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MOtown A4
07-25-2010, 01:11 PM
Myself and a buddy of mine (Belle Tire employee for years/ASE certified/ suspension and alignment expert) were having a discussion last night about camber issues with lowered vehicles and since I just ordered some Koni coilovers and wheels & tires I figured it would be a good time to get a clear idea on how to approach this. First and foremost, I know this has been covered a little bit, but, most of the threads searched were from YEARS ago and new products and solutions have emerged since then. So to start this out, in my own personal taste I DO NOT want to slam my car. I would ideally like to have a 1-2 finger gap all the way around my car and with a modest drop I don't anticiate having a gigantic problem with camber but I would like to correct it to increase the longevity of my tires. I have looked at the k-mac bushings but I dont exactly know how they work. Other options would be adjustable upper control arms (stern, 034). although the k-mac bushings are almost half the price are they the better choice? I would preferable like to hold -.5- -1.0 camber, the closer to -.5 the better. As far as possible camber issues go for the rear what should I exect to see after installation? Are there any upgraded parts that I can purchase to correct undesirable negative camber in the rear?

Kyle H
07-25-2010, 01:32 PM
034 makes adjustable rear upper control arms.


I'm not very low on Stasis coilovers and have around -1.5 deg camber. I don't see any added tire wear. Save the >$1000.

Seerlah
07-25-2010, 01:37 PM
I did much searching on this before deciding on the 034 Adjustable Control arm bushings (really, only got the 034 units because the Stern ones were sold out everywhere, and glad I ended up with the 034 units...........for cheaper). You don't want the K-Mac units. Adjusting them will be a major PIA. That is what detered me from getting those. The process to get a proper alignment sucks major balls. I wouldn't want to put my mechanic through what it takes for a proper adjustement. I tried to find the thread I came across that prompted me to get adjustable control arms over the K-mac units, but came up fruitless. But the process he had to go through for a proper alignmment was ridiculous and K-Mac does not disclose that information.
He said that everytime you adjust the k-mac bushings, you throw the toe off. So, he had to keep making tweeks till he got the toe and camber correct. And to adjust camber, you will need to take the actual control arms off for each adjustment (if I recall correct. either way, he basically explained a headache and was telling anyone to just go a different route if they could).

Do it: http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php/368073-*NEW*034Motorsport-Adjustable-Front-Upper-Control-Arm-Kit-for-the-C5-B5-B6-B7-chassis

I also am not into the slammed look, but more of a clean arch over the wheel/tire. I am still on stockers with my coilovers, and my drop isn't significant from stock sports height. But it is enough to have a "minor" camber issue (if you want pics, just request and I will PM them to you in a couple days. my mother has the camera in Italy and I am picking her up from the airport tommorow). My toe is good, so tires show really no uneven tire wear. But the bow-legged stance is starting to piss me off. So, I ordered the adjustable 034 units. I will eventually get 18" wheels when I can justify it after spending $500 on my tires (for my stockers) with plenty of life left in them.

biketsai
07-25-2010, 02:16 PM
I am at about 24.5gtf with Stasis/Koni coils. I have the CPP (discontinued, but similar to 034) control arms and I am able to dial in my alignment with perfect camber being as low as I am with no excess tire wear.

MOtown A4
07-25-2010, 02:28 PM
I am at about 24.5gtf with Stasis/Koni coils. I have the CPP (discontinued, but similar to 034) control arms and I am able to dial in my alignment with perfect camber being as low as I am with no excess tire wear.

hey man! off topic, you get that 2871 in yet? i just fixed a few terrible boost leaks yesterday and the car is a completely new beast again! back on topic-im really leaning toward getting the 034 units. i like the company and i like the customer service, although i think i might wait just a little (month tops) to get them as they wont be absolutely needed right away.

Seerlah
07-25-2010, 02:44 PM
I have had mine in my possession for roughly a month now and haven't installed them. I won't be installing them till spring time (will do complete CA, sway bar link, tie rod end overhaul at that time). My camber is annoying, but I don't have unven or bad tire wear because my wheels are straight. You will be fine with the negative camber if your toe is correct. I just can't stand the unwanted camber.

MOtown A4
07-25-2010, 05:10 PM
yah, i think im going to wait and do all of it together. anything for the rear camber adjustment?

Seerlah
07-25-2010, 05:18 PM
The rear camber can be adjusted via rear camber bolt. You don't need adjustable units for the rear, unless going really low. But if you feel the need to, 034 sells rear ones (like Kyle said).

biketsai
07-25-2010, 05:52 PM
X2 about the rear camber ^^^, no excessive wear for me although I think the alignment guys say that Ive maxed it out.

I actually havent had the chance to put in the 71r, Ive just been super lazy and busy with working. I finally put the new tune in and fuel pump just to let everything adjust, so when it comes time to stick the turbo in the ECU will be all ready!

chris

MOtown A4
07-25-2010, 06:03 PM
X2 about the rear camber ^^^, no excessive wear for me although I think the alignment guys say that Ive maxed it out.

I actually havent had the chance to put in the 71r, Ive just been super lazy and busy with working. I finally put the new tune in and fuel pump just to let everything adjust, so when it comes time to stick the turbo in the ECU will be all ready!

chris
nice, i love it, im planning on maxing out a uni 630 tune next summer!

sprAfour
07-25-2010, 10:52 PM
figured yall might like this....

http://www.cambertire.com/

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/optima-sports-announces-new-camber-tire-technology-**-93677134.html

something i stumbled upon a while ago- dnt know if its been talked about..

Thi
07-26-2010, 09:12 AM
I just posted a review of the Koni 1150 coilover kit installed in my Avant last week! Inside are my alignment specs and also some helpful info on installing the coilovers. I myself do not like the slammed look. Let me know if you have any other questions.

http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php/376024-Koni-COs-installed-pics-amp-impressions

onemoremile
07-26-2010, 10:50 AM
There is a big difference between static and dynamic camber/toe especially with the soft stock bushings. They allow so much deflection that camber can change about 2 degrees under load especially with r-comp tires.

That said, toe is what kills tires the fastest. If you are really concerned then just flip the tires on their rims once a year. That way the fresh outer is now the inner and wear will be balanced.

Lowering these cars more than an inch or so doesn't yield quicker times on a race course. I know most people lower for looks but I've run mine at various heights and while lower felt faster (quicker steering feel and sharpness) it wasn't any quicker. I've been running Shine Racing's suspension for a couple years and it is as quick as it ever was on coilovers and looks pretty much stock.

mysman
07-26-2010, 12:00 PM
Dynamic camber/toe is not talked about very much. If you replace the UCA with rod ends (CPPs) and remove all deflection at the top, you will modify the camber curve, for the worse, I would think.

MOtown A4
07-26-2010, 03:45 PM
my main goal is to get all the parts i need and do it in one swift install. one install one alignment. im really starting to see the big picture and not skimping on the parts just because of price. gameplan as of now is 034 adj. uppers. density line lowers, and i dont know what to do for the rear. does 034 make density line rears?

MOtown A4
07-26-2010, 03:54 PM
I just posted a review of the Koni 1150 coilover kit installed in my Avant last week! Inside are my alignment specs and also some helpful info on installing the coilovers. I myself do not like the slammed look. Let me know if you have any other questions.

http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php/376024-Koni-COs-installed-pics-amp-impressions
i saw that, i was really stoked on your teflon bushings you Mcguyver'd! im planning on doing something like that also.

Seerlah
07-26-2010, 06:08 PM
You don't need to do anything with the rear. Leave it alone, unless there is a problem with it. I already PM'd you the most cost effecient route. That's the route I'm taking.

MOtown A4
07-26-2010, 06:59 PM
You don't need to do anything with the rear. Leave it alone, unless there is a problem with it. I already PM'd you the most cost effecient route. That's the route I'm taking.

bushings are poop. i know people make rear kits, the question was if theres a density line package with higher durometer bushings than rear stockers.