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View Full Version : how much could a stock block take?



outti-a4wd
01-23-2011, 02:58 AM
i was wondering how much power and boost could you run on a stock block safely? i think i might need a new turbo i was thinking of a k04 whats the next size bigger after an k04 and also can it bolt right up to our manifold with out fabrication?

b6nukka
01-23-2011, 04:47 AM
you wont have to worry about that with a K04 but next step is a gtrs and its not the block you need to worry about is the head has a 300hp limit probably no more than 18 psi to be safe

AudiNFS
01-23-2011, 07:51 AM
Being AEB helps with the rod point though. I'm not sure how much, but I know AEB internals are stronger.

black99.5a4
01-23-2011, 08:06 AM
you wont have to worry about that with a K04 but next step is a gtrs and its not the block you need to worry about is the head has a 300hp limit probably no more than 18 psi to be safe

what are you talking about? there are plenty of 350+ awhp setups on stock heads. its how far you rev the head is the biggest issue.. Laser Viking is making over 300 in his car at 20psi on his 50 trim with a completely stock motor.. Let alone the countless VW guys making 350-380 on their completely stock motors

AudiNFS
01-23-2011, 08:11 AM
Interesting... So what's the safe revving mark? Does the revving mark have anything to do with the turbo setup's power?

black99.5a4
01-23-2011, 08:16 AM
if you shift early you can fall out of boost.. you'd have to run a lot and i mean a LOT of pressure to do any damage to the head (think 3076 at 25-30psi and bigger).

stock head can be revved to 7500 but i'd do a 7300-7400 rev limiter as our tachs arent that accurate when going that fast. Anything above 7500 will float the valves and could come in contact with the piston. I think this is the head issue people talk about from time to time. Its not really the pressure its the fact that idiots think they can rev them above 7500.

black99.5a4
01-23-2011, 08:18 AM
Being AEB helps with the rod point though. I'm not sure how much, but I know AEB internals are stronger.

This use to be the talk for the longest time. The pistons are for sure stronger, as well as the 20mm wrist pins. But where AEB's are blowing up around 315-320 from bent rods. There are 3-5 b6 guys over the last few years that have taken their setups extreme and made 330-340 on eliminator or baby full frames that spool quick without rod issues.

So i think, now that people are testing waters.. its hard to say where the strength and weaknesses are anymore.

ThatA4T
01-23-2011, 08:20 AM
ive seen a stock aeb with a gt3071 pushing 25ish psi consistantly but by no means would i reccomend it

AudiNFS
01-23-2011, 08:52 AM
if you shift early you can fall out of boost.. you'd have to run a lot and i mean a LOT of pressure to do any damage to the head (think 3076 at 25-30psi and bigger).

stock head can be revved to 7500 but i'd do a 7300-7400 rev limiter as our tachs arent that accurate when going that fast. Anything above 7500 will float the valves and could come in contact with the piston. I think this is the head issue people talk about from time to time. Its not really the pressure its the fact that idiots think they can rev them above 7500.

So on a stock AEB head, would it be safe to run a GT2860RS turbo at 23-25PSI without W/M and shift around or before 7K RPM's? or would that boost pressure still cause damage and require rods?

Gaberossi
01-23-2011, 09:01 AM
I plan on putting down 400hp before building the head on my AEB just I wont rev above 7400rpm...my PTE5857 flows more than a gt3076 and I have seen other members using a 5857 and a 6262 @ 25+psi and not blow the head

AudiNFS
01-23-2011, 09:12 AM
I plan on putting down 400hp before building the head on my AEB just I wont rev above 7400rpm...my PTE5857 flows more than a gt3076 and I have seen other members using a 5857 and a 6262 @ 25+psi and not blow the head
[up] That is awesome. Do you need anything to compensate for the bigger power without having the rods and stuff?

black99.5a4
01-23-2011, 09:17 AM
I plan on putting down 400hp before building the head on my AEB just I wont rev above 7400rpm...my PTE5857 flows more than a gt3076 and I have seen other members using a 5857 and a 6262 @ 25+psi and not blow the head

if you're talkn about the B6 members on them.. they are all cammed except Dan and he's running springs/retainers. If you dont do AT LEAST that, your 5857 isnt going to see 400hp having to stop at 7300-7400. Dan's revving his to 8g's or more, now he's on a 6262. 1.8 with just rods, spa manifold, 830's, maestro and a 6262.. spool is 4800-4900 rpm's.

the BB units are only spooling 100-200 rpm sooner.. not really worth the extra cash, imo if you were considering.

black99.5a4
01-23-2011, 09:18 AM
[up] That is awesome. Do you need anything to compensate for the bigger power without having the rods and stuff?

he's going to have rods in it to see 400.. the head you'll want retainers/springs to really use a big turbo.. with a 2860, you'll max it out in efficiency on a stock motor before it blows.. a GT2860 is good to 300hp, sure a race file and w/m will probably make 300 to the wheels.. that isnt going to hurt the motor either.

There are apr stg3+ guys running 280-285 on 93 files without issues and putting 100k+ miles on their setups.

outti-a4wd
01-23-2011, 09:23 AM
So around how much power could you make with a k04 set up with intake turbo back fmic chip pretty much bolt on how much whp could a k04 produce an with a tune and can k04 boost I'm just looking to get around the 350 mark also how much power could the k04 produce over the stock k03 and the gt28 also it the gt28 a good size and would you have to tune if you put it on or can you run it for a while like going with a k04?

Polski
01-23-2011, 09:35 AM
There a plenty of discussions regarding the k04, if you can find it dirt cheap, got for it, if not, its not worth it.
Optimistically, the k04 can give you about 200-220 at the wheels, and I stress the word optimistically.
The k04 has a lot of torque down low, which is dangerous if you catch an important spike.

Bottom line is; the cost to power ratio of the k04, makes it not worth it.
Your better off dishing out some extra coin and go with a gt28 series.

outti-a4wd
01-23-2011, 09:52 AM
Can a gt28 bolt up To my stock exhaust and can I run a gt28 with out tune for a little while or would it need a tune off top? About how much power could you make off a gt28 with full bolt ons and ecu upgrade? I just got the car so I want an efficient turbo set up with out going in side of the engine I plan on buying an engine Down the road to play with so I wanna play it safe I learned my lessions with playing with internals when it's your only car lol so now I like to keep a race engine and a fun dd lol so about how much could a bolt on gt28 give you and also is it just an gt28 or is it like a gt28rs ect, and will it bolt up to the stock manifold like the k03/04?

Shhmaudi
01-23-2011, 10:35 AM
So on a stock AEB head, would it be safe to run a GT2860RS turbo at 23-25PSI without W/M and shift around or before 7K RPM's? or would that boost pressure still cause damage and require rods?

I am running that setup everyday on my car and it loves it.. holds strong till the rev limiter. AEBs have forged internals.. good guess would bearound 300awhp

AudiNFS
01-23-2011, 10:38 AM
Not to thread jack (could have been stated earlier), but how much is the power difference between a GTRS Elim. and a GT2860RS full frame setup?

Gaberossi
01-23-2011, 11:00 AM
my setup is already built and now just fab'n up the exhaust and intercooler, I am building the head in september with ferrea valves,springs,retainers,solid lifters and its 1mm over sized with a port and polish job so I can live with less than 400hp til then lol..who would think a ~360hp DD is garbage =P... i got the Ball bearing 5857