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britishturbo
09-26-2012, 01:18 PM
So I recently picked up my first Audi... a 2001.5 S4 6 speed.
Got it from a friend of mine, he had it parked in his junk yard... it had dropped a valve which put a hole through a piston.

So I towed the car home (Always had a love for B5 S4's)
https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/s720x720/578673_10150958794242895_660417618_n.jpg

Then I pulled the engine:
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-RJkRdZ4bD6s/UCfKepuSxtI/AAAAAAAAP-8/QRYdM2x4mxY/s903/IMG_20120812_103429.jpg

Another friend had a complete running 2.7 from an A6 so I got that from him.

So then came the decision... put the stock engine in and be content with 250HP for a while and then tear it apart when I want more power... Or do it right from the start?

So I did it right from the start.... Over the last month or two I've been building my own custom single turbo setup.
Mocking up the single turbo up pipes (used 2.8 manifolds and 034 Motorsports flanges)

Late night victory - engine installed. And yes I'm doing this outside under my car port... The garage is full with my Eclipse racecar I'm building...
https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/546384_10151055367007895_822259264_n.jpg

Turbo installed - yes I cut the 2nd firewall slightly for many reasons, but It's going to get boxed back in nicely :)
https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/282209_10151071253097895_901610002_n.jpg

I'll post more pics and details soon when it's all complete, but here's the first start up of the car :D


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZkswagyjBCY

Now I need to install my fuel system... :-D
https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/156173_10151073703077895_457300765_n.jpg

Goal is a 400 to 500 WHP daily driver at first to replace my 350HP daily driver AWD Talon.
I'll build a new motor over the winter with all forged internals, CNC ported heads (I'll port them myself), Billet Intake manifold (again I'll make this myself ;-)) and much much more...

P.S. I'm sure this belongs int he builds and projects sub forum but I don't have enough posts to put it there yet...

britishturbo
09-26-2012, 01:19 PM
I have to fly out to Arizona this weekend to help some people setup and tune some Megasquirt's, once I'm back I will hopefully have the car moving under it's own power next week. :-)

034Motorsport
09-26-2012, 01:22 PM
From stock to big single turbo! Love it!

Looks like you got your work cut out with the fueling system, but looks like you are doing it right.

What turbo did you go with?

s4930
09-26-2012, 01:22 PM
Wow way to break the ice lol.... Interested in seeing the out come for sure!

britishturbo
09-26-2012, 01:28 PM
Hey Max, thanks I was quite inspired by the 034 STK as you can see... I just couldn't wait to get started lol.
The fuel system shown is the planned final fuel system, but at first I'm just going to run with a bigger pump and injectors until I get my new fuel rails made. Then I'll go with the full system.

The turbo is a custom build based on a Borg Warner S256 w. 0.63 A/R hot side.
Turbo will support about 550 WHP. Should be good to start ;-)
I actually already had it from my Eclipse I'm building...
Here's the state of the Eclipse:
https://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/525776_10150883333937895_515349028_n.jpg
https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/526854_10150879776302895_1362650206_n.jpg



From stock to big single turbo! Love it!

Looks like you got your work cut out with the fueling system, but looks like you are doing it right.

What turbo did you go with?

britishturbo
09-26-2012, 01:29 PM
I'm never happy with stock power... I'll be sure to keep everyone updated :-)


Wow way to break the ice lol.... Interested in seeing the out come for sure!

coolgraymemo
09-26-2012, 01:32 PM
These forums need new members like yourself.

kbS42001
09-26-2012, 01:37 PM
very nice...cant wait to see more

Monty23
09-26-2012, 01:37 PM
BEST FIRST POST EVER! Glad to see another close by single setup. We will have to meet up when I finish my build!

What clutch are you running?

hendrj5689
09-26-2012, 01:41 PM
Looks awesome! Can't wait to see how everything finishes up!

britishturbo
09-26-2012, 01:41 PM
Thanks man! I appreciate that.
I've been reading AZ for a cpl months now doing research and the like.
OF all the forums for Audi's I think I like it the most!


These forums need new members like yourself.

britishturbo
09-26-2012, 01:45 PM
Fidanza Flywheel and Clutchmaster FX-400 6 Puck clutch

https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/488005_10151050030657895_1599863189_n.jpg
https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/561584_10151054814907895_1376377363_n.jpg
https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/395180_10151055364082895_1711683433_n.jpg

And sure man I always love to meet new people :-)


BEST FIRST POST EVER! Glad to see another close by single setup. We will have to meet up when I finish my build!

What clutch are you running?

britishturbo
09-26-2012, 01:49 PM
Btw I must say I feel the B5 s$ platform is very underrated to this day.
I think the problem is not many people push the engine to it's limits in every aspect.
Many people bolt on bigger turbos, but most people seem to not do enough work when it comes to the intake system or the fuel system.

I plan on seeing how far I can push things... I already have port designs ready to CNC and I'm working on my Intake manifold design too...
It doesn't hurt that I build 5 Axis CNC machines for a living ;-)

AudiNFS
09-26-2012, 01:51 PM
I wanna come by too! I rode in edge motors single turbo S4 and that thing was a monster.

britishturbo
09-26-2012, 01:51 PM
Intercooler setup:
https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/601432_10151075001232895_1557967044_n.jpg

Air to Water... because I can :-P
I like the idea of 3 feet of intercooler system lol.
Ignore the mess and dirt... things are still very much work in progress...

britishturbo
09-26-2012, 01:53 PM
CNC port I did myself for my 420A Eclipse project
https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/423358_10150615153972895_564054770_n.jpg

britishturbo
09-26-2012, 01:54 PM
I wanna come by too! I rode in edge motors single turbo S4 and that thing was a monster.

Give me a month or so to get it all done and running well :-)

bgzs4
09-26-2012, 01:57 PM
I feel like a poser reading this thread. Good stuff.

britishturbo
09-26-2012, 01:57 PM
Billet Aluminum Intake Plenums I made for a certain Lamborghini project at work recently... Took me 80 Hrs to make these bad boys!
Hopefully my S4 intake will be as sexy ;-)

https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/598807_10151081928477895_2018962086_n.jpg

AudiNFS
09-26-2012, 01:59 PM
Wow, that is some impressive stuff IMO. I can't wait to see how your build turns out!

britishturbo
09-26-2012, 02:07 PM
Turbo Up Pipe - I even welded in bungs for the factory EGT probes.
I figure they are a great feature, so why get rid of them!

https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/402772_10151068286027895_721873296_n.jpg

Monty23
09-26-2012, 02:14 PM
What is the thought behind putting a flex pipe on only one side of the up pipe? I would assume you would want a flex pipe on both sides....

s4930
09-26-2012, 02:16 PM
Noob question but what goes in that small opening on the up pipe?

britishturbo
09-26-2012, 02:16 PM
What is the thought behind putting a flex pipe on only one side of the up pipe? I would assume you would want a flex pipe on both sides....

Same reason for 034 only using one, all you are really doing is dealing with the expansion of the engine. When the engine heats up the banks will actually grow and move the exhaust manifolds ever so slightly further apart. If you didn't have a flex section the up pipe would crack.
This should take care of that problem.

britishturbo
09-26-2012, 02:18 PM
Noob question but what goes in that small opening on the up pipe?

That is the flange for the Tial wastegate.
You can see it installed here:
https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/298448_10151071252472895_2037573101_n.jpg

Monty23
09-26-2012, 02:18 PM
Noob question but what goes in that small opening on the up pipe?

Wastegate.


Same reason for 034 only using one, all you are really doing is dealing with the expansion of the engine. When the engine heats up the banks will actually grow and move the exhaust manifolds ever so slightly further apart. If you didn't have a flex section the up pipe would crack.
This should take care of that problem.

thanks[up]

britishturbo
09-26-2012, 02:22 PM
Another future plan / experiment I have planned is testing a Megasquirt vs Motronic ecu.
I'm a big Megasquirt guy, I've built and installed many many units through the years.
I'm going to make a harness adapter that will let me unplug the factory ecu and plug in a Megasquirt.
Only other changes needed will be the Throttle Body and removal of MAF sensor.

But that's down the road...

s4930
09-26-2012, 02:23 PM
That is the flange for the Tial wastegate.
You can see it installed here:
https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/298448_10151071252472895_2037573101_n.jpg

Thanks! your work looks super legit, I'd love a custom mani from you no homo

britishturbo
09-26-2012, 02:26 PM
Thanks! your work looks super legit, I'd love a custom mani from you no homo

lol thanks. I don't know about offering manifolds for people yet though, with 034 introducing their STK I think that would be the best solution for most people... But I never say never ;-)

caliskate12
09-26-2012, 02:38 PM
DROOL

Monty23
09-26-2012, 02:39 PM
lol thanks. I don't know about offering manifolds for people yet though, with 034 introducing their STK I think that would be the best solution for most people... But I never say never ;-)

He is most likely talking about an intake manifold. And fyi, don't talk about selling anything unless your an advertiser or its in the classifieds or you may get in trouble.

s4930
09-26-2012, 02:45 PM
Yea I meant intake mani... And we must also beware of AZ secret police ....

britishturbo
09-26-2012, 02:45 PM
Ah yes didn't think about the intake... And I have zero plans of making and selling anything at this point... Purely personal parts ;-)
But thanks for the heads up!


He is most likely talking about an intake manifold. And fyi, don't talk about selling anything unless your an advertiser or its in the classifieds or you may get in trouble.

haggard69er
09-26-2012, 02:45 PM
Intercooler setup:
https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/601432_10151075001232895_1557967044_n.jpg

Air to Water... because I can :-P
I like the idea of 3 feet of intercooler system lol.
Ignore the mess and dirt... things are still very much work in progress...
Exact same setup I'm using in my build! consistent iats and minimal pressure loss! Good luck with your build sir!

britishturbo
09-26-2012, 02:46 PM
Exact same setup I'm using in my build! consistent iats and minimal pressure loss! Good luck with your build sir!

Sweet and thanks!!! You have any pics? Curious to see how your setup is!

britishturbo
09-26-2012, 02:47 PM
Yea I meant intake mani... And we must also beware of AZ secret police ....

Haha beware the Gestapo? lol ;-)

Don Supreme
09-26-2012, 02:47 PM
Ah yes didn't think about the intake... And I have zero plans of making and selling anything at this point... Purely personal parts ;-)
But thanks for the heads up!

Can you tell us more about your line of work? It seems like you have a pretty solid skill set fabbing parts manually and using a CNC.

britishturbo
09-26-2012, 02:51 PM
Can you tell us more about your line of work? It seems like you have a pretty solid skill set fabbing parts manually and using a CNC.

Sure... My official job title is "Systems Engineer" I work at a company that makes CNC machines and controls... This company actually: http://www.centroidperformanceracing.com/ / http://centroidcnc.com
So I have access to many nice toys at work... just never have much free time to take advantage of it all.

haggard69er
09-26-2012, 02:55 PM
Sweet and thanks!!! You have any pics? Curious to see how your setup is!
I will take a few next time I'm at the garage. I have all the pieces to the puzzle, just finishing up the engine. Waiting till summer to put it together. I don't like cold lol.

britishturbo
09-26-2012, 02:59 PM
Intake manifold design for my 420A project, haven't got this far on the Audi intake yet though, no time yet...
The runners will be billet.

https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/430394_10151081997732895_354678843_n.jpg

Stock for the runners:
https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/550134_10150732597907895_1670363060_n.jpg

britishturbo
09-26-2012, 03:00 PM
I will take a few next time I'm at the garage. I have all the pieces to.the pieces to the puzzle, just finishing up the engine. Waiting till summer to put it together. I don't like cold lol.

Sweet :-)
And I know what you mean about the cold... I'm trying to get it on the road before the PA winter hits... brrrrrrr lol

Tec_Nine
09-26-2012, 03:13 PM
mother of god, that is such a great job on everything i can honestly say im jelous

Don Supreme
09-26-2012, 03:14 PM
Welcome to the community, great project and great work.

I am also happy you didn't create the thread until you were this far a long.... you're legit.

britishturbo
09-26-2012, 03:16 PM
mother of god, that is such a great job on everything i can honestly say im jelous

lol why thank you :-)
I'm pretty anal about things though, I see lots that I could have done better... but the urge to move forward and get her driving keeps winning...

britishturbo
09-26-2012, 03:17 PM
Welcome to the community, great project and great work.

I am also happy you didn't create the thread until you were this far a long.... you're legit.

Thank you!
And yeah I have been lurking here since I first got the car and Google'd "Audi S4 Upgrades" lol but figured I would wait till I was almost there and had everything figured out.

britishturbo
09-26-2012, 03:50 PM
Kinda sucks that I will have to wait almost 3 months before I can post in the Tech sub forums and move this post to the Projects :/

S4 00 2.7
09-26-2012, 03:59 PM
Great stuff. Good to see you diving right in without hesitation.

034Motorsport
09-26-2012, 04:13 PM
I will be very interested to see your take on the intake manifold.

We are just finishing up our billet 24v VR6 turbo intake manifold; so much tooling but such a beautiful finished product.

I'm glad my project helped fuel yours, and I certainly don't blame you for not wanting to wait!!! I will be interested to see what you think of the air 2 water; they have their advantages, but also disadvantages as well. Going to use any type of pump/exchange?

Keep up the good work. Those Lambo manifolds are nuts.

britishturbo
09-26-2012, 04:17 PM
I will be very interested to see your take on the intake manifold.

We are just finishing up our billet 24v VR6 turbo intake manifold; so much tooling but such a beautiful finished product.

I'm glad my project helped fuel yours, and I certainly don't blame you for not wanting to wait!!! I will be interested to see what you think of the air 2 water; they have their advantages, but also disadvantages as well. Going to use any type of pump/exchange?

Keep up the good work. Those Lambo manifolds are nuts.

I've been keeping an eye on your VR6 manifold on facebook ;) What CAD/CAM software do you guys use?

As for the A2W system I have a Bosch pump that is OEM on a Supercharged Mustang and a front mount heat exchanger - looks just like a front mount intercooler lol. I'm excited to see how it works out on the street. I have always uses Air to Air before, but I am using A2W on the racecar and decided to try it on the Audi as well. One of my customers swears by A2W and uses it on every build they do. So we shall see...

britishturbo
09-26-2012, 06:06 PM
Stuck at work so while I was waiting for a 5-Axis machine to finish some test cuts I made some quick SAI block off plates :-)
https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/430462_10151082175807895_919252876_n.jpg

scottyboyx845
09-26-2012, 06:15 PM
I wish I had 1/10th of your skill. Can't wait to see the finished product

tambat
09-26-2012, 06:39 PM
welcome to the forum man! i love following builds like yours. inspiring stuff!

UkuRiSh
09-26-2012, 06:51 PM
This is awesome so many new good projects from last two years . We should all meet not only the single turbo S4 and twin turbo and have a good time and of course race :)

WillRaceForBeer
09-26-2012, 06:53 PM
Loving this thread, nice work so far! Looking forward to watching your progress. I to am a S4/Eclipse guy so I appreciate both of your projects.. never.. ending.. projects ;)

britishturbo
09-26-2012, 07:08 PM
This is awesome so many new good projects from last two years . We should all meet not only the single turbo S4 and twin turbo and have a good time and of course race :)

I agree man an S4 meet would be awesome!
Btw I wanted to reply to you about your cracked pistons but I can't reply in the tech forums yet :-( The damage is from running too lean causing detonation. I remember reading you were getting AFR under boost of 12.x. This is too lean. On pump gas you should aim for between 11.5 and 11.8 AFR. Any leaner is dangerous and will either melt pistons or cause detonation.

britishturbo
09-26-2012, 07:11 PM
I wish I had 1/10th of your skill. Can't wait to see the finished product

I'm just stubborn and / or determined Haha.

britishturbo
09-26-2012, 07:14 PM
Loving this thread, nice work so far! Looking forward to watching your progress. I to am a S4/Eclipse guy so I appreciate both of your projects.. never.. ending.. projects ;)

Haha awesome. I think I'll always love my DSMs. But the Audi love is hard to resist now lol

DiscoPotato
09-26-2012, 09:52 PM
I like where this is going... I like it a lot.

jibberjive
09-26-2012, 11:37 PM
Looks like an awesome project! I will be keeping up on this.

dubzackvr6
09-27-2012, 06:54 AM
I'm super jealous of that billet of AL.

JPM-Engineering
09-27-2012, 06:57 AM
Very nice work !!

Congrats

laserb5
09-27-2012, 08:08 AM
Sure... My official job title is "Systems Engineer" I work at a company that makes CNC machines and controls... This company actually: http://www.centroidperformanceracing.com/ / http://centroidcnc.com
So I have access to many nice toys at work... just never have much free time to take advantage of it all.

DUDE!!!! You work at centroid?!?!?! im pretty sure i have had wet dreams about the A532! Lucky man, I'd love to tour that facility!

britishturbo
09-27-2012, 08:36 AM
DUDE!!!! You work at centroid?!?!?! im pretty sure i have had wet dreams about the A532! Lucky man, I'd love to tour that facility!

Haha yepp. I am in charge of building the machines among many many many other things lol. And if you like the A532 you need to check out the new A560 Port Block machine. It's beast.
Check it out in this video...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mEsuTX6Empc&list=UU3RoiREsLGwSEtPJsh-9luA&index=1&feature=plcp

I'm finishing up building 2 of them right now actually.
And any time you want to tour the place you are welcome.
And if anyone makes it down to the Performance Racing Industry show in Orlando in December come hit me up :-)

britishturbo
09-27-2012, 08:40 AM
I'm super jealous of that billet of AL.

Luckily I didn't have to pay for it! haha
It's actually split down the middle right now, I can make 2 x 420A runners from it, so I'm going to make one for myself and one for display for work.

infinkc
09-27-2012, 09:05 AM
amazing work

britishturbo
09-27-2012, 09:07 AM
Thanks for all the kind words guys :-)
I look at everything and see a lot more I want to do yet, so it should only get better :-)
Really wish I wasn't heading to Arizona tomorrow or I could get her running on the road the weekend... But alas I have to go help someone with tuning ;-)

s4930
09-27-2012, 09:11 AM
I thought I was a bad ass after changing my downpipes... Way to kill my self esteem.

britishturbo
09-27-2012, 09:13 AM
I thought I was a bad ass after changing my downpipes... Way to kill my self esteem.

I think anyone who changes out the downpipes in the car deserves a cookie! Haha
When I pulled the engine the downpipes were a nightmare... partly because I pulled the Engine only and left the tranny in the car... :-D

Monty23
09-27-2012, 09:29 AM
Haha yepp. I am in charge of building the machines among many many many other things lol. And if you like the A532 you need to check out the new A560 Port Block machine. It's beast.
Check it out in this video...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mEsuTX6Empc&list=UU3RoiREsLGwSEtPJsh-9luA&index=1&feature=plcp

I'm finishing up building 2 of them right now actually.
And any time you want to tour the place you are welcome.
And if anyone makes it down to the Performance Racing Industry show in Orlando in December come hit me up :-)

Wow what an amazing job - any job openings for a Penn State graduate with a Bachelor's in Mechanical Engineering and 2 yrs of industry related experience? JK lol

britishturbo
09-27-2012, 09:38 AM
Wow what an amazing job - any job openings for a Penn State graduate with a Bachelor's in Mechanical Engineering and 2 yrs of industry related experience? JK lol

Actually... yes lol
http://www.centroidcnc.com/jobs_state_college_pennsylvania.html

:-)

lo-lyfe
09-27-2012, 09:59 AM
Wow what an amazing job - any job openings for a Penn State graduate with a Bachelor's in Mechanical Engineering and 2 yrs of industry related experience? JK lol

Way to network, my man, way to network!

OP--> Reading your forum (and others') and owning an S4 and all the drama that comes with it makes me wish I had gone into engineering instead of finance. Feel like I work f/t as a half-ass mechanic (read "hack") and in my spare time I do what I went to college for. Amazing job so far and looking forward for more. Keep the updates coming!

Monty23
09-27-2012, 10:47 AM
Actually... yes lol
http://www.centroidcnc.com/jobs_state_college_pennsylvania.html

:-)

The grass is always greener right! Na, I have a wonderful job that I'm very thankful to have. If I wasn't 3+ hours away I would certainly look into the open job positions at Centroid. To have a job that goes hand in hand with one of my true passions in life would be an amazing blessing! I look forward to you sharing more about your projects!

britishturbo
09-27-2012, 01:27 PM
A little tease of the future... ;-)

http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/ports_zps5cb470b3.jpg

britishturbo
09-27-2012, 01:28 PM
They always look like alien fingers to me ;-)

S4 00 2.7
09-27-2012, 01:40 PM
Oooh, exhaust manifold?

Monty23
09-27-2012, 01:47 PM
head porting....

britishturbo
09-27-2012, 01:55 PM
Oooh, exhaust manifold?

Nope...


head porting....

Yepp... a Cylinder Head port design I have laying around... ;-)

infinkc
09-27-2012, 02:04 PM
Nope...



Yepp... a Cylinder Head port design I have laying around... ;-)



I have some heads sitting around if you need a tester ;)

034Motorsport
09-27-2012, 02:15 PM
While I do feel that this platform is seriously behind in cylinder head design and such, it's worth mentioning how important velocity is pre-turbo. Going big port is not always beneficial, although judging from the fuel system you are going with, I am guessing your Borg turbo is not the final size of turbo you will be testing?

We've done quite a bit of testing over the years concerning 5v porting, ranging from intake and exhaust port testing to oversized valve flow testing, and combinations of both. There is definitely power to be made on the intake side of things, so long as velocity is maintained based on the turbo size and displacement, etc. On the valve side of things, you need to be pushing some serious amounts of air to benefit from oversizing the valves. Power can be lost.

Increasing exhaust valve size and porting can hurt performance, especially if you aren't revving out and running a very large volume turbo. If your goals do not surpass 550whp, you may consider the disadvantages of porting to the levels it seems you want to port.

But probably one of my main points is, what cams will you be running? I hope CAT (or some other aftermarket cam). The stock cams (or even 2.8L) do not have nearly enough profile to properly take advantage of very large ports and oversized valves.

britishturbo
09-27-2012, 02:27 PM
While I do feel that this platform is seriously behind in cylinder head design and such, it's worth mentioning how important velocity is pre-turbo. Going big port is not always beneficial, although judging from the fuel system you are going with, I am guessing your Borg turbo is not the final size of turbo you will be testing?

We've done quite a bit of testing over the years concerning 5v porting, ranging from intake and exhaust port testing to oversized valve flow testing, and combinations of both. There is definitely power to be made on the intake side of things, so long as velocity is maintained based on the turbo size and displacement, etc. On the valve side of things, you need to be pushing some serious amounts of air to benefit from oversizing the valves. Power can be lost.

Increasing exhaust valve size and porting can hurt performance, especially if you aren't revving out and running a very large volume turbo. If your goals do not surpass 550whp, you may consider the disadvantages of porting to the levels it seems you want to port.

But probably one of my main points is, what cams will you be running? I hope CAT (or some other aftermarket cam). The stock cams (or even 2.8L) do not have nearly enough profile to properly take advantage of very large ports and oversized valves.

My plan is to find the limit of the stock heads and intake first, then I'll make an intake.
I'm not planning on running any cnc ported heads until after winter really. I haven't decided if I'll be using APB or 2.8 heads ether, but they will be +1mm on the intake side when I do go that route. The stock heads do not have enough intake throat size.
My customers are some of the best head porters in the world so trust me when I say I know a fair bit about heads and have access to the minds of people who do some amazing stuff...

One of the biggest problems people face is the stock exhaust manifolds and small turbos. There is a limit to how much they can flow which will ultimately limit how much the intake side can breath. You can pressurize the intake as much as you like but if the gasses can't escape then you get minimal gains. The extra flow capabilities you get from a single turbo setup should really help.

Oh and the 2.7 would really benefit from a much larger plenum size. In the order of 3.0 liters of volume or more. I really need to work on my plenum design...

And you are correct, I do plan on going with a larger turbo down the road... the injectors in the fuel system pic are 1680cc... so I have a lot of overhead ;-) but again not until I have a built bottom end. The S256 should be perfect up to the limit of stock rods.

Goal for now is just one fun daily driver.

britishturbo
09-28-2012, 01:42 PM
I have some heads sitting around if you need a tester ;)

Are they stock APB heads? I won't have time to work on heads anytime soon... But when I do I'd like a set of APB heads and a set of 2.8 heads to work with.
I do have a cpl APB heads though already...

britishturbo
09-28-2012, 03:43 PM
While I do feel that this platform.s seriously behind in cylinder head design and such, it's worth mentioning how important velocity is pre-turbo. Going big port is not always beneficial, although judging from the fuel system you are going with, I am guessing your Borg turbo is not the final size of turbo you will be testing?

We've done quite a bit of testing over the years concerning 5v porting, ranging from intake and exhaust port testing to oversized valve flow testing, and combinations of both. There is definitely power to be made on the intake side of things, so long as velocity is maintained based on the turbo size and displacement, etc. On the valve side of things, you need to be pushing some serious amounts of air to benefit from oversizing the valves. Power can be lost.

Increasing exhaust valve size and porting can hurt performance, especially if you aren't revving out and running a very large volume turbo. If your goals do not surpass 550whp, you may consider the disadvantages of porting to the levels it seems you want to port.

But probably one of my main points is, what cams will you be running? I hope CAT (or some other aftermarket cam). The stock cams (or even 2.8L) do not have nearly enough profile to properly take advantage of very large ports and oversized valves.

Oh i forgot to add that an example of what heads can do on a 2.7. One of my customers did some cnc heads with +1mm intake valves and gained 70HP over the stock heads.
I can't mention their name just know they do heads for many ppl.
I can get their head program for my car if I want ;-)

britishturbo
09-28-2012, 11:47 PM
Well it looks like my customer I'm visiting in Tuscon Arizona this weekend already has some CNC Ported 2.8 heads with +1mm Supertech valves for me.... Hmmmmm :-D

1illA6
09-29-2012, 12:18 AM
Well it looks like my customer I'm visiting in Tuscon Arizona this weekend already has some CNC Ported 2.8 heads with +1mm Supertech valves for me.... Hmmmmm :-D

http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20120928_201244_zpsf1f934f4.jpg
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20120928_200901_zps7355d1f6.jpg

I'm in Tucson, you should bring me a set of heads as well;)

britishturbo
09-29-2012, 10:01 AM
I'm in Tucson, you should bring me a set of heads as well;)

I'll get right on that lol :-P

Austonwerner4
09-29-2012, 08:43 PM
That is the flange for the Tial wastegate.
You can see it installed here:
https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/298448_10151071252472895_2037573101_n.jpg

How did you plug the back of your intake manifold?
I pulled out the 3 pieces and am going to tap threads to full them with plugs.

tekazgtr1984
09-29-2012, 09:37 PM
Amazing thread. Your skills are awesome, OP. Keep up the good work and I can't wait to see the finished product.

britishturbo
09-30-2012, 01:22 PM
How did you plug the back of your intake manifold?
I pulled out the 3 pieces and am going to tap threads to full them with plugs.

I'll probably be using all but one of them which I will just cap.
When I make my billet intake though I will have more ports than I'll need threaded just to be safe.

haggard69er
09-30-2012, 01:49 PM
Sweet and thanks!!! You have any pics? Curious to see how your setup is!
Hey! I was at my garage yesterday and snapped a few pics.
http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa238/haggard69er/IMG_3998.jpg
http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa238/haggard69er/IMG_3995.jpg
http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa238/haggard69er/IMG_3993.jpg
http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa238/haggard69er/IMG_3996.jpg
Some of the parts i have collected so far. Btw, the cnced heads look so beautiful!

britishturbo
09-30-2012, 06:32 PM
Hey! I was at my garage yesterday and snapped a few pics.
Some of the parts i have collected so far. Btw, the cnced heads look so beautiful!

Cool, I got some of my parts from mandrel-ends.com too. Good stuff.
And thanks on the heads. They are nice, I won't be installing them until after the new year though more than likely.

haggard69er
09-30-2012, 06:44 PM
Cool, I got some of my parts from mandrel-ends.com too. Good stuff.
And thanks on the heads. They are nice, I won't be installing them until after the new year though more than likely.
When i get to the heads i will hit you up for some knowledge! Good luck with your build, i will be following this!

britishturbo
09-30-2012, 06:48 PM
When i get to the heads i will hit you up for some knowledge! Good luck with your build, i will be following this!

Thanks, I'm sitting in an airport right now on my way home... I was helping a customer in Tuscon with their 5-Axis and doing some tuning... We were getting this turbo quad running (Megasquirt :-)) and tuning it on the dyno, plus working on a turbo gsxr1000 engined quad too... that one's sick lol. Can't wait to get home and work ont he Audi some more.
https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/340281_10151086022867895_1406478358_o.jpg

Hit me up anytime on heads.

Cobra Commander
09-30-2012, 07:45 PM
Very nice work...subscribed for more.

britishturbo
09-30-2012, 08:53 PM
Well since my flight has been delayed I've been sat here bored in Atlanta airport... so I started on some intake manifold design work...
Here's what I have roughed out as a concept so far...

http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/runners_zpsecc3e8e2.png

britishturbo
10-02-2012, 06:31 PM
Worked on my downpipe tonight

britishturbo
10-02-2012, 06:38 PM
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121002_190608_zps06747503.jpg

http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121002_190616_zps7d5d95a4.jpg

http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121002_190623_zps9a8743ef.jpg

Not the best welding ever... but it will do

britishturbo
10-02-2012, 06:39 PM
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121002_195759_zpse7ae7b51.jpg

S4 00 2.7
10-02-2012, 08:47 PM
Looking good. My welding also needs work, actually mine is terrible.

britishturbo
10-04-2012, 12:14 AM
Worked on my gauges tonight.

http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121004_020826_zpsbb3b9924.jpg

Monty23
10-04-2012, 06:05 AM
45 psig, I like where this is going[drool]

britishturbo
10-04-2012, 07:33 AM
45 psig, I like where this is going[drool]

I hate getting 30psig gauges and then having to replace them when I need 30+... so I'll just start with the range I plan on needing :-)

lo-lyfe
10-04-2012, 08:42 AM
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121002_190608_zps06747503.jpgNot the best welding ever... but it will do

Better than my welds, which look like a little kid had been playing with Play-Doh.

britishturbo
10-04-2012, 08:50 AM
Better than my welds, which look like a little kid had been playing with Play-Doh.

If I wouldn't insist on welding in the dark while crouched on the floor it would probably help haha ;-)
I was more concerned about good penetration than looks, and I only have a MIG at home not a TIG so that's about as good as I can get it lol

rockcandy
10-04-2012, 09:02 AM
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121002_195759_zpse7ae7b51.jpg

You show those awesome manifolds amd then post this? What is wrong with you? Haha. You have to redo this, im sorry:)

britishturbo
10-04-2012, 09:08 AM
You show those awesome manifolds amd then post this? What is wrong with you? Haha. You have to redo this, im sorry:)

Haha yeah I know... I'm not a big fan of the downpipe I have at this stage, but I plan on reworking it once I have it all working and proved out.
The sharp angle isn't ideal but it will still flow plenty for stage 1 of the project... ;-)

Once the downpipe is all in place and I knwo the angle work and everything then I can see what angles and bend radius I need to do it right.

britishturbo
10-04-2012, 05:15 PM
Intercooler piping mock up:

http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121004_190443_zps79dd4155.jpg

Blow off valve should work here:
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121004_190539_zpse93624eb.jpg

Limey
10-04-2012, 06:50 PM
Intercooler piping mock up:

http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121004_190443_zps79dd4155.jpg

Blow off valve should work here:
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121004_190539_zpse93624eb.jpg

Awesome build so far, can't wait for future updates. Your pics arent working for me, just red X's poping up

Austonwerner4
10-04-2012, 07:03 PM
I think they work for everyone else

Spooled1.8
10-04-2012, 07:19 PM
Awesome build, excited to see updates!

michael66899
10-04-2012, 07:24 PM
Blow through MAF?

Loving it all so far, best of luck!

britishturbo
10-04-2012, 07:35 PM
Blow through MAF?

Loving it all so far, best of luck!

Indeed :-)
I love a real Blow Off Valve, so we'll see how Blow Through goes :-)

Worst case I'll convert to Speed Density ;-)

britishturbo
10-05-2012, 01:54 PM
My plan for the weekend is to try and move the car under it's own power. Hopefully all goes to plan :-)

michael66899
10-05-2012, 03:56 PM
Indeed :-)
I love a real Blow Off Valve, so we'll see how Blow Through goes :-)

Worst case I'll convert to Speed Density ;-)

Indeed, good stuff man can't wait to see this car all finished up.

I might have missed it somewhere but are you doing all the tuning?

britishturbo
10-05-2012, 04:48 PM
Indeed, good stuff man can't wait to see this car all finished up.

I might have missed it somewhere but are you doing all the tuning?

Yes I do all my own tuning. Friend of mine just flew me to Arizona to help him with some tuning the weekend ;-)

britishturbo
10-05-2012, 04:49 PM
Front mount heat exchanger. Should work nicely :-)
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121005_183544_zps0b40d8f8.jpg

britishturbo
10-05-2012, 04:50 PM
I haven't decided if I'm going to install this in the S4 or if I'll save it for the race car...

http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20120609_203645_zps09f5404c.jpg

britishturbo
10-07-2012, 02:18 PM
Today's update. Got coolant in the system and fixed some leaks.
Installed the intercooler and piping. Not 100% happy with the intercooler piping just yet though.
Tomorrow I'll extend the MAF cable and it should be ready for a quick road test. Then this week I'll install the fuel system and intercooler heat exchanger and pump/hoses.
Then it's tuning time :-)

http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121006_184318_zps1449e429.jpg

britishturbo
10-07-2012, 07:09 PM
It's annoying how the flash makes the exhaust housing look rusty lol.
Trying this out for the wastegate plumbing
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121003_182552_zps99bdca5d.jpg

britishturbo
10-07-2012, 07:10 PM
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121003_182421_zps3dbbda31.jpg

britishturbo
10-08-2012, 06:14 PM
The car moved under its own power for the first time in my possession tonight... pretty awesome stuff :-D

S4 00 2.7
10-08-2012, 06:44 PM
Good to hear it's driving now.

D Lo
10-08-2012, 07:24 PM
.
The car moved under its own power for the first time in my possession tonight... pretty awesome stuff :-D.

[up]

Matador
10-09-2012, 07:40 AM
Well since my flight has been delayed I've been sat here bored in Atlanta airport... so I started on some intake manifold design work...
Here's what I have roughed out as a concept so far...

http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/runners_zpsecc3e8e2.png

You using SolidWorks?

britishturbo
10-09-2012, 08:28 AM
You using SolidWorks?

That was done in Mastercam but I'm doing it from scratch in Inventor now.
But the final shape will wait till I have my APB port design ready :-)

britishturbo
10-09-2012, 05:53 PM
Tried closing the hood to check it would close... it did :-)
Have an inch above the compressor housing to allow for larger turbos. As planned ;-)

Started mounting the fuel surge tank. It will sit where the passenger side intercooler was from the factory.

Nor_Cal_Driver
10-13-2012, 10:10 AM
Great build thus far. Welcome to Audizine!

Tec_Nine
10-13-2012, 10:14 AM
i love it

GO-GOTEKNO
10-13-2012, 10:49 AM
I bet it hauls ass , im super jealous!!

britishturbo
10-13-2012, 10:49 AM
Thanks, I'm liking it here so far.
Hopefully this weekend I'll get the fuel system installed and start on tuning.

Don Supreme
10-13-2012, 10:53 AM
Tried closing the hood to check it would close... it did :-)
Have an inch above the compressor housing to allow for larger turbos. As planned ;-)

Started mounting the fuel surge tank. It will sit where the passenger side intercooler was from the factory.

Any risks of explosion in a front end collision?

britishturbo
10-13-2012, 11:04 AM
Any risks of explosion in a front end collision?

Hopefully not! I haven't 100% decided on that location yet though, there just aren't too many places it will fit...

Austonwerner4
10-13-2012, 11:09 AM
Cant you put it where the battery is and relocate the battery to the trunk?

britishturbo
10-13-2012, 01:25 PM
Cant you put it where the battery is and relocate the battery to the trunk?

I have other plans for that space ;-)

naudlee
10-13-2012, 01:32 PM
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121003_182421_zps3dbbda31.jpg

wtf... dont be a cheap ass. -AN braided line for your wastegate DUMP.... looks like a DUMP

Buy proper mandrel bends and make a proper dumptube... or re-route it into the downpipe...

BTW the frozenboost brand A2W setups/heat exchangers are hit or miss. I ran a few of their setups in my day... great on a drag car just making 1/4 mile passes but have heard horror stories w/ the roadrace guys.
-What pump did you use? Their cheap plastic pump they provide w/kits is a ticking time bomb. Def. Upgrade.

regardless, you went single on your own and it runs... awesome. Now do her so justice and fix the issues/bandaids properly...

DiscoPotato
10-13-2012, 01:40 PM
You show those awesome manifolds amd then post this? What is wrong with you? Haha. You have to redo this, im sorry:)

I'm with him

britishturbo
10-13-2012, 01:45 PM
wtf... dont be a cheap ass. -AN braided line for your wastegate DUMP.... looks like a DUMP

It looks like you can tig weld by the looks of some of your stufff... that downpipe needs help too.

Buy proper mandrel bends and make a proper dumptube... or re-route it into the downpipe...

Heatsleeve the shit out of everything back there and for god sakes get the proper LINED hose-clamps for the hoses in the bay, those are just eating away at your hose and will pose a problem in the future... esp w/ all that heat

BTW the frozenboost brand A2W setups/heat exchangers are hit or miss. I ran a few of their setups in my day... great on a drag car just making 1/4 mile passes but have heard horror stories w/ the roadrace guys.
-What pump did you use? Their cheap plastic pump they provide w/kits is a ticking time bomb. Def. Upgrade.

regardless, you went single on your own and it runs... awesome. Now do her so justice and fix the issues/bandaids properly...

The wastegate dump is actually something I had for another project that I was testing for now, I need to get some more stainless for the final dump setup ;-)
And its not an line its basically flex pipe ;-)

For the pump I have a Bosch Motorsports pump that's used on a supercharged mustang.

Setup is still very much work in progress ;-)

britishturbo
10-13-2012, 01:47 PM
I'm with him

Its not going to be the final downpipe ;-)

naudlee
10-13-2012, 02:24 PM
The wastegate dump is actually something I had for another project that I was testing for now, I need to get some more stainless for the final dump setup ;-)
And its not an line its basically flex pipe ;-)

For the pump I have a Bosch Motorsports pump that's used on a supercharged mustang.

Setup is still very much work in progress ;-)

Bosch pump is good pump... good choice

DiscoPotato
10-13-2012, 07:00 PM
Its not going to be the final downpipe ;-)

Nicee

britishturbo
10-13-2012, 07:32 PM
Bosch pump is good pump... good choice

Not something I want to go cheap on :-)

britishturbo
10-13-2012, 07:34 PM
Added an oil pressure gauge to the mix. Because if you aren't watching oil pressure you really don't know the health of your engine.

http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121013_212655_zps0043caaf.jpg

http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121013_212916_zpsab0fddcd.jpg

britishturbo
10-13-2012, 07:36 PM
Nicee

I couldn't get a good feel for the angle I needed without making it first like I did. Then I can get the bends right on rev 2 :-)

britishturbo
10-13-2012, 07:46 PM
Int Engineering fuel rails going on tomorrow. I was going to make my own rails but I can use that time better for other things right now...
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121013_214200_zpsb0dfd765.jpg

It will have 1680 CC injectors hanging from it... yes... I said 1680CC ;-)

Austonwerner4
10-13-2012, 07:57 PM
It will have 1680 CC injectors hanging from it... yes... I said 1680CC ;-)

Why so Small??

britishturbo
10-13-2012, 07:59 PM
Why so Small??

I like to have overhead in my fuel system. And only like to build it once.

Austonwerner4
10-13-2012, 08:05 PM
I said small as a joke

britishturbo
10-13-2012, 08:10 PM
I said small as a joke

I know ;-)

britishturbo
10-14-2012, 11:32 AM
Fuel rail and 1680CC injectors :-)
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121014_133007_zpscf937783.jpg

Austonwerner4
10-14-2012, 11:48 AM
Looks nice.

Don Supreme
10-14-2012, 12:13 PM
Added an oil pressure gauge to the mix. Because if you aren't watching oil pressure you really don't know the health of your engine.


Do you know the typical oil pressure range on these engines?

boot
10-14-2012, 03:08 PM
wow man, this is quite impressive stuff! sick as hell man.

britishturbo
10-14-2012, 03:45 PM
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121014_172533_zps591d4715.jpg

Quattro_2.7tt
10-14-2012, 03:58 PM
Wow, great work man looks really good for a wucik job. I wish I coulkd help you work on it!

britishturbo
10-14-2012, 05:08 PM
Do you know the typical oil pressure range on these engines?

Not yet... but I will lol. Was that a loaded question though? Haha

howardfootball
10-14-2012, 05:19 PM
That was done in Mastercam but I'm doing it from scratch in Inventor now.
But the final shape will wait till I have my APB port design ready :-)

Bleh I hate using Mastercam. I find it very buggy and will often fail to properly save my work.Inventor is my preference. Been using it since sophomore year in high school.

britishturbo
10-14-2012, 05:40 PM
Bleh I hate using Mastercam. I find it very buggy and will often fail to properly save my work.Inventor is my preference. Been using it since sophomore year in high school.

Mastercam is a lot better than it used to be in that regard that's for sure. I used to call it Mastercrash but they improved it a lot.
But inventor is awesome for sure.
I have Mastercam X6 and Inventor 2013

howardfootball
10-14-2012, 05:48 PM
Mastercam is a lot better than it used to be in that regard that's for sure. I used to call it Mastercrash but they improved it a lot.
But inventor is awesome for sure.
I have Mastercam X6 and Inventor 2013

We have Mastercam X6 at work so I have to deal with it, but your right and it has gotten better. Never used Solidworks much.

britishturbo
10-14-2012, 06:49 PM
We have Mastercam X6 at work so I have to deal with it, but your right and it has gotten better. Never used Solidworks much.

Yeah I've not used solidworks all that much. Between Mastercam and Inventor I can get anything done.

rockcandy
10-14-2012, 06:58 PM
Yeah I've not used solidworks all that much. Between Mastercam and Inventor I can get anything done.

I just got Inventer recently. It's going to take me a little while to learn it. It looks like it should suit my needs very well though.

jibberjive
10-15-2012, 12:43 AM
I had to use Mastercam X3 for a little bit, I'm not the biggest fan. Though I'm pretty sure they now have a shell that integrates it into the Solidworks program, which would have helped keep it more simple than when I was using it. Inventor is pretty good, though I'm partial to Solidworks myself.

DiscoPotato
10-16-2012, 01:34 PM
Is the MAF on the charge piping?

britishturbo
10-16-2012, 01:43 PM
Is the MAF on the charge piping?

Yepp. Blow through MAF :-)

britishturbo
10-17-2012, 02:22 PM
I'm thinking about not installing the surge tank setup for now.
It will be overkill for the car at this point, so I'm thinking I'll leave the surge tank off until I rebuild the bottom end... Then we'll need it ;-)
So probably an In Tank / Inline setup for now.

Monty23
10-17-2012, 02:45 PM
When are you going to start power tuning....

Smitty2A4
10-17-2012, 02:56 PM
This thread is amazing and I have enjoyed reading through it so far! You have knowledge and fabrication skills I wish I possessed!

britishturbo
10-17-2012, 02:57 PM
When are you going to start power tuning....

Hopefully in the next few weeks... but I'm going to be so busy getting ready for the PRI show at work its hard to say

britishturbo
10-17-2012, 02:59 PM
This thread is amazing and I have enjoyed reading through it so far! You have knowledge and fabrication skills I wish I possessed!

Thank you! And I'm just getting started ;-)

Tec_Nine
10-17-2012, 05:08 PM
Great build, no doubt

britishturbo
10-19-2012, 04:15 PM
A little update for today:

http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121019_180406_zps61077ee5.jpg

ElliottG
10-19-2012, 05:40 PM
EEEEEsh what are the IAT's going to be on this beast lol.

britishturbo
10-19-2012, 05:57 PM
EEEEEsh what are the IAT's going to be on this beast lol.

When the firewall is fabbed up and the turbo blanket in place... very low... I.e. outside air temp. Just wait and see ;-)

britishturbo
10-20-2012, 09:19 AM
So I changed my mind again. I will do the surge tank and dual walbros now not later. Do it once and do it right I say ;-)
But I'm now going to mount it in the back where the charcoal canister is stock.

somebody5788
10-24-2012, 11:24 AM
A little update for today:

http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121019_180406_zps61077ee5.jpg

Reminds me of the way I had my air filter on my old A4 with the supercharger.

http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p223/somebody5788/My%20cars/A4/2206d7e6.jpg

http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p223/somebody5788/My%20cars/A4/992c9802.jpg

I'd look for a solid mandrel bent Aluminum pipe to do that bend instead. I had a lot of problems with driveability on the supercharger setup and in hindsight I think it might have been due to the way I did that part of the intake.

Also, I had a question. Is it possible to set the intercooler vertical? Or is there just not enough clearance? What if the inlets on it were on the side facing the engine instead? I was thinking it would be neat to be able to use the stock location for the air filter if there could be room made for the filter. Mainly because I would be too lazy to do a battery relocate if I ever did a single turbo haha.

britishturbo
11-04-2012, 11:59 AM
Reminds me of the way I had my air filter on my old A4 with the supercharger.

http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p223/somebody5788/My%20cars/A4/2206d7e6.jpg

http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p223/somebody5788/My%20cars/A4/992c9802.jpg

I'd look for a solid mandrel bent Aluminum pipe to do that bend instead. I had a lot of problems with driveability on the supercharger setup and in hindsight I think it might have been due to the way I did that part of the intake.

Also, I had a question. Is it possible to set the intercooler vertical? Or is there just not enough clearance? What if the inlets on it were on the side facing the engine instead? I was thinking it would be neat to be able to use the stock location for the air filter if there could be room made for the filter. Mainly because I would be too lazy to do a battery relocate if I ever did a single turbo haha.

Hey, nice setup you had there.

The Intercooler is too bit to sit vertical I think... plus it wouldn't flow as smoothly as it does the way it sits.
There is actually room to put the air filter in the stock location but I want it in the back there because when I box it all off it will be a true cold air setup...

britishturbo
11-04-2012, 12:07 PM
Some updates...

I've been so busy lately working and traveling for work (will have 68 Hrs OT the last two weeks by end of today) that I haven't had much time to work on much :/

Here's a progress pic:
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121028_170926_zps355d17da.jpg

Engine firewall plastic mockup:
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121028_153713_zps618b7021.jpg

Front bumper cover I picked up for much $$$ lol. It's brand new and already painted the factory color:
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG957818_zpsa2c1d696.jpg

Brakes and turbo blanket to install:
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121029_154406_zpsfbf6dac6.jpg

When I get back home (In Louisiana today then back up to Brodix in Arkansas tomorrow ugh) from working away I havce lots to do...
Also should have nice Fenders waiting for the car too as well as a box full of goodies from a friend... ;-)

britishturbo
11-04-2012, 12:08 PM
You'll see I have the hood on the car now too, it shuts perfectly and clears all the added hardware like I planned it that way... oh wait, I did! lol
The downside of having the hood on is that I keep hitting my head on it haha

S4UCE
11-04-2012, 01:41 PM
That's a funny looking battery you got there! Great progress, can't wait to see this thing up and running

britishturbo
11-04-2012, 01:48 PM
That's a funny looking battery you got there! Great progress, can't wait to see this thing up and running

Haha yeah the battery made its way to the trunk. I welded the battery tray to the CD changer bracket... ;-(

Meow
11-04-2012, 02:00 PM
I haven't decided if I'm going to install this in the S4 or if I'll save it for the race car...

http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20120609_203645_zps09f5404c.jpg

PLEASE DOoooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!! That would be fun! :)


edit: Also get a turbo blanket for that thing, will help out a lot!

britishturbo
11-04-2012, 02:05 PM
So it looks like over the winter I'll be building a 3.0 bottom end and slapping on some CNC heads :-)

britishturbo
11-04-2012, 02:06 PM
Then I'll probably try an AGP Zeta 3.2 turbo.

Creed
11-04-2012, 11:53 PM
Great staff, a couple of fresh ideas I see here! So what kind of boost you run? I really like that MAF location, cold air should be no problem, hope it runs smooth under boost

britishturbo
11-04-2012, 11:56 PM
Great staff, a couple of fresh ideas I see here! So what kind of boost you run? I really like that MAF location, cold air should be no problem, hope it runs smooth under boost

Have to finish some things and put all the bodywork on before I start tuning.
I plan on running 10 Psi at first while I check everything out, then 20 Psi and up...

Creed
11-05-2012, 01:30 AM
http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php/153109-does-anyone-here-run-a-relocated-bov-dv-or-maf?p=1816106&viewfull=1#post1816106
check it out, MAF seems to work fine on similar config

britishturbo
11-05-2012, 07:28 AM
http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php/153109-does-anyone-here-run-a-relocated-bov-dv-or-maf?p=1816106&viewfull=1#post1816106
check it out, MAF seems to work fine on similar config

Ha that thread made me laugh. Most of the people posting there have no idea what they are talking about.
Contrary to what they think the Maf sensor is not made from unicorns... its just like other Maf sensors.
Running blow through is common on most other turbo cars.
And just like that guy I don't care what others think I like the sound of a blow off valve.

Monty23
11-05-2012, 07:56 AM
I'm very interested in the blow through setup. Awesome work here! What's your plan for the PCV system?

ggg20t
11-05-2012, 08:27 AM
car is coming along man! Cant wait to see the final product - I will definitely make a trip up to State College to check it out when you're done!.

S4 00 2.7
11-05-2012, 09:54 AM
Can't wait to see some videos. [up]

damunky
11-05-2012, 10:36 AM
Wow, what an awesome thread and build. Can't wait to see this running! Great progress so far man

britishturbo
11-05-2012, 10:38 AM
I'm very interested in the blow through setup. Awesome work here! What's your plan for the PCV system?

I somewhat have a plan... but I'm saving the pcv system till last. I'll be running a large catch can with all the hoses attached to it. Plus will likely run a line from catch can to intake manifold with a decent check valve so it only pulls negative pressure.

I also will be going to a larger MAF once this one hits its flow limits. But I want to show what can be done with Blow Through using stock Hitachi sensor first.

britishturbo
11-05-2012, 10:39 AM
car is coming along man! Cant wait to see the final product - I will definitely make a trip up to State College to check it out when you're done!.

Thanks man! I look forward to hanging out anytime.

britishturbo
11-10-2012, 06:22 PM
Turbo blanket:

http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121110_163145_zps1812e97e.jpg

JackalS4
11-10-2012, 08:52 PM
Yepp. Blow through MAF :-)

wwwsssssssssPSSSSHwwwsssssssssssssssssPSSSSHH (burble, burble, pop, cackle)

Worth it! [:D]

Great project, keep us up to date as you have been! [up]

britishturbo
11-10-2012, 09:10 PM
wwwsssssssssPSSSSHwwwsssssssssssssssssPSSSSHH (burble, burble, pop, cackle)

Worth it! [:D]

Great project, keep us up to date as you have been! [up]

Ha! It is indeed worth it, and when tuned and setup right it will run no problem.

I try to keep updated every time I work on the car. I got a couple hours in today.
Tomorrow I plan on finishing the fuel system which includes fabricating and installing the surge tank and inline fuel pump and all related fuel lines. Then I need to change all the brake rotors and pads. Plus I need to fabricate the mount for the intercooler heat exchanger.
Then I have a bunch of wiring to do... A lot to do yet, let's see how much I can get done tomorrow.

If anyone in State College is bored feel free to come help! Ha!

MileMan402
11-10-2012, 10:34 PM
I prob wouldn't be too much help but I'll be home for thanksgiving lol. Keep up the great work!

britishturbo
11-11-2012, 04:41 PM
Got some of the fuel system upgrades installed today.
Fuel filter to -6 AN feed for surge tank:
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121111_144233_zps5f1a8313.jpg

Fuel feed for rail and return, ran in place of stock lines:
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121111_164908_zps687df506.jpg

Surge tank mounting plate mock up:
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121111_172436_zps065f6268.jpg

The surge tank and external pump will mount where the charcoal canister used to be.

britishturbo
11-11-2012, 05:59 PM
Wideband controller installed behind ecu:
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121110_165740_zpsa86860cb.jpg

britishturbo
11-11-2012, 06:00 PM
And believe it or not all this work is being done outside... it sucks that its getting cold!
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121110_160913_zps868a7da2.jpg

SpeedWorksAuto
11-15-2012, 09:37 AM
I somewhat have a plan... but I'm saving the pcv system till last. I'll be running a large catch can with all the hoses attached to it. Plus will likely run a line from catch can to intake manifold with a decent check valve so it only pulls negative pressure.

I also will be going to a larger MAF once this one hits its flow limits. But I want to show what can be done with Blow Through using stock Hitachi sensor first.

Following your build......food for thought :

http://nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?topic=983.0

Not trying to discourage your blow through. I plan to run blow through. After seeing what SnowTrooper went through and the fact that he is a much better tuner than I am, I figureed it would be better off not following donw that same path. Considering you are going to be remapping for the MAF in that location anyhow, might as well start with one that can handle blow through better.

britishturbo
11-15-2012, 09:51 AM
Following your build......food for thought :

http://nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?topic=983.0

Not trying to discourage your blow through. I plan to run blow through. After seeing what SnowTrooper went through and the fact that he is a much better tuner than I am, I figureed it would be better off not following donw that same path. Considering you are going to be remapping for the MAF in that location anyhow, might as well start with one that can handle blow through better.

Howdy,

Yeah I am familiar with his experiences...
I am planning on changing the MAF sensor, but because of my radical fuel system changes I want to keep MAF stock at first to make the tuning process a little easier...

The fuel system is as follows:
Stock pump feeding a 3 liter surge tank.
The surge tank then feeds 2 x Walbro 255 inline pumps (only running 1 at first)
The walbros then feed -8AN line to the billet fuel rails
Next after the fuel rail by -6AN is an Aeromotive regulator (set at 3 bar) with -6AN return line to the surge tank.
Oh and it all feed 1680CC injectors :-) Plenty of fuel lol

So once I get things dialed in on the fuel side (@ 10psi of boost) then I will change out the MAF sensor.
Fuel and air to deal with at the same time sounds like a headache to me :-)

I have my base tune ready to go once I finish the fuel system this weekend.
I'll let you know how it all goes!

MileMan402
11-15-2012, 10:39 AM
Are you not worried about loss of psi due to those sharp bends in your intake? I don't remember what you said your intended use is for this car, but coming from the LS engine scene with centri blowers, a lot of guys at the strip were running straight intakes because they would make more power (appx. 5 more psi) rather than having even slight bends (much less than those two 90 degree ones you have.

ie. this car made 23-25 psi (~950 rwhp) with no intake pipe and ran 9.3, but with this pipe it was only hitting 18 psi (~850rwhp) and could only get a 9.8
http://www.camaro5.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=376655&d=1338057606

SpeedWorksAuto
11-15-2012, 11:09 AM
Since you are not using a stock air box, and relocated your MAF you will be dialing in fuel and air at the same time anyhow.

britishturbo
11-15-2012, 11:50 AM
Are you not worried about loss of psi due to those sharp bends in your intake? I don't remember what you said your intended use is for this car, but coming from the LS engine scene with centri blowers, a lot of guys at the strip were running straight intakes because they would make more power (appx. 5 more psi) rather than having even slight bends (much less than those two 90 degree ones you have.

ie. this car made 23-25 psi (~950 rwhp) with no intake pipe and ran 9.3, but with this pipe it was only hitting 18 psi (~850rwhp) and could only get a 9.8
http://www.camaro5.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=376655&d=1338057606

I'm not too worried about it. This will be my daily driver street car not a race car. And the gains I'll have from having cold air will be worth it :-)

britishturbo
11-15-2012, 11:51 AM
Since you are not using a stock air box, and relocated your MAF you will be dialing in fuel and air at the same time anyhow.

This is true. But its one less variable you know?

MikeyB3
11-15-2012, 11:54 AM
How'd I miss this thread. So much car porn.

AWESOME setup [:)]

britishturbo
11-15-2012, 11:58 AM
How'd I miss this thread. So much car porn.

AWESOME setup [:)]

Thanks! I'm just getting started lol.
Now if only I could quit working so much and actually finish the car!

SpeedWorksAuto
11-15-2012, 01:04 PM
Only way it is one less variable is if you use the stock airbox and MAF, and then dial in your injectors. Your setup is so radical that everything is a variable. Maybe if you went stock MAF pre turbo first and dialed in fuel, and then switched to blow through? I am still working on my setup, and just with a "standard" 85mm MAF pre turbo, I had to change up so much crap in the MAF tables to get it to work right. I was hoping and wishing SnowTrooper figured the blow through out with stock hitachi element. It would have been a good starting point. Plus, I hope you switch to another MAF soon. I like to see feedback on the other options.

phila_dot
11-15-2012, 01:08 PM
Only way it is one less variable is if you use the stock airbox and MAF, and then dial in your injectors. Your setup is so radical that everything is a variable. Maybe if you went stock MAF pre turbo first and dialed in fuel, and then switched to blow through? I am still working on my setup, and just with a "standard" 85mm MAF pre turbo, I had to change up so much crap in the MAF tables to get it to work right. I was hoping and wishing SnowTrooper figured the blow through out with stock hitachi element. It would have been a good starting point. Plus, I hope you switch to another MAF soon. I like to see feedback on the other options.

IIRC, he is tuning standalone, not Motronic.

britishturbo
11-15-2012, 01:10 PM
Only way it is one less variable is if you use the stock airbox and MAF, and then dial in your injectors. Your setup is so radical that everything is a variable. Maybe if you went stock MAF pre turbo first and dialed in fuel, and then switched to blow through? I am still working on my setup, and just with a "standard" 85mm MAF pre turbo, I had to change up so much crap in the MAF tables to get it to work right. I was hoping and wishing SnowTrooper figured the blow through out with stock hitachi element. It would have been a good starting point. Plus, I hope you switch to another MAF soon. I like to see feedback on the other options.

That is very true... and not a bad idea on starting with the MAF pre turbo to start... The BOV would mess things up a little then but it's not a bad idea.
Maybe my tuning should go as follows:

1) MAF Pre Turbo - Tune fuel side
2) MAF Blow Through - Tune for Blow Through MAF changes
3) Larger MAF - Tune for MAF

Although I am going to experiment with a voltage divider to find the limits of the Hitachi MAF sensor.
It's been said the sensor will keep reading about 5V... how high will it go though?
I will find out.

britishturbo
11-15-2012, 01:12 PM
IIRC, he is tuning standalone, not Motronic.

Going with the Motronic...
I am going to then experiment with a Megasquirt setup. My plan is to make an adapter harness to plug the Megasquirt into the factory harness with no changes. This of course has two options - piggy back on top of the ME7, keeping it for DBW duties and other functions or total replacement.

But I'm going to see how far I can push the stock ECU first :-)

SpeedWorksAuto
11-15-2012, 01:25 PM
MAF pre turbo will be close, I dunno how close. From what I have read the stock MAF maps are tuned for the stock intake tract from airbox to throttle body. What about if you went stock injectors, and dial in your MAF, and then switch injectors and dial those in? That way there will be one "absolute" constant. Just thinking out loud.

Phila_dot knows a lot more about this stuff, and I am learning a lot of stuff from him and a few others. he is also helping me overcome what I think is one of the last hurdles in the tuning process with mine.

britishturbo
11-15-2012, 01:51 PM
MAF pre turbo will be close, I dunno how close. From what I have read the stock MAF maps are tuned for the stock intake tract from airbox to throttle body. What about if you went stock injectors, and dial in your MAF, and then switch injectors and dial those in? That way there will be one "absolute" constant. Just thinking out loud.

Phila_dot knows a lot more about this stuff, and I am learning a lot of stuff from him and a few others. he is also helping me overcome what I think is one of the last hurdles in the tuning process with mine.

Hmmmm That isn't a bad idea... The Stock injectors.
It's not just the Airbox that is tuned in the ECU, it's the entire intake system - Airbox, turbos, piping and intake manifold. They all impact the overall VE.
Starting with Stock MAF and Stock Injectors would allow me to tune for the overall VE changes in the system...
I like it. Good idea.
It means pulling my injectors again but so be it lol.

Thanks for the suggestion bud.
I guess taking it one step further I could use MAF in stock location or in BLOW Through to start ... Hmmmm Why waste the time in stock location I guess.

SpeedWorksAuto
11-15-2012, 02:07 PM
Exactly! You can use the MAF as you have it set up now with stock injectors, and only need to dial in the intake side.

S4M3
11-15-2012, 02:45 PM
Nice intercooler setup :0

RedRocketS4
11-15-2012, 02:55 PM
Are you not worried about loss of psi due to those sharp bends in your intake? I don't remember what you said your intended use is for this car, but coming from the LS engine scene with centri blowers, a lot of guys at the strip were running straight intakes because they would make more power (appx. 5 more psi) rather than having even slight bends (much less than those two 90 degree ones you have.

ie. this car made 23-25 psi (~950 rwhp) with no intake pipe and ran 9.3, but with this pipe it was only hitting 18 psi (~850rwhp) and could only get a 9.8

Typically, how much boost a turbo makes is controlled by a boost controller that will open the wastegates to control the exhaust gas flow to the turbo itself. the boost controller knows how much boost there is from a pressure source either directly from the turbo or from the intake manifold. While several bends on the intake side may or may not affect how quickly the turbo spools to the set pressure level, it *should* not affect how much boost the turbo will make. That's how I understand it, anyway.

I pretty much know nothing about blowers/superchargers/prochargers/etc except that they make a lot of noise and make the car go zoom, so I can't comment on how the boost is controlled.

somebody5788
11-15-2012, 02:56 PM
I just noticed you have an A4 grill on the car hahaha

britishturbo
11-15-2012, 03:08 PM
I just noticed you have an A4 grill on the car hahaha

Ha really? It came on the car... hmmmm

Brens
11-15-2012, 09:24 PM
How in the.... no CEL on startup? amazing.

Sorry if I missed it at all... but what background do you have for your field? As in your degree, education, ect. What you're doing is much like what I hope to do...

britishturbo
11-15-2012, 11:32 PM
How in the.... no CEL on startup? amazing.

Sorry if I missed it at all... but what background do you have for your field? As in your degree, education, ect. What you're doing is much like what I hope to do...

My job description is hard to sum up in one word... but Systems Engineer is what it says on my business cards lol.
I work for www.centroidcnc.com where I'm Project Manager / Project Engineer / Systems Engineer etc.
I don't actually have a degree, I'm self taught in everything I do really. I've been working on cars all my life as well. :-)

BigPen!S4doods!
11-16-2012, 03:31 PM
Only read first few pages but wow! Custom Audi!

britishturbo
11-17-2012, 03:19 PM
Surge tank and fuel pump #2 (external #1) hooked up ready for install:
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121117_161217_zpsb68bba0f.jpg

Start of heat exchanger mount:
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121117_170901_zps78ae9bcf.jpg

britishturbo
11-18-2012, 09:48 AM
Finished mount before being painted:
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121118_110602_zps1755f329.jpg

More goodies:
Euro headlights and INA 2.0 Coils and Adapter plates.
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121118_111414_zpsadb9e513.jpg

http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121118_111443_zpsa350c657.jpg


Junk bumper showing how it fits:
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121118_111304_zps5d7b3806.jpg
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121118_111321_zps21800849.jpg
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121118_111242_zpse7a329a4.jpg

britishturbo
11-18-2012, 10:54 AM
Mount painted and installed:
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121118_123324_zps7d675473.jpg

Surge tank ready to go in:
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121118_122303_zps65e97a60.jpg

britishturbo
11-19-2012, 07:43 PM
RS4 throttle body from my buddy Issam @ INA. Destined for a special intake manifold project in the new year:
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121119_211515_zps600630d9.jpg

millo
11-20-2012, 02:31 PM
Hi read your forum pages with great interest,I've just pulled my engine out due to poorly turbo's,I'm really interested in what you,ve done,very impressed.You say your going to run standard Motronic ECU, how do you get round the fact that normally the ecu has 2 lambda sensors 1 for each bank of cylinders yet with a single turbo install there is only one exhaust downpipe! I assume the exhaust temp sensors are mounted in or around the standard position. I won't be running massive boost, something that would give me RS4 type power would do for now.

britishturbo
11-20-2012, 03:15 PM
Hi read your forum pages with great interest,I've just pulled my engine out due to poorly turbo's,I'm really interested in what you,ve done,very impressed.You say your going to run standard Motronic ECU, how do you get round the fact that normally the ecu has 2 lambda sensors 1 for each bank of cylinders yet with a single turbo install there is only one exhaust downpipe! I assume the exhaust temp sensors are mounted in or around the standard position. I won't be running massive boost, something that would give me RS4 type power would do for now.

Hello Mate,

There are a few ways that have been tried to deal with the o2 sensor problems. There's a lot of work going on over on the nefariousmotorsports forums. Some have tried using a wideband to simulate 2 different narrowband sensors, both fed into each of the upstream sensors inputs. If you offset the voltages from each other it will work with some degree of success.
Another way involves remapping the software so that the bank 1 sensor input is used by both banks. This seems to be very promising.
Until I start tuning I won't know for sure if it works out as planned... but I will let you know!
The other options is to use 2 narrowband sensors upstream of the turbo but they will not last long there at all!
And yes the egt sensors are in the pipes upstream of the turbo.

RedRocketS4
11-20-2012, 04:47 PM
On my old single turbo setup with stock ecu they ran the2 front OEM o2 sensor after the manifolds and before the turbo. Worked perfectly for tuning. Also ran an innovate wide band in the singlr down pipe for in-cab monitoring. Hope it helps

MalibuMafiaV
11-20-2012, 04:57 PM
Can't wait to see a video of this car tearing up some pavement.

britishturbo
11-20-2012, 05:02 PM
On my old single turbo setup with stock ecu they ran the2 front OEM o2 sensor after the manifolds and before the turbo. Worked perfectly for tuning. Also ran an innovate wide band in the singlr down pipe for in-cab monitoring. Hope it helps

Yeah this way will work great other than how long the sensors will last... I kinda wish I did it that way too now, just don't want to pull the turbo and all back out to do it just yet if I don't have too... I'll try using the wideband first :-)

britishturbo
11-20-2012, 05:03 PM
Can't wait to see a video of this car tearing up some pavement.

Me too! I'm crossing my fingers, if I get everything finished Friday I "might" be able to start tuning on Saturday... before I head to Florida for a week on Sunday lol. Doh!

034Motorsport
11-21-2012, 12:00 PM
Hello Mate,

There are a few ways that have been tried to deal with the o2 sensor problems. There's a lot of work going on over on the nefariousmotorsports forums. Some have tried using a wideband to simulate 2 different narrowband sensors, both fed into each of the upstream sensors inputs. If you offset the voltages from each other it will work with some degree of success.
Another way involves remapping the software so that the bank 1 sensor input is used by both banks. This seems to be very promising.
Until I start tuning I won't know for sure if it works out as planned... but I will let you know!
The other options is to use 2 narrowband sensors upstream of the turbo but they will not last long there at all!
And yes the egt sensors are in the pipes upstream of the turbo.

Says who? And what is your definition of lasting long?

There are plenty of cars that run o2s in the upstream. If you are worried, you can add a heat sink to them. We run them in the upstream on our single turbo kit for both the 2.7T and the 3.2L VR6 motor. Will they not last as long as normal? Sure, but that can still be over 25k miles.

So far no one has figured out the stereo bank issue without bandaids or running the O2's in the upstream.

britishturbo
11-21-2012, 12:05 PM
Says who? And what is your definition of lasting long?

There are plenty of cars that run o2s in the upstream. If you are worried, you can add a heat sink to them. We run them in the upstream on our single turbo kit for both the 2.7T and the 3.2L VR6 motor. Will they not last as long as normal? Sure, but that can still be over 25k miles.

So far no one has figured out the stereo bank issue without bandaids or running the O2's in the upstream.

Allow me to rephrase that... Reading what some have experienced running single turbo setups that way, "they" often report that the lifespan is reduced... To what I do not know because I have not done it, therefore your experience wins on it ;-)
I actually wish I had put in upstream bungs in the up pipe... just because I'd rather replace sensors than have to worry about making the ecu work with one input... But I like a challange so I'm going to see how far I can get with a mono sensor and the me7.
If I give up I'll just pull the up pipe and weld in some bungs :-)

jibberjive
11-21-2012, 06:12 PM
So far no one has figured out the stereo bank issue without bandaids or running the O2's in the upstream.
Pretty close, it's on the brink of being verified to work.

britishturbo
11-21-2012, 08:24 PM
Pretty close, it's on the brink of being verified to work.

Yepp. If all goes well I hope to be testing it this weekend...

britishturbo
11-22-2012, 07:38 AM
So I made a slight miscalculation... I had assumed that the 1680CC injectors I had were High Impedance, but it turns out they are probably Low... I will check them with a multimeter after thanksgiving dinner today to be sure.
If they are Low I will throw in a set of 44 lb injectors just to keep things moving this weekend, then I'll have to source some different injectors. I don't want to run resistors.

Not a big deal really, 1680 was way overkill, so I'll just go with some 1000CC units or something.
And I'll only be running ~10psi for initial tuning so the 44lb guys should work for now.

Oh and as mentioned above there is indeed an Alpha version of ecu code that has the second lambda sensor removed at the code level, so I will be trying this. If it doesn't work I'll help make it work ;-)

britishturbo
11-22-2012, 07:58 AM
Should I run without the center grill piece?

Here's a mock up with a test front bumper with no center grill piece:
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121118_112941_zps89082739.jpg

Thoughts?
The bumper going on is brand new so I almost feel bad at the thought of hacking up a brand new bumper.... Hmmmmm

SpeedWorksAuto
11-22-2012, 12:06 PM
Hello Mate,

There are a few ways that have been tried to deal with the o2 sensor problems. There's a lot of work going on over on the nefariousmotorsports forums. Some have tried using a wideband to simulate 2 different narrowband sensors, both fed into each of the upstream sensors inputs. If you offset the voltages from each other it will work with some degree of success.
Another way involves remapping the software so that the bank 1 sensor input is used by both banks. This seems to be very promising.
Until I start tuning I won't know for sure if it works out as planned... but I will let you know!
The other options is to use 2 narrowband sensors upstream of the turbo but they will not last long there at all!
And yes the egt sensors are in the pipes upstream of the turbo.

The Innovate emmulating the two works ok for a while, but I have found that the ecu really does not like it and eventually will start to trim the banks in totally opposite directions on long drives. I have seen my STFT reach -25 and +25 after a 30-45 minute drive regradless of how dialed in I have my trims. I disabled my LTFT since these kind of STFT got worsened when the ECU started using the LTFT to mess with the fueling even more. I always had to have the laptop in the car to clear the trims just to get the car to run right. Most of the time I had the laptop in the car with VCDS on and wouyld watch the LTFT and clear the codes to reset the LTFT once I hit about a 12% split. At least with just wacky STFT I was able to drive and the car can balance out by just modultaing throttle. If Kept it at a cretain RPM/Speed/whatever for too long the ecu would get to work on the fueling.

The only way I can explain it, the ecu is taking its reading from one spot and it thinks its reading from two. It thinks it sees one bank getting lean so it starts adding fuel, but then it thinks it sees the other bank getting richer so it pulls fuel from the other and this keeps going until the ecu cannot pull or add anymore. It wont show up on the wideband since while the is happening the combined AFR is still pretty close to stoich.

Be very careful if you decide to use my file over at NEFMOTO.com. I would start by changing a bunch of the maps FKKVS, MLHFLM, KRKTE, you definately want to take a look at those timing maps. I think I have it pretty aggressive in the mid range. The boost PID is not applicable to anyone else since I have my setup tuned to work with my VGT turbo, the n75 opens really late since the VGT helps control boost a bit. I cant even list all the maps I have tweaked. So just be very careful.

britishturbo
11-22-2012, 08:10 PM
So I checked the resistance of the injectors I have and they are 4.7 Ohm. This is higher than the average Peak & Hold (Low Impedance - ~1 to 3 Ohm) injectors but lower than the average Saturated (High Impedance ~12 to 14 Ohm) injectors.

I was curious if the Bosch ME7 can drive these injectors so after some digging I found the following info on the injector drivers:

These output drivers can deliver a maximum current of 2.2 Ampere. Therefore the valves must have at least 6 Ohm internal resistance.

Soooooo I can either replace the injectors or use a 1.3 Ohm resistor on each injector and it should work fine... Hmmmm

britishturbo
11-22-2012, 08:19 PM
The Innovate emmulating the two works ok for a while, but I have found that the ecu really does not like it and eventually will start to trim the banks in totally opposite directions on long drives. I have seen my STFT reach -25 and +25 after a 30-45 minute drive regradless of how dialed in I have my trims. I disabled my LTFT since these kind of STFT got worsened when the ECU started using the LTFT to mess with the fueling even more. I always had to have the laptop in the car to clear the trims just to get the car to run right. Most of the time I had the laptop in the car with VCDS on and wouyld watch the LTFT and clear the codes to reset the LTFT once I hit about a 12% split. At least with just wacky STFT I was able to drive and the car can balance out by just modultaing throttle. If Kept it at a cretain RPM/Speed/whatever for too long the ecu would get to work on the fueling.

The only way I can explain it, the ecu is taking its reading from one spot and it thinks its reading from two. It thinks it sees one bank getting lean so it starts adding fuel, but then it thinks it sees the other bank getting richer so it pulls fuel from the other and this keeps going until the ecu cannot pull or add anymore. It wont show up on the wideband since while the is happening the combined AFR is still pretty close to stoich.

Be very careful if you decide to use my file over at NEFMOTO.com. I would start by changing a bunch of the maps FKKVS, MLHFLM, KRKTE, you definately want to take a look at those timing maps. I think I have it pretty aggressive in the mid range. The boost PID is not applicable to anyone else since I have my setup tuned to work with my VGT turbo, the n75 opens really late since the VGT helps control boost a bit. I cant even list all the maps I have tweaked. So just be very careful.

Don't worry, I have already changed most of the tables back to stock.
I'm more interested in the lambda sensor changes and testing them... :-)

britishturbo
11-24-2012, 12:40 PM
Bosch pump for Ait to Water Intercooler setup:
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121124_132820_zpsd4eb56eb.jpg

wezzy785
11-25-2012, 07:19 AM
Man it is all looking good !! keep up the good work

Monty23
11-28-2012, 05:00 PM
How long before we get a video of you driving this thing!

britishturbo
11-28-2012, 05:06 PM
How long before we get a video of you driving this thing!

Between working so much, the weather and family I haven't had as much time to work on it as i wanted.
I was installing the new brakes the other day but ran into bad seals on the left rear caliper, so I had to order up some new seals.
I'm out of state all this week, will get back Sunday. I'm planning on taking Monday off work to work on the car :-)

So hopefully soon...

haggard69er
11-28-2012, 05:39 PM
Should I run without the center grill piece?

Here's a mock up with a test front bumper with no center grill piece:
http://i1357.photobucket.com/albums/q755/britishturbo/IMG_20121118_112941_zps89082739.jpg

Thoughts?
The bumper going on is brand new so I almost feel bad at the thought of hacking up a brand new bumper.... Hmmmmm
I say run with out or get some lltek rs4 mesh[evilsmile]

britishturbo
11-28-2012, 05:41 PM
I say run with out or get some lltek rs4 mesh[evilsmile]

Well I'm glad someone replied lol.
I actually need to mock it up one more time with the broken bumper so then I'll see how she will really look

034Motorsport
11-28-2012, 06:02 PM
Well I'm glad someone replied lol.
I actually need to mock it up one more time with the broken bumper so then I'll see how she will really look

What did you have to hack? I didn't need to trim anything except maybe a 1/2" off a few extraneous tabs. Running a 3.5" core. My grills fit as well with 2.5" IC piping, I just didn't have time to reattach them after getting my bumper repainted.

Bumper support obviously a different issue.

britishturbo
11-28-2012, 06:05 PM
What did you have to hack? I didn't need to trim anything except maybe a 1/2" off a few extraneous tabs. Running a 3.5" core. My grills fit as well with 2.5" IC piping, I just didn't have time to reattach them after getting my bumper repainted.

Bumper support obviously a different issue.

The only thing I have to hack off is the 3 tabs under the bumper support.
The heat exchanger sits perfectly up against the bottom edge of the bumper support but the tabs are in the way.

I just didn't want to find out with my brand new freshly painted bumper... seeing exactly what I had to do with the broken one first ;-)

hendrj5689
11-28-2012, 09:28 PM
I say run it without the center grille piece as well, looks pretty good!

britishturbo
11-28-2012, 09:29 PM
I say run it without the center grille piece as well, looks pretty good!

I kinda like it... It will look better too when I cut the tabs off, the bumper shown int he pic is sitting forward about 1 to 2 inches.

britishturbo
11-28-2012, 09:30 PM
Plus the stock center piece actually blocks a lot of the airflow I imagine...