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Raacerx
03-28-2010, 11:24 AM
If anyone comes to the first page, laff...

Evolved to a built 2.8L motor, RS4 intake manifold, Hemi 80mm TB, and a lot more.

7/13/2011 Running on rough base tune, motor broken in, dyno tune soon on stock intake. Then move to big intake components.

12/3/2011 Things just haven't worked out exactly the way I hoped. I have a leaky wastegate actuator on the passenger side, requiring another motor pull.

So the decision was made to go single turbo. Turbo has arrived, project has begun.

http://fototime.com/%7BB66F1D2D-7C07-4CE0-964B-D7AE0BEFDD93%7D/origpict/IMG_3897A.jpg


















***************

So a lot of things have changed since I first posted this 4+ months ago... One disaster after another, but the light is finally at the end of the tunnel. I am going to keep my original post here, but offer the modified version as well.

Months after I started this latest Stage 3 project, I started working for 034Motorsport, which of course allowed me to deviate a little from my original plan. Needless to say, some modifications have been added, and some changes made. I am going to post up the new updated list of parts, although my goals remain pretty much the same (about 450whp).

I am finally near the final brinks of Stage 3, and thought I would start a little build thread if anyone is interested to see the progress of my car.

EDIT August 1st, 2010 - PARTS LIST

I bought this B5 S4 11 months ago, with blown turbos and needing some work, for under $5k with 115k miles. I will have taken it from bone stock to beyond full Stage 3 in under a year. I started with an ECU, and now I am here, with 3" downpipes, 4" exhaust, meth injection, Sparco seats, and more. The car is a 2001.5 Mbox with the factory sports package, I've put over 15k miles on it since I bought it and pulled the engine twice to replace the blown K03's with used K03's while I saved for K04's. I have replaced half of the vehicle in the time I have owned it, and it is finally nearing "completion" (is there ever such a thing with an S4?).

The goal of the car is that never-quite-attainable quest for a daily driver that can also destroy the track. It doesn't make financial or spacial sense right now for me to own 2 cars, and if I had a devoted track car, I would still have the same worries about getting it to the track and back. Despite living close to Laguna Seca, Thunderhill is my favorite track and its 5 hours away. I have always loved having a car that I drive everyday, but that destroys the track. Of course, this presents all kinds of problems and compromises in both departments, but that is part of the challenge. So far, the car drives wonderfully. There are S4 issues of course, but on the whole, I get 25-26mpg on the highway, its never left me stranded (even when the turbos blew I was able to drive the 30 miles home), and the car has kept a high level of comfort despite track mounts all around. Even with the 4" exhaust and Sparco seats and Tracksport suspension (before the Motorsports), I still made plenty of 4+ hour drives.


Here is a list of whats been installed so far (this is whats currently installed; lots of things have been preceded by other parts). Aside from these aftermarket parts, I have replaced every hose, gasket, etc in the engine, along with new oxygen sensors, new sensor this, new that, etc, etc.

- Stasis Ohlins Motorsports 700/800 suspension
- H-sport rear sway bar with CPP adjustable swaybar links
- Touareg 6 piston 330mm front BBK
- 034Motorsport B6/B7 S4 300mm rear BBK
- Carbotech XP10 custom front brake pads, XP8 rear pads and stainless lines all around
- Upper control arms and Tie Rod Ends
- 034Motorsport 3" downpipes, catless, and custom 4" exhaust
- K&N filter, darintake airbox, sidefire plugs
- 034Motorsport Track motor mounts, Track tranny mounts
- 034Motorsport poly snub mount
- 034Motorsport Billet Diff Crossmember and diff carrier mounts
- Apikol rear diff mount
- AWE DTS (finally got it to work with minimal vibration)
- 034Motorsport Power Steering cooler upgrade/relocation
- VAST meth injection kit
- VAST bi-pipes
- Samco diverter valves
- JHM SS shift knob
- Sparco Roadster seats / Recaro double sliders / Wedge Eng. brackets
- 17" Avus w/ Michelin PS2 for the street
- 17" Kosei T1S w/ Nitto NT01 R-compounds for the track

- ATP GT2560 Eliminators
- 034Motorsport Stage 3 GT tune (~23psi, 90m MAF, EV14 injectors)
- 034Motorsport Bosch 044 dropin fuel pump
- VAST ported/ceramic coated exhaust manifolds
- 2.8L semi-built V6 heads with Supertech Inconel exhaust valves
- 034Motorsport Phenolic intake manifold spacers (RS4 transition)
- Ported intake manifold
- 034Motorsport X34 Carbon Fiber cold air intake
- JHM solid shifter linkage upgrade and Delrin stabilizer bushing upgrade
- VAST Stage 4 clutch and OEM flywheel (hate flywheel chatter)
- 034Motorsport Billet subframe bushings
- RS4 OEM oil cooler
- SAMCO hose kit


I am very excited for the 034Motorsport tune, as it is relatively new and I am also local to their shop, and it is important for me to be there for the tuning and have a dialog going on between me and the tuner. The initial goal is over 400whp @ 20psi on 91 octane. Very confident I can make this considering my Stage 2+ did 306whp on 91 octane. My eventual goal is 450whp with meth, 91 octane, aggressively tuned, with the 2.8L heads and a 3.2L VR6 throttle body. This would be one of the highest powered K04 cars on 91 octane around.

After this work next week, there are very few things I have planned. JHM shifter (only doing the solid shifter linkage now), 4:1 diff, and 2 piece rotors for the brakes, and eventually a transmission rebuild. As time goes by, and the car receives less and less daily driver responsibilities, I will be adding a cage and widebody. This car will never be sold; it will be driven till its too rough to go on the street, then it will be full track duty. Not the most ideal track car as far as lap times, but its all about fun.

Here are some pictures throughout my ownership, chronologically.

The day she came home. Passed SMOG that week, despite turbos almost gone
http://fototime.com/%7B7856F892-AA8A-410E-AA39-F281A80C8B94%7D/origpict/P1020671.JPG

My first visit to 034Motorsport
http://fototime.com/%7B7949DFB0-AF9E-43B5-875F-0F96A7987C84%7D/origpict/P1020677.JPG

http://fototime.com/%7B3902626D-25AB-41C2-B5CF-841608DA0E3C%7D/origpict/P1020687A.JPG

Success! Mid May
http://fototime.com/%7B79962DDE-ECF8-443E-B06E-7D1C449DDCB7%7D/origpict/P1020716A.JPG

Up and running
http://fototime.com/%7BCB7276F7-82C1-4EDD-8E1D-E1E888EA2E13%7D/origpict/P1020744A.JPG

Emergency timing belt replacement (don't drop a socket into your timing belt area)
http://fototime.com/%7B62F60858-5D79-4314-B027-647A783E1B51%7D/origpict/p1030370.jpg

Yes, about 5 seconds from bending valves
http://fototime.com/%7BFFD5803C-BF62-4128-8BEC-8A034A5B1A10%7D/origpict/p1030371.jpg

Touareg BBK
http://fototime.com/%7B71F17555-6178-4F92-A42E-FDE136B7AE2D%7D/origpict/P1030477.JPG

Engine pull #2 (K03 blew @ 6800rpm 4th or 5th gear shift)
http://fototime.com/%7B61B017B9-5D8D-474B-9492-0BDC9619E0CF%7D/origpict/P1030611A.JPG

Yummy
http://fototime.com/%7B244A4E68-CA5E-4595-BE84-922A6F1F5388%7D/origpict/P1030614A.JPG

Back on the road with free K03's from Hawaii (THANKS Will175!!!)
http://fototime.com/%7B7C1045F7-E1C9-4412-8234-4F8FDB9A3D94%7D/origpict/P1030628A.JPG

Destroying WRX
http://fototime.com/%7BD3739706-7606-41D6-8C48-213623B47DB4%7D/origpict/HT4U3953A.JPG

http://fototime.com/%7B9908A88A-7891-4E1C-B6CD-035941949835%7D/origpict/HT4U4741A.JPG

meth install
http://fototime.com/%7BCDDB6254-1345-4222-A292-194FE9E1DF11%7D/origpict/P1030697A.JPG

Custom 4" exhaust
http://fototime.com/%7B89088661-DDE7-4EB8-BCEC-1FE1806CBD72%7D/origpict/P1030762A.JPG

034Motorsport rear BBK
http://fototime.com/%7B22246607-3285-4C7C-B4C2-C1B9DABFF1E2%7D/origpict/P1030840.JPG

Goodies
http://fototime.com/%7BC08A643B-A0B4-413D-AC00-7FD9D0E69D05%7D/origpict/P1030861.JPG

034Motorsport 3" downpipes
http://fototime.com/%7B4399D5E6-4766-4D2B-A4FA-1559C56DE3FE%7D/origpict/P1030965.JPG

http://fototime.com/%7B3E7EB758-00C0-4CC0-823C-9EBD91D85B0F%7D/origpict/P1030961.JPG

http://fototime.com/%7B51AFA083-163D-43F1-B409-BE8D244BAAAC%7D/origpict/P1040012A.JPG

Sparco
http://fototime.com/%7B8DBA73C0-57D3-4950-8229-242B07A882FF%7D/origpict/P1040111.JPG

davidkae
03-28-2010, 11:37 AM
Very cool. Keep up the great work!

exclusivett
03-28-2010, 11:52 AM
awesome. VAST does the tuning for 034 and JHM IIRC, right? Looking forward to gettign a vast tune myself.

raaab2536
03-28-2010, 12:01 PM
damn that thing must haul ass

Raacerx
03-28-2010, 12:07 PM
awesome. VAST does the tuning for 034 and JHM IIRC, right? Looking forward to gettign a vast tune myself.

It was my understanding that JHM used a modified VAST tune, but I really have absolutely no idea and that could just be a rumor. 034 does their own tune, far as I know. They only just released it. Not many cars have had it yet.

I am pretty excited. Funny thing is, I am actually perfectly happy with Stage 2+ power. The car is plenty fast, overly fast for my skills. However, Im sick of swapping turbos, and I figure, when in Rome...

infinkc
03-28-2010, 12:14 PM
Great build Max, wish I documented mine.

04/01-s4
03-28-2010, 12:31 PM
Im jealous to start my stgIII build, very nice rims....

STOCK 2.8 HEADS HAVE HOLLOW VALVES which is almost worse then sodium filled valves if your trying to run some serious go fast juice. spend like...350 on an entire set of solid exhaust valves. Now im not entirely sure if all the 2.8 guys will agree but just my 2 cents

How heavy were the stock s4 seats next to the sparco's ?

S4jet
03-28-2010, 12:56 PM
Looks awesome keep it up

HotSauce
03-28-2010, 01:34 PM
Im jealous to start my stgIII build, very nice rims....

STOCK 2.8 HEADS HAVE HOLLOW VALVES which is almost worse then sodium filled valves if your trying to run some serious go fast juice. spend like...350 on an entire set of solid exhaust valves. Now im not entirely sure if all the 2.8 guys will agree but just my 2 cents

How heavy were the stock s4 seats next to the sparco's ?

Stock S4 seats are almost exactly 60lbs/seat. Mine were power/heated for reference.

Quattro_2.7tt
03-28-2010, 01:44 PM
Nice build. Im going stage 3 soon.

alexverve
03-28-2010, 04:35 PM
where did u get the Tourag BBK? did u put it together or someone is selling whole kit?

exclusivett
03-28-2010, 04:48 PM
It was my understanding that JHM used a modified VAST tune, but I really have absolutely no idea and that could just be a rumor. 034 does their own tune, far as I know. They only just released it. Not many cars have had it yet.
.

Cool. thanks... what tuner are you going with? Also, where did you find the best deal on the seat mounts and sliders? ive been looking around and cant find a good deal on that stuff anywhere.

M.S4
03-28-2010, 04:52 PM
Cool. thanks... what tuner are you going with? Also, where did you find the best deal on the seat mounts and sliders? ive been looking around and cant find a good deal on that stuff anywhere.

034Motorsport... like in the title and the original post.

RolledMySTi
03-28-2010, 06:00 PM
What intercoolers are you going with?

damnthemansam
03-28-2010, 06:31 PM
034motorsport has just released their own tune, and a strong one at that. 390whp stg 3 for one example. plus being close to your tuner is huge so they can tweak for every last modification.

drkenan
03-28-2010, 06:49 PM
Sounds awesome...you've done a great job with an inexpensive car.[up]

AudiSportB5S4
03-28-2010, 06:53 PM
awesome. VAST does the tuning for 034 and JHM IIRC, right? Looking forward to gettign a vast tune myself.

No sir, 034 does not get their tuning from VAST.. If you're looking for VAST tuning down in the Florida area, PM "BlackS4TT (Josh)"... He lives down there and has the flashing cable.

OP- Very nice build and looks like the car has progressed very nicely! Keep it up and enjoy stage 3 !

Don Supreme
03-28-2010, 06:54 PM
Lofty power goals.

BlkdoutS4
03-28-2010, 07:17 PM
Lofty power goals.

he's trying to finally beat me in a race...[:D]

bakeravant
03-28-2010, 07:19 PM
I am pretty excited. Funny thing is, I am actually perfectly happy with Stage 2+ power. The car is plenty fast, overly fast for my skills. However, Im sick of swapping turbos, and I figure, when in Rome...
I think I'm in the same boat.. My stage 3 setup surely exceeds my driving skills, on the other hand, my k03 went out and I wasn't about to spend money to put in two more k03s and wait for them to fail again if I could afford not to. I'm kind of a gear head, so even though the s4 doesn't really need to be modded it happens anyways :) I hope to have a well sorted, custom tuned 3+ someday when finances permit! You're well on the way to being there. Oh, and the brake upgrade is sick!

B_EEZY
03-28-2010, 07:26 PM
Lookin good, did the engine pulls on your own?

csre9
03-28-2010, 08:20 PM
Looks like a solid build man! My car is at another forum members garage right now and were doing a vast tuned pjko4 setup.

As far as 034 software, I called them a few months back and they use Unitronic software.

Not to put any tuner/software down,I had uni for my ko3 set up and it ran strong, 10.2 afr's, but strong nontheless. I have a buddy with ko4/16's, actually my friend that has my car at his garage right now and he has Unitronic on a 60lb file, long story short, it runs like shit. My ko3 car would give his a run for his money it runs so bad. Breaks up under load, misses at idle, revs bounce at idle and the list goes on.

Hopefully you'll have better luck with the ev14's though, they are definitely better rounded injector.
Best of luck and keep us updated with the 034 tune!

BlkdoutS4
03-28-2010, 08:28 PM
As far as 034 software, I called them a few months back and they use Unitronic software.



034 is now doing in-house custom dyno tuning for the B5 S4

rouellettea4
03-28-2010, 08:32 PM
Looks like a solid build man! My car is at another forum members garage right now and were doing a vast tuned pjko4 setup.

As far as 034 software, I called them a few months back and they use Unitronic software.

Not to put any tuner/software down,I had uni for my ko3 set up and it ran strong, 10.2 afr's, but strong nontheless. I have a buddy with ko4/16's, actually my friend that has my car at his garage right now and he has Unitronic on a 60lb file, long story short, it runs like shit. My ko3 car would give his a run for his money it runs so bad. Breaks up under load, misses at idle, revs bounce at idle and the list goes on.

Hopefully you'll have better luck with the ev14's though, they are definitely better rounded injector.
Best of luck and keep us updated with the 034 tune!

I think Uni, IIRC, was releasing a platform for tuning that was available to dealers so that they could tune using it. Some kind of software suite I recall them advertising a little while ago. That being said, putting it in the hands of 034ms I'm sure they could make great tunes using it, even if the tools are being licensed by uni. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

BlkdoutS4
03-28-2010, 09:32 PM
I think Uni, IIRC, was releasing a platform for tuning that was available to dealers so that they could tune using it. Some kind of software suite I recall them advertising a little while ago. That being said, putting it in the hands of 034ms I'm sure they could make great tunes using it, even if the tools are being licensed by uni. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

way to read my post right above yours

USAFS4
03-28-2010, 09:41 PM
Thanks to you I will hopefully be riding your back bumper around Laguna. You are a standup guy for helping me with my car when yours was on the brink of Greatness. Best of Luck !!(not that you'll need it). And please don't forget us little people when you make it to the Big Show.

rouellettea4
03-28-2010, 09:46 PM
way to read my post right above yours

[rolleyes] sorry for taking your thunder...

post wasn't there when I started typing.

Edit: and it still didn't really answer the question as to whether they are using the unitronic suite to do the actual tuning or if they have their own setup for that, so... anyone?

BlkdoutS4
03-28-2010, 09:48 PM
[rolleyes] sorry for taking your thunder...

post wasn't there when I started typing.

haha no hard feelings, i'm just sayin...

sparkyvw
03-28-2010, 11:57 PM
No sir, 034 does not get their tuning from VAST.. If you're looking for VAST tuning down in the Florida area, PM "BlackS4TT (Josh)"... He lives down there and has the flashing cable.



so do i!!


raacerx props to you for doing it your self. On DIRT with just some sheets on wood on the ground!

ZMEY
03-29-2010, 12:02 AM
good job man, looks very good

Sales@RAI
03-29-2010, 12:11 AM
Looks like a solid build man! My car is at another forum members garage right now and were doing a vast tuned pjko4 setup.

As far as 034 software, I called them a few months back and they use Unitronic software.

Not to put any tuner/software down,I had uni for my ko3 set up and it ran strong, 10.2 afr's, but strong nontheless. I have a buddy with ko4/16's, actually my friend that has my car at his garage right now and he has Unitronic on a 60lb file, long story short, it runs like shit. My ko3 car would give his a run for his money it runs so bad. Breaks up under load, misses at idle, revs bounce at idle and the list goes on.

Hopefully you'll have better luck with the ev14's though, they are definitely better rounded injector.
Best of luck and keep us updated with the 034 tune!

Sebastian, I keep telling you guys that you should have come up to get everything fixed man. I can promise that the Uni tunes are awesome, it seemed like it just needed to get dialed in

washyourrhands
03-29-2010, 01:13 AM
good shit max!

[up]

Raacerx
03-29-2010, 02:00 AM
Im jealous to start my stgIII build, very nice rims....

STOCK 2.8 HEADS HAVE HOLLOW VALVES which is almost worse then sodium filled valves if your trying to run some serious go fast juice. spend like...350 on an entire set of solid exhaust valves. Now im not entirely sure if all the 2.8 guys will agree but just my 2 cents

How heavy were the stock s4 seats next to the sparco's ?

I am not revving my engine past 7000rpm. Not really past 6800rpm unless I am doing FATS. K04 run out of breath up there anyways. I am not worried about it, and rather just do all the valves at once and do springs, retainers, lifters, etc. If I get paranoid, I can swap valves from the 2.7 heads. They are also the AHA heads, not ATQ.


where did u get the Tourag BBK? did u put it together or someone is selling whole kit?

put it together myself. no one is selling it as a kit. the calipers are quite hard to find these days.


Cool. thanks... what tuner are you going with? Also, where did you find the best deal on the seat mounts and sliders? ive been looking around and cant find a good deal on that stuff anywhere.

Wedge Engineering for the brackets. They are the popular choice. They run about $90 for the bracket, $50-$100 for the sliders depending on if you want double lock, etc. Not sure where to find them. I got my seats with the sliders and brackets all together, from a local forum member who sold his B5 S4. I got them for around $900 for everything.


What intercoolers are you going with?

I am not sure yet Rick... Can't quite justify dropping $1200+ on ER, and can't justify spending anything about $500 on anything but ER... So I think I will probably just go with a front mount. If I do, you can guarantee it will be painted black, and I will be minimizing trimming of the bumper as much as possible. I hate the look of the FMIC, and dont want the attention. Thats one of the reasons I love running stock rims. I blend in pretty good... except for the 4" exhaust of course. Not sure I can really afford ER's anyways. If I can't afford anything better or figure something else out, meth and FMIC will have to do. I have a core already, and actually have some make shift piping as well; just need a crapload of t-clamps or I will just invest in some better piping.


034motorsport has just released their own tune, and a strong one at that. 390whp stg 3 for one example. plus being close to your tuner is huge so they can tweak for every last modification.

Exactly! Being able to have an open and local dialog with the tuner is very important to me. I also have experience with 034, I run a lot of their products, and I like guys. They do a lot of B5 work, and they took a long time to release this tune, so I have confidence it will end up with the power I want. And like you said damnthemansam, I want to be able to have the tune tweaked for mods such as the 3.2L throttle body I will be adding in the near future. I don't want something like that done remotely, and 034 is 45 minutes away from me.


he's trying to finally beat me in a race...[:D]

Hahahahah! You know... it was never my original intention, but lately I have realized that I might have a few extra goodies on BlkdoutA4, so yes! Yes now I am trying to beat Brian. He put down good numbers, and is a good goal to beat, despite it never being my original intention to "one up" him. Muhahaha!


Thanks to you I will hopefully be riding your back bumper around Laguna. You are a standup guy for helping me with my car when yours was on the brink of Greatness. Best of Luck !!(not that you'll need it). And please don't forget us little people when you make it to the Big Show.

Thanks jason! I cannot wait to get you, Brian, Kanyon, and more of us out on the track. It would be phenomenal to have a big B5 turn out somewhere. We'll get your car good enough to give us all a run for our money. VAST tune with meth... your going to be hauling.


Lookin good, did the engine pulls on your own?

yep... just finished my 7th pull this last week. Doing my 8th next week (my own). Have to admit... I did a suspension swap today and it was incredibly refreshing compared to pulling engines. I've pulled 3 in the last month and a half, and about to do my 4th in a 2 month span. Satisfying, but not terribly fun.


so do i!!


raacerx props to you for doing it your self. On DIRT with just some sheets on wood on the ground!

haha thanks. luckily i've upgraded to a large patio and a garage, but the dirt was fun. I think thats what I get the most comments on. just got to work with what ya got. I am one of the cheapest guys ever, so sometimes I deal with less then ideal situations or settings.



Appreciate the kind and encouraging words gents... The day is getting near... I am giddy. Feel like a little kid.

Oh, and I will be running 255/35R18. Need to find me some 8.5 or 9" wide rims, ET30 offset

Raacerx
03-29-2010, 02:08 AM
Oh, forgot to mention. With the 034 tune, and everything I've got listed here, my total investment (after selling off parts I have replaced, and including the multiple sets of tires, etc), I have spent about $15k-$16k. That includes the cost of the car, registration, everything.

This is encouraging, since the going rate for a good running Stage 3 is about $15k. So, not that I would ever sell the car, but I could make back my entire monetary investment.

RolledMySTi
03-29-2010, 08:39 AM
Also, do the 4:1 diff now. It is freaking awesome, especially if you go to the track. Trust me, you will be pissed off if you wait once you realize how awesome it is.

veggiemonster
03-29-2010, 09:31 AM
Looks like a solid build man! My car is at another forum members garage right now and were doing a vast tuned pjko4 setup.

As far as 034 software, I called them a few months back and they use Unitronic software.

Not to put any tuner/software down,I had uni for my ko3 set up and it ran strong, 10.2 afr's, but strong nontheless. I have a buddy with ko4/16's, actually my friend that has my car at his garage right now and he has Unitronic on a 60lb file, long story short, it runs like shit. My ko3 car would give his a run for his money it runs so bad. Breaks up under load, misses at idle, revs bounce at idle and the list goes on.

Hopefully you'll have better luck with the ev14's though, they are definitely better rounded injector.
Best of luck and keep us updated with the 034 tune!

1. that thing needs a 3 bar soooo bad. i bet the tune is decent with a 3 bar, maybe not the most powerful, but def not a 9.0 afr or w/e he's been getting.

2. how far along are you? i need your car done to get my car done ;)

kbS42001
03-29-2010, 10:24 AM
NICE, Best of luck man, it looks solid. Makes me sad that i didnt do more research and build a cheap s4 that needs help rather than trying to find a low mi pristine car.( which didnt happen either, lol)
and kudo's x2 for DIY in tha dirt[wrench]

exclusivett
03-29-2010, 11:02 AM
Wedge Engineering for the brackets. They are the popular choice. They run about $90 for the bracket, $50-$100 for the sliders depending on if you want double lock, etc. Not sure where to find them. I got my seats with the sliders and brackets all together, from a local forum member who sold his B5 S4. I got them for around $900 for everything.



Thanks!

NOTORIOUS VR
03-29-2010, 11:14 AM
I can promise that the Uni tunes are awesome

LOL

awd2ks4
03-29-2010, 12:52 PM
So 034 is going to set u up with a custom file and tweak it on their dyno?

Raacerx
03-29-2010, 01:34 PM
Yums...

http://fototime.com/%7BD6E59FC1-549F-43F3-B2E4-426CFA5F61F7%7D/origpict/IMG_1095.jpg

definitely will be doing 4:1 diff, but I am trying to do the washer method so I am looking for a donor diff so I can get the dimensions.

yes, tune will be dyno tweaked.

sparkyvw
03-29-2010, 01:49 PM
Yums...

http://fototime.com/%7BD6E59FC1-549F-43F3-B2E4-426CFA5F61F7%7D/origpict/IMG_1095.jpg



i hate you [:D]
I really want that suspension but i cant run it. I do need a upgrade for my konis thou.

will175
03-29-2010, 02:32 PM
Hey Max,
Just seen you thanked me in your thread..Hahaha. Yah homie no prob. Hit ya up later.

TweetsS4Estate
03-29-2010, 02:53 PM
the 3.2L TB will have ton of bottle necks. like you will need a rs4 intake manifold. ard bi-pipes ect

BlkdoutS4
03-29-2010, 03:18 PM
the 3.2L TB will have ton of bottle necks. like you will need a rs4 intake manifold. ard bi-pipes ect

he's got the bi pipes already, dont know if he has plans to do the rs4 intake mani though..

Sales@RAI
03-29-2010, 04:04 PM
LOL

Fair enough, I know they aren't big in the B5 S4 crew, but we have currently the fastest B6 S4 (not on nitrous) with our S/C kit, fastest B6 A4 1/4 times, my car might make either another first or second, and a bunch more FAST VWs. Honestly the files need to get tweaked to run right. Unitronic is probably doing that, although I can't speak for them.

Raacerx
03-29-2010, 06:10 PM
I may be doing the RS4 mani and 034 rails in the near future, but I would like to get it tuned with just the TB first to see gains. This would be purely to know if gains are possible. From what I can tell, gains can still be made despite the bottleneck back to the intake mani. not as much of course. my only concern is part throttle driveability, so we'll see. This is still my DD. But that is all in the future. Picking up the heads this weekend, and on Tuesday, I will be pulling the engine!

Everything else is on its way, thanks to Prince @ VAST and Dan @ JHM.

http://fototime.com/%7BA68334A0-0756-4961-9F4B-389EFA5ECFA2%7D/origpict/P1040128.JPG

Number54
03-29-2010, 07:04 PM
I may be doing the RS4 mani and 034 rails in the near future, but I would like to get it tuned with just the TB first to see gains. This would be purely to know if gains are possible. From what I can tell, gains can still be made despite the bottleneck back to the intake mani. not as much of course. my only concern is part throttle driveability, so we'll see. This is still my DD. But that is all in the future. Picking up the heads this weekend, and on Tuesday, I will be pulling the engine!

Everything else is on its way, thanks to Prince @ VAST and Dan @ JHM.



I just remembered... have you seen the modded manifold ASP was showing a while back? Dunno how it compares to the RS4 one, but it'd probably be a whole lot easier. It would avoid the RS4->S4 gaskets and different throttle-body, right?

NOTORIOUS VR
03-29-2010, 09:42 PM
Fair enough, I know they aren't big in the B5 S4 crew, but we have currently the fastest B6 S4 (not on nitrous) with our S/C kit, fastest B6 A4 1/4 times, my car might make either another first or second, and a bunch more FAST VWs. Honestly the files need to get tweaked to run right. Unitronic is probably doing that, although I can't speak for them.

this isn't the place for it so I'm not gonna pollute more then I already have... but I wouldn't let Unitronic touch any car unless it has stock injectors. I actually like to have my cars start without flooding.

Raacerx
03-29-2010, 10:03 PM
I just remembered... have you seen the modded manifold ASP was showing a while back? Dunno how it compares to the RS4 one, but it'd probably be a whole lot easier. It would avoid the RS4->S4 gaskets and different throttle-body, right?

Do you have any info on it? Any documentation? The RS4 manifold runs about $600, but then I can use 034 fuel rails. Is the ASP any cheaper? does it allow use of the factory rails? I couldn't find any info on their website.


this isn't the place for it so I'm not gonna pollute more then I already have... but I wouldn't let Unitronic touch any car unless it has stock injectors. I actually like to have my cars start without flooding.

Lets keep it on topic here guys? K? thanks. The subject of unitronics is really irrelevant to my thread. Whatever method 034 uses to tune, I will be there and I am knowledgable when it comes to what to look for in a tune. 034 will make me happy. So please, keep the arguments outside of here.

will175
03-29-2010, 11:10 PM
Hey bubba, So when you just going to pick up a new tig and make some stuff we talked about for your ride.... ;-)

Calif_Kid
03-30-2010, 05:42 PM
Max - nice job on the build. Do you already have an oil cooler or will be installing one soon? With all of that horsepower and plans on tracking it, it seems like a good thing to have. - Jim

Go_S4
03-30-2010, 06:43 PM
Hey Raacerx,if you don't mind me asking, how much is 034 asking for their tune? Pm me if you don't want to list it here...thanks

jon c
03-30-2010, 08:59 PM
Also interested in how much it costs to get some 034 juice in my car

Raacerx
03-31-2010, 11:53 PM
Max - nice job on the build. Do you already have an oil cooler or will be installing one soon? With all of that horsepower and plans on tracking it, it seems like a good thing to have. - Jim

Hey jim! I've got a basic oil cooler (followed the DIY posted here by gearhead). I think it should be ok for the time being. When I am ready, I can upgrade to a nicer core. Also... it's your fault I bought the Ohlins Motorsports. After feeling yours, there was just no other option. For pure bling factor and further adjustment, I think I'd like to add rear reservoirs too. If I can get ahold of them, I can the shocks rebuilt for a good price to incorporate the reservoirs by Performance Shock @ Infineon. The rears already have the provisions for it; just need an oil line with banjo fittings and the reservoirs themselves. Wonder if I can contact Ohlins directly for that? I know all their shocks share the same reservoirs pretty much. I'm also going do a battery relocation and definitely doing a rear meth tank. I'd like to relocate as much stuff to the trunk as I can. Right now, I'd rather leave my spare tire in too and everything in the back to at least give a minimal balance.



Also interested in how much it costs to get some 034 juice in my car

Don't quote me, you'll have to ask 034 themselves, but I believe its about ~$1600 with MAF, adapter, EV14 injectors, tune, etc. I am doing a bit of a custom route and getting a 044 dropin and some other stuff so I'm not sure on the exact breakdown of all the stuff. Not sure if they are doing a remote tune or if its just local or what. My car will be tuned there, so I am not sure on details. I'll try to find something out or get Laszlo to chime in.


Right now my big dilemma is intercoolers. I have nearly everything to run a FMIC kit, but I don't think it is something I want to leave on very long. I like SMIC more, but I haven't been convinced ER are the ultimate. People are telling me different things. FMIC is by far the cheapest and I already have a core and everything. Just not super stoked on how much the FMIC limits airflow. Maybe I can make some ducts to direct more air into the engine bay/air filter.


mmmm, more stuff arriving.

http://fototime.com/%7B5C063949-3F46-4F5C-9222-DA791727EC7D%7D/origpict/P1040190.JPG

S4DTM
04-02-2010, 04:23 PM
Awesome man, hopefully we'll see you at at the track! You're gonna love the 034 tune, they did a great job with our car!

p.s. There's NO WAY that T-Hill is 5 hours from you! Haha, how slow you drivin?? Santa cruz is about an hour from me, and T-hill is about 2 hours from here...I say you can make it in 3! (Test this out the weekend of the 24th maybe??)

Raacerx
04-02-2010, 06:39 PM
Awesome man, hopefully we'll see you at at the track! You're gonna love the 034 tune, they did a great job with our car!

p.s. There's NO WAY that T-Hill is 5 hours from you! Haha, how slow you drivin?? Santa cruz is about an hour from me, and T-hill is about 2 hours from here...I say you can make it in 3! (Test this out the weekend of the 24th maybe??)

hahaha. its not 5 hours but its around 4 usually. especially with traffic on the way back. And you know I dont drive slow! I will definitely be out there once everything is squared away. i hear you guys are going for sub 2 minutes @ TH. I will be very impressed, and require a ride along!!!

Speaking of the track, oil cooler stuff:

http://fototime.com/%7B6FAAD508-B21A-43FD-ABB1-028D2E1942B4%7D/origpict/P1040193.JPG

washyourrhands
04-02-2010, 07:02 PM
4 hours if you drive like a bitch;)

oil cooler looks sick bud

S4DTM
04-02-2010, 08:11 PM
hahaha. its not 5 hours but its around 4 usually. especially with traffic on the way back. And you know I dont drive slow! I will definitely be out there once everything is squared away. i hear you guys are going for sub 2 minutes @ TH. I will be very impressed, and require a ride along!!!

Speaking of the track, oil cooler stuff:

http://fototime.com/%7B6FAAD508-B21A-43FD-ABB1-028D2E1942B4%7D/origpict/P1040193.JPG

It's a goal...we'll see if it happens, haha. And that can be arranged [up]. Nice lookin oil cooler...will definitely come in handy!


4 hours if you drive like a bitch;)

oil cooler looks sick bud

Hahaha, well played

Audi S4 Turbo
04-02-2010, 08:39 PM
What Psi are you going to run with 91 and meth for 450 whp?

Raacerx
04-02-2010, 08:59 PM
What Psi are you going to run with 91 and meth for 450 whp?

22psi. but that is with 2.8L heads and a 3.2L throttle body. I won't have the throttle body for a few months. that is just the eventual, after a few retunes hopefully.

Raacerx
04-04-2010, 05:15 PM
2.8L heads. look ok?

Question... Has anyone considered modifying the stock exhaust manifolds from the 2.8L? They look to be a heckuva lot bigger and end in a simple 3 bolt flange that could easily have a bent piece/flange welded to it to fit T25/T30 turbos. Question i guess is if it can fit, and if it really is any bigger. The discharge sure is, but inside its a bit flattened out.

http://fototime.com/%7BCF9D0AE5-C0CC-4CD0-9E85-09F6166C006E%7D/origpict/P1040203A.JPG

Raacerx
04-04-2010, 07:24 PM
Single best upgrade ever.


http://fototime.com/%7B49116D2D-66F9-4555-B8B1-845985A01477%7D/origpict/IMG_1099A.JPG

USAFS4
04-04-2010, 10:01 PM
Single best upgrade ever.


http://fototime.com/%7B49116D2D-66F9-4555-B8B1-845985A01477%7D/origpict/IMG_1099A.JPG

What are those??

Rated S
04-05-2010, 10:38 AM
What are those??

Shock reservoirs for the Motorsport suspension.

belinko
04-05-2010, 10:40 AM
Single best upgrade ever.


http://fototime.com/%7B49116D2D-66F9-4555-B8B1-845985A01477%7D/origpict/IMG_1099A.JPG

^^X2

washyourrhands
04-05-2010, 11:43 AM
Single best upgrade ever.


http://fototime.com/%7B49116D2D-66F9-4555-B8B1-845985A01477%7D/origpict/IMG_1099A.JPG

ohhhhh you dick

NYMKV
04-05-2010, 11:46 AM
Loving your approach to this build [up]

Good luck with everything cant wait to see final results!

Raacerx
04-10-2010, 02:51 PM
Just a quick update...

Got the one head back from the machine shop, there was a leak in cylinder #1 but everything is fixed up and they hooked it up for very cheap. Just waiting on a few items from VAST and then everything is a go.

http://fototime.com/%7BD62C3986-2A30-4904-BADC-CA0F0355104A%7D/origpict/IMG_1134.jpg

wdbdy2000s4
04-10-2010, 05:15 PM
Im jealous to start my stgIII build, very nice rims....

STOCK 2.8 HEADS HAVE HOLLOW VALVES which is almost worse then sodium filled valves if your trying to run some serious go fast juice. spend like...350 on an entire set of solid exhaust valves. Now im not entirely sure if all the 2.8 guys will agree but just my 2 cents

How heavy were the stock s4 seats next to the sparco's ?

it's not even an argument which set is better. The hollow valves bend/break/melt under the extreme heat produced by our cars.

Raacerx
04-11-2010, 01:56 PM
it's not even an argument which set is better. The hollow valves bend/break/melt under the extreme heat produced by our cars.

Not an argument, but considering I don't rev past 7000rpm, I really do not think it is going to be a problem. I am also running K04, not GT or RS6 turbos and tapering to like 18psi @ redline so things shouldn't be extremely hot. For the sake of saving money, the sake of saving time, and the sake of being another guinea pig, I am going to run the stock 2.8 valves and see what happens. I would just swap my 2.7 valves over but after talking to some people, no one seems to think its necessary unless you are trying to rev way tall or are running 30psi.

Evilevo
04-11-2010, 02:33 PM
Not an argument, but considering I don't rev past 7000rpm, I really do not think it is going to be a problem. I am also running K04, not GT or RS6 turbos and tapering to like 18psi @ redline so things shouldn't be extremely hot. For the sake of saving money, the sake of saving time, and the sake of being another guinea pig, I am going to run the stock 2.8 valves and see what happens. I would just swap my 2.7 valves over but after talking to some people, no one seems to think its necessary unless you are trying to rev way tall or are running 30psi.

I wouldn't do that if i were you. If you drop or bend a valve, you can end up hitting your Pistons with your valves and than you have to rebuild the whole motor. Do it once and do it right, cause it will only cost you more money in the end.

You dropped $$$$ on those coils, why not drop the $400 or so for the valves.

imola
04-11-2010, 02:39 PM
Single best upgrade ever.


http://fototime.com/%7B49116D2D-66F9-4555-B8B1-845985A01477%7D/origpict/IMG_1099A.JPG


Oh yummy!

Raacerx
04-11-2010, 02:47 PM
I wouldn't do that if i were you. If you drop or bend a valve, you can end up hitting your Pistons with your valves and than you have to rebuild the whole motor. Do it once and do it right, cause it will only cost you more money in the end.

You dropped $$$$ on those coils, why not drop the $400 or so for the valves.

there are people running GT turbos or Tial's on stock 2.8L heads and revving past 7500rpm. Not a lot, but there are. I actually don't really have an extra $400 to replace the valves, and if I do anything, I'll swap them over from the 2.7, but I'd really rather not deal with it.

Its true, risk having to rebuild the engine... but if I knock a piston head, then its time for rods ( i don't see this happening anytime soon ). The heads are low mileage. I've seen way way more evidence that the stock 2.8 valves run just fine with 500whp, then I've seen evidence of them busting, melting, or bending. If you have links to people with this damage from running K04 and stock 2.8L valves, please, post it here. I am here to learn, but I like to push the envelope and using stock valves is a good test. So far, a few well known shops have told me I will be just fine with stock valves since i am stock displacement, K04, and running under 22psi. The only time the car will get revved high, will be dyno sessions.

I'd rather save for ti springs and retainers, oversized valves, etc.

J-b5
04-11-2010, 03:09 PM
LOL

2nd/// this sounds awfully familiar "
Not to put any tuner/software down,I had uni for my ko3 set up and it ran strong, 10.2 afr's, but strong nontheless. I have a buddy with ko4/16's, actually my friend that has my car at his garage right now and he has Unitronic on a 60lb file, long story short, it runs like shit. My ko3 car would give his a run for his money it runs so bad. Breaks up under load, misses at idle, revs bounce at idle and the list goes on."

anyone else FTW.

Raacerx
04-14-2010, 07:22 PM
Finally have everything.

What showed up and is also getting installed next:
VAST Stage 4 Clutch
Resurfaced dual mass FW
VAST MBC
Inner CV boot kit
JHM Solid Shift linkage upgrade
JHM Delrin shifter linkage bushing upgrade
New coolant temp sensor for shiz and giggles
couple odds and ends

Complete list of everything being installed this next week, not including whats above:
RP K04 turbos
ARD inlet pipes
SAMCO hose kit
VAST ported and ceramic coated exhaust manifolds
AHA 2.8L heads, cleaned by machine shop, stock valvetrain (yes, flame away)
034Motorsport phenolic intake manifold Big Port to Small Port spacers
New head gaskets, valve cover gaskets, etc
DIY oil cooler (thanks gearhead for the write-up) with B&M cooler, sandwich plate, npt connection, etc
034Motorsport power steering cooler and relocation upgrade
Front mount intercooler
034Motorsport Bosch 044 Fuel Pump (still need to buy this, so I guess I don't quiiiite have everything, but that might have to wait until the clutch is broken in)

Once clutch is broken in, off to 034Motorsport to do the fueling, and get tuned.

sexysatorin
04-15-2010, 10:03 AM
Finally have everything.

What showed up and is also getting installed next:
VAST Stage 4 Clutch
Resurfaced dual mass FW
VAST MBC
Inner CV boot kit
JHM Solid Shift linkage upgrade
JHM Delrin shifter linkage bushing upgrade
New coolant temp sensor for shiz and giggles
couple odds and ends

Complete list of everything being installed this next week, not including whats above:
RP K04 turbos
ARD inlet pipes
SAMCO hose kit
VAST ported and ceramic coated exhaust manifolds
AHA 2.8L heads, cleaned by machine shop, stock valvetrain (yes, flame away)
034Motorsport phenolic intake manifold Big Port to Small Port spacers
New head gaskets, valve cover gaskets, etc
DIY oil cooler (thanks gearhead for the write-up) with B&M cooler, sandwich plate, npt connection, etc
034Motorsport power steering cooler and relocation upgrade
Front mount intercooler
034Motorsport Bosch 044 Fuel Pump (still need to buy this, so I guess I don't quiiiite have everything, but that might have to wait until the clutch is broken in)

Once clutch is broken in, off to 034Motorsport to do the fueling, and get tuned.

Let us know how those RP K04 do!!

Raacerx
04-23-2010, 12:12 AM
mega pics

http://fototime.com/%7BF1EE6369-E881-4988-9D27-9C2CD807A407%7D/origpict/P1040272A.JPG

http://fototime.com/%7B484AF958-1943-4D76-BC00-7BF592ED6AEA%7D/origpict/P1040273A.JPG

http://fototime.com/%7BA6A19888-47A7-4BA9-B540-E01FC2CA03A1%7D/origpict/P1040274A.JPG

http://fototime.com/%7B07A04188-7626-4094-B011-4CD527557828%7D/origpict/P1040276A.JPG

http://fototime.com/%7BBCF0F1A5-3B89-4336-9C6C-E294D1C00309%7D/origpict/P1040278A.JPG

http://fototime.com/%7B913A11AE-DDA0-4946-B34A-4A579F6F5459%7D/origpict/P1040282A.JPG

http://fototime.com/%7B5CE8EBA6-23E6-4DCB-8EB1-E0D46F29CA3C%7D/origpict/P1040286A.JPG

http://fototime.com/%7BF3BD5B16-0BD2-4B3C-8CA4-3B6699121A7D%7D/origpict/P1040289A.JPG

http://fototime.com/%7B3F867569-36C5-4196-98D7-16C4F51E28EA%7D/origpict/P1040291A.JPG

http://fototime.com/%7B9066CFD3-1921-4557-B978-9CD352884E94%7D/origpict/P1040292A.JPG

http://fototime.com/%7B52373321-484F-4759-8916-478D5002C960%7D/origpict/P1040295A.JPG

http://fototime.com/%7B079B2E19-BB78-4BB8-862B-3EBC2B5766BE%7D/origpict/P1040297A.JPG

http://fototime.com/%7B6A412637-B4D4-415C-8B59-095B51DA2130%7D/origpict/P1040301A.JPG

http://fototime.com/%7B4868E7D1-1398-41EA-92DE-2F8D8556652E%7D/origpict/P1040304A.JPG

http://fototime.com/%7B9D7C8330-6A5E-49F9-9621-D453124564C1%7D/origpict/P1040313A.JPG

washyourrhands
04-23-2010, 02:39 AM
good progress max!

jibberjive
04-23-2010, 03:35 AM
It feels so good when the engine finally gets out, eh!


They are also the AHA heads, not ATQ.


What do you think the difference between the two is?


For the sake of saving money, the sake of saving time, and the sake of being another guinea pig, I am going to run the stock 2.8 valves and see what happens.

I say do it, cause I want to see what the results are.


there are people running GT turbos or Tial's on stock 2.8L heads and revving past 7500rpm. Not a lot, but there are.

Who's running GT's on stock 2.8 valvetrain? Just curious, do you have any links?

It's a really interesting approach you're taking here, super budget in some parts, yet super extravagant in others. You bought the most expensive suspension made for our car, a power steering cooler, bigger TB, 2.8 heads, 044 pump for KO4's, but you're running replica turbos and stock valvetrain. Not knocking it, and though it's not what I would do, it's an interesting approach. Good luck! I'm dying to get back out on the track!

Raacerx
04-23-2010, 11:09 AM
What do you think the difference between the two is?

No difference, I have just heard over the years that AHA were more ideal, although they look the exact same to me. Just need to plug SAI port and heads are good to go. I am running normal 2.8L compression headgaskets, RS4 transition phenolic spacers, and ported exhaust manifolds in order to help the transition of the big ports to small ports.


I say do it, cause I want to see what the results are.

Exactly! If for some godawful reason I bend a valve, and end up kissing a piston, then, while it sucks, i will just have to pull the engine again. My 3rd pull on this car alone in a year. However, I am actually pretty confident it will be fine. As I've mentioned a few times before, I don't rev high, and Im never going to even hit 7000rpm. Plus I am gonna be running 22psi MAX.



Who's running GT's on stock 2.8 valvetrain? Just curious, do you have any links?

I'll find u the links, but a couple people posted dynos of cars running stock 2.8L valvetrain and smaller GT turbos (not 2871) over the past year. They received a lot of flak.


It's a really interesting approach you're taking here, super budget in some parts, yet super extravagant in others. You bought the most expensive suspension made for our car, a power steering cooler, bigger TB, 2.8 heads, 044 pump for KO4's, but you're running replica turbos and stock valvetrain. Not knocking it, and though it's not what I would do, it's an interesting approach. Good luck! I'm dying to get back out on the track!

It is definitely an interesting approach. As you can see from my sig, I am all about finding the best deal possible. But that doesn't mean I will be getting the cheapest quality item... If I can get Ohlins Motorsports for an insane deal, whether it still costs thousands of dollars or not, I am going to jump on it.

The reality of the heads, is that I am not going to swap over 2.7 valves and stuff. I don't think it is worth it, and I want to prove you can run stock 2.8L valves without them blowing apart or bending. So the only other choice, would be ti retainers, springs, etc. It would cost me probably about $2500 to build the heads with machine work. And then, honestly, without some big equal length exhaust manifolds and RS4 intake manifold, etc, I don't think its going to make much more power, aside from being able to rev higher. Then you need a precision balanced flywheel, and you need this, and you need that...

I also want to lay the foundation for the future of the car. I don't plan on running the RP K04's for more then a year or two. I do one or two engine pulls a month, so having to pull mine again is not a big deal. When I am ready, I can pull the engine, throw in rods, build the heads, and strap some GT2560 onto there. Everything else will be ready to support it.

The other thing to remember, is that a lot of my mods are just kind of like "why not...". With the 2.8L heads, I wanted to inspect my 2.7 heads and I wanted to replace my head gaskets, so I figured, why not throw some 2.8L heads on there and see if we can't prove there are gains to be had. I love being part of research and development, and I'd love to be part of proving that big port heads make a difference... or proving that they are a waste of money. With the Ohlins suspension, I'd been through a few coilover sets already, and I needed to get my Tracksports rebuilt, so I figured, why not drop a bit extra and get a suspension setup that will never ever need to be replaced.

In reality, I am actually 100% satisfied with the power output of my car right now. Over 300whp is plenty for me, especially on the track where its never the power that is lacking; its braking and handling and aerodynamics. However, I am sick of throwing K03's in and worrying about them, hence why I decided to upgrade.

Raacerx
04-23-2010, 11:14 AM
Also, big thanks to Laszlo and 034 Motorsport. Really helping me make this dream a reality. Only weeks away from getting tuned!!!!!

splatt
04-24-2010, 11:42 PM
Any more progress, or are you still waiting on the head bolt tool?

DiscoPotato
04-24-2010, 11:48 PM
Im a big fan of this setup cant wait to see the results.

jibberjive
04-25-2010, 12:10 PM
No difference, I have just heard over the years that AHA were more ideal, although they look the exact same to me. Just need to plug SAI port and heads are good to go. I am running normal 2.8L compression headgaskets, RS4 transition phenolic spacers, and ported exhaust manifolds in order to help the transition of the big ports to small ports.


Yeah, I had both a set of AHA and ATQ's at the same time. They are completely interchangable. I just thought you were implying that they're different since you explicitly stated you have AHA, not ATQ's. Good luck with the stock valves, and keep the forums informed!

Raacerx
04-26-2010, 06:59 PM
Yeah, I had both a set of AHA and ATQ's at the same time. They are completely interchangable. I just thought you were implying that they're different since you explicitly stated you have AHA, not ATQ's. Good luck with the stock valves, and keep the forums informed!

Yeah I originally was under the impression they were different until a few months ago. I will certainly be the first to admit my mistake if I bend a valve. However, its so much easier to justify to myself and the girlfriend that I need rods when I've got another excuse to pull the engine! Not that I want it to happen. I'd like these RP to put down 1 or 2 good seasons of track time.


Im a big fan of this setup cant wait to see the results.

Thanks Disco! Good luck with your build as well. It seems in not too long, the majority of S4 on here will be Stage 3!!!


Any more progress, or are you still waiting on the head bolt tool?

None!!!!! In fact, I've actually been moving backwards, since Mike (washyourrhands) has cannibalized my oil cooler and oil pressure sender and I think some other stuff too. But the SnapOn guy will finally be around tomorrow morning, so ($30) I will get the prodrive tool and be able to swap heads. Midterms are this Wednesday for me. So after that, I will be able to relax. Let's plan on doing your CA on Thursday. I should be more relaxed by then.

Plan is to have the car up and running and breaking in the clutch on Sunday.

QUESTION:

So, I've got some ideas on how to do it and such, but if someone would be so kind as to clarify for me, how do i get the timing right on my new heads? For the camshaft where the cam gear bolts on, do the tabs that the camlock bar fit into, fit only one way onto the camshaft? Or are they infinitely adjustable like the cam sprocket? If I remember, when I removed my cam sprockets, the tab that holds the gear on there only goes on one way? So therefore, as long as I use a camlock bar, I can get my engine to TDC right?

Big hole goes on inside right? Small hole on out? All of my exhaust valves look closed except for 2. This sound right? Done like 15 timing belts now, but never started without a timing reference.

Raacerx
04-29-2010, 08:50 PM
Was just waiting for this, in order to do my heads. $100, hell yeah for Craigslist.

http://fototime.com/%7B2CB3B5B5-D8D4-4993-B607-66A33F6A063A%7D/origpict/IMG_1167.jpg

infinkc
04-29-2010, 09:09 PM
Was just waiting for this, in order to do my heads. $100, hell yeah for Craigslist.

http://fototime.com/%7B2CB3B5B5-D8D4-4993-B607-66A33F6A063A%7D/origpict/IMG_1167.jpg

nice, is that a 1/2" one seems short.

Raacerx
04-29-2010, 09:30 PM
3/8". I wanted something that would go down to 30, and I've always been told to get a wrench that is atleast 10 ft/lb below the lowest setting you will use. This one is 20-100. I really don't need a torque wrench for things over 100 ft/lb. The majority of stuff that I need one for is in between 30 and 80, so this seemed perfect. I was literally talking to the SnapOn guy 2 days ago when i got my prodrive E14 Torx headbolt tool. He wanted $300 for the exact same one, I talked him down to $250. And this one has been used a handful of times, always zeroed, etc.

In the future, I'd like to get a 1/2" that goes to 200, but honestly, I've never had anything come undone or fail on me from over or under tightening. I've actually tested my own torque accuracy (just my hands), and I can easily get within 10 ft/lbs if I have an idea of what it should be like.

bigern45
04-29-2010, 10:14 PM
Was just waiting for this, in order to do my heads. $100, hell yeah for Craigslist.

http://fototime.com/%7B2CB3B5B5-D8D4-4993-B607-66A33F6A063A%7D/origpict/IMG_1167.jpg

thats my torque wrench.. .. well. . not my exact one.. but i have one just like it and it works great for this and many other engine build/intake manifold applications!!! i hit my DTS with it everytime i have the car in the air!!

gearhead1186
04-29-2010, 10:36 PM
QUESTION:

So, I've got some ideas on how to do it and such, but if someone would be so kind as to clarify for me, how do i get the timing right on my new heads? For the camshaft where the cam gear bolts on, do the tabs that the camlock bar fit into, fit only one way onto the camshaft? Or are they infinitely adjustable like the cam sprocket? If I remember, when I removed my cam sprockets, the tab that holds the gear on there only goes on one way? So therefore, as long as I use a camlock bar, I can get my engine to TDC right?

Big hole goes on inside right? Small hole on out? All of my exhaust valves look closed except for 2. This sound right? Done like 15 timing belts now, but never started without a timing reference.

The cam gears will only fit on the cams one way. You want the big holes facing inwards. This is the only way the cam lock bar will fit. Pull the cover on the drivers side of the block for the crank lock pin. If you dont have a lock pin, you might b able to squeeze ur pinkie finger in there to make sure the hole in the crank is centered.. you shuld be good to go.

if your heads are still off, try to get the crank close to TDC b4 you throw your heads on. this way you dont run the risk of knocking the pistons into the valves while spinning the crank around. remember, depending on the state of your cams, some valves will be open. did that make sense?

PS. move this baby into the build section!!

Raacerx
04-30-2010, 02:34 PM
PS. move this baby into the build section!!

Thanks gearhead. I just spaced since I didn't have my cam gears in front of me. Muchas gracias.


I picked up everything I finally needed, minus a few oil cooler parts I lent out, which will be here Monday, along with the Bosch 044 pump. Going to be out of town for most of the weekend, unfortunately, so hopefully get as much done as I can.

Today, got the 1/4"-18 NPT thread tap, along with 2 flush pipe plugs. Got my new OEM headbolts, $72 thanks to Folks Cafe in Santa Cruz. Dealership wanted $150, I laughed. Everything set to go.

Raacerx
05-03-2010, 09:35 PM
Well, 2 bent intake valves (not sure how it happened, well leave it at that), so I guess it is time to learn how to swap valves. I guess the bright side is that I will have my 2.7 valves and won't have to worry about bending any 2 piece. However, I was looking forward to trying out the stock 2.8L valves, cause I think they are just fine. But... whatever. Local shop has the c-clamp tool to borrow. Valve seals here tomorrow.

Raacerx
05-07-2010, 06:01 PM
Well, since I am having to swap valves here, I decided since I am in there, I would get valve springs as well. Looks like I will end up going with a set of the Rosten. Price can't be beaten, and I am not revving past 8500 (AHAHAH!) so I don't need the CAT Gold. Stock retainers and guides and everything. Should be good to take the big port heads to 8000 if I ever want to; primarily for the future, but I am very interested to see how much power the little K04 can flow through those big heads at that RPM. I think its worth it.

Just cause the K04 are out of their efficiency, doesn't mean they don't make power at 7000+ rpm. They just can't be as efficient about it.

http://www.rosten-performance.com/images/springs/vw_audi_6cyl.jpg

*Blue-Angel*
05-07-2010, 06:21 PM
Yeah they will just blow a bunch of hot air into your engine.

Raacerx
05-08-2010, 01:00 PM
I am not going to be running 24psi up there. 18 or 20psi @ 8000rpm, is faster then not being able to rev past 7k. meth and FMIC will keep things cool enough. My IAT temps don't get above 10-15 degrees ambient with stock intercoolers and pushing my little K03 way past their map to 7k. 500 extra rpm, whether its 18psi or 24psi, is better then nothing.

Besides, I am only doing the springs for the future, since I am swapping valves. I don't actually have plans to rev that high, but an extra 1k of rpm... thats a lot of pull on someone. But data will prove whats really up.

Blue Angel, you saying that if we for instance had equivalent cars, like exact cars, except that I had valve springs that allowed me to rev to say 7800rpm, and you could only rev to 7200rpm, that your car would beat me in couple gear pull because I'd only be pushing hot air?

Raacerx
05-12-2010, 06:31 PM
http://fototime.com/%7B9C58E7E4-ABAD-4328-8740-DF88F0B731EC%7D/origpict/IMG_1214A.JPG

http://fototime.com/%7B0B6B99F8-4CAE-4936-943C-F20100937777%7D/origpict/IMG_1215.jpg

http://fototime.com/%7B6ABE9F72-BF87-407D-8BD9-5EF01C20C95B%7D/origpict/IMG_1216.jpg

SAI port plugged
http://fototime.com/%7B7E4A56D6-CCAD-4800-85B6-562E4A63A2F1%7D/origpict/IMG_1217.jpg

http://fototime.com/%7B4F4BD453-CA21-42E3-828B-2E080CBF510B%7D/origpict/IMG_1218.jpg

http://fototime.com/%7BC69CD135-AC1A-4BF0-8926-C36E14E4CCD3%7D/origpict/IMG_1219.jpg

Rosten Valve Springs
http://fototime.com/%7BB78D546B-12E2-4C7B-9DF0-61BD71540A0C%7D/origpict/IMG_1224.jpg

gearhead1186
05-12-2010, 06:38 PM
nice.. take a close up of the number of links between your cams.. just curious how your look.

Raacerx
05-12-2010, 07:06 PM
nice.. take a close up of the number of links between your cams.. just curious how your look.

I'll upload another one later tonight from my phone gearhead. I counted 15-16 where they sit right now on both. I've got a bunch of marks on the back of the cam cog with the chain, etc. I feel pretty confident I can get everything back together good. I've really marked the crap out of everything, just cant see in the pics. I feel much more confident I can finish this project by Sunday if I can just get ahold of this tool in time. Summit usually only takes 1-2 days max.

http://fototime.com/%7BC5C73FF8-5A63-4B64-8B22-50AAB815240C%7D/origpict/IMG_1225.jpg

mmmmmm... methanol
http://www.fototime.com/%7B6ADD7F95-F76B-4890-82BB-0120477A2A82%7D/origpict/IMG_1226.jpg

First coat
http://fototime.com/%7B25DB1918-47D0-4506-BD29-E5F3F732DACE%7D/origpict/IMG_1227.jpg

http://fototime.com/%7B19B37C98-D00A-4414-9B98-6FE245F79084%7D/origpict/IMG_1228.jpg

Raacerx
05-12-2010, 07:18 PM
Also, has anyone determined if there is much advantage to polishing and porting the entrances of the intake manifold? I just wonder how much I should go to town. I've enlarged (length wise primarily) the ports on the cylinder head side of the manifold, but man... it would be nice to get the whole thing cleaned up. I had no idea it was so rough in there from the sand cast or whatever.

Raacerx
05-13-2010, 03:24 PM
Got everything removed, what a PITA. Thanks gearhead for that Summit link. I got the tool and it was still a pain, but drastically easier then before.

Heads are at the machine shop now, I said screw it and they are getting a minor/medium valve job so everything seals up real nice and then a slight decking. Just keeps adding up, but this way, I feel the heads are good for some high powered turbo setups. The valves are all getting cleaned, new valve seals, guides will be all nice, the Rosten springs... I get them back monday. Everything else will be ready and on Tuesday, finally finally finally, I will get this thing back together, break in the clutch, and get it tuned!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

will175
05-13-2010, 04:13 PM
Looking good bro. Glad you got motivated.

Raacerx
05-14-2010, 01:28 PM
Looking good bro. Glad you got motivated.

I need to make Wustefest!!! Just found out my only final is on Thursday the the 10th so that gives me plenty of time to study! Vegas here I come! Come out Will! Show me the town! Keep me updated on what you do with the car. You already know what I think you should do!

Couple other things last night. New oil lines and JHM solid shifter linkage and delrin bushing upgrade. Needless to say, I needed to replace this stuff badly. I cannot WAIT to feel the shifting. I am not doing the JHM solid shifter; that will have to wait and honestly, its a bit notchy and knocky for me. I'm sure I just need to get used to it. Also, word to the wise, don't try to trim your shifter linkage rod after a few beers... You might end up cutting about half the wrong side of the rod off. Good work, Raacerx... [headbang]

http://www.fototime.com/%7B1ACCB670-AD66-43CD-A060-627D188242CD%7D/origpict/IMG_1233.jpg

Time for replacement?
http://www.fototime.com/%7B5364A9F3-D9F5-487D-BECE-B4A70E766699%7D/origpict/IMG_1236.jpg

Trimmed [Thanks Calif_Kid for pointing out I needed to trim! That would have been frustrating!]
http://www.fototime.com/%7B8BEE0D07-DA7C-4ED3-AF2E-1146327C368E%7D/origpict/IMG_1237.jpg

Test fit
http://www.fototime.com/%7B25EE0079-5DE6-4C22-B0CA-BF9D849B72D5%7D/origpict/IMG_1238.jpg

Spooled1.8
05-14-2010, 01:54 PM
Man I wish I had the guts to just tear apart my car and have at it. [up] [up] for you.

gearhead1186
05-14-2010, 02:27 PM
[up]

Raacerx
05-17-2010, 02:21 PM
Well... I give up. I just found out that my 2.8L heads that I've now spent over $1000 rebuilding... are 100% unusable. They are destroyed. Waiting to hear back from the previous owner......

Now I don't have enough cash to get my old heads working well again either, since I have so much invested into these.

So... if anyone wants some Rosten valve springs, let me know. I am about ready to sell my Stage 3 shit and just get the car running again, since I am now in debt. This was BS I did not want to deal with.

Mooseimage
05-17-2010, 02:24 PM
That sucks Max. I hope you don't go selling your stage 3 stuff.

VR6Bomber
05-17-2010, 02:29 PM
yikes..
?

gearhead1186
05-17-2010, 02:31 PM
why are they unusable? destroyed?

Matt Danger
05-17-2010, 02:46 PM
What happened with the heads?

Raacerx
05-17-2010, 02:58 PM
Apparently they were oil starved for a long time. I had one of them initially checked out by the shop to see if they leaked, and it did, but it wasn't until we removed the cams and went to rebuild it and do a valve job that they discovered the huge play in the heads where the cams sit and saw all the uneven and bad wear patterns. One head had an oil port blocked, and the cam just ran completely dry and took a huge amount of material off. The other one suffered a similar fate, but they said is "potentially repairable", but it will be very costly and they are unsure of the outcome. They said I'd be stupid to repair and build it considering the boost and the plans for the car. They also said there was no way the heads came from the same car.

This is a real good machine shop, and I trust them over anyone else. Since I was told they were in perfectly good working order by the previous owner, with low mileage, I made the grave grave grave grave mistake of assuming this was true. Last time I will ever make that mistake again. I haven't heard back from the previous owner, but I am going to give him the benefit of the doubt that he will make things right and that he did not know this was up.

Either way, whether the previous owner properly reimburses me or not, I am out over $500 in parts and labor that cannot be refunded. There were also bent valves. My only hopes are to get reimbursed, sell my valve springs, and rebuild my old heads or find a pair of working heads that someone will give me for cheap.

infinkc
05-17-2010, 03:57 PM
:( that sux. hopefully someone has another set cheap.

pohsib
05-17-2010, 04:00 PM
Apparently they were oil starved for a long time. I had one of them initially checked out by the shop to see if they leaked, and it did, but it wasn't until we removed the cams and went to rebuild it and do a valve job that they discovered the huge play in the heads where the cams sit and saw all the uneven and bad wear patterns. One head had an oil port blocked, and the cam just ran completely dry and took a huge amount of material off. The other one suffered a similar fate, but they said is "potentially repairable", but it will be very costly and they are unsure of the outcome. They said I'd be stupid to repair and build it considering the boost and the plans for the car. They also said there was no way the heads came from the same car.

This is a real good machine shop, and I trust them over anyone else. Since I was told they were in perfectly good working order by the previous owner, with low mileage, I made the grave grave grave grave mistake of assuming this was true. Last time I will ever make that mistake again. I haven't heard back from the previous owner, but I am going to give him the benefit of the doubt that he will make things right and that he did not know this was up.

Either way, whether the previous owner properly reimburses me or not, I am out over $500 in parts and labor that cannot be refunded. There were also bent valves. My only hopes are to get reimbursed, sell my valve springs, and rebuild my old heads or find a pair of working heads that someone will give me for cheap.

I have a driver's side head from a 03 allroad BEL engine that you are welcome to. Its just sitting in my storage taking space. Email me at pohsib at hotmail.com if you want some pictures.

washyourrhands
05-17-2010, 04:03 PM
call some wrecking yards max....thats where i got minee

Raacerx
05-17-2010, 06:30 PM
call some wrecking yards max....thats where i got minee

Yeah. I could have bought a pair of 2.8L heads in far better condition for under $200. I could have got some for free that were still good to use but needed a rebuild. I just thought it would be better to get some that were supposedly in great condition and had under 60k miles, which is why I spent over $500 on them from an Audizine member.

The problem is... I don't have money to go buy a whole other set of used heads that might be screwed, have them checked out by the machine shop, etc. Thats another $300 minimum when everything is checked and decked. I was already stretching myself with these 2.8L heads and high rate valve springs and doing a full valve job. Thank GOD they found out the heads were screwed before I owed them an additional few hundred for the complete machine and valve jobs.

If someone buys my Rosten valve springs, then I'll have enough to get some used heads or get mine rebuilt, otherwise I am a fish out of water and I am not going anywhere anytime soon. Certainly not making Wustefest or going to Vegas.

*Blue-Angel*
05-17-2010, 06:35 PM
Thats depressing. Sorry to hear you and your car are in the dumps. Glad it wasnt any worse than it is right now tho....if thats possible.

dannyn424
05-17-2010, 06:45 PM
Thats depressing. Sorry to hear you and your car are in the dumps. Glad it wasnt any worse than it is right now tho....if thats possible.

hmmm that sux man...... i wonder what the hemi tbb is like...... I wonder how it will feel with stock heads.......... ......... might try and p and p my iM too for some more topend... thats my plan anyway...

will175
05-17-2010, 07:02 PM
Max will $300 help you get this together. Let me know bro!

Sales@RAI
05-17-2010, 07:08 PM
I actually noticed this

http://fototime.com/%7B0B6B99F8-4CAE-4936-943C-F20100937777%7D/origpict/IMG_1215.jpg

in the pic. That wear did not look right

Raacerx
05-17-2010, 07:29 PM
Thats depressing. Sorry to hear you and your car are in the dumps. Glad it wasnt any worse than it is right now tho....if thats possible.

Haha, while it seems to be about the worst thing that could happen, I imagine there could be worse things. It just is happening at the worst time, with the worst part possible right now. I've had everything necessary for the Stage 3 swap for months, just been waiting to have enough $$$ to build the heads.


hmmm that sux man...... i wonder what the hemi tbb is like...... I wonder how it will feel with stock heads.......... ......... might try and p and p my iM too for some more topend... thats my plan anyway...

I certainly will not be doing the Hemi TBB or RS4 manifold if I don't have the big port heads. defeats the purpose entirely IMO. Looks I am going to need to sell my 3" downpipes and 4" exhaust. Can't think of anything else that I can't replace with relatively little effort in the future.


I actually noticed this

in the pic. That wear did not look right

Yeah Clint. The more and more I look, the more indications I see that things were just f*cked. Part of not seeing it was my desire to make it work, and limit the hassle for both me and the seller if I had to return them (since we are not local), cause I really wanted to make them work and i really believed that they weren't screwed up and that they just had a little oil leak. But there were major problems from the very start, but I just wanted everything to be as easy for both of us. I also just didn't know enough about the subject to immediately be like "something is wrong here". However, once I found the bent valves, I should have just freaked out then and returned them immediately and gotten as far away from them as I could. I didn't cause I just assumed everything would be ok, and I sucked up the cost and hassle of the bent valves.

washyourrhands
05-17-2010, 08:21 PM
ill have my apr exhaust for sale soon

and i have a cam chain tensioner i can sell you cheap if you need one

*Blue-Angel*
05-17-2010, 08:32 PM
Yeah Clint. The more and more I look, the more indications I see that things were just f*cked. Part of not seeing it was my desire to make it work, and limit the hassle for both me and the seller if I had to return them (since we are not local), cause I really wanted to make them work and i really believed that they weren't screwed up and that they just had a little oil leak. But there were major problems from the very start, but I just wanted everything to be as easy for both of us. I also just didn't know enough about the subject to immediately be like "something is wrong here". However, once I found the bent valves, I should have just freaked out then and returned them immediately and gotten as far away from them as I could. I didn't cause I just assumed everything would be ok, and I sucked up the cost and hassle of the bent valves.

:(

Raacerx
05-18-2010, 10:44 AM
Well had my first bit of semi-encouraging news, the previous owner of the heads is being great, and he is willing to take back them back. I'm still out a ton of money, but I will take a deep breath and try to remain optimistic and be thankful there are still some good AZ members around. I am going to look for another set of 2.8L heads, and try to get this project finished.


in the mean time...

BUY MY EXHAUST!!!
034Motorsport 3" downpipes and custom 4" exhaust, $1200. Bolt on, ready to go, nicest flex pipes, V-banded. Help me pay for my new heads!

infinkc
05-18-2010, 10:50 AM
man hate for you to sell your exhaust to fund some heads, i can loan you some $ if you need.

veggiemonster
05-18-2010, 10:59 AM
man hate for you to sell your exhaust to fund some heads, i can loan you some $ if you need.

+50 imaginarium rep points for this

97B518TQM
05-18-2010, 11:29 AM
Max, if you think you will have the money next month I can also lend you up to $1k to get you through until the next month comes. This way you won't have to sell your exhaust or anything else just so you can get your car running earlier.

AsianA408
05-18-2010, 11:30 AM
damn, i guess i owe you a favor too for the coilpacks. let me know if you need scrilla also.

Raacerx
05-18-2010, 11:44 AM
Wow. Thanks a lot guys. Thats really awesome actually, and it reminds me that AZ Norcal is still a tight knit group. Thank you so much for the offers. I am going to try my absolute hardest to do this without borrowing any more money, as it is embarrassing enough to be at this point and this low on cash. Although it does feel retarded to just sell my exhaust and get a new one a month later... But I'd rather have a pimped Stage 3 on SSAC exhaust, then a non-working Stage 3 with a sick ass exhaust!

Thanks for all the supportive words, and the great Audizine members who have been willing to help in all sorts of ways. I am hoping I can source a set of 2.8L heads very soon, get everything swapped like I originally wanted, and get this show on the road.



And special thanks to Will175 here on AZ... you da man homie. Will is the most generous person I have ever met, despite the fact that we have yet to meet eachother in person. Thanks again dude, you are a good friend.

will175
05-18-2010, 03:05 PM
Max, thanks for those kinds words bro. I told you that I got ya. :-) I wish I could be up there to help you with the work too, but work needs me here for now. Shit we spent so many hours/days rappin out on cars and a bunch of other stuff. I have a lot of respect for you bro for everything you have been through and still stay positive (not talking bout the S). You are also a good friend bro. Wish you the best with the completion on the build. Pizza Hut gets expensive,lol.

Raacerx
05-31-2010, 05:16 PM
Just thought I'd throw out an update on this disaster. Sold my carbon hood and oil kit. Have enough money to get another pair of heads. Project is going forward, but in the middle of finals and Wustefest (Vegas) is next week. Going on the straight credit card, but already booked hotel so can't cancel! Screw it! Debt; its the American Way.

Hopefully the previous owner of the heads recovers soon and can begin to help me out with some of these costs so that I can get my car working again. Once I have some of that, I will be able to get the valve jobs and swap everything and get the car back together (untuned but better then nothing).

Major withdrawal!!!


EDIT. We are in business now! Got a partial refund (thank you dude for keeping to your word!), hoping to salvage one head, minimize money lost between both parties. A passenger replacement head will be here on Monday of next week. Once finals are done on the 10th, bang this bad boy back together.

BlkdoutS4
05-31-2010, 09:21 PM
nice dude! stoked to get this thing back on the road!

splatt
06-08-2010, 08:16 PM
Have you gotten your head situation sorted yet? My grad rehearsal is on Friday morning, I have to bail immediately after but might be able to pop my head in for a few minutes before to see how things are progressing.

Raacerx
06-25-2010, 10:23 PM
Just the biggest disaster yet hahaha. I am in absolutely no way closer to my goal of the car running. Abandoning the 2.8L heads. Just too difficult, and its just one bad thing after another with each set of heads I get.

So... For the umpteenth time, I am changing my plan. Since I have one ok condition 2.8L cam, I found another 2.8L cam. I will put these in my 2.7 heads, with high rate valve springs, and get the heads ported to match my already ported/partially polished intake manifold (need to enlarge the intake ports about 1/8"). I will enlarge the exhaust ports ever so slightly to maximize the transition between the ported exhaust manifolds and the heads.

As far as what turbos... you guys will just have to find out when its finally done.

will175
06-25-2010, 10:27 PM
Hope you get that baby running soon bro. It has been down wayyy to long and I know its a huge inconvenience for you. Wish you the best homie.

gearhead1186
06-25-2010, 10:29 PM
sounds like a good plan. keep plowing forward!!

Raacerx
07-24-2010, 10:02 AM
Well this project is officially cursed... Had to cancel my Tial order yesterday after waiting over a month and then being told it will be 1-2 more months (so probably more). Another month of waiting, wasted. For nothing. Time to cancel my insurance and accept this car will not be working anytime soon.

Looks like K03 are going back in. I don't want to get K04 and spend all that time tuning it, when its not what I want.

We will see, maybe something will pop up or happen. Have the 2.8 heads at least, but they are still a ways away from being done.

_________

I did however grab even more chassis parts that I am very happy about. Special thanks to the person who hooked me up with these.

H-sport rear swaybar
CPP adjustable heim swaybar endlinks
034Motorsport Billet Diff Cross Member / Track bushings
OEM RS4 oil cooler (stoked)
Kosei K1-TS 17" track wheels with Nitto NT01 R-compounds (still can see groove)

gearhead1186
07-24-2010, 12:04 PM
ive been hearing the same thing about tials... tough to get your hands on them now.

Raacerx
07-24-2010, 01:14 PM
ive been hearing the same thing about tials... tough to get your hands on them now.

Their general attitude isn't something that inspires confidence either... Disappointed, but I guess I won't put K03 back in. Being dramatic. Ill just have to get yet another set of K04 and suck it up and go Stage 3. Not that I won't be happy or excited with a 400whp+ built head Stage 3... I just really like doing things that are different, not the norm, and try to do everything once and for all (atleast until I build the engine in 1-2 years).

Right now its either K04 or GT28R's, or back to K03 for a third time until I can build the engine and say "phuckitall"

97B518TQM
07-24-2010, 01:37 PM
Ah damn, Max, that sucks big time. I was expecting an update from you saying that your car is back on the road. Sucks that you sold your K04s too but CTS has them now in stock so you can get another pair. Do the stage 3, you might actually like it and be happy with the power. You can always upgrade later on. By the way, there is a pair of Tial 650s in the classifieds for $3400 just in case you haven't seen them.

safab
07-24-2010, 03:27 PM
Are ATP Eliminators available? That would be a good option at a much cheaper price.

Raacerx
07-25-2010, 12:11 PM
Are ATP Eliminators available? That would be a good option at a much cheaper price.

Cheaper? Not sure where you are getting that info... Eliminators retail for $4000, and don't include inlet pipes like the Tial's. They usually take 2-3 weeks to make the turbos also. Plus, they don't have billet wheels. But that may end up being an option. I don't know. Right now I am waiting to see if the 4th set of heads that I got are going to even work

Not interested in the Tial 650's. There is a reason they moved to the 605 and the 770. Plus $3400 is retail price on the 605 kit. I'd rather throw in K04's then get an outdated Tial kit that isn't supported anymore.

Also Jay, its not that I wouldn't be happy with 400whp on K04's... It's really more the principle now; all this work, all this time, all this head bullshit, and then just go K04? I'm sick of pulling the engine and I want a setup and I can rally on for a year before I build another engine up. If you've ever seen any of my other vehicles, you'll know I like to do it once and do it right. And when I cant do it once and do it right, I want to at least lay the groundwork for the future.

I am back to square one, for the umpteenth time. Now it sounds like 1.5 months to get the headwork done, so I am trying to find another guy for that too since I am not going to drop $1k in labor and wait 45 days or more. So might just have to throw some stock heads on and build the heads on the side, in which case, there isn't any point in really do GT's. No idea what to do, besides burn the car for insurance money...

FML


Here are the new wheels
http://fototime.com/%7BDDE7B5BB-3479-4AA4-9A70-79253A09A101%7D/origpict/IMG_1506.JPG

Diff Crossmember
http://fototime.com/%7B3C234BE7-D730-4163-B9A1-05BDF2C0D5E8%7D/origpict/SAM_0018.JPG

safab
07-26-2010, 02:59 AM
http://www.aptuning.net/Audi_2_7T_Twin_Turbo_Eliminator_GT287_p/atp-vvw-224.htm
http://www.aptuning.net/Audi_2_7T_Twin_Turbo_Eliminator_GT28R_p/atp-vvw-222.htm

Not sure though but according to their website they have them listed @ $3350. What the hell...considering what you've been through, i'll happily weld you a set of inlet pipes if you paid for the cost of materials.

P.S: I've got a set of 2.7T stock heads sitting around as well as a set of 2.7t heads w/ upgraded springs+valves that I might be moving. LMK.

Raacerx
07-26-2010, 09:13 AM
http://www.aptuning.net/Audi_2_7T_Twin_Turbo_Eliminator_GT287_p/atp-vvw-224.htm
http://www.aptuning.net/Audi_2_7T_Twin_Turbo_Eliminator_GT28R_p/atp-vvw-222.htm

Not sure though but according to their website they have them listed @ $3350. What the hell...considering what you've been through, i'll happily weld you a set of inlet pipes if you paid for the cost of materials.

P.S: I've got a set of 2.7T stock heads sitting around as well as a set of 2.7t heads w/ upgraded springs+valves that I might be moving. LMK.

Yeah aptuning is just whoring them for pretty much wholesale. I obviously wouldn't be paying retail, but wholesale is barely below what they are selling for online. So its still over $500 more over Tial 605's. I've got inlet pipes but they are K04 and it would be nice to weld up some large one piece. The actually welding isn't an issue; I weld and of course we've got welders at work. Its mainly the work involved with getting them to fit nicely in that tight area.

As far as the heads... I actually would maybe be interested in one of those pairs. I've got blank 2.7 heads that maybe I could trade to you, or I've got 3 good 2.8L heads. At this point though, I just want to get the car running. PM me what kind of price you would be willing to do, and maybe we can work a partial or possible trade.

thanks safab

PS. The thought has occurred to me once more to just throw the 2.8L cams into my 2.7 heads and call it a day... However, since I've already pulled all the valves out, I still need a valve angle job so I feel that if I am going to drop money into something, it might as well be the big ports.

Smitherines
07-26-2010, 08:52 PM
Yeah aptuning is just whoring them for pretty much wholesale. I obviously wouldn't be paying retail, but wholesale is barely below what they are selling for online. So its still over $500 more over Tial 605's. I've got inlet pipes but they are K04 and it would be nice to weld up some large one piece. The actually welding isn't an issue; I weld and of course we've got welders at work. Its mainly the work involved with getting them to fit nicely in that tight area.

As far as the heads... I actually would maybe be interested in one of those pairs. I've got blank 2.7 heads that maybe I could trade to you, or I've got 3 good 2.8L heads. At this point though, I just want to get the car running. PM me what kind of price you would be willing to do, and maybe we can work a partial or possible trade.

thanks safab

PS. The thought has occurred to me once more to just throw the 2.8L cams into my 2.7 heads and call it a day... However, since I've already pulled all the valves out, I still need a valve angle job so I feel that if I am going to drop money into something, it might as well be the big ports.

Been lurking here awhile, and I decided to chime in, but...Honestly bro? You're this far into it, and you're rushing to and making all sacrafices for what, a meet? C'mon man, think about it, from one European enthusiast to another, just take your time and do it right, like you said, do it once, and do it right. That's how I roll as well. I spent a year turboing my E36 M3 Sedan. I know how it feels not to drive your baby. Just take your time bro, and it will all be worth it. If you cut any corners now, you'll regret them later, and there will be a ton "I wish I would have..." because thats how it always goes. I wasn't able to make it to BimmerFest and MFest one year, and it was worth the sacrafice, now that I know that I have 630whp at the press of a pedal, its more than worth it's weight in giggles and sloppy grins and "holy shit"s out of all the people I take for rides. Just take it easy my man and roll with the punches...Get a new set of 2.8L heads and get them done right like you originally intended to do, wait for your turbos, wait for the machine work, just chillax...keep us updated!

P.S. Expect me to be around in a few months with a B5 S4, currently looking for a nice Nogaro or White S4.

gearhead1186
07-26-2010, 08:55 PM
^ well said.

Raacerx
07-26-2010, 10:34 PM
Thanks for the words. I am not trying to make any car meet or anything like that; my daily driver is simply my one and only car. The need to get things working is because I need to get to work, not to make some event or trackday. I can't pay for any of this without my job, so if cutting corners is what allows me to keep my job, its going to have to happen. My girlfriend and friends have been great about lending me cars and such for the last 3+ months, but everyone is getting fed up with it by now so I need to get everything working. My roommates have also been great about me taking up the entire garage since April, but my lease ends next month. The car has to be running well before then for me to clean and get everything read for a move out.

The head situation will be figured out. If it will take too long and too much money to get the 2.8's running, then I'll get my 2.7 heads working again and throw the 2.8 cams in them. That is where the power is coming from anyways, and honestly, it might even be faster with the smaller ports. In the meantime, I can really clean up the 2.8s and slowly upgrade them, even though Im fully convinced now that building the heads is a lost cause.

The turbo situation should theoretically be taken care of in two weeks, but Im so sick of disappointment I don't really want to tell everyone what I ordered until it sits in front of me. Sick of paying for stuff, and ending up with false alarms. Needless to say, I am not doing K03 or K04 unless I am 2 weeks away from moving out and shit still isn't working. If for some reason I do end up with K04 turbos on there, you can guarantee I will have another engine built and ready to go within a couple months. However, I didn't want a built engine, so I am trying to avoid going that route.

It would have been different if I started a turbo M3 project; but this was supposed to just be a 2.8 head K04 car, nothing out of the ordinary. If I had just had some good heads to start with, i would have been tearing shit up for months now. But its been one string of badluck after another. Now that I have a new job and a long commute, I really need to kick things into high gear or I will just be bleeding money via a rental car. I would much rather throw some K03 on there and be able to drive my own car for a month, then spend $1000 on renting a car.

PS. Smitherines, good luck with the white... Nogaro seem to be more and more common now. Hope to see you around with a B5 soon. Its a strange obsession. I always enjoy (and hate) the challenge of converting a car into something its not originally meant for.

Raacerx
07-26-2010, 11:25 PM
Thought this was just good to post, hard to find comparison pics

http://fototime.com/%7B1BF3E185-DACD-4A1F-A8B1-A853E0DA00E3%7D/origpict/SAM_0029A.jpg

And some other bling

http://fototime.com/%7B5091614C-46D7-4777-890A-534539815108%7D/origpict/SAM_0030.JPG

Raacerx
07-31-2010, 05:37 PM
Heads are at the machine shop. Supertech inconel exhaust valves and a full rebuild/valve job/deck. Decided to stick with stock valve springs and use that money for the exhaust valves. New guides and seals all around. Should be back next week.

My turbos should be here in the next few weeks as well, and they aren't Tial 605 or K04 or K03.

For the first time in a bit, I am feeling somewhat optimistic.

AAAA
07-31-2010, 09:02 PM
Heads are at the machine shop. Supertech inconel exhaust valves and a full rebuild/valve job/deck. Decided to stick with stock valve springs and use that money for the exhaust valves. New guides and seals all around. Should be back next week.

My turbos should be here in the next few weeks as well, and they aren't Tial 605 or K04 or K03.

For the first time in a bit, I am feeling somewhat optimistic.

uh huh....can you at least hint who you bought them from to give us a clue??

Raacerx
07-31-2010, 10:50 PM
uh huh....can you at least hint who you bought them from to give us a clue??

lol. They are ball bearing; we'll leave it at that until they arrive at my feet!!!

*Blue-Angel*
08-01-2010, 05:05 AM
i vote 770

splatt
08-01-2010, 08:43 AM
lol. They are ball bearing; we'll leave it at that until they arrive at my feet!!!

Disco potato?

gearhead1186
08-01-2010, 09:12 AM
stock springs -> 2554s or 2560s.

Raacerx
08-01-2010, 12:19 PM
stock springs -> 2554s or 2560s.

yep. stock block and stock valve springs. Revving to 7500, mild/conservative tune. When I do rods in a year or so, I will throw in some springs and retainers for some peace of mind so I can periodically pull it to 8000.

Feel like the car may be coming together finally. Still going to expect it to take another 1.5 months to get things running... But finished installing a lot of random stuff such as swaybar, diff crossmember, brake ducts, Bosch 044, so I am literally just waiting for the heads and turbos.

Of course... now I am worried my VAST Stage 4 clutch wont be able to handle the new power...

Don Supreme
08-02-2010, 05:57 AM
Tial 650s...

gearhead1186
08-02-2010, 09:07 AM
Tial 650s...

he seemed pretty against those.. unless he changed his mind.

Tarmac
08-02-2010, 11:45 AM
he seemed pretty against those.. unless he changed his mind.

I assumed they discontinued the TiAL 650’s & now only run with the TiAL S605 & the TiAL R770

gearhead1186
08-02-2010, 12:02 PM
I assumed they discontinued the TiAL 650ís & now only run with the TiAL S605 & the TiAL R770

Yes sir

Anthony
08-02-2010, 04:20 PM
Hey 'Raacerx', you ready to move this bad-boy build thread to the Projects & Build subforum (http://www.audizine.com/forum/forumdisplay.php/161) yet? If so, PM myself or another Mod.

betet
08-02-2010, 04:22 PM
y Feel like the car may be coming together finally. Still going to expect it to take another 1.5 months to get things running.

Sweet dude!

Tarmac
08-02-2010, 04:52 PM
I know this is not a TiAL thread (just a quick one) someone told me the TiAL S605 is old technology with the old journal bearings & consequently outdated. You guys know if this is true or not? I noted 034 must have just put the TiAL S605 on there website.

gearhead1186
08-02-2010, 05:12 PM
I know this is not a TiAL thread (just a quick one) someone told me the TiAL S605 is old technology with the old journal bearings & consequently outdated. You guys know if this is true or not?

yea i remember somebody flamed on journal bearings for being outdated. it was a pretty ignorant statement. yes, it is an older and more simple technology but I feel if a turbo is run in its efficiency range, a turbo being ball bearing should not be a deciding factor. I remember reading somewhere that a import company's full frame journal turbos out spooled comparable BB competitors. this is obviously out of the norm but just goes to show you that journal bearings are not "outdated." its also a hell of a lot cheaper to rebuild a journal bearing turbo.

back on topic... can you give us any hints on ur turbo choice?

Raacerx
08-02-2010, 06:02 PM
yea i remember somebody flamed on journal bearings for being outdated. it was a pretty ignorant statement. yes, it is an older and more simple technology but I feel if a turbo is run in its efficiency range, a turbo being ball bearing should not be a deciding factor. I remember reading somewhere that a import company's full frame journal turbos out spooled comparable BB competitors. this is obviously out of the norm but just goes to show you that journal bearings are not "outdated." its also a hell of a lot cheaper to rebuild a journal bearing turbo.

back on topic... can you give us any hints on ur turbo choice?

I updated the 1st page of the thread with the turbos I will be running. I'm no good at keeping secrets.

As far as the whole Journal Vs. Ball Bearing, I agree with gearhead. The 605 is a journal bearing... but calling the 605 old technology is pretty ignorant indeed. It has billet wheels, far nicer oil/boost/coolant lines, and a high level of detail in the housing. I don't call that old technology, and they spool faster the a comparable GT turbo (but this is probably due to the wheels, not the CHRA).

Journal bearings are also easier to rebuild, and like gearhead said, as long as the turbo is run in its efficiency range and treated well, it should last just as long. You run a K04 @ 24psi, or an RS6 at 25+psi, and you will eventually have problems. The Tial 605 is designed to run to 30psi, so I don't think there is going to be any premature wear problems like the other associated journal bearing turbos.

People have been using journal bearings for years, without issues. Ball bearing theoretically offers smoother operation and a bit better reliability; I've yet to see it on a comparable turbo. Ball bearing to me isn't new technology; ceramic bearing is though, like that which Precision Turbo uses.

Remember... a K04 is designed to run between 8-16 psi depending on the particular model. An RS6 runs under 10psi under normal operating. A GT or Tial is designed to withstand much higher performance, regardless of what the CHRA is made from.

Tarmac
08-02-2010, 07:02 PM
Max, looking a your list of goodies I see you have the adjustable rear sway bar links.
I’ve been hunting around for ages. Can you point me to a supplier for the CPP adjustable sway bar links? I did a cut & past but no luck.
Cheers;-)

gearhead1186
08-02-2010, 07:03 PM
28R huh? nice. when u getting them? internal WGs with custom manifold or external WGs?

Raacerx
08-02-2010, 10:28 PM
28R huh? nice. when u getting them? internal WGs with custom manifold or external WGs?

2560 Eliminators, ported stock manifolds, internal WG. They'll be here in the next few weeks if things go well.


I got the CPP end links from a buddy. CPP is dead. Sorry.

gearhead1186
08-02-2010, 10:37 PM
2560 Eliminators, ported stock manifolds, internal WG. They'll be here in the next few weeks if things go well.


I got the CPP end links from a buddy. CPP is dead. Sorry.

nice congrats man. light at the end of the tunnel. ill be waiting for pics.

Raacerx
08-03-2010, 12:36 AM
nice congrats man. light at the end of the tunnel. ill be waiting for pics.

congratulate me when they are in my possession LOL!

97B518TQM
08-03-2010, 01:30 AM
I hope the turbo lag is not too bad, Max. One thing I hate is turbo lag, the reason I sold my A4 with the Gt2871R on it, I hated waiting for it to spool at 3600 rpm. It shouldn't be too bad with the GT25s though but it will be noticeable I bet.

GarbatyA4
08-03-2010, 06:25 AM
I hope the turbo lag is not too bad, Max. One thing I hate is turbo lag, the reason I sold my A4 with the Gt2871R on it, I hated waiting for it to spool at 3600 rpm. It shouldn't be too bad with the GT25s though but it will be noticeable I bet.

I had a GT2871R on my A4. I know what you mean. Sucks balls.

My buddy is doing the Agtronic GT2554's right now. I'll let you know the difference. aka. when the fun starts.

Smitherines
08-03-2010, 06:59 AM
2560 Eliminators, ported stock manifolds, internal WG. They'll be here in the next few weeks if things go well.


I got the CPP end links from a buddy. CPP is dead. Sorry.

Awesome bro, keep us updated on the progress. Keep your spirits up!

Smitherines
08-03-2010, 07:09 AM
2560 Eliminators, ported stock manifolds, internal WG. They'll be here in the next few weeks if things go well.


I got the CPP end links from a buddy. CPP is dead. Sorry.

Awesome bro, keep us updated on the progress. Keep your spirits up!

awd2ks4
08-06-2010, 01:51 PM
I hope the turbo lag is not too bad, Max. One thing I hate is turbo lag, the reason I sold my A4 with the Gt2871R on it, I hated waiting for it to spool at 3600 rpm. It shouldn't be too bad with the GT25s though but it will be noticeable I bet.

yeah you better watch out doing low 2k rpm pulls with ko3 cars lol

Tarmac
08-06-2010, 04:33 PM
2560 Eliminators, ported stock manifolds, internal WG. They'll be here in the next few weeks if things go well.


I got the CPP end links from a buddy. CPP is dead. Sorry.

Got in touch with your buddy for the CPP rear sway bar links, Cheers!!

At one point I was seriously looking at the Tial 605 Kit but now you got me think about the 2560r Eliminators........Interesting set up, will need to research about this lag everyone’s chatting on about and it's true they are a direct fit to stock exhaust manifold & 034 3"Dp's?

Raacerx
08-06-2010, 07:11 PM
Got in touch with your buddy for the CPP rear sway bar links, Cheers!!

At one point I was seriously looking at the Tial 605 Kit but now you got me think about the 2560r Eliminators........Interesting set up, will need to research about this lag everyone’s chatting on about and it's true they are a direct fit to stock exhaust manifold & 034 3"Dp's?

The only reason I went with the Eliminators is because I am not willing to wait months indefinitely for Tial to get their shit together. I'd rather have 605, as they spool faster and can flow more. It is a turbo designed specifically for maxing out a stock motor, and still having some left over for when you build it. The Eliminators are more expensive and the oil lines/hardware is not as nice.

I've just waited too long to let Tial dick me around. ATP ain't the fastest company either, but supposedly the turbos will be done next week. We will see.

Raacerx
08-06-2010, 08:52 PM
There is rumor that the turbos might be done early this coming week. Good god do I have my fingers crossed. This should coincide nicely with the heads finishing.

Picked up a JHM solid shifter this week, along with this...

http://fototime.com/%7BEAAC8787-4304-466E-8EEB-6297576EC63E%7D/origpict/SAM_0108A.jpg

Tarmac
08-07-2010, 06:29 AM
The only reason I went with the Eliminators is because I am not willing to wait months indefinitely for Tial to get their shit together. I'd rather have 605, as they spool faster and can flow more. It is a turbo designed specifically for maxing out a stock motor, and still having some left over for when you build it. The Eliminators are more expensive and the oil lines/hardware is not as nice.

I've just waited too long to let Tial dick me around. ATP ain't the fastest company either, but supposedly the turbos will be done next week. We will see.

What about EPL I suppose they have the TiAL 605 in stock, I think or maybe not?

awd2ks4
08-07-2010, 02:08 PM
Its pretty rare for someone to stock a turbo kit on the shelf for this car. Seems like they dont want the extra overhead in case it doesnt sell. Unless someone just ordered a kit and backed out last second and you luck out on it. Plus they are just getting it direct, thats why its always good to go to the source and cut out the middle man.

michael66899
08-07-2010, 02:28 PM
Looks good buddy where'd you get that carbon hood at? I'm going to pick one up in the next couple weeks as well and get it painted as theres a nice big dent in mine from the previous owner.

awd2ks4
08-07-2010, 03:22 PM
Looks good buddy where'd you get that carbon hood at? I'm going to pick one up in the next couple weeks as well and get it painted as theres a nice big dent in mine from the previous owner.

he got it from a friend i have the same hood also and i love it

Raacerx
08-07-2010, 04:20 PM
EPL doesn't have any Tial 605, just like no one else has any 605 in stock. 770's are ready to go.

Some pics from last weekend. H-sport rear sway, CPP end links, 034Motorsport Billet Diff Crossmember, Track Density bushings for the crossmember, and brake ducts. Forgot to take pics of Bosch 044 install.

http://fototime.com/%7BDF8EDE4E-30DD-4F36-BE31-DBB462430F20%7D/origpict/SAM_0116A.jpg

http://fototime.com/%7B245D93B0-5E77-43C4-9B29-31C0ABC8CE67%7D/origpict/SAM_0114A.jpg

Brake Ducts
http://fototime.com/%7BDDEB4952-50E0-4B73-A39A-DF123045DFED%7D/origpict/SAM_0117A.jpg

http://fototime.com/%7B368C8FA6-3828-4F4D-8C1D-3CB9A0CCB1D1%7D/origpict/SAM_0119.JPG

Tarmac
08-07-2010, 10:06 PM
I’ve got the same Brake Duct Plates from PMS. Appreciate if you can, will be interesting to see how you route the ducting hose, I haven’t had time to install mine yet.

Raacerx
08-11-2010, 06:08 PM
I’ve got the same Brake Duct Plates from PMS. Appreciate if you can, will be interesting to see how you route the ducting hose, I haven’t had time to install mine yet.

Easiest way I see if you keep the side mount intercoolers, is to modify an aluminum skidplate with airpickups.



Update: There is a slim possibility I will have everything (turbos and heads) ready to install this weekend. Fingers are freakin crossed, I can assure that! I have every little nut, bolt, gasket, etc and I am just itching to get everything back together.

97B518TQM
08-11-2010, 07:05 PM
Oh damn, Max. Even I am excited about this, I can only imagine your excitement. Don't forget to stock up on oil and other fluids before the weekend, they are hard to find on weekends, except the oil :)
I have prefred pricing for Amsoil oil for about $8 per quart for the 5w-40 European formula oil if you ever need some.

joe@vwvortex
08-11-2010, 07:19 PM
Easiest way I see if you keep the side mount intercoolers, is to modify an aluminum skidplate with airpickups.

I have the same brake duct plates and spent about an hour or so last week trying different hose routing. My plan would be to come in through the inside part of the wheel well - through the bottom part of the liner and then add a 2.5" diameter hose NACA duct on the bottom of the belly pan. I THINK that tire clearance on full lock won't be an issue and it results in a very short amount of hose ducting. That all being said - i'm open to other ideas as well.

awd2ks4
08-11-2010, 08:34 PM
You guys want the pickups on the bottom of the car? seems alot harder to do then run a duct to the lower grille area

joe@vwvortex
08-12-2010, 09:16 AM
You guys want the pickups on the bottom of the car? seems alot harder to do then run a duct to the lower grille area

If you can show me how it is possible with SMIC's - i'd do it in a heartbeat. There is no room at all to get the 2.5" hose through past the SMIC to the front grill area and I only have RS4 SMIC's. There are what I believe to be AC hoses and a canister below the bottom of and behind the SMIC on the passenger side. If they were removed you might have a shot. Might be able to get them through on the inside top of the SMIC closer to the radiator - but I would have had to remove my SMIC shroud to even try it, but from looking at it - it wasn't going to fit.

dla79
08-12-2010, 09:54 AM
EPL doesn't have any Tial 605, just like no one else has any 605 in stock. 770's are ready to go.

Some pics from last weekend. H-sport rear sway, CPP end links, 034Motorsport Billet Diff Crossmember, Track Density bushings for the crossmember, and brake ducts. Forgot to take pics of Bosch 044 install.

http://fototime.com/%7BDF8EDE4E-30DD-4F36-BE31-DBB462430F20%7D/origpict/SAM_0116A.jpg

http://fototime.com/%7B245D93B0-5E77-43C4-9B29-31C0ABC8CE67%7D/origpict/SAM_0114A.jpg

Brake Ducts
http://fototime.com/%7BDDEB4952-50E0-4B73-A39A-DF123045DFED%7D/origpict/SAM_0117A.jpg

http://fototime.com/%7B368C8FA6-3828-4F4D-8C1D-3CB9A0CCB1D1%7D/origpict/SAM_0119.JPG

Wouldn't this design just be better if you made it like a scoop that would grab air coming from those wheel well vents??? It seems like this is not really the best design and this is how I have seen them do it on race cars with a simple scoop...... Getting that hose through their will be a PITA with the SMICS as Joe said.

joe@vwvortex
08-12-2010, 10:07 AM
Wouldn't this design just be better if you made it like a scoop that would grab air coming from those wheel well vents??? It seems like this is not really the best design and this is how I have seen them do it on race cars with a simple scoop...... Getting that hose through their will be a PITA with the SMICS as Joe said.

You can retrofit the Phaeton or A8 brake cooling ducts which are just that, a big scoop. However - these types of ducts generally concentrate more colder air onto the brake disc and are more effective in cooling. This is why I wanted to give this a shot.

awd2ks4
08-12-2010, 12:43 PM
If you can show me how it is possible with SMIC's - i'd do it in a heartbeat. There is no room at all to get the 2.5" hose through past the SMIC to the front grill area and I only have RS4 SMIC's. There are what I believe to be AC hoses and a canister below the bottom of and behind the SMIC on the passenger side. If they were removed you might have a shot. Might be able to get them through on the inside top of the SMIC closer to the radiator - but I would have had to remove my SMIC shroud to even try it, but from looking at it - it wasn't going to fit.

HAHAHAHA guess im glad i went with my front mount

awd2ks4
08-12-2010, 12:46 PM
Wouldn't this design just be better if you made it like a scoop that would grab air coming from those wheel well vents??? It seems like this is not really the best design and this is how I have seen them do it on race cars with a simple scoop...... Getting that hose through their will be a PITA with the SMICS as Joe said.

Ive seen multiple race cars and thats how they do it too, over course others will do differently. But i think this design is great it will not only cool the rotor but it will also cool the caliper as well and the fluid in it. And if you have cross drilled rotors the air will be pushing through the vent holes on the rotor which will cool your brakes ALOT.

joe@vwvortex
08-12-2010, 02:04 PM
Ive seen multiple race cars and thats how they do it too, over course others will do differently. But i think this design is great it will not only cool the rotor but it will also cool the caliper as well and the fluid in it. And if you have cross drilled rotors the air will be pushing through the vent holes on the rotor which will cool your brakes ALOT.

Here's a couple pics of the Phaeton/A8 setup on an A6 - same as an S4. If I can't find a suitable routing for the hoses - I may just opt for this.

http://www.audiworld.com/tech/pics/wheel60_dsc_0670.jpg
http://www.audiworld.com/tech/pics/wheel60_13.jpg

Raacerx
08-12-2010, 10:50 PM
Wouldn't this design just be better if you made it like a scoop that would grab air coming from those wheel well vents??? It seems like this is not really the best design and this is how I have seen them do it on race cars with a simple scoop...... Getting that hose through their will be a PITA with the SMICS as Joe said.

You see vents like you describe primarily on open wheel cars... On normal GT class and below production body style cars, you see many many many many cars with hose fed systems. People often use (which was new info to me) brake duct cooler fans to help draw air onto the brakes even when speeds are low. What you describe is also more expensive. I am fully willing to modify an aluminum under-body pan in order to channel in air. I believe this will work far better then a simple air catch at the inside of the wheel. This setup cost me $75, and won't cost me anything to modify. If you look at the Stasis race car's and other B5 S4 Champion car, you see they take the air from the belly pan as well, except they can run a splitter which allows more space. This is just a modification of that principle.


Anyways, I could care less about my brake ducts. My ATP GT2560R Eliminators are in my official possession, along with my rebuilt 2.8L heads with Supertech inconel exhaust valves. The heads look great, the turbos look great. I am putting together as much as I can this weekend.

Never thought I'd see this day. Next step? First start...

97B518TQM
08-13-2010, 12:01 AM
I wouldn't be surprised if you get it all done this weekend, Max. You probably won't sleep until you start the car :). Give me a call if you need a hand.

dla79
08-13-2010, 12:11 AM
You see vents like you describe primarily on open wheel cars... On normal GT class and below production body style cars, you see many many many many cars with hose fed systems. People often use (which was new info to me) brake duct cooler fans to help draw air onto the brakes even when speeds are low. What you describe is also more expensive. I am fully willing to modify an aluminum under-body pan in order to channel in air. I believe this will work far better then a simple air catch at the inside of the wheel. This setup cost me $75, and won't cost me anything to modify. If you look at the Stasis race car's and other B5 S4 Champion car, you see they take the air from the belly pan as well, except they can run a splitter which allows more space. This is just a modification of that principle.


Anyways, I could care less about my brake ducts. My ATP GT2560R Eliminators are in my official possession, along with my rebuilt 2.8L heads with Supertech inconel exhaust valves. The heads look great, the turbos look great. I am putting together as much as I can this weekend.

Never thought I'd see this day. Next step? First start...

Just make sure you get a base tune on there before you go starting it up and putzing around ;-)

joe@vwvortex
08-13-2010, 08:11 AM
Didn't mean to hijack your thread - but I'm still interested in where you put the brake ducts :-)

Raacerx
08-14-2010, 01:21 AM
http://fototime.com/%7B216E5B69-A5F4-43F8-A6A8-276204C9ACF3%7D/origpict/SAM_0131.JPG

http://fototime.com/%7BBC431BEA-7512-4C70-B997-7195E78F309D%7D/origpict/SAM_0128.JPG

http://fototime.com/%7B74B27F2A-48FE-4C2A-906F-0D1944D5E196%7D/origpict/SAM_0126.JPG

Spooled1.8
08-14-2010, 07:24 AM
Nice, all your stuff is here. get to work and keep us updated [up]

97B518TQM
08-14-2010, 12:11 PM
Wow, that actuator is actually welded onto the housing. Interesting.

Looking good, Max. I hope you are halfway done by now. You didn't sleep last night instead of putting it together, right? :)

awd2ks4
08-14-2010, 12:42 PM
Wow, that actuator is actually welded onto the housing. Interesting.

The actuator isnt welded on, its bolted to the bracket. Saw these last night cant wait to see them under some high boost

Raacerx
08-15-2010, 12:27 AM
Installing and timing cams
http://fototime.com/%7BA1D02536-FF4C-44C0-BAD4-7CCEAC4BCFEA%7D/origpict/SAM_0139A.jpg

Drilling and tapping the SAI port
http://fototime.com/%7BBB8AB61B-4500-444E-BEB5-726B84A5329A%7D/origpict/SAM_0143A.jpg

Plugged SAI port
http://fototime.com/%7BEF46CAEB-8D7D-457B-9BC1-5F836D5FCB08%7D/origpict/SAM_0154A.jpg

Heads installed. DAMN those head bolts are a bitch! I had no idea.
http://fototime.com/%7BFC77FF48-7192-4372-ACDE-D58598D932CA%7D/origpict/SAM_0153A.jpg

Some intake manifold thread and gasket surface repair
http://fototime.com/%7BC1A3C0F6-8CCC-4B10-AC01-15150F590E79%7D/origpict/SAM_0156A.jpg

Intake manifold and phenolic transition spacers installed.
http://fototime.com/%7B1D41EB4E-6A76-4D80-998E-219C28EC7B39%7D/origpict/SAM_0157A.jpg

Throttle body is now installed amongst other stuff as well. Ported the transition phenolic spacers to match my intake manifold porting job.

michael66899
08-15-2010, 01:55 PM
Looks good man I'm pretty excited to see this thing all finished up as well and see what you think of the turbos, and yes those head bolts are definitely a pain in the ass. Oh and I'll be giving you a call tomorrow with a long list of parts, now hurry up and get that motor back in the car.

Raacerx
08-15-2010, 10:47 PM
Looks good man I'm pretty excited to see this thing all finished up as well and see what you think of the turbos, and yes those head bolts are definitely a pain in the ass. Oh and I'll be giving you a call tomorrow with a long list of parts, now hurry up and get that motor back in the car.

Thanks Michael! I won't be at work tomorrow, but give Dan or Christian a call or shoot me over an email.

http://fototime.com/%7B7023B830-624F-4EB8-BC7F-808D25678ACB%7D/origpict/SAM_0162A.jpg

http://fototime.com/%7B1812C0BA-86B1-4D73-B1D5-1A7C36EA9CCA%7D/origpict/SAM_0165A.jpg

http://fototime.com/%7B094EF9F9-0FD9-4910-B8DD-AAE0AB691EB6%7D/origpict/SAM_0169A.jpg

http://fototime.com/%7B903C60B5-299E-462B-9CF0-02B923851854%7D/origpict/SAM_0174A.jpg

will175
08-16-2010, 12:17 AM
Looking good my white brotha.lol. Can not wait to see this done....And looking forward to getting the paint in order for ya... :-)

RolledMySTi
08-16-2010, 09:00 AM
Looking good Max. I just noticed you are going gt's. Should be sweet once this epic journey is done.

Don Supreme
08-16-2010, 11:12 AM
Please let us know what modifications were required to make these fit.

Raacerx
08-16-2010, 11:35 AM
will let u know when im fully finished. Its mainly moving around some coolant lines, utilizing some of the factory lines, and things like that.

nefkntym
08-18-2010, 12:31 PM
Nice build thread. Congrats on being able to see through. I know it is hard to do.

Raacerx
08-18-2010, 10:05 PM
Nice build thread. Congrats on being able to see through. I know it is hard to do.

thanks nefkntym. its been a really rough road. but today had been the best day I've had in awhile in regards to the car. The engine is 95% ready to go back in the car, just need to grab a camlock bar and tighten down/time everything. And do valve cover gaskets. Everything fits, and while it was rough, I feel good about the way everything came out (except the driverside turbo outlet pipe location, which im worried will hit the motor mount bracket on the frame, but we will see. The important outlet junctions have been t-clamped for extra protection. I am feeling pretty good about stuff. I've wrapped everything I can in heat wrap, and doing the entire inlet pipes as well since I have some wrap left. I also got the inlet pipes done today with a buddy, and I am super happy how they came out and the price.

Everything is torqued down and ready to go. I did snap a tab off my engine block @ the transmission, but I think it will be ok. Don't ask.

Clutch/Pressure Plate (VAST Stage 4; I don't launch car so I think it will be fine).
http://fototime.com/%7BBDF9A63E-29C6-40DE-80E1-917F037C2932%7D/origpict/SAM_0178A.jpg

Crowded!!!
http://fototime.com/%7B507F11F9-9A91-4A74-B2CB-601B049E398D%7D/origpict/SAM_0181A.jpg

Passenger side turbo outlet was nice and easy, stock fitment pretty much.
http://fototime.com/%7BD83C31DA-DBDE-4280-979B-FED39AAB244F%7D/origpict/SAM_0193A.jpg

Wrapped up and ready to go. Added top hose clamp for safety.
http://fototime.com/%7BB99C635A-FEF9-458B-BBA7-E6F48CAB5178%7D/origpict/SAM_0200A.jpg

JHM shifter trio (solid shifter not shown) - THANKS DAN@JHM!
http://fototime.com/%7B47A86696-6806-46C1-8257-6DC8760F65B4%7D/origpict/SAM_0201A.jpg

Engine
http://fototime.com/%7BA848BFF3-9FC5-4516-B5F0-4CE185D7E29E%7D/origpict/SAM_0203A.jpg

Wrapped and ceramic coated! Heat can go suck it!
http://fototime.com/%7B83DCE80F-46EC-4C7E-AD4D-CF2C3D4862A7%7D/origpict/SAM_0207A.jpg

nefkntym
08-18-2010, 10:19 PM
Very nice. I like the wrap the coating. I want to do that on the VR6 when it is time.

Are you the one making the harnesses?

Calif_Kid
08-18-2010, 10:30 PM
Max - for the JHM linkage upgrade, did you do the grinding that is mentioned in http://jhmotorsports.com/products/pictures/linkages/JHM_S4_Linkage_Final_Assembly.JPG ? Just wanted to make sure you did that before you got the engine reinstalled. Nice work!! - Jim

Raacerx
08-18-2010, 11:04 PM
Very nice. I like the wrap the coating. I want to do that on the VR6 when it is time.

Are you the one making the harnesses?

I do now make the harnesses @ 034, amongst other things. If you know of anyone who is interested in a 034EFI system or harness, the turn around time has been drastically lowered now that I am onboard. Some people have told me I am wasting my time with heat wrap and stuff. $50 was enough to cover almost everything in the entire engine. My bipipes are ceramic coated, everything else is wrapped and/or ceramic coated, I don't see how spending $50 out of thousands is a stupid idea. Low and consistent IAT are where the power is IMO.



Max - for the JHM linkage upgrade, did you do the grinding that is mentioned in http://jhmotorsports.com/products/pictures/linkages/JHM_S4_Linkage_Final_Assembly.JPG ? Just wanted to make sure you did that before you got the engine reinstalled. Nice work!! - Jim

Hey Jim! Hope your car is doing great, haven't seen you around for awhile. I did it months ago as soon as you reminded me about it. Thanks one more time cause I'm sure I would have forgotten. I just grabbed a JHM solid shifter too when I was up there a couple weeks ago, so the shifting should be gorgeous. I am really excited to get the car back on the road. I expect I still have some road to travel before things get nice and locked, but this is all in the right direction.

97B518TQM
08-18-2010, 11:17 PM
Good progress, Max. You are so close to putting it in, it's crazy. You can actually drop the engine in the car and do whatever is left with it in the car. You know what it's like putting it back in so you shouldn't have any problems. I had a pretty hard time doing by myself but after a couple of hours of moving it around and aligning all the mounts it fit like a glove. An hour later it was running.
That clutch looks very familiar :). I just put 50 miles on my car today and it's getting better and better. I can't wait to put all 500 miles it takes to break it in so I can finally feel the power. Even at 5 psi now it feels very smooth and as fast as the car is stock. I have the Greddy dual stage electronic boost controller and that helps a lot with controlling my heavy foot :).

I am excited for you. After all the problems you went through you deserve to have a problem-free car for at least the next five years :). I predict the car being on the ground and running by the end of the weekend.

bigern45
08-19-2010, 06:14 AM
funny, i have the RS4 pp as well, have not had a single problem with it to date. numerous track days, hard driving, its never given me a problem. very drivable. i think all of the horror stories that come about from them are 9 out of 10 installer error.. thats what ive seen anyhow..
good luck with the build mang, looks good, glad you are getting it sorted out. and i know the feeling, youve just turned the corner, on the home stretch and you can see the finish line. its one of the best feelings in the world after all the time and effort into one of these builds. congrats.

and seeing a nice GT kit come together, as well as evilevos build, its making me think that a GT kit or a TiAL 770 will be cheaper and much easier/feasible than a VR6 build, even though that and a BAT would be my dream car (thanks a lot USP...lol)..

nefkntym
08-19-2010, 09:52 AM
I do now make the harnesses @ 034, amongst other things. If you know of anyone who is interested in a 034EFI system or harness, the turn around time has been drastically lowered now that I am onboard. Some people have told me I am wasting my time with heat wrap and stuff. $50 was enough to cover almost everything in the entire engine. My bipipes are ceramic coated, everything else is wrapped and/or ceramic coated, I don't see how spending $50 out of thousands is a stupid idea. Low and consistent IAT are where the power is IMO.

Good to know, me actually. I am doing a S4VR6T build.

Wrapping stuff is not wasting time. I used to live in SoCal, in 29Palms. Heat was bad for my turbo awd Talon. Had to wrap and coat stuff as well. Went to a bigger external oil cooler, remote mounted filter, bigger Fluidyne radiator and 18x10 CF reverse scoop hood vent to suck the hot air out from under hood. All of it did the trick. Coating and wrapping is quick and easy, excess radiant heat is never a good thing. So I know where you are coming from.

Raacerx
08-20-2010, 08:37 AM
Injectors installed, engine is timed. Only thing left is valve cover gaskets and putting the motor back in. Also got my baseline tune flashed.


There is essentially nothing holding me back at this point, except having to go to work. So tomorrow...she will be filled up and started up. The excitement level is high.

wdbdy2000s4
08-20-2010, 09:16 AM
good luck with the start-up. Take Vids.

AudiSportB5S4
08-20-2010, 09:27 AM
good luck with the start-up. Take Vids.

X2, good luck ! Hope everything works well, seems like its all taken care of. Hopefully she fires right up! [drive]

gearhead1186
08-20-2010, 10:58 AM
awaiting the good news.

Raacerx
08-22-2010, 10:40 AM
Working out some power steering issues, realized I have no MAF sensor (was borrowing one for months, forgot bout that until yesterday), and I am missing a large section of the PCV breather/Spider hose that broke. Aside from that, and a few hoses not fitting right (I need to weld J-pipes to the inlet pipes so I can run a straight silicone connector instead of trying to pitifully stretch the Samco boots over the XL inlet pipes), the car is running. Started it up a few times. About to move it out of the garage.

It is loud as shit... That normal for GT's? LOL! I guess I am coming from K03 turbos, but my 3" downpipes and 4" exhaust is ridiculously loud now. Sounds like open downpipes. Makes me a bit worried, but I am going to assume its due the the turbos being about twice as big as before.

So far, no horribly bent valves or things like that, so it seems the timing turned out good. Looking forward to getting the MAF and the PCV in so I can clear codes and see which remain.

http://fototime.com/%7B93F0581F-DE94-41DB-83B3-9271B678EFD2%7D/origpict/SAM_0221A.jpg

PS, can someone remind me which front axle goes on which side? I swear I have them on the wrong side...

Audi_S4
08-22-2010, 11:42 AM
Took the time to read the whole thread!

Damn dude thumbs up for you! You've done a great job with this car so far, hope everything turns out perfect!

These are the APT Eliminators you have fitted?

Curious how they perform at the same PSI as K04's and spoolup !

Raacerx
08-22-2010, 01:49 PM
She is outside, on her own power. Clutch feels great in the driveway. Power steering pump has quieted down. Idling good. No leaks so far, even at operating temps. If I had the MAF and the spider hose I would go drive it around the block.

97B518TQM
08-22-2010, 02:22 PM
Max, I have my old spider hose (new version) that I replaced just as preventative maintenance when I was putting my engine in. You are free to take it, it's in perfect condition.
I can also let you borrow my spare MAF sensor for as long as it takes you get a new one. You can get them today if you want.

Good job so far, you are officially DONE! :)

Raacerx
08-22-2010, 03:16 PM
Max, I have my old spider hose (new version) that I replaced just as preventative maintenance when I was putting my engine in. You are free to take it, it's in perfect condition.
I can also let you borrow my spare MAF sensor for as long as it takes you get a new one. You can get them today if you want.

Good job so far, you are officially DONE! :)

Dude!!! That would be awesome! Should only take a week or two to get a new MAF. I will text you.

97B518TQM
08-22-2010, 03:27 PM
Dude!!! That would be awesome! Should only take a week or two to get a new MAF. I will text you.

Sure thing, Max. I am free today until the late afternoon, after that I am going to my brother's house but I can still meet you somewhere in my area. 3757249

shorterthanrich
08-23-2010, 10:36 AM
Awesome! Need videos!!!

Raacerx
08-23-2010, 10:52 AM
Awesome! Need videos!!!

Video to come. Took one last night but its too hard to see.

Drove the car for 5 minutes last night (got spider hose piece and MAF sensor, THANKS 97B518TQM). Exciting, but there are indeed some issues. Front axles feel strange, knocking around, there are some odd vibrations, and a lot of stuff is still smoking and settling in (seems to have gone away though). I am getting a few drips out of a coolant line from the driverside turbo, and need to shave down a 19mm wrench to get to it. Also noticed that my turbo outlet pipe on one side is touching the subframe... not sure if I need to dent/clearance the subframe or what. Damn things are so big they hit everywhere.

Today, the goal is to get the car feeling good enough to start breaking in the clutch a bit and make the 1 hour drive over to work so I can get the car a little better tuned. Not sure this base file is going to allow me to break in the clutch for 600 miles. It seems just fine when I reset the ECU, but after it starts to learn some fuel curves it starts to run a bit rougher.

Hoping the weirdness I am feeling is the front axles, cause I seriously think I threw them on the wrong sides...

http://fototime.com/%7BBC59CDC9-00E5-4A41-BBBD-BA5CCA4F3DFF%7D/origpict/SAM_0226A.jpg

Don Supreme
08-23-2010, 11:33 AM
You work quickly!

gearhead1186
08-23-2010, 11:48 AM
lookin good. videos of it running? maybe a rev or two? [:D]

are you going to change your plates or use them to beat on unsuspecting victims?

Raacerx
08-23-2010, 12:33 PM
so the car just started to pour out some blueish smoke, and now it is dead. Won't start. I got a code for too rich both banks. Now it won't even start, MAF plugged in or unplugged. Fuck My Life.

gearhead1186
08-23-2010, 12:35 PM
so the car just started to pour out some blueish smoke, and now it is dead. Won't start. I got a code for too rich both banks. Now it won't even start, MAF plugged in or unplugged. Fuck My Life.

pull the plugs

97B518TQM
08-23-2010, 12:35 PM
I also had my axles on backwards at first when I first put the engine in. One of them just wasn't reaching quite like it should have and I reversed them so they are in the right place now for sure. These things are so similar in size, it's almost impossible to tell them apart. I had mine marked when I took them off and I still put them backwards because it didn't seem right at first while I was putting the engine in. Once the engine was in the right spot and sitting on the mounts it was obvious that my marking was indeed right and I had to reverse them. Also, you did you put new gaskets on the axles where they connect to the tranny, right? Not that it makes any difference in fitment or anything, just making sure you are spitting grease everywhere over time.

Raacerx
08-23-2010, 02:13 PM
Pulled plugs. Its very wet, looks flooded. Not exactly sure why all of a sudden I am running major major rich.

I am also not sure if things are just wet because I tried to start it a few times. Should I turn the motor over without the plugs and the fuel pump fuse removed? Will this help clear things out?

The smoke looked mostly blueish. Pressure tested; definitely leaking out my plastic intercoolers but nothing major. Everything is relatively tight. My vacuum was moving around a lot today when I started before it died.

Raacerx
08-23-2010, 05:40 PM
white smoke out the pcv system when the engine runs. runs very rough.

Any ideas?

wdbdy2000s4
08-23-2010, 05:48 PM
pull your lower intercooler hoses and see how much oil they have. Also, pray to god you didn't blow your turbos to pieces. Usually I don't worry about blue smoke when replacing the turbos or manifold but the insta-blue smoke and the death of the car are not good signs when they happen simultaneously. I could be very wrong though, so don't panic yet.

edit: just saw bouncing vacuum @ idle. probly not blown turbo. good luck

gearhead1186
08-23-2010, 05:53 PM
id just leave the plugs out and spin the motor over a couple times to clean things out. if u have a compressor, blow some air through the cylinders as well. as im sure u know, blue smoke is oil and white is coolant/water. blue smoke is never really a good sign to be honest, especially since it wasnt the first time u had the car running and being that the car died at the same time the blue smoke appeared. excessive smoke out the pcv system could be the symptom of a bad seal which could explain the blue smoke out the exhaust. check your intercooler hoses for oil. do a compression and leak-down test.

97B518TQM
08-23-2010, 10:54 PM
Aw shit, Max. That sucks big time.

Definitely pull the plugs and spin the engine for a bit with no fuel. I remember my engine got flooded when my starter wasn't starting my engine but it started after a while and a lot of smoke and raw fuel came out the exhaust initially but then cleared out after a minute or so. Blue smoke though,... that's a different story. You might have to pull the valve covers to check the valve seals. I remember my eclipse was smoking quite a lot, especially under boost, when a couple of my valve seals were getting bad. I know yours are brand new but defective parts do exist and maybe the seal failed once it warmed up a couple of times.

gearhead1186
08-24-2010, 05:07 PM
any word on the witchcraft going on?

034Motorsport
08-24-2010, 05:22 PM
any word on the witchcraft going on?

Stuck at work =(

I ran the car for 20 minutes last night, and drove it around for 5 minutes. The steam/smoke did not change. I'll post a picture tonight, to show how much is pouring out. Its a lot.

Back to work! Update a bit more tonight, but essentially I believe I am screwed to high heaven...

gearhead1186
08-24-2010, 05:25 PM
Stuck at work =(

I ran the car for 20 minutes last night, and drove it around for 5 minutes. The steam/smoke did not change. I'll post a picture tonight, to show how much is pouring out. Its a lot.

Back to work! Update a bit more tonight, but essentially I believe I am screwed to high heaven...

hmm. make sure to do a compression/leakdown test when you get a chance.

Raacerx
08-24-2010, 08:34 PM
hmm. make sure to do a compression/leakdown test when you get a chance.

Did compression test when engine was cold and pretty damn washed from flooding. Ranged from 130 to 80. Added tiny bit of oil to each cylinder, everything jumped above 130. Haven't tested it when warm. Leakdown test is next, but it seems to be more and more likely I scored the cylinder walls or busted a piston ring. Not sure how, but I can't figure out anything else.

What happens if I run the car without a PCV breather? Just get the engine bay messy? Is there any way the PCV could be causing the crankcase to pressurize? I am using the same spider hose I had before, which was working fine, but who knows whats happened to it. Just wondering if there is a quick way to test the integrity of the spider hose and if somehow that could be causing this.

I pulled 10% fueling to help with the richness. The adaptation values seem to be slowly maxing out. I cannot figure out why, since the tune should be just fine for an ultra basic baseline. The computer just keeps pulling more and more. This baseline tune is literally just to get me the 50 miles to work to do a bit better baseline tune, and it is technically for a Tial 605 turbo setup, but the turbos are really similar and I don't see why I would need to pull over 10% fueling when I have the same FPR, same 52lb injectors, same 85mm MAF, same downpipes, same exhaust, etc. Theoretically, with my bigger heads and bigger piping, shouldn't I be running leaner?

MAF is pulling about 8-9g/s @ idle. I am getting a fair amount of misfires on Cylinder 2 and some on cylinder 4 during startup, but once the car is warmed up, they at least disappear from VAGCOM but the engine still feels rough. Cylinder 2 and Cylinder 4 are the 2 cylinders with the lowest compression readings, which doesn't seem like a coincidence.

Fuel injector timing is about 2m/s @ idle.

Raacerx
08-24-2010, 10:40 PM
Drained oil. Its filled with metal. Cut open oil filter; even worse. In total anger, hucked oil filter into backyard somewhere, or I would post pictures. Did hot compression test finally, without adding oil, 2 cylinders below 100 psi.

Thats the end of this project for at least awhile. Overextended myself physically, emotionally, and financially to the point that this failure is more then I can handle. Have to move this week too, so everything has to be put on hold anyways and then school starts again in a few weeks, so I'll be working even less.

Someday it will get fixed, or maybe I will just swap everything over to an Avant down the line when I don't owe people thousands of dollars.

gearhead1186
08-24-2010, 10:54 PM
hey man im sorry to hear that. i know how it feels to be in a situation like that so im feeling you. dont ask me how I know lol. take a breather from the car to get yourself straight and then dive into the motor to see what went wrong. i know uve been thru a lot with the build already but anything can be fixed and it will be even more enjoyable when you get it all sorted out. i wish we werent on other ends of the US so I can give you a hand but Im here for moral support. from some of the posts in this thread it seems like u got a great bunch of guys near u willing to help so your in good hands. it can always be worse. get up and brush it off.

nefkntym
08-24-2010, 10:54 PM
Damn, I was afraid of that. Sucks man, I'm sorry.

revhards4
08-24-2010, 11:20 PM
you may have washed your rings out. Running rich on a fresh build will do that if the tune was off and running rich.

97B518TQM
08-24-2010, 11:23 PM
Holy shit! THAT SUCKS, Max. You haven't even pulled the pistons for the this, just swapped the heads. Where the hell would all these metal shavings come from... I am speechless.
Well,... take a little break from it. It's not a lost cause but will require another engine pull. I wonder if the low compression could be due a bad valve job on the heads. Did you lap the valves when you were assembling the heads? I still can't imagine where all the metal would come from though, especially that much.

I know you have to move this week so if you have the right conditions (a garage) I can help you pull the engine out so you can at least tear it apart and find out what the damn problem is so you are not wondering what is going on in there. I am sure together we can pull it very fast with one person disconnecting everything under the car and the other disconnecting everything on the top. Let me know, I am will be free the whole next week and my wife will be on a business trip so I am free any time. I am off work these days so any time, just let me know.

infinkc
08-24-2010, 11:26 PM
Omg I don't even know what to say.

Raacerx
08-24-2010, 11:51 PM
hey man im sorry to hear that. i know how it feels to be in a situation like that so im feeling you. dont ask me how I know lol. take a breather from the car to get yourself straight and then dive into the motor to see what went wrong. i know uve been thru a lot with the build already but anything can be fixed and it will be even more enjoyable when you get it all sorted out. i wish we werent on other ends of the US so I can give you a hand but Im here for moral support. from some of the posts in this thread it seems like u got a great bunch of guys near u willing to help so your in good hands. it can always be worse. get up and brush it off.

Thanks a lot gearhead, you've been a great help already with all of this. I really appreciate all the support, advice, etc that everyone has had for me. An hour ago I was practically in tears. Right now, I am trying to look forward, but financially this is very difficult. All of this wouldn't be such a big deal if I had been smart enough to buy another car first LOL!!! But luckily I do have some great folks around here, including some awesome coworkers and a great/supportive boss @ 034.


Damn, I was afraid of that. Sucks man, I'm sorry.

Thanks Aaron. It is what it is =(


you may have washed your rings out. Running rich on a fresh build will do that if the tune was off and running rich.

=( Tried to follow every bit of advice/directions I could for the whole process. I still can't figure out why the tune was so rich, but I think it was something with the car rather then the actual file. I trust the tuner and blame only myself.


Holy shit! THAT SUCKS, Max. You haven't even pulled the pistons for the this, just swapped the heads. Where the hell would all these metal shavings come from... I am speechless.
Well,... take a little break from it. It's not a lost cause but will require another engine pull. I wonder if the low compression could be due a bad valve job on the heads. Did you lap the valves when you were assembling the heads? I still can't imagine where all the metal would come from though, especially that much.

I know you have to move this week so if you have the right conditions (a garage) I can help you pull the engine out so you can at least tear it apart and find out what the damn problem is so you are not wondering what is going on in there. I am sure together we can pull it very fast with one person disconnecting everything under the car and the other disconnecting everything on the top. Let me know, I am will be free the whole next week and my wife will be on a business trip so I am free any time. I am off work these days so any time, just let me know.

Thanks J. The heads were professionally rebuilt/assembled. Unfortunately, as you mentioned, I have to spend the next week or two moving into my new place. Going to be a bit difficult without a working car hahahah. I always cut things close, and this time I cut everything too close. For now, this car is going to have to move to the back of my head while I take some deep breaths. I already failed out of my summer class trying to get this thing working. Enough damage to the rest of my life has been caused; got to pause, recollect.


Omg I don't even know what to say.

Do it once, do it right. The part that really pisses me off is that when I started this almost 5 months ago, my car was working just fine. I just wanted bigger turbos and 2.8 heads. Makes me realize how I should value what I got before I go trying to improve it all the time.



All will be ok at some point, just very, very, very discouraging. Either the engine will get rebuilt, a new block will be found, or I will find myself an Avant with a working motor and transfer everything over and keep myself a black B5 S4 shell for when I want to build a track machine.

97B518TQM
08-25-2010, 12:09 AM
I completely understand, Max. Let me know if I can help somehow.

BTW, PM me when you get your new maf. I keep getting these codes and I think my maf is causing me to run lean on and off. Nothing urgent, just keep me updated on when your new one comes.

Spooled1.8
08-25-2010, 08:22 AM
Damn man, that's horrible news. I was really looking forward to the results. The only advice I can give you is find a nice $1000 beater and get on with your daily life. Work on the S from time to time, eventually it'll be ready [up]