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Ryanic
06-27-2013, 08:35 AM
So i'm curious as if anyone could give me some suggestions/thoughts/opinions on a issue that has started creeping up on me with my 98 A4. When I first got the car it shifted like butter, and didn't have any issues shifting into gears etc (Maybe once or twice it was notchy going into 2nd or 3rd). But for me having not driven a manual for over a year and a half and for some reason I was unable to get used to the whole really high engage point on the clutch seemed to have cause some issues with my transmission/clutch/etc. My poor audi :( didn't deserve to get hurt from my lack of proper shifting while relearning/getting used to the car

*Also like to point out I've only own this for a month, and i assume it was almost mostly city driven it's entire life. Currently has 138,500

The issue is that my 2nd and 3rd gear are almost always notchy feeling at any speed/rpm combo. (Used to be butter a month ago). Also when I shift into 2nd at low RPM, around 2,500-3,000 I get a really bad like double clunk/lurch (Or maybe it's only one clunk, I try to ignore it :/). I also have the clunk sometimes in lower rpms in 3rd but it's not as violent. When I shift into 2nd or 3rd in higher rpms, 4,000-5,000 it doesn't seem to clunk/lurch, but more so feels like it grabs and lurches because of the grab. Idk honestly I'm horrible when it comes to diagnosing this stuff...I'm just learning more about cars lately so excuse my misuse of words/lack of proper descriptions.

I talked to my brother about it, who knows cars pretty well. He said it could be possibly my mounts becoming loose/worn out. Could be some transmission slave drive/valve??? I don't remember the name he told me, it was a few days ago. He didn't think it was the clutch... What exactly does a slipping clutch feel like? I'll be driving my car again today so I'll pay very close attention to what happens in different rpm/speeds/gears and report back with a better description etc.

I just want to get an understanding of what could be going wrong etc...because if there is something I can do/try to replace from my parts car I want to before parting out those parts that I could have used...

I know the first thing would be to replace the transmission fluid to help the notchy feeling, but I can live with that for now. I'm just more so concerned about the clunking/lurch when shifting.

Thank you everyone who looks at this and offers suggestions/thoughts!

M-Hood
06-27-2013, 09:08 AM
The clunk could also be the dual mass flywheel failing and the B5 is known for the rear diff clunking because the stock rear diff mount is too soft.

Artiemas
06-27-2013, 09:08 AM
The clunk comes on after you disengage the clutch? If so, that's a very common problems with our B5s/. Do some mild searxching and you'll find that people are running a lot of 034 Mounts. The snub and the SD 034 Engine mounts.

If you can get the car on a lift, you can actually move the drive shaft back and forth and replicate the "clunk" you are talking about.

Look at all your Diff carrier mounts, and look into the Stern Power ring, and your transmission mounts.

I wouldn't be surprised at all if your snubv mount (its the mount that pushes into the front clip) is also about to fall apart.

Ryanic
06-27-2013, 07:10 PM
So did some more driving today, and It seems to kind of be random (Random is hard to say because it's obviously dependent on how smooth the release of the clutch pedal was). But I had times when it was smooth on a shift to 2nd at 3,000 and I've had times where it was really bad at the same scenario. I did notice though if I REALLYYY babied the shift, like waited for the RPM's to fall down to like 1,000 or less before shifting and making sure that I released the clutch really smooth it was better...but that made shifting unnatural. I also did get the clunk a few times while shifting into 4th.

The lurch/clunk almost seemed to be coming from the front of the car though?

And the lurch/clunk is by far the worst shifting into second...And it usually does a double lurch and one clunk...

@artiemas yes the clunk/lurch happens after when I fully release the clutch pedal (Back up into normal position under the dash) and it grabs.

One piece of information that may or may not help is this only happens on upshifting....When i downshift coming to stop signs/turns etc It doesn't lurch or clunk...I only get the rapid increase of rpms which is supposed to happen lol and the "lurch forward" from that....

I also don't have access to a lift... So would it be best to just jack up the front of my car as much as possible and crawl under it to check the mounts etc? What am I looking for exactly with the diff carrier mounts/transmission mounts. If they're just really worn or what?

Artiemas
06-27-2013, 07:41 PM
What Mike said. The rear diff mount is much too soft. Look into that and the stern power ring. It might fix some of your issue.

Your snub mount might also be cause a lot of clunk, look into replacing that.

It could also be your DMF failing - though I've yet to hear of one failing at your mileage. Excuse me if there has been, though. Basically what happens is the membrane between the two discs in the flywheel deterioates and allows a lot of rotational play.

But, in (probably) your case, your mounts are worn.

Refer to my previous post for some suggestions as to fix them.

Ryanic
06-27-2013, 07:49 PM
I have a parts car so I'd like to pull the mounts from that if they're any good/better than mine. Which is why I asked what I should be looking for when checking if the mounts are any good anymore. Thank you for your help thus far though :) I've never touched anything actually underneath a car before except bolting on a exhaust on my last car so if you know of any tutorials/care to explain the steps required/what I should be looking for that'd be amazing! I don't mind getting my hands dirty I just don't know how to do much so I learn by tutorials.

Also I'll look into the stern power ring if I do a few mount swaps etcs and it doesn't improve much. I'd rather just use my parts car for now since I'm really low on money...and honestly I can't even afford the 57$ for the power ring right now.. :'(

gmx
06-27-2013, 11:31 PM
You should focus on the snub mount and rear diff mount (Apikol one imo) first and foremost.

The rear and centre diffs accumulate considerable amount of wear and backlash over time. Test them out on a lift.

If you can't afford the power ring, just get some urethane filler and fill up the mount yourself and do the same with the gearbox ones if you want to (honestly I would not touch gearbox until you pinpoint and eliminate 1 by 1).

Mad Cow
06-28-2013, 06:28 AM
What Mike said. The rear diff mount is much too soft. Look into that and the stern power ring. It might fix some of your issue.

Your snub mount might also be cause a lot of clunk, look into replacing that.

It could also be your DMF failing - though I've yet to hear of one failing at your mileage. Excuse me if there has been, though. Basically what happens is the membrane between the two discs in the flywheel deterioates and allows a lot of rotational play.

But, in (probably) your case, your mounts are worn.

Refer to my previous post for some suggestions as to fix them.


I've pulled a DMF out of a motor with 170k km on it that was just out of spec in terms of rotational play, so it's definitely possible.

M-Hood
06-28-2013, 06:50 AM
I've pulled a DMF out of a motor with 170k km on it that was just out of spec in terms of rotational play, so it's definitely possible.

Brian in Australia had a issue just like this and he replace mounts and still couldn't figure it out till he pulled the flywheel out to find it had way too much play since the spring had gotten really soft. When this happens the part that rotates when the disk starts to make contact just slaps back really hard instead of slowly since there isn't enough tension on the spring to slow it down. The clunk is only going to happen when engaging the clutch going up thru the gears not when you down shift since at that point you are engine breaking using the driveline to slow down the motor.

Ryanic
06-28-2013, 07:50 AM
Brian in Australia had a issue just like this and he replace mounts and still couldn't figure it out till he pulled the flywheel out to find it had way too much play since the spring had gotten really soft. When this happens the part that rotates when the disk starts to make contact just slaps back really hard instead of slowly since there isn't enough tension on the spring to slow it down. The clunk is only going to happen when engaging the clutch going up thru the gears not when you down shift since at that point you are engine breaking using the driveline to slow down the motor.


Does the clunking happen when it's due to mounts upshifting and downshifting? Because if so...Basically ruled out those then (To be the main cause but could still have an effect)... Because like I said it only happens when upshifting and it doesn't happen when downshifting....

Artiemas
06-28-2013, 11:12 AM
You should focus on the snub mount and rear diff mount (Apikol one imo) first and foremost.

The rear and centre diffs accumulate considerable amount of wear and backlash over time. Test them out on a lift.

If you can't afford the power ring, just get some urethane filler and fill up the mount yourself and do the same with the gearbox ones if you want to (honestly I would not touch gearbox until you pinpoint and eliminate 1 by 1).

Completely forgot about that solution with the urethane filler. OP, look into this. It's chewaper, and I'm pretty sure it does really well. If I'm not mistakebn, Coolgraymemo did it? Not 100% sure.

Ryanic
06-28-2013, 01:53 PM
I'll look into it but again I'd like to ask does clunking happen if it's the mounts on up and down shifts....and it'll clunk only on up shifts and not on downshifts if it's the DMF?

Ryanic
06-29-2013, 11:10 PM
bumppp

Ryanic
07-01-2013, 08:21 AM
Anyone? I know to check the mounts / possibly going to have buy some new aftermarket ones etc. But I want to try and narrow this down to possibly mounts or possibly the dmf... The clunk/lurch only happens on upshifting and not on downshifting.

Cgoon009
07-01-2013, 09:02 AM
Brian in Australia had a issue just like this and he replace mounts and still couldn't figure it out till he pulled the flywheel out to find it had way too much play since the spring had gotten really soft. When this happens the part that rotates when the disk starts to make contact just slaps back really hard instead of slowly since there isn't enough tension on the spring to slow it down. The clunk is only going to happen when engaging the clutch going up thru the gears not when you down shift since at that point you are engine breaking using the driveline to slow down the motor.

I think M-Hood may have answered your question already

Ryanic
07-01-2013, 09:26 AM
Yes, I know but I wanted another person to verify this. :P I like to make sure I get two answers because people are sometimes wrong and i don't want to go tear into something all day and find out it didn't need to happen.

Cgoon009
07-01-2013, 09:32 AM
Ahh. Fair enough, well If you can get a hold of Walky Talky, he may be able to help. M-Hood does know his stuff, if that makes you feel better. Let us know what it ends up being.

Ryanic
07-07-2013, 10:45 PM
Update, since It seems to be getting a little worse... So today was 93 degrees out and after driving my car on the highway for about an hour I noticed when I came to a stop and tried to shift in all of the gears. It felts like metal on metal was sliding (Not grinding) and it was somewhat stiff/hard to engage in the gears...Almost felt like there was no transmission fluid to lubricate the shifts etc... I almost couldn't get it into first, and all of the gears were very notchy feeling to shift in to. After I got to work the car sat for 6 hours, and on my way home it was around 65 degrees and all the shifts were back to "normal" only slightly notchy feeling but it didn't feel like it was metal on metal. Idk its hard to describe, its almost like I could feel everything moving through the shifter.

I still have the clunk, but I've learned to shift smoother and slower so it's not as big of a issue but if I do shift fast it's still there...

I'm starting to believe I need to change my transmission fluid much sooner than I thought...My last manual kind of did this also but I never changed the fluid. Anyone agree? (My reasoning with my issues today was that it was so warm that the transmission oil got so thin that it wasn't working properly and yeah it was just a mess.) Also what transmission fluid/oil do you recommend for 98 2.8L Manual?

DeltaAlpha9
07-08-2013, 03:05 AM
Not sure if this is overly redundant but have you checked to make sure that you do in fact have gear lube in the transmission? As far as what I've used since I got the car I use Amsoil 75w-90 API GL-4. Apparently using GL-5 can eat your syncros so be cautious of that.


Link because why not.
http://www.amsoil.com/shop/by-product/transmission-fluid/manual/manual-transmission-and-transaxle-gear-lube-75w-90/?code=MTGQT-EA

Artiemas
07-08-2013, 06:07 AM
ECS Tuning has a few kits for the 2.8l that even includes a magnetic drain plug for the transmission.

Tanzimur
07-08-2013, 07:42 AM
All these clunks and what not remind me of my freinds gmc pick up it was a 5 speed and every time hed up shift it would clunk like hell till one day it got bad and we decided to take the tranny out and found a worn throw out bearing... just throwing that out there

Ryanic
07-08-2013, 09:20 AM
I think I just really need to change the transmission oil first, because I haven't checked if there is any left in it (I didn't notice any drip spots or anything under my car...but you never know). I'll have to pick up some 75w90 GL-4 Full Synthetic real soon. I've read online it takes about 3 quarts?

Artiemas
07-08-2013, 09:29 AM
http://www.audiforums.com/forum/diy-do-yourself-55/b5-5-spd-tranny-fluid-change-sandman-18729/

Artiemas
07-08-2013, 09:31 AM
http://www.audiforums.com/forum/diy-do-yourself-55/b5-5-spd-tranny-fluid-change-sandman-18729/

http://www.ecstuning.com/Audi-B5_A4-Quattro-V6_30v/Search/SiteSearch/Transmission/ES259863/

I dun goofed. Hit quote instead of edit.

M-Hood
07-08-2013, 10:54 AM
I think I just really need to change the transmission oil first, because I haven't checked if there is any left in it (I didn't notice any drip spots or anything under my car...but you never know). I'll have to pick up some 75w90 GL-4 Full Synthetic real soon. I've read online it takes about 3 quarts?

Yeah that would be the first thing to do. Is it still on the original transmission fluid?

If you drive in cold weather conditions you will want to stick with a GL4 gear oil that is on the thin side and yes it is about 3 quarts. I would not recommend MT90 for a car that is driving in cold weather conditions since it will be too thick and will cause shifting issues, that stuff is best suited for hot weather conditions. Redline does offer a MT85 and a MTL which would be a better choice in cold conditions. Other options would be Motul, Amsoil or just putting in fresh OEM gear oil.

Ryanic
07-08-2013, 03:44 PM
I live in Minnesota so it can get below 0 pretty often. I'll probably just use Amsoil 75W90 GL-4. And honestly I think it's still on original fluid... So it's time for a change. I checked online walmart and it looks like they only carry one brand that comes in 75w90...and it's a synthetic blend not full synthetic...and also it's online only. Yikes. I was really hoping for walmart to carry something because it's like 35% cheaper than Oreilys or Napa or something along those lines... I'll just have to drive around town tomorrow and find some.

Thanks everyone for your help thus far. I appreciate it.

M-Hood
07-09-2013, 09:37 AM
I live in Minnesota so it can get below 0 pretty often. I'll probably just use Amsoil 75W90 GL-4. And honestly I think it's still on original fluid... So it's time for a change. I checked online walmart and it looks like they only carry one brand that comes in 75w90...and it's a synthetic blend not full synthetic...and also it's online only. Yikes. I was really hoping for walmart to carry something because it's like 35% cheaper than Oreilys or Napa or something along those lines... I'll just have to drive around town tomorrow and find some.

Thanks everyone for your help thus far. I appreciate it.


Did you check Summit Racing or Jegs web sites?

Ryanic
07-09-2013, 04:09 PM
Drove around... Went to two different Oreilys and Napas, couple walmarts...Only found one that carried any kind of GL-4 75W90 fluid and it was Amsoil... It was $15 a quart so I didn't pick up any. I'm going to just have to order some online. And hope to get it within a few days.

I found Valvoline, Mobile 1, Lucas, and one other random brand all in 75W90 but they were GL-5... Do most of you guys just order it online when ever you've done your tranny fluid change?

Edit*
So I looked around online and I guess I can't find it for any cheaper than $15 a quart....is that pretty standard for full synthetic transmission oil/fluid?

M-Hood
07-09-2013, 06:12 PM
Drove around... Went to two different Oreilys and Napas, couple walmarts...Only found one that carried any kind of GL-4 75W90 fluid and it was Amsoil... It was $15 a quart so I didn't pick up any. I'm going to just have to order some online. And hope to get it within a few days.

I found Valvoline, Mobile 1, Lucas, and one other random brand all in 75W90 but they were GL-5... Do most of you guys just order it online when ever you've done your tranny fluid change?

Edit*
So I looked around online and I guess I can't find it for any cheaper than $15 a quart....is that pretty standard for full synthetic transmission oil/fluid?


Yeah that is about normal for gear oil, Motul 300 is closer to $20.

Ryanic
07-09-2013, 06:48 PM
Alright $15 a quart it is then... I'll pick up 3 quarts of Amsoil 75W90 GL-4 on Thursday and I'll change it out asap and let you guys know if it fixed anything.

DeltaAlpha9
07-10-2013, 01:46 AM
Don't forget to pick up a triple square tamper proof socket to drain the transmission. I find it ironic that Audi is fine with you filling it, but you need a special tool to drain it.

Cgoon009
07-10-2013, 07:21 AM
And take the filler plug out first

M-Hood
07-10-2013, 09:04 AM
Don't forget to pick up a triple square tamper proof socket to drain the transmission. I find it ironic that Audi is fine with you filling it, but you need a special tool to drain it.

Well it isn't to keep you from draining it, it is to keep some punk from draining it without you know it.

Cgoon009
07-10-2013, 09:11 AM
^ I always wondered that, I guess that would do some serious damage. Could you even drive it?

Mad Cow
07-10-2013, 10:03 AM
^ I always wondered that, I guess that would do some serious damage. Could you even drive it?

I drove for a week with basically no gear oil, stupid mistake mistake on my part. Apart from some gear noise in first that sounded almost exactly like a dying turbo and difficulty downshifting it was perfectly fine. Then one day it suddenly made made some scary noises and locked up on the highway.

I seriously doubt that tamper proof drain plugs are there to prevent vandalism, nobody is going to just crawl under your car and drain your diff and tranny in the middle of the night. Most likely has to do with these fluids being considered a "lifetime" fill by VAG, I guess to signify to shops that replacing the fluid isn't something that needs to be done regularly, basically covering their asses if a shop puts in the wrong stuff while the car is still under warranty.