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adr3naline fix
08-10-2010, 08:51 PM
......I needz a MUCH bigger turbo.



Any maybe some meth








and nitrous























and pixie dust






edit: Maybe I should just get an S4 and go twin GT's

DrkZide
08-10-2010, 08:58 PM
That fast huh? What were the specs on the S3? What body? Do you know motor size?

biketsai
08-10-2010, 09:00 PM
That fast huh? What were the specs on the S3? What body? Do you know motor size?

Lol, umm Im pretty sure a stage 3 S4 is a
2.7L twin turbo V6 with K04 turbos.

adr3naline fix
08-10-2010, 09:00 PM
That fast huh? What were the specs on the S3? What body? Do you know motor size?

Ko4's, 3in Dp's, LW flywheel - and a meth injection that was not working- that's all I know of. I'll link him to this thread and maybe he can fill us in

DrkZide
08-10-2010, 09:10 PM
Lol, umm Im pretty sure a stage 3 S4 is a
2.7L twin turbo V6 with K04 turbos.

I'm new here so I didn't know and didn't know if he had any other mods. That stage 3 sounds alot like a stock VR4 with upgraded turbos. How much do those normally weigh?

adr3naline fix
08-10-2010, 09:14 PM
I'm new here so I didn't know and didn't know if he had any other mods. That stage 3 sounds alot like a stock VR4 with upgraded turbos. How much do those normally weigh?

The Stg 3 S4? ~3700lbs.
The VR-4? I dont know - how much do two elephant and a Hummer H2 weigh?



Big turbo VR-4's are no joke. I have a buddy from highschool that has a 700awhp 91 before nitrous - about $13k into it ontop of the car. Total maintenance bitches though - worse that S4's!

a408
08-10-2010, 09:18 PM
2.0 + pte5857 or gt3076 + a good tune should be able to keep up with a stg3 s4.

...right?

DonnieDark0
08-10-2010, 09:28 PM
ko4 / ko3 s4 = instaboost. lol. you really need to know what your doing with an A4 to get it to beat that instaboost. ( big ass turbo on a highway pull )

a408
08-10-2010, 09:55 PM
ko4 / ko3 s4 = instaboost. lol. you really need to know what your doing with an A4 to get it to beat that instaboost. ( big ass turbo on a highway pull )

you can easily have the spook of a k04 with 300whp.

you just need a 2.0, and a gt2868 (billet compressor wheel)[:D]

GaroBlu
08-10-2010, 10:12 PM
B5 A4s are nice and fast when built, but to make enough HP you will lose too much low end torque. Not to say that you couldn't beat a stage 3 s4, it would have to be a david vs goliath affair.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nfVmBrhbWWw

bryzf1
08-10-2010, 10:18 PM
that video never gets old :)

GaroBlu
08-10-2010, 10:47 PM
You have a 3L Allroad!? That would never get old :p

I am trying to convince my wife that the Allroad would be a good car, but she doesn't want me to mess with it too much.

/threadjack

Coopa
08-10-2010, 11:22 PM
Fully built 3.0 gt25 or gt28 allroad would be straight up insanity.

To the op, you're gonna need pixie dust on steriods! I don't even see a way that it's possible that a 1.8t to ever keep with a stage 3. A 2.0 w/ gt35 hx35 etc. would be a little laggy and 3071 or 3076 wouldn't be enough grunt. (talking no weight reduction)

JumboBlack1.8
08-10-2010, 11:52 PM
I'd like to think that my car (when dialed in) can take a stg 3 S4. Even without meth...... (Flame suit on)

GaroBlu
08-11-2010, 04:08 AM
I'd like to think that my car (when dialed in) can take a stg 3 S4. Even without meth...... (Flame suit on)

When dialed in you could probably beat me since I need fueling (Stage 3-). I don't think there would be a chance once I get some new injectors and larger intercoolers. It would motivate the S4 crowd to try new stuff if A4s started beating the stage 3 guys... it just wont happen though.

lowandslow4now
08-11-2010, 05:32 AM
You would need atleast 400awhp+ to keep up with a healthy stage3 and there are not too many people out there with healthy BAT A4's.

A4 TSCHUSS
08-11-2010, 06:16 AM
Not the greatest and the car had some issues that night but stage 3s aren't "that" almighty. There are actually quite a bit that arent super fast. They are not even close to all created equal. Brake boost and you can hang/beat one if your car is actually fast. Not even tuned completely right and could run more boost than the 26psi. This was the result, wish I didn't somehow miss 4th.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ctpzx1WD3so&feature=youtube_gdata

Don Supreme
08-11-2010, 06:21 AM
Now keep in mind, that was an near average Stage 3 car, while David's car has almost every mod you can put on a street driven A4. (2.0, BAT, METH, CAMS, ETC, ETC).. Both cars could be faster.

A4 TSCHUSS
08-11-2010, 06:37 AM
I don't know about average [:p] a friend kept up with one (apr) pretty much in his b5 a4 with 3071r and I put aircraft carrier links on that friend. That particular s4 trapped a best of 114 on race gas. Another stage 3 (awe) trapped a best of 114 on pump that I have ran. That car in the video obviously had some kind of issue when he went to the track recently since he dynoed very high 400s hp and tq but trapped 117.9 which is why I assume you are saying is "average." A 4th s4 I drove (awe) was not faster than my car and the owner agreed after he rode in mine and then drove it. I couldn't get him to race on video. Trust me, there are way more s4s out there that are stage 3 that aren't incredible like the 4 or 5 YouTube celebrities beating everything (Marc, evilempire, etc)

Here is my friend racing that s4 I was talking about


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qqb6GAtBSac&feature=youtube_gdata

Here I am racing that same friend so imagine what I would have done to that stage 3 s4, I would have raped him like I did to my friend. And that was with my 30r I have more power now with the 5857


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xCPVTC3wVNM&feature=youtube_gdata

jturnbull
08-11-2010, 07:33 AM
s4 can make much more smooth reliable power for less money then an a4 anyday

Altech75
08-11-2010, 07:52 AM
s4 can make much more smooth reliable power for less money then an a4 anyday

If you took out the words 'reliable', 'for less money' and 'anyday'. Then I'd believe you, or do you mean when they were all new.

EuroDriven
08-11-2010, 08:17 AM
Cool story bro.

guy022077
08-11-2010, 08:19 AM
wont the guy with the most money win? doesnt matter S4 S9 and S15 A4 the guy that was willing to mod his car into the poor house is gonna be faster. I would like to see a "Which is faster on a 5k budget?" or same on a 2k budget.

1NaudiA4
08-11-2010, 08:29 AM
A well running properly set-up 30r A4 should be able to keep up with a stage 3 S4. Properly set-up as in cams, meth, and a good tune. Heck last time I went to the track I trapped 120mph (with stock cams) so a stage 3 S4 isn't too far away.

TighTT
08-11-2010, 08:30 AM
Fully built 3.0 gt25 or gt28 allroad would be straight up insanity.

To the op, you're gonna need pixie dust on steriods! I don't even see a way that it's possible that a 1.8t to ever keep with a stage 3. A 2.0 w/ gt35 hx35 etc. would be a little laggy and 3071 or 3076 wouldn't be enough grunt. (talking no weight reduction)


Untrue.....an HTAGT35R is more than enough. Trust me.

Jc61990
08-11-2010, 08:40 AM
wow. this kinda makes me not wanna build my car anymore. i wanted to do a 2.0L Stroker, Cat 3658 Cams, HTA3076r, water meth, and stuff. after all that and you cant even pull on a stg3 s4. thats kinda like... upsetting.

1NaudiA4
08-11-2010, 08:49 AM
wow. this kinda makes me not wanna build my car anymore. i wanted to do a 2.0L Stroker, Cat 3658 Cams, HTA3076r, water meth, and stuff. after all that and you cant even pull on a stg3 s4. thats kinda like... upsetting.

You would have no problem pulling on a stage 3 S4 with that setup. Thats basically my setup except except I have stock cams and run E85..... a 120mph trap speed is enough to keep up with most and pull on some stage 3 s4's.

DonnieDark0
08-11-2010, 08:53 AM
wow. this kinda makes me not wanna build my car anymore. i wanted to do a 2.0L Stroker, Cat 3658 Cams, HTA3076r, water meth, and stuff. after all that and you cant even pull on a stg3 s4. thats kinda like... upsetting.

dude you gotta understand the s4 is v6 twin turbo. Big handicap. but to hang with the s4's is cool as shit. Not many a4's can. Id say GO FOR IT. thats fucin fast and fun.


ive never even drove a stg3 s4 OR a BT a4. I am pretty sure daily driving a BT a4 would be alot more nicer. The torque spikes early on s4's is a bit uncomfortable for Daily driving.

Jc61990
08-11-2010, 08:59 AM
dude you gotta understand the s4 is v6 twin turbo. Big handicap. but to hang with the s4's is cool as shit. Not many a4's can. Id say GO FOR IT. thats fucin fast and fun.


ive never even drove a stg3 s4 OR a BT a4. I am pretty sure daily driving a BT a4 would be alot more nicer. The torque spikes on s4's is a bit uncomfortable for Daily driving.


yeah i know all about the s4. i almost bought one not to long ago, but i have a lot of money invested in my car already and decided to keep and build it. but yeah. after its done. come find me on LI and ill let u drive it.

TighTT
08-11-2010, 09:13 AM
I am pretty sure daily driving a BT a4 would be alot more nicer.

I think you have that backwards. Daily driving a 500+ whp A4 issnt too easy. S4 on the other hand is cake.

belinko
08-11-2010, 09:17 AM
It's about time this topic gets tackled. I'm just waiting for the S4 guys to chime in. Back in the day the only comparison's were APR stg3 A4's vs APR/AWE stg3 S4's. In any case it's extremely difficult to compensate for an extra turbo and an extra 0.9L of displacement. I believe that a 400awhp A4 should be able to hang with a 350-400awhp S4 in a standing mile up to a point. On the track I would think the A4 get's the advantage.

On a side note I plan to build and keep my car, one of the primary reasons for not going to an S4 was that fact that you've got to pull the motor just about every time it needs to be worked on, especially if it has GT's. There's just no room.$.02

Jc61990
08-11-2010, 09:21 AM
It's about time this topic gets tackled. I'm just waiting for the S4 guys to chime in. Back in the day the only comparison's were APR stg3 A4's vs APR/AWE stg3 S4's. In any case it's extremely difficult to compensate for an extra turbo and an extra 0.9L of displacement. I believe that a 400awhp A4 should be able to hang with a 350-400awhp S4 in a standing mile up to a point. On the track I would think the A4 get's the advantage.

On a side note I plan to build and keep my car, one of the primary reasons for not going to an S4 was that fact that you've got to pull the motor just about every time it needs to be worked on, especially if it has GT's. There's just no room.$.02

thats also another reason i didnt get the s4.

JumboBlack1.8
08-11-2010, 09:26 AM
I think you have that backwards. Daily driving a 500+ whp A4 issnt too easy. S4 on the other hand is cake.

Totally true...I'm at 400+whp, and its certainly fun to drive daily, but it just doesn't have the instant torque an S4 does....I will definitely own a project B5 S4, hopefully some time soon-ish. It's a fantastic motor......but I'm pretty sure my car can hang with a Stg 3.....When I get tuned for meth, I'll try putting it to the test

sean1.8t
08-11-2010, 09:29 AM
When dialed in you could probably beat me since I need fueling (Stage 3-). I don't think there would be a chance once I get some new injectors and larger intercoolers. It would motivate the S4 crowd to try new stuff if A4s started beating the stage 3 guys... it just wont happen though.

funny thread.

a lot of A4's out there are faster than stg3 S4's. been that way for a long time. most of them you just don't see on teh forums. and overall, there are more faster S4's than A4's.

guy022077
08-11-2010, 10:14 AM
well I hope when im done with my typical bt 5857 fmic 1.9 blah blah i hope to keep up with quite a bit...then in a years time ill be going vr6 2.9 or 3.0 turbo. will it still count as a4 vs s4 if i am not doing it with a modified 1.8t?

chris164935
08-11-2010, 10:26 AM
Not the greatest and the car had some issues that night but stage 3s aren't "that" almighty. There are actually quite a bit that arent super fast. They are not even close to all created equal. Brake boost and you can hang/beat one if your car is actually fast. Not even tuned completely right and could run more boost than the 26psi. This was the result, wish I didn't somehow miss 4th, it was about to get ugly.
Exactly. Brake boost=win. Although, it's a lot harder to do with DBW...

TighTT
08-11-2010, 10:31 AM
funny thread.

overall, there are more faster S4's than A4's.

Fo sho.

jamestown478
08-11-2010, 10:41 AM
A well running properly set-up 30r A4 should be able to keep up with a stage 3 S4. Properly set-up as in cams, meth, and a good tune. Heck last time I went to the track I trapped 120mph (with stock cams) so a stage 3 S4 isn't too far away.

Custom tune on that s4 and you wont have a chance in hell of taking it

jsquillz22
08-11-2010, 11:04 AM
2.0 + pte5857 or gt3076 + a good tune should be able to keep up with a stg3 s4.

...right?

wrong....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nfVmBrhbWWw

KNaudi
08-11-2010, 11:11 AM
ive never even drove a stg3 s4 OR a BT a4. I am pretty sure daily driving a BT a4 would be alot more nicer. The torque spikes on s4's is a bit uncomfortable for Daily driving.

LOL what?!?! you admit to having driven neither then make THAT statement?!? riiiiight. A k04ed S4 is MILES better as a daily than a BAT A4. Torque SPIKES on a K04ed s4 are WORSE than on a BAT A4? Have you even seen the dyno charts of either of these cars?

I think you've been drinking, especially considering that you said 'more nicer'

veggiemonster
08-11-2010, 11:11 AM
Now keep in mind, that was an near average Stage 3 car, while David's car has almost every mod you can put on a street driven A4. (2.0, BAT, METH, CAMS, ETC, ETC).. Both cars could be faster.

tweets car runs about a 3.3-3.4 fats on e85, which is worse than evilempires car runs (i remember 3.0's). just fyi

the custom files have improved a great deal since those days of that video, and now custom files make about 75 more whp than the older OTS kits.

you guys shouldn't use old data to make comparisons!

veggiemonster
08-11-2010, 11:14 AM
LOL what?!?! you admit to having driven neither then make THAT statement?!? riiiiight. A k04ed S4 is MILES better as a daily than a BAT A4. Torque SPIKES on a K04ed s4 are WORSE than on a BAT A4? Have you even seen the dyno charts of either of these cars?

I think you've been drinking.

lol. torque spikes are only on k03's kid, on k04s you only get power when you ask for it.

NOTORIOUS VR
08-11-2010, 11:20 AM
in

exorcet
08-11-2010, 11:35 AM
wow. this kinda makes me not wanna build my car anymore. i wanted to do a 2.0L Stroker, Cat 3658 Cams, HTA3076r, water meth, and stuff. after all that and you cant even pull on a stg3 s4. thats kinda like... upsetting.

reality....she's a bitch!

JumboBlack1.8
08-11-2010, 11:39 AM
We clearly need to revisit this issue, considering all the changes that have occurred in both platforms.......If someone wants to help me tune my car for meth (preferably someone who's familiar with Maestro 7), I'll be up for making some video comparisons, for the sake of friendly competition

J-b5
08-11-2010, 11:43 AM
Im always available for a freindly run in the ottawa area. Stage3 S4 here.

veggiemonster
08-11-2010, 11:51 AM
We clearly need to revisit this issue, considering all the changes that have occurred in both platforms.......If someone wants to help me tune my car for meth (preferably someone who's familiar with Maestro 7), I'll be up for making some video comparisons, for the sake of friendly competition

talk to aiellios4, his s4 is slow! and he lives in boston i'm pretty sure

DonnieDark0
08-11-2010, 12:04 PM
:D

AudiSportB5S4
08-11-2010, 12:06 PM
If I see a 3.4 FATS I'm pissed :-p. Since getting alcohol injection and 60's, I haven't been higher than a 3.3X. Fastest has been a 3.0X... All my logging for 3 years now has been down the same stretch of road, where I've logged countless cars/customers, etc. All I use is 93 octane. Never have put race gas in my car!

Platforms develop more and more and options become available, I'm sure there are A4s that can mow down some S4s, but Stage 3 S4s have also been advancing with the addition of alcohol injection 1.5-2 years ago (really popular now) and larger injectors..

Don Supreme
08-11-2010, 12:08 PM
Well I have had a BAT A4 (HTA GT35r, stand alone, built from head to toe) and now I have a S4. My advice is get an S4.... Chip, DPs, Exhaust, and intake and you are either pulling or very least staying even with a 2871 A4. I have run a 3076 and 2871 A4... details to both pulls, but with only a Stage II+ S4 that instant torque gets them almost every time.

I do get walked by a fully built GT35R A4, but i guarantee a Stage 3 s4 would walk that car pretty hard.

Don Supreme
08-11-2010, 12:09 PM
. Thats what I came to understanding after reading a shit ton posts and after owning an extremly torquey stg2+ s4. at 3k the car would Jolt so hard. very uncomfortable.

.
N75 or MBC? Car is butter smooth, it responds to throttle input on N75.

spokismB5S4
08-11-2010, 12:13 PM
Not the greatest and the car had some issues that night but stage 3s aren't "that" almighty. There are actually quite a bit that arent super fast. They are not even close to all created equal. Brake boost and you can hang/beat one if your car is actually fast. Not even tuned completely right and could run more boost than the 26psi. This was the result, wish I didn't somehow miss 4th, it was about to get ugly.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ctpzx1WD3so&feature=youtube_gdata

yeah but with a more aggressive tune that s4 could be much quicker.

KNaudi
08-11-2010, 12:14 PM
hey shithead, im not talking about daily driving and reving the piss out of the damn thing. I mean , driving it with low rpms around town and not worrying about hitting maxboost at 3k. If boost comes in later , just makes sense it will be more comfortable especially when shifting alot earlier. Thats what I came to understanding after reading a shit ton posts and after owning an extremly torquey stg2+ s4. at 3k the car would Jolt so hard. very uncomfortable.

so sorry if you got butthurt over my post. take it deep bird.

lol alright dude. there's something wrong with your S4 with its ebay SS and SSAC exhaust if its bucking like that. either that or you have no idea how to drive.

I daily my stage 3 s4 and its miles better than my b5 a4 was in any situation save for gas mileage.



Thats what I came to understanding after reading a shit ton posts and after owning an extremly torquey stg2+ s4 maybe you should go drive a bit more instead.

A4Rob
08-11-2010, 12:18 PM
A4s started beating the stage 3 guys... it just wont happen though.

Really? I would love to prove you wrong. (I used to have a Nogaro Blue EPL stage 3 S4) Time will tell.


We clearly need to revisit this issue, considering all the changes that have occurred in both platforms.......If someone wants to help me tune my car for meth (preferably someone who's familiar with Maestro 7), I'll be up for making some video comparisons, for the sake of friendly competition


True. It is always good to keep it friendly :-)

DonnieDark0
08-11-2010, 12:18 PM
:D

S4_NE
08-11-2010, 12:18 PM
I think you have that backwards. Daily driving a 500+ whp A4 issnt too easy. S4 on the other hand is cake.

X2 /\ An S4 with hi power is still civil around stop traffic,

IMO not to start a pissing match with A4 guys it takes a lot to make a 1.8T keep up with an 2.7T , the instant TQ is tuff to beat, but I have my hat off to the guys that make there 1.8T put down big HP #'s

KNaudi
08-11-2010, 12:21 PM
not this s4 u sandy vagina. Was my last noggy s4 i had a year ago. It was all custom and extremely fast for a stg2. It was tuned to boost at 23 on ko3s. Alot more uncomfortable then the s4 I have now (mbc with the boost turned all the way down till the ko4s go in)

then why are you chiming in? the conversation is k04ed s4 vs. BAT a4 not 'k03ed s4 with mbc with the boost turned all the way down till the ko4s go in' vs BAT a4

A4Rob
08-11-2010, 12:22 PM
the instant TQ is tuff to beat, but I have my hat off to the guys that make there 1.8T put down big HP #'s

I do miss the torque of my old S4.

JumboBlack1.8
08-11-2010, 12:23 PM
True. It is always good to keep it friendly :-)

For sure, ha. But I say all us B5 guys unite to knock the B6/B7 S4 guys down a peg ;)

DonnieDark0
08-11-2010, 12:25 PM
:D

jamestown478
08-11-2010, 12:27 PM
not this s4 u sandy vagina. Was my last noggy s4 i had a year ago. It was all custom and extremely fast for a stg2. It was tuned to boost at 23 on ko3s. Alot more uncomfortable then the s4 I have now (mbc with the boost turned all the way down till the ko4s go in)

23psi? u sure ur boost gauge wasn't fucked up? how long did them k03's last before you friend them?

spokismB5S4
08-11-2010, 12:27 PM
not this s4 u sandy vagina. Was my last noggy s4 i had a year ago. It was all custom and extremely fast for a stg2. It was tuned to boost at 23 on ko3s. Alot more uncomfortable then the s4 I have now (mbc with the boost turned all the way down till the ko4s go in)

driving a k04 s4 with a good tune is smoother than a k03 car at any stage. You need to drive both cars before you talk nonsense.

Jc61990
08-11-2010, 12:28 PM
For sure, ha. But I say all us B5 guys unite to knock the B6/B7 S4 guys down a peg ;)

+1

GarbatyA4
08-11-2010, 12:28 PM
wow. this kinda makes me not wanna build my car anymore. i wanted to do a 2.0L Stroker, Cat 3658 Cams, HTA3076r, water meth, and stuff. after all that and you cant even pull on a stg3 s4. thats kinda like... upsetting.

And thats why I sold my GT2817r my friend.

I'm going to the dark side soon.

DonnieDark0
08-11-2010, 12:32 PM
23psi? u sure ur boost gauge wasn't fucked up? how long did them k03's last before you friend them?

heh. i rarely put it into boost. Didnt have a MBC so I couldnt turn it down. But it fuckin moveddddddd......I got rid of the car cause it was an attention magnet and I lost my job.

EDIT: spiked to 23 and tapered down to like 20/19

EErie B6
08-11-2010, 12:33 PM
why do i see this turning into another AW like showdown?

GaroBlu
08-11-2010, 12:35 PM
why do i see this turning into another AW like showdown?

Is there any reason it shouldn't? Bring it! :D

DonnieDark0
08-11-2010, 12:42 PM
As long as its friendly and Civil lol.

Anyone have any recent vids of stg3 a4s vs s4's? besides a4tschuss vids. heh

TighTT
08-11-2010, 12:48 PM
wrong....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nfVmBrhbWWw

Oh please...what a POOR example of a BT A4!! Bassed was a great guy and his car was nice....but a stage III killer? Nope. Any A4 that wants to take on stage III S4's needs some serious juice. That being said...there ARE a few A4's out there that are up to the challenge.

EErie B6
08-11-2010, 12:49 PM
uh, oh, you have awakened a monster...

http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php/380638-the-a4-boys-are-starting-to-think-they-can-beat-stg-3-s4-s-again.....?p=5562934#post5562934

someone is in trouble.

AudiSportB5S4
08-11-2010, 12:49 PM
heh. i rarely put it into boost. Didnt have a MBC so I couldnt turn it down. But it fuckin moveddddddd......I got rid of the car cause it was an attention magnet and I lost my job.

EDIT: spiked to 23 and tapered down to like 20/19

Sorry but after logging more cars than God knows what, and not the same, many many cars, I'd have to see a boost log of you holding 19psi on K03s.. I've seen the MBC turned up to 22psi on K03s and they were falling to 15-16 by redline. It's off the thread topic obviously, but I find it hard to believe. I'm a big ECUx log whore, so proof is in the pudding.

TighTT
08-11-2010, 12:50 PM
heh. i rarely put it into boost. Didnt have a MBC so I couldnt turn it down. But it fuckin moveddddddd......I got rid of the car cause it was an attention magnet and I lost my job.

EDIT: spiked to 23 and tapered down to like 20/19

Something was wrong then.....a chipped Ko3 S4 should run 16-17 psi on the high side.
23 PSI? Can you say "hot air"?

flynnr
08-11-2010, 12:55 PM
X2 /\ An S4 with hi power is still civil around stop traffic,

IMO not to start a pissing match with A4 guys it takes a lot to make a 1.8T keep up with an 2.7T , the instant TQ is tuff to beat, but I have my hat off to the guys that make there 1.8T put down big HP #'s

MIIIIIIIIght have something to do with having a much bigger engine, and twice as many turbo's...

DonnieDark0
08-11-2010, 12:57 PM
What kind of 1/4 times are these BAt a4's getting around?

GaroBlu
08-11-2010, 12:58 PM
Really? I would love to prove you wrong. (I used to have a Nogaro Blue EPL stage 3 S4) Time will tell.


I would love to see it and I am serious about that! It would give us more motivation and I mean no bad blood in the community. Competition is what furthers tuning :)

JumboBlack1.8
08-11-2010, 01:01 PM
I would love to see it and I am serious about that! It would give us more motivation and I mean no bad blood in the community. Competition is what furthers tuning :)

Agreed.....if we can keep this civil (i.e. no A4 bashing threads over in the S4 section ;-)...) then I'd be more than willing to make some videos. Win or lose, it'd be fun to see

S4_NE
08-11-2010, 01:06 PM
MIIIIIIIIght have something to do with having a much bigger engine, and twice as many turbo's...

it helps :)

looseboost
08-11-2010, 01:09 PM
how about 1.8taround 300-400 Hp ? even then would it not even hang with a stage 3 s4? a kid on my fb is claiming 400 whp for 6k with his jetta and im having trouble believing it.
he says
Gt28r turbo, cams, port and polish, and possibly stroke it or forge rods and pistons with a stage 2/3 tune

NOTORIOUS VR
08-11-2010, 01:11 PM
heh. i rarely put it into boost. Didnt have a MBC so I couldnt turn it down. But it fuckin moveddddddd......I got rid of the car cause it was an attention magnet and I lost my job.

EDIT: spiked to 23 and tapered down to like 20/19

Please top talking crap. You've already lost all credibility from your last few posts.

Don Supreme
08-11-2010, 01:13 PM
That car in the video obviously had some kind of issue when he went to the track recently since he dynoed very high 400s hp and tq but trapped 117.9 which is why I assume you are saying is "average."


Yes that is exactly why i said "near average", remember he ran you on pump and then he trapped 117 on e85, which as we know makes a big difference.

Sales@RAI
08-11-2010, 01:29 PM
DonnieDark0 - I did a 12.1@24lbs with a bad tune on straight 93 full weight

Turned it up to 33psi but the tune is still all over the place, should get into the 11s tho.

TighTT
08-11-2010, 01:32 PM
DonnieDark0 - I did a 12.1@24lbs with a bad tune on straight 93 full weight

Turned it up to 33psi but the tune is still all over the place, should get into the 11s tho.

We really need to get your tune strait. Likewise...I really need to up the meth on my car. Can you say "500+whp on pump?" [:D]

Sales@RAI
08-11-2010, 01:35 PM
Adam, by "we" do you mean you're giving me a tune? haha I know the Unitronic stuff is awesome, just need some time with Mike to fix my fueling. 500awhp shouldn't be a problem though. The car is just wild

guy022077
08-11-2010, 01:37 PM
what kind of fueling are you guys doing? 2,3,4 fuel pumps surge tanks?

NOTORIOUS VR
08-11-2010, 01:38 PM
just need some time with Mike to fix my fueling

It's always the same problem. It just never get's fixed.

TighTT
08-11-2010, 01:40 PM
what kind of fueling are you guys doing? 2,3,4 fuel pumps surge tanks?

2 pumps right now...but the whole system will be re-vamped over the winter.

TighTT
08-11-2010, 01:41 PM
Adam, by "we" do you mean you're giving me a tune? haha I know the Unitronic stuff is awesome, just need some time with Mike to fix my fueling. 500awhp shouldn't be a problem though. The car is just wild

Im not giving you a tune...but I know someone that will tune the piss outa that thing!

guy022077
08-11-2010, 01:45 PM
2 pumps right now...but the whole system will be re-vamped over the winter.

this is where i am now, i read about all these BT's but no mention of fuel pump or pumps, surge tanks or not, which FPR, very odd.

sean1.8t
08-11-2010, 01:47 PM
wrong....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nfVmBrhbWWw

i hate this video with a passion. Ian was running a gt2871r equivilent turbo at this time. nothing huge, nothing special. he only held the CAPS record becasue CAPS doesn't mean shit for how fast your car is.

you'll need at least a 3076r with all the bells and whistles to be in healthy stage 3 territory(at least 35r to run with EvilEmpire's wagon). and S256 like Ian's, not even close. was fun to watch all that flaming after he ran his mouth to the wrong people

sean1.8t
08-11-2010, 02:00 PM
tweets car runs about a 3.3-3.4 fats on e85, which is worse than evilempires car runs (i remember 3.0's). just fyi

the custom files have improved a great deal since those days of that video, and now custom files make about 75 more whp than the older OTS kits.

you guys shouldn't use old data to make comparisons!

well how about this... you S4 guys bring up the EvilEmpire vs Bassed video everytime a topic like this is brought up.

EvilEmpire was one of the first to get on the custom tune bandwagon YEARS ago. he had/has one of the top 3 fastest full weight k04 S4's out. Bassed had a small turbo on a base tune.

what kind of comparison is that?

Evilevo
08-11-2010, 02:42 PM
I'll happily run Clint. We can see GT A4 vs GT S4 [evilsmile]

I'm only at 25psi [>_<]

guy022077
08-11-2010, 02:44 PM
I'll happily run Clint. We can see GT A4 vs GT S4 [evilsmile]

I'm only at 25psi [>_<]

no excuses both of you should be at MAX to end this once and for now.

Evilevo
08-11-2010, 02:45 PM
no excuses both of you should be at MAX to end this once and for now.

Max? you got money for me to do Intake Manifold and TB and the rest of my Fueling? So i can run 40psi and C16.

A4 TSCHUSS
08-11-2010, 03:09 PM
tweets car runs about a 3.3-3.4 fats on e85, which is worse than evilempires car runs (i remember 3.0's). just fyi

Wrong. Tweet flashed his car and did a little tweaking before making his trip to Florida. He ran a 3.4 fats on 93 and meth injection. That is why I have 3.4 fats listed in the description of the video of us. He later got the e85 tune finished and ran 3.0 fats. He also only runs 21.5psi of boost, what does Evil run?

yeah but with a more aggressive tune that s4 could be much quicker.
Yeah and? My car couldn't run over 26psi because it was already going lean at that boost running high 12s from a poor fuel pump dropping pressure since it couldn't keep up. My car is also on a half ass tune where the a/f goes all over the place. I will be running more like 30psi daily when my tune is finally done. I also now have a better fuel pump to allow more boost.


Yes that is exactly why i said "near average", remember he ran you on pump and then he trapped 117 on e85, which as we know makes a big difference.

Yes, he also said he had some issues and was also running 2psi less boost. Don't forget when his car was running good he dynoed on a mustang and did 430whp 484wtq uncorrected (with open dump). And a stock 505hp Z06 dynoed 428whp on that dyno a few days before (little low) so his numbers could be even higher. So I definitely believe something was wrong that night at the track trapping 118. He ran 93.5 in the 1/8th which is pretty good so having boost issues could explain the 1/4 trap.


what kind of fueling are you guys doing? 2,3,4 fuel pumps surge tanks?

Bosch 044 in tank and 4 bar regulator. That's it.

bryzf1
08-11-2010, 03:14 PM
You have a 3L Allroad!? That would never get old :p

I am trying to convince my wife that the Allroad would be a good car, but she doesn't want me to mess with it too much.

/threadjack


Stroked out to a full 3.0L w/ 2.8 heads and cams, rods, pistons w/ Tial turbos ** 6spd of course! ;)

guy022077
08-11-2010, 03:34 PM
Max? you got money for me to do Intake Manifold and TB and the rest of my Fueling? So i can run 40psi and C16.

yes, but im not giving it to you, but at least if you lose you have your excuse ready

"guy didnt buy me an ntake Manifold and TB and the rest of my Fueling? So i can't run 40psi and C16."

haha

Evilevo
08-11-2010, 03:43 PM
Doesn't matter anyway. 25psi is enough.

2psi would be enough, Clints car is broken. Lol

adr3naline fix
08-11-2010, 04:21 PM
Whoa this thread blew up over the day.

More details to satisfy some posters:
-I'm at about 275awhp with the current tune & gas I'm running.
-The S4 ("Mott Power" AZ SN) has 410awhp
-He pulled at about 1 - 1.5 cars per second on me from 50 to ~110mph if I recall correctly.

It was on Rancho Guadalupe Hwy.

nunya
08-11-2010, 04:30 PM
what kind of fueling are you guys doing? 2,3,4 fuel pumps surge tanks?

Bosch 044 and 550cc's with an adjustable FPR up pretty high.

derek072887
08-11-2010, 04:39 PM
i will gladly race any streetable a4 that wants to come to iowa city, don't care what you have done to the car 1.8 or 2.0 doesn't matter big turbo or small turbo... ill put money on my s4 winning that race... and ill video it and make a video just like the very first video link in this thread lol!!

zx6r1033
08-11-2010, 04:55 PM
In for the results. :)

1NaudiA4
08-11-2010, 05:06 PM
i will gladly race any streetable a4 that wants to come to iowa city, don't care what you have done to the car 1.8 or 2.0 doesn't matter big turbo or small turbo... ill put money on my s4 winning that race... and ill video it and make a video just like the very first video link in this thread lol!!

Too bad your not closer to Chicago.... a few hundred bucks in my pocket would be nice [:D]

Sin is sick
08-11-2010, 05:36 PM
I will run any a4 in michigan to ohio/ chi.... Or I will run any a4 at h20 lets set something up..... And david I love how reid at the end of yelling hot mode bitch calls you brad lmao

Sin is sick
08-11-2010, 05:37 PM
Inaudia4 I will gladly run you for a grand

derek072887
08-11-2010, 05:39 PM
Inaudia4 I will gladly run you for a grand

oh its on!

JumboBlack1.8
08-11-2010, 05:40 PM
This is not the kind of "friendly" competition I'd hoped for.....

A4 TSCHUSS
08-11-2010, 05:40 PM
God I wish I lived somewhere else sometimes where these stage 3 guys live. When I get my tune finished I would gladly race any stage 3 willing to. You better get a nice jump off the honk because I am gonna be getting it when that boost hits! Better yet, bring race gas and I will run it too with about 36psi, that should be good for somewhere in the 500s [:)]

My roommate has a B6 A4 that he is trying to sell since he recently bought a B5 S4 (stock). When it sells we will be bringing his to Vast tuned stage 3 status, then we will get some videos [:D] Someone buy the A4 in the classifieds!!!! (turbo1a4)

nunya
08-11-2010, 05:46 PM
There is plenty in norcal. But, we are friendly and dont have to do pulls with money on the table. I guess most S4 guys need to recoup money from pulling their motor to change the turbo's. Whats that 22hrs of labor? :-)

--dillon

sean1.8t
08-11-2010, 05:47 PM
Inaudia4 I will gladly run you for a grand

you must have some crazy out of this world k04 car. or you don't know what all the words in Inaudiaa4's sig mean

derek072887
08-11-2010, 05:51 PM
you must have some crazy out of this world k04 car. or you don't know what all the words in Inaudiaa4's sig mean
all those words mean " my turbo won't spool till your 5 cars ahead of me but when it does hit i may catch you by 120mph"

A4 TSCHUSS
08-11-2010, 05:51 PM
you must have some crazy out of this world k04 car. or you don't know what all the words in Inaudiaa4's sig mean

I don't know who it is, but I kinda think it is someone with a Vast tuned RS6 S4 from him commenting on my video aka he was the camera man of the video.

A4 TSCHUSS
08-11-2010, 05:54 PM
all those words mean " my turbo won't spool till your 5 cars ahead of me but when it does hit i may catch you by 120mph"

He is a B5 so he can easily break boost (kinda like I did with my ebrake on the one run since I cant use the brakes due to drive by wire) only better. The S4 wont go anywhere off the honk and that car on e85 with the boost at 30-32psi could be making 500whp.

derek072887
08-11-2010, 06:00 PM
i can BRAKE boost all day and im drive by wire..... lol and i highly doubt he can brake boost that car past 5psi in a low second gear pull say from 20mph...

A4 TSCHUSS
08-11-2010, 06:07 PM
Well guess the S4 is different, but the B6 A4 can't. And 20mph in 2nd wtf? If I am going that slow then you are running me from a dig and I guarantee you aren't getting me off the line. Maybe equal but you won't beat me, well unless you are good at running 1.6 60fts which I highly doubt.

derek072887
08-11-2010, 06:14 PM
20mph in 2nd is right at 3k rpm in an s4 which is where we get full boost :) and can brake boost to a full 22psi at that rpm.... how high can you "brake" boost at that rpm?

adr3naline fix
08-11-2010, 06:16 PM
I hope some good videos get posted out of my thread here....lot a smack talk.

derek072887
08-11-2010, 06:16 PM
and 20 mph isnt that slow... around her we do 20-120 rolls all the time

A4 TSCHUSS
08-11-2010, 06:17 PM
So you are super confident about smoking an A4, BUT you want to start in the absolute best spot for you and worst for the A4? Got it. Are you scared a little? I can't brake boost to well since I have to use the e-brake, at that point I would have to start in 1st at a high rpm, good thing I can go to 8000rpm [:)]

derek072887
08-11-2010, 06:18 PM
high rpm at 20mph should be perfect 4 u :)

and i can safely rev to 7200 u dont have that much on me

S4tranquility
08-11-2010, 06:20 PM
well how about this... you S4 guys bring up the EvilEmpire vs Bassed video everytime a topic like this is brought up.

EvilEmpire was one of the first to get on the custom tune bandwagon YEARS ago. he had/has one of the top 3 fastest full weight k04 S4's out. Bassed had a small turbo on a base tune.

what kind of comparison is that?
I think you're underselling it. The showdown was between a 2.0L BUILT motor BAT A4 running 30 PSI IIRC vs Plain Jane K04 S4 running tweaked AWE (not custom tuning) without meth or any unusual mods. Bassed produced logs and held the CAPS record. Maybe that doesn't mean everything, but it was clearly running well based on logs.

A4 TSCHUSS
08-11-2010, 06:20 PM
and 20 mph isnt that slow... around her we do 20-120 rolls all the time

120, that's it? I don't let off until the other guy does, they always let off first [:/] And out of curiousity what tuning do you have I don't see it in the sig? And of course fats are popular in your neck of the woods (S4 world), what does yours do?

A4 TSCHUSS
08-11-2010, 06:21 PM
I think you're underselling it. The showdown was between a 2.0L BUILT motor BAT A4 running 30 PSI IIRC vs Plain Jane K04 S4 running tweaked AWE (not custom tuning) without meth or any unusual mods. Bassed produced logs and held the CAPS record. Maybe that doesn't mean everything, but it was clearly running well based on logs.

That car had a tiny "big turbo" which was definitely not a "BAT" and was slow as dirt, and I am not even sure eactly what the CAPS crap is. I know it is like FATS in some way but that is about it.

LB S4 LB
08-11-2010, 06:29 PM
i own a b5 s4 and b5 a4 and theres no comparing the two.. yes a4s can be built very fast for instance http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php/368053-Big-Power-Audi-A4
should be around 600 awhp
is it fast? hell yea..
will it walk a stg 3 ko4 s4 yea
is there 15k+ in the motor? YES
but just dosnt seem "do-able" for your average b5 a4 owner

when i could take 15k buy a stg 3 s4 and be 400awhp with daily driveability
and easily walk 90% of the a4s out there

nunya
08-11-2010, 06:32 PM
i own a b5 s4 and b5 a4 and theres no comparing the two.. yes a4s can be built very fast for instance http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...-Power-Audi-A4
should be around 600 awhp
is it fast? hell yea..
will it walk a stg 3 ko4 s4 yea
is there 15k+ in the motor? YES
but just dosnt seem "do-able" for your average b5 a4 owner

when i could take 15k buy a stg 3 s4 and be 400awhp with daily driveability


Your link is broken. You would be surprised how many A4's have that much in their motor.

--dillon

S4tranquility
08-11-2010, 06:32 PM
That car had a tiny "big turbo" which was definitely not a "BAT" and was slow as dirt, and I am not even sure eactly what the CAPS crap is. I know it is like FATS in some way but that is about it.

Wow. I honestly don't even know how to respond to your ignorance. Use the search tool and learn something.

1NaudiA4
08-11-2010, 06:32 PM
high rpm at 20mph should be perfect 4 u :)

and i can safely rev to 7200 u dont have that much on me

Wow!, you can safely rev to 7200 you must feel soooo special. Come to Chicago and we'll see how bad my brake boost is [;)]

nunya
08-11-2010, 06:35 PM
Wow. I honestly don't even know how to respond to your ignorance. Use the search tool and learn something.

caps isnt used anymore, the site isnt even up.

http://modifieda4.com

--dillon

Sin is sick
08-11-2010, 06:37 PM
my car has k04-28 and k04-29 with some billet goodness

LB S4 LB
08-11-2010, 06:38 PM
Your link is broken. You would be surprised how many A4's have that much in their motor.

--dillon
http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php/368053-Big-Power-Audi-A4 *fixed

1NaudiA4
08-11-2010, 06:41 PM
I think you're underselling it. The showdown was between a 2.0L BUILT motor BAT A4 running 30 PSI IIRC vs Plain Jane K04 S4 running tweaked AWE (not custom tuning) without meth or any unusual mods. Bassed produced logs and held the CAPS record. Maybe that doesn't mean everything, but it was clearly running well based on logs.

Bassed car did so well in CAPS times because his turbo was the perfect size for the section of the powerband CAPS measures (3800-6500). Some BAT cars don't even spool until 4500rpm so the times become way off.

A4Rob
08-11-2010, 06:52 PM
i will gladly race any streetable a4 that wants to come to iowa city, don't care what you have done to the car 1.8 or 2.0 doesn't matter big turbo or small turbo... ill put money on my s4 winning that race... and ill video it and make a video just like the very first video link in this thread lol!!

Careful what you say... Mpls is not too far away.

derek072887
08-11-2010, 06:53 PM
Wow!, you can safely rev to 7200 you must feel soooo special. Come to Chicago and we'll see how bad my brake boost is [;)]

didnt say i was special i was just saying that you (as in a4 guys) reving to 8000 isn't that much more than s4 guys reving to 7200 oooo 800 rpm...

derek072887
08-11-2010, 06:54 PM
120, that's it? I don't let off until the other guy does, they always let off first [:/] And out of curiousity what tuning do you have I don't see it in the sig? And of course fats are popular in your neck of the woods (S4 world), what does yours do?

the funny thing is i have never logged my car so no idea what FATS times it runs... and i am on untouched apr stg 3 software running on the 100octane tune with w/m with 91 octane in the tank :)

derek072887
08-11-2010, 06:55 PM
Careful what you say... Mpls is not too far away.

make the trip ill be glad to run you! the more video the easier it will be to shut you BAT a4 guys up.....

A4Rob
08-11-2010, 06:57 PM
make the trip ill be glad to run you! the more video the easier it will be to shut you BAT a4 guys up.....

hahaha... i am sure us bt A4 guys will be amazed at the power of an S4. (pssst, I had a Stage 3 S4 a few months ago)

derek072887
08-11-2010, 06:58 PM
hahaha... i am sure us bt A4 guys will be amazed at the power of an S4. (pssst, I had a Stage 3 S4 a few months ago)

you don't have to be amazed you just need to be reminded of what has already been proven to you :)

A4 TSCHUSS
08-11-2010, 06:59 PM
Wow. I honestly don't even know how to respond to your ignorance. Use the search tool and learn something.

Ahh, you are one of "those guys" aren't you. Makes perfect sense now, what a joke. CAPS is a B5 A4 thing, I have a B6 smart guy. I know it is a timed period from X to Y just don't know the specifics. And I could care less about the CAPS, FATS bull shit. Because you are fast from 32.9mph-76.4 who gives a fuck. That don't mean shit. And if you can't comprehend the sarcasm, the previous sentence had sarcasm in it [;)]

Now bring that stage 3 of yours down here so I can send you packing with your tail between your legs! I have nothing against S4s, in fact I like them alot but some of you are so damn clueless about other cars. For example, the guy JK35 that posted in the S4 chatterbox thread, he would rape every last one of you and the RS6 S4s included. Some cars are built correctly while others aren't. You know, just like there are so many "stage 3" S4s that are far less than impressive but everyone thinks since Jack Meoff ran 11.7@124 on race gas that all stage 3 S4s run 11.7@124 when the truth is that is FAR from the truth. Just like the two stage 3s I went to the track with once and both trapped a highest of 114 and both ran a best of 12.4, one was apr and on 100 octane, one was awe on 93. Then I drove another APR stage 3 that was stupid slow, and later on I drive another AWE stage 3 that I could smoke as well with the owner agreeing 100%. That is 4 different S4s right there that were stage 3 that just myself have had experience with that were far from impressive so trust me there are tons out there. Sure you can absolutely make one fast as hell but there are so many more out there running around that aren't "that fast."

A4Rob
08-11-2010, 07:00 PM
^^Well said

A4 TSCHUSS
08-11-2010, 07:01 PM
didnt say i was special i was just saying that you (as in a4 guys) reving to 8000 isn't that much more than s4 guys reving to 7200 oooo 800 rpm...

8000 is actually not that high, others rev to 8500, I just chose not to rev my engine that high and had the limiter set lower.

derek072887
08-11-2010, 07:01 PM
^^Well said
correct same applied to the a4... some can be made fast and others just aren't

derek072887
08-11-2010, 07:02 PM
8000 is actually not that high, others rev to 8500, I just chose not to rev my engine that high and had the limiter set lower.

so like i said you have 800 rpm big whoop....

A4 TSCHUSS
08-11-2010, 07:03 PM
the funny thing is i have never logged my car so no idea what FATS times it runs... and i am on untouched apr stg 3 software running on the 100octane tune with w/m with 91 octane in the tank :)

I hope you are joking about that with your confidence and all. Untouched APR software, o man. See my above post where I had 2 differnt APR cars impress me as much as my little sisters barbie jeep [:p]

derek072887
08-11-2010, 07:05 PM
damn i think im gonna have to visit my family in jacksonville just so i can shut you up!!
not all cars are created equal and one apr car is not necessarily the same as the next... i have meth on top of mine and phenolic spacers and a fmic which bring my iats to 95 degrees on a 90 degree day after mulitple pulls!!!!

A4 TSCHUSS
08-11-2010, 07:06 PM
OMG!!!! Please, PLEASE do. I will have the HD camera ready!

derek072887
08-11-2010, 07:07 PM
i have an HD camera mounted in my car at all times!! gd it why can't some of you bitches be closer to me!!

adr3naline fix
08-11-2010, 07:13 PM
I'll put up $10 for gas for tschuss and derek to go at it. $5 for each. Lets start a pool

TweetsS4Estate
08-11-2010, 07:15 PM
Not the greatest and the car had some issues that night but stage 3s aren't "that" almighty. There are actually quite a bit that arent super fast. They are not even close to all created equal. Brake boost and you can hang/beat one if your car is actually fast. Not even tuned completely right and could run more boost than the 26psi. This was the result, wish I didn't somehow miss 4th.

The second run I wish I would have hit it when you came into boost we never could get your lag timed right lol.

derek072887
08-11-2010, 07:15 PM
I'll put up $10 for gas for tschuss and derek to go at it. $5 for each. Lets start a pool

were gonna need alot of money for me as ill be driving from about 1400 miles away....

A4 TSCHUSS
08-11-2010, 07:19 PM
I'll put up $10 for gas for tschuss and derek to go at it. $5 for each. Lets start a pool

You can give him all $10 [:p]

A4 TSCHUSS
08-11-2010, 07:21 PM
The second run I wish I would have hit it when you came into boost we never could get your lag timed right lol.

Honestly I wish I would have left my 30r on the car instead of putting the damn 5857 on the night before. I had much better spool and the car rode out with it too on my daily 28-30psi. I just wanted my new turbo on and it ended up biting me in the ass! Get that wastegate fixed and come back down! I should have a new correct tune by the time you come haha. This time 93 and meth and 31psi not 26 [evilsmile]

Watson
08-11-2010, 07:31 PM
I love this thread, btw im still stock and you can all beat my car!

1NaudiA4
08-11-2010, 07:33 PM
i have an HD camera mounted in my car at all times!! gd it why can't some of you bitches be closer to me!!

Your going to need 1080p to see how far ahead I'll be from you.

Sin is sick
08-11-2010, 07:33 PM
David you can run both or tweets and I's S4's when we come to florida again.

A4 TSCHUSS
08-11-2010, 07:34 PM
haha [:p]

Edit: this was for the 1080p post above.

And um, how soon you coming? I should be ready by then, or should I say I better be! Hoping to have the tune very soon.

TweetsS4Estate
08-11-2010, 07:46 PM
Honestly I wish I would have left my 30r on the car instead of putting the damn 5857 on the night before. I had much better spool and the car rode out with it too on my daily 28-30psi. I just wanted my new turbo on and it ended up biting me in the ass! Get that wastegate fixed and come back down! I should have a new correct tune by the time you come haha. This time 93 and meth and 31psi not 26 [evilsmile]

yeah will do buddy it might be better race then when I get around to fixing my gates.. it might have to be next spring again... I agree with your opinion on FATS times david. I mean there are custom tuned cars that are running 3.3ish FATS and are only running high 12.80s in the quarter. The day I ran the 12.21 I was on E85 my car was only running a 3.25 FATS when it usually runs 3.0s.

flynnr
08-11-2010, 08:10 PM
well i only have off the shelf tuning for my bta4 so i have no say in this.... but just curious what is the best b5 1/4 mile time for both a4 and s4?

and even the fact that this topic comes up comparing an s4 to an a4 is kinda funny... your handicap of getting twicw the turbos and over a L of displacement says a lot for how far a4s have come in the last couple years

nunya
08-11-2010, 08:11 PM
damn i think im gonna have to visit my family in jacksonville just so i can shut you up!!
not all cars are created equal and one apr car is not necessarily the same as the next... i have meth on top of mine and phenolic spacers and a fmic which bring my iats to 95 degrees on a 90 degree day after mulitple pulls!!!!

People still run APR stuff? You are really bragging about phenolic spaces? This is comical.

--dillon

TighTT
08-11-2010, 08:19 PM
I think you're underselling it. The showdown was between a 2.0L BUILT motor BAT A4 running 30 PSI IIRC vs Plain Jane K04 S4 running tweaked AWE (not custom tuning) without meth or any unusual mods. Bassed produced logs and held the CAPS record. Maybe that doesn't mean everything, but it was clearly running well based on logs.

BAT?!?! Are you high???? Just because bassed called it a "BAT" doesnt mean sh!t. In the real world....his turbo is small potatoes. Also...holding the CAPS record means nothing.

S4tranquility
08-11-2010, 08:26 PM
Ahh, you are one of "those guys" aren't you. Makes perfect sense now, what a joke. CAPS is a B5 A4 thing, I have a B6 smart guy. I know it is a timed period from X to Y just don't know the specifics. And I could care less about the CAPS, FATS bull shit. Because you are fast from 32.9mph-76.4 who gives a fuck. That don't mean shit. And if you can't comprehend the sarcasm, the previous sentence had sarcasm in it [;)]

Now bring that stage 3 of yours down here so I can send you packing with your tail between your legs! I have nothing against S4s, in fact I like them alot but some of you are so damn clueless about other cars. For example, the guy JK35 that posted in the S4 chatterbox thread, he would rape every last one of you and the RS6 S4s included. Some cars are built correctly while others aren't. You know, just like there are so many "stage 3" S4s that are far less than impressive but everyone thinks since Jack Meoff ran 11.7@124 on race gas that all stage 3 S4s run 11.7@124 when the truth is that is FAR from the truth. Just like the two stage 3s I went to the track with once and both trapped a highest of 114 and both ran a best of 12.4, one was apr and on 100 octane, one was awe on 93. Then I drove another APR stage 3 that was stupid slow, and later on I drive another AWE stage 3 that I could smoke as well with the owner agreeing 100%. That is 4 different S4s right there that were stage 3 that just myself have had experience with that were far from impressive so trust me there are tons out there. Sure you can absolutely make one fast as hell but there are so many more out there running around that aren't "that fast."

Dude, I don't oven know what you are arguing about. I have seen lots of unhealthy/slowish 2.7T cars. Logged one today. I don't know how that matters. Yet in the same breath you make excuses for the A4 even when I tell you I saw the logs and it was indeed healthy for what it was.

You are calling my car out now? Why? My car is well documented. If you can run sub 11.8 and/or trap 122 MPH, then more power to you. Ever run it at the strip?

My point was you are arguing about stuff you know nothing about and there is really no point in entering into a discussion with you if you are talking out your arse and dismissing presented facts because you don't have the base knowledge to intelligently debate the subject.

bob12312357
08-11-2010, 08:39 PM
It's sad when I have 2 be the voice of reason, but for the love of christ we all bought our cars for diffrent reasons. Bench racing proves nothing, 2 cars with a million drivers theres 2 much room for error to say anything is factaul short when diffrent cars,built diffrently,tuned diffrently and raced by diffrent people are going to be used to settle an argument. I have my A4 to go to work regaurless of weather and I like the fact that I can get 33mpg highway and around 21 -22 city in a car that is decently quick with the turbo I strapped 2 it. Nothing mind blowing, slighty more exciting then a Camry. Whatever, it is the tool I choose to do the tasks I need. You guys take this way 2 far.

S4tranquility
08-11-2010, 08:44 PM
BAT?!?! Are you high???? Just because bassed called it a "BAT" doesnt mean sh!t. In the real world....his turbo is small potatoes. Also...holding the CAPS record means nothing.

Information on the turbo: http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php/197768-SPA-and-Bullseye-make-a-beautiful-combination

Evilevo
08-11-2010, 08:54 PM
I love AZ

Wish there were some 500+ hp A4s here to do some runs with.

1NaudiA4
08-11-2010, 08:55 PM
I love AZ

Wish there were some 500+ hp A4s here to do some runs with.

I think I would need a GT37r vr setup to keep up with a twin gt2871r S4.



Information on the turbo: http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php/197768-SPA-and-Bullseye-make-a-beautiful-combination

That thread just shows how poorly bassed turbo flowed. He was running a tiny .55a/r exhaust housing which means he didn't get shit out of that turbo.

Heres the compressor map for that turbo
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2143/1815332741_c6a5dd0d12_o.jpg

Evilevo
08-11-2010, 09:10 PM
I think I would need a GT37r vr setup to keep up with a twin gt2871r S4.




Come on now [;)] my car isnt that fast. I did 540awhp 480awtq at 22psi on pump 93. I'm only at 25psi right now. Waiting to do my a bigger Intake Manifold and 80mm TB and than the boost goes back up to 30psi on 93/meth.

bryzf1
08-11-2010, 09:12 PM
Come on now [;)] my car isnt that fast. I did 540awhp 480awtq at 22psi on pump 93. I'm only at 25psi right now. Waiting to do my a bigger Intake Manifold and 80mm TB and than the boost goes back up to 30psi on 93/meth.

Then it goes back on the dyno again I hope?!

Evilevo
08-11-2010, 09:14 PM
Then it goes back on the dyno again I hope?!

Ya, it will. Hopefully a lot cooler out when i go to dyno it.

I've had it at 29psi before. But it didn't seem much faster than at 25psi so i just turned it back down. Pretty sure stock intake manifold and stock TB are restricting the air flow at higher boost

chris164935
08-11-2010, 09:15 PM
To itterate on the above post, here is this: http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php/241360-So-first-time-behind-the-wheel-at-the-strip-turned-out-to-not-be-to-bad-should-be-in?highlight=

Also, this:
http://bassed.smugmug.com/photos/352505452_m7Ny8-X3-1.jpg
So, basically, car was not impressive and to brag about beating it (regardless of whether or not he was shit talking) is equally unimpressive...

Oh, and I'll race my A4; first one to 170mph wins?

zrowcool
08-11-2010, 09:24 PM
i can beat an s4 with my a4... lets see who could swap out our turbos the quickest!

flynnr
08-11-2010, 09:56 PM
Ya, it will. Hopefully a lot cooler out when i go to dyno it.

I've had it at 29psi before. But it didn't seem much faster than at 25psi so i just turned it back down. Pretty sure stock intake manifold and stock TB are restricting the air flow at higher boost

sounds like fun... what do your drag slips look like??!! must be mid 10's ?! post them up!

Evilevo
08-11-2010, 09:58 PM
sounds like fun... what do your drag slips look like??!! must be mid 10's ?! post them up!

I don't drag race my car.......

beemercer
08-11-2010, 10:43 PM
For sure, ha. But I say all us B5 guys unite to knock the B6/B7 S4 guys down a peg ;)

Hey now, we're not all that bad [:p]

TighTT
08-11-2010, 11:13 PM
Information on the turbo: http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php/197768-SPA-and-Bullseye-make-a-beautiful-combination

I'm well aware of what a small turbo it is/was.....thanks. TERRIBLE representative of what a BAT A4 is. Im not even sure it falls in the BT category.

A4Rob
08-11-2010, 11:59 PM
i have meth on top of mine and phenolic spacers and a fmic which bring my iats to 95 degrees on a 90 degree day after mulitple pulls!!!!

Plastic intake spacerz!?? Shit, now i don't want to race you! That APR tune is really something considering no one runs it anymore!


i have an HD camera mounted in my car at all times!! gd it why can't some of you bitches be closer to me!!

I am close to you. Come race me. I am more than ready. [rolleyes]

Peter1.8t
08-12-2010, 01:29 AM
I love this thread haha

LB S4 LB
08-12-2010, 02:06 AM
I love this thread haha

+1 x 10

J-b5
08-12-2010, 05:02 AM
Adam, by "we" do you mean you're giving me a tune? haha I know the Unitronic stuff is awesome, just need some time with Mike to fix my fueling. 500awhp shouldn't be a problem though. The car is just wild

Lol.. good luck with that.

jamestown478
08-12-2010, 05:06 AM
8000 is actually not that high, others rev to 8500, I just chose not to rev my engine that high and had the limiter set lower.

so you tellin me I can rev my tt out to 8500? lol

J-b5
08-12-2010, 05:07 AM
not what i would do on hydrolic lifters..

jamestown478
08-12-2010, 05:09 AM
Plastic intake spacerz!?? Shit, now i don't want to race you! That APR tune is really something considering no one runs it anymore!



I am close to you. Come race me. I am more than ready. [rolleyes]

Rob I wanna run you this spring :)

A4 TSCHUSS
08-12-2010, 05:41 AM
so you tellin me I can rev my tt out to 8500? lol
If your head is built yes. If it is stock, hell no.

nunya
08-12-2010, 06:19 AM
so you tellin me I can rev my tt out to 8500? lol

You tell us, is you head properly built for it?

--dillon

nunya
08-12-2010, 06:20 AM
so you tellin me I can rev my tt out to 8500? lol

You tell us, is you head properly built for it?

--dillon

TighTT
08-12-2010, 07:54 AM
so you tellin me I can rev my tt out to 8500? lol

If you build the head...sure......I do.

JumboBlack1.8
08-12-2010, 07:59 AM
Also revving to 8500 with a .82a/r GT30R here

Dan[FN]6262
08-12-2010, 08:17 AM
Well guess the S4 is different, but the B6 A4 can't.

wrong. i posted a video doing it. and i didnt use the ebrake. i brake boosted against all the V8s that i raced

EuroDriven
08-12-2010, 08:18 AM
http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:s15DVSqGOFnj1M:http://forums.corral.net/photopost/data/500/medium/E-Thug.jpg&t=1

You people...why is everyone taking everything so seriously. What do you gain by having the faster car, sure it's something to want but everyone is taking this to far. [rolleyes]

JumboBlack1.8
08-12-2010, 08:22 AM
[
You people...why is every taking everything so seriously. What do you gain by having the faster car, sure it's something to want but everyone is taking this to far. [rolleyes]

Its only a few people who are getting amp'd up about it......this is mostly friendly competition IMO. As long as no one brings too much of an ego to the table, theres really no harm in having a race to see where our platform stacks up. Even though the B5 S4 has progressed FAR beyond the Stg 3 package, it'd still be cool for us B5 A4 guys to take down what was once pretty iconic in the Audi tuning scene......But that's just me

A4Rob
08-12-2010, 08:31 AM
Rob I wanna run you this spring :)

That would be fun. I drive through Milwaukee a few times a year.

chris164935
08-12-2010, 08:55 AM
Just found this: http://titsup-racing.com/video/s4/aprstg3s4_vs_50trimsrt4.wmv
I thought the S4 was fast?

split71
08-12-2010, 08:57 AM
ive never even drove a stg3 s4 OR a BT a4. I am pretty sure daily driving a BT a4 would be alot more nicer. The torque spikes early on s4's is a bit uncomfortable for Daily driving.

I own a Stage II S4 and i've had a BT 1.8t in a previous car (Not spectacular but Scat rods, 50 trim, etc etc, made 300 whp).

In no way do i ever want that type of power band again. I was so sick of trying to get up to speed in traffic because the car makes no power before 3500 RPM. It did have a fun top end, but it's nothing like an S4. The S4 is just full of fun, torque and power. DDing my S4 is so much nicer than the BT 1.8t, i can be at 1500 rpms and get up to speed very easily or pass somebody without hesitation of lag for power from a big turbo..

chris164935
08-12-2010, 09:00 AM
I own a Stage II S4 and i've had a BT 1.8t in a previous car (Not spectacular but Scat rods, 50 trim, etc etc, made 300 whp).

In no way do i ever want that type of power band again. I was so sick of trying to get up to speed in traffic because the car makes no power before 3500 RPM. It did have a fun top end, but it's nothing like an S4. The S4 is just full of fun, torque and power. DDing my S4 is so much nicer than the BT 1.8t, i can be at 1500 rpms and get up to speed very easily or pass somebody without hesitation of lag for power from a big turbo..
Downshift much?

Mantis
08-12-2010, 09:06 AM
I'll chime in, I speak from experience when I say that from a 4k roll a BT 1.8t will keep up with a stage 3 S4 (A6 in my case), from a roll at 2k the Bt 1.8 has no chance over the first 50 yards. K series turbos spool very fast. Once I finish building my A4 I will run the A6 and see which one wins, but I suspect that by the time I finish the A4 the A6 will have substantially more power.

1NaudiA4
08-12-2010, 09:08 AM
Treffen is only about a week away.... I say some of you guys come out for a fun show and we could do a couple of friendly pulls on the highway to see how everyone stacks up.

http://midwesttreffen.com/

EuroDriven
08-12-2010, 11:09 AM
Its only a few people who are getting amp'd up about it......this is mostly friendly competition IMO. As long as no one brings too much of an ego to the table, theres really no harm in having a race to see where our platform stacks up. Even though the B5 S4 has progressed FAR beyond the Stg 3 package, it'd still be cool for us B5 A4 guys to take down what was once pretty iconic in the Audi tuning scene......But that's just me

I totally agree, just reading through page 4 it seems like people get too hostile in their posts. Competition makes the world go 'round. If no one wanted to be faster nothing new would ever be made.

Haenszel20v
08-12-2010, 11:20 AM
I can't take this thread seriously. Both sides make me pee.

Dan[FN]6262
08-12-2010, 11:23 AM
I can't take this thread seriously. Both sides make me pee.

http://lawblog.legalmatch.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/Pee-lawsuit-236x300.jpg

Mott Power
08-12-2010, 12:06 PM
Haha, Corey, I was quite surprised how well your car kept up, definitely faster than a lot of tuned STIs and Evos i come across.

For the record, I was driving the stage 3, i just put the car back together after a 2 months of down time so there are a few snags (vacuum leak somewhere) but a list of the mods is as follows:

PJK04s, 60# injectors, Bosch 044 pump, ebay fmic, RAI 3 inch catless DPs, 3 inch catback with borla muffler, jhm shortnshifter and solid linkage, autospeed stage 5 twin disc clutch and flywheel, open element filter (no heat shield at the moment, pretty low AITs), forge DVs, vast performance tune with MBC peaking 24 psi and tapering to 21 at redline. Devils own W\M kit but it's not working right now.

That's about it for engine mods, other than that, autospeed racing density engine and tranny mounts, apikol drivetrain stabilizer, stern racing diff mounts, custom oil cooler, hotchkis sway bars, KW V3 coil overs.

Corey, I'm going to try getting the leaks and meth working bybthe time I get back, so hopefully we can get the 10r against the s4. If I can get my r6 out of limp mode then you can hop on that as well and do a run, too.

AudiSportB5S4
08-12-2010, 01:00 PM
This thread is a whole lot of brag racing [race]

TweetsS4Estate
08-12-2010, 03:28 PM
Come on now [;)] my car isnt that fast. I did 540awhp 480awtq at 22psi on pump 93. I'm only at 25psi right now. Waiting to do my a bigger Intake Manifold and 80mm TB and than the boost goes back up to 30psi on 93/meth.

You'll need to change your intercooler as well, your pressure drop is too high, that core isn't meant for that kind of air flow.

TweetsS4Estate
08-12-2010, 03:30 PM
Treffen is only about a week away.... I say some of you guys come out for a fun show and we could do a couple of friendly pulls on the highway to see how everyone stacks up.

http://midwesttreffen.com/

I'm in Grand Rapids MI, only 2 hours away. I might be able to make it out there for import nights if your down for a few friendly pulls.

TweetsS4Estate
08-12-2010, 03:39 PM
Come on now [;)] my car isnt that fast. I did 540awhp 480awtq at 22psi on pump 93. I'm only at 25psi right now. Waiting to do my a bigger Intake Manifold and 80mm TB and than the boost goes back up to 30psi on 93/meth.

lol I didn't know I made more ft lbs than you did on similar boost. That E85 is a beast of a fuel!

adr3naline fix
08-12-2010, 04:58 PM
Haha, Corey, I was quite surprised how well your car kept up, definitely faster than a lot of tuned STIs and Evos i come across.

For the record, I was driving the stage 3, i just put the car back together after a 2 months of down time so there are a few snags (vacuum leak somewhere) but a list of the mods is as follows:

PJK04s, 60# injectors, Bosch 044 pump, ebay fmic, RAI 3 inch catless DPs, 3 inch catback with borla muffler, jhm shortnshifter and solid linkage, autospeed stage 5 twin disc clutch and flywheel, open element filter (no heat shield at the moment, pretty low AITs), forge DVs, vast performance tune with MBC peaking 24 psi and tapering to 21 at redline. Devils own W\M kit but it's not working right now.

That's about it for engine mods, other than that, autospeed racing density engine and tranny mounts, apikol drivetrain stabilizer, stern racing diff mounts, custom oil cooler, hotchkis sway bars, KW V3 coil overs.

Corey, I'm going to try getting the leaks and meth working bybthe time I get back, so hopefully we can get the 10r against the s4. If I can get my r6 out of limp mode then you can hop on that as well and do a run, too.


Thanks for posting Adam, next time I'm going to put a plastic bag over your intake in the parking lot :)

the 10R vs your Stg 3 is going to be another 6 page thread....if not longer

TweetsS4Estate
08-12-2010, 05:21 PM
yeah I don't think he'll get the 10r, I know the 6r should be toast but not a 1000..

Sales@RAI
08-12-2010, 05:25 PM
It's those damn RAI Downpipes, theyre just too fast

Evilevo
08-12-2010, 05:49 PM
lol I didn't know I made more ft lbs than you did on similar boost. That E85 is a beast of a fuel!

Ya man. It is the lag. I don't make enough boost down low to make big TQ.


You'll need to change your intercooler as well, your pressure drop is too high, that core isn't meant for that kind of air flow.

I don't think it would be that hard for me to get a good Garrett core and have the end tanks from my ebay core welded onto it. That shouldn't be all that expensive, I don't think

sean1.8t
08-12-2010, 06:00 PM
You'll need to change your intercooler as well, your pressure drop is too high, that core isn't meant for that kind of air flow.

So it's too big since it has a high pressure drop. But, you say it's not meant for that kind of flow, so its too small? Which is it? Lol

TweetsS4Estate
08-12-2010, 07:06 PM
So it's too big since it has a high pressure drop. But, you say it's not meant for that kind of flow, so its too small? Which is it? Lol

pressure drop means that the intercooler cannot flow enough air past its core... I don't understand the question.

meaning pressure is higher on the turbo side of the intercooler and the pressure is lower on the intake side of the IC thus pressure dropping as it goes through the IC thus the word pressure drop.

TweetsS4Estate
08-12-2010, 07:08 PM
Ya man. It is the lag. I don't make enough boost down low to make big TQ.
I don't think it would be that hard for me to get a good Garrett core and have the end tanks from my ebay core welded onto it. That shouldn't be all that expensive, I don't think
Hopefully not, I just know thats a big issue for your car.. or one of the big issues

nkbks4
08-12-2010, 07:12 PM
2.0 + pte5857 or gt3076 + a good tune should be able to keep up with a stg3 s4.

...right?

keep dreaming

JumboBlack1.8
08-12-2010, 07:15 PM
keep dreaming

Great contribution

Evilevo
08-12-2010, 07:23 PM
Hopefully not, I just know thats a big issue for your car.. or one of the big issues

Reid, hit me up on Google Talk

chris164935
08-12-2010, 07:33 PM
pressure drop means that the intercooler cannot flow enough air past its core... I don't understand the question.

meaning pressure is higher on the turbo side of the intercooler and the pressure is lower on the intake side of the IC thus pressure dropping as it goes through the IC thus the word pressure drop.
Pretty sure that would cause compressor surge... Might want to invest in fixing that asap.

1NaudiA4
08-12-2010, 07:42 PM
Every intercooler is going to have pressure drop, some are just not going to flow as well as others. Of course there are other things you can do to combat the pressure drop like a larger throttle body, larger (to a point) post intercooler piping, and better flowing intake manifold will all lower pressure drop.

csre9
08-12-2010, 08:47 PM
Holy batman

Mott Power
08-13-2010, 02:07 AM
It's those damn RAI Downpipes, theyre just too fast

lol, I absolutely love them! Thank you RAI!

veggiemonster
08-13-2010, 06:13 AM
well how about this... you S4 guys bring up the EvilEmpire vs Bassed video everytime a topic like this is brought up.

EvilEmpire was one of the first to get on the custom tune bandwagon YEARS ago. he had/has one of the top 3 fastest full weight k04 S4's out. Bassed had a small turbo on a base tune.

what kind of comparison is that?

i'm sorry. you know nothing. its OTS AWE fueling thats tweaked. lol. and its def not even close to the fastest, or probably even in the top 10.

and did you notice how many s4 guys walked right in hear to say they are willing for friendly runs? i don't see many a4 guys throwing the same offer. so i think that video proves just about everything. ;)

JumboBlack1.8
08-13-2010, 06:22 AM
and did you notice how many s4 guys walked right in hear to say they are willing for friendly runs? i don't see many a4 guys throwing the same offer. so i think that video proves just about everything. ;)

Hahaha....only cuz there are a LOT more stg 3 S4's than built 2.0 BAT A4's.....most of the BT guys here just have bolt-ons. I"m sure most of the built BAT guys would be up for some friendly competition....I personally don't care if I lose. Again, it's just be cool to see how my sled stacks up

veggiemonster
08-13-2010, 06:53 AM
Hahaha....only cuz there are a LOT more stg 3 S4's than built 2.0 BAT A4's.....most of the BT guys here just have bolt-ons. I"m sure most of the built BAT guys would be up for some friendly competition....I personally don't care if I lose. Again, it's just be cool to see how my sled stacks up

obviously. i'm just playing devil's advocate. i would love to do some runs with one as well

Papa Stone
08-13-2010, 07:30 AM
Great contribution

jajaja is the only way to get our post count up.. Look at me, I just did [o_o]

veggiemonster
08-13-2010, 07:46 AM
So it's too big since it has a high pressure drop. But, you say it's not meant for that kind of flow, so its too small? Which is it? Lol

what????????? LMAO

boost is literally back pressure in the intake system because the motor is "overfed"....so pressure drop is because the flow isn't there which has nothing to do with size btw, its the velocity of the airflow within the core...hence why one side has more pressure than the other...too big would cause spool issues (more vacuum/and area to "fill") too small would have heat issues.

TighTT
08-13-2010, 07:51 AM
i'm sorry. you know nothing. its OTS AWE fueling thats tweaked. lol. and its def not even close to the fastest, or probably even in the top 10.

and did you notice how many s4 guys walked right in hear to say they are willing for friendly runs? i don't see many a4 guys throwing the same offer. so i think that video proves just about everything. ;)

For a LONG time Evils car was considered one of the fastest S4's in my area (tristate). He smoked NUMEROUS other stage III and III+ S4's. Putting a car like that up against a 300whp A4 is just plain silly.

And to comment on your "did you notice how many s4 guys walked right in hear to say they are willing for friendly runs". I was approached by a gentleman via PM asking to run me @ H20....seems harmless enough right? Oh wait...he'll be TRAILERING his car to H20 because he runs E85. Yea.....great comparison. Me running 93 vs him running what is basically race juice. Its enough of an uphill battle for a little 1.8t to make OTS stage III S4 power let alone one running race fuel. Give me an OTS stage III on 93 octane and I'll run. Otherewise expect me to be running c16 AND spraying.

csre9
08-13-2010, 08:38 AM
Im in the dc area, im down to do a couple friendly runs

Evilevo
08-13-2010, 09:28 AM
For a LONG time Evils car was considered one of the fastest S4's in my area (tristate). He smoked NUMEROUS other stage III and III+ S4's. Putting a car like that up against a 300whp A4 is just plain silly.

And to comment on your "did you notice how many s4 guys walked right in hear to say they are willing for friendly runs". I was approached by a gentleman via PM asking to run me @ H20....seems harmless enough right? Oh wait...he'll be TRAILERING his car to H20 because he runs E85. Yea.....great comparison. Me running 93 vs him running what is basically race juice. Its enough of an uphill battle for a little 1.8t to make OTS stage III S4 power let alone one running race fuel. Give me an OTS stage III on 93 octane and I'll run. Otherewise expect me to be running c16 AND spraying.


Do it! I'll be on 93/meth at H2Oi. I'll run you with you on C16 and Spray. That'll be fun! [>_<]

TighTT
08-13-2010, 09:42 AM
Do it! I'll be on 93/meth at H2Oi. I'll run you with you on C16 and Spray. That'll be fun! [>_<]

First off..a GT car Vs. A4 is not what we're discussing here. OTS stage III vs. BAT A4. There is only so much power a 1.8T can pump out while still being drivable.

Evilevo
08-13-2010, 09:45 AM
First off..a GT car Vs. A4 is not what we're discussing here. OTS stage III vs. BAT A4. There is only so much power a 1.8T can pump out while still being drivable.

Haha. I know. But it would still be fun ;)

Plus, I'm not making that much power right now. Still under 600AWHP. IDK about H20i though [evilsmile]

TweetsS4Estate
08-13-2010, 10:43 AM
Pretty sure that would cause compressor surge... Might want to invest in fixing that asap.

No, compressor surge happens when you rapidly decrease the load on the turbo and the air in the system has a problem escaping. And with the throttle body now closed because the throttle has been backed off the air has no where to go but back through the turbine , thus throwing the turbine in an opposite direction of the flow of the exhaust. Which is a huge issue with large turbo'd diesel engines (they have no wastegates). pressure drop has to do with the amount of pressure or PSI drop over the IC core.

veggiemonster
08-13-2010, 11:27 AM
For a LONG time Evils car was considered one of the fastest S4's in my area (tristate). He smoked NUMEROUS other stage III and III+ S4's. Putting a car like that up against a 300whp A4 is just plain silly.

And to comment on your "did you notice how many s4 guys walked right in hear to say they are willing for friendly runs". I was approached by a gentleman via PM asking to run me @ H20....seems harmless enough right? Oh wait...he'll be TRAILERING his car to H20 because he runs E85. Yea.....great comparison. Me running 93 vs him running what is basically race juice. Its enough of an uphill battle for a little 1.8t to make OTS stage III S4 power let alone one running race fuel. Give me an OTS stage III on 93 octane and I'll run. Otherewise expect me to be running c16 AND spraying.

that is not his problem.

here's the deal that the s4 guys get and you guys seem to not get. you did say that you built your car for yourself, so i'm not saying this just to you, but to everyone. in racing, (not F1, we don't do that. i'm talking the dragstrip, track, on the street) you run what you brought. if you get walked, its your own fault. i don't see why him being on e85=race gas anyways. its mid level at best, and not all cars even run good with it.
not to mention, no s4 is equal. just cus its on e85 doesn't mean it will be either faster or slower than tweets car, which is on e85 in the video posted. my s4 was running about 3.0's on 93, with no meth. thats not even that good for 93 only.

i'd love for you to find an OTS stg 3. but the fact is, the new OTS is an EPL/VAST custom tune. so good luck. what you will find with an actual un-lemmi'd (again good luck) apr or giac file then it will be a really old file, dating back to this same time frame of evil vs bassed...so i don't know how that would even be a fair comparison to show the gains we've all had te past few years.

and isn't that the point of the thread? to see how we all stack up now? if you can't keep up, you can't, and be a man and admit it.

and stop with the little 1.8 stuff. the 2.7 isn't a very good example of a power making motor, and again, you guys bought them??? i don't get the whole idea behind a4 owners getting butthurt by facts...

ZimbutheMonkey
08-13-2010, 11:31 AM
I'll chime in, I speak from experience when I say that from a 4k roll a BT 1.8t will keep up with a stage 3 S4 (A6 in my case), from a roll at 2k the Bt 1.8 has no chance over the first 50 yards. K series turbos spool very fast. Once I finish building my A4 I will run the A6 and see which one wins, but I suspect that by the time I finish the A4 the A6 will have substantially more power.

As the guy who was keeping up with Ryan's stage 3 car, I'd still have to hand this one over to the S4/A6 guys. You just can't beat the extra 900 CC of displacement and the second turbo. Sure, you can probably build a 3076 or bigger that will hang with a K04'd S4 on the highway, but guess what, they can strap on a set of GT turbos too. Fact is you're fighting a loosing battle with the 4 cylinder.

Add to the fact that a ratty C5 corvette with a supercharger and it's low 3000 lbs curb weight could probably spank both an S4 and A4. This really illustrates the fact that these horsepower wars are really kind of pointless. It's the same thing I learned after training as a Wing Chun (kung-fu) student for a number of years. There's always someone faster and stronger out there, and even if you're the best one day, the next you could catch a flu and be outmatched. In the end, it's really about being happy with the state of your training and development. If you can only be satisfied by comparing yourself to others, then you always seem to come up short somewhere.

PS: I also have to give Ryan's car a lot of credit. He was keeping up with me despite running 10:1 A/F ratios and a 600-800 lb weight penalty. Trust me, that thing is wicked fast when it's dialed in right. I was in it when it raped a viper despite having 220 lbs of me, AWD power losses and a baby seat in the back, it's schnell.

TweetsS4Estate
08-13-2010, 11:39 AM
My car was on pump gas in the video.. Jacksonville doesn't have a E85 station within 200 miles.. yes and I always said my car was not the fastest stage III ever, its healthy and runs good enough for now. Here's the deal I have turbos that wont boost past 22psi, when hybrids should be good for 25-26psi no problem.. I've been fighting bad wastegates ever since I installed them, it is what it is. I don't need to invest in pulling the engine just to replace the wastegates. I'll wait until when I can build an engine for it, refresh the turbo's and fix the wastegates.

that is not his problem.

here's the deal that the s4 guys get and you guys seem to not get. you did say that you built your car for yourself, so i'm not saying this just to you, but to everyone. in racing, (not F1, we don't do that. i'm talking the dragstrip, track, on the street) you run what you brought. if you get walked, its your own fault. i don't see why him being on e85=race gas anyways. its mid level at best, and not all cars even run good with it.
not to mention, no s4 is equal. just cus its on e85 doesn't mean it will be either faster or slower than tweets car, which is on e85 in the video posted. my s4 was running about 3.0's on 93, with no meth. thats not even that good for 93 only.

i'd love for you to find an OTS stg 3. but the fact is, the new OTS is an EPL/VAST custom tune. so good luck. what you will find with an actual un-lemmi'd (again good luck) apr or giac file then it will be a really old file, dating back to this same time frame of evil vs bassed...so i don't know how that would even be a fair comparison to show the gains we've all had te past few years.

and isn't that the point of the thread? to see how we all stack up now? if you can't keep up, you can't, and be a man and admit it.

and stop with the little 1.8 stuff. the 2.7 isn't a very good example of a power making motor, and again, you guys bought them??? i don't get the whole idea behind a4 owners getting butthurt by facts...

sean1.8t
08-13-2010, 11:42 AM
i'm sorry. you know nothing. its OTS AWE fueling thats tweaked. lol. and its def not even close to the fastest, or probably even in the top 10.

and did you notice how many s4 guys walked right in hear to say they are willing for friendly runs? i don't see many a4 guys throwing the same offer. so i think that video proves just about everything. ;)

sorry, you weren't around for the older days. Evil's wagon was top. he was running even with Mac's silver S4(that ran 11.4 @ like ~125) way back when only a handfull of guys were in the 11's. and yes, it was tweaked, but he knew his shit. i remember a vid of his tweaked AWE car running against bonedoc's OTS awe car. he put like 10+ car lengths on it. trust me, i know this shit.

and i noticed ever single A4 guy here that has a BAT offer to race. pretty sure there was about 6-7 of them.

chris164935
08-13-2010, 11:45 AM
No, compressor surge happens when you rapidly decrease the load on the turbo and the air in the system has a problem escaping. And with the throttle body now closed because the throttle has been backed off the air has no where to go but back through the turbine , thus throwing the turbine in an opposite direction of the flow of the exhaust. Which is a huge issue with large turbo'd diesel engines (they have no wastegates). pressure drop has to do with the amount of pressure or PSI drop over the IC core.
So, an intercooler can be a bottle neck that causes less psi on the outlet side? Then, where does all the boost bottlenecked at the intercooler go? Sounds like a type of compressor surge to me.
Also, are you sure you know what your talking about? Because what you just said makes hardly any sense. Most compressor surge is defined as boost pressure built up in the charge piping that has no where to go when the throttle plate is closed, thus, it goes back toward the compressor and the pushing air would cause the compressor wheel to spin in reverse suddenly, with the turbine wheel also following suit because it's connected to the compressor wheel. Obviously, blow-off valves and diverter valve alleviate this pressure so it does not go back to the compressor... Exhaust gases have no part in this...
Wastegates divert exhaust gases away from the turbine to keep the turbine spinning at a certain RPM to maintain a set boost level. Only problem diesel engines have with not running a wastegate is their turbos spool to the moon, but that is part of the design, not a flaw.

sean1.8t
08-13-2010, 11:48 AM
that is not his problem.

here's the deal that the s4 guys get and you guys seem to not get. you did say that you built your car for yourself, so i'm not saying this just to you, but to everyone. in racing, (not F1, we don't do that. i'm talking the dragstrip, track, on the street) you run what you brought. if you get walked, its your own fault. i don't see why him being on e85=race gas anyways. its mid level at best, and not all cars even run good with it.
not to mention, no s4 is equal. just cus its on e85 doesn't mean it will be either faster or slower than tweets car, which is on e85 in the video posted. my s4 was running about 3.0's on 93, with no meth. thats not even that good for 93 only.



everyone understands that. "run what you brung" not a big deal.

but what YOU don't seem to get is, were talking OTS stg 3 on pump gas/meth vs BAT on pump gas/meth. even fueling. it's not, who's car is faster cause they're running a 100 shot of nitrous. BAT vs k04's. nothing else

veggiemonster
08-13-2010, 11:59 AM
everyone understands that. "run what you brung" not a big deal.

but what YOU don't seem to get is, were talking OTS stg 3 on pump gas/meth vs BAT on pump gas/meth. even fueling. it's not, who's car is faster cause they're running a 100 shot of nitrous. BAT vs k04's. nothing else

okay. but you're still avoiding te fact that apr/giac isn't the OTS for us anymore. the OTS files now are the base files we get from vast/epl/asp/etc etc. that means near 400, on pump, with no corrections. thats the new "OTS"

TweetsS4Estate
08-13-2010, 12:09 PM
It may sound like surge to you, but its not. Yes I'm sure of what I am talking about, especially here. I have been learning everything I can about intercoolers, and pressure drop issues for my new setup. The air leaks through but it is slowed down. Ask any prominent tuner, they put pressure gauges before and after the intercooler all of the time just to see what the pressure drop is across the core. Yes the intercooler is a bottle neck, but on the S4 so are things like: the throttle body and the intake manifold and the heads. as far as the diesels go I was stating some differences between our cars and a diesel engine, earlier ones didn't have the diverter or blow off systems that we have which is why they had more issues with surging. Surging usually only happens when there is a quick change of on load to off load. Thank you for defining what I already said. the turbine I was speaking about both sides of the turbo because I assumed we were all educated on what a turbo was I didn't need to explain that there is this thing called a compressor wheel and a turbine wheel which is powered by exhaust gasses.. Yes it does somewhat have to do with exhaust gasses, because thats why the wheel surges forwards and backwards because the charge pressure is forcing the turbine against the exhaust flow while the exhaust gasses fight to throw it back in motion. Thats how turbo shafts are broken. So, sir I do understand what I am talking about. But I can see from this conversation you will never believe what I say, so do some researching of your own and figure it out.

So, an intercooler can be a bottle neck that causes less psi on the outlet side? Then, where does all the boost bottlenecked at the intercooler go? Sounds like a type of compressor surge to me. also, are you sure you know what your talking about? Because what you just said makes hardly any sense. Most compressor surge is defined as boost pressure built up in the charge piping that has no where to go when the throttle plate is closed, thus, it goes back toward the compressor and the pushing air would cause the compressor wheel to spin in reverse suddenly, with the turbine wheel also following suit because it's connected to the compressor wheel. Obviously, blow-off valves and diverter valve alleviate this pressure so it does not go back to the compressor... Exhaust gases have no part in this...
Wastegates divert exhaust gases away from the turbine to keep the turbine spinning at a certain RPM to maintain a set boost level. Only problem diesel engines have with not running a wastegate is their turbos spool to the moon, but that is part of the design, not a flaw.

chris164935
08-13-2010, 12:36 PM
How do we know everybody who reads this thread knows what you are talking about? Maybe everyone posting here does.
But, you can't honestly tell me that if you knew hardly anything about turbos, and you read this:

And with the throttle body now closed because the throttle has been backed off the air has no where to go but back through the turbine , thus throwing the turbine in an opposite direction of the flow of the exhaust.
You would know what it meant and fully understood the concept.
Misinformation and assumptions are why people keep asking the same questions everyday...

Also, so I understand you better, the air flow slows down at bottlenecks, but doesn't actually return to the compressor housing at all, even if the turbo is still building boost? Is that what you are saying?

sean1.8t
08-13-2010, 12:38 PM
okay. but you're still avoiding te fact that apr/giac isn't the OTS for us anymore. the OTS files now are the base files we get from vast/epl/asp/etc etc. that means near 400, on pump, with no corrections. thats the new "OTS"

that's the whole fucking point! arrrg!

advancements in the platforms. there have been many with the 2.7t and the 1.8t. but which one has evolved more......

sean1.8t
08-13-2010, 12:41 PM
I have been learning everything I can about intercoolers, and pressure drop issues for my new setup. .

with all due respect, Tweets. this is where you and Chris differ. you have been reading about this stuff. Chris has delt with it first hand many different times. listen to what he has to say and you might learn more [up]

TweetsS4Estate
08-13-2010, 12:51 PM
First of all I apologize if i sounded irritated and arrogant. With that said lets look at a turbo car in the big picture. We all talk about boost with out really understanding what it is. Boost is back-pressure in our cars intake system. The back pressure that we usually reference is metered after the intercooler and before the throttle body. So to anwser one question you have, the compressor side of the turbo is always seeing pressure when it is under load. An example of pressure drop that might help is this, my silver S4 it has to make 23.5 psi of boost before the intercooler to actually see 22 at the Map sensor. I hope this helps.

How do we know everybody who reads this thread knows what you are talking about? Maybe everyone posting here does
But, you can't honestly tell me that if you knew hardly anything about turbos, and you read this:

You would know what it meant and fully understood the concept.
Misinformation and assumptions are why people keep asking the same questions everyday...

Also, so I understand you better, the air flow slows down at bottlenecks, but doesn't actually return to the compressor housing at all, even if the turbo is still building boost? Is that what you are saying?

salts
08-13-2010, 12:55 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ctpzx1WD3so&feature=youtube_gdata

I know this was way back... like one of the first posts, but all i want to know is who is driving the s4 and why are they brake boosting using the e-brake? You know that you can hold more power back with 4 brakes instead of 2?
P.S. Sorry for thread jacking....im just really curious

sean1.8t
08-13-2010, 01:02 PM
I know this was way back... like one of the first posts, but all i want to know is who is driving the s4 and why are they brake boosting using the e-brake? You know that you can hold more power back with 4 brakes instead of 2?
P.S. Sorry for thread jacking....im just really curious

yes, it was way back. and it was discussed way back also.

the answer: DBW. DBW on me7 car's closes the TB when brake pressure is applied. therefore the only way for me7 guys to brake boost is using the E-brake

TweetsS4Estate
08-13-2010, 01:04 PM
with all due respect, Tweets. this is where you and Chris differ. you have been reading about this stuff. Chris has delt with it first hand many different times. listen to what he has to say and you might learn more [up]

haha this isn't just reading, this is me taking over a year talking to people. This is me trying new setups, trying to figure out how to make the most amount of power. I know this is a petty argument but I'm serious when I say if there is one thing that I've figured out its what pressure drop is... lol

ZimbutheMonkey
08-13-2010, 01:04 PM
I think we need to distinguish between two types of surge here. The first type (mentioned here) occurs when you close the throttle plate on a moving column of air with nowhere to go. That's the most common type. It manifests as a rhythmic ch-ch-ch sound which ricers seem to love for some odd reason. At that point, a far as I know the compressor isn't actually stalling. However it's being forced to 'cut up' the intake air. While it's hard on a turbo it probably won't break a shaft. Although it is hard on the bearings.

The second type of surge happens when you have the turbo pushing more air into the engine than the engine can move. This usually happens at low RPM high load conditions with a turbo that's too big for the engine, or a turbo with a mismatched turbine/compressor. Just think massive compressor with a tiny turbine housing (like a 2876). This is when the compressor can stall and blow your turbo and engine. I've had it happen once (although nothing was damaged) with an old K04 hybrid I was running. It felt like my car just hit a brick wall and the engine tried to eat itself. This type of suge should be avoided at all costs because the damage can be severe and virtually instant.

Hope this helps, and if I'm wrong please feel free to add to this.

TweetsS4Estate
08-13-2010, 01:06 PM
I know this was way back... like one of the first posts, but all i want to know is who is driving the s4 and why are they brake boosting using the e-brake? You know that you can hold more power back with 4 brakes instead of 2?
P.S. Sorry for thread jacking....im just really curious

I wasn't brake boosting it was the A4. S4s can only brake boost with the e brake because the ecu has a brake boost protection where it unloads the car and closes the throttle when you try to brake boost. You should try it on your car and see what happens..

TweetsS4Estate
08-13-2010, 01:14 PM
The former can break a shaft, because I have done it in my brothers diesel truck. the second version rarely happens, at that point in time you are overboosting, think backpressure. All I've been trying to say is that you have to have an extreme case of pressure drop to see a surge. Just because there is a pressure drop that hurts your performance doesn't mean it will surge.. maybe that's what I've been not saying clearely

I think we need to distinguish between two types of surge here. The first type (mentioned here) occurs when you close the throttle plate on a moving column of air with nowhere to go. That's the most common type. It manifests as a rhythmic ch-ch-ch sound which ricers seem to love for some odd reason. At that point, a far as I know the compressor isn't actually stalling. However it's being forced to 'cut up' the intake air. While it's hard on a turbo it probably won't break a shaft. Although it is hard on the bearings.

The second type of surge happens when you have the turbo pushing more air into the engine than the engine can move. Just think massive compressor with a tiny turbine housing (like a 2876). This is when the compressor can stall and blow your turbo and engine. I've had it happen once (although nothing was damaged) with an old K04 hybrid I was running. It felt like my car just hit a brick wall and the engine tried to eat itself. This type of suge should be avoided at all costs because the damage can be severe and virtually instant.

Hope this helps, and if I'm wrong please feel free to add to this.

salts
08-13-2010, 01:26 PM
yes, it was way back. and it was discussed way back also.

the answer: DBW. DBW on me7 car's closes the TB when brake pressure is applied. therefore the only way for me7 guys to brake boost is using the E-brake

I was waiting for someone to say that. I have brake boosted every S4 i have ever driven. You can brake boost an S4 you just have to know the order of operations and you have to be careful how you control the pedals. I'm going to put a video up of foot control and how to brake boost an s4. Didn't mean to pick you out of a crowd sean1.8T, i don't know you, no hard feelings, but there are way too many S4 drivers that think you cant brake boost. It makes the car so much quicker out of a roll...especially big turbo guys. Not saying that im all about rolling... but when your on the highway and someone rolls up to you... what else are you supposed to do :)

sean1.8t
08-13-2010, 01:31 PM
I was waiting for someone to say that. I have brake boosted every S4 i have ever driven. You can brake boost an S4 you just have to know the order of operations and you have to be careful how you control the pedals. I'm going to put a video up of foot control and how to brake boost an s4. Didn't mean to pick you out of a crowd sean1.8T, i don't know you, no hard feelings, but there are way too many S4 drivers that think you cant brake boost. It makes the car so much quicker out of a roll...especially big turbo guys. Not saying that im all about rolling... but when your on the highway and someone rolls up to you... what else are you supposed to do :)

im not talking S4. the A4 was brake boosting, not the S4. i have no idea how the S4's ECU reacts to brake boosting as i have never tried it on an S4

salts
08-13-2010, 01:33 PM
OK, this was a run a long time back of my car (2002 Audi S4 ME7 factory software) against one of my buddies. A fully gutted 2500lb talon with about 400 wheel. This was a fun run and yes i got eaten on the first race. But you can hear me brake boost very hard in both runs. To the point in the second run that the compressor was surging at 30psi. So here it is. Brake boosting is possible in an s4 with me7. Ill put up a foot control video at the end of the month.

Ok im done. Enjoy

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X7XFkvy4emE

salts
08-13-2010, 01:37 PM
OK, sorry sean its the same for the S4's. This was a couple posts up.
"S4s can only brake boost with the e brake because the ecu has a brake boost protection where it unloads the car and closes the throttle when you try to brake boost. You should try it on your car and see what happens.. "

terraflata
08-13-2010, 02:12 PM
the answer: DBW. DBW on me7 car's closes the TB when brake pressure is applied. therefore the only way for me7 guys to brake boost is using the E-brake

Which is why some people prefer DBC but don`t like the lack of tuning capabilities.......unless of course you feel like spending money in other departments.

sean1.8t
08-13-2010, 02:31 PM
Which is why some people prefer DBC but don`t like the lack of tuning capabilities.......unless of course you feel like spending money in other departments.

no one has prefer'd DBC since like 2006. you can't make power on it. not unless you go full SEM. and i doubt that people are giving up DBW just so they can brake boost lol