Done with OE Sports...now which KW spring?

[adbender]

Looking at switching of OE Sports. I have ADS so coilovers are not an option for now.

Drop is nice and as advertised but found them way too bouncy when traveling on some back roads. Even bottomed out the front end on an unexpected rough patch.

Looking now at KW Height Adjustable Springs but noticed two kit set-ups:


Sedan 2WD & Quattro F 5-35mm R 5-30mm 25310075
Avant/Wagon; 2WD & Quattro F 5-35mm R 5-30mm 25310078

Mod bargains is showing one image for the sedan:

http://www.modbargains.com/images/Products/KW_Coilovers/kw-adjustable-springs.jpg

KW store is showing another for the sedan:

http://www.kw-store.com/media/catalog/product/cache/4/image/265x265/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/k/w/kw__25310075_640_4.jpg

...and this for the Avant:

http://www.kw-store.com/media/catalog/product/cache/4/image/265x265/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/k/w/kw_25310078_001_640_12.jpg

I have heard the rear has sagged for some with the sedan springs when the product was first released.

Not sure if I need to go the the Avant spring (which is slightly longer) to allow about a 1-1.2" drop or if they have rectified the issue for the sedan springs.

Please chime in if you have any info or experience with this product...not clear on my search. Thanks.

[Leor604]

If you found the H&R's bouncy, I doubt the KW's will be much different. A bouncy ride would suggest the spring is too stiff for the stock shocks.

However, you also bottomed out which means the spring is too soft or too short. You can't decrease bounce AND increase spring rate at the same time. If you are happy with the drop, you may want to consider swapping your shocks before spending more money on springs.

[adbender]

If you found the H&R's bouncy, I doubt the KW's will be much different. A bouncy ride would suggest the spring is too stiff for the stock shocks.

However, you also bottomed out which means the spring is too soft or too short. You can't decrease bounce AND increase spring rate at the same time. If you are happy with the drop, you may want to consider swapping your shocks before spending more money on springs.

I have ADS shocks...

The OE sports dropped a little too much for the roads I drive on...constantly concerned about clearance. Bounce is not my biggest concern.

Bottoming out on some rough roads suggests to me the spring is too short or not stiff enough.

I like the adjustable option to ensure there is no rake and i have enough clearance.

Any experience with the KW H.A.S?

[apexit1]

I have the HAS, love them. nothing but compliments so far (40k). Going to be swapping in V3's soon though. If you're interested in them PM me.

[adbender]

I have the HAS, love them. nothing but compliments so far (40k). Going to be swapping in V3's soon though. If you're interested in them PM me.

Good to hear...

Curious, why are you swapping to V3s? No longer concerned about suspension adaptability?

Heard that in Europe KW is offering coilovers that adapt with ADS. Not yet available in NA.

[Leor604]

Good to hear...

Curious, why are you swapping to V3s? No longer concerned about suspension adaptability?

Heard that in Europe KW is offering coilovers that adapt with ADS. Not yet available in NA.

Now that's what I'd be interested in!

[adbender]

Now that's what I'd be interested in!

Check it out...

http://www.kw-suspension.com/us/kw_ddc.php

I think there is also a version for B8 S4s

http://www.rushlane.com/damper-setup-via-iphone-for-audi-a4-kw-ddc-ecu-coilover-kit-and-smartphone-adaptability-1235748.html

http://www.ecstuning.com/Audi-B8_S4-Quattro-3.0T/Suspension/Coilovers/ES2574544/

Not sure if this version communicates with ADS.

Looks like another dude did it...http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php/538424-KW-Dynamic-Dampening-Control-Coilover-Kit-installed-at-Eurocode

[Mops@Nemesis]

I've ridden in two B8 5 ADS cars with the HAS kit. It's great. Ride quality spot on. A better stiffer than the V1/ST.

[apexit1]

Good to hear...

Curious, why are you swapping to V3s? No longer concerned about suspension adaptability?

Heard that in Europe KW is offering coilovers that adapt with ADS. Not yet available in NA.

I'm at 65k now, I figure I can either go full coils or pay close to 3k to replace the stock shocks. I may hold on to them just in case I can't dial in the ride to my tastes. But like I said no complaints ever.

[adbender]

I'm at 65k now, I figure I can either go full coils or pay close to 3k to replace the stock shocks. I may hold on to them just in case I can't dial in the ride to my tastes. But like I said no complaints ever.

That makes sense. The KW full adaptive setup is about $5K with all the parts and electronics.

Thanks for the feedback. Anyone use the AVANT coils are am I to assume the sedan kit seems fine.

[ModBargains.com]

The KW adjustable spring kit (http://www.modbargains.com/KW-Adjustable-Spring-Kit-Audi.htm) is a great choice. It'll maintain ride comfort and definitely wont be as bouncy as the H&R setup in my opinion. This KW Adjustable Spring Kit is perfect for all you B8 A4/S4 owners out there with factory equipped electronic dampening system (ADS). Your ADS will still function and there will be any issues.

Lowering Rates:
Front Lowering: 0.6" to 1.8"
Rear Lowering: 0.6" to 1.6"

We use standard pictures and use them across the board. The picture below is direct from KW's website under the part number for your the B8 S4 sedan application.

http://www.kw-store.com/media/catalog/product/k/w/kw__25310075_640_4.jpg

[ehaze]

I've ridden in two B8 5 ADS cars with the HAS kit. It's great. Ride quality spot on. A better stiffer than the V1/ST.

What is the HAS kit?

[Mops@Nemesis]

What is the HAS kit?

The adjustable spring kit pictured above.

http://www.vividracing.com/catalog/2011_Audi_S4_kw-has-coilover-spring-kit-audi-a4-s4-avant-quattro-08-p-143872.html

[adbender]

Thanks for the feedback guys...

I'm going with kw has sedan springs.

[SilveR316]

Thanks for the feedback guys...

I'm going with kw has sedan springs.

Let us know how it works out. I'm interested in getting a set of these as well, but I'm currently on the fence.

Any chance you could take a pic with them set at the highest setting in both the front and rear? Also curious about your take on the rear end sagging with the sedan springs.

[wwhan]

Thanks for the feedback guys...

I'm going with kw has sedan springs.

If you plan on droping the height 1.2", should work fine.

If less than 1" drop, you may need a spacer or KW Avant rear spring.

[boostfiend77]

The KW adjustable spring kit (http://www.modbargains.com/KW-Adjustable-Spring-Kit-Audi.htm) is a great choice. It'll maintain ride comfort and definitely wont be as bouncy as the H&R setup in my opinion. This KW Adjustable Spring Kit is perfect for all you B8 A4/S4 owners out there with factory equipped electronic dampening system (ADS). Your ADS will still function and there will be any issues.

Lowering Rates:
Front Lowering: 0.6" to 1.8"
Rear Lowering: 0.6" to 1.6"

We use standard pictures and use them across the board. The picture below is direct from KW's website under the part number for your the B8 S4 sedan application.

http://www.kw-store.com/media/catalog/product/k/w/kw__25310075_640_4.jpg

Do yo know the spring rates for the KW Springs?

[adbender]

If you plan on droping the height 1.2", should work fine.

If less than 1" drop, you may need a spacer or KW Avant rear spring.

1 want 1.2" max, which is what OEs are supposed to do.

For some reason, my fronts OEs really settled...almost 1.5". I had a bit of a rake unfortunately which left my front end too low and too soft.

[dangerous_dave7]

Does the KW height adjustable suspension work on b8.5 / 2014 S4's?

Thanks

[zps123]

kw height adjustable springs DO work on b8.5 cars. b8 and b8.5 are pretty much the same thing.

[adbender]

Been about 1 month now since I pulled the trigger.

http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5522/10524961284_92f80c6caa_c.jpg

http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3761/10524904325_8aac58009f_c.jpg

Drop: You will not get more of a drop than OE sports. I had them readjusted once, but they now sit about 26.25 at each corner. I may tweek it after the winter. For now, Im not looking to go any lower as Im enjoying not scraping on entrance inclines, speed bumps and car washes. I think the "adjustability" is most important for getting the drop you want, rather than thinking you will change your ride height with the seasons. My OE sports went too low on the front leaving me stuck with a forward rake.

Ride: Excellent. Not harsh in any way. More controlled and compliant. The suspension now does exactly what I want with no excessive bounce, dipping or thuds. Dynamic and Comfort on ADS are distinguishable and useful. On the track, the car was very composed and stable at speeds over 200km/hr and through the s-turns.

Noise: Initially had some creaking coming in and out of parking spaces. This has now ceased, which leads me to believe its part of the break-in. No other apparent noises during other driving.

Cost: Paid $825 shipped. This is about 3 times my OE sports ($275) but worth it in my mind. I had initially considered changing my ADS shocks, but this would have been a waste.

Conclusion: Huge improvement over OE sports. Costly if you just want a modest drop but worth it if you want significant improvements in performance while keeping your all your ADS functions.

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7395/10525115334_d3254f49bd_c.jpg
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5543/10525329403_c4e4891dbc_c.jpg

[patinsd]

I have mine for about 40k and very happy with them ,not bouncy at all !


Been about 1 month now since I pulled the trigger.

http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5522/10524961284_92f80c6caa_c.jpg

http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3761/10524904325_8aac58009f_c.jpg

Drop: You will not get a more drop than OE sports. I had them readjusted once, but they now sit about 26.25 at each corner. I may tweek it after the winter. For now, Im not looking to go any lower as Im enjoying not scraping on entrance inclines, speed bumps and car washes. I think the "adjustability" is most important for getting the drop you want, rather than thinking you change your ride height with the seasons. My OE sports went too low on the front leaving me with a forward rake.

Ride: Excellent. Not harsh in any way. More controlled and compliant. The suspension now does exactly what I want with no excessive bounce, dipping or thuds. Dynamic and Comfort on ADS are distinguishable and useful. On the track, the car was very composed and stable at speeds over 200km and through the s-turns.

Noise: Initially had some creaking coming in and out of parking spaces. This has now ceased, which leads me to believe its part of the break-in. No other apparent noises during other driving.

Cost: Paid $825 shipped. This is about 3 times my OE sports ($275) but worth it in my mind. I had initially considered changing my ADS shocks, but this would have been a waste.

Conclusion: Huge improvement over OE sports. Costly if you just want modest drop but worth it if you want significant improvements in performance while keeping your ADS functions.

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7395/10525115334_d3254f49bd_c.jpg
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5543/10525329403_c4e4891dbc_c.jpg

[SilveR316]

Thanks for the update. I'm definitely considering these instead of OE Sports so this helps immensely.

Have you noticed any issues with sagging in the rear? It looks like KW has fixed the issue with the springs or perches sitting too low in the rear?

[adbender]

Thanks for the update. I'm definitely considering these instead of OE Sports so this helps immensely.

Have you noticed any issues with sagging in the rear? It looks like KW has fixed the issue with the springs or perches sitting too low in the rear?

I talked to they guys at TAG about this as I heard the same thing. It seems that was just an early issue and not the case now.
They said that the rears take longer to settle and may need adjustment upwards. There is lots of room for adjustment in the rear, less in the front, which may have been KWs fix.

[SilveR316]

I talked to they guys at TAG about this as I heard the same thing. It seems that was just an early issue and not the case now.
They said that the rears take longer to settle and may need adjustment upwards. There is lots of room for adjustment in the rear, less in the front, which may have been KWs fix.

Awesome, thanks! I'll be picking up a set of these soon.

Where in Canada are you? Are you around the GTA?

[patinsd]

I bought mine when they came out .
Lowered the car about 08 inch and never sagged but I remember some people had issues with them .
They had to get spacer in the rear if I remember !


Awesome, thanks! I'll be picking up a set of these soon.

Where in Canada are you? Are you around the GTA?

[incognitoS4]

How did spacers in the back help? Did you lower the car about 08 inch all around? I thought cars with ADS sit slightly higher in the back than non-ADS cars.

[SilveR316]

How did spacers in the back help? Did you lower the car about 08 inch all around? I thought cars with ADS sit slightly higher in the back than non-ADS cars.

Mine has ADS and I haven't noticed it sitting higher in the rear than the front.

[adbender]

How did spacers in the back help? Did you lower the car about 08 inch all around? I thought cars with ADS sit slightly higher in the back than non-ADS cars.

They dont need a spacer anymore. I think they lengthened the adjustments threads on the rear springs or possibly the spring itself.

If you are in Toronto like me, you could source them from JRP in Mississauga or have them shipped from US. Same costs considering duty and shipping, though mine came quick from TAG.

[Bus Driver]

I'm on HnR OE with ADS and thinking of going the HAS route..does this mean with the HAS I can put back the rear spacer and have all four corners level height ? Had to remove them with the HnR as the rear was a tad higher..

[adbender]

I'm pretty sure my guy left the rear spacer out. U will be able to level without.

[SilveR316]

They dont need a spacer anymore. I think they lengthened the adjustments threads on the rear springs or possibly the spring itself.

If you are in Toronto like me, you could source them from JRP in Mississauga or have them shipped from US. Same costs considering duty and shipping, though mine came quick from TAG.

Did you install them yourself, or did you have a shop do the install? Pfaff Tuning quoted me 8 hours @ $115/hour to install springs. Wondering if there are any better options?

[adbender]

Did you install them yourself, or did you have a shop do the install? Pfaff Tuning quoted me 8 hours @ $115/hour to install springs. Wondering if there are any better options?

No way in hell i could do them myself...apparently its a bitch to get the rears but certainly not 8 hours.

I had mine done at RPM Import and Domestic...5 hours at $95/hour. These guys are very honest, reasonable and make sure the customers are happy.

[SilveR316]

No way in hell i could do them myself...apparently its a bitch to get the rears but certainly not 8 hours.

I had mine done at RPM Import and Domestic...5 hours at $95/hour. These guys are very honest, reasonable and make sure the customers are happy.

That is a lot more reasonable. After I heard Pfaff Tuning tell me it would cost $920 to install the springs, I was contemplating doing it myself. I've installed coilovers myself before and theres no way it would take 8 hours to do the entire car.

[wwhan]

No way in hell i could do them myself...apparently its a bitch to get the rears but certainly not 8 hours.

Actually, the rear springs are pretty easy, if you have a second person using a heavy 4 foot pry bar on the lower control arm, while you remove the rear OEM spring.

[adbender]

You guys are way handier than me. Im missing some of the essentials like a garage, lifts, pry bars, skills and friends.

[mattchat]

Any updates from anyone....settling, squeeking, spring clatter, etc. Getting ready to make the switch to KW HAS from OE sports myself.

[Bikel]

Any updates from anyone....settling, squeeking, spring clatter, etc. Getting ready to make the switch to KW HAS from OE sports myself.

no issues whatsoever after 9 months on KW HAS. [up] 25.75" at all four corners since day one...

[ModBargains.com]

Glad to hear that you're happy with the KW Adjustable Spring Kit for your B8 S4 (http://www.modbargains.com/kw-adjustable-spring-kit-audi.htm)!

[adbender]

now sitting about 26" on all corners with a finger gap...perfect for me.

Installed in October 2013 and no rattling or squeaking any more.

Total of 3 track days and a very harsh city winter with them and they have been fantastic.

Only regret is not installing them the first round.

[TSXCman]

Are adjustable coilovers the way to go for Canadian winters? How hard is it to adjust from a winter setup (little drop) to a summer setup (medium drop) ?

Is it as easy as lifting the car and rotating parts?

[adbender]

Are adjustable coilovers the way to go for Canadian winters? How hard is it to adjust from a winter setup (little drop) to a summer setup (medium drop) ?

Is it as easy as lifting the car and rotating parts?

you can raise an lower with a lift...its not an issue after the install.

Only issue is alignment adjustments which technically should be done with each change.

I have heard if you leave it untouched..eventually it will seize over the years.

[audistealth]

you can raise an lower with a lift...its not an issue after the install.

Only issue is alignment adjustments which technically should be done with each change.

I have heard if you leave it untouched..eventually it will seize over the years.

Do they have a lubrication maintenance cycle to prevent seizing?

[adbender]

Do they have a lubrication maintenance cycle to prevent seizing?

good question...

[TSXCman]

you can raise an lower with a lift...its not an issue after the install.

Only issue is alignment adjustments which technically should be done with each change.

I have heard if you leave it untouched..eventually it will seize over the years.

Is it true that if you don't use it, you lose it? ;)

[mattchat]

DONE! And yes, another ADS equipped B8.5 happier on these springs over the H&Rs. Just a bit more supple on dynamic and comfort now has no bounce to it at all. I'm sitting at about 26" all corners though the front drivers has settled slightly lower, getting my final adjustment done on Friday with an alignment (my steering wheel is slightly off too). Its a few mm lower than I had with H&R and it seems to scrape a tad more....strange, even though its such a slight difference in height but I think it shows the difference in the spring rates. I think those H&Rs were just too stiff. Cornering feels good too, hard to compare it to the H&R but I would say the same, just overall better ride comfort. I did notice a time or two when I hit a hard bump or porthole that I had some spring clatter? Anyone else have this or know if there is a fix, things to look for when I take it back in for final adjustment on Friday?

Also, the install took them 7.5 hours and Audi calls for a 10 hour job for "spring" replacements from factory so I don't think Pfaff was far off. I was expecting a quicker install myself but my shop called and told me it was going to take longer, rear was a pain!

[SilveR316]

It's been a few months since I got my set on, but I adjusted my ride height a bit lower a while back and the springs have finally settled. I still have about half an inch of room to go lower, but I think this is plenty low enough for me.

The spring clatter is the lower coils slapping together on bumps. I'm going to get some of those Tien spring silencer rubbers and see if that fixes it.

http://i192.photobucket.com/albums/z43/FindATherapist/DSC_0492_zps4939fcf7.jpg

[mattchat]

It's been a few months since I got my set on, but I adjusted my ride height a bit lower a while back and the springs have finally settled. I still have about half an inch of room to go lower, but I think this is plenty low enough for me.

The spring clatter is the lower coils slapping together on bumps. I'm going to get some of those Tien spring silencer rubbers and see if that fixes it.

http://i192.photobucket.com/albums/z43/FindATherapist/DSC_0492_zps4939fcf7.jpg

Let me know how that goes, and what is your ride height? wheel well to ground?

[HRDNTS]

Do they have a lubrication maintenance cycle to prevent seizing?

After setting the height on my other car, I wrapped the threaded areas around the spring perch with 2 layers of black insulation tape. This helps prevent damage from stray rocks and prevents the thread filling up with dirt/grime. When they get grubby/banged up, that can be a real problem if you want to adjust the height in the future.
I wanted to drop the height after over 2 years of daily driving and after peeling back some of the tape, it was still like brand new.

[SilveR316]

Let me know how that goes, and what is your ride height? wheel well to ground?

I'm at approx. 25.75" ground to fender.

[provenflipper]

Is there any disadvantage to using these on a non ADS equipped B8.5?

[mattchat]

So I had 5 people in my car last night and I was getting some rubbing (the car, not the people though that happened too). It sounded more like metal though so I'm wondering if the tighter springs were touching. Going in Friday for my final adjustment so I'll have to bring this up. Might have to raise my ride height a bit. Possibly go 26.25.


Is there any disadvantage to using these on a non ADS equipped B8.5?
None, other than they're expensive springs and you should just fork out some extra cash for coilovers.

[mattchat]

Looking at the install manual today the specs show 345mm from center hub to fender edge which would put standard fit tires and all in to about 26.1 inches fender edge to floor in the front (so I'm close to spec), but it does request 350mm in the rear, which raises it to about 26.25 inches and I think would make the wheel gap front and rear perfect. Right now the back gap is less than the front.

Anyone with ADS know if they kept the rear caps on their car? One issue on the H&R forums and ADS was to make sure that those rear caps were removed otherwise the ride height would be a lot higher in the back. With the H&R installed on my car, gaps were pretty dang close (without that rear spring cap from the ADS springs). Obviously the KW HAS is adjustable but did anyone keep their rear caps in? Wondering if that might be related to the noise issue I mentioned above.

[mrpeterparker]

what was the result here?

[mattchat]

No more noise issues just unsure about the ride height. Had my shop adjust twice now and it still isn't right. Front driver is 26.25, my target height, front passenger is 26 and rears are like 26.5 and 26.75. Rears fluctuate a bit after a drive but not too bad. Wonder what moron in the shop was measuring the height and if they drove it around the block after each adjustment to make sure. Not happy with them anymore. They couldn't even install my Eurocode short shifter properly. Was all kind of stuck getting out of reverse and got under the car myself to fix it. These guys are the only shop in town to do aftermarket Exotic car mods and my Audi was probably the cheapest car in their getting work done. So frustrating. I need to just go in and adjust myself and have audi do the alignment.

[blackbenzz]

Will the HAS go low enough to tuck some tire?

[raudiace4]

Very nice, I looked into these as well before ultimately deciding to go full coils. Glad you like them [up]