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lak2881
04-11-2007, 10:26 PM
I have read a couple posts and everyone swares by the RS4 rear sway bar but someone brough up a good point that just becasue it is a thicker bar does not mean that it is necessarily stiffer. It may be made with a different strength metal. Well my question is first does anyone here use the H&R sway bar here and if so what do you think about it. I just ordered the H&R today since i am using H&R suspension i thought it would be a nice match. Any info would be a great help. Also i want to put spacers on the rear and i was thinking 10 or 12mm my car is a S line B7 2.0T FWD.

Nico
06-17-2007, 05:52 AM
SO how did you go with the H&R swaybar? sorry to drag up the old post.

I'm interested in upgrading mine and would like to check out options other than the OEM RS4.

leo_yuen_
06-17-2007, 09:09 PM
interested to know as well

kristokes
06-17-2007, 09:15 PM
i have tha H&R front 32mm sway bar and rear 20mm sway bar

and i love them both!!

taj avant
06-18-2007, 09:23 PM
Hello All,

I am running the H&R 32mm front and an H&R 22mm S4 rear bar on my A4. This combination works well and also has a couple of adjustment holes at each end of the bar so you can taylor the stiffness of the bars to your needs.

Another bonus of the H&R swaybar kits is that the bushings are lined with a material that helps reduce bushing squeak.

Tom

Nico
06-19-2007, 02:16 AM
Does running both front and rear H & R sways reduce under steer?

What does the adjustments change? Stiffness? How does this work?

Can you use the RS4 H & R rear sway? It is 24mm in thickness?

leo_yuen_
06-19-2007, 05:27 AM
is the H&R s4 one direct bolt on as well?

pcdrj
06-19-2007, 06:35 AM
I have read a couple posts and everyone swares by the RS4 rear sway bar but someone brough up a good point that just becasue it is a thicker bar does not mean that it is necessarily stiffer. It may be made with a different strength metal. Well my question is first does anyone here use the H&R sway bar here and if so what do you think about it. I just ordered the H&R today since i am using H&R suspension i thought it would be a nice match. Any info would be a great help. Also i want to put spacers on the rear and i was thinking 10 or 12mm my car is a S line B7 2.0T FWD.

Sway bars are made from soft steel (carbon based) and will not vary due to material. The diameter of the bar and the bushing material hardness will determine the effectiveness of the bar.

Nico
06-19-2007, 07:39 AM
Sway bars are made from soft steel (carbon based) and will not vary due to material. The diameter of the bar and the bushing material hardness will determine the effectiveness of the bar.


I'm sure that some of the bars are holow, this would then negate the thickness argument. so there must be differences.

pcdrj
06-19-2007, 08:40 AM
"I'm sure that some of the bars are holow"

At 20mm thick, that would surprise me.

4-tified
06-19-2007, 09:52 AM
I'm sure that some of the bars are holow, this would then negate the thickness argument. so there must be differences.

Stay within the same bar and materials and that way you can tune by going up or down in thickness, and/or bushing position, if the bar is adjustable.

Does the 22, 24, etc...Audi bar equate to the HR 22, 24, etc...?
It might.
Unless you know the actual stiffness of the different bars from different manufacturers, it won't be exact.
However, call the manufacturers and ask them how their bars compare to the stock bars. They can tell you if their 22 is equivalent to Audi's 22, or maybe their 20 is Audi's 22 in stiffness.

Understand however that sway bars are a fine tuning component designed to help dial in the smaller adjustments once you have the spring rate and damper compression and rebound adjusted.
IOW, sway bars can't make up for the much greater effect of the springs and dampers.

You can even get reduced understeer or greater oversteer by changing your front and rear tire pressures. Again, tire pressure is another fine tuning part of the setup.
In general, if the rest of the suspension is set to your liking, you can use sway bars to help correct the more minor issues.


Most passenger road cars are designed to have understeer as most drivers can deal with understeer easier than oversteer, which requires a bit more skill. In an understeer the front wants to keep going in the same forward direction, and thus the tires "plow" through the turn as the front end doesn't have the needed grip to overcome the greater grip of the rear's pushing and momentum. Most drivers can correct by simply turning the wheel more towards the direction they want to go.
Also, they can give less throttle, more naturally, and that will transfer more weight to the front end giving it more grip and bringing the car back in to the turn.

If the car oversteers in a turn, the front end dives towards the turn, and the rear starts to step out of it's arc and begins slipping. If not correct that will cause the car to spin.
Controlling oversteer requires more skill as it requires a counter intuitive move to give MORE throttle to shift weight back to the rear to regain grip, and might require a counter turn of the steering wheel towards the direction of the rear ends travel and NOT in the direction the driver intended. So, most cars are setup to understeer.

Of course, the ideal is to have a setup that is neutral, such that the car always turns and goes where the drivers steers. Up to certain speeds, most cars do this. But when speeds increase a drivers skill may not be up to it.
Also, some cars drive wheels configurations tend more toward under or over steer. FWD and AWD tend to understeer as a natural consequence of the drive wheels needs to steer and apply power.
RWD, depending on weight balance, tends to oversteer as it's drive wheels have more slip and less grip as the car is asked to turn.

Sway bars do have an effect on the overall effective stiffness of the suspension. However, their main function is to control weight transfer from side to side, and thus they help the chassis to ride "flatter" instead of "swaying" to one side during turns, as the vehicles weight shifts.
As a side effect of doing that, the overall stiffness of the vehicle's suspension is also affected.

Whew, a long winded response. [:)]
But, it does depend on what you're trying to correct.
If the front end is "plowing" through a turn and you want more bite, then you can either reduce the sway bar size/stiffness in the front, or increase it in the rear. If the rear is loosing grip in a turn and wanting to step out, then softening the rear and/or stiffening the front can help.

I bookmarked a decent more in depth explanation and here it is if someone wants to read it.

http://www.stealthtdi.com/SwayBars.html

taj avant
06-21-2007, 09:54 PM
Hello,

The OE Audi A4 and S4 anti-sway bars are hollow (not sure about the OE RS4 rear bar), whereas the H&R anti-sway bars are solid. I definitely believe that the H&R bars are stiffer than an OE Audi bar of the same diameter. The H&R bars also allow for some adjustment using the different end link holes.

The H&R S4 rear anti-sway bar is a direct bolt on for any B6 or B7 A4 or S4. It comes supplied with its own bushings, and uses the factory bushing bracket.

I'm sure someone has tried blending different brands of anti-sway bars for Audis and other cars successfully, but I like to stick with the same manufacturer for my car front and back. Using two different brands of bars feels like using two different brands of tires on the same car (just personal preference).

H&R has not yet brought the 24mm RS4 rear anti-sway bar to North America, but promises they are coming. My guess that this bar will also be a direct bolt-on for Audi A4 and S4 cars when it does arrive. I just might have to try one out when they become available just to cure my curiosity.

Tom

mattchow
06-21-2007, 10:05 PM
hsport kit ftw.

Nico
06-22-2007, 05:03 AM
Great info guys. Thanks for taking the time to answer. Seems like H & R it is. Just need to decide between the S4 and RS4..

leo_yuen_
06-22-2007, 07:59 AM
nico, if u have got any info on the price of them in australia.
pm me here =D

lak2881
06-22-2007, 09:13 AM
I am running the H&R sport springs with the H&R 20mm rear sway bar set on the stiff setting. Becasue of the adjustability i figured it was not necessary to get the 22mm S4 sway bar. Also as far as the spacers i am running the H&R 10mm spacers and they look great. LEt me know if you have any other questions. SO far i love the ride and drive of my car.