Would you pay $115 to get reflashed??

[Svart]

Yup, Got my 25,000 mile service done and I guess Audi has some new software so I lost my chip. GMG, where I initially got chipped, wants $115 for the reflash, because it takes 1-2 hours to do. Ya right. Sometimes it amazes me how hard they rape people. Eurocode will now get my business, even though its much further. Had to vent...

[darin1274]

no bueno...

[Auditude2.0T]

i paid 50 for a reflash

[Mike@PureMS]

Sounds excessive. Our customers get reflashed for free!

[kooltechie]

Yup, Got my 25,000 mile service done and I guess Audi has some new software so I lost my chip. GMG, where I initially got chipped, wants $115 for the reflash, because it takes 1-2 hours to do. Ya right. Sometimes it amazes me how hard they rape people. Eurocode will now get my business, even though its much further. Had to vent...

1-2 hours?
it seems the shop is run by a buncha 200 year old blind grandpas [down]

[IceMole]

$25 for me

[Jersey Stephen]

free for me KMD FTW

[PaperishPlastic]

I got my chip from Eurocode and they flashed it for free the first time, than when I needed a reflash they did that for free.

[gyroscope]

What software?
Call the manufacturer and complain and they'll most likley work something out with your tuner. If you bitch and complain enough they will not charge you, just to shut you up.

[muffinman]

Hell no, don't bend over

[autoverruckt]

I think its fair for a shop to charge for their time, but 1-2 hours and $115? How much time did they spend the first time you got flashed? See if you can use that to help with your case.

[Ski DraGoN]

Rip Off

[Ryne@AE Performance]

Yup, Got my 25,000 mile service done and I guess Audi has some new software so I lost my chip. GMG, where I initially got chipped, wants $115 for the reflash, because it takes 1-2 hours to do. Ya right. Sometimes it amazes me how hard they rape people. Eurocode will now get my business, even though its much further. Had to vent...

Hello,

Thank you for your concern. I talked to you today on the phone personally for about 5 minutes, and while I was explaining the process, you seemed very frustrated on what actually goes on while flashing a car. Also, 1-2 hour was never mentioned, I said time billed is 1 hour.

Our labor rate is $115/hr. That is common knowledge and the rate we have had for the last year. I have 5 factory trained technicians and two master technicians under our roof, and actual time spent on the car is actual time billed.

I understand you got your car chipped here, and understand your concern. Let me just go through what happens when a car is flashed.

As you recall, you told me on the phone "come on, that stuff only takes like 5 minutes tops." I then corrected you and ran through the process with you.

This is how it actually happens, contrary to popular relief.

1) Car is brought in and racked (5 Min)
2) Battery charger is hooked to car and plugged in, and battery covers are popped off (5 Min)
3) Vag-Com is connected to the car and diagnosis is checked along with all existing fault codes (5-7 Min)
4) Software Companies Hardware is connected to car via OBD II port and DME is read for GCF File (5-7 Min)
5) DME is looked up on database and attached to a performance file. (5 Min)
6) Performance file is requested for sending to GMG and sent via email. (5-20 min depending on server speed at software company)
7) Once performance file is received, Key file is needed to sync with VIN number and Customer information that has to be inputed. (10-15 Min)
8) Car is turned to ignition on and flash process begins if all of above goes well. Flash process can take anywhere from 15-25 minutes on the 2.0t motor. (15-25 Min)
9) Car is finished being flashed and started. Car is test driven by technician and taken off of rack, making sure all programs are installed correctly (10 Min)
10) Car is brought back and Vag-Com is plugged in to verify fault codes are non-existant. If fault codes arise, customer is notified and asked how he would like to resolve the issue if it is a non-flash issue. (5 Min)

There you have it, an average of 87 Minutes. We charge 1 hour, which is 60 minutes. If you have any issues with that, please give me a call, I am in the office daily and can talk it over with you.

*Note that my technician has flashed cars in 40 minutes before, but like I said, this is like clock work and the list above is executed every time a flash is made. It is not simply a "5 minute re-flash."



Thank you for your time, hopefully you can understand the actual process and ask more questions before you go on the internet.

[Ryne@AE Performance]

Sounds excessive. Our customers get reflashed for free!

See above please. Thanks Mike, hope all is well over there, I hope you can understand why our policy is what it is.

[Ryne@AE Performance]

1-2 hours?
it seems the shop is run by a buncha 200 year old blind grandpas [down]

200 year old grandpa's.... :)

http://gmgracing.com/images/gmgteam08.jpg

[GMG Racing]

Yup, Got my 25,000 mile service done and I guess Audi has some new software so I lost my chip. GMG, where I initially got chipped, wants $115 for the reflash, because it takes 1-2 hours to do. Ya right. Sometimes it amazes me how hard they rape people. Eurocode will now get my business, even though its much further. Had to vent...




Lets be perfectly clear on what happened here.


1. You called and were quoted a price of $115.00 because that is our hourly labor rate. Someone spent over 10 minutes on the phone with you explaining the procedures on how this works and tried to educate you on what is involved in the re-flash process.

2. You were told it may take up to 1-2 hours depending. Sometimes it takes less sometimes it takes more. What happens when the ECU crashes or the sever fails. Anyone who has been doing this long enough knows these things happen.

3. You were not going to be charged any more than the 1 hour of service.


4. I am sure that there are other shops who can do it for less and do. Some charge $75 some charge $25 some charge $ 0. Some may even want to pay you for working on your car. Thats is the way they run there business and I cant change that.

5. As a consumer you have the right to shop and go where you want to.
As a business which has overhead we have the right to charge an appropriate for the service we provide.



In the future just call and we can usually work something out. The technicians get paid by the hour to do the work they do.. Dont you think its fair that they get paid for doing work on your car?

If this was something that "we" casued you would not have been charged 1 penny for the work. This is surely not the case in this matter.



Should you have any further questions please feel free to contact me directly and I will be more than happy to help you out in any way that I can.

[07-Aythree]

had a similar issue w/ Eurocode...wanted 100 dollars for a reflash. but in all seriousness that is ridiculous. I've done enough flashes to know it takes a total of 20mins. Its a hook up to the laptop. Checking codes takes 2 steps on the vagcom. 5-7 mins is more like 30 seconds.
To charge someone to "rack" the car is pretty incredible as well since the car does not need to be on a lift or anything, rather flashes can be done pretty much anywhere. Its a great way to make money for them. You can charge $50 bucks MAX which is still beyond ridiculous to me. When I worked for a company we NEVER charged for flashes since all it took was a laptop hookup. Inputting all the information takes a few mins - I don't see many companies charging people for paperwork done. If a car comes in for a new suspension, do you charge them for the 'labor' of inputting the vehicle information into a computer or invoice? Same thing...its pretty ridiculous to me. [headbang]
I can rant on this forever, but its their policy as they stated, if you don't like it, go somewhere else. Simple as that, there is no use to argue with them since they will not change policies. Check out Supreme Power in OC, or PureMS, or Autobahn Exotics or if your in La, Inglostadt West does great work too (even though they are APR dealers)

[kooltechie]

200 year old grandpa's.... :)

http://gmgracing.com/images/gmgteam08.jpg

Ryne,
my comment was based on the original post.
I've had my car chipped more than once and the actually time it took each time was less than 30 min (@ ingolstadt west & dtm).
as you said in your replies on this thread, you're absolutely right...you should do what you need to do to keep your business running and make profit.
however, as a consumer, given the level of service is about the same, wouldn't you much rather go to a shop that provides free reflash?
just as there's nothing "wrong" with you charging for whatever the services you provide "after" a customer purchases from your shop, there's nothing wrong with consumers sharing info so that they're more informed to make decisions on what shops to do business with OR what shops not to do business with.
the OP might have exaggerated a bit, but the bottom line is $115 vs. $0
I highly doubt those shops would go broke by providing free reflash to their customers...I for one would love to go back to the shop for more business for their great service and eventually the shop would make profit.
for fairness, I apologize for my not-so-funny comment of accusing your employees to be grandpas.
however, the shops that provide "extra" service in addition to quality work and professionalism are favored more and get more business from people like us, the consumers, and a forum such as AZ is a great place to find such shops by sharing experiences and opinions. [up]

[muffinman]

Hello,

Thank you for your concern. I talked to you today on the phone personally for about 5 minutes, and while I was explaining the process, you seemed very frustrated on what actually goes on while flashing a car. Also, 1-2 hour was never mentioned, I said time billed is 1 hour.

Our labor rate is $115/hr. That is common knowledge and the rate we have had for the last year. I have 5 factory trained technicians and two master technicians under our roof, and actual time spent on the car is actual time billed.

I understand you got your car chipped here, and understand your concern. Let me just go through what happens when a car is flashed.

As you recall, you told me on the phone "come on, that stuff only takes like 5 minutes tops." I then corrected you and ran through the process with you.

This is how it actually happens, contrary to popular relief.

1) Car is brought in and racked (5 Min)
2) Battery charger is hooked to car and plugged in, and battery covers are popped off (5 Min)
3) Vag-Com is connected to the car and diagnosis is checked along with all existing fault codes (5-7 Min)
4) Software Companies Hardware is connected to car via OBD II port and DME is read for GCF File (5-7 Min)
5) DME is looked up on database and attached to a performance file. (5 Min)
6) Performance file is requested for sending to GMG and sent via email. (5-20 min depending on server speed at software company)
7) Once performance file is received, Key file is needed to sync with VIN number and Customer information that has to be inputed. (10-15 Min)
8) Car is turned to ignition on and flash process begins if all of above goes well. Flash process can take anywhere from 15-25 minutes on the 2.0t motor. (15-25 Min)
9) Car is finished being flashed and started. Car is test driven by technician and taken off of rack, making sure all programs are installed correctly (10 Min)
10) Car is brought back and Vag-Com is plugged in to verify fault codes are non-existant. If fault codes arise, customer is notified and asked how he would like to resolve the issue if it is a non-flash issue. (5 Min)

There you have it, an average of 87 Minutes. We charge 1 hour, which is 60 minutes. If you have any issues with that, please give me a call, I am in the office daily and can talk it over with you.

*Note that my technician has flashed cars in 40 minutes before, but like I said, this is like clock work and the list above is executed every time a flash is made. It is not simply a "5 minute re-flash."



Thank you for your time, hopefully you can understand the actual process and ask more questions before you go on the internet.

Ryne,

Very professional of you to breakdown the process for us, you guys seem to do the job thoroughly and properly. However, what I gathered from your list above is that it's more like 10-15 minutes of real work and 60 minutes of waiting for something to finish running or downloading. It's not like installing suspension where it's pretty much hands-on "work" for hours.

Chipping is something that is relatively easy to do (and is very non-labor intensive) and a reflash is something that's done for free or minimal charge at a majority of other shops hence the $115 sticker shock.

[kooltechie]

Sounds excessive. Our customers get reflashed for free!

Mike, after hearing many props for your shop, if it was at half the distance from Pasadena, I would've definitely done business with you.
hopefully your business policy will stay the same for a long time. [up][up]

[Ryne@AE Performance]

Ryne,
my comment was based on the original post.
I've had my car chipped more than once and the actually time it took each time was less than 30 min (@ ingolstadt west & dtm).
as you said in your replies on this thread, you're absolutely right...you should do what you need to do to keep your business running and make profit.
however, as a consumer, given the level of service is about the same, wouldn't you much rather go to a shop that provides free reflash?
just as there's nothing "wrong" with you charging for whatever the services you provide "after" a customer purchases from your shop, there's nothing wrong with consumers sharing info so that they're more informed to make decisions on what shops to do business with OR what shops not to do business with.
the OP might have exaggerated a bit, but the bottom line is $115 vs. $0
I highly doubt those shops would go broke by providing free reflash to their customers...I for one would love to go back to the shop for more business for their great service and eventually the shop would make profit.
for fairness, I apologize for my not-so-funny comment of accusing your employees to be grandpas.
however, the shops that provide "extra" service in addition to quality work and professionalism are favored more and get more business from people like us, the consumers, and a forum such as AZ is a great place to find such shops by sharing experiences and opinions. [up]

I know where you are coming from, but are the companies really taking a hit on the labor rate, paying their tech and losing money on the free labor, or are they essentially discounting the price of the software, which cannot be sold under MSRP, but since they do a free flash, the total price is less.

You see, where does it end after that? We try to be fair in every way about this, but sometimes it is hard to please everyone.

I have no problem with people going elsewhere if they think the price is too much, that is their choice. I took this thread as a stab at us, especially with the tone, and had to make a reply explaining the situation.

I hope this helps.

Happy Motoring.

[07-Aythree]

From a business aspect what your doing can make sense, but calling that 'labor' is kind of excessive. Labor is installing a suspension, header, turbo kit etc. not hooking up a laptop, but to each his own. good luck :)

[speedydragon]

this is a capitalistic society :]

[kooltechie]

I know where you are coming from, but are the companies really taking a hit on the labor rate, paying their tech and losing money on the free labor, or are they essentially discounting the price of the software, which cannot be sold under MSRP, but since they do a free flash, the total price is less.

You see, where does it end after that? We try to be fair in every way about this, but sometimes it is hard to please everyone.

I have no problem with people going elsewhere if they think the price is too much, that is their choice. I took this thread as a stab at us, especially with the tone, and had to make a reply explaining the situation.

I hope this helps.

Happy Motoring.

Ryne,
as I mentioned earlier, I don't think it's wrong to charge the customers for the services your shop provides.
but, as muffinman wrote above, the flashing process doesn't require much "physical labor" compared to other jobs such as suspension install.
each time I had my car chipped, the tech plugged in the cable and walked away for 10-15 min before it was completed.
the actual time the tech spent "on" the car is far less than 20 min.
then I saw 1-2 hours of labor w/ $115 charge.
had this thread been about installing suspension or other hardware, I wouldn't have voiced in.
I wonder how many AZ members would actually pay $115 to get their cars reflashed and think it's a fair deal.

[INTEGRATION]

this is a capitalistic society :]

Not to mention the economy is bad, unemployment is at a highest in almost 10 years... it really affects everyone and hopefully all these great shops in SoCal can endure through it :(

But honestly, as mentioned above- there is some labor work involved in reflashing but it's not very intensive at all. If I were a tech I couldn't be happier to get paid "that much" in an hour :P

[Ryne@AE Performance]

Not to mention the economy is bad, unemployment is at a highest in almost 10 years... it really affects everyone and hopefully all these great shops in SoCal can endure through it :(

But honestly, as mentioned above- there is some labor work involved in reflashing but it's not very intensive at all. If I were a tech I couldn't be happier to get paid "that much" in an hour :P

I agree on the non-labor intensive side. These things are more like baby sitting and making sure the system or server does not crash. If that happens (which happens 10% of the time or so) we have to eat the extra time it takes, and explain to the customer the issue.

The problem is, if a technician is going between a computer that is flashing a car and multi-tasking and finishing another car that is more labor intensive, he gets dirty, can't continue the flash until he finishes another corner on a suspension install, etc. I can't have him running around between jobs and not staying on task. All of this add's up, and the babysitting of the flash takes time. So yes, 20-30 min of time, and the other time is just waiting for technology and non-tangible things to fall into place. If it were faster, trust me, we would not be charging the rate we do.

As I said, total time spent is total time billed. I give the customers a benefit by only charging 1 hour, because multiple times it has taken 1-2 (even overnight if the server totally fails, which has happened twice). If it only takes 20 minutes, there are plenty of times where I break down the bill to 20 minutes and charge the customer $40. We quote $115 and take time off if it is actually less, so that is the policy.

Talk to you guys soon.

Thanks!

[Ryne@AE Performance]

Ryne,
as I mentioned earlier, I don't think it's wrong to charge the customers for the services your shop provides.
but, as muffinman wrote above, the flashing process doesn't require much "physical labor" compared to other jobs such as suspension install.
each time I had my car chipped, the tech plugged in the cable and walked away for 10-15 min before it was completed.
the actual time the tech spent "on" the car is far less than 20 min.
then I saw 1-2 hours of labor w/ $115 charge.
had this thread been about installing suspension or other hardware, I wouldn't have voiced in.
I wonder how many AZ members would actually pay $115 to get their cars reflashed and think it's a fair deal.

See above.

Thanks!

[vtracer20]

just FYI, when i got my car chipped it took OVER 2 hours...this is because the CAN bus had issues connecting to the ECU.....not to mention i guess the CAN bus is very finicky about things being open in the car...i was looking the car over cause i was picking it up after purchasing it so many things went wrong that day...but i'm happy

[4-tified]

Yup, Got my 25,000 mile service done and I guess Audi has some new software so I lost my chip. GMG, where I initially got chipped, wants $115 for the reflash, because it takes 1-2 hours to do. Ya right. Sometimes it amazes me how hard they rape people. Eurocode will now get my business, even though its much further. Had to vent...

Yeah, 1 or 2 hours of you waiting around for them to get to it, then it'll take about 10-15 minutes to do the actual install.

It's an industry wide situation and it SUCKS. It's up to the consumer to demand better. Next time I get a turbo, and want a flash,
I'm going with whoever gives FREE reflashes or gives me the option to do it myself with my own copy of the software. It can be coded to my ECU. I don't need a master technician to download and test performance software.
The problem comes from software tuners who don't give customers access to the software they buy and force us to have to go to a shop to get reflashes. The software companies act like it's no big deal, well it is.

[4-tified]

Hello,

Thank you for your concern. I talked to you today on the phone personally for about 5 minutes, and while I was explaining the process, you seemed very frustrated on what actually goes on while flashing a car. Also, 1-2 hour was never mentioned, I said time billed is 1 hour.

Our labor rate is $115/hr. That is common knowledge and the rate we have had for the last year. I have 5 factory trained technicians and two master technicians under our roof, and actual time spent on the car is actual time billed.

I understand you got your car chipped here, and understand your concern. Let me just go through what happens when a car is flashed.

As you recall, you told me on the phone "come on, that stuff only takes like 5 minutes tops." I then corrected you and ran through the process with you.

This is how it actually happens, contrary to popular relief.

1) Car is brought in and racked (5 Min)
2) Battery charger is hooked to car and plugged in, and battery covers are popped off (5 Min)
3) Vag-Com is connected to the car and diagnosis is checked along with all existing fault codes (5-7 Min)
4) Software Companies Hardware is connected to car via OBD II port and DME is read for GCF File (5-7 Min)
5) DME is looked up on database and attached to a performance file. (5 Min)
6) Performance file is requested for sending to GMG and sent via email. (5-20 min depending on server speed at software company)
7) Once performance file is received, Key file is needed to sync with VIN number and Customer information that has to be inputed. (10-15 Min)
8) Car is turned to ignition on and flash process begins if all of above goes well. Flash process can take anywhere from 15-25 minutes on the 2.0t motor. (15-25 Min)
9) Car is finished being flashed and started. Car is test driven by technician and taken off of rack, making sure all programs are installed correctly (10 Min)
10) Car is brought back and Vag-Com is plugged in to verify fault codes are non-existant. If fault codes arise, customer is notified and asked how he would like to resolve the issue if it is a non-flash issue. (5 Min)

There you have it, an average of 87 Minutes. We charge 1 hour, which is 60 minutes. If you have any issues with that, please give me a call, I am in the office daily and can talk it over with you.

*Note that my technician has flashed cars in 40 minutes before, but like I said, this is like clock work and the list above is executed every time a flash is made. It is not simply a "5 minute re-flash."



Thank you for your time, hopefully you can understand the actual process and ask more questions before you go on the internet.

Wow. Why don't you also list how often and how many breaths you take in while doing this, along with how many hand movements and how many steps it takes to walk from the batter to the key, to the battery, to the keyboard, to the key, to the door, to the bathroom, to the bench, to the battery, to the laptop, etc....

I had my car flashed twice, installing the SAME software the second time due to Audi reflash. I watched the "install" the second time and it took about 15 minutes to do all the hooking up.
The manager did it. It's THAT simple.

Look, you can book charge for your techs time, however, the actual "service" doesn't require a "master technician" to do it, not to mention that $115 per hour is a very high hourly rate.
You're right though, you can and should charge whatever you feel is appropriate. Customers then have the right to bitch and complain and disagree with how much you want to charge, and they can and do go elsewhere.

[4-tified]

Lets be perfectly clear on what happened here.



5. As a consumer you have the right to shop and go where you want to.
As a business which has overhead we have the right to charge an appropriate for the service we provide.


That's the one, right there!

[Svart]

ugh i didnt expect this thing to blow up. I'll agree that my comment about you guys raping people was inappropiate; I was still shocked that you would charge that much plus a I had a previous experience where you guys did not install my stock program properly and came up with every excuse in the book except for the flash itself not being done properly (my center display would freeze and beep when switching to stock mode). I ended up taking my car to Eurocode at the time and they found a fault in the software and flashed me again and bam, problem solved. And you did say that it can even take up to 2 hours on the phone.
I didnt mean to rip your company; Im sure you guys do great work and have a good staff, but my previous experience of getting flashed at GMG initially and the $115 for the reflash made me over react. No hard feelings I'm over it.

[RedS-line]

i think that the lesson learned here is to try to find out ahead of time how much its gonna cost to get reflashed before you do business with a shop. that way, yo know what youre getting yourself into when u get flashed. if a shop sounds unreasonable, then maybe you should consider doing business elsewhere. all shops are different, but if one shop charges twice as much to do the same thing you have to ask yourself if they are worth the money.

[womensecks]

I most definitely wouldn't pay $115 ... to answer the original question.

I see you are in the O.C. as well ... does it matter if you keep APR or would you prefer a switch to REVO?

[VZWalex]

here's my $0.02 ...

Sometimes as a business you have to do things that give you an edge over your competition and at the same time do those *small things* that keep customers happy and coming back for repeat business as well as the more important referral business. As a business owner I am sure you know the power of word a mouth advertising. There is nothing more powerful than that and its been proven time and time again ... Why do you think all the big fortune 500 companies are spending $$$$$$ on surveys? Cause they need to see how the customer feels about the service and products they received and if they will be more likely to recommend a friend or Family member.

In My opinion a re-flash is something that falls under keeping the customer happy or like a *perk* for being a exclusive customer of XXXX race shop / motorsports .. etc;...

With competition getting tougher and tougher its all going to come down to the 2 most important things a customer really VALUES ...

1. Customer Service
2. Quality of Goods / Service or combination of.

the price .... I feel is irrelevant since competition will mange a competitive price unless its a exclusive piece.
the distance ... also not as important ... people are willing to drive if the above 2 mentioned are up to par.

If the business makes sure it practices Clear Disclosure and believes in running a business with Integrity, I am sure all of the proper info would be given to the customer prior to completing the sale along with a Satisfaction Guarantee. This is usually done by disclosing refund/exchange policy, any charges that can be assessed ( IE: need for re-flash) tech labor, inspection fee's, shop hourly labor rate, 15/30 day money back guarantee and so on ....

In the long run, doing what's right for the customer will usually benefit the business and the bottom line for a business is to be successful and grow a large customer base.

I could give you so many examples of what I have to do everyday to keep my customers happy .. but i would bore you guys to death... so anyways thats my $0.02

[forumballer]

I most definitely wouldn't pay $115 ... to answer the original question.

I see you are in the O.C. as well ... does it matter if you keep APR or would you prefer a switch to REVO?

do you know of a good REVO shop in orange county?

[womensecks]

In Mission Viejo yes, and the shop owner is a very friendly knowledgeable awesome guy.

PM me if you need.

[flath12]

i got flashed in about 20 minutes, so i don't know where all this whole "process" is coming from. Just go somewhere else.

[mal100]

i dont understand why these guys are charging so much when others offer it for free i mean if i owned a shop i would give out stupid little incentives like free reflashes to draw in buisness... because as a Customer when i see a shop charging 115 for just a reflash im gonna think twice about doing buisness with them because of such a high cost on a simple task just my .02 though

[davis449]

i got flashed in about 20 minutes, so i don't know where all this whole "process" is coming from. Just go somewhere else.

X2, it took my shop 20 minutes to re-flash my car and they don't charge either. I was in the shop for both times (first flash and re-flash after Audi update) and no offense to GMG or anything, but I didn't see much of a "process" in it.

[SD Turbo]

Sounds excessive. Our customers get reflashed for free!

Yes, and it's great, thanks!!! [up]

[Noffy]

5 minutes to hook up battery charger... haha with one hand. Vag com cable takes about 30 secs to hook up, maybe a minute to get results back.

You would be alot more honest if you said. We have a minimum 1 hour labor fee and our labor rate is 115/hour than trying to justify specific minutes to hook up cables. Thats just silly. To OP, if that is to much take you business else where. I would, thats just crazy to charge that much to basically keep you business at their shop. That just makes not business sense to me.

[drock13]

When I was researching where to get my car chipped at I heard great things about GMG on this forum. I personally have never been there. When I emailed them for a quote about chipping and specifically asked about how much it would be to reflash, this is what they responded with:

06' APR 2.0t Software runs $599 + $50 for stock programming. You are looking at $115 for initial install making the grand total $764.


Reflashing is $50 if the dealer flashes back to stock, but with the stock program you should not have an issue.

This was about 2 weeks ago, I have no problem with shops charging whatever they want to charge. Its their business they can do as they please and consumers have the right to pick and choose.

I just think its kind of messed up that they would quote me lower since I havent purchased there but they are charging you more because you already purchased and can't go else where.

[GEkido]

Come down to the MIA and go to German Motorin and the APR program is $599.00 and the reflash is FREE! Yup, if the dealer reprograms the ECU, they (GM) will reflash the APR program for Free. I was waiting to save some cash before I got mine done but my bank account just got stimulated by the IRS so I will do my civic duty and go spend my loot on my Audi!

APR here I come!!!

*Edit*
They also told me it takes them less then 30 minutes for the process. Could be wrong but i'm just relaying what I was told..

[benaudia4]

ok i read the first gmg response and then stopped reading.
This is the problem. I am in no way a mechanic, but I do have a business degree and am a half intelligent person like most the people on here.
GMG I understand that it takes that long to perform the reflashing process BUT there is NO WAY that you should be charging that type of labor rate. First off all I live right outside of DC and Benz and Audi dealerships charge anywhere from 95-110/hr labor and thats a STEALERSHIP.
Secondly, thats fine that that is your labor rate, if people are willing to pay that then I would make that my labor rate as well. BUT we all know that the type of labor required (reading a computer screen) is not the same as pulling out an engine, putting on a turbo kit, custom fab, and so on. Its just like how body shops charge one labor rate for mechanical and a cheaper rate for cosmetic body repairs. People know when they are getting ripped off and they dont like it. Even if your labor rate is 115 and it was the hardest thing to do in the world you should give him a break because he is a returning customer needing service on a product he purchased from you and had installed by you. Its called customer service and I am sure GIAC would love to here how you are treating their end users.

[fD3S]

$115 is a rip-off, then again anyone can charge what they want. I watched my car get re-flashed in 15 minutes for free.