered in 82mm and 85mm, also in different thickness. Just checked their web site and looks like they fixed that issue, the 82mm is still part # C4558 while the 85mm is now C4559. lol

[S4NIK8]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Cometic-Head-Gasket-for-VW-AUDI-1-8L-Turbo-85mm-051-Inch-MLS-C4559-051-/281338351822?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item41811290ce&vxp=mtr
I offered 70, tbey counter offered 90. I then offered 80 and told them I can get it for 80 from importperformanceparts.net and that id rather get it from them since importperformanceparts.net shipping is slow. they counter offered 89 shipped, so I accepted it and told them they drive a hard bargain lol

next time ya gotta ask them to throw in their lunch money too or no deal

[M-Hood]

next time ya gotta ask them to throw in their lunch money too or no deal


Seemed like too much back and forth to save $4.33 lol

[nynoah]

Seemed like too much back and forth to save $4.33 lol

So much that

[GrapeBandit]

Seemed like too much back and forth to save $4.33 lol
well they didnt bugde. its not like I offered 89 when they were asking 94 lol

[GrapeBandit]

well this came while i was at work[wrench]
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150217_231652.jpg~original
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150217_231511.jpg~original
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150217_231448.jpg~original
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150217_231438.jpg~original
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150217_231401.jpg~original
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150217_231101.jpg~original
they have been sitting on their shelf at Supertech since the end of 2010. this was the last set they had. lol

[redline380]

Those look very similar to my powerpaks. 83.5 is kind of ballsy

[GrapeBandit]

Those look very similar to my powerpaks. 83.5 is kind of ballsy
nothing wrong with 83.5mm. brazilian vw dragsters use 83.5mm and boost 50+psi.

[redline380]

nothing wrong with 83.5mm. brazilian vw dragsters use 83.5mm and boost 50+psi.

I know there is nothing wrong with it, but the walls are starting to get kind of thin at that point. The reason I stuck with a small bore is because 1) I got a killer deal on my pistons (from importperforamnceparts.net even) and 2) if I need to overbore someday, I always can. Even though I have a spare bare block just in case lol

Funny thing is the pistons I bought were 81.25mm. Odd size! But they were $320 so I couldn't complain

[GrapeBandit]

I know there is nothing wrong with it, but the walls are starting to get kind of thin at that point. The reason I stuck with a small bore is because 1) I got a killer deal on my pistons (from importperforamnceparts.net even) and 2) if I need to overbore someday, I always can. Even though I have a spare bare block just in case lol

Funny thing is the pistons I bought were 81.25mm. Odd size! But they were $320 so I couldn't complain
we can actually bore our blocks to 84mm. i never saw 84mm pistons, im sure they would have to be custom ordered. im not worried in any way about how thin the wall is between the cylinders, it will hold up just fine. blocks can be had for cheap, so if anything ever were to happen to this block, it wont cost much to source another

[chris164935]

I am curious if anyone has actually run a motor with a bore of 85mm. Or why Cometic makes a head gasket with an 85mm bore...

[GrapeBandit]

I am curious if anyone has actually run a motor with a bore of 85mm. Or why Cometic makes a head gasket with an 85mm bore...
im curious as to why the big bore head gaskets run $90+ and stock size is like $35 lol. only reason I can think of is that ppl who are building these engines are spending thousands of dollars and these companies know it, so they just mark up the price because they know we're spenders. lol...hell, bigger bore pistons are the same price as standard size lol

[S4NIK8]

I am curious if anyone has actually run a motor with a bore of 85mm. Or why Cometic makes a head gasket with an 85mm bore...

I assume at some point someone had a block sonic checked for the cylinder wall thickness and decided it wasn't a good idea? I could've tested mine when it was apart but didn't even think about it since I only went one oversize from stock.

[ray4624]

Supposedly you can run 83mm pistons with a stock head gasket. I believe the 83.5 is to large though.


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[GrapeBandit]

Supposedly you can run 83mm pistons with a stock head gasket. I believe the 83.5 is to large though.


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think you are correct. I have a stock HG I will hit with the micrometer later to doubke check

[GrapeBandit]

so which block breather adapter will fit AEB 058 block? i think ABA, correct me if im wrong.
ABA? (http://nothingleavesstock.com/online-store/#!/Block-breather-plate-for-ABA-2-0L/p/14166950/category=2903030)
early 16V 1.8? (http://nothingleavesstock.com/online-store/#!/Block-breather-plate-for-EARLY-16v-1-8L/p/13912882/category=2903030)
16V 2.0L? (http://nothingleavesstock.com/online-store/#!/Block-breather-plate-for-16v-2-0L/p/13929535/category=2903030)

[xdewaynex]

Both pictures for the ABA and 16v 2.0 look the same, but the smaller picture in both descriptions look like the early 16v 1.8. Not sure why that is.

[GrapeBandit]

Both pictures for the ABA and 16v 2.0 look the same, but the smaller picture in both descriptions look like the early 16v 1.8. Not sure why that is.
bcuz stock photo usage lol

[ray4624]

Sent payment for my block. I gotta catch up on the parts ordering.

What's the advantage of those block greater adapters over the stock piece with the ie or 034 bung


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[xdewaynex]

bcuz stock photo usage lol

False advertisement lol.


Sent payment for my block. I gotta catch up on the parts ordering.

What's the advantage of those block greater adapters over the stock piece with the ie or 034 bung


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Apparently some people have problems with the 034 adapter leaking. Havent noticed mine leaking, but it looks like my whole breather assembly is leaking, which I bought a new gasket for. Might end up ordering that block off and getting a plug for the other hole to the left of it.

[GrapeBandit]

no real advantage besides cleaning up the engine bay in that area

[M-Hood]

Supposedly you can run 83mm pistons with a stock head gasket. I believe the 83.5 is to large though.


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A few years back the Victor Reinz 1.8t head gasket was able to fit up to 83.5mm, which is what I have on my A4 1.8t with 83.5mm JE pistons. But last year I ordered a Victor Reinz 1.8t head gasket and a Elring Klinger 1.8t head gasket and both of them measure at 82.5mm.

[GrapeBandit]

whats the ARP part number for the main studs? i have ARP main studs from my last build(06a) and im trying to see if they will work with my current 058 build. i know 058 bolts are M10x65mm and the 06a is M10x80mm, but i get conflicting information as to whether i can use my pre-existing ARP studs from my 06a build


I don't think they can be mixed between blocks, but pretty sure IE could give you a definite answer.
well I just came back from the machine shop where my block is at, I had to drop off my pistons. I brought a main cap and 2 ARP main studs/nuts that I ran in my 06a block. guess what, they work fine.

so the myth saying they arent interchangeable and that the 06a studs are too long for the nut to tighten down enough on the threads has been debunked.

EDIT: ARP main studs I have are 84.1375mm tall

[chris164935]

well I just came back from the machine shop where my block is at, I had to drop off my pistons. I brought a main cap and 2 ARP main studs/nuts that I ran in my 06a block. guess what, they work fine.

so the myth saying they arent interchangeable and that the 06a studs are too long for the nut to tighten down enough on the threads has been debunked.
But, perhaps the clamping forces are different? There might be other reasons to use different ones, but I'm not much of an expert of the subject.

As for head gaskets, I run the 83mm gasket that, if I remember correctly, comes from Europe. Also not much of an expert in this area, but I suppose you don't want too much of the head gasket in the combustion chamber, but it seems (just an observation from the longevity of Mike's car) that 1mm of "protrusion" is fine.

[GrapeBandit]

clamping forces are different? lol
the main stud kits are made from the same 8740 chrome moly material.




200,000psi 10mm
Following the manufacturers recommended torque sequence tighten the nuts in three equal steps to 60 ft lbs with ARP ULTRA-TORQUE FASTENER ASSEMBLY LUBRICANT.
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150218_214254.jpg

[M-Hood]

well I just came back from the machine shop where my block is at, I had to drop off my pistons. I brought a main cap and 2 ARP main studs/nuts that I ran in my 06a block. guess what, they work fine.

so the myth saying they arent interchangeable and that the 06a studs are too long for the nut to tighten down enough on the threads has been debunked.

EDIT: ARP main studs I have are 84.1375mm tall


I guess what I would want to know is the measurement from the block end of both styles of studs to the start of the threads where the nut goes. Last thing you want to end up with is a nut that bottoms out and isn't actually putting the same amount of force on the main caps as it is being torqued down to. I guess a side by side comparison would be nice.

[GrapeBandit]

I guess what I would want to know is the measurement from the block end of both styles of studs to the start of the threads where the nut goes. Last thing you want to end up with is a nut that bottoms out and isn't actually putting the same amount of force on the main caps as it is being torqued down to. I guess a side by side comparison would be nice.
the washer/nut does not reach the bottom of the threads when screwing down, which was my main concern since that what I read online. thats the reason ppl say you couldnt use 06a studs, is that the 06a studs are too long and that theres not enough thread and the nut will bottom out the threads. complete bullshit which was probably made up by some vendor(s) so ppl go out and spend more money. you know some vendors act like shit is top secret and are scared to give you part numbers sometimes, but then come on the boards and act like "they are all about doing things for the community" **COUGH, COUGH, ISSAM**.
this is why you cant believe everything your read on the Internet! first hand experience> internet babble

[M-Hood]

the washer/nut does not reach the bottom of the threads when screwing down, which was my main concern since that what I read online. thats the reason ppl say you couldnt use 06a studs, is that the 06a studs are too long and that theres not enough thread and the nut will bottom out the threads. complete bullshit which was probably made up by some vendor(s) so ppl go out and spend more money. you know some vendors act like shit is top secret and are scared to give you part numbers sometimes, but then come on the boards and act like "they are all about doing things for the community" **COUGH, COUGH, ISSAM**.
this is why you cant believe everything your read on the Internet! first hand experience> internet babble


You guys removed the nut after torquing it down so that the stud went all the way in? I have ordered both for 058 and 06A many times, just never opened them up to compare them side by side or take measurements.

[GrapeBandit]

You guys removed the nut after torquing it down so that the stud went all the way in? I have ordered both for 058 and 06A many times, just never opened them up to compare them side by side or take measurements.
I didnt torque it down. I hand tightened the studs and the nuts, but there was like 1/4" of thread still buried inside the top of the main cap. not a chance in hell that the nuts will ever bottom out to the last thread

[GrapeBandit]

so which block breather adapter will fit AEB 058 block? i think ABA, correct me if im wrong.
ABA? (http://nothingleavesstock.com/online-store/#!/Block-breather-plate-for-ABA-2-0L/p/14166950/category=2903030)
early 16V 1.8? (http://nothingleavesstock.com/online-store/#!/Block-breather-plate-for-EARLY-16v-1-8L/p/13912882/category=2903030)
16V 2.0L? (http://nothingleavesstock.com/online-store/#!/Block-breather-plate-for-16v-2-0L/p/13929535/category=2903030)
anyone?

also, what is the length of the stock turbo>cat studs?

[Avant Nate]

40mm long, size 10 and a 1.5 pitch thread.
from http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php/36444-Update-part-3-DNP-exhaust-manifold-studs

[GrapeBandit]

40mm long, size 10 and a 1.5 pitch thread.
from http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php/36444-Update-part-3-DNP-exhaust-manifold-studs
was just about to post, google says its a 28mm length, but that cant be right
https://www.google.com/search?q=N0445203&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8

im think im getting step studs(10mm>8mm), its almost impossible for me to get a 14mm thin wall socket on these to tighten(due to my custom exhaust). now i can run a copper nut with a hex head of my choice, anywhere from 10mm to 13mm hex

[GrapeBandit]

more stuff[cool]
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150218_213323.jpg~original
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150218_213557.jpg~original
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150218_214910.jpg~original
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150221_193828.jpg~original
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150222_213923.jpg~original
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150227_111850.jpg~original

IM shaft just came in a few minutes ago from FFE. Oil pump gear reduced/chamfered, smoothed and balanced.
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150227_111923.jpg~original
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150227_112006.jpg~original
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150227_111958.jpg~original
. . .and a temporary manifold until i go BT[:D]
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20141215_131309.jpg~original
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20141215_131314.jpg~original
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20141215_131324_1.jpg~original
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20141215_131327.jpg~original
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20141215_131345.jpg~original

[S4NIK8]

I have one of those manifolds sitting on the shelf, been there for a couple years.

[GrapeBandit]

I have one of those manifolds sitting on the shelf, been there for a couple years.
from your name, I thought you had an S4. lol. guess you have or had a 1.8t too?

[ray4624]

according to his "garage" he has both....and an rs6


Good to see the parts piling up!

[Seerlah]

Pretty sure he has both.

Do yourself a favor and don't run that coolant flange. Had a couple leak on me in the past. You can also diy dowel pin your crank gear. Know a few who did it. You drill, ream, and place in dowel pin. You will also need to shave the washer section of an old crank bolt off to use for drilling. I'll text a friend for specs he used (ie dowel pin size and shear strength). I do remember he said to ream the crank with gear removed. Reamer would snag and basically get stuck if done with gear bolted to crank. I was going to go this route but opted for the IE press fit gear instead.

[ray4624]

to bad they do not exist for the 058

[S4NIK8]

from your name, I thought you had an S4. lol. guess you have or had a 1.8t too?

I like variety, so theres a little bit of everything. But yes I have a B5 1.8t car in the mix and yes an RS6 is in there (currently getting an 01E)

[ray4624]

6 speed rs6....do want

[GrapeBandit]

Pretty sure he has both.

Do yourself a favor and don't run that coolant flange. Had a couple leak on me in the past. You can also diy dowel pin your crank gear. Know a few who did it. You drill, ream, and place in dowel pin. You will also need to shave the washer section of an old crank bolt off to use for drilling. I'll text a friend for specs he used (ie dowel pin size and shear strength). I do remember he said to ream the crank with gear removed. Reamer would snag and basically get stuck if done with gear bolted to crank. I was going to go this route but opted for the IE press fit gear instead.
I will use that coolant flange, always had them on my cars and they never failed me(I know, lucky guy[:p]).

Thanks for trying to get me the bit sizes to drill & ream, but I already ordered my drill bit and reamer today[up]


to bad they do not exist for the 058
thats why you make your own kit, will save you about $100 instead of the overpriced IE one


I like variety, so theres a little bit of everything. But yes I have a B5 1.8t car in the mix and yes an RS6 is in there (currently getting an 01E)
variety is the key to happiness my friend[:)] same applies when it comes to girls[evilsmile]


6 speed rs6....do want
tell me about it

[ray4624]

ill be making my own dowel crank gear as well.
Let me know what you use for parts.

[coolgraymemo]

. . .and a temporary manifold until i go BT[:D]
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20141215_131309.jpg~original
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20141215_131314.jpg~original
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20141215_131324_1.jpg~original
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20141215_131327.jpg~original
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20141215_131345.jpg~original

inb4 GrapeBandit shits on this thread because of the eBay manifold lol




oh wait.

[GrapeBandit]

ill be making my own dowel crank gear as well.
Let me know what you use for parts.
ill link the drill bit and reamer I ordered tomorrow. going to bed, I have work early in the morning.
also ill be selling the 7200lb sear strength dowel pins on the cheap when they come in, I had to buy a bag of 100 to place my order lol


inb4 GrapeBandit shits on this thread because of the eBay manifold lol




oh wait.
lol. I had this thing sitting for a few months already, might as well use it. I didnt get it off ebay, I got it off CL for half the price[:D]A1 A2 German runs the same manifold with no issues, so thats why I scooped it up. if it doesnt work out, ill put the stock one back on, no big deal.

[GrapeBandit]

Let me know what you use for parts.
#16 drill bit(black oxide, high speed steel).
0.1870" dowel pin chucking reamer(high speed steel).
3/16"(0.1875") x 1.0" 7200lb double shear dowel pins(alloy steel).

ill sell some pins if anyone wants them so they dont have to buy 50 or 100 at a time.

[Seerlah]

Forgot to say, order amsoil engine assembly lube same time you pick up break in oil if going that route. Quality stuff.

[GrapeBandit]

Forgot to say, order amsoil engine assembly lube same time you pick up break in oil if going that route. Quality stuff.
too late, I already purchased the Permatex Ultra Slick Assembly lube. Lucas High Zinc Break-in Oil came in today.

are you an Amsoil shareholder[confused][:D]

[Seerlah]

Spun a bearing before. Only two culprits. The same lube you will be using or cheap mahle bearings. Was told afterwards that permatex does not like sitting more than a few days tops. When mine went it was just one rod bearing. But it was enough to trash both that one rod and the crankshaft.

I used to run nothing but amsoil, engine oil and all. But it just got too expensive. I'll be going back to it later. Was even recommended by one of their reps on bitog to run their diesel oil in my app over the euro blend.

[GrapeBandit]

Spun a bearing before. Only two culprits. The same lube you will be using or cheap mahle bearings. Was told afterwards that permatex does not like sitting more than a few days tops. When mine went it was just one rod bearing. But it was enough to trash both that one rod and the crankshaft.

I used to run nothing but amsoil, engine oil and all. But it just got too expensive. I'll be going back to it later. Was even recommended by one of their reps on bitog to run their diesel oil in my app over the euro blend.
well im going to assemble the engine and run it within a day or two. it wont be sitting.

I used this combo last time, Permatex and the "cheap mahle" bearings. disassembled the engine after 35,000 and all the bearings were new. im going off first hand experience, not hear say and/or internet babble.

[Seerlah]

I'm also telling you from personal experience. Guess luck of the draw.

[GrapeBandit]

^guess only time will tell. im not scared though[;)]

[GrapeBandit]

jesus christ these wrist pins are impossible to get through my piston and rod at the same time. They fit perfectly in the piston without the rod, they need excessive force to get through just the rod without connecting it to the piston, but the pin wont go through both the piston and rod[headbang]

I rounded off the edges the bore with sandpaper of the small rod end so there are no sharp edges. god damn SCAT rods. I think next I will freeze wrist pins to see if that helps any.

I didnt have this problem with my pauter rods last time, but I guess thats the difference between $800 rods and $300 rods

[chris164935]

I had SCAT rods before and never had any issues with the wrist pins, even after they had been used. Are the wrist pins straight? Assembly lube being used? Measured and checked the bores of the rods?

[S4NIK8]

Get those rods honed for the pins to fit right or you're going to have a bad time

[GrapeBandit]

I had SCAT rods before and never had any issues with the wrist pins, even after they had been used. Are the wrist pins straight? Assembly lube being used? Measured and checked the bores of the rods?
the wrist pins are as straight as my straight edge.
using assembly lube.
Im at home and dont have my calipers here, they are at my parents garage where I do all my work so I haven't checked them yet. also, not sure calipers are the most accurate to measure the bore anyway

Get those rods honed for the pins to fit right or you're going to have a bad time
yup, my exact thoughts. thats the price you have to pay for going cheap rods. save money here, then spend money there lol

[viceprp]

Assembly lube. I had no trouble at all.

Be sure to put your main bearings in correct. Double groove goes in #4.

[GrapeBandit]

Be sure to put your main bearings in correct. Double groove goes in #4.
ok, so double groove on the #4 wrist pin[wrench]

[viceprp]

Wait. What.

Main bearings...!

[GrapeBandit]

Wait. What.

Main bearings...!
jokes man, figured id throw that in since I was talking about rods/wrist pins/pistons and you came from right field talking about main bearings. . .im not full retard, YET! ! ![>_<]

[Seerlah]

Line hone would be best with rod and pin, but not necessary. You can use "fine" emery cloth to take some material off the wristpin bore. But...you have to be very meticulous here because you can take material off, but you can't add any. If too much is taken off, rod is basically trash. I did this with 2 of my Brute rods with AEB pistons on my current block. You ONLY want to take enough off to the point the pin goes through and can move freely. ANY amount of play, you did it wrong and rod is trash.

But having the pin move freely is incredibly important. The friction heat would be too much at the rotational speed they will see, and no oil squirter would be able to keep those temps down. Plus if you have rifle drilled rods, it makes them basically useless (what I have). Next thing you know, pin will snap and your block will be trashed. Happened to a friend of mine.

[GrapeBandit]

Line hone would be best with rod and pin, but not necessary. You can use "fine" emery cloth to take some material off the wristpin bore. But...you have to be very meticulous here because you can take material off, but you can't add any. If too much is taken off, rod is basically trash. I did this with 2 of my Brute rods with AEB pistons on my current block. You ONLY want to take enough off to the point the pin goes through and can move freely. ANY amount of play, you did it wrong and rod is trash.

But having the pin move freely is incredibly important. The friction heat would be too much at the rotational speed they will see, and no oil squirter would be able to keep those temps down. Plus if you have rifle drilled rods, it makes them basically useless (what I have). Next thing you know, pin will snap and your block will be trashed. Happened to a friend of mine.
my best bet would be to drop the pins and rods at the machine shop if i cant get the emery cloth to work. quite frankly, i dont have to time to dick around and may just take the easy way out and drop them at my machine shop for a guaranteed fit. my rods are not rifle drilled, as they are pretty pointless.

i see you have the same misconception as most do when it comes to free-floating wrist pins. i guess the term free-floating is misleading as the rod is not supposed rotate around the wrist pin. the rod is supposed to be snug on the wrist pin holding it still, and the rotating part of the wrist pin is done within the piston wrist pin journals(and the outer most edges of the wrist pin(why rifle drill is pointless). some machine shops will have a rod heater with a thermostat and possibly dry ice for the pins to get these installed

[Seerlah]

If you think that's the case, have fun lining your rod to your crank journal once pistons are in the cylinders. I was told that you want the pin to be able to go through the hole without requiring something like a dowel and mallet to beat it in. Emery cloth worked fine for me.

[GrapeBandit]

I said its supposed to be a tight fit, not tight enough to use a hammer to get it through though lol

I will try emery cloth if/when I have time. I may just send it straight to the machinist though

[Seerlah]

I took snug as in it won't budge without decent to moderate force.

[M-Hood]

I haven't heard of any other 1.8t owners having problems with their Scat rods. Any chance the Scat rods you bought aren't actually real Scat rods?

[GrapeBandit]

I haven't heard of any other 1.8t owners having problems with their Scat rods. Any chance the Scat rods you bought aren't actually real Scat rods?

I havent heard of any other ppl having issues either, thats why I went with them. unless Scat is drop shipping fake rods from their own facility in California, then these are real. they dont say Scat on them anywhere though, juat on th3 rod bolts.

EDIT: Either the Scat rod small end is undersized, or the Supertech wrist pins are oversized. I can send the rods back, but theres no guarantee that the wrist pins will fit the new set. I dont really have time to wait for shipping back and forth, so I may just drop the rods and wrist pins off to get them machined properly.

[GrapeBandit]

machine shop just mic' out the wrist pins, they are 0.787"(19.9898mm). so we know what part is the culpirt here----> Scat

[B5A4coastie]

I'll jump on the "I didn't have any issues with SCAT rods" train. Sound's like you have some solid grounds for SCAT to send you a shipping label and rush you out some new ones.

[GrapeBandit]

I'll jump on the "I didn't have any issues with SCAT rods" train. Sound's like you have some solid grounds for SCAT to send you a shipping label and rush you out some new ones.

im not going to bother. I dont have time to wait. dropped the rods and wrist pins off at the machine shop. also, for some strange reason, the side of the scat box says 0.787 wrist pin hole size. wtf, thats smaller than 20mm[headbang] so the next set will be the same.

[M-Hood]

im not going to bother. I dont have time to wait. dropped the rods and wrist pins off at the machine shop. also, for some strange reason, the side of the scat box says 0.787 wrist pin hole size. wtf, thats smaller than 20mm[headbang] so the next set will be the same.

yeah .787" is correct since that is 19.9898mm which is what every 1.8t owner gets when ordering the Scat 1.8t rod. That is what size all of their rods come with for a 20mm wrist pin.
http://scatenterprises.com/docs/sport-compact-pdf.html

[GrapeBandit]

yeah .787" is correct since that is 19.9898mm which is what every 1.8t owner gets when ordering the Scat 1.8t rod. That is what size all of their rods come with for a 20mm wrist pin.
http://scatenterprises.com/docs/sport-compact-pdf.html

well thats horse shit. how the fuck do they expect a 20mm pin to go through a hole smaller than 20mm[headbang]
just checked JE Pistons website and their wrist pins are also 0.787. so not sure how they would fit into a 0.787 hole either. these Scat rods are bored to the wrong size to begin with. didnt have this problem with Pauter rods.

reminds me of the blocks children play with in pre-school. round goes into round hole, square goes into square hole, and 2" rounds go into 2" round holes not the 1 1/2" holes[facepalm]

[ray4624]

Buy cheap rods they said. >.<


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[M-Hood]

well thats horse shit. how the fuck do they expect a 20mm pin to go through a hole smaller than 20mm[headbang]
just checked JE Pistons website and their wrist pins are also 0.787. so not sure how they would fit into a 0.787 hole either. these Scat rods are bored to the wrong size to begin with. didnt have this problem with Pauter rods.

reminds me of the blocks children play with in pre-school. round goes into round hole, square goes into square hole, and 2" rounds go into 2" round holes not the 1 1/2" holes[facepalm]

Just because a wrist pin is called 20mm doesn't mean it is exactly 20mm, not like they are going to say your car comes stock with a 19.9898mm wrist pin. See the problem is your not actually playing with an actual 20mm wrist pin and hole. lol

[Seerlah]

Fwiw, my brute rods fit well. I just personally didn't like how 2 pins fit. Other 2 is how I wanted all 4. So, hit them up with emery cloth. And like a said before, I have a friend who threw a rod from a wristpin overheating and snapping. It happens. What sucks is the cost to correct something like that. He did it, but damn sure he didn't like doing it. His car rapes mine. Trying to get to his status [drive]. He runs like 35-40 psi on meth with a gtx3071r. Over 400whp.

[GrapeBandit]

Buy cheap rods they said. >.<


. . .it will be fun they said
[:D]

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Just because a wrist pin is called 20mm doesn't mean it is exactly 20mm, not like they are going to say your car comes stock with a 19.9898mm wrist pin. See the problem is your not actually playing with an actual 20mm wrist pin and hole. lol
I know tbey arent exactly 20mm, but you would "think" Scat has the knowledge of what companies machine their wrist pins to so they dont make them too small like they do[facepalm]

[M-Hood]

I know tbey arent exactly 20mm, but you would "think" Scat has the knowledge of what companies machine their wrist pins to so they dont make them too small like they do[facepalm]

Did you check the exact size of the opening on the Scat rods with a caliper? I just find it odd that you had an issue with it and yet I haven't seen any other 1.8t owner that is running Scat rods have an issue. But then like I asked before, how do we know those are actually real Scat rods and not some knockoff rod with the Scat name on it. One of the reasons I tend to only buy from real manufacture dealers/distributors that I know and trust.

[GrapeBandit]

Did you check the exact size of the opening on the Scat rods with a caliper? I just find it odd that you had an issue with it and yet I haven't seen any other 1.8t owner that is running Scat rods have an issue. But then like I asked before, how do we know those are actually real Scat rods and not some knockoff rod with the Scat name on it. One of the reasons I tend to only buy from real manufacture dealers/distributors that I know and trust.

I answered your question earlier. tbey were dropped shipped directly from Scat bought from a reputable 3rd party company. how can you find it odd that I have an issue? you are telling me Scat's quality control is 100% and that nothing can slip by? no company has 100% quality control so lets get real.

I had the rods mic'd out. they are the same size as the wrist pins[facepalm] so tell me, why would they make the small rod end the same size as the wrist pins?

also, its not uncommon to have to get rods machined to fit the pins. my case isnt the first time in history this happened! ! !

EDIT: Actually I think the rods were 0.687, either way though, they were not bored correctly to fit 0.787 wrist pins

[Urtorsen]

I got scat rods from someplace when I was building the block, they weren't in the 'scat' logo'd sealed bags and they didn't have the black stamp/print on each rod like scat rods are meant to, there was something else about the finish that wasn't right but it's years ago so I don't remember exactly.
I got them cheap too, but when I learned about the stamp that was supposed to be there I returned them, when I got them from ringer racing they had the stamp and scat bags.
Just thought I'd share even though it's useless info at this stage.

[Urtorsen]

Nice build taking place btw!! Everytime I see 2.0 threads like this I get the itch for taking that nice 106k block in storage and throwing money at it lol.

[chris164935]

I've used 2 different brands of wrist pins with the SCAT rods that I used to have (one was JE and currently they are in a motor with OEM wrist pins, still running 2 years later). Am I surprised that you probably got some that might not be 100%? A little. But, I certainly wouldn't make such a stink about, especially not for the price when the possible fixes are simple (taking it to the machine shop like you have or returning them for another set).

In any case, at this point, you might as well have the machine shop check other measurements as well, such as the big bore end, big end and small end weights, etc.

[GrapeBandit]

I got scat rods from someplace when I was building the block, they weren't in the 'scat' logo'd sealed bags and they didn't have the black stamp/print on each rod like scat rods are meant to, there was something else about the finish that wasn't right but it's years ago so I don't remember exactly.
I got them cheap too, but when I learned about the stamp that was supposed to be there I returned them, when I got them from ringer racing they had the stamp and scat bags.
Just thought I'd share even though it's useless info at this stage.
not all scat rods have the black stamp on them or even the logo on the bag, so you cant go by that.


Nice build taking place btw!! Everytime I see 2.0 threads like this I get the itch for taking that nice 106k block in storage and throwing money at it lol.
THANKS! ! ! take your engine and slowly accumulate parts for it, then this way it wont hurt the pocket as much since its not all at once


Am I surprised that you probably got some that might not be 100%? A little. But, I certainly wouldn't make such a stink about, especially not for the price when the possible fixes are simple (taking it to the machine shop like you have or returning them for another set).

In any case, at this point, you might as well have the machine shop check other measurements as well, such as the big bore end, big end and small end weights, etc.
you are surprised that Scat like all other companies in the world do not have 100% quality control[facepalm] something like that is ridiculous to assume. hell, even commercial airlines or even military planes/helicopters crash once in a while from a bad part, and their standards are way more important than a god damn connecting rod sold to the public.

it just sucks that i happened to get the bum set of rods and its delaying my process and costing me more money[down] just my luck of the draw, just like how my key way on the crank timing gear sheared[mad]

[GrapeBandit]

got off the phone with Eddy at Scat and they did indeed ship my rods. he said they no longer have Scat printed on the sealed bags the rods come on or the black Scat logo on the rods. so if anyone gets them with a printed bag or black Scat stamp on the rods, they are old stock that has been sold to distributers.

he said the specs they get machined to are between 0.7883-0.7884. obviously not the case in my situation since my 0.787 wrist pins dont go through them. I dont have time to send rods back and wait for another set to be shipped, so they will get line honed to match my wrist pins, all part of blue-printing. my guy said $20 which is worth it to me since it will cut time down considerably

[B5A4coastie]

$20 which is worth it to me since it will cut time down considerably

No question there, glad it's a simple/cheap fix.

[GrapeBandit]

No question there, glad it's a simple/cheap fix.

yup, so when its all said and done ill have $335(including shipping) invested into authentic Scat rods[cool]

[xdewaynex]

Glad youre getting it sorted out all for $20. Hell Id rather spend the $20 to have them machined locally than bother sending them back for another set when not even in a hurry, lol.

[Urtorsen]

.THANKS! ! ! take your engine and slowly accumulate parts for it, then this way it wont hurt the pocket as much since its not all at once

Meh, It's throw another grand plus change into the bottom end and hours of work and all the Jazz, or just stick with what I have, and save that money for another build I have in mind..... a 5cyl older model audi like a cq or urs where results are far better for the money invested imo.
I'm even thinking of downsizing the turbine side of this 5156 to a .48........with the ported aeb head, 56 ex and .63ar housing its late spooling for a fun daily, and it's too laggy between shifts for my liking even pushing it, changing the housing is the easiest and cheapest route right now. That plus anti-lag and it should be a little more entertaining.
It was meant to be a 5152 but comp put an end to that 52 wheel.
Sorry bout the thread jack, just venting.....maybe a lil bit jelly of that 2.0 of yours too lmao

[GrapeBandit]

Glad youre getting it sorted out all for $20. Hell Id rather spend the $20 to have them machined locally than bother sending them back for another set when not even in a hurry, lol.
im glad too. i still have less money into these rods than any of the so-called community sponsors and/or audi/vw companies can offer them for[up]


Meh, It's throw another grand plus change into the bottom end and hours of work and all the Jazz, or just stick with what I have, and save that money for another build I have in mind..... a 5cyl older model audi like a cq or urs where results are far better for the money invested imo.
I'm even thinking of downsizing the turbine side of this 5156 to a .48........with the ported aeb head, 56 ex and .63ar housing its late spooling for a fun daily, and it's too laggy between shifts for my liking even pushing it, changing the housing is the easiest and cheapest route right now. That plus anti-lag and it should be a little more entertaining.
It was meant to be a 5152 but comp put an end to that 52 wheel.
Sorry bout the thread jack, just venting.....maybe a lil bit jelly of that 2.0 of yours too lmao
i always wanted to throw a 5cyl into a b5, that would be sweet.

not sure why you have a ported aeb head with that turbo. stock one flows hell of a lot. your slow spool can be directly related to that. sure you have air flow, but no velocity.

[Crispy222]

oh, gotcha. I can drill, ream, and dowel pin my crank for way cheaper than that. hell, you could bring it to a machine shop and habe it done for less than $200. I think thats ridiculously priced[headbang]

I dowel pinned my crank gear with (2) 1/4x1.0" pins. Drilled to C letter drill size (.242) and straight reamer of 0.248. Tapped in the pins lightly with a small hammer.
http://i63.photobucket.com/albums/h146/Crispy222/Engine/IMG_20110703_211115_zpsd842b6f4.jpg

[GrapeBandit]

^1/4" is too big, but good job none the less

[BaseDrifter]

How do you remove the dowel pins if you need to replace the crankshaft seal or crankcase cover gasket?

[Crispy222]

Bearing separator
http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41H-KL6cdfL._SY300_.jpg

EDIT: Not enough clearance behind the pulley for standard jaw puller

[Seerlah]

You could also use a 3 jaw puller. Get a long enough bolt to stick into the crank hole that will bottom out, and use that for leverage.

[RENOxDECEPTION]

im not near any of those. im about 1 hr north of Tampa, and about 1 1/2hr west of Orlando

Jesus christ grapebandit, we could have been friends in 2013 when I lived in Inverness for 6 months.

anyway, I like this thread, makes me want to buy stuff.

[GrapeBandit]

Jesus christ grapebandit, we could have been friends in 2013 when I lived in Inverness for 6 months.

anyway, I like this thread, makes me want to buy stuff.
im only 10 to 15mins from Inverness, depending on what part of Inverness we are talking about. im down hwy44 closer to hwy 19. we could havebeen friends, but I didnt move here until the beginning of the summer 2014[:D]

[GrapeBandit]

update on the rods for all you Scat fanboi's who swear(like the guys at Scat) that they can achieve 100% quality control: my machine shop mic'd out my Supertech wrist pins and Scat small rod ends with 3 different micrometers. all the Supertech wrist pins are exactly 0.787". the small rods ends are 0.787, far from what Eddy@Scat said they were machined to: 0.7883"/0.7884". no wonder the wrist pins didnt go through the rods[facepalm]

my machinist got it all worked out now, honed the small rod ends 0.0013" over the wrist pin size. what a coincidence, that equals 0.7883", what they should have originally been[wrench]
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150306_175237.jpg~original

more stuff came in[up]
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150301_103055.jpg~original
Highly sought after M8x1.25 copper nuts w/10mm hex to connect the exhaust manifold to head and the turbo to down pipe w/use of M10x1.5>M8x1.25 step studs
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150302_212427.jpg~original
bronze valve guides and valve stem seals
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150304_131431.jpg~original
block breather adapter to get rid of that stock plastic piece of shit[:D]
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150306_132809.jpg~original
my HSS reamer, HSS drill bits, and 100 alloy steel 3/16" dowel pins w/7200lb double sheer strength.
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150306_174547.jpg~original
i will probably have a few drill bits and dowels pins for sale on the cheap since i wont be using all of them[cool]

[xdewaynex]

Does that breather block off plate have a groove on the back side of it for the gasket, or is machined flat? Which one need you end up going with anyways?

[GrapeBandit]

Does that breather block off plate have a groove on the back side of it for the gasket, or is machined flat? Which one need you end up going with anyways?
sure does have a groove fr the gasket
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150306_132836.jpg~original
i went with this one (http://nothingleavesstock.com/online-store/#!/Block-breather-plate-for-ABA-2-0L/p/14166950/category=2903030), it fits all 058 blocks

[xdewaynex]

Awesome. I was curious of how it would seal if it didnt have the gasket groove, but no worries now.

[GrapeBandit]

Awesome. I was curious of how it would seal if it didnt have the gasket groove, but no worries now.
for things that dont have gaskets, you can use an anaerobic flange sealant. it works wonders and we use it all the time on commercial diesel trucks

[RENOxDECEPTION]

There's not shit to do there, went boating a few times. As a summer job I worked at the TJmaxx just to pay for gas and groceries (and to hunt for dem buns) while I was living with my brother. That's the least paying job I've ever had.

I know two deputies from the Citrus County Sherrifs dept.

https://scontent.cdninstagram.com/hphotos-xfp1/outbound-distilleryimage1/t0.0-17/OBPTH/28235864d3ae11e2b44322000a1f92df_7.jpg

are you going to plastigauge everything to make sure tolerances are correct?

Can't wait to see more. Also interested in how you're going to overcome the oil squirter clearance.

[GrapeBandit]

^you arent kidding about shit to do. its country as hell here. im used to the jersey city life where there are actually more ppl than wild animals, concrete, and sidewalks haha.

it took me a few months to find a job when I moved own here, but I was lucky to land a decent paying job as a diesel mechanic for local company, so I cant complain about that. everything else, well. . . . mmehhh, kinda blows, totally opposite from what I am used to.

does your brother still live down here? is he a car enthusiast?

[RENOxDECEPTION]

Yes he still lives there, off highway 581, he likes audi's but doesn't own one, owns like 3 trucks a fishing boat, and jetskis though.

[GrapeBandit]

Yes he still lives there, off highway 581, he likes audi's but doesn't own one, owns like 3 trucks a fishing boat, and jetskis though.
sounds like most ppl down here, diesel pickup trucks and fishing boats lol. im not about that life lol

[ray4624]

update on the rods for all you Scat fanboi's who swear(like the guys at Scat) that they can achieve 100% quality control: my machine shop mic'd out my Supertech wrist pins and Scat small rod ends with 3 different micrometers. all the Supertech wrist pins are exactly 0.787". the small rods ends are 0.787, far from what Eddy@Scat said they were machined to: 0.7883"/0.7884". no wonder the wrist pins didnt go through the rods[facepalm]

my machinist got it all worked out now, honed the small rod ends 0.0013" over the wrist pin size. what a coincidence, that equals 0.7883", what they should have originally been[wrench]
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150306_175237.jpg~original

more stuff came in[up]
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150301_103055.jpg~original
Highly sought after M8x1.25 copper nuts w/10mm hex to connect the exhaust manifold to head and the turbo to down pipe w/use of M10x1.5>M8x1.25 step studs
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150302_212427.jpg~original
bronze valve guides and valve stem seals
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150304_131431.jpg~original
block breather adapter to get rid of that stock plastic piece of shit[:D]
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150306_132809.jpg~original
my HSS reamer, HSS drill bits, and 100 alloy steel 3/16" dowel pins w/7200lb double sheer strength.
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/m1racing_2009/Casa%20b5/20_20_BUILD/20150306_174547.jpg~original
i will probably have a few drill bits and dowels pins for sale on the cheap since i wont be using all of them[cool]

dibs on extra doweling parts :)