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View Full Version : swapping a 2.8v6



austinw2000
10-22-2011, 11:28 AM
debating swapping in a 2.8v6 in place of my 1.8t was wondering what would be needed to do it.

alhoward101
10-22-2011, 11:44 AM
I'm no b5 guy but i thought the 2.8 was balls slow, do you have a free 2.8 with a supercharger sitting in your backyard or something? trying to figure out why someone would do this

Mad Cow
10-22-2011, 11:50 AM
Stock for stock a 2.8 will easily outrun a 1.8t, but still why would you spend that money to completely throw away any chance of adding power?

A4Rob
10-22-2011, 11:55 AM
Stock for stock a 2.8 will easily outrun a 1.8t, but still why would you spend that money to completely throw away any chance of adding power?

Bad idea. If anything swap a vr

austinw2000
10-22-2011, 11:57 AM
becuase unless people can just give me a 1.8t crank for an automatic then i am out of options. truly tired of fixing the 1.8t everytime the damn wind blows. I am not looking to break speed records anymore. Allhoward everyone is not looking to break speed records. because i am tired. i have tried selling this car bu now it has some issue that i dont have time to hunt down in the 1.8t.

Corrado_Guy
10-22-2011, 12:16 PM
It is going to be far easier/cheaper to fix the motor in your current car than swap it out for a V6. Yes, if you really wanted to find all of the swap parts and wiring to put a V6 in there then you could do it. It will cost you way more than getting another 1.8T crank/motor and swapping that into the car. Once you have the motor in the car put it on the market and dump it for whatever you can get for it.

austinw2000
10-22-2011, 12:22 PM
ok dude i dont know how it is cheaper when the crank aloneis a grand from the dealer. I have tried selling this car already. SO that idea of putting it on the market and dumping it for whatever i can get blows. Rather sell my motor with pauter rods and let someone else deal with it.

austinw2000
10-22-2011, 12:25 PM
To everyone telling me oh dont do it because of the lack of performance or swap a vr6. I am not loaded with time or money. This is my daily driver. I am not looking to race this car or do very many more upgrades to this car. I have to start saving money for a changing event in my life. So please stop the flaming or dumbass comments. Do not suggest something thatis not feasible.

Corrado_Guy
10-22-2011, 12:48 PM
ok dude i dont know how it is cheaper when the crank aloneis a grand from the dealer. I have tried selling this car already. SO that idea of putting it on the market and dumping it for whatever i can get blows. Rather sell my motor with pauter rods and let someone else deal with it.

Okay dude, I don't know why you would go to a dealer unless you want to get bent over a counter and get done. Go out and research the price of a V6 motor, exhaust, wiring harness, and all of the small parts needed to get that to fit and explain how it will be cheaper than fixing what you have? There are a lot short/long blocks kicking around and even with shipping it will be cheaper than the crank at the dealer. I don't know all of the parts needed but the ones listed above should be enough for you to start getting pricing.

There is no flaming in this post, if anything it is filled with you whining and people trying to understand what you are trying to achieve so they can help. Seeing as this post is only a few hours old you can't expect much but if you had bother to add any detail to the thread to begin with you would have gotten much better input by now.

austinw2000
10-22-2011, 12:53 PM
I need thi car reliable. I dont have a vr6 or thefund to do the swap. I dont have the money to keep dropping in the 1.8t. I have already spent a small fortune rebuilding my motor to end up with a unknown sound that some say is a spun bearing and others say is a cam chain tensioner giving out.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KK_-bp6KhYg

Unless I can get the parts to fix it without breaking thebank again. I am no longer looking for performance. I mean damn its a tiptronic FWD. Why would i swap a vr6 into it? I have a child on the way and can no longer afford to be going theroute of performance. I am just looking for reliability. Willing to trade my whole car off at this point for a Small SUV. not no kia or hyundai.

NeedingAnAudi
10-22-2011, 01:00 PM
Pretty sure no one in the history of living has swapped a 2.8 in place of a 1.8. Performance aside a v6 swap would be illogical. Subframes are different, front engine mount and supports etc are different. Do not go to the dealer. Craigslist and ebay are you're friend.

austinw2000
10-22-2011, 01:04 PM
Becausei dont have the damn 1500 to drop on another 1.8t motor. I have even tried trading a 4 thousand dollar set of wheels for a used engine. for someone on this forum to come offer me 200 dollars for the wheels. I have to fix this car as cheap as possible no more dumping money into it. Would love to get rid of the car at this point and just get into something that will be a better fit like a small suv

austinw2000
10-22-2011, 01:09 PM
if you all have such great ideas then buy the car. I am fed up with the dont do that instead drop 7-10 grand in it. I am not ballin' likesome people. I just need to get it fixed to have reliable transportation back and forth to work and doctors appts.

austinw2000
10-22-2011, 01:12 PM
guess lets not give tech advice les just tell you how its a bad idea. posted a video of it running to get nothing but no one would do that swap because its not performance orientated.

NeedingAnAudi
10-22-2011, 01:18 PM
Do you have a v6 already? If not, then from a financial point, it's a waste of time. You obviously have a problem with the engine, so you will be putting money into the car, unless you sell it as is.

EDIT: read your pm.

austinw2000
10-22-2011, 01:22 PM
I have hunted a damn 1.8t AEB with no luck for anything lower than 1500 unless i want a 200 thousand mile motor. I just rebuilt it to have it end up woth a spun bearing and spent 1400 on that rebuild. to have to replace the cranks and bearings. where are you finding a crankshaft at.

NeedingAnAudi
10-22-2011, 01:24 PM
I have hunted a damn 1.8t AEB with no luck for anything lower than 1500 unless i want a 200 thousand mile motor. I just rebuilt it to have it end up woth a spun bearing and spent 1400 on that rebuild. to have to replace the cranks and bearings. where are you finding a crankshaft at.

I haven't looked yet for a crankshaft. I can look for one in Chicago if you like. Do you have a v6 already?

NeedingAnAudi
10-22-2011, 01:26 PM
http://www.ebay.com/itm/97-98-99-AUDI-A4-QUATTRO-1-8T-CRANKSHAFT-AEB-AUTO-TRANS-/110738618066?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&vxp=mtr&hash=item19c88936d2#ht_1355wt_1029

austinw2000
10-22-2011, 01:26 PM
No but unlike this motor i know where there is atleast 4 of them. everyone telling me dont go to the dealer. but when thedealer seems to be the only place with them.

austinw2000
10-22-2011, 01:29 PM
well 230.00 for a used crank from a motor with undisclosed mileage. great deal. not. sorry to piss people off but trying to cold turkey quit cigarettes at the same time.

NeedingAnAudi
10-22-2011, 01:31 PM
lol great. mad about 1.8s being a bitch and going cold turkey?? Not your week sir, I can understand that. My car is running an unknown mileage short block off ebay, for about 10k now.

austinw2000
10-22-2011, 01:34 PM
sitting here ready to pull my hair out. unless you can get a better idea what i wrong from the video i posted. was originally hoping it was the cam chain tensioner. had to rebuild my engine when the timing belt snapped and got a used head that was supposedly rebuilt. then rebuilt my lower end with pauter rods.

austinw2000
10-22-2011, 01:38 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=KK_-bp6KhYg

NeedingAnAudi
10-22-2011, 01:38 PM
It kinda sounds like the tensioner. Have to tried driving it? A cam tensioner would still drive normally-ish. Spun bearing would die very quickly.

Also, if you spun a bearing, it is possible the crank is fine, you could get lucky and only need to install new bearings.

austinw2000
10-22-2011, 01:39 PM
my luck blows. did but now it wants to stall when i give it gas.

austinw2000
10-22-2011, 01:42 PM
I have not tried driving it since i got it to crank after a starter issue. due to the noise i am trying to figure out. if its the tensioner then cool. but if its a bearing i dont want to be driving it.

NeedingAnAudi
10-22-2011, 01:44 PM
my luck blows. did but now it wants to stall when i give it gas.

Yeah it does, fairly certain its the bearing. I doubt you will find much info on 1.8 to 2.8, but I know there is some info on 2.8 to 1.8, so everything they swapped over would just be opposite to what you need to swap.

mkturbo3
10-22-2011, 02:11 PM
try sticking a flat head screw driver right where the cam tensioner is and see if the noise is coming from there or the bottom end..

austinw2000
10-22-2011, 03:36 PM
well cant tell the difference. whe doing thaqt tried it with a stethoscope already

b5v6
10-22-2011, 05:56 PM
why not focus the time and energy into making the 1.8t more reliable. You wouldn't be the first...
Can't find the crank, buy a short block, or a long block. I've seen complete 1.8T engines go for less than $2K. Once you get the crank it's gonna cost extra to assemble engine, just seems better off if you get a long block.

anmagro
10-22-2011, 10:40 PM
even if u get a 2.8 in there....after that...everything u do to the car just take the price and X2 it and that will be how much u spend after doing the swap, everything from cats to heat work to gaskets to oil changes will cost you more.

austinw2000
10-23-2011, 06:01 AM
I do not have even a grand to throw at this motor. I just spent 1500 rebuilding it for this to happen. So another 2 grand is out the question.

S4NIK8
10-23-2011, 09:45 AM
Why buy a new crankshaft instead of taking the crank to a reputable machine shop and having it machined down then get new bearings? Did you do the rebuild or someone else?

spinall4
10-23-2011, 01:56 PM
I need thi car reliable. I am no longer looking for performance. I am just looking for reliability. Willing to trade my whole car off at this point for a Small SUV. not no kia or hyundai.

Yea why would you want a kia or hyundai with a 10 year warranty!!!! Hyundai has the best customer retention in the us market currently almost 60% of Hyundai buyers purchase another Hyundai product. You should so drive a new tucson if all of your local dealers are'nt sold out like mine are.

austinw2000
10-23-2011, 04:17 PM
Couldnt give me a damn kia or hyundai. But i guess you didnt get the fact I dont have the money to keep throwing at this car. I dont have the money or credit to pick up a car payment right now. People I am trying to save money due to a unforeseen addition to the family.

austinw2000
10-23-2011, 04:19 PM
Wel because I have no clue about buying bearings for a remachined crank. Some people claim they are unavailable. Only set i have found are sealed power and they gave out within 1 thousand miles of the rebuild. I rebuilt it myself not the first engine I rebuilt but the first to give me issues on the rebuild.

austinw2000
10-23-2011, 04:25 PM
what are my options on a used crankshaft at this point. Can i use a manual crankshaft in an automatic. because i can find one relatively easy for a manual, are any other crankshafts usable without modyifing my engine block.

csosnowski
10-23-2011, 04:34 PM
the block isnt different, the crankshaft is.

here: 1.8t crankshaft (http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?3125000)

austinw2000
10-23-2011, 05:28 PM
wondering what other cars i can get a crank from. that just tells me it has to be 058 block thats it. What stops me from using a manual crank for now till I swap my car to 5spd when i get the funds to complete the swap. It will be beneficial for me if I can. Saw on one forum it can be done but cant find the thread because i cant remember which forum.

S4NIK8
10-23-2011, 05:36 PM
There are undersized bearings avaliable, I would pull the motor out and see how bad things look inside. Did you check all the engine clearances? I haven't heard of anyone having issues with properly installed sealed power bearings in many different applications.

austinw2000
10-23-2011, 05:43 PM
was wondering since the transverse version uses a single crank style for both that matches our manual crank. why cant we use a manual crank in tiptronic cars then. be great for now.

austinw2000
10-23-2011, 06:02 PM
I am not trying to be sitting here with the car in pieces waiting to be fixed. I am trying to have the car parts here i need and then pulling the motor back out swapping out the parts and being done with it. I have to use it as my daily driver.

austinw2000
10-23-2011, 06:18 PM
Only thing I can seem to find is oversized bearings. Not had anyluck on undersized bearings.

JohnCash
10-23-2011, 08:23 PM
Yeah. I have a 2.8 w/ blown head gasket(s). And right now I wish I had a 1.8 You can get a 2.8 for around 500-1000+ with mileage varying. And then add in for labor. Unless you are going to shadetree the project and gain some knowledge and loose some patience. So roughly 1100ish with the price of the motor being lower. Im just giving you the run down in my situation. Anything is possible with time and money and persistence. I'd work on the noise with the 1.8t and find out for sure whats going on with that before swapping motors. Honestly swapping motors is not feasible unless its mandatory or your trying to break records. lol. good luck.

austinw2000
10-24-2011, 04:15 AM
Well i can pick up a v6 for about 250 used. But still no answers to my question about what all cranks areusable in an 058 block. because i have a chance to pick up a manual crank. Was wondering why cant i use it for now until I swap mine to a manul transmission.

austinw2000
10-24-2011, 01:55 PM
what is the deal with the AUG block in the passat. I have access to one that i can get w/ automatic crank.

csosnowski
10-24-2011, 04:33 PM
AUG is a 06B similar to the AWM so the crank wont work with your block but if Im not mistaken you can just drop the whole engine in and swap the accessories from your existing engine over. That is, if the AUG isnt damaged.

Or you can pull the head+accessories off your AEB and put it on the AUG block.

IIRC the main difference with the AEB=>AUG (AWM) is the 19mm vs 20mm piston wristpins, water pump (internal on AUG/AWM) and accessory brackets.

Someone with direct knowledge on this would have to confirm, but Im pretty sure theres some posts around here that detail this process. I know plenty of guys put the AEB head on the newer ATW,AWM block for the bigger ports, I just dont remember about the particulars on swapping the block.

austinw2000
10-24-2011, 05:00 PM
I know it requires a cable throttle body no matter what due to my car being drive by cable. Wondering so I can make this guy a worthwhile offer on the motor. Wondering because I am jusrt looking for daily driver that can hold up to my K04 without issues. So as long as the 19mm wrist pins can take it and no hard issues doing it then i guess it will be good.

walky_talky20
10-24-2011, 05:36 PM
EDIT: reading fail.

With the newer block (internal water pump) all of the cooling hard lines are different. Of course the throttle body is different, but there will be no place to mount the cable holder to the intake manifold, so there is a small issue there. Might have some trouble with the A/C compressor, so that might need swapped. Then a bunch of the sensors are different. So things like the knock sensors and such will need to be switched out. A bunch of little things.

austinw2000
10-24-2011, 05:45 PM
walky saw part of your post before it refreshed. Whats the deal with the aeb block you have? How much you looking for it?

austinw2000
10-24-2011, 05:46 PM
I know 034 sells a bracket for a drive by cable conversion if my throttle body would work. have new knock sensors.

S4NIK8
10-24-2011, 06:10 PM
Are you still driving the car? If not have you taken it apart yet?

austinw2000
10-24-2011, 06:10 PM
what all cars can i scavenge a 1.8t from? can my mount brackets be put on a tranverse engine if I swap the manifolds with mine? Wondering because I see alot of beetles floating around in junkyards and some jettas and golfs.

austinw2000
10-24-2011, 06:17 PM
it is parked for right now. havent had the chance to tear it down. but i know with a spun bearing the chance of the crank not being damaged is slim to none. everyone has pointed to a spun bearing and away from the cam chain tensioner. but need to get it back up and running asap due to costing me an arm and a leg to get rides to and from work. wondering because the transverse uses one crank with or without the bearing installed depending on trans. but longtiudal uses different cranks.

S4NIK8
10-24-2011, 07:14 PM
I would get it torn apart and see for sure how bad the damage is. If anything then you know what parts you will be able to resell to recoup some of your money for the new motor.

austinw2000
10-25-2011, 12:59 PM
I dont have the availability to keep it down. Why do people not understand that. I need to find a easy solve for this issue. These parts for B5 a4s dont seem to be selling. Because I tried to pretty much give away a set of gray leather seats and no one would come get them.

austinw2000
10-25-2011, 08:01 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qOyh89S7P5k

Here is what mine sounds like running right now.

austinw2000
10-26-2011, 12:24 PM
I am at the point of not knowing what to do with it. About ready to sell this car for scrap metal because I do not have the time or funds to retear this motor down and replace every part again since everyone says it has to be something different. it can't be the cam tensioner, rod bearings, oil pump and, lifters.

austinw2000
10-31-2011, 07:46 PM
Well the car is going on the market as is. Make a reasonable offer on it and its yours. Rims and all.

austinw2000
10-31-2011, 07:53 PM
http://www.audizine.com/classifieds/showproduct.php?product=59947

austinw2000
11-06-2011, 05:56 PM
Well guessing selling this car is pointless.