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a4mafia
09-18-2008, 11:57 AM
okay so i came up with a list and the price and the website. should this be good? also there are a couple things i cant find so i need some help.[confused]



A4 Big Turbo Setup

-GT3076R Turbo: $1250 www.ecodetuning.com

-SPA Manifold: $495 www.034motorsprt.com

-Southbend Stage 3 Clutch: $600 www.ecodetuning.com

Eurodyne Tuning: $750 www.eurodyne.ca

-630cc Injectors:?

-Test Pipe: $395 www.atpturbo.com

-SCAT Rods: $375 www.034motorsport.com

-Turbo Timer: $100 www.ecodetuning.com

-Boost Controller: $165 www.ecodetuning.com

-Intercooler?

-Forge BOV/DV Splitter: 160 www.ecodetuning.com

-MAF: $150 www.034motorsport.com

-Lines?

-Silicone?

let me know anything. my mind is open.

Jibberific
09-18-2008, 12:08 PM
i think you should be able to find a test pipe for less than 400 bucks. that's kind of a lot

Jung
09-18-2008, 12:08 PM
higher flowing head would definitely be on my list also. it'll help out the top end power made available by this large of a turbo.
stroker kit (2.0)
ARP bolts

Jung
09-18-2008, 12:09 PM
i think you should be able to find a test pipe for less than 400 bucks. that's kind of a lot

my test pipes on my S are less than 30 bucks each. go to an exhaust shop and have them fab up a pipe for you, 02 bung, spacer, weld it on, you're good to go

Don Supreme
09-18-2008, 12:12 PM
Your list needs a lot of work...................................

Please read the other thread on this topic. Its still on the front page of this forum and it has a better list.

njm23
09-18-2008, 12:14 PM
running a GT30 I would suggest building the head, on a 1.8 your not going to take full advantage of the turbo only revving to 7000 and on stock cams. And IDK what would make you think a stage 3 clutch would be okay, you want atleast the stage 4 if not stage 5. EDIT: Also would suggest replacing all your rod/main bearings and piston rings since you gotta do rods anyway. Theres a recent thread about this look at it.

AudiRacerS4
09-18-2008, 12:17 PM
running a GT30 I would suggest building the head, on a 1.8 your not going to take full advantage of the turbo only revving to 7000 and on stock cams. And IDK what would make you think a stage 3 clutch would be okay, you want atleast the stage 4 if not stage 5

x2 and your list is missing a lot of stuff that you are going to need or want to replace while you are in there. seals, rings, bearings, etc.

jturnbull
09-18-2008, 02:51 PM
http://www.kineticmotorsport.com/products/97_05_1_8T_A4_FE_Series_Stage_5-597-139.html


heres a south bend stage 5 for $50 more

Wizard-of-OD
09-18-2008, 02:57 PM
His list is partial....

djwimbo
09-18-2008, 04:15 PM
Call up 034MS, or BobQ and get a total breakdown of what's needed.

Otherwise PM Issam, Mike, or any of the other members that know more of wtf they're doing.

mike-2ptzero
09-18-2008, 04:29 PM
http://www.kineticmotorsport.com/products/97_05_1_8T_A4_FE_Series_Stage_5-597-139.html


heres a south bend stage 5 for $50 more

How about stage 5 for $1 less then that and free ground shipping (48 states)?[>_<]

But I am not sure where he got the stage 3 price for $600 when it retails for $450 + shipping.

GetBoosted84
09-19-2008, 08:13 AM
<Shameless Plug>

FS: ATP 3" Downpipe (http://www.audizine.com/classifieds/showproduct.php?product=1747)

</Shameless Plug>

onemoremile
09-19-2008, 10:08 AM
If you crack open the bottom end to do any work then put it back together with longevity in mind. The additional reliability gained by performing a basic rebuild will mean a lot when pushing 125 hp out of each cylinder. At the very least you should replace the rod bearing shells, piston rings, gaskets, and seals. Timing belt too.

JumboBlack1.8
09-19-2008, 10:54 AM
U dont need a turbo timer

t1demont1
09-19-2008, 11:01 AM
you dont need a tt. However that atp "Testpipe" wont work with a spa manifold. the turbo position is different. Like everyone else said with a gt3076. Your gonna wanna do rods, piston rings, main and rod bearings, and arp main bolts, you will also want a head gasket kit since your gonna need to pull the head for that kind of work. which requires head bolts as well. IF you dont wanna do bottom end work, I would reccomend a 2871r at the very most.

AudiA4_20T
09-19-2008, 08:33 PM
Give yourself ~$1k for just the bottom end build, and $1500 if u dont do the rods ureself

1fstavant
09-20-2008, 04:13 AM
you cna run a stg 3...but its better to go bigger and beefier....

or youll end up like me afraid to launch your car

djwimbo
09-20-2008, 09:42 AM
or youll end up like me afraid to launch your car

X2,... Until I manned up and now I'm decent at it.

onemoremile
09-20-2008, 09:56 AM
Give yourself ~$1k for just the bottom end build, and $1500 if u dont do the rods ureself

Sounds about right. Especially if you need to buy some tools for the project. [up]

It can be done cheaper though. Mine was around 700 and that included all of the PCV valves and parts (~2 bills) and a new oil pump. TQMB5's was probably cheaper than mine including that janky engine stand. [>_<]

The only problem with these rod swapped homebrews is that the balance might not be as perfect. Since we build these things for 3076 sized turbos and playtime lasts past 8,000 rpm that could present a longevity problem. Mine was done 2 year and 30k miles ago and is smooth like butta. I cleaned the rods up and tossed them and the pistons on the digital scale at the bike shop.

onemoremile
09-20-2008, 10:00 AM
I've had the Southbend OFE with SS pressure plate for over 4 years and about 60k miles. I'd go one step up for a 3076. Although it could probably handle race gas pulls I know mine would be happier with less than 450 torques ripping at it. When I bought it the rating was 420 Awtq or 450 Fwtq.

Wizard-of-OD
09-21-2008, 01:46 AM
you dont need a tt. However that atp "Testpipe" wont work with a spa manifold. the turbo position is different. Like everyone else said with a gt3076. Your gonna wanna do rods, piston rings, main and rod bearings, and arp main bolts, you will also want a head gasket kit since your gonna need to pull the head for that kind of work. which requires head bolts as well. IF you dont wanna do bottom end work, I would reccomend a 2871r at the very most.
Brenden I allready have the downpipes working out for him if he wants the SPA manifold:

http://i226.photobucket.com/albums/dd25/issamabed/SPAdownpipe.jpg

t1demont1
09-21-2008, 10:15 AM
Yeah ive been seeing that everywhere Issam, that downpipe looks too nice.

317ssayzarc
09-21-2008, 10:25 AM
The only problem with these rod swapped homebrews is that the balance might not be as perfect. Since we build these things for 3076 sized turbos and playtime lasts past 8,000 rpm that could present a longevity problem. Mine was done 2 year and 30k miles ago and is smooth like butta. I cleaned the rods up and tossed them and the pistons on the digital scale at the bike shop.

Agreed that balance is an issue on homebrewed setups, but rods are SO good these days that its not the biggest issue imo... All of my rods were within .6 of a gram, I went further and went to .1 of a gram, but Im sure .6 would have been fine... The biggest issue is when people throw bearings in there without mic'ing the clearances, and then people wonder why they spin bearings lol... What did you balance your motor to? I did less than a gram for the crank/flywheel/pulley, and .1 gram for pistons/rods

a4mafia(Red)
11-10-2008, 05:09 PM
U dont need a turbo timer and while your at it. forget the front mount too....hey, and what the hell do you want rods for? that will like make your engine not blow and stuff right....

AudiRacerS4
11-10-2008, 05:11 PM
and while your at it. forget the front mount too....hey, and what the hell do you want rods for? that will like make your engine not blow and stuff right....

you really dont need a turbo timer

bassed
11-10-2008, 05:35 PM
Brenden I allready have the downpipes working out for him if he wants the SPA manifold:

http://i226.photobucket.com/albums/dd25/issamabed/SPAdownpipe.jpg

Do you have any in the bay pics yet? Curious how that will clear.

JumboBlack1.8
11-10-2008, 05:46 PM
and while your at it. forget the front mount too....hey, and what the hell do you want rods for? that will like make your engine not blow and stuff right....

U tryin to mock me?......lots of people dont use these....they're pointles...but go ahead and waste ur money if u'd like [up]

JumboBlack1.8
11-10-2008, 05:48 PM
Do you have any in the bay pics yet? Curious how that will clear.

x2.....really interested in gettin one of these down the road......whats the general pricing on these? I never saw it listed anywhere

a4mafia
11-11-2008, 08:10 PM
and while your at it. forget the front mount too....hey, and what the hell do you want rods for? that will like make your engine not blow and stuff right....
haha I love u justin lol not in a gay way though...

Kyle H
11-11-2008, 08:33 PM
here is a list I put together a couple of months ago with the help of some guys on here... you may need to tweak it a bit for the direction you're going.

Part:.........................Cost:
gt3071......................1100
spa manifold................460
wastegate setup..........230
630cc injectors...........260
ctapp tune (pump).......700
lightning maf...............120
3" catback ...............750
hfc...........................250
fmic .........................900
scat rods....................400
rod bearings.................80
main bearings...............60
piston rings ................150
main bolts...................20
sb stg 4.....................600
walbro 255..................100
a/f+oil gauge................430
ebc...........................400
misc...........................1500

Total:.......................8510

sean1.8t
11-12-2008, 01:05 AM
depending on how you are planning on driving the car. i would really consider tweaking your clutch setup past the generic stg 3/4/5 options.

talk to Mike Hood about this. he knows what im talking about and will get you a good price

Pete@IE
11-12-2008, 10:56 AM
We've got lots of IE 144 x 20's in stock, I can do them for $350 with free shipping. We've also got 630's in stock for $47 each. I'll also price match on the exhaust manifold which I have in stock as well.

Hit me up I'll throw you together a little combo pack. pete@intengineering.com

a4mafia
11-12-2008, 12:49 PM
here is a list I put together a couple of months ago with the help of some guys on here... you may need to tweak it a bit for the direction you're going.

Part:.........................Cost:
gt3071......................1100
spa manifold................460
wastegate setup..........230
630cc injectors...........260
ctapp tune (pump).......700
lightning maf...............120
3" catback ...............750
hfc...........................250
fmic .........................900
scat rods....................400
rod bearings.................80
main bearings...............60
piston rings ................150
main bolts...................20
sb stg 4.....................600
walbro 255..................100
a/f+oil gauge................430
ebc...........................400
misc...........................1500

Total:.......................8510

i can find most of that stuff way cheaper

Wizard-of-OD
11-12-2008, 04:48 PM
Do you have any in the bay pics yet? Curious how that will clear.
Clears just fine.We have a half cut here that we use for mocking up all our parts.
[:)]

pipe7284
11-12-2008, 04:58 PM
Issam is a great guy to deal with, he can answer all your questions no matter how stupid they seem. and can guide you for a build you will never regret.

a4mafia
11-12-2008, 06:16 PM
Issam is a great guy to deal with, he can answer all your questions no matter how stupid they seem. and can guide you for a build you will never regret.
^x2!

Kyle H
11-12-2008, 07:35 PM
i can find most of that stuff way cheaper

I know, I just posted it so you have a guideline of parts to get for the most part.

The prices are a high estimate to compensate for tax and shipping. Good luck [up]

a4mafia
11-12-2008, 08:25 PM
I know, I just posted it so you have a guideline of parts to get for the most part.

The prices are a high estimate to compensate for tax and shipping. Good luck [up]

I appreciate the help bec I need it. Does anyone know if a state 2 ignition required?

A4Rob
11-12-2008, 08:30 PM
I appreciate the help bec I need it. Does anyone know if a state 2 ignition required?

no

oh and wtf is that software you want to run?!


I appreciate the help bec I need it.

Maybe Search more to find answers?

a4mafia(Red)
11-12-2008, 08:51 PM
you really dont need a turbo timer

so when your driving around. maybe you'll get on it a couple times and then you arrive at your destination and shut off the car?....letting your oil bake and in your 800+ Degree turbo(turbos can idle at 20000 rpm)?!?!?!?!? is this what your trying to tell me?



lots of people blow their stock turbos bc they dont wait 45 seconds at the end of driving(as recommended by audi) when they're reallll hot and the oil sludges up and eventually blocks up the flow....

JumboBlack1.8
11-12-2008, 08:53 PM
so when your driving around. maybe you'll get on it a couple times and then you arrive at your destination and shut off the car?....letting your oil bake and in your 800+ Degree turbo(turbos can idle at 20000 rpm)?!?!?!?!? is this what your trying to tell me?



lots of people blow their stock turbos bc they dont wait 45 seconds at the end of driving(as recommended by audi) when they're reallll hot and the oil sludges up and eventually blocks up the flow....

Simple solution.......let ur car cool down on ur own.....thats what everyone who knows better will do[up]

I personally let mine cool for at least a minute or two

No need for a turbo timer

sixfiveoh
11-12-2008, 08:54 PM
so when your driving around. maybe you'll get on it a couple times and then you arrive at your destination and shut off the car?....letting your oil bake and in your 800+ Degree turbo(turbos can idle at 20000 rpm)?!?!?!?!? is this what your trying to tell me?



lots of people blow their stock turbos bc they dont wait 45 seconds at the end of driving(as recommended by audi) when they're reallll hot and the oil sludges up and eventually blocks up the flow....

IIRC, coolant still cools our turbos even after the motor is shut off, making my turbo timer really just another little toy with flashing lights in my cabin [:p]

Wizard-of-OD
11-12-2008, 09:37 PM
IIRC, coolant still cools our turbos even after the motor is shut off, making my turbo timer really just another little toy with flashing lights in my cabin [:p]
How if the water pump is not rotating?

AudiRacerS4
11-13-2008, 06:40 AM
so when your driving around. maybe you'll get on it a couple times and then you arrive at your destination and shut off the car?....letting your oil bake and in your 800+ Degree turbo(turbos can idle at 20000 rpm)?!?!?!?!? is this what your trying to tell me?



lots of people blow their stock turbos bc they dont wait 45 seconds at the end of driving(as recommended by audi) when they're reallll hot and the oil sludges up and eventually blocks up the flow....

I'd rather just let my car idle for 2-3 min after ripping on it then waste money on a turbo timer. If you have the extra cash for one by all means go for it but you don't need one....you're comparing apples to oranges rods and turbo timers are not on the same level [cool]

a4mafia
11-13-2008, 09:54 AM
no

oh and wtf is that software you want to run?!



Maybe Search more to find answers?
okay well you dont gotta be a douche about it. im searching. trust me. ive spent the last two months of my life searching. jsut trying to get inputs thats all. and i saw someone with a stage 2 ignition with a gt3071. idk what software but he had it.

a4mafia
11-13-2008, 09:55 AM
so when your driving around. maybe you'll get on it a couple times and then you arrive at your destination and shut off the car?....letting your oil bake and in your 800+ Degree turbo(turbos can idle at 20000 rpm)?!?!?!?!? is this what your trying to tell me?



lots of people blow their stock turbos bc they dont wait 45 seconds at the end of driving(as recommended by audi) when they're reallll hot and the oil sludges up and eventually blocks up the flow....
Touché!

sean1.8t
11-13-2008, 01:40 PM
no. not touche.

i never let my car sit for more than 10 seconds after im done driving it. you don't need a turbo timer, and you don't have to sit in your car for 1-2 minutes after parking. that is just asinine.

for the last minute of driving, just stay in as much vacume as possible. the air moving around the turbo while the car is in motion will cool it down far better than if you just sit stagnent in a parking spot.

if im able to coast for a few seconds before i park, i throw it into neutral and let it coast til i park. bam. done

Yasek
11-13-2008, 03:50 PM
turbo timer is a luxury not a necessity, its like having toilet paper that comes scented, so when u unroll it, it freshens the bathroom (they have those)... while you will be fine with unscented paper, and just have the bathroom stink for a bit.

I got a timer in my car, have not used it once. Previous owners doing, soon to be pulled out and replaced for something useful like EBC.

1fstavant
11-13-2008, 03:57 PM
[QUOTE=Yasek;3062874]turbo timer is a luxury not a necessity, its like having toilet paper that comes scented, so when u unroll it, it freshens the bathroom (they have those)... while you will be fine with unscented paper, and just have the bathroom stink for a bit.QUOTE]

fin hysterical and soo true [>_<]

bassed
11-13-2008, 04:06 PM
turbo timer is a luxury not a necessity, its like having toilet paper that comes scented, so when u unroll it, it freshens the bathroom (they have those)... while you will be fine with unscented paper, and just have the bathroom stink for a bit.

I got a timer in my car, have not used it once. Previous owners doing, soon to be pulled out and replaced for something useful like EBC.

2nd that. Music is my turbo timer and has been for 6 years and 3 turbo setups. Cruise for last 5 minutes of your drive and enjoy a song or track, park, turn ignition off and then walk to your final destination.

As for the build peep the projects section and call Joe at Axis, he's just as helpful and knowlegable as Issam. He's closer to you which means less shipping and he carries all the same products and parts. He won't over sell you and is hands down the best to deal with IMO. He's another option.

a4mafia(Red)
11-13-2008, 04:24 PM
I'd rather just let my car idle for 2-3 min after ripping on it then waste money on a turbo timer. If you have the extra cash for one by all means go for it but you don't need one....you're comparing apples to oranges rods and turbo timers are not on the same level [cool]

haha apples to oranges is very true...lol i was just bein a dick....but if you can afford the whole turbo set up, rods and all....turbo timer is not expensive. also if your running late, you probably drive fast, and you probably wont wait...how many times will this happen?(ive heard lots of stories of ppl blowin BT's after 10 or 20k miles)

its not necessarily a luxury, more of a safety precaution....its probably more of soft toilet paper vs. the shit that feels like a pine cone..not scented vs unscented.

sean1.8t
11-13-2008, 06:05 PM
(ive heard lots of stories of ppl blowin BT's after 10 or 20k miles)


that is due to most likely 2 things:

it's an old T series journal bearing turbo. the GT series turbo's cool down internities faster than T seres turbo's

it's not due to them not using a turbotimer. it's most likely them running their turbo's hard and past their effeciency. wrong oil restrictors, etc..

its not necessarily a luxury, more of a safety precaution....i

no, its not. you aren't listening.

turbo timers are 1)novelty items. and 2)useless except for the companies that make them

AudiA4_20T
11-13-2008, 06:07 PM
2nd that. Music is my turbo timer and has been for 6 years and 3 turbo setups. Cruise for last 5 minutes of your drive and enjoy a song or track, park, turn ignition off and then walk to your final destination.

True, whenever Im with bitties I always tell them I really like the song thats on so I sit for another minute or two

a4mafia(Red)
11-14-2008, 02:31 PM
no, its not. you aren't listening.

turbo timers are 1)novelty items. and 2)useless except for the companies that make them

ok i am READING what your saying and i just dont feel the same way....first of all they are not novelty items....Novelty:an article of trade whose value is chiefly decorative......do what you want, but i'm pretty sure he'll end up getting a turbo timer

a4mafia
11-19-2008, 04:49 PM
okay so i came up with a list and the price and the website. should this be good? also there are a couple things i cant find so i need some help.[confused]



A4 Big Turbo Setup

-GT3076R Turbo: $1250 www.ecodetuning.com

-SPA Manifold: $495 www.034motorsprt.com

-Southbend Stage 3 Clutch: $600 www.ecodetuning.com

Eurodyne Tuning: $750 www.eurodyne.ca

-630cc Injectors:?

-Test Pipe: $395 www.atpturbo.com

-SCAT Rods: $375 www.034motorsport.com

-Turbo Timer: $100 www.ecodetuning.com

-Boost Controller: $165 www.ecodetuning.com

-Intercooler?

-Forge BOV/DV Splitter: 160 www.ecodetuning.com

-MAF: $150 www.034motorsport.com

-Lines?

-Silicone?

let me know anything. my mind is open.
supposed to be stage 5 not stage 3. and my list is changing everyday. Find out something new, something better, you all know how it goes

B5A4Kevin
11-19-2008, 06:26 PM
In "Maximum Boost," Corky Bell on turbo timers:

"When an engine is turned off, the instant the spark is discontinued, heat available to the turbo for its driving power is removed, and the turbo stops. Generally, the turbo will stop before the engine's rotation ceases. A nonrotating turbo needs no lubrication.

Removing heat from a turbo is always a good idea. However, a turbo that is already air cooled, oil cooled, and probably water cooled is going to enjoy little extra benefit from one more quart or so of oil pumped through it to cool it. Not cost-effective."

"What is all that jazz about coking your turbo bearings?

Although I tend to think journalists are responsible for coked turbo bearings, it might be that never changing the oil is a more likely culprit. In actual practice, if one lets the engine idle for 30 seconds before shutdown, changes the oil every 2000 miles, and uses high quality oil, turbo lubrication failures aren't going to happen. Water-cooled bearings ensure that bearing housing temperatures never reach the oil breakdown temperature. Please resist the idea of "oilers and lubers" (oil system aids) as the savior of turbo bearings. The advertised merits of these devices is based on fallacious information. In my opinion, they are worthless."

JumboBlack1.8
11-19-2008, 07:25 PM
In "Maximum Boost," Corky Bell on turbo timers:

"When an engine is turned off, the instant the spark is discontinued, heat available to the turbo for its driving power is removed, and the turbo stops. Generally, the turbo will stop before the engine's rotation ceases. A nonrotating turbo needs no lubrication.

Removing heat from a turbo is always a good idea. However, a turbo that is already air cooled, oil cooled, and probably water cooled is going to enjoy little extra benefit from one more quart or so of oil pumped through it to cool it. Not cost-effective."

"What is all that jazz about coking your turbo bearings?

Although I tend to think journalists are responsible for coked turbo bearings, it might be that never changing the oil is a more likely culprit. In actual practice, if one lets the engine idle for 30 seconds before shutdown, changes the oil every 2000 miles, and uses high quality oil, turbo lubrication failures aren't going to happen. Water-cooled bearings ensure that bearing housing temperatures never reach the oil breakdown temperature. Please resist the idea of "oilers and lubers" (oil system aids) as the savior of turbo bearings. The advertised merits of these devices is based on fallacious information. In my opinion, they are worthless."

Word[up]

JumboBlack1.8
11-20-2008, 11:50 AM
Is someone out there really so sensitive that they had to negative rep me for that ^^^......grow up

sean1.8t
11-20-2008, 03:00 PM
Is someone out there really so sensitive that they had to negative rep me for that ^^^......grow up

they definately shouldn't have since the post rings true.

i'll swing the rep back the other way for you.


and don't you hate it when people rep you(especially negatively) and don't have the balls to sign it... fucking losers.

i helped answer a question for someone and got a negative rep with not signature. i don't really care for the rep either way. but at least let me know who you are

317ssayzarc
11-20-2008, 03:02 PM
As of December 1st, you can see who left that rep for you Justin, and any other reps you've gotten or will get [;)]

JumboBlack1.8
11-20-2008, 03:03 PM
they definately shouldn't have since the post rings true.

i'll swing the rep back the other way for you.


and don't you hate it when people rep you(especially negatively) and don't have the balls to sign it... fucking losers.

i helped answer a question for someone and got a negative rep with not signature. i don't really care for the rep either way. but at least let me know who you are

Its just the principle man.....the rep was put in place to help clean up the community a bit and to help prevent trolls and suspect characters from ruining shit.....but it is NOT intended to be used like this when someone just doesn't agree with you.....thats completely childish

a4mafia(Red)
11-20-2008, 07:11 PM
first off, i promise you it was not me who left the negative rep for you....i'm just saying this bc we've been arguing for awhile and you may think it is.


In "Maximum Boost," Corky Bell on turbo timers:

"When an engine is turned off, the instant the spark is discontinued, heat available to the turbo for its driving power is removed, and the turbo stops. Generally, the turbo will stop before the engine's rotation ceases. A nonrotating turbo needs no lubrication.

Removing heat from a turbo is always a good idea. However, a turbo that is already air cooled, oil cooled, and probably water cooled is going to enjoy little extra benefit from one more quart or so of oil pumped through it to cool it. Not cost-effective."

"What is all that jazz about coking your turbo bearings?

Although I tend to think journalists are responsible for coked turbo bearings, it might be that never changing the oil is a more likely culprit. In actual practice, if one lets the engine idle for 30 seconds before shutdown, changes the oil every 2000 miles, and uses high quality oil, turbo lubrication failures aren't going to happen. Water-cooled bearings ensure that bearing housing temperatures never reach the oil breakdown temperature. Please resist the idea of "oilers and lubers" (oil system aids) as the savior of turbo bearings. The advertised merits of these devices is based on fallacious information. In my opinion, they are worthless."


ok, first off, i don't give a fuck about what corky bell thinks about turbo timers.....second, he says and i pull this from the last sentence of the quote "In my opinion"....if you want a straight(non opinionated) answer on whether or not they are necessary, ask god.[hail] the facts are, it will prolong the life of your oil, which will prolong the life of your turbo charger and engine.

if you want to look like a stalker and chill in your car for an amount of time after driving you can. if you idle it for too long or too little it can be hurtful to your turbo bearings, but turbo timers take how high you rev and how long you drive into account when keeping your car idling and shut it off accordingly.

spending $5 a quart on oil that's rated to last 18000 miles and changing it every 2 is not practical and way more of a waste of money than a $90 turbo timer.

mike-2ptzero
11-20-2008, 08:22 PM
first off, i promise you it was not me who left the negative rep for you....i'm just saying this bc we've been arguing for awhile and you may think it is.




ok, first off, i don't give a fuck about what corky bell thinks about turbo timers.....second, he says and i pull this from the last sentence of the quote "In my opinion"....if you want a straight(non opinionated) answer on whether or not they are necessary, ask god.[hail] the facts are, it will prolong the life of your oil, which will prolong the life of your turbo charger and engine.

if you want to look like a stalker and chill in your car for an amount of time after driving you can. if you idle it for too long or too little it can be hurtful to your turbo bearings, but turbo timers take how high you rev and how long you drive into account when keeping your car idling and shut it off accordingly.

spending $5 a quart on oil that's rated to last 18000 miles and changing it every 2 is not practical and way more of a waste of money than a $90 turbo timer.

So you drive your car at WOT, then slam on the brakes to jump out of the car? You must be road racing your car all day long or ditching your car because cops are chasing you.

Nearly every person here that is pushing their cars very hard end up driving 1-2 minutes off boost before they turn the car off, at that point a turbo timer is just a gadget that does nothing more then what the driver just did. There is no reason to leave the car running at idle once the car has been driven easy for 1-2 minutes just before shutting it off.

B5A4Kevin
11-21-2008, 08:57 AM
ok, first off, i don't give a fuck about what corky bell thinks about turbo timers.....second, he says and i pull this from the last sentence of the quote "In my opinion"....if you want a straight(non opinionated) answer on whether or not they are necessary, ask god.[hail] the facts are, it will prolong the life of your oil, which will prolong the life of your turbo charger and engine.
The entire reason i posted that was to give a professional opinion about the subject. You have yet to show any evidence directly linking turbo failure to the lack of a turbo timer. Meanwhile there's numerous people on these forums who don't use one and have not run into any problems. The OP is asking for opinions on his build list. No one is stopping you or him from running one, but it is the opinion of the majority that it is pointless.


if you want to look like a stalker and chill in your car for an amount of time after driving you can. if you idle it for too long or too little it can be hurtful to your turbo bearings, but turbo timers take how high you rev and how long you drive into account when keeping your car idling and shut it off accordingly.

As in Corky Bell's quote, how much is it going to help and air-cooled, oil-cooled, and water cooled turbo to stay running for another 1-2minutes? I'm not sure about the BAT community as i haven't upgraded my personal car yet, but even with a k03s, its extremely hard to stay in boost in a parking lot or a residential street/driveway unless you are really trying to be a dick or run someone over. this is ample enough time to let the turbo reach a normal temperature after a spirited run. They may exist, but I have yet to see a turbo timer that chooses to idle for 1.75 minutes after shut-down because i revved to 7200 miles 6 times in the last 12 minutes. the ones i see are adjustable and usually set in minute and/or second increments by the driver.



spending $5 a quart on oil that's rated to last 18000 miles and changing it every 2 is not practical and way more of a waste of money than a $90 turbo timer.

This book was published in 1997. Synthetic oil technology has grown in leaps and bounds in the last 11 years. The original quote is directed towards people who turbocharge their SBC's and other V8's and then put storebrand conventional oil in it and run it for 5-10k miles. I dont feel like posting the whole book, but maybe you should read it, and learn something. hope this helps. [up]

sean1.8t
11-21-2008, 09:08 AM
guys, give it up. he just wants to impress people with his ghost running car.

"did you forget to turn off your car man?"

"naw mang, the turbo'z on a timerzzzzz!!!"

[:D]

a4mafia
11-21-2008, 12:02 PM
im still new on here. wat are all the abbreviations? i know what BAT is. whats WOT? and also, what are the rings about?

sean1.8t
11-21-2008, 01:36 PM
im still new on here. wat are all the abbreviations? i know what BAT is. whats WOT? and also, what are the rings about?

you'd be amazed at what you can learn in this thread [;)]

http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php?t=113728

a4mafia
11-21-2008, 02:08 PM
you'd be amazed at what you can learn in this thread [;)]

http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php?t=113728
thanks man. thats alot of info to take in. lol. but that did help out alot even though most of it was stuff i already knew (mostly the basics).

a4mafia(Red)
11-21-2008, 03:04 PM
So you drive your car at WOT, then slam on the brakes to jump out of the car? You must be road racing your car all day long or ditching your car because cops are chasing you.

Nearly every person here that is pushing their cars very hard end up driving 1-2 minutes off boost before they turn the car off, at that point a turbo timer is just a gadget that does nothing more then what the driver just did. There is no reason to leave the car running at idle once the car has been driven easy for 1-2 minutes just before shutting it off.


first off, we stopped being dicks awhile ago.....but 1-2 minutes on a big turbo set up is not an adequate amount of time for it to cool down....majority of the time.




The entire reason i posted that was to give a professional opinion about the subject. You have yet to show any evidence directly linking turbo failure to the lack of a turbo timer. Meanwhile there's numerous people on these forums who don't use one and have not run into any problems. The OP is asking for opinions on his build list. No one is stopping you or him from running one, but it is the opinion of the majority that it is pointless.

As in Corky Bell's quote, how much is it going to help and air-cooled, oil-cooled, and water cooled turbo to stay running for another 1-2minutes? I'm not sure about the BAT community as i haven't upgraded my personal car yet, but even with a k03s, its extremely hard to stay in boost in a parking lot or a residential street/driveway unless you are really trying to be a dick or run someone over. this is ample enough time to let the turbo reach a normal temperature after a spirited run. They may exist, but I have yet to see a turbo timer that chooses to idle for 1.75 minutes after shut-down because i revved to 7200 miles 6 times in the last 12 minutes. the ones i see are adjustable and usually set in minute and/or second increments by the driver.



This book was published in 1997. Synthetic oil technology has grown in leaps and bounds in the last 11 years. The original quote is directed towards people who turbocharge their SBC's and other V8's and then put storebrand conventional oil in it and run it for 5-10k miles. I dont feel like posting the whole book, but maybe you should read it, and learn something. hope this helps. [up]


ok first, i understand why you put corky bells quote up there. thanks for that, its just that i could go find some other well respected man in the engineering world and post his quote up there too, but i'm not.

secondly, my friend who is a mechanic at audi has told me that on several occasions people come in who have blown their turbos....as i previously stated audi recommends 45 seconds of idling after driving harder.

third, i cannot personally show you people who have blown their turbos bc of oil sludge, but i have many friends(ish) who drive hondas that this has happened to. i do not know many people who have tuned up audis bc the parts are much more costly.

sean1.8t
11-21-2008, 04:16 PM
first off, we stopped being dicks awhile ago.....but 1-2 minutes on a big turbo set up is not an adequate amount of time for it to cool down....majority of the time.



god you are so clueless man.

have fun wasting gas and your time

mike-2ptzero
11-21-2008, 05:01 PM
first off, we stopped being dicks awhile ago.....but 1-2 minutes on a big turbo set up is not an adequate amount of time for it to cool down....majority of the time.





Odd, I drive my car about 30 seconds before turning it off after making a run from 0-140 mph and I run a GT35r. So your going to tell me what is or is not adequate for a big turbo setup?


Wish to post up a picture of that "Big turbo" you have under your hood?

JumboBlack1.8
11-22-2008, 12:31 AM
You completely contradict yourself.....you say that 1-2 minutes isn't adequate.....THEN you say audi recommends 45 secs of idle to cool it down.........dude.....just admit ur wrong. The guys who've posted on this thread are NOT just talkin out their asses to make you look bad......our methods have been tested over long periods of time with cars that're track driven. A turbo timer is NOT necessary........period

mike-2ptzero
11-22-2008, 06:33 AM
Didn't you know 4ring status = NOOB[;)]


I guess I became BAT #1 because I dont know squat.[:p]

pipe7284
11-22-2008, 06:38 AM
you posted here for opinions and see what we can help you on...just LISTEN to what we have to say, specially from Mike.

a4mafia(Red)
11-22-2008, 07:56 AM
You completely contradict yourself.....you say that 1-2 minutes isn't adequate.....THEN you say audi recommends 45 secs of idle to cool it down.........dude.....just admit ur wrong. The guys who've posted on this thread are NOT just talkin out their asses to make you look bad......our methods have been tested over long periods of time with cars that're track driven. A turbo timer is NOT necessary........period

dude, i never contradicted myself......i said 45 seconds is recommended by audi for STOCK A4'S. 1-2 minutes is not adequate for BIG TURBOS......(depending on how you drove)


Didn't you know 4ring status = NOOB[;)]


I guess I became BAT #1 because I dont know squat.[:p]

so 2rings = expert? [;)][>_<] just playin


you posted here for opinions and see what we can help you on...just LISTEN to what we have to say, specially from Mike.

thanks for you opinions, i didn't post this though....although i respect them and take them into consideration. its just for this turbo timer discussion you haven't told me differently enough to say that a turbo timer is not a good idea. like i said, i've seen many people blow their turbos bc coking. its not needed to run your bt, but there is a lot of stuff that is not NEEDED. it is just a good safety precaution

all i'm saying is turbos cost too much to replace, better to take car of the one you have [;)]

B5A4Kevin
11-22-2008, 12:51 PM
secondly, my friend who is a mechanic at audi has told me that on several occasions people come in who have blown their turbos....as i previously stated audi recommends 45 seconds of idling after driving harder.

I am an Expert Certified Audi Technician who has been working on Audi's for the last 3 years. I have done several turbo replacements, as well as several engine replacements. the engines fail due to sludging of oil, usually caused by excessive service intervals or improper oil quality. when you warranty an engine for sludge, you replace the turbo, however, on most sludged engines, the turbo is actually still fine, even though the cam bearings are scored to all hell. most turbos fail either from foreign object damage (or compressor nut spins off), or from the seals failing and blowing oil out the hot side and create mass amounts of smoke. the feed line can get sludged and cause the shaft to overheat and break, however this is usually due to as above, excessive service intervals, or improper oil quality. As an "Audi Expert Level Technician" I would suggest using Castrol Syntec 5w40 on maintenance, and not exceeding 10,000mi service intervals.

third, i cannot personally show you people who have blown their turbos bc of oil sludge, but i have many friends(ish) who drive hondas that this has happened to. i do not know many people who have tuned up audis bc the parts are much more costly.

i don't have a lot of experience with Hondas but i do know that they don't make factory turbocharged cars. this means that any turbo system is either a kit, or a home brewed system. depending on price and design, many kits (retail and homemade) can be incomplete or inadequate for a specific application. Are these failed Honda turbo's running water cooled turbos, or just oil? What kind of oil? did they lower compression to reduce NOx, and exhaust temperatures? did they run proper fueling systems to prevent fuel dumping into the turbine, causing catastrophic damage? these are just some of many factors that go into choosing a proper kit for a given application. this is one reason people tune VW/Audi, as well as Subaru, Nissan, Mitsubishi, and Toyota; all of which offer factory turbocharged powerplants. it is much easier and often times cheaper to upgrade an existing system, than it is to start from scratch on an engine which was never made to be turbocharged in the first place.

B5A4Kevin
11-22-2008, 01:01 PM
its just for this turbo timer discussion you haven't told me differently enough to say that a turbo timer is not a good idea. like i said, i've seen many people blow their turbos bc coking. its not needed to run your bt, but there is a lot of stuff that is not NEEDED. it is just a good safety precaution


I think this is the heart of the discussion. previously, it seemed (at least to me) like you were stating that it is an absolute necessity that when running a turbo, you must run a timer. thats why everyone jumped on you. There are many in the VW and Audi community who dont run turbo timers and have great success. However, installing a turbo timer can cause no harm unless improperly wired. To each his own. I have no plans to run a timer once i upgrade to BAT, but it is your god-given right to do whatever you feel like to your own car. I just hope we can settle on a middle ground and put this issue to bed.

sean1.8t
11-22-2008, 01:27 PM
^brav-the fuck- O!!!!!!

im repping you for each of those posts once it lets me

edit. damn. i fucked up and hit enter too fast. and spelt eloquent wrong i think [:p]

B5A4Kevin
11-23-2008, 01:29 PM
^^^ thanks. i guess i should have joined the debate team, heheh.

a4mafia
11-24-2008, 07:31 PM
anyone know anything about the integrated engineering rod and piston package? are they good?

sean1.8t
11-25-2008, 12:41 PM
anyone know anything about the integrated engineering rod and piston package? are they good?

very good. they(Pete), know their stuff. quality for sure [up]

a4mafia(Red)
11-25-2008, 04:13 PM
Are these failed Honda turbo's running water cooled turbos, or just oil? What kind of oil?

yes they are both water and oil cooled. not sure on the oil but they are experienced in working on cars, so i do not think that was the problem. one of them converted his car to a right hand drive himself.


did they lower compression to reduce NOx, and exhaust temperatures?

yes they did.


did they run proper fueling systems to prevent fuel dumping into the turbine, causing catastrophic damage?

i am not sure about this one, but like i said i'm pretty sure they did their studying.



some of the cars were not done by my friends themselves. a couple just took them to a custom mechanics/body shop.



I think this is the heart of the discussion. previously, it seemed (at least to me) like you were stating that it is an absolute necessity that when running a turbo, you must run a timer. thats why everyone jumped on you. There are many in the VW and Audi community who dont run turbo timers and have great success. However, installing a turbo timer can cause no harm unless improperly wired. To each his own. I have no plans to run a timer once i upgrade to BAT, but it is your god-given right to do whatever you feel like to your own car. I just hope we can settle on a middle ground and put this issue to bed.

VERY WELL PUT!!!! [:D]

no hard feelings anyone????[:p]

CTS Turbo
11-25-2008, 06:22 PM
Is this Biggietalls from vortex?

Poopie
11-25-2008, 08:36 PM
anyone know anything about the integrated engineering rod and piston package? are they good?

its good stuff...but if you are planning to stick with the stock compression, then keep your oem pistons if they are still in spec. don't get pistons for the sake of getting pistons. the aeb has good pistons and 20mm wrist pins.

a4mafia
11-26-2008, 07:55 PM
Is this Biggietalls from vortex?
No

a4mafia
11-26-2008, 07:56 PM
its good stuff...but if you are planning to stick with the stock compression, then keep your oem pistons if they are still in spec. don't get pistons for the sake of getting pistons. the aeb has good pistons and 20mm wrist pins.
so no pistons just rods?

sean1.8t
11-26-2008, 09:14 PM
a few reasons to upgrade the pistons.

1- if you want to up the displacment

2- if you have damaged cyllinder walls and have to re bore the block to save it.

3- to lower the compression ratio. which will let you run much more advanced timing on all octane levels.


if you aren't planning on any of those 3, then the stock mahle pistons are perfectly fine

CTS Turbo
11-27-2008, 07:46 AM
so no pistons just rods?

If your block's in good shape you should be fine with just rods.

a4mafia
11-27-2008, 08:31 PM
well my black only has 89k miles on it. So it should be fine

a4mafia
11-27-2008, 08:33 PM
What about head work? Is that necessary?

JumboBlack1.8
11-27-2008, 08:52 PM
Just use the search function a bit. Theres a lot of info out there, but I think we should at a headwork thread to the FAQ or the Projects forum....it'd be real helpful to new builders.......but generallly, you should at least replace the exhaust valves IIRC.....but personally, if I were building my motor to 2.0, I would increase my rev limit to 8.5k

CTS Turbo
11-27-2008, 10:33 PM
What about head work? Is that necessary?


I would say it's not necessary, if you went with a bigger turbo it would be worth it for the wider powerband. There are lots of guys that rev into the upper 7000's with stock springs, lifters, retainers etc.

a4mafia
11-28-2008, 07:44 AM
I would say it's not necessary, if you went with a bigger turbo it would be worth it for the wider powerband. There are lots of guys that rev into the upper 7000's with stock springs, lifters, retainers etc.
yeah. well i got to thinking and if im going big turbo, im gonna get a gt35. i dont know yet im so torn between that and a gt3076. i'll make the decision the day that im ready to order it. but i'll prolly do more engine work other than rods after i put the turbo on and everything.

CTS Turbo
12-03-2008, 09:42 PM
yeah. well i got to thinking and if im going big turbo, im gonna get a gt35. i dont know yet im so torn between that and a gt3076. i'll make the decision the day that im ready to order it. but i'll prolly do more engine work other than rods after i put the turbo on and everything.

Sounds good, if its more of a daily driver I"d go with a GT3076R, the GT3582Rs are nice, but they've got some more lag, which isn't bad if you're racing. [up]

sean1.8t
12-04-2008, 01:34 AM
yeah. well i got to thinking and if im going big turbo, im gonna get a gt35. i dont know yet im so torn between that and a gt3076. i'll make the decision the day that im ready to order it. but i'll prolly do more engine work other than rods after i put the turbo on and everything.

oh god[rolleyes]

Sigma 3
12-04-2008, 12:27 PM
yeah. well i got to thinking and if im going big turbo, im gonna get a gt35. i dont know yet im so torn between that and a gt3076. i'll make the decision the day that im ready to order it. but i'll prolly do more engine work other than rods after i put the turbo on and everything.

[:)] Do it

mike-2ptzero
12-04-2008, 12:31 PM
Go HTA3076r, get the best of both.

AudiA4_20T
12-04-2008, 12:34 PM
I would say it's not necessary, if you went with a bigger turbo it would be worth it for the wider powerband. There are lots of guys that rev into the upper 7000's with stock springs, lifters, retainers etc.

Clay, although this is true, I floated a valve at the 7200rpm limit on my stock head... I dont think it caused the valve to bend, as it just slightly kissed the piston, but it kissed it nontheless, and these valves have been known to drop with high pressure

mike-2ptzero
12-04-2008, 02:03 PM
Clay, although this is true, I floated a valve at the 7200rpm limit on my stock head... I dont think it caused the valve to bend, as it just slightly kissed the piston, but it kissed it nontheless, and these valves have been known to drop with high pressure

I didn't float mine till running beyond 8k, before that I had no issues even while pushing 32psi and making around 500whp.


Could be that valve spring just got weak, I had a used stock valve spring break and caused the car to stop running.

sean1.8t
12-04-2008, 02:07 PM
I didn't float mine till running beyond 8k, before that I had no issues even while pushing 32psi and making around 500whp.

either way, who wants to take that gamble.....

CTS Turbo
12-05-2008, 07:35 PM
either way, who wants to take that gamble.....


I'm a gamblin man [drive] but for the price of springs and retainers I can gamble and goto the spearmint rhino gentlemans club too! [hail]

B5A4Kevin
12-06-2008, 07:52 AM
do they have rhino strippers giving rhino lapdances? that would be schweeeet! to me it seems like a sooner or later kinda thing. if you drive it hard enough the stock valve train wont be able to keep up for very long (not soon though, unless you are hitting the rev-limiter every shift), so why not just upgrade before hand, do it right, and enjoy another 1000rpms in your powerband? these would be my $0.02 if i had any money to my name [:p]

mike-2ptzero
12-06-2008, 08:07 AM
do they have rhino strippers giving rhino lapdances? that would be schweeeet! to me it seems like a sooner or later kinda thing. if you drive it hard enough the stock valve train wont be able to keep up for very long (not soon though, unless you are hitting the rev-limiter every shift), so why not just upgrade before hand, do it right, and enjoy another 1000rpms in your powerband? these would be my $0.02 if i had any money to my name [:p]


1000 rpms? Stock is good for up to 8k, there are plenty of people that have been pushing them to that without a problem. I think the issue for most comes down to money, not willing to shell out a good chunk of change for something that will just let them push the car well out of its power band seeing that 99% of the a4's are going to hit peak hp before 7500 rpm.



The odd thing is that failing valves hasn't been a issue with the A4, well not that I have seen in the last 9 years. I have seen more 1.8t's throw rods then a valve or valve spring failing. Some people here just feel that the stock exhaust valves "might" fail at some point because they are filled not solid, this is possible over a long period of time or if the EGT's are much higher then they should be. Now if the person really wants to push the rpm's beyond 8k rpms while feeling safer about it then yes they should upgraded the valvetrain.

B5A4Kevin
12-06-2008, 08:30 AM
i stand corrected. thanks mike. i dont have a lot of experience with bat's since i work at a dealer and only see mostly stock vehicles but i was going by stories (a mistake) that i have heard, such as exhaust valves burning up or springs breaking when pushed past the redline. if i had the money i would do it right and go fully built high rpm aeb head, t3 flanged 3076, and fully built 2.0L. the big thing is that i dont have the money. so most likely im going to go the route of rods, aeb pistons, stock head, and 2871r elim and stay below 7200 rpms.

a4mafia
12-06-2008, 01:49 PM
Go HTA3076r, get the best of both.
okay. what is the difference between the 30r and the hta version?

also, i was wondering if you thought i could upgrade my rods, lightweight pistons, exhaust valves and valve springs(with supporting parts), would i be safe revving to 8k-8.3k rpms? also if i did that, how much boost could i run? I was thinking 25-30psi.

mike-2ptzero
12-06-2008, 02:15 PM
okay. what is the difference between the 30r and the hta version?

also, i was wondering if you thought i could upgrade my rods, lightweight pistons, exhaust valves and valve springs(with supporting parts), would i be safe revving to 8k-8.3k rpms? also if i did that, how much boost could i run? I was thinking 25-30psi.

If you upgrade the valves/valve springs you can rev it to 8500 without any problems.


The HTA uses a Billet 7 blade extended tip design compressor wheel that allows the turbo to make boost quicker, the efficiency of the compressor wheel is just better then the 6 blade Garrett and basicaly equal to that of the Borgwarner which is the company that came out with the extended tip design. It is also upgraded to a slightly larger compressor housing. The HTA's turbos boost can be pushed well into the 40's which is something the Garrett 30 and 35r just cant do.

http://store.forcedperformance.net/merchant2/graphics/00000001/full/NTGT3076HTA1.jpg

sean1.8t
12-06-2008, 05:41 PM
1000 rpms? Stock is good for up to 8k, there are plenty of people that have been pushing them to that without a problem. I think the issue for most comes down to money, not willing to shell out a good chunk of change for something that will just let them push the car well out of its power band seeing that 99% of the a4's are going to hit peak hp before 7500 rpm.



The odd thing is that failing valves hasn't been a issue with the A4, well not that I have seen in the last 9 years. I have seen more 1.8t's throw rods then a valve or valve spring failing. Some people here just feel that the stock exhaust valves "might" fail at some point because they are filled not solid, this is possible over a long period of time or if the EGT's are much higher then they should be. Now if the person really wants to push the rpm's beyond 8k rpms while feeling safer about it then yes they should upgraded the valvetrain.

i remember quite a few 1.8t guys dropping stock exhaust valves after revving past 7500rpms on BT and BAT power..

1 exampe would be k0mpresd. he did get super lucky and it didn't destroy his engine. but it does happen.

and you may be making high amounts of HP, Mike. but i don't see you as a good example to use against others. your car is a drag car. it see's WOT for 11 seconds or so. it's not a street car/track car that will see repeated back to back and long periods of WOT and high revs.

a 400whp 1.8t revving around the track for a 20minute session is under FAR more stress than your "600whp" car for 10-11 seconds

mike-2ptzero
12-06-2008, 09:30 PM
i remember quite a few 1.8t guys dropping stock exhaust valves after revving past 7500rpms on BT and BAT power..

1 exampe would be k0mpresd. he did get super lucky and it didn't destroy his engine. but it does happen.

and you may be making high amounts of HP, Mike. but i don't see you as a good example to use against others. your car is a drag car. it see's WOT for 11 seconds or so. it's not a street car/track car that will see repeated back to back and long periods of WOT and high revs.

a 400whp 1.8t revving around the track for a 20minute session is under FAR more stress than your "600whp" car for 10-11 seconds

My car was making 400-500whp as a daily driver from 2002 to 2006, which means I was driving it as my ONLY car for 4 years straight with that much power but it seems you keep leaving that fact out. My car was my daily driver for 6 years, but yet less then 2 years for just drag racing only.

My car was ran at Streets of Willow for a whole damn day for testing with Kris of DRS behind the wheel and then again not long after that it was ran at Fontana's road course for the 1.8t challenge. All of that was done with 100% stock valvetrain with schrick cams and was running it to 8500 rpms up till 2007 which is when 034 replaced all of it with aftermarket parts.

A street car is going to see more time running at 7500-8500 rpms then me making 10 passes in a weekend? I guess those people need to spend some time in jail seeing that they are breaking plenty of laws. But then I have a hard time believing there are that many A4 owners running their cars that hard for that long.

Mind posting up links to those cars that had their stock valves fail?

BTW didn't Ian(kompresed) have a retainer fail not the valve itself, causing the valve to drop?

a4mafia
12-07-2008, 08:38 AM
If you upgrade the valves/valve springs you can rev it to 8500 without any problems.


The HTA uses a Billet 7 blade extended tip design compressor wheel that allows the turbo to make boost quicker, the efficiency of the compressor wheel is just better then the 6 blade Garrett and basicaly equal to that of the Borgwarner which is the company that came out with the extended tip design. It is also upgraded to a slightly larger compressor housing. The HTA's turbos boost can be pushed well into the 40's which is something the Garrett 30 and 35r just cant do.

http://store.forcedperformance.net/merchant2/graphics/00000001/full/NTGT3076HTA1.jpg
doesn't the HTA have a mitsu flange? which would mean i would need someone to custom make a mani for me. which i would rather not do since i have no money to my name lol.

mike-2ptzero
12-07-2008, 09:09 AM
doesn't the HTA have a mitsu flange? which would mean i would need someone to custom make a mani for me. which i would rather not do since i have no money to my name lol.

They offer both, a T3 or T4 HTA and a DSM HTA version. The actual HTA part of the turbo is just the cold side.



FP HTA GT3076r
http://store.forcedperformance.net/merchant2/graphics/00000001/full/NTGT3076HTA3.jpg

FP HTA DSM76
http://store.forcedperformance.net/merchant2/graphics/00000001/full/NTDSM76HTA_03.jpg

njm23
12-07-2008, 09:42 AM
which i would rather not do since i have no money to my name lol.

Well... your aware that the HTA is an $1700 turbo? seams kinda outta your range form that statement, if I was you I would do headwork, if not now then down the line. gunna go to a 3076+ might as well take full advantage of it with cams ect.

mike-2ptzero
12-07-2008, 10:12 AM
Well... your aware that the HTA is an $1700 turbo? seams kinda outta your range form that statement, if I was you I would do headwork, if not now then down the line. gunna go to a 3076+ might as well take full advantage of it with cams ect.

I think he made that statement because he wouldn't have money to get someone to make him a custom manifold with a DSM flange since he thought the HTA only came with a DSM flanged housing.

The HTA is only around $500 more then a standard GT30r.

a4mafia
12-07-2008, 11:01 AM
I think he made that statement because he wouldn't have money to get someone to make him a custom manifold with a DSM flange since he thought the HTA only came with a DSM flanged housing.

The HTA is only around $500 more then a standard GT30r.

thats correct.


Well... your aware that the HTA is an $1700 turbo? seams kinda outta your range form that statement, if I was you I would do headwork, if not now then down the line. gunna go to a 3076+ might as well take full advantage of it with cams ect.
im going to do headwork. over the summer, the engine is coming out and theres quite a few parts getting replace. Rods, Pistons (maybe), valves, valve springs, southbend stg.5 clutch, engine and tranny mounts, bearings. Possibly cams. Im not sure about the cams. I'll have to do more research on them to decide.


They offer both, a T3 or T4 HTA and a DSM HTA version. The actual HTA part of the turbo is just the cold side.



FP HTA GT3076r
http://store.forcedperformance.net/merchant2/graphics/00000001/full/NTGT3076HTA3.jpg

FP HTA DSM76
http://store.forcedperformance.net/merchant2/graphics/00000001/full/NTDSM76HTA_03.jpg

And thanks Mike for the info on the HTA.


My car was making 400-500whp as a daily driver from 2002 to 2006, which means I was driving it as my ONLY car for 4 years straight with that much power but it seems you keep leaving that fact out. My car was my daily driver for 6 years, but yet less then 2 years for just drag racing only. A street car is going to see more time running at 7500-8500 rpms then me making 10 passes in a weekend? I guess those people need to spend some time in jail seeing that they are breaking plenty of laws. But then I have a hard time believing there are that many A4 owners running their cars that hard for that long. Mind posting up links to those cars that had their stock valves fail?

My car is going to be a DD, since im 18 and dont have a 2nd car just yet (in the process of it). How did that much hp work out for your DD? If you dont mind me asking how the mpg was also with that big of a turbo as a DD?

Don Supreme
12-07-2008, 11:50 AM
The odd thing is that failing valves hasn't been a issue with the A4, well not that I have seen in the last 9 years. I have seen more 1.8t's throw rods then a valve or valve spring failing. Some people here just feel that the stock exhaust valves "might" fail at some point because they are filled not solid, this is possible over a long period of time or if the EGT's are much higher then they should be. Now if the person really wants to push the rpm's beyond 8k rpms while feeling safer about it then yes they should upgraded the valvetrain.

What are you talking about? I have seen several 1.8ts destroyed from dropping a valve ------------- The first Audi A4 into the 10s being one of them.

a4mafia(Red)
12-07-2008, 12:18 PM
If you upgrade the valves/valve springs you can rev it to 8500 without any problems.


The HTA uses a Billet 7 blade extended tip design compressor wheel that allows the turbo to make boost quicker, the efficiency of the compressor wheel is just better then the 6 blade Garrett and basicaly equal to that of the Borgwarner which is the company that came out with the extended tip design. It is also upgraded to a slightly larger compressor housing. The HTA's turbos boost can be pushed well into the 40's which is something the Garrett 30 and 35r just cant do.


could you run 40 psi with new rods, lightweight pistons, valves/valve springs?

mike-2ptzero
12-07-2008, 01:50 PM
could you run 40 psi with new rods, lightweight pistons, valves/valve springs?

If you are running a lower CR and the setup is tuned for it on race gas, then yes you could.

a4mafia(Red)
12-07-2008, 05:09 PM
if you lower the CR, would you be getting less hp from say 20Lbs on pump gas? sorry if these are noob questions

B5A4Kevin
12-07-2008, 05:35 PM
the only real downside of lowering compression ratio is power under the curve. while you are out of boost, the engine will not make as much power as an engine with a higher CR. however, once at full boost, the lower CR engine (lets say 8-8.5:1 vs 9.3:1) will have a much lower chance of detonation or pre-ignition. the same reason that people use w/m injection or higher octane/additives is the same reason people lower CR.

a4mafia(Red)
12-07-2008, 05:48 PM
interesting...so in no boost=less power=better gas mileage? :)

also, would i be able to get higher boost on pump gas with lower compression ratio?

mike-2ptzero
12-07-2008, 06:42 PM
the only real downside of lowering compression ratio is power under the curve. while you are out of boost, the engine will not make as much power as an engine with a higher CR. however, once at full boost, the lower CR engine (lets say 8-8.5:1 vs 9.3:1) will have a much lower chance of detonation or pre-ignition. the same reason that people use w/m injection or higher octane/additives is the same reason people lower CR.

That first statement is not 100% true, seeing that more timing can be ran while out of boost and makes up the difference for the lower CR. Lucas runs 7.8:1 CR on his 2 liter GT35r setup which he drives as a daily driver.

B5A4Kevin
12-08-2008, 04:51 AM
That first statement is not 100% true, seeing that more timing can be ran while out of boost and makes up the difference for the lower CR. Lucas runs 7.8:1 CR on his 2 liter GT35r setup which he drives as a daily driver.

good point but i was actually comparing the engines if all else was the same (including timing) except for the CR. Would this require going standalone or could this be done by tweaking a file (giac, uni, etc..)

Don Supreme
12-08-2008, 06:21 AM
^ no issues with Motronic ECU tuning for compression changes or timing changes. The tuner can sort it all out.

mike-2ptzero
12-08-2008, 07:59 AM
good point but i was actually comparing the engines if all else was the same (including timing) except for the CR. Would this require going standalone or could this be done by tweaking a file (giac, uni, etc..)

Could tweak the file if the boost is staying the same.

a4mafia
12-08-2008, 09:00 AM
so if you change the timing it would make up for the power loss while out of boost if lowering compression ratio. How hard is that to do? Shouldn't be too hard right? And is anyone on here an authorized dealer to get an HTA gt3076r?

Mike, who are you an authorized dealer for? and what kind of gas mileage were you getting with your BAT a4 as a DD?