View Full Version : My StopTech BBK got completed today
eastwick897
03-09-2009, 09:31 PM
As the title states the final pieces I was missing arrived today. The pics don't include the rotors but i'm going to be running 355x32mm slotted rotors. The calipers are the St-40's. If anyone has any personnel experience about install and all that good stuff go ahead and say it.
http://www.audizine.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1200&pictureid=4160
http://www.audizine.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1200&pictureid=4159
http://www.audizine.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1200&pictureid=4158
http://www.audizine.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1200&pictureid=4157
AudiWxGuy
03-09-2009, 09:41 PM
BBK FTL....Such a waste of money on these cars. That is all I've got say about that. They will look cool tough, that is for sure!
ryannorthcott
03-09-2009, 09:46 PM
BBK FTL....Such a waste of money on these cars. That is all I've got say about that. They will look cool tough, that is for sure!
agreed...
well for B6's they are too, unless you get matching rears
Nice brakes, but why include the calculator and accounting text books?
apatchin
03-09-2009, 09:56 PM
they look good [race] ^reference the size i think...
unless your planning on BT/tracking it our brakes our fine IMO.
quattrosaint
03-09-2009, 10:02 PM
BBK FTL....Such a waste of money on these cars. That is all I've got say about that. They will look cool tough, that is for sure!
Not a waste if you track it! Besides its HIS money and it's only a waste if he leaves it next to his calculator lol.
eastwick897
03-09-2009, 10:09 PM
yea calculator and the book are for some kind of reference and I plan on doing some autoX when the weather gets better.
AudiWxGuy
03-09-2009, 10:10 PM
You do not need a BBK for Auto X....I've done it a few times and run about 4 laps, each a min long within about 5 mins of each other and did not get brake fade on the stock brake setup....For a track, yes you need them. Auto X...No.
eastwick897
03-09-2009, 10:17 PM
^^^I'll probably do some tracking also.
AudiWxGuy
03-09-2009, 10:19 PM
Good! Make the BBK worth it. [:D]
eastwick897
03-09-2009, 10:22 PM
Good! Make the BBK worth it. [:D]
won't let you down. honestly i got this because I got a exceptional deal from my buddy.
AudiWxGuy
03-09-2009, 10:32 PM
Starting to make sense now.
quattrosaint
03-09-2009, 10:46 PM
won't let you down. honestly i got this because I got a exceptional deal from my buddy.
good dont let the babbies go to waste, for just a couple dollars a day you can enjoy the stopping power of a 777. You may want to make sure those calipers will work with 32X355mm rotors. These are mine that are designed for that size for reference.
http://i273.photobucket.com/albums/jj225/quattrosaint/brakesinches.jpg
Quattro
03-09-2009, 10:51 PM
congrads on the calipers, if you install yourself make a diy please.
it seems like everyone is doing a bbk recently!
slimmj0k3r
03-09-2009, 11:06 PM
BBK FTL....Such a waste of money on these cars. That is all I've got say about that. They will look cool tough, that is for sure!
i'd disagree. stasis/alcon BBK pack some serious bite [up].
Nice. You'll enjoy it.
And to whoever said a BBK is a waste of money on a B6 must've never driven a B6 with stock brakes lol. They suck.
Grishbok
03-10-2009, 08:52 AM
The stock brakes on the B7 have some SERIOUS FADE when you are tracking or running the car hard on some back roads. The stoptech kit will maintain the bite much longer with less fade. In an intensive track situation, keeping your brakes crisp and fade-free equates to faster lap times which is the difference between a win, and a loss.
I am envious of your brake kit.
ggg20t
03-10-2009, 09:05 AM
all the dudes saying that its a waste -- you know you want a set.
Hell, i haven't tracked my car yet and i would still like to have them for the road.
GL with the setup man and congrats!!
A4ringedONE8T
03-10-2009, 09:12 AM
Anyone that says a BBK is a waste merely doesnt have them because they can't afford them. Cry, bitch, call me out, whatever, it is the truth. They are worth every penny whether you track your car or just drive aggressively on the street. Until you have them, just keep telling yourself they are a waste. Out of everything I did to my B6, when I put it back to stock the thing I missed most was the brakes. Also the reason they went back on my B7 the day I brought it home.
To the OP, enjoy them. Stoptech, Brembo, and Alcon 355's are a hell of a setup! [up]
A4ringedONE8T
03-10-2009, 09:13 AM
good dont let the babbies go to waste, for just a couple dollars a day you can enjoy the stopping power of a 777. You may want to make sure those calipers will work with 32X355mm rotors. These are mine that are designed for that size for reference.
http://i273.photobucket.com/albums/jj225/quattrosaint/brakesinches.jpg
Just because they are the biggest doesn't mean they are the best. Alcon, Stoptech, and Brembo will outperform the ECS/Porsche setups like no ones business. A good rotor, pad, line, and fluid combo using the stock sizes and calipers will perform just as well as the ECS kits
elwigglero
03-10-2009, 09:52 AM
Increased stopping power and dramatically reduced brake fade is not a waste of money. Sure they're expensive, but being able to stop on a dime is a nice upgrade...especially if you're upping the power with ECU and turbo upgrades.[up]
OP...Make sure you post pics once they're installed.[up]
turbo kraut
03-10-2009, 09:58 AM
tell this guy good brakes wouldn't have mattered........
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9zq4uH0vQbg
i know might not have been fade, but can happen all the same
and if he goes bt, those brakes will make a difference
i have the a8/tt upgrade with ss lines and i can tell the difference, now to get my abs mod fixed
9Hooker
03-10-2009, 10:06 AM
BBK FTL....Such a waste of money on these cars. That is all I've got say about that. They will look cool tough, that is for sure!
Agree. My money will be spent on better pads/lines. Maybe these rotors if I've got some cash to spare... way later down the road, same size as stock.
http://www.ebcbrakes.com/Assets/85-silverusr2.jpg
Auditude2.0T
03-10-2009, 10:08 AM
The stock brakes are good but have fade when driven hard
Grishbok
03-10-2009, 10:17 AM
The stock brakes are good but have fade when driven hard
ive got video proof of that, at the end of the run, approaching a stop sign, got a little giddy and wasnt sure it was gonna make it.
AudiWxGuy
03-10-2009, 10:17 AM
Anyone that says a BBK is a waste merely doesnt have them because they can't afford them. Cry, bitch, call me out, whatever, it is the truth. They are worth every penny whether you track your car or just drive aggressively on the street. Until you have them, just keep telling yourself they are a waste. Out of everything I did to my B6, when I put it back to stock the thing I missed most was the brakes. Also the reason they went back on my B7 the day I brought it home.
To the OP, enjoy them. Stoptech, Brembo, and Alcon 355's are a hell of a setup! [up]
No. Even if i had all the money I wanted, unless I was tracking the car every weekend, I wouldn't buy a BBK for my car.
elwigglero
03-10-2009, 10:25 AM
No. Even if i had all the money I wanted, unless I was tracking the car every weekend, I wouldn't buy a BBK for my car.
Why not? If I had all the money I wanted, I'd buy a BBK for my lawnmower.
AudiWxGuy
03-10-2009, 10:26 AM
I meant just for the car. Woops.
eastwick897
03-10-2009, 10:28 AM
thanks for the compliment guys and i'll do my best in making a DIY for the braided brake line (front/back) and everything else included. I will definitely post some pics once they are installed. If anyone has this setup on the stock 18"s with the 43et. Let me know what size spacers your running. Thanks!!!!
04Ultrasprt
03-10-2009, 10:35 AM
awesome brakes man, and for everyone who thinks they not worth it how about you come take a little ride through some mountains with me and see how long those stock brakes last before they begin to fade.
9Hooker
03-10-2009, 10:39 AM
Why not? If I had all the money I wanted, I'd buy a BBK for my lawnmower.
two words. sprung weight. you now have to SPIN those rotors to accelerate/decelerate. turning is not so much of an issue with power steering + overall weight of car.
on my motorcycles, the SECOND upgrade I always do is buy lighter wheels. they improve acceleration and allow the bike to swap sides in chicanes easier. first upgrade of course has always been suspension. holds true for cars IMO. first suspension, then power, then brakes. I don't drive like an idiot on the roads and I won't track the car so fade isn't an issue. even if it were, you can work just fine with better pads/lines/bleed the brakes between track sessions that day.
if I autox or otherwise track the car, the suspension becomes absolutely paramount (to include tires, NEVER overlook those!), then brakes (lines new fluid, good pad), then power. if you're tracking it, you should have fade resistant track pads on anyway!
having all the power in the world doesn't do you any good if your tires/suspension give up the ghost and you can't point your nose where you want it.
i digress.
Grishbok
03-10-2009, 10:56 AM
thats where the e-brake comes into play hehe (joke)
If you rnose points halfway where you want it, use the ebrake and get it the rest of the way! weeee!
hmmm.... Big E-brake Kit on the way?
BremboGuy
03-10-2009, 11:31 AM
I can't speak for every brand, but the Brembo BBK's for the Audi cars actually reduce unsprung AND rotational weight. That is a major benefit of a properly engineered brake kit, and one that is equally beneficial for daily driving and/or track use.
I agree that those who do not see the benefit are simply the ones who have not had the chance to experience a properly developed aftermarket brake kit yet. Even between home and work, in traffic on the 405 from LA to OC, I use my brakes for everything they are worth. The better pedal feel and modulation allows me to brake harder with less effort, and be more precise when I change speeds. It's also confidence inspiring to know that no matter what I have all the brake I'm ever going to need, if someone jumps into my lane, or if I need to quickly scrub off 25mph to get back down to the speed limit.
At the track I am 100% fade free, repeatedly, from triple digit speeds down to what's necessary for corner entry. The modulation allows me to trail brake if I get overly aggressive, and the firm pedal allows me to stand on the pedal and remain comfortable without second guessing myself. The weight savings is noticeable in acceleration and handling. The streering just feels more responsive, especially at high speeds where the drivers input must be precise.
Everything lasts longer than stock by as much as 2-3 times, and even though it's a pricey upgrade, I can't think of anything that adds more value to a car that gets driven a lot in different scenarios.
two words. sprung weight. you now have to SPIN those rotors to accelerate/decelerate. turning is not so much of an issue with power steering + overall weight of car.
on my motorcycles, the SECOND upgrade I always do is buy lighter wheels. they improve acceleration and allow the bike to swap sides in chicanes easier. first upgrade of course has always been suspension. holds true for cars IMO. first suspension, then power, then brakes. I don't drive like an idiot on the roads and I won't track the car so fade isn't an issue. even if it were, you can work just fine with better pads/lines/bleed the brakes between track sessions that day.
if I autox or otherwise track the car, the suspension becomes absolutely paramount (to include tires, NEVER overlook those!), then brakes (lines new fluid, good pad), then power. if you're tracking it, you should have fade resistant track pads on anyway!
having all the power in the world doesn't do you any good if your tires/suspension give up the ghost and you can't point your nose where you want it.
i digress.
9Hooker
03-10-2009, 11:57 AM
I agree that those who do not see the benefit are simply the ones who have not had the chance to experience a properly developed aftermarket brake kit yet.
Having seen both, I will concede that in a high stakes environment having big, less fading brakes is a must. For chsissakes, our cars have leather and sunroofs not to mention it weighs a TON. I certainly would be running metallic track pads, and certainly not the cheapest 18" tires I can cram on my super expensive wheels.
BBK for 90% of people is OVERKILL. Slotted/Drilled also negligible performance difference for everyday driving.
The only reason I mentioned me getting slotted rotors in the first place I've had good luck with them. More to personal taste than actual benefit I suppose.
It's all about personal preference, everything in this thread.
elwigglero
03-10-2009, 12:24 PM
Having seen both, I will concede that in a high stakes environment having big, less fading brakes is a must. For chsissakes, our cars have leather and sunroofs not to mention it weighs a TON. I certainly would be running metallic track pads, and certainly not the cheapest 18" tires I can cram on my super expensive wheels.
BBK for 90% of people is OVERKILL. Slotted/Drilled also negligible performance difference for everyday driving.
The only reason I mentioned me getting slotted rotors in the first place I've had good luck with them. More to personal taste than actual benefit I suppose.
It's all about personal preference, everything in this thread.
Agreed, but in a forum where many people list debadging and tint under their mods[rolleyes], the aesthetics of drilled/slotted/dimpled rotors are hard to argue with. Of course a lot of kits are going to be overkill, (maybe the porsche brakes above), but a nice brake upgrade that isn't huuuuuge/heavy is a nice and worthwhile improvement...Definitely not before suspension, ecu/turbo upgrades, and sticky tires though.[up]
cstarky15
03-10-2009, 12:39 PM
I have the 332 rotors for my stoptechs. st-40s. I love them and just makesure that the wheels you have will fit over them. The stock split spoke 17's need at least a 5mm spacer. For those wondering about install, My buddy did mine for me and you can follow any B5 brake upgrade DIY and it works. We transfered the brakes ffom an B5 S4 to my B7 A4 and went pretty smooth.
RedS-line
03-10-2009, 02:49 PM
Pics looks good, but now you need a new set of wheels and summer tires to show them off and to rip it up in the autox. Lemme know how the pedal feels after the install. If it gets rid of the mushiness then the piece of mind gained is totally worth it imo.
ggg20t
03-10-2009, 03:33 PM
elwiggerlo - hahahaha bbk on your lawnmower.
On a side note - even if you are driving on the road with a BBK and some tractor trailer or a deer jumps out at you, i would say that having a BBK would be safer. I know thats a stretch but, i would definitely feel a tiny bit safer! who knows, maybe a BBK could save your 40,000 dollar investment (depreciating asset) but nonetheless i think its a wonderful upgrade.
9Hooker
03-10-2009, 04:10 PM
elwiggerlo - hahahaha bbk on your lawnmower.
On a side note - even if you are driving on the road with a BBK and some tractor trailer or a deer jumps out at you, i would say that having a BBK would be safer. I know thats a stretch but, i would definitely feel a tiny bit safer! who knows, maybe a BBK could save your 40,000 dollar investment (depreciating asset) but nonetheless i think its a wonderful upgrade.
simple test.
disable your ABS... slam on your brakes. do your tires lock? YES? your tires are the weakest link. NO? upgrade your brakes.
ABS enabled it's moot anyway because... well... you get it.
My old BBK. These are the rears. No pics of front. Stock calipers on larger rotors, mounted farther out obviously. Solid disk (this is old school). Braided lines, EBC Greenstuff. From FastBrakes. Lame, I know, but it was a decade ago, well before it's time.
http://i305.photobucket.com/albums/nn235/thepilotswhore/MVC-299X.jpg
swoardrider
03-10-2009, 08:19 PM
two words. sprung weight. you now have to SPIN those rotors to accelerate/decelerate. turning is not so much of an issue with power steering + overall weight of car.
on my motorcycles, the SECOND upgrade I always do is buy lighter wheels. they improve acceleration and allow the bike to swap sides in chicanes easier. first upgrade of course has always been suspension. holds true for cars IMO. first suspension, then power, then brakes. I don't drive like an idiot on the roads and I won't track the car so fade isn't an issue. even if it were, you can work just fine with better pads/lines/bleed the brakes between track sessions that day.
if I autox or otherwise track the car, the suspension becomes absolutely paramount (to include tires, NEVER overlook those!), then brakes (lines new fluid, good pad), then power. if you're tracking it, you should have fade resistant track pads on anyway!
having all the power in the world doesn't do you any good if your tires/suspension give up the ghost and you can't point your nose where you want it.
i digress.
Your logic, as well as others in this thread are funny to me. In the 15 years of being around the motorcycle and car track/race scene I've never heard of anyone saying suspension first or that BBK's are only for heavy track use. I don't know how many times I've seen stock cars running BBK's and sticky tires walk all over modified high HP cars with stiffer lowered suspension and stock brakes. I love it when I see POS gutless Neons and Probes with Stoptech's and Hoosiers looking like 4x4's running down $30k+, 300hp+ cars on the track.
Some people bitch the ride sucks when the suspension is modified. Some complain aftermarket exhausts and modified intakes are too loud. Or engine mods decrease mpg. Never heard anyone complaining that your car stops too good, or is too safe now. Also probably the one mod that doesn't decrease the vehicle's value, diminish vehicle life/reliability. Every mod I can think of right now has a negative trade off too except a BBK.
quattrosaint
03-10-2009, 11:24 PM
Just because they are the biggest doesn't mean they are the best. Alcon, Stoptech, and Brembo will outperform the ECS/Porsche setups like no ones business. A good rotor, pad, line, and fluid combo using the stock sizes and calipers will perform just as well as the ECS kits
Porsche kits are made by Brembo..... so how does it outperform the ECS kit that uses Porsche/Brembo calipers????
Alkemix
03-11-2009, 01:26 AM
two words. sprung weight. you now have to SPIN those rotors to accelerate/decelerate. turning is not so much of an issue with power steering + overall weight of car.
on my motorcycles, the SECOND upgrade I always do is buy lighter wheels. they improve acceleration and allow the bike to swap sides in chicanes easier. first upgrade of course has always been suspension. holds true for cars IMO. first suspension, then power, then brakes. I don't drive like an idiot on the roads and I won't track the car so fade isn't an issue. even if it were, you can work just fine with better pads/lines/bleed the brakes between track sessions that day.
if I autox or otherwise track the car, the suspension becomes absolutely paramount (to include tires, NEVER overlook those!), then brakes (lines new fluid, good pad), then power. if you're tracking it, you should have fade resistant track pads on anyway!
having all the power in the world doesn't do you any good if your tires/suspension give up the ghost and you can't point your nose where you want it.
i digress.
You brought up a very good point, and is the first good reason I've heard why this BBK purchase might have been unwise, BUT why the fuck is anyone even talking shit about this guy buying BBK?
swoardrider
03-11-2009, 01:44 AM
Porsche kits are made by Brembo..... so how does it outperform the ECS kit that uses Porsche/Brembo calipers????
Because Brembo is such a large company and makes so many OE products they have many different levels of quality/performance. Their OE stuff is typically good, but not at the level of their aftermarket stuff, and both are certainly not at the level of their race stuff. If you search AZ, you'll find many thread debates regarding Brembo and just how good their Gran Turismo aftermarket stuff is compared to the boutique type companies like AP Racing or Alcon at similar cost levels.
My thoughts with them is that they make good high quality products in all of their levels of performance, but their aftermarket stuff like the Gran Turismo kits are mass produced therefore detail to each specific application is somewhat lost vs. a small company which in many cases can be more vehicle specific. At the aftermarket level, maybe putting more emphasis on show then performance. Their race stuff however is top notch, yet to achieve this level can run in the $10k+ range.
9Hooker
03-11-2009, 03:40 AM
Every mod I can think of right now has a negative trade off too except a BBK.
Not saying it's BAD. For the same $$, I would do other things BEFORE a BBK. I don't see any "negative" to throwing on some Koni Red/Yellows first, lines/pads, tires... and still have money to spare.
A4ringedONE8T
03-11-2009, 04:39 AM
Porsche kits are made by Brembo..... so how does it outperform the ECS kit that uses Porsche/Brembo calipers????
BIG difference between the internal workings of a caliper made for a 5k lb SUV vs a 3500 lb car with a complete different weight bias and backed by a master cylinder which is much smaller and/or different whether they are made by the same manufacturer or not. What you have is a caliper designed to work for the Cayenne and the Cayenne master cylinder bolted to an A4 with an A4 master cylinder. Is that the same as a caliper from Brembo made to bolt to the A4 for the A4 master cylinder? I think not ... Some of you B7 guys have ALOT to learn!!!! [headbang]
Honestly, you clearly didnt do any research before buying that BBK from ECS, you bought the biggest and cheapest thing you could find. For your own good, do some research on Alcon, Brembo, and Stoptech on their designs and how they apply to the A4, and also their rotor design. ECS makes a cheap bling bling BBK, it is what it is. It will not compete with the others when ran hard, it wasn't designed to. I only hope they have solved their carrier issue. Quite a few people have had ECS carriers brake under moderate load in the past due to inferior design and/or quality of the part.
Everyone should try upgrading pads & fluid before assuming they need to upgrade to a BBK. Unless it is being done as bling.
BremboGuy
03-11-2009, 02:36 PM
My thoughts with them is that they make good high quality products in all of their levels of performance, but their aftermarket stuff like the Gran Turismo kits are mass produced therefore detail to each specific application is somewhat lost vs. a small company which in many cases can be more vehicle specific. At the aftermarket level, maybe putting more emphasis on show then performance. Their race stuff however is top notch, yet to achieve this level can run in the $10k+ range.
Hope this isn't a "thread jack".
It is relative to topics discussed within the thread, but a bit off base from the original OP's intended post.
Just an FYI...
Aftermarket GT (Gran Turismo) applications use identical discs to what is used in professional racing, with the addition of the patented McLaren hardware. The difference is that the discs are true floating (radially and axially) without the noises associated with a full race type disc. There is nothing lost here. These are the highest quality discs available, simply designed with a practical solution for the excessive noise. You'll see identical rotor part #'s being used in anything from World Challenge, Grand Am, ALMS, Rolex GT, WRC, NASCAR etc...
The calipers are a similar deal, being manufactured in the same facilities as much of the racing product. Again, nothing is "lost" in the design and development process for aftermarket kits, they are simply developed with practical changes to provide top level performance while also offering the ability to require less maintenance and avoid potential problems associated with long term use (specifically in the variety of scenarios such as road use, canyon driving, HPDE, and club level racing). A race caliper requires additional maintenance such a rebuilding, and has noise related issues such as pad "chatter" and/or brake squeal. There are design traits in the GT calipers such as outer dust boots that prevent the need for rebuilding as typical maintenance, and special pad retention hardware that prevents pad "chatter" and helps to prevent unwanted brake squeal.
The fact that they are available in different color options, and often in different disc diameters to suit larger wheel designs should not deter from the fact that these are some of the highest performing brake systems available. The reason that much of Brembo's "top level" racing product is more expensive is because there is a point where it becomes very expensive to continually improve the product and obtain the additional performance advantages from such similar products. The race systems often use more expensive raw materials, costly manufacturing processes and are produced in much lower quantities. The addition of benefits such as titanium piston inserts, internal plumbing (no cross over tubes to connect the fluid from one side of the caliper to the other), and vented caliper bodies take an already phenomenal product and put it at the level expected by world class teams in the most competitive racing series in the world.
The thought process should be that you are grabbing a LARGE piece of that pie, at a significantly lower price point. If you dissect a Brembo GT kit piece by piece, you be very hard pressed to find anywhere where there needs to be improvements in manufacturing quality, build quality, engineering & development, and overall performance.
lunch special
03-11-2009, 04:33 PM
I am taking the same finance class using the same book. I hate finance.
eastwick897
03-11-2009, 05:05 PM
I am taking the same finance class using the same book. I hate finance.
I love it dude, but it will suck if you have a real boring teacher.
lol at all the guys in here thinking you need a matching "rear bbk" or that a bbk is useless
quattrosaint
03-11-2009, 05:34 PM
BIG difference between the internal workings of a caliper made for a 5k lb SUV vs a 3500 lb car with a complete different weight bias and backed by a master cylinder which is much smaller and/or different whether they are made by the same manufacturer or not. What you have is a caliper designed to work for the Cayenne and the Cayenne master cylinder bolted to an A4 with an A4 master cylinder. Is that the same as a caliper from Brembo made to bolt to the A4 for the A4 master cylinder? I think not ... Some of you B7 guys have ALOT to learn!!!! [headbang]
Honestly, you clearly didnt do any research before buying that BBK from ECS, you bought the biggest and cheapest thing you could find. For your own good, do some research on Alcon, Brembo, and Stoptech on their designs and how they apply to the A4, and also their rotor design. ECS makes a cheap bling bling BBK, it is what it is. It will not compete with the others when ran hard, it wasn't designed to. I only hope they have solved their carrier issue. Quite a few people have had ECS carriers brake under moderate load in the past due to inferior design and/or quality of the part.
This forum has really gone down hill. I should just buy another B5 S4 so I dont have to deal with all these dicks who think the know everything! Its one thing to give useful information that will help us B7 guys, its another to be put down for the choices we make because you dont agree with them. Bottom line its my money and I will spend it how I see fit.
9Hooker
03-11-2009, 05:35 PM
lol at all the guys in here thinking you need a matching "rear bbk" or that a bbk is useless
well if you don't do something to the rear, the bias IS different... you can always get a manual valve but no one here will.
also, the top end gear is made of things like iron, ceramics, carbon just to name a few. consumer grade stuff even if made in the "same facilities" as an F1 product DO NOT mean they are of the same caliber.
well if you don't do something to the rear, the bias IS different... you can always get a manual valve but no one here will.
also, the top end gear is made of things like iron, ceramics, carbon just to name a few. consumer grade stuff even if made in the "same facilities" as an F1 product DO NOT mean they are of the same caliber.
a set of good brake pads in the rear will compliment a front bbk just fine. most of the bbks available to the prosumer are leaps and bounds above OEM.
9Hooker
03-11-2009, 06:01 PM
a set of good brake pads in the rear will compliment a front bbk just fine. most of the bbks available to the prosumer are leaps and bounds above OEM.
agree, but so what? a good set of pads/goodridge lines all around and high performance tires will also be leaps and bounds above OEM. remember, OEM is for the masses. moms dads soccer moms high school dropouts elderly... you get it. good enough for you and me for everyday driving. if upgrades are what you are looking for, know why you are doing it and what it buys you in terms of goods and others.
money can be better spent on other upgrades IMO... for power the chip and IC upgrade (air to liquid for me next week), for feel shocks (springs only for the stiffer rate, not the lowering), creature comforts (speaker replacement), etc.
A4ringedONE8T
03-11-2009, 06:25 PM
well if you don't do something to the rear, the bias IS different... you can always get a manual valve but no one here will.
also, the top end gear is made of things like iron, ceramics, carbon just to name a few. consumer grade stuff even if made in the "same facilities" as an F1 product DO NOT mean they are of the same caliber.
IMO the company that pays the most attention to details is Stasis/Alcon. They DO NOT recommend a rotor size upgrade in the rear unless you are running AT MINIMUM a 355 setup up front. Of course a pad and line upgrade for the rear will complement any BBK 328-355mm
A4ringedONE8T
03-11-2009, 06:29 PM
This forum has really gone down hill. I should just buy another B5 S4 so I dont have to deal with all these dicks who think the know everything!
You want to try and tell me a brake setup made for a completely different car works as well as one designed for a specific car? And I think I know everything? At least my arguement is true ... And give me a break, I work on these F'in cars everyday. I have either owned or installed and used pretty much every brake setup that is available for these cars, both OEM and aftermarket upgrades. I know what works well, what doesnt, and how they differ better than most people unless of course others of you own a VW/Audi tuning shop and do the same thing as I do everyday. Get rid of your attitude, no one is keeping you here, if you want a B5 S4 knock yourself out, I promose no one would miss you here [rolleyes]
quattrosaint
03-11-2009, 06:44 PM
You want to try and tell me a brake setup made for a completely different car works as well as one designed for a specific car? And I think I know everything? At least my arguement is true ... And give me a break, I work on these F'in cars everyday. I have either owned or installed and used pretty much every brake setup that is available for these cars, both OEM and aftermarket upgrades. I know what works well, what doesnt, and how they differ better than most people unless of course others of you own a VW/Audi tuning shop and do the same thing as I do everyday. Get rid of your attitude, no one is keeping you here, if you want a B5 S4 knock yourself out, I promose no one would miss you here [rolleyes]
So maybe instead of being an ass and saying that the kit I bought is shit why dont you try to tell me why. What makes others better. That would be some useful information that would benefit the forum. So why dont you loose you attitude and get the hell off your high horse. Just because you work on cars everyday does not mean you know everything. There are alot of Audi's over here in Dallas running the ECS big brake kit for years with no problems. And yes we track out cars. Here are some of our local tracks
http://www.motorsportranch.com/
http://www.eaglescanyon.com/2008/home.php
JumboBlack1.8
03-11-2009, 06:53 PM
So maybe instead of being an ass and saying that the kit I bought is shit why dont you try to tell me why. What makes others better.
He already did...
BIG difference between the internal workings of a caliper made for a 5k lb SUV vs a 3500 lb car with a complete different weight bias and backed by a master cylinder which is much smaller and/or different whether they are made by the same manufacturer or not. What you have is a caliper designed to work for the Cayenne and the Cayenne master cylinder bolted to an A4 with an A4 master cylinder. Is that the same as a caliper from Brembo made to bolt to the A4 for the A4 master cylinder? I think not ...
[up]
swoardrider
03-11-2009, 08:30 PM
So maybe instead of being an ass and saying that the kit I bought is shit why dont you try to tell me why. What makes others better. That would be some useful information that would benefit the forum. So why dont you loose you attitude and get the hell off your high horse. Just because you work on cars everyday does not mean you know everything. There are alot of Audi's over here in Dallas running the ECS big brake kit for years with no problems. And yes we track out cars. Here are some of our local tracks
http://www.motorsportranch.com/
http://www.eaglescanyon.com/2008/home.php
Not trying to start a fight, fuel a fire, or put anyone's products/decisions down, but the education I got from this website gave me a lot of insight on how a BBK works and is R&D'd. The chart is for an S4.
http://www.zeckhausen.com/Testing_Brakes.htm#Summary
This is what led me to choose my Alcon/Stasis kit. I figured any company that specializes in our cars and races them on a national level would be the best at making it right.
I think of it as kind of like buying a suit off the rack vs. a custom hand tailored suit. Both could be Armani's but if Giorgio himself hand tailored it, I would think its gonna be that much better. When it comes to brakes on the track, I'd hate to be wrong. Could mean life or death!
quattrosaint
03-11-2009, 11:11 PM
Not trying to start a fight, fuel a fire, or put anyone's products/decisions down, but the education I got from this website gave me a lot of insight on how a BBK works and is R&D'd. The chart is for an S4.
http://www.zeckhausen.com/Testing_Brakes.htm#Summary
This is what led me to choose my Alcon/Stasis kit. I figured any company that specializes in our cars and races them on a national level would be the best at making it right.
I think of it as kind of like buying a suit off the rack vs. a custom hand tailored suit. Both could be Armani's but if Giorgio himself hand tailored it, I would think its gonna be that much better. When it comes to brakes on the track, I'd hate to be wrong. Could mean life or death!
Very cool, thank you very much!
quattrosaint
03-11-2009, 11:17 PM
He already did...
[up]
Looks like I was being an as too. Sorry guys
Monkey77
05-31-2009, 05:14 PM
Why not? If I had all the money I wanted, I'd buy a BBK for my lawnmower.
hahahah
Tgr_Clw
05-31-2009, 08:59 PM
This is a fun thread. BBK > OEM.