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View Full Version : Did i screw up by getting an ATW



Barf Hat
01-14-2015, 01:00 PM
It seems like i got the bastard child of engines[confused]. Should i even do anything with this car or should i try to find an AWM? What is your preference

redline380
01-14-2015, 01:15 PM
Nothing wrong with ATW. AWM is better from about every single aspect, but not like you need to go and buy another car. With a chip, AEB, ATW, and AWM are all the same speed. It really depends on what you want to do in the long run, but ATW is just fine.

MetalMan
01-14-2015, 01:24 PM
ATW can also be converted to wideband (like AWM) relatively easily, which opens up tuning options quite a bit. It would be more work to swap in the VVT components found on the AWM, but this isn't a necessity.

Avant Nate
01-14-2015, 01:27 PM
What are your plans? If it were me, I'd do the wide band swap before any major tuning.

Barf Hat
01-14-2015, 01:43 PM
My plan in the near future is to upgrade to a K04. I did the timing belt and noticed quite a bit of oil in my inter cooler lines, more than I'm comfortable seeing anyway. The wide band just helps out with tuning right? I may hold off on that swap until I get at least a base map. but seeing as how its a three hour drive to PHX or Sand Diego from where I'm at that might not be for a while.
Isn't the VVC on AWMs just for start up emisions?

MetalMan
01-14-2015, 02:04 PM
My plan in the near future is to upgrade to a K04. I did the timing belt and noticed quite a bit of oil in my inter cooler lines, more than I'm comfortable seeing anyway. The wide band just helps out with tuning right? I may hold off on that swap until I get at least a base map. but seeing as how its a three hour drive to PHX or Sand Diego from where I'm at that might not be for a while.
Isn't the VVC on AWMs just for start up emisions?

Depending on your tuner, if you started with an AWM tune and wanted to upgrade to a bigger turbo tune later (also for AWM), then there may only be an "upgrade" fee instead of paying for a whole new tune for AWM.
Also there are MANY more tuners out there for AWM than ATW, not to mention the tunes are better due to wideband.
Even just on a stock AWM ECU you'll get more power out of the car than a stock ATW ECU because stock AWM boost is 10-11 psi and stock ATW boost is 7-8 psi.

To convert you need:
-AWM ECU (sometimes you can buy a used ECU with a tune already on it)
-wideband conversion harness
-AWM fuel injectors
-AWM MAF (I think)
-AWM wideband O2 sensor
-VVT components if desired

VVT is variable valve timing. I believe Audi's implementation on the 1.8T mostly helps with increasing lower-RPM power output.
You may be thinking of SAI (Secondary Air Injection, which the ATW also has) which activates for a short time period at a cold start, and adds air to the exhaust to reduce emissions by more quickly warming up the catalytic converter.

Barf Hat
01-14-2015, 02:23 PM
Will my turbo be safe on this tune or would an upgrade be almost mandatory

bleach
01-14-2015, 03:23 PM
I have an APU engine ,it's an european engine code but is very similar to your engine and ecu it's a ME7.1 ,i tune my ecu myself .
it's not a bad child ,and you don't need to convert your harness,after market afr gauge exist, find just a good tuner ...

ray4624
01-14-2015, 03:25 PM
i dont understand the need for everyone to have a wideband capable car.
many people make great numbers on AEBs etc without wideband. I dont really see the need for it unless i was going with a serious build.
I would worry about a million other things on the car before i would swap it to wideband.

bleach
01-14-2015, 03:27 PM
i dont understand the need for everyone to have a wideband capable car.
many people make great numbers on AEBs etc without wideband. I dont really see the need for it unless i was going with a serious build.
I would worry about a million other things on the car before i would swap it to wideband.
X2

ray4624
01-14-2015, 03:35 PM
http://www.unitedmotorsport.net/performance-software/audi-performance-software/audi-00-01-a4-tt-narrowband-me7-20v-1-8t-performance-software/

theres some tunes that would work for your car. Stage 2 would be perfect for franken turbo/kov etc
Stage one would be for the stock turbo.
I run their AEB stage 3 tune and i love it. Will be going to their stage 4 shortly.

alexvanlewen
01-14-2015, 05:59 PM
ATW can also be converted to wideband (like AWM) relatively easily, which opens up tuning options quite a bit. It would be more work to swap in the VVT components found on the AWM, but this isn't a necessity.

The conversion is super easy to do. VVT is definitely an option.


What are your plans? If it were me, I'd do the wide band swap before any major tuning.

There are plenty of tunes for ATW and AEB that do just fine.


Depending on your tuner, if you started with an AWM tune and wanted to upgrade to a bigger turbo tune later (also for AWM), then there may only be an "upgrade" fee instead of paying for a whole new tune for AWM.
Also there are MANY more tuners out there for AWM than ATW, not to mention the tunes are better due to wideband.
Even just on a stock AWM ECU you'll get more power out of the car than a stock ATW ECU because stock AWM boost is 10-11 psi and stock ATW boost is 7-8 psi.

To convert you need:
-AWM ECU (sometimes you can buy a used ECU with a tune already on it)
-wideband conversion harness
-AWM fuel injectors
-AWM MAF (I think)
-AWM wideband O2 sensor
-VVT components if desired

VVT is variable valve timing. I believe Audi's implementation on the 1.8T mostly helps with increasing lower-RPM power output.
You may be thinking of SAI (Secondary Air Injection, which the ATW also has) which activates for a short time period at a cold start, and adds air to the exhaust to reduce emissions by more quickly warming up the catalytic converter.

All you need:AWM ECU
Unitronic Conversion harness
AWM/Wideband FRONT o2 sensor

MAF and Injectors are a good idea, but not necessarily required.

Clewe
01-14-2015, 08:21 PM
I have an ATW and I'm running a F21 turbo with 550cc's and a Motoza tune (dave) and it pulls really good.. He does require you to go wideband but it's really not all that pricey or difficult to do the conversion and I think it's definitely worth it. From my understanding a wideband sensor and ecu is way better for tuning opposed to narrowband. Either way you can practically do anything to an ATW that you can to an AWM or AEB. In other words, let the madness begin!

redline380
01-14-2015, 08:38 PM
MAF and Injectors are a good idea, but not necessarily required.

Kind of like how running 91 octane on a 91 octane tune is a good idea, but not necessary. [rolleyes] After all, if you were to run 87 octane, the ECU would just sense knock and adjust for it.

AWM uses a different MAF and different injectors. If you don't put in the correct parts, don't bother with the conversion.

Avant Nate
01-14-2015, 11:09 PM
I figured that since he was even asking, his intentions were BT. I mean, if you staying stock, then of course there's no reason to even care about the being the bastard child.
And oil in the intercooler lines may have nothing to do with the turbo, could be your pcv. Grape will tell you to just dump it to the ground.

ray4624
01-14-2015, 11:31 PM
I second the dumping of said Pcv to the ground

MetalMan
01-15-2015, 07:27 AM
i dont understand the need for everyone to have a wideband capable car.
many people make great numbers on AEBs etc without wideband. I dont really see the need for it unless i was going with a serious build.
I would worry about a million other things on the car before i would swap it to wideband.

Not everyone needs a wideband capable car, you're right.
There are likely quite a few more tuning options for AEB than ATW... so by doing this relatively simple wideband conversion to AWM wideband it opens up the tuning options quite a bit. Not to mention the tuning capabilities of doing so.

Mad Cow
01-15-2015, 07:49 AM
Kind of like how running 91 octane on a 91 octane tune is a good idea, but not necessary. [rolleyes] After all, if you were to run 87 octane, the ECU would just sense knock and adjust for it.

AWM uses a different MAF and different injectors. If you don't put in the correct parts, don't bother with the conversion.

Technically you could get away with ATW injectors since they're close enough in flow rate that fuel trims will take care of it, but AWM injectors have a better spray pattern so it doesn't make sense not to change them. You'll need AWM injectors cups too. You could still use the ATW MAF so long as you modify the tune appropriately.

Also if you're not installing the VVT tensioner you will absolutely need to code out VVT in your tune, that resistor that comes with conversion harnesses does diddly squat since you'll still get a code from the cam timing never changing. I honestly don't even know why it's included, it's like whoever designed the first harness didn't even bother testing it and everyone else just copied it afterwards. If you are installing VVT, make sure you get an AWM intake cam, it's a different part number.