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View Full Version : Cheapest source for pistons



nynoah
11-05-2012, 04:44 PM
Ok guys as some of you know, I am building my 1.8t right now. I dropped my motor off at the shop over a month ago. They have been dragging their heels for ever. Winter is coming and I am going to be screwed soon. Well the shop called last night and said that they could not hone my block to stock piston size, that they needed to go 1mm over. So now I am screwed. Because I don't have the cash. Does anyone know of the cheapest source or have a line of some used 1mm over pistons?

Seerlah
11-05-2012, 04:50 PM
What was wrong with your block that they could not hone the cylinder walls? And why couldn't you do this yourself?

nynoah
11-05-2012, 04:53 PM
They said there was too much material missing to get it to seal again.

Seerlah
11-05-2012, 05:30 PM
Take the block back, hone it yourself, and check the piston to cylinder wall clearance yourself. I'll even let you borrow my honing tool. I personally don't know how to do this properly, so you need to research that yourself. I would think rings with piston would need to be installed to check. But if rings check out, so should the piston. Sold my bore gauge, otherwise I would have let you borrow that too.

tHatOne guY
11-05-2012, 05:33 PM
They said there was too much material missing to get it to seal again.


Did the cylinder walls have any damage to them other than typical wear n tear? dropped valve? excessively scuffed? anything?

Seerlah
11-05-2012, 05:35 PM
I am thinking incompetent shop, but didn't want to just come out and say it.

tHatOne guY
11-05-2012, 05:42 PM
I'm leaning towards that myself.

nynoah
11-05-2012, 05:48 PM
Its 3zero3 motorsport, so they are not incompetent. But that does not mean that someone at the machine shop was not a fool.

thenj3
11-05-2012, 05:51 PM
How many miles on the block? My guess is that they might have started to oval. I'd always do a overbore to allow for a good solid seal against the wall.

nynoah
11-05-2012, 05:52 PM
So now the other option is to return all the parts I bought like rods (which I have to return no matter what to get 20mm ones), calico bearings, seals, ARP main bolts, IE dowel pinned pulley.... and just pick this up
http://www.audizine.com/classifieds/showproduct.php?product=80912&title=2-1-shortblock&cat=21

What makes me hesitate is that I have a GTRS turbo setup with a UNI 630 tune. Can that tune be used with that 2.1 stroker kit?

Seerlah
11-05-2012, 05:58 PM
An engine is basically a vacuum. With 2.1L of displacement you are simply drawing in more air. Slight tuning to compensate for this added air (more fuel) will need to be done.

And to add to the thread I checked the bore on my original block before I proceeded to build it with a bore gauge, which ended up being a catastrophe by itself (scratched bore on cylinder 4). Picked up block from thenj3 and did not even bother to check the bore on that block. Worked out for me. Thing is, I trust him. And I trust me...most times anyways.

nynoah
11-05-2012, 06:02 PM
So even if I go 1mm over I am screwed with the tune?

Seerlah
11-05-2012, 06:05 PM
Most likely, yes. One more reason Maestro is just the better route. But you won't know if you would need to unless you log your AFR afterwards. ECU may be able to compensate.

nynoah
11-05-2012, 06:07 PM
I have a wide band AWM

Seerlah
11-05-2012, 06:09 PM
I can not recall up to what percentage, but the ECU will compensate to correct fueling up to a certain range. After that you will run lean or rich, depending.

nynoah
11-05-2012, 06:10 PM
So basically return all the parts, pay the show what I owe them and buy the 2.1 stroker. Sell the Uni tune and buy Maestro.

nynoah
11-05-2012, 06:12 PM
but that makes me worry that my 240 mm FX300 clutch will not hold. Ahhhhh

Seerlah
11-05-2012, 06:13 PM
Sounds like a plan. And while you are at it, upgrade your turbo [up]. And the 240mm FX300 is good for 525 ft/lbs torque at the flywheel.

thenj3
11-05-2012, 06:16 PM
The difference will be minimal, but with maestro you will be able to easily change your injector constant to compensate for the difference. Then when you change turbo which I hope you would provided you would have a 2.1 it will be easy to tune for bigger turbo and injectors.

Mitch I do hope not measuring works out for in theblong run...

nynoah
11-05-2012, 06:25 PM
I also have this fear of Maestro. So many stories of people being swamped trying to tune their car.

Seerlah
11-05-2012, 06:28 PM
Mitch I do hope not measuring works out for in the long run...

Only thing I did not measure was for ovalation. I measured all else.

redline380
11-06-2012, 07:25 AM
but that makes me worry that my 240 mm FX300 clutch will not hold. Ahhhhh
that clutch will hold just fine. my s4 clutch holds 2871r fine. for how long? i dont know but it hasnt slipped in a few thousand miles

M-Hood
11-06-2012, 12:35 PM
So now the other option is to return all the parts I bought like rods (which I have to return no matter what to get 20mm ones), calico bearings, seals, ARP main bolts, IE dowel pinned pulley.... and just pick this up
http://www.audizine.com/classifieds/showproduct.php?product=80912&title=2-1-shortblock&cat=21

What makes me hesitate is that I have a GTRS turbo setup with a UNI 630 tune. Can that tune be used with that 2.1 stroker kit?

2.1 liter is a horrible motor, doesn't rev for crap which means that extra .1 liter replaces the 1k+ extra rpm you can rev a 1.8-2.0L. A GTRS is going to feel like a K04 when used on a 2.1 liter.


Other option is to just return the 19mm IE rods for a set of 20mm IE rods and then get a set of aftermarket pistons in the size you need. You can go 81.5 - 83.5mm depending on if you want to increase your displacement up to 1.9 liter with the stock crank.

geeky
11-06-2012, 03:54 PM
Just buy my spare 06A block. You can buy just the block for $150. Pm me if you're interested or ask jordan for my number.

nynoah
11-06-2012, 06:05 PM
I have 2 blocks already

thenj3
11-06-2012, 06:57 PM
Build one with a stroker.

M-Hood
11-07-2012, 06:02 AM
I have 2 blocks already

Switch to the other block if you want to stick with stock pistons.

nynoah
11-07-2012, 07:06 AM
That block had the AC assembly mounting points RIPPED off by a dukes of hazard incident.

M-Hood
11-07-2012, 07:14 AM
That block had the AC assembly mounting points RIPPED off by a dukes of hazard incident.

Makes it the perfect "Race Car" block. Do you need AC up in Denver?


If you change to an aftermarket piston to build the block they have now it will run you around $500+.

nynoah
11-07-2012, 07:56 AM
Denver gets to be like 110 in the summer. Mind you I have not had AC for a while. But I drove my spare car when it became unbearable. I would much rather keep my AC. Which speaking of AC, I need a 1.8t AC pulley if anyone has one.

thenj3
11-07-2012, 08:26 AM
I have my old compressor laying around

geeky
11-07-2012, 09:22 AM
That block had the AC assembly mounting points RIPPED off by a dukes of hazard incident.

so technically you have ZERO blocks. You have one that needs to be over bored and in turn you need to return/exchange and purchase new parts and you have another one that doesn't have the structural integrity/mounting points for the AC while my block I currently have is a good shortblock and all mounting holes are still perfect. Like I said I'll sell you just the block and throw in an AC compressor for free.

walky_talky20
11-07-2012, 09:30 AM
so technically you have ZERO blocks. You have one that needs to be over bored and in turn you need to return/exchange and purchase new parts and you have another one that doesn't have the structural integrity/mounting points for the AC while my block I currently have is a good shortblock and all mounting holes are still perfect. Like I said I'll sell you just the block and throw in an AC compressor for free.

^I'd steer clear of this guy. He's obviously trying to swindle you with his "free" stuff, good prices, and sound logic.

geeky
11-07-2012, 09:46 AM
^I'd steer clear of this guy. He's obviously trying to swindle you with his "free" stuff, good prices, and sound logic.

Walky, you forgot the part that the block is local and he can pick it up today!

walky_talky20
11-07-2012, 09:58 AM
See? He's definitely trying to hustle you.

M-Hood
11-07-2012, 11:24 AM
Walky, you forgot the part that the block is local and he can pick it up today!

Noah this might be your best option, plus you can always sell your other block to someone that needs a block to go 2 liter or 1.9 liter with a overbore. You could even hold onto the block that needs to be bored out in case you feel like doing a 2 liter build later on while the car is running.

geeky
11-07-2012, 12:22 PM
See? He's definitely trying to hustle you.

+1

Seerlah
11-07-2012, 12:44 PM
II only have one mounting point left for my AC compresser. The other 2 thread nipples are cracked in half (half missing), and I can lay the bolt down on top of them. So, I did just that and added JB Weld. Holds fine for me.

nynoah
11-07-2012, 01:23 PM
Alright so plans are to return parts and get +.5 mm over. I am going to return some other parts and the rods. I am going to have the pistons coated on the tops and sides. This way I can keep my standard tune. If I was going to use the stock pistons, I was going to have them coated anyways. I already have this block honed out to those specs for those pistons. So if I used the other block, I would have to pay more machine shop costs to have it done like this one, and even then, I am not sure if I will not end up in the same exact position I am in now.

Oh car stress... [:/]

thenj3
11-07-2012, 03:47 PM
It's worth it dude. All the pain you go through fly out the window when it runs. Everytime I drive mine huge smile across my face

melomandn
11-07-2012, 06:05 PM
2.1 liter is a horrible motor, doesn't rev for crap which means that extra .1 liter replaces the 1k+ extra rpm you can rev a 1.8-2.0L. A GTRS is going to feel like a K04 when used on a 2.1 liter.


Other option is to just return the 19mm IE rods for a set of 20mm IE rods and then get a set of aftermarket pistons in the size you need. You can go 81.5 - 83.5mm depending on if you want to increase your displacement up to 1.9 liter with the stock crank.

I feel like a huge noob, but how does that extra .1 liter make it so bad and why cant you rev it out that extra 1k?

walky_talky20
11-07-2012, 06:22 PM
I'm going to take rod to stroke ratio for 800 Alex.