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xthealienatorx
11-25-2014, 06:21 AM
Hey all, I'm about to do a large service to my 30v over the long weekend, and I was just wondering if anyone had any tips and what order would be the best. I will be doing:
Timing Belt (and all components), all valve train seals, motor mounts, transmission mounts, cleaning out the pcv system, vacuum lines, accessory belt, accessory belt tensioner, and I feel like I'm forgetting something but I don't know what.
All help appreciated, Thanks.

walky_talky20
11-25-2014, 06:34 AM
I would recommend a new OEM thermostat due to it being behind the t-belt. Also, since you're draining the coolant, might be nice to pop in a new coolant temp sensor and o-ring. Even if the sensor doesn't fail (they do), the o-rings will deteriorate and can create a coolant leak emergency. Seems more common on V6.

xthealienatorx
11-25-2014, 09:20 AM
Already got one. I got the second tier ECS timing belt kit. How much coolant do I need in total. I have a large bottle of vw g12 I bought from the dealer about a year ago, I want to say it's 5l but I'm not 100%

AudiholicA4
11-25-2014, 10:40 AM
do you have the cam locking tool? you'll need it. if not I can rent one out to you for 5 bucks and you pay the shipping. ECS sells it for 150.


Sent from my iPhone device

bhusted
11-25-2014, 11:37 AM
The cam locking bar and crank locking pin are a must for this job. You'll also need a smallish sized gear puller to loosen the cam sprockets. I will also second the replacement of the thermostat and o-ring. Only use an OEM thermostat. Not sure on the coolant volume. I usually keep a couple of the concentrated bottles in my stash of stuff for just in case.

walky_talky20
11-25-2014, 11:44 AM
Are you taking care of all the oil leaks? VC gaskets, Cam plugs, Cam Adjuster gasket w/ half-moon, etc?

BaseDrifter
11-25-2014, 11:47 AM
Here are the coolant capacities for the B5 engines (posting them all for people who may stumble on this thread when searching.)

1.8L (AEB) = 7.5 liters (8.0 qt)
1.8L (ATW, AWM) = 7.0 liters (7.4 qt)
2.8L (AFC) = 8.5 liters (9.0 qt)
2.8L (AHA, ATQ) = 6.0 liters (6.4 qt)

That bottle you got from the dealer is probably concentrated, don't forget to dilute it with distilled water.

xthealienatorx
11-25-2014, 02:48 PM
Are you taking care of all the oil leaks? VC gaskets, Cam plugs, Cam Adjuster gasket w/ half-moon, etc?
Yes. I am.

xthealienatorx
11-25-2014, 03:06 PM
Okay, I'm home and have access to what I
Ordered. http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/14/11/25/ae8bb12bc7ff32aa601b5b68bf99e159.jpg
The thermostat is a "vemo". Will it be okay?
I won't be using the tools as I have been talking to a guy who does them without it and I feel pretty good about it. The only thing I'm now worried about is I don't have the tool for the cam chain tensioner, is it needed?

Mad Cow
11-25-2014, 03:13 PM
For your first time I'd highly recommend using the tools, makes it so much easier and more foolproof. And yes you do need the cam chain tensioner tool. And I'd toss that vemo thermostat in favour of OEM, they're not expensive from a dealership.

BaseDrifter
11-25-2014, 03:26 PM
It looks like it should be, but confirm that the timing tensioner is NTN brand. Also, what's in that Uro box?

walky_talky20
11-25-2014, 04:14 PM
- Agree. Don't use a vemo t-stat. On an AEB, I'd be like "whatevs, you can easily swap it later during an oil change", but on a 30v it's behind the t-belt. Not something you want to be doing again anytime soon.

- Agree. Open ALL THE THINGS. [:D]

- Sort of agree, kinda. Yes you can do the t-belt without the lock tools. As long as you paint mark stuff, and accurately transfer marks, you won't hurt anything. But you might lose some performance due to "cam phase position" deviation. If you want to do it without tools, I would challenge you to check the phase position (ie: record the readings in Block 093 at hot idle) and compare to the numbers you get after your t-belt job. Regrettably, I've never done this even though I've had the opportunity. I would like to know far off spec it ends up without the tools.

xthealienatorx
11-25-2014, 04:51 PM
It looks like it should be, but confirm that the timing tensioner is NTN brand. Also, what's in that Uro box?
Yes, the tensioner is. The Uro box is my accessory belt tensioner, which thankful went bad at the right time.

xthealienatorx
11-25-2014, 04:55 PM
- Agree. Don't use a vemo t-stat. On an AEB, I'd be like "whatevs, you can easily swap it later during an oil change", but on a 30v it's behind the t-belt. Not something you want to be doing again anytime soon.

- Agree. Open ALL THE THINGS. [:D]

- Sort of agree, kinda. Yes you can do the t-belt without the lock tools. As long as you paint mark stuff, and accurately transfer marks, you won't hurt anything. But you might lose some performance due to "cam phase position" deviation. If you want to do it without tools, I would challenge you to check the phase position (ie: record the readings in Block 093 at hot idle) and compare to the numbers you get after your t-belt job. Regrettably, I've never done this even though I've had the opportunity. I would like to know far off spec it ends up without the tools.
I have the resources and can easily make a cam lock bar to just keep the cams straight, but how does this happen?

bhusted
11-25-2014, 06:39 PM
I would encourage you to use the cam locking bar and crank pin. The paint marking method will "work", but as walky said above, you will sacrifice some performance. It also makes it difficult to get everything lined up.

walky_talky20
11-26-2014, 08:10 AM
I have the resources and can easily make a cam lock bar to just keep the cams straight, but how does this happen?

I don't understand the question. How do the cams get out of optimal phase position?

Basically, the 30v timing belt is approximately 3 miles long. We know this. Audi knows this. With so much length, it is impossible to get the cam timing balls-on (to use the technical term). Usually not a problem, as long as it's close. But we've got a lot of valves going on (almost 30 of them, as I recall) and some VVT shenanigans as well. In order to keep everything working flawlessly, the belt variance should be accounted for. In comes the factory-equipped, infinitely adjustable cam gears. Failure to make use of this adjustment will leave your engine imperfectly timed. The horror.

"But Mr. Walky", you may ask, "what about those 4-cam Subaru's or Toyota UZ engines, or...or...or? They don't have any of this cam gear adjustment stuff, right?"

I think the best answer here is that none of those vehicles off the level of class and sophistication of your Audi product. As such, they needn't bother with dialing in the cam timing on their ordinary engines.

bhusted
11-26-2014, 08:31 AM
"But Mr. Walky", you may ask, "what about those 4-cam Subaru's or Toyota UZ engines, or...or...or? They don't have any of this cam gear adjustment stuff, right?"

I think the best answer here is that none of those vehicles off the level of class and sophistication of your Audi product. As such, they needn't bother with dialing in the cam timing on their ordinary engines.

^This guy. [:D]

xthealienatorx
11-27-2014, 06:41 AM
Okay guys, 1st day done, had a rough time getting the bumper uncliped, but managed. Then drained the disgusting coolant
http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/14/11/27/76dbc9e826eae7f66b205eb159586189.jpg
Then took the remains of my snub mount off.
http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/14/11/27/9caf729a2a93b367206cc6e7aca98a40.jpg
Then got everything off that was needed and my dad started making a cam lock bar. http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/14/11/27/41d4a53361dd0efa6cb39df112a9dbdd.jpghttp://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/14/11/27/6b7329e67a36024230885cc1e854566a.jpg
Then as we went to do all the seals, realized I need the cam chain tensioner tool and as we looked at tensioner pad, the end is missing. I'll try to post a pic in a bit. So we decided to just change the seal that is really bad and we'll go back in again. Alot more work, but I need my car back, we also finished the timing belt and changed out the plastic impeller water pump.
http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/14/11/27/f4c3c7fcc488db38804f23d2b517433c.jpg
And after 12 hours of work, that's how she sits until Friday.

bhusted
11-27-2014, 07:39 AM
You can pickup the pads for the CCT on ebay. I would replace all 4 if one has gotten to the point of failure. You'll likely find the pieces of the one that broke in the oil pan.

xthealienatorx
11-28-2014, 08:52 AM
Anybody know of a diy for changing the pads? My dad just wants to do the one side (driver side) and he's paying for it all so I'm not going to argue. If I see it right, you can do it by just compressing it, no need to take timing belt back off, just detention?

bhusted
11-28-2014, 09:57 AM
The tensioner has to be removed from the head to replace the pads. On the driver's side, this means removing the timing belt. Changing the pads themselves is super easy. It just snaps onto the tensioner. To remove the tensioners, you have to pull the intake cam from the head.

xthealienatorx
12-01-2014, 05:45 PM
The tensioner has to be removed from the head to replace the pads. On the driver's side, this means removing the timing belt. Changing the pads themselves is super easy. It just snaps onto the tensioner. To remove the tensioners, you have to pull the intake cam from the head.
http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/14/12/01/fdb068b378b27595e52dd0fa57c1f052.jpg

walky_talky20
12-01-2014, 08:14 PM
Good thing you caught it now. If the guide completely falls off, there is *just* enough chain slop to bend a couple intake valves. Had this happen on a customer's car once. It was a "worst case scenario" where it actually hit the piston just right and busted off the top land. Took a little chunk right out of it. They opted to just put it back together with 1 new valve, forget about the piston damage and run it. Talk about cutting corners (har, har).

You could probably sneak the top guide in there by just compressing the tensioner, but the bottom one of course, will require removal of the tensioner assembly.