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MFT
12-04-2014, 11:13 AM
I've had a lot of VAG products over the years (multiple GTIs, B7 RS4, B8 S4 and A4, etc.) but recently traded my 2011 S4 in on a 2013 M5 with 6MT. Now, the M5 is pretty incredible with 560 horses and 500 lb.ft. of torque with a manual transmission, but I didn't count on what a handful it would be driving in the winter (with winter tires obviously). So, I've been contemplating trading it in for a RS5. The biggest thing I would likely miss is the manual tranny, but I could live without it I think.

Any thoughts? Am I crazy to think about doing a straight trade on a low-mileage 2013 M5 for a CPO'd low-mileage 2014 RS5? I know they're different vehicles (sedan vs. coupe), but not really a big factor in my books.

MacFady
12-04-2014, 11:29 AM
Why not park your M5 for the winter and drive your A4 Avant?

i1overice
12-04-2014, 11:46 AM
Why not park your M5 for the winter and drive your A4 Avant?

He has a pretty good point there.

Brava
12-04-2014, 11:49 AM
The RS5 is a beauty next to M5.

And the M5 with RWD is a PITA regarding traction.

Not sure what I would do though, the M5 is a wonderful car too.

MFT
12-04-2014, 12:08 PM
Why not park your M5 for the winter and drive your A4 Avant?

I could, but my wife wouldn't be too happy (the Avant is her DD)...

On the same theme though, I thought about getting a mk5 GTI or similar for the winter, but if I'm not going to have a dedicated summer and winter car, I'd rather the summer car be a bit more "sporting", like a Cayman. I guess I though the M5 would be decent enough in the winter to be a 4 seasons car like an Audi, but apparently not.

Beast
12-04-2014, 12:13 PM
I would not do it, but that's just because I am not a fan of big sedans.... Maybe in 20 years.

shonseb
12-05-2014, 05:13 AM
I think you'd be disappointed in the loss of power. Why not consider an s6 or s7? With just a tune, you would be north of 500+ HP/TQ

http://www.goapr.com/products/ecu_upgrade_40tfsi_s6s7.html

ExhaustNote
12-05-2014, 06:14 PM
shonseb is right. An S6 or S7 is more inline with the M5 and it would make more sense to jump into one of those over an RS5.

blackluna
12-05-2014, 08:48 PM
I had an opportunity to drive the latest gen M5, chipped. It was insane.

I think RS5 would be a significant disappointment in terms of power, space and overall comfort. I admit I haven't driven the RS5 but I think S5 is close enough to make that conclusion.

M5 that I drove was of my coworkers and he cross shopped S7 and AMG Merc and he wasn't at all impressed with either of those. He is crazy about his M5 though and it's a fun car.

ExhaustNote
12-05-2014, 11:02 PM
I had an opportunity to drive the latest gen M5, chipped. It was insane.

I think RS5 would be a significant disappointment in terms of power, space and overall comfort. I admit I haven't driven the RS5 but I think S5 is close enough to make that conclusion.

M5 that I drove was of my coworkers and he cross shopped S7 and AMG Merc and he wasn't at all impressed with either of those. He is crazy about his M5 though and it's a fun car.

An S5 is not even remotely close enough. I had a significantly modded S5 before my RS5 and there is no comparison.

LINDW4LL
12-05-2014, 11:39 PM
Any thoughts? Am I crazy to think about doing a straight trade on a low-mileage 2013 M5 for a CPO'd low-mileage 2014 RS5? I know they're different vehicles (sedan vs. coupe), but not really a big factor in my books.
I think an RS5 is definitely the wrong choice in your case. It's vastly underpowered compared to the M5 and even worse is the lack of torque. It feels like a complete slug in comparison to the M. I think you'd be extremely disappointed.

That being said, I fully endorse shone's suggestion of the S6/S7 (or if you're feeling spendy; RS7). Even in stock form, the S6/S7 is fast enough where you wouldn't be disappointed, and with a tune you are pretty damn close to M5 power levels.

Encardyle
12-06-2014, 01:03 AM
I drive rs5. And my cousins got the M5. To be honest the fun pleasure excitement and more horse power you get out of M5. You can't get that from rs5. Both cars are totally different. If you really want the rs. Go for rs7. But that's my personal opinion. I know most of the people won't agree with me. So whatever you do. Good luck :)

mozman68
12-06-2014, 04:19 AM
Which one handles better in the shitty Michigan weather?

Question I always ask myself....[:p]

shellbmb
12-06-2014, 05:40 AM
Why not consider just keeping the M5 and getting a "beater" that will work for crappy weather days. Something that has good traction and that you won't mind if it gets dinged, scraped or abused. Then drive the M5 on nicer days and in the summer.

The M5 has poor traction even with ideal conditions. I just picked up an RS5 and I was trying to make it lose traction one day down here when it rained and it would not. In the M5, the dash would light up like a Christmas tree with the DSC going off.

But I agree with some other posters that the RS5 will feel slow due to the disparity in torque. Once you get the revs up it comes alive, but low end torque is not there. Don't get me wrong though, still a blast to drive. The M5 is a boat compared to the nimble RS.

Is a winter tire setup possible on the M5? or does that not even make much of a difference? Winter tires and some sand bags in your trunk!

SDS
12-06-2014, 06:23 AM
^^ I'm with this guy. Get a B5 or B6 S4 with some miles for less than $15k for the winter.

LINDW4LL
12-06-2014, 08:01 AM
The M5 is a boat compared to the nimble RS.

Is a winter tire setup possible on the M5? or does that not even make much of a difference? Winter tires and some sand bags in your trunk!
You'd think so, but it's really not. In fact the weights are near the same despite the larger chassis of the M5, and the M5 has much better weight distribution (52% front vs 58% front for the RS).

One way of displaying this is to look at the tested figure eight times for both cars, which come out to be within a tenth of a second of each other (24.8 vs 24.9).


Sent from my iPhone 6 using Tapatalk

Johnhanson
12-06-2014, 03:18 PM
RS7 or nothing. The RS5 just can't compete with the FI cars. Even my X6 50 could put down similar straight line power, and an M4 I just drove would embarrass it in a straight line (but shit interior, sounds like garbage, and hard to drive in winter).

However, if you live where there's snow you're wasting your time 3-6 months a year with a rwd BMW. Which is why I love my RS5. But coming from any FI car you will feel like a turtle. The RS7 will give you the power you need but be useable and fun all year. My gripe with the RS7 is how huge and relatively floaty it is compared to the RS5 (and just less fun) but coming from the M5 it will work for you and be better than M5 in every way. If you want a super fast big hog with a superior interior RS7 is no brainer - having driven them all now I would even go S6/S7 over M5. But no RS5 for you.

Jokergod2000
12-06-2014, 04:15 PM
RS7 or nothing. The RS5 just can't compete with the FI cars. Even my X6 50 could put down similar straight line power, and an M4 I just drove would embarrass it in a straight line (but shit interior, sounds like garbage, and hard to drive in winter).

However, if you live where there's snow you're wasting your time 3-6 months a year with a rwd BMW. Which is why I love my RS5. But coming from any FI car you will feel like a turtle. The RS7 will give you the power you need but be useable and fun all year. My gripe with the RS7 is how huge and relatively floaty it is compared to the RS5 (and just less fun) but coming from the M5 it will work for you and be better than M5 in every way. If you want a super fast big hog with a superior interior RS7 is no brainer - having driven them all now I would even go S6/S7 over M5. But no RS5 for you.

I would not call the RS7 floaty with the DRC option. On Comfort it's easily as stiff as my S4 was. On dynamic it feels VERY solid.

Johnhanson
12-06-2014, 05:17 PM
***relatively***

Jokergod2000
12-06-2014, 08:52 PM
***relatively***

Well now I want go for a ride in an RS5. It must be hella stiff. Someone come pick me up!

Johnhanson
12-07-2014, 07:26 AM
I just left Calgary this morning, lol otherwise I would! I am In the habit of showing off my new Capristo

Jokergod2000
12-07-2014, 10:21 AM
I just left Calgary this morning, lol otherwise I would! I am In the habit of showing off my new Capristo

Next time you are in town drop me a PM. Ride stiffness comparison. Back to back RS5 vs. RS7. This is a duel! lol

MFT
12-11-2014, 08:43 AM
I think an RS5 is definitely the wrong choice in your case. It's vastly underpowered compared to the M5 and even worse is the lack of torque. It feels like a complete slug in comparison to the M. I think you'd be extremely disappointed.

That being said, I fully endorse shone's suggestion of the S6/S7 (or if you're feeling spendy; RS7). Even in stock form, the S6/S7 is fast enough where you wouldn't be disappointed, and with a tune you are pretty damn close to M5 power levels.

Well, after much consideration, I'm leaning towards an S6 or S7. It looks like I could get into a lightly used 2014 S7 for about an even trade of my 2013 M5. I had a chance to drive the M5 home in the snow yesterday and the DSC light on the dash was lighting up like a Christmas tree on any moderately snow-covered streets - I definitely wasn't going anywhere fast, even with the winter tires! Coming from an S4 and RS4 which just powered through in those conditions, it was a bit frustrating.

On the other hand, having a 6MT 560 HP rear driver is a ton of fun in the dry (though really too much power on the streets), so the question is whether I want to give up that fun summer driving with a stick for AWD fun from December to March and live with a DSG AWD tranny in the summer months.

Decisions decisions...

bknewtype
12-11-2014, 09:14 AM
gt-r? all the power and AWD. :)

i personally dont like the look of the new m's so i would def pick a s7 over that. s6 is a bit bland imo.

i would def choose the rs5 doe (;

LINDW4LL
12-11-2014, 09:26 AM
Well, after much consideration, I'm leaning towards an S6 or S7. It looks like I could get into a lightly used 2014 S7 for about an even trade of my 2013 M5. I had a chance to drive the M5 home in the snow yesterday and the DSC light on the dash was lighting up like a Christmas tree on any moderately snow-covered streets - I definitely wasn't going anywhere fast, even with the winter tires! Coming from an S4 and RS4 which just powered through in those conditions, it was a bit frustrating.

Decisions decisions...
That's a good choice, S6/S7 is the best compromise. Nothing can replace rowing your own gears, but the S-Tronic is pretty damn good. I don't think you'd miss the M5 at all if you were to tune the S7.



i would def choose the rs5 doe (;
You drive an A5, so I guess it's possible the RS5 would maybe feel fast to you (if it's possible for an RS5 to feel fast?? [confused] [:D])

However the RS5 would feel like a complete dog in comparison to the M5. OP would probably want to die if he bought one.

bknewtype
12-11-2014, 09:35 AM
That's a good choice, S6/S7 is the best compromise. Nothing can replace rowing your own gears, but the S-Tronic is pretty damn good. I don't think you'd miss the M5 at all if you were to tune the S7.


You drive an A5, so I guess it's possible the RS5 would maybe feel fast to you (if it's possible for an RS5 to feel fast?? [confused] [:D])

However the RS5 would feel like a complete dog in comparison to the M5. OP would probably want to die if he bought one.

lol. speed means nothing to me being in NYC :( and im not one to fish tail on the highway. i have no use for all the power. i would pick an rs5 over an m5 based soley on looks alone. if i wanted power, i would not look at the rs5. really like the s/rs7. but no money, no talk.

actually might consider the new vette as my next car

LINDW4LL
12-11-2014, 09:38 AM
lol. speed means nothing to me being in NYC :( and im not one to fish tail on the highway. i have no use for all the power. i would pick an rs5 over an m5 based soley on looks alone. if i wanted power, i would not look at the rs5. really like the s/rs7. but no money, no talk.

actually might consider the new vette as my next car
Haha, I know bro. I wasn't ripping the A5, just saying it makes sense that you would pick the RS5. Doesn't make sense for OP.

bknewtype
12-11-2014, 09:40 AM
Haha, I know bro. I wasn't ripping the A5, just saying it makes sense that you would pick the RS5. Doesn't make sense for OP.

true. s7 makes more sense comparing 2 boaty high powered sedans. who knows, maybe he wants to drive slow for once and have panties dropped w/ the rs5 [:D]

superswiss
12-14-2014, 10:22 AM
Well, after much consideration, I'm leaning towards an S6 or S7. It looks like I could get into a lightly used 2014 S7 for about an even trade of my 2013 M5. I had a chance to drive the M5 home in the snow yesterday and the DSC light on the dash was lighting up like a Christmas tree on any moderately snow-covered streets - I definitely wasn't going anywhere fast, even with the winter tires! Coming from an S4 and RS4 which just powered through in those conditions, it was a bit frustrating.

On the other hand, having a 6MT 560 HP rear driver is a ton of fun in the dry (though really too much power on the streets), so the question is whether I want to give up that fun summer driving with a stick for AWD fun from December to March and live with a DSG AWD tranny in the summer months.

Decisions decisions...

Have you had a chance to drive an S7 yet? I wasn't very impressed with the S6. The S6 weighs about the same as the M5, so it might feel right to you, but the RS5 while not a featherlight weighs about 400 lbs less. The S7 weighs another 100 lbs over the S6 and M5. The S6 had a nice growl standing next to it, but the cabin is like a concert hall. You can't hear the engine nor the exhaust. Being used to the barks on downshifts, it felt very strange not getting any feedback other than the revs going up when downshifting. The S6 felt marginally faster off the line, but once moving it felt like the RS5 with 2 passengers plus driver. Took it around a cloverleaf onramp at the speed I'm usually going with the RS5 and I had to back off the throttle. The S6 has massive body roll and started to push over the front wheels. Didn't feel confidence inspiring at all. Seems like the sport diff has a hard time keeping the car on track once you start pushing it. I had to double check and make sure ADS was in Dynamic. After that cloverleaf onramp it felt like I was in Comfort mode. The S6/7 would be phenomenal cars going long distance on the Autobahn at triple digit speeds in comfort, but I think coming from the M5 you might be disappointed unless you go RS7 with DRC.

MFT
12-14-2014, 07:07 PM
Have you had a chance to drive an S7 yet? I wasn't very impressed with the S6. The S6 weighs about the same as the M5, so it might feel right to you, but the RS5 while not a featherlight weighs about 400 lbs less. The S7 weighs another 100 lbs over the S6 and M5. The S6 had a nice growl standing next to it, but the cabin is like a concert hall. You can't hear the engine nor the exhaust. Being used to the barks on downshifts, it felt very strange not getting any feedback other than the revs going up when downshifting. The S6 felt marginally faster off the line, but once moving it felt like the RS5 with 2 passengers plus driver. Took it around a cloverleaf onramp at the speed I'm usually going with the RS5 and I had to back off the throttle. The S6 has massive body roll and started to push over the front wheels. Didn't feel confidence inspiring at all. Seems like the sport diff has a hard time keeping the car on track once you start pushing it. I had to double check and make sure ADS was in Dynamic. After that cloverleaf onramp it felt like I was in Comfort mode. The S6/7 would be phenomenal cars going long distance on the Autobahn at triple digit speeds in comfort, but I think coming from the M5 you might be disappointed unless you go RS7 with DRC.

These are two things that worry me...but to be honest, I find that (1) the M5 really has too much power for the street as there are very very few situations where you can actually floor it and use all 560 horses; and (2) coming from the S4, RS4 and several GTIs, I find the M5 big/heavy already, so maybe what I should be looking for is something more nimble, like the RS5, or going back to a S4.

The age old question: is it more fun to have a low-power/nimble car that you can (safely) drive to the limit or a high-powered car that you could only ever use 6/10th's of on the street.

Johnhanson
12-14-2014, 07:41 PM
The age old question: is it more fun to have a low-power/nimble car that you can (safely) drive to the limit or a high-powered car that you could only ever use 6/10th's of on the street.

^^Exactly. Guess you have some test driving to do.

I have my RS5, a buddy with an S6, one with an RS7, and one looking at an S8. All great cars, all quite different with their own character. We all love the different cars, but are extremely happy with our own choices. Maybe I was wrong initially, given your tastes you might still be happy with an RS5.

CreoSTi
12-19-2014, 12:05 PM
coming from the S4, RS4 and several GTIs, I find the M5 big/heavy already, so maybe what I should be looking for is something more nimble, like the RS5, or going back to a S4.

That pretty much sums up my experience right now with the S6 (after a year of ownership and having spent 3 years in a B8 S4), and I'll probably be looking to go back into something the size of an S4/M3/C63 when the 2016 model year comes out. I don't have to deal with winter like you do, but if the heft of the M5 is one of the concerns, I definitely don't think the S6/S7/RS7 is going to be the right option.

dgszweda
01-02-2015, 07:30 PM
I have been driving a brand new M5 for the last few months on the weekends. I also have an RS5. I get frustrated when people call the RS5 a "dog". I think the OP needs to be clear on what he is actually looking for. An RS5 is not an M5, but it is still a very fun car. The M5 is a handful on the street, and while it is definitely quicker, the power and performance cannot really be fully realized on the street. To me though it isn't really as much fun as the RS5. While everyone likes the torque in the M5, most people don't know how to drive an RS5. The RS5 was not built to drive between 1K and 3K rpm. To me, I am getting tired of 1) the traction lights always coming on, or when you turn off the traction control, 2) the backend is all over the place. While that is cool on a race track it isn't a lot of fun on the street. I do like the shifting on the M5 DCT set at 3. It is fast and really "slams" thru the gears. With that said, I still fine the sweet spot of my RS5 of romping through the hills around Pittsburgh, keeping the car between 6K and 8.5K. The sound is wonderful, the power and pull is nearly as great as the M5 at that speed, and the car always feels in control and you can actually drive at a higher speed in a more safer scenario on public streets than you can in the M5.

superswiss
01-03-2015, 01:04 AM
There's an interesting phenomenon that can be observed. Once you hit 500-550hp in a car, most people actually end up driving slower than with a less powerful car. Top Gear built an episode around this once where they took a Cayman S vs Pagani Huyara around the track. The Stig in the Cayman S beat Richard Hammond in the Huyara.

Tasho3
01-07-2015, 11:34 AM
But the Stig in the Cayman S did not beat the Stig in the Huyara.

doug97gxe
01-07-2015, 11:42 AM
That pretty much sums up my experience right now with the S6 (after a year of ownership and having spent 3 years in a B8 S4), and I'll probably be looking to go back into something the size of an S4/M3/C63 when the 2016 model year comes out. I don't have to deal with winter like you do, but if the heft of the M5 is one of the concerns, I definitely don't think the S6/S7/RS7 is going to be the right option.

any pics of the S6?

CreoSTi
01-08-2015, 04:20 PM
any pics of the S6?

https://www.flickr.com/photos/creoucla/sets/72157638681475446/

doug97gxe
01-09-2015, 07:39 AM
https://www.flickr.com/photos/creoucla/sets/72157638681475446/

thank you... very beautiful.. i kept picturing your sig in my head.. had to see the pics

CreoSTi
01-09-2015, 10:13 AM
thank you... very beautiful.. i kept picturing your sig in my head.. had to see the pics

Thanks! [up]

Zee Dgerman
03-24-2015, 07:37 PM
I have been driving a brand new M5 for the last few months on the weekends. I also have an RS5. I get frustrated when people call the RS5 a "dog". I think the OP needs to be clear on what he is actually looking for. An RS5 is not an M5, but it is still a very fun car. The M5 is a handful on the street, and while it is definitely quicker, the power and performance cannot really be fully realized on the street. To me though it isn't really as much fun as the RS5. While everyone likes the torque in the M5, most people don't know how to drive an RS5. The RS5 was not built to drive between 1K and 3K rpm. To me, I am getting tired of 1) the traction lights always coming on, or when you turn off the traction control, 2) the backend is all over the place. While that is cool on a race track it isn't a lot of fun on the street. I do like the shifting on the M5 DCT set at 3. It is fast and really "slams" thru the gears. With that said, I still fine the sweet spot of my RS5 of romping through the hills around Pittsburgh, keeping the car between 6K and 8.5K. The sound is wonderful, the power and pull is nearly as great as the M5 at that speed, and the car always feels in control and you can actually drive at a higher speed in a more safer scenario on public streets than you can in the M5.

Yes +1

It's not always about how much power you have, but how much power you can actually use. Personally I really like the high revving v8. It's doesn't have the low rpm torque of the turbo engines, but I find I get to use it to most of its potential. Very relaxed when driving slow, very exciting when nailing it...