View Full Version : Test Pipe w/o stage 2...Can it cause damage???
RogoBen
05-30-2011, 06:12 AM
I recently received my RAI test pipe for and can't wait to put it on [wrench] I am currently running APR stage 1 and will go stage 2 immediately after installing the tp but I am torn between installing it myself or having a Goodspeed Performance in Scottsdale, AZ do it. I am not worried about the install, as it seems pretty straight forward and the RAI tp came with all the necessary hardware. What worries me is that one of the techs at Goodspeed told me that if I put the tp on myself and drive the car to the shop to get stage 2 put on by them, that I "can do some damage to the turbo" by driving it with the new test pipe and no stage 2? [confused] ? Is that correct or is he just trying to scare me into paying them 2.5 hrs of labor to install the tp and re-flash my ecu on the spot??? Any information would help so I can separate fact from fiction and get this thing put on already!!! [drive]
***I have to make a correction to this post. I just spoke with Goodspeed again and they now said they will charge me 1.5 hrs of labor as opposed to the 2.5 hrs originally quoted***
mikebo212
05-30-2011, 06:23 AM
The things people will say to make money! [facepalm] You running the test pipe on stage 1 will do nothing to the turbo. And they would have to reflash the chip anyway if you were going stg 2. Dont worry man and just install it and have fun.
mr shickadance
05-30-2011, 06:47 AM
2 things jump out at me,
1) being the fact that a decent shop can put in your test pipe within an hour
2) stage 2 offers no performance gains... Its just a system override that masks your check engine light that will inevitably come on via your second o2 sensor
This place seems to want stick it in you witb a 2.5 hour install
Kipper984x
05-30-2011, 06:53 AM
I recently put my HFC on, and had to wait about 2 weeks before I could get reflashed to stage 2, similar situation. You will notice performance gains immediately after installing. For me, my CEL came on about 50 miles after driving with it, and stayed that way until I got reflashed. Haven't seen that light since, and also just recently passed NY inspection with it. No damage to the car at all.
RogoBen
05-30-2011, 06:53 AM
Thanks for all the good information mikebo212 and mr shickadance!!! I kinda felt like the guy was trying to pull a fast one on me that's why I thought I'd check here to see what the truth was.
RogoBen
05-30-2011, 06:54 AM
I recently put my HFC on, and had to wait about 2 weeks before I could get reflashed to stage 2, similar situation. You will notice performance gains immediately after installing. For me, my CEL came on about 50 miles after driving with it, and stayed that way until I got reflashed. Haven't seen that light since, and also just recently passed NY inspection with it. No damage to the car at all.
Also very good information Kipper!!! Thanks!
schirm
05-30-2011, 08:20 AM
I was stage 1 with TP for about 15,000 miles you will be fine man
Gil2.0T
05-30-2011, 08:40 AM
I wouldnt go to them if they were gonna do that to you. I wonder what else they would try to pull.
jvis08
05-30-2011, 08:51 AM
I wouldnt go to them if they were gonna do that to you. I wonder what else they would try to pull. x2!....seems like shady business
NODO-GT
05-30-2011, 09:27 AM
today i was going to delete catalyst and i was told that sensors including o2, would get wrong readings and the engine would not work properly and fuel consumption would increase.
Gil2.0T
05-30-2011, 09:30 AM
The only thing that will happen is a cel on your dash because the first sensor is reading the same as the second since there is no cat to filter the gases.
You won't need the "stage 2" CEL overwrite anyways. The TP with jetted spacer should not throw a code. Like others have said, the stage 2 and stage 1 flash are the same, just overwriting the second 02 sensor. Just install the TP yourself and you'll be good to go, no shop required.
RogoBen
05-30-2011, 09:45 AM
You won't need the "stage 2" CEL overwrite anyways. The TP with jetted spacer should not throw a code. Like others have said, the stage 2 and stage 1 flash are the same, just overwriting the second 02 sensor. Just install the TP yourself and you'll be good to go, no shop required.
Thanks Will and everyone else!! I will definitely do this myself now!
mr shickadance
05-30-2011, 10:04 AM
the spacer is not a 100% garuntee that the light will go away....its worked for some, others have not had the luck, the stage 2 software should only be about 50$ if you decide to stay with the software you have
mr shickadance
05-30-2011, 10:05 AM
read the diy on doing this mod, and also PB blast the bolts bc the rust will make it a bitch to get out, so do that for a few days before you attempt it.....and jack your car up very high
mikebo212
05-30-2011, 10:09 AM
read the diy on doing this mod, and also PB blast the bolts bc the rust will make it a bitch to get out, so do that for a few days before you attempt it.....and jack your car up very high
amen. i didnt jack my car high enough so the downpipe was hitting the ground :x ended up sawing that shit off so i could slide the cat out.
Patience and a pack of beer should do the job [:D]
Sh4wn
05-30-2011, 06:46 PM
Been running the stage 1 software with a HFC for about 1 year now... never got the stage 2 flash since I got the o2 sensor spacer and I wasent getting a check engine... never got a single problem!
Oh and, I'd change shops if I were you!
RogoBen
05-31-2011, 07:05 AM
Been running the stage 1 software with a HFC for about 1 year now... never got the stage 2 flash since I got the o2 sensor spacer and I wasent getting a check engine... never got a single problem!
Oh and, I'd change shops if I were you!
Thanks for the info, DEFINITELY going to look into a new shop.
wootwoot
05-31-2011, 10:14 AM
I have also had poor dealings with Good Speed Performance in Scottsdale. They are the only APR authorized dealer in the area so they get you in the door that way but they charge you and arm and a leg for any work done there. I too am looking for another shop. They also quoted me 2.5 hours at $95 an hour to install a test pipe.
why wouldnt the stage 2 software give you any more power gains? To my understanding, the stage one is limited to what it is because there is still quite a bit of restriction at the turbo. Once the turbo can breathe a lot better, it can spool faster, giving you more gains.
please correct me if I am wrong.
Kipper984x
05-31-2011, 07:04 PM
why wouldnt the stage 2 software give you any more power gains? To my understanding, the stage one is limited to what it is because there is still quite a bit of restriction at the turbo. Once the turbo can breathe a lot better, it can spool faster, giving you more gains.
please correct me if I am wrong.
I once emailed APR directly about this, and they told me when you get flashed you are getting both stage 1 AND stage 2 at the same time. Your car becomes stage 2 when you add a HFC or test pipe. You then need to get reflashed (what most people think of as stage 2) to get rid of the CEL. Thats all getting the second reflash does, it doesn't redo anything in the APR tune because those changes were made when you were flashed originally. Apparently the chip can "learn" what hardware you have and adapt accordingly.
this makes sense, thank you much.
RogoBen
06-02-2011, 08:08 PM
So I got the RAI test pipe installed at Goodspeed yesterday. I am very pleased with the sound and performance I am getting now. The sounds are great coming both from the turbo as well as deeper tones from the exhaust. I do want to say that the RAI test pipe gave the shop a bit of a problem because the bolts on the down pipe end were crooked causing the RAI tp and the stock dp to not connect flush (it left a quarter inch gap between the two). The shop ended up drilling the holes in the stock dp flange a size bigger to make room for the crooked bolts on the tp closing the gap and allowing for a flush tight fit between the two. All in all everything fits well now, looks great and sounds even better.
So I got the RAI test pipe installed at Goodspeed yesterday. I am very pleased with the sound and performance I am getting now. The sounds are great coming both from the turbo as well as deeper tones from the exhaust. I do want to say that the RAI test pipe gave the shop a bit of a problem because the bolts on the down pipe end were crooked causing the RAI tp and the stock dp to not connect flush (it left a quarter inch gap between the two). The shop ended up drilling the holes in the stock dp flange a size bigger to make room for the crooked bolts on the tp closing the gap and allowing for a flush tight fit between the two. All in all everything fits well now, looks great and sounds even better.
You didn't happen to take any pictures did you? Our jig is set up for perfect fitment so you shouldn't have had any problems. Shoot me a PM and I can look into this more for you.
wootwoot
06-02-2011, 08:42 PM
How long of an install was it and how much did it set you back? Does your car feel a lot faster?
RogoBen
06-03-2011, 02:36 PM
How long of an install was it and how much did it set you back? Does your car feel a lot faster?
The install took the shop about 2 hrs a little bit of that was because we talked about our options for the bad fitment between the two rai tp and the stock down pipe as well as the drilling of the holes in the down pipe. The shop charged me like $150 for install plus stage 2 apr flash. I definitely feel more power and it sounds great. The problem now is traction. I have a fwd 6 speed manual and first gear is just tire spin. It's worth doing this modification.