Potential owner?

[Geoduck]

Test drove an S4 DSG last week at the dealer and was very impressed. Coming from a 4cyl Honda Accord you see how amazed I was with the power, handling, braking, interior, etc.

Been lurking around and reading up and it seems there really haven't been any issues with the 6MT vs the DSG. Have read that a few '13's are already starting to have issues. I was looking to get a DSG because I was impressed with the shifting characteristics and I also live in an area with high traffic and hills. On the other hand, I have heard about idling issues with the DSG in higher temps and I live in very mild climate so it might not be an issue?

I was basically going to build a premium plus, with MMI, DSG, 19"Peelers, and the Sport Diff/Dynamic package. Dealer would give me 6% off MSRP. I don't mind getting a 6MT but if I'll have less issues to deal with I'll go manual.

Thanks

[VeryBadman]

I'm not sure what dealer you are going to work with but ask them for invoice price and offer 500 on top of that. 6% off from MSRP is not a good deal.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

[Geoduck]

With the options I want KBB has it at $51,631 for the invoice price. Decent?

[millerrh]

I thought I read somewhere (and also seemed to verify with sites like KBB) that Audi charges 6% over invoice to come up with their MSRP. Wouldn't that make 6% off close to invoice? Or am I wrong about that?

[VeryBadman]

That sounds good to me. Just try to make it not going over $53,000. Dealership like to say they break even at invoice but that's just not true. I was just offered for another car at invoice price and it's just impossible to think that they would sell me the car without any profit at all.

Good luck with the negotiation!

BTW, where are you in Bay Area? I'm in Concord/Clayton area.

[Geoduck]

I thought I read somewhere (and also seemed to verify with sites like KBB) that Audi charges 6% over invoice to come up with their MSRP. Wouldn't that make 6% off close to invoice? Or am I wrong about that?

Milerrh, I noticed you are awaiting delivery of your S4. My dealer said if I order this month I will be expecting an Oct. delivery, how long do you have to wait for yours?

[Geoduck]

That sounds good to me. Just try to make it not going over $53,000. Dealership like to say they break even at invoice but that's just not true. I was just offered for another car at invoice price and it's just impossible to think that they would sell me the car without any profit at all.

Good luck with the negotiation!

BTW, where are you in Bay Area? I'm in Concord/Clayton area.

Thanks and I'm from the City!

[Madbusy168]

I see that you have a 2010 accord, if you dont intend to keep the S4 till its past the warranty period then it shouldnt matter if you get the dsg or the 6spd. Everythings gonna be covered right? lol And unlike Honda, Audi provides loaners so go with what you liike. I also had no problem getting either stick or dsg, but ended up with the dsg cause its 2mpg more and faster than the 6spd. Do I miss the manual shifting once in a while? yes, but do I like the more Mature feel of the Dsg? Yes ( I dont feel as Fast and Furious when im in an automatic) lol

[millerrh]

Milerrh, I noticed you are awaiting delivery of your S4. My dealer said if I order this month I will be expecting an Oct. delivery, how long do you have to wait for yours?

That's a great question. A dealer on these forums looked it up a few weeks back and said it would be August 31st. I might hit him up in a week or so again to be sure.

But I went into my dealer the other day to ask him, and rather than actually look anything up, gave me a blanket "90 days from date of order" line. Which would put me in October...even though I ordered at the end of June. I'm pretty frustrated by the lack of support my dealer has given me thus far. I feel pretty in the dark about the actual status of the thing. Would be further frustrated if I found out 6% really was considered a bad deal. Two dealers I negotiated with wouldn't budge below 5% of MSRP.

[Geoduck]

I see that you have a 2010 accord, if you dont intend to keep the S4 till its past the warranty period then it shouldnt matter if you get the dsg or the 6spd. Everythings gonna be covered right? lol And unlike Honda, Audi provides loaners so go with what you liike. I also had no problem getting either stick or dsg, but ended up with the dsg cause its 2mpg more and faster than the 6spd. Do I miss the manual shifting once in a while? yes, but do I like the more Mature feel of the Dsg? Yes ( I dont feel as Fast and Furious when im in an automatic) lol

When I'm buying a car like this, MPG is prob last on my list of things to worry about. I prob intend to keep it past warranty and there is an excellent Audi master mechanic where I live that is very reasonable and honest so if I have issues I won't be robbed blind by a stealership.


That's a great question. A dealer on these forums looked it up a few weeks back and said it would be August 31st. I might hit him up in a week or so again to be sure.

But I went into my dealer the other day to ask him, and rather than actually look anything up, gave me a blanket "90 days from date of order" line. Which would put me in October...even though I ordered at the end of June. I'm pretty frustrated by the lack of support my dealer has given me thus far. I feel pretty in the dark about the actual status of the thing. Would be further frustrated if I found out 6% really was considered a bad deal. Two dealers I negotiated with wouldn't budge below 5% of MSRP.

I hate it when you put your hard earned money on the table and they take it for granted.

[VeryBadman]

When I'm buying a car like this, MPG is prob last on my list of things to worry about. I prob intend to keep it past warranty and there is an excellent Audi master mechanic where I live that is very reasonable and honest so if I have issues I won't be robbed blind by a stealership.

That's a right attitude. The reported consumption on the sticker is just a hair thin better than bullshit because in the reality especially in a city like San Francisco 20 - 22 MPG is pretty much a gift from heaven already.

Believe it or not, I used to think that I would keep my Audi's pass warranty but have never been able to pull it off. Something would come up and tempt me to make a switch before that.

[Madbusy168]

Believe it or not, I used to think that I would keep my Audi's pass warranty but have never been able to pull it off. Something would come up and tempt me to make a switch before that.

Haha, why do u think that I suggested that he has a high chance of not keeping his car past warranty? Especially seeing that he's coming from a 2010 accord. Honestly, a lot of owners here treat the s4 as a beater and gas is not an issue, but I'm assuming since op is coming from a more economical car, he's not loaded and in the long run that 2mpg is gonna make somewhat of a difference. Not saying he's a broke ass, but he's not like some of the fellow forum members here that has a Porsche or a Lamborghini in the garage either. It's like him telling me, since I'm driving a S4 now, gas shouldn't be an issue, yeah? Then it shouldn't be an issue to pay near full sticker also for this type of premium german car either then... Moneys money bro.. Me and my wife plunked over $100k in the same month this year to get a 2013 S4 and a 2013 Gs350, but she still fills up her car with regular, and I serious considered the S4 in dsg mainly cause of that 2 mpg difference. Sounds like we are weird and don't make sense, but I guess I am one of the more frugal owners here that tries to get the most bang for the buck type.

[Madbusy168]

Also, one of the reason most of us here that bought a S4 is that it's "wonderful efficiency " of the supercharged V6. Instead of a thirsty big V8. So don't be telling me that gas is not an issue here, lol..

[VeryBadman]

Also, one of the reason most of us here that bought a S4 is that it's "wonderful efficiency " of the supercharged V6. Instead of a thirsty big V8. So don't be telling me that gas is not an issue here, lol..

I didn't mean to say gas is not an issue but more of telling OP that be prepared for higher consumption than the advertised number. I live in the same area as him so I kinda what the actual number would be for this area. That's why I said it's a right attitude otherwise he could be disappointed to see a much lower MPG in the real life.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

[MVR 155]

I thought I read somewhere (and also seemed to verify with sites like KBB) that Audi charges 6% over invoice to come up with their MSRP. Wouldn't that make 6% off close to invoice? Or am I wrong about that?

This is exactly right, Audi has a 6% margin from invoice to MSRP, Audi also does not have holdback money so unless your buying a left over 2013 or getting current incentives (You would have to see what current offers are in place) don't expect to do any better than invoice. Chances of getting invoice on a 2014 since orders on them just started back at the end of April/Early May is also likely going to be rare as those ordered cars are just recently hitting dealerships.


Also since it's been brought up..... Mileage is going to vary based on many things such as driver, blended of fuel (some areas have ethanol which results in lower mileage), amount of stop/go traffic as well as topography. In my area (Chicagoland) it is mainly flat, I drive normal most of the time but like to jump on it/drive spiritedly here and there. Most of the traffic I encounter is light to moderate and Im seeing a combined 20-21mpg which is exactly what the car is rated at. Around my area the fuel is also up to 10% ethanol.

[afig367]

The issues with the DSG are overstated given the bias of the forums. People post when they have a problem, not when they don't, but the majority have no issues at all.

The DSG related to high traffic and temps is not the German-produced ZF that is in our cars. I believe well_armed pointed out that it's a different model manufactured by a Chinese subcontractor.

[focusaudi]

The issues with the DSG are overstated given the bias of the forums. People post when they have a problem, not when they don't, but the majority have no issues at all.

Well said, +1

[VeryBadman]

The issues with the DSG are overstated given the bias of the forums. People post when they have a problem, not when they don't, but the majority have no issues at all.

The DSG related to high traffic and temps is not the German-produced ZF that is in our cars. I believe well_armed pointed out that it's a different model manufactured by a Chinese subcontractor.

I have to agree. In my ownership I don't have issue even a single time with DSG.

[Dr GP]

I see that you have a 2010 accord, if you dont intend to keep the S4 till its past the warranty period then it shouldnt matter if you get the dsg or the 6spd. Everythings gonna be covered right? lol And unlike Honda, Audi provides loaners so go with what you liike. I also had no problem getting either stick or dsg, but ended up with the dsg cause its 2mpg more and faster than the 6spd. Do I miss the manual shifting once in a while? yes, but do I like the more Mature feel of the Dsg? Yes ( I dont feel as Fast and Furious when im in an automatic) lol

Unfortunately, the weak link with the 6mts is the clutch. If and when that goes, Audi will not be inclined to cover it under warranty, That being said, my second B8 S4 is arriving this week with a 6MT.

[Geoduck]

I guess the 6% off isn't that bad. I'll prob have to go back and drive a 6MT just to feel the difference. Yeah, I figure the clutch is a wear item and not covered under warranty and with all the hills I have to deal with I'd prob need a new clutch fairly early. Thanks for all the inputs!

[LakeShow]

I saw DSG all the way. You get the most for your money because its an expensive transmission that you only pay about a 1k premium over a 6MT and its the best transmission in the world used on every supercar these days. I mean the S4/S5 are the only Audi's with an offered DSG other than the R8 in which they just made the Dual clutch available for 2014. Not even the S6/7/8 or RS6 in Europe have the dual clutch, just 8-speed autos.

[Dr Chill]

Uh.... my 2014 S6 has a DSG. As does the S7.

[s4buckeye]

Uh.... my 2014 S6 has a DSG. As does the S7.

Lol, exactly. Soooooo much misinformation around here it hurts.

Kind of like the "you can only do as well as invoice" on a 2013 S4 and "Audi has no holdback" nonsense.

It is indeed amazing that a fool and his money got together in the the first place.




I guess the 6% off isn't that bad. I'll prob have to go back and drive a 6MT just to feel the difference. Yeah, I figure the clutch is a wear item and not covered under warranty and with all the hills I have to deal with I'd prob need a new clutch fairly early. Thanks for all the inputs!


OP: you CAN do better than invoice on a 2013 if you shop it around the Bay. As to the 6MT in SF, I drove a stick for years when we lived in the city. It sucked, as you already know.

[VeryBadman]

Uh.... my 2014 S6 has a DSG. As does the S7.

+1 S6 comes with DSG.

And yeah, driving manual in Bay Area is suck.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

[MVR 155]

Lol, exactly. Soooooo much misinformation around here it hurts.

Kind of like the "you can only do as well as invoice" on a 2013 S4 and "Audi has no holdback" nonsense.

It is indeed amazing that a fool and his money got together in the the first place.






OP: you CAN do better than invoice on a 2013 if you shop it around the Bay. As to the 6MT in SF, I drove a stick for years when we lived in the city. It sucked, as you already know.

Im guessing you must be referring to my post??? I suggest you read it more clearly.......

This is copy/pasted directly from my post.....

This is exactly right, Audi has a 6% margin from invoice to MSRP, Audi also does not have holdback money so unless your buying a left over 2013 or getting current incentives (You would have to see what current offers are in place) don't expect to do any better than invoice. Chances of getting invoice on a 2014 since orders on them just started back at the end of April/Early May is also likely going to be rare as those ordered cars are just recently hitting dealerships.

Audi also does NOT have holdback money..... there may be dealer cash for clearing out inventory etc... but Audi does not have holdback. Feel free to do your own research and report back. Also if your referring to me as "a fool and his money" I got my car under invoice and it was before the 2014 orders were being taken so I don't think I did too "foolish" on my deal. I simply told the OP that he should not expect to do better than invoice on a 2014, it does not state anywhere that it's impossible or he will "never" get it. So before you make another stupid comment/assumption you may want to try reading a bit better.

[s4buckeye]

Im guessing you must be referring to my post???

Defensive much? Borrowing from your affinity for bold type and italics, no, I was not referring specifically to your post. I was referring to the common refrain heard often that "you can't do better than invoice" as most people seem to automatically think that invoice plus $500 is a good deal. "Invoice" is rarely (if ever) what a dealer paid for a car, and when you factor in the multiple layers of holdback, incentives and other financial twists and turns (kickback of a point on financing, etc.), invoice means nothing.

However, if we are talking about being incorrect, you can say all day that Audi does not have any holdback, but they do, along with incentives and that is a fact. "Holdback" is a vague term meaning different things to different manufacturers, but it is always a subsidy to the dealer from the manufacturer that affects the "true" net cost paid by the dealer for the vehicle.

Stop whining and being so self-conscious, defensive and lame.

[MVR 155]

Defensive much? Borrowing from your affinity for bold type and italics, no, I was not referring specifically to your post. I was referring to the common refrain heard often that "you can't do better than invoice" as most people seem to automatically think that invoice plus $500 is a good deal. "Invoice" is rarely (if ever) what a dealer paid for a car, and when you factor in the multiple layers of holdback, incentives and other financial twists and turns (kickback of a point on financing, etc.), invoice means nothing.

However, if we are talking about being incorrect, you can say all day that Audi does not have any holdback, but they do, along with incentives and that is a fact. "Holdback" is a vague term meaning different things to different manufacturers, but it is always a subsidy to the dealer from the manufacturer that affects the "true" net cost paid by the dealer for the vehicle.

Stop whining and being so self-conscious, defensive and lame.

Since you were not referring to my post then no harm....no foul..... I was not being self conscious, defensive and lame, it simply looked like you near quoted what I said in an earlier post and made the comment about "a fool and his money". Water under the bridge.

[s4buckeye]

Lol. Ok man.