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View Full Version : How about an auto-x thread?



.Mad Hatter.
03-18-2009, 03:46 PM
For our B5s.

I am going to give it a go this season, depending on how much regionals cost I will register. If not at the very least I will run some club events. I dont expect to do so well being that I have never tried anything like this (I know everyone wants to think they are a great driver but I am ready to actually see how good I am, and I expect to be disappointed [>_<].)

Any tips? Some pics for motivation would be great, maybe keep this going throughout the season. I hope to have a lot of fun and finally start doing something I have wanted to do since I had my 16v.

Militant-Grunt
03-18-2009, 03:59 PM
Get some good brakes and dedicated wheels / tires. You're going to eat through both fast, especially if your car is a DD

.Mad Hatter.
03-18-2009, 04:05 PM
ive got new brakes and mintex reds with ss lines

tires are 1 season old 912s....which will go fast i think.
oh well they will have to do for now.

andyrew
03-18-2009, 04:18 PM
Nab an instructor that has AWD experience.

Try and find autox schools.

Bring your own helmet. Go to the website and do all the prechecks on your car (Battery secure, wheel bearings tight, ect., Fill your tires up 5lbs more than you normally do, bring a pressure guage and chaulk.

Clear out your car before you go or bring a big duffle bag, remove any wheel caps, bring water, sun screen, a thin long sleeve shirt, and a hat (fishing hat or similar, keep the sun off your neck and face).

As for driving, Find the limit of your car, push it. See what happens. Just learn your limits your first outing and have fun. Dont bother about times, your learning your car's handling limits in various different situations from 20-60mph

Next couple of times learn the line and when to brake. Get a ride in an instructors car if possible. Try and hit your lines, and follow your instructors line and braking patterns to a degree.

Then after this, and you should be going all over the place trying to get that last bit of mph out of corners, you will need to learn to be smooth and easy with your transitions, and all your movements. A smooth car at the limits is much faster than someone continually under and over the limit.


GL and have fun.

arorem
03-18-2009, 04:22 PM
Its really fun. This will be my first year autocrossing the audi. I started doing it back in 06 with my mkIII jetta, and actually got some first in class prizes.

The best advice i can give you is during your first few runs, go slow, and get the feel of the coarse. Pay attention to corner workers, and be respectful. Always walk the coarse when you have the chance to get the layout of it in your head. And what grunt said, get some dedicated wheels and tires for your car. I made the mistake of just going out on my all seasons that i had on the jetta, and i went through a brand new set of tires in >6 months, but got some really good finishes on them. Know the classing and the way it works, and pay attention during the drivers meetings.

Here are some pics from 07 at the auto x here in my town.
https://netfiles.uiuc.edu/johnli/pics/barney_camaro.jpg
https://netfiles.uiuc.edu/johnli/pics/phillip_wrx.jpg
https://netfiles.uiuc.edu/johnli/pics/louds2000.jpg
https://netfiles.uiuc.edu/johnli/pics/tiburon.jpg

This isnt from my town, but at a autocross event, one of the local cops thought he would give it a shot.
http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n230/digitalseance/GAAutoX/P1000167s.jpg

.Mad Hatter.
03-18-2009, 04:23 PM
awesome advice.

i generally run 35psi in my tires to squeeze out some better mileage. think 40 is too high?

.Mad Hatter.
03-18-2009, 04:24 PM
i cant at all afford a dedicated set of wheels and tires this year, i dont even know if i am going to compete in regionals. we shall see though.

arorem
03-18-2009, 04:27 PM
awesome advice.

i generally run 35psi in my tires to squeeze out some better mileage. think 40 is too high?

not really, i would start on 50 psi with my jetta, but i had alot of sidewall though.

but REMEMBER: as the tires heat up they will increase pressure, so after every run, check the pressure and adjust as needed.


Also, while checking your tires, you can also see where the tires are wearing down, id they are rolling over onto the sidewall, you could try to increase pressure a tad. Or it could be because your pushing the car a bit to hard, so try and back off a bit, slower can be faster.

Tifun
03-18-2009, 04:30 PM
Nab an instructor that has AWD experience.

Try and find autox schools.

Bring your own helmet. Go to the website and do all the prechecks on your car (Battery secure, wheel bearings tight, ect., Fill your tires up 5lbs more than you normally do, bring a pressure guage and chaulk.

Clear out your car before you go or bring a big duffle bag, remove any wheel caps, bring water, sun screen, a thin long sleeve shirt, and a hat (fishing hat or similar, keep the sun off your neck and face).

As for driving, Find the limit of your car, push it. See what happens. Just learn your limits your first outing and have fun. Dont bother about times, your learning your car's handling limits in various different situations from 20-60mph

Next couple of times learn the line and when to brake. Get a ride in an instructors car if possible. Try and hit your lines, and follow your instructors line and braking patterns to a degree.

Then after this, and you should be going all over the place trying to get that last bit of mph out of corners, you will need to learn to be smooth and easy with your transitions, and all your movements. A smooth car at the limits is much faster than someone continually under and over the limit.


GL and have fun.

Perfect IMO. I was thinking all the same stuff. I never did the schools, although I would like to, but I made up for it in experience on the course over the years. Tons of fun. One note, you shouldn't really have to worry about your brakes, I don't really recall ever having any fade issues or premature wear from an autoX, now an actual road course is a different story. Have fun it's a race against yourself, not others.

anmagro
03-18-2009, 05:16 PM
unorthodoxa4 wtf is that link in your profile man? what is it??

.Mad Hatter.
03-19-2009, 09:01 AM
naked pics of some dudes ex, but i think its down.

lol.

picked up my helmet today, HJC CL-15 cyclone, im itching to start now. first meeting is april 7th for the club.

.Mad Hatter.
03-19-2009, 01:26 PM
mmmmmmm, and some DK love:

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3610/3368037527_7096f054f8_o.jpg

Skidder
03-20-2009, 10:48 AM
I use to autox before I started getting on road courses... I found the two styles so contradictory that i stopped autox entirely. On the road course you need to be smooth and smart or you will throw your car away. On the autox course you need to drive super aggressive (brake hard, accelerate hard).

One trick you might find beneficial is for the corners you need to find a way to rotate the car... especially an AWD which is prone to understeer. If you turn-in right before you get off the brakes you might induce snap oversteer which helps the back end rotate. Also some huge Anti Sway Bars, with the rear bar on its stiffest setting. Some negative camber is great for the turns too.

To figure out your tire pressures you can use chalk on your sidewalls to see how much your sidewall is folding over. Obviously you don't want to be using the sidewall to get through the corner, just the tread.

andyrew
03-20-2009, 11:05 AM
Lift throttle oversteer is really helpful on a awd car for getting around some of those decreasing radius turns.

Skidder
03-20-2009, 11:56 AM
I would still autox if they had decreasing radius turns... all the autox's my local place did were set up the same. 3 90 degree turns, 2 hairpins, and maybe one or two straights had a slalom or kink.

I think once they had a sweeper for one corner, in which I took a decreasing radius line so that I could enter faster and scrub speed through the corner.

I've herd of some autocross's having a 70mph straight and 2 min laps... that sounds way better than the ones my track held. Mine were like 50mph tops and 52 second laps (ie: not exciting).

.Mad Hatter.
03-21-2009, 05:57 AM
I use to autox before I started getting on road courses... I found the two styles so contradictory that i stopped autox entirely. On the road course you need to be smooth and smart or you will throw your car away. On the autox course you need to drive super aggressive (brake hard, accelerate hard).

One trick you might find beneficial is for the corners you need to find a way to rotate the car... especially an AWD which is prone to understeer. If you turn-in right before you get off the brakes you might induce snap oversteer which helps the back end rotate. Also some huge Anti Sway Bars, with the rear bar on its stiffest setting. Some negative camber is great for the turns too.

To figure out your tire pressures you can use chalk on your sidewalls to see how much your sidewall is folding over. Obviously you don't want to be using the sidewall to get through the corner, just the tread.

my car came with a big front lower sway and no rear...i might have to invest in a rear soon.

andyrew
03-21-2009, 09:37 AM
Serious ouch.
Buy the biggest you can, make sure you properly reinforce it.

.Mad Hatter.
03-21-2009, 11:19 AM
wait, what did they come with on the rear from the factory? mine has a 19mm front sway iirc

quattro16
03-21-2009, 12:10 PM
^^^^That helmet is not Snell SA2005 certified. Which means you can't use is for Auto racing. Now it depends on how stirct the auto-x club is. Now for HPDE use I can bet you will not be able to use it on the track, because they check for sure. And I would never wear a motorcycle helmet on a track.

.Mad Hatter.
03-21-2009, 05:53 PM
^^^^That helmet is not Snell SA2005 certified. Which means you can't use is for Auto racing. Now it depends on how stirct the auto-x club is. Now for HPDE use I can bet you will not be able to use it on the track, because they check for sure. And I would never wear a motorcycle helmet on a track.

it is snell M2005 rated, which is exactly what i need, thanks for the input though

andyrew
03-21-2009, 06:43 PM
wait, what did they come with on the rear from the factory? mine has a 19mm front sway iirc

19" seems stock, im not sure, mine is pretty darn thick, probably 25+ in the front.

My rear is a 22".. fronts should be much thicker than the rears..

.Mad Hatter.
03-22-2009, 06:47 AM
ya i see some that are like 35 front and 25 rear...maybe for next season.

Skidder
03-22-2009, 11:33 AM
Anti Sway bars are just about the most bang for your buck handling mod you can do. I highly recommend on any car.

.Mad Hatter.
03-22-2009, 11:43 AM
ya im going to scan the slassifieds for a used set. will the s4 rear sway fit on my 97? worth $60?

andyrew
03-22-2009, 11:56 PM
Nope, go big or go home. I bought mine from ECS for 125 or so and welded up a permanent brace myself out of 1/8" stock.

gmx
03-23-2009, 01:00 AM
ya im going to scan the slassifieds for a used set. will the s4 rear sway fit on my 97? worth $60?

S4s are the same as sports (15mm)

You can grab a H&R bar off ECS for about $200 i think. Rated @ 21mm.

.Mad Hatter.
03-23-2009, 03:15 AM
alright thanks for the tips...i will certainly make it a priority

.Mad Hatter.
03-23-2009, 01:03 PM
question about wheels when i can afford a dedicated set: my RCs are around 16lbs, but I think very soft. Would it be worth my while to buy say...ultraleggeras for the track?

i could save up and buy new/used track wheels or save up and buy new/used street wheels...not sure which is better; a soft wheel for the street or a soft wheel for the track, assuming the weights are around the same.

would a 16" or 17" wheel be better suited?

A4Rob
03-23-2009, 01:08 PM
That is a sick paint job on that helmet!

andyrew
03-23-2009, 01:29 PM
question about wheels when i can afford a dedicated set: my RCs are around 16lbs, but I think very soft. Would it be worth my while to buy say...ultraleggeras for the track?

i could save up and buy new/used track wheels or save up and buy new/used street wheels...not sure which is better; a soft wheel for the street or a soft wheel for the track, assuming the weights are around the same.

would a 16" or 17" wheel be better suited?

Soft wheels? Or are you referring to the tire compound?

16's and 17's have cheaper tires (16's are really cheap) and more racing/ sticky street tires available to them.

Obviously the larger diameter wheel the less sidewall flex you'll have. Unless you go with a pure racing tire like a hoosier or cantilever slick, then you'll have a stiff sidewall.

IMHO get some cheap beater 16" wheels, throw some sticky street tires (RT-615's, RE-01R's, ect) and just use those. They will be sticky enough to have some fun, but not too sticky to mask your mistakes and make for bad habits.

.Mad Hatter.
03-23-2009, 01:56 PM
no i meant soft wheels, as in soft aluminum. just wondering if they would be more or less prone to damage in a race setting.

and ya the wheels will likely be beater wheels, nothing too great just something to throw some tires on and same my RCs/falkens

.Mad Hatter.
03-23-2009, 01:56 PM
That is a sick paint job on that helmet!

Thank you HJC!

[:D]

andyrew
03-23-2009, 03:16 PM
no i meant soft wheels, as in soft aluminum. just wondering if they would be more or less prone to damage in a race setting.

and ya the wheels will likely be beater wheels, nothing too great just something to throw some tires on and same my RCs/falkens

I wouldnt bother with getting aluminum wheels. This will be your first season autoxing, Cheap and long lasting is where its at. You can start spending lots of money on things when you start getting competitive and want that extra .10 of a second.

.Mad Hatter.
03-23-2009, 09:37 PM
well this season im going to be using my daily wheels/tires until i can afford others

.Mad Hatter.
03-24-2009, 06:25 AM
are you guys putting a little more air in your front tires to help with the sidewalls? or even front and rear?

andyrew
03-24-2009, 08:26 AM
I ran 38psi on the skidpad. but my inside tire was cold, I needed more camber and maybe more PSI.
No rollover on the tire to the sidewall though, but you can see the tire flex in my skidpad pics.


Heres a tip, start at max psi on your tires, use chalk and keep turning the psi down till you get all the tread being used up front, in the back you might actually want it pumped up a bit to get the rear to rotate better on your stockish suspension.

.Mad Hatter.
03-24-2009, 12:15 PM
ok great, lots of great info man, much appreciated

andyrew
03-24-2009, 04:21 PM
No problem, I've been around autoxing for about 10 years, been doing it for 6 years (I did it the day after I got my license).

.Mad Hatter.
03-24-2009, 09:46 PM
thats awesome, i really wish i did it in my 16v

.Mad Hatter.
04-08-2009, 01:20 PM
registered 2 days ago and got my class; D super stock.

the top 7 from last year in that class, in order, were; 240sx, neon, neon, civic SIR, civic, neon ACR, neon 2.0sx

Revzillia
04-08-2009, 03:09 PM
This is my second yr . my a4 seems to like 50 psi in the tries . Pick up the rule book , One mod or sway bar change could move you into another class . I currently fight to be comptive with mini coopers in G stock . can;t touch the rear bar or springs

.Mad Hatter.
04-08-2009, 08:18 PM
the only things that put me in super stock over stock are short shifter, ss brake lines and no cat...maybe the chip.

i need to see where i stand on 2.5" exhaust and a rear sway, as those are my next mods.

andyrew
04-08-2009, 09:07 PM
Dont tell them about the chip...

.Mad Hatter.
04-09-2009, 02:10 AM
chip doesnt change my class...it adds prep points, 2 of them. not sure what exactly that means, but im still in the same class. lol

gmx
04-09-2009, 03:32 AM
the only things that put me in super stock over stock are short shifter, ss brake lines and no cat...maybe the chip.

i need to see where i stand on 2.5" exhaust and a rear sway, as those are my next mods.

ssk doesn't do much for autox, shouldn't have an effect on the class. Same goes for SS lines imo, for a short course, not much high speed stops (typical autox).

What do I know though, we rarely have motorkhanas, mostly just track days.

.Mad Hatter.
04-09-2009, 04:29 AM
thats what the rules state brosef, those are the 2 reasons i am not in the stock class.

.Mad Hatter.
04-09-2009, 04:29 AM
also the deletion of the cat puts me out of the stock class

.Mad Hatter.
04-23-2009, 10:33 AM
dudes, with regard to coils, how are you setup?

about 1/4" lower in the rear?

onemoremile
04-23-2009, 11:58 AM
Some autocross setup info:
http://farnorthracing.com/autocross_secrets.html
http://www.autocross.com/autoc/started.htm

.Mad Hatter.
04-23-2009, 01:10 PM
awesome, thanks Jim!

andyrew
04-23-2009, 02:44 PM
Ride height?

Just slightly lower than sport springs. I make full use of my suspension.

Worked perfectly when I went off the track last weekend at buttonwillow doing 80mph :)

onemoremile
04-23-2009, 03:32 PM
That is the perfect height to take advantage of the factory engineered toe and camber curves. Too low puts the car in panic mode and the resulting faulty geometry negates any potential advantages from the lower center of gravity. Lower also increases the roll couple which tends to make the car roll more than when higher. I've tracked mine at several different heights and found about .5" below stock sport to be just as fast as slammed but with much better ride quality and a more confidence inspiring feel.

.Mad Hatter.
05-03-2009, 04:17 PM
had my first event today. i had a blast!

my coils have not come in yet, but i cant wait until they do. honestly, ZERO understeer, not sure if i wasnt pushing it enough or what, but the car felt great.

R compounds are in the works, and my coils should be here soon...its going to be a great season!

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e374/geoff16vII/1997%20A4/Geoff-autocross156e.jpg
http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e374/geoff16vII/1997%20A4/Geoff-autocross115e.jpg
http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e374/geoff16vII/1997%20A4/Geoff-autocross042e.jpg

TMorris
05-03-2009, 05:13 PM
way to go Geoff[up]

.Mad Hatter.
05-03-2009, 05:27 PM
thanks tyler...it was hands down the most fun ive had in the car.

andyrew
05-03-2009, 05:50 PM
That looks like a track day. Not going to see much understeer at those speeds. Gotta say your car looks pretty flat as it is. Dont know if your going to tell a huge difference between what you have now besides from more adjustability and probably going to feel slightly more solid.

Next time you go out push it harder, Try to make the car understeer, try to make it oversteer. looks like you have NO obstacles that could hurt your car.

.Mad Hatter.
05-03-2009, 05:53 PM
its a 2.4km track that was broken up with slaloms and boxes. all other races this season are in lots or airfields.

.Mad Hatter.
06-29-2009, 10:54 AM
is it just me, or does the car seem to have A LOT of roll? lol. first event with the coils and r compounds

http://www.tanneymotorsport.com/gallery2/d/37788-1/2009_06_28-CASCEvent2_8773-web.jpg

biketsai
06-29-2009, 10:56 AM
^^ I think it has to do with how you transfer the weight and your suspension. Looks like you are taking a pretty crazy turn!
http://photos-f.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs005.snc1/4162_102705779837_611214837_2602341_2781343_n.jpg

.Mad Hatter.
06-29-2009, 11:10 AM
oh ya, its back and forth and quite tight lol.

andernalin_junk
06-29-2009, 11:31 AM
I love auto X's ... doing that allot
usally i'd go with 40 PSI on T1R's ... dont forget that semi's will take you one category up

while stock suspension
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l130/andernalin_junk/track%20day/IMG_4442.jpg
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l130/andernalin_junk/track%20day/IMG_4450.jpg
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l130/andernalin_junk/DSC03571.jpg
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l130/andernalin_junk/DSC03506.jpg
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l130/andernalin_junk/DSC03510.jpg
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l130/andernalin_junk/n.jpg
17" rims and 35mm drop
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l130/andernalin_junk/pic158.jpg
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l130/andernalin_junk/pic226.jpg
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l130/andernalin_junk/pic224.jpg
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l130/andernalin_junk/pic223.jpg
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l130/andernalin_junk/pic179.jpg

i'm planning of going to a new AutoX club this weekend ... 1.7km long
will post new photos ...

.Mad Hatter.
06-29-2009, 11:33 AM
wow thats long! that would be awesome.