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View Full Version : Who is it that rents out the torque plate?



pac1085
04-22-2008, 04:15 PM
http://www.wgcinc.com/sd/shawnweb.nsf/83638cf52a6a156085256f2c005edbb4/5279687b2e37091b8525714200502f27/$FILE/TorquePLateFinished.jpg

Anyone know?

audiness
04-22-2008, 05:23 PM
what's it do?

Ewok_Fetus
04-22-2008, 06:35 PM
That's a mighty thick head gasket!

pac1085
04-22-2008, 06:39 PM
what's it do?

it doubles the displacement, hence the reason it's called a torque plate.

317ssayzarc
04-22-2008, 07:16 PM
thats just mean lol

SilverB5A4
04-22-2008, 07:54 PM
ill take two of them!

djwimbo
04-22-2008, 09:38 PM
looks like the deal the Honda guys use when machining aluminum blocks. Except that thing is aluminum as well and wouldn't do any good for that.

SilverB5A4
04-22-2008, 10:22 PM
It is used to simulate how the block reacts to having the head torqued down to it while boring or honing

djwimbo
04-23-2008, 08:13 AM
It is used to simulate how the block reacts to having the head torqued down to it while boring or honing

Yea, that's what I was gettin at. Except we use Steel ones here at school instead of that one that's aluminum.
IIRC there's no need to use one on an Iron Block. Only time it's really needed is in an Aluminum block setup.

ModifiedA4
04-23-2008, 08:29 AM
IIRC there's no need to use one on an Iron Block. Only time it's really needed is in an Aluminum block setup.

that would be my guess as well.

317ssayzarc
04-23-2008, 09:19 AM
that would be my guess as well.

well when distortion can happen, lets say only .0005" or so, thats totally unacceptable... my pistons wanted .003" clearence, so that .0005" out of round is very bad... iron blocks DO distort

pac1085
04-23-2008, 09:22 AM
did you use one?

i'm probably not going to worry about it...they are hard to get your hands on. also, from what i've read no manufacturer uses it from the factory, except GM on the corvette.

317ssayzarc
04-23-2008, 09:24 AM
did you use one?

i'm probably not going to worry about it...they are hard to get your hands on. also, from what i've read no manufacturer uses it from the factory, except GM on the corvette.

i sure did, i have over 12k into my engine and would never bore it w/o one... my machine shop guy made one, and any reputable shop would... they need to have it for future engines anyways...

Don Supreme
04-23-2008, 09:38 AM
Yea, that's what I was gettin at. Except we use Steel ones here at school instead of that one that's aluminum.
IIRC there's no need to use one on an Iron Block. Only time it's really needed is in an Aluminum block setup.

Here is a quote from a local machine shop.............

"During our honing process, we use BHJ torque plates to recreate the stress of having the cylinder head torqued on the block. We can torque plate hone many engines and we have torque plates in both cast iron and aluminum to match the customer's cylinder head type. We will buy a torque plate for your application if we do not have it in stock. We recently spent $1200 on a custom torque plate for a VR6 Volkswagon; we are committed to excellence.

After everything is finished, the block is final cleaned and cam bearings and core plugs are installed. The block is ready for assembly."

djwimbo
04-23-2008, 09:57 AM
... my machine shop guy made one, and any reputable shop would...

How do you know that he made it flat/square?
I'm not saying that under somer circumstances the block can't flex some. I just don't see it flexing that much while using an aluminum head.
I'm willing ot be wrong, but I just don't see it happening

djwimbo
04-23-2008, 10:01 AM
Here is a quote from a local machine shop.............

"During our honing process, we use BHJ torque plates to recreate the stress of having the cylinder head torqued on the block. We can torque plate hone many engines and we have torque plates in both cast iron and aluminum to match the customer's cylinder head type. We will buy a torque plate for your application if we do not have it in stock. We recently spent $1200 on a custom torque plate for a VR6 Volkswagon; we are committed to excellence...

What machine shop is this?
I understand needing a torque plate for block boring, but I don't see why it's needed for honing. The hone doesn't effect the out of round or bore(not much). If it's already installed then yea I see the point, but not installing for just that.

Don Supreme
04-23-2008, 10:24 AM
^ The OP is going 2.0, which means he is boring the block 2MM over stock.... I WOULD NOT DO THAT without the use of a torque plate.

P.S. A AZ member had a 2.0 fail @ 1500 miles. The failure was blamed on the shop not using the torque plate during the bore process.

ModifiedA4
04-23-2008, 10:34 AM
well when distortion can happen, lets say only .0005" or so, thats totally unacceptable... my pistons wanted .003" clearence, so that .0005" out of round is very bad... iron blocks DO distort

in our case, im pretty sure any al plate bolted to the block is just going to conform to the much stiffer block, not the other way around. i find it hard to believe you'd get a measureable distortion to the magnitude you stated (which is huge btw).

djwimbo
04-23-2008, 12:37 PM
^ The OP is going 2.0, which means he is boring the block 2MM over stock.... I WOULD NOT DO THAT without the use of a torque plate.

P.S. A AZ member had a 2.0 fail @ 1500 miles. The failure was blamed on the shop not using the torque plate during the bore process.

I am curious as to a more in depth look at why that engine failed. I'm not saying it's not needed for a 2mm overbore, but as long as it's not punched out 1.8mm in the first pass and a .2mm to clean it up, it shouldn't hve that much deflection of the metal.

Yes, our blocks do distort, otherwise some of the members wouldn't need the main journal brace for higher HP cars.

The only issue I see is if somebody has one hell of a Cam-ground piston, and it being starved for oil at the widest spots.

pac1085
04-23-2008, 12:41 PM
in our case, im pretty sure any al plate bolted to the block is just going to conform to the much stiffer block, not the other way around. i find it hard to believe you'd get a measureable distortion to the magnitude you stated (which is huge btw).

Well if that was the case, the stock cylinder head would conform to the block, but it doesn't. I just talked with a shop, the guy was really cool. He went into detail on torque plates, and explained that you want them made from the same material as the cylinder head (makes sense) He also explained how you can check it with the stock cylinder head and a dial bore gauge to determine whether or not a torque plate needs to be used.

I think I'm going to try and acquire a trashed AEB head to turn into a torque plate.

ModifiedA4
04-23-2008, 12:53 PM
Well if that was the case, the stock cylinder head would conform to the block, but it doesn't. I just talked with a shop, the guy was really cool. He went into detail on torque plates, and explained that you want them made from the same material as the cylinder head (makes sense) He also explained how you can check it with the stock cylinder head and a dial bore gauge to determine whether or not a torque plate needs to be used.

I think I'm going to try and acquire a trashed AEB head to turn into a torque plate.

unless the plate is worse than the flatness of a stock head, it cant hurt.

dougyfresh
04-23-2008, 01:08 PM
I am curious as to a more in depth look at why that engine failed. I'm not saying it's not needed for a 2mm overbore, but as long as it's not punched out 1.8mm in the first pass and a .2mm to clean it up, it shouldn't hve that much deflection of the metal.

Piston slap on the cylinder walls because the block was not bored with a torque-plate and things were out of spec once heated up to operating temperature.

317ssayzarc
04-23-2008, 01:28 PM
How do you know that he made it flat/square?
I'm not saying that under somer circumstances the block can't flex some. I just don't see it flexing that much while using an aluminum head.
I'm willing ot be wrong, but I just don't see it happening

I dont see it flexing much either, but I do see it flexing some... Even if its .0000001 I want to eliminate that... Also I know the plate was flat as it was decked by the same machine that did my block [up]

pac1085
04-28-2008, 07:21 AM
Does anyone have any ideas? There isn't a shop anywhere near me that has a torque plate. The shops are not interested in making one, since they never work on these engines.

Think I could buy a junk 8v/16v head (some of them bolt up) and carve it out to work as a ghetto torque plate?

TQMB5
04-28-2008, 08:17 AM
to bad you didnt have this problem 6 weeks ago, i could have had one made for you no problem to whatever spec you want

pac1085
04-28-2008, 08:35 AM
Well, I found the place that makes them:

http://www.bhjinc.com/

But it sells for $611.25!! [O_O]