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Thread: k0422-822

  1. #1
    Established Member Two Rings
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    k0422-822

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    so im gonna give the speed3 k04 a try. got the turbo from ebay. had a flange laser cut at work. bought a 5 bolt to 3" v-band on the advise from zimbu. got a UM 440 ecu on the way with 415cc genesis injectors and a 3" maf housing. also have a ra4/s4 clutch setup on the way. might move to full 3" exhaust front to rear also. right now its 3" dp to 2.5" free flowing. im gonna keep a running total on this upgrade. by the way, all this is in a bagged and bodied s10.

    turbo -- $145
    v-band adpter -- $50
    ecu, inj, maf -- $300
    s4 clutch -- $167
    ra4 flywheel -- $266
    ------------
    $928


    ebay fmic
    31x12x3 --$99
    couplers
    tbolt clamps --$100
    aem filter --$31
    3" ic pipe --$42
    2" weld el --$20
    3" 45 for dp --$22
    o2 bungs --$17
    -------------
    $1259









    current 2.5" exhaust. in the bottom of the pic, thats were it connects to the 3"dp



    pic of said s10 at ride height

    Last edited by josh baker; 02-13-2018 at 05:58 PM.

  2. #2
    Veteran Member Three Rings kwnk's Avatar
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    Sweet! I remember when you first posted the s10 build! Glad to see the build continue.

    the mazda k04 is up on my experimental parts list. Looking forward to the progress

    Cheers,
    1999 1.8TQM Avant | H&R Coilovers | 034 1bar tune | 16" URS4 Fuchs | Forge 008 | Borla

  3. #3
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    My "other car" is an '08 Speed 3 bought new in '08 and maintained and modded by me ever since. I am tuned on a K04 and running a 3" catless dp/rp into the stock MS3 CBE, which I recall is about 2.60". The turbo benefits from the 3" free flowing dp/rp, but in the Mazdaspeed community we found no real power gains on the K04 by increasing the size of the CBE. By the time the exhaust gas gets that far back it has cooled and compressed enough to flow freely through the stock CBE.

    Not suggesting you shouldn't try going larger, just don't expect any real gains on pump gas.

    The K04 flows much better than the K03, but is subject to center shaft failure if exhaust gas temps get above 1500 degrees F. That limits boost to about 15 psi from and above 6,000 rpm. You can go as high as 20-22 psi on pump gas down low if you gradually taper beginning at 4,000-4,500.

    We had a lot of K04 failures on the Mazda MZR engine due to center shaft seal failure. That was not a fault of the K04, but rather due to excess crankshaft pressure caused by a design flaw in Mazda crankcase ventilation system. You will not have that problem adapting it to the 2.0T Audi engine. But, a used K04 from a Speed 3 may have damaged seals. These "smoking turbos" can be rebuilt, so you might want to get a kit and take care of it on the front end. It did us little good to rebuild, as the high crankcase pressure would just cause the rebuilt turbo to start smoking.

    We resorted to aftermarket fixes, some working, some not. One solution, which has worked for me is a hybrid turbo using Garrett GT28 series CHRA modified to fit in the K04 snail. Again, you'll not have that problem if you replace the seals.

    BTW, I have a K0422-882 that I will give someone for free if you pay for shipping. It smokes and will need seals, but is otherwise in very good shape. It was replaced by a BNR stage 1, which is the K04/Garret GT28 hybrid with much more stout center shaft journal bearings and seals, but identical flow.

    The K04 is good to about 310-320 whp on pump gas, after which it is outside its compressor map efficiency and just turns into a hot air flame thrower.

    It has very rapid spool, incredible low end grunt and nice power to about 6,200 rpm if you taper boost, keep AFRs relatively rich and crank up timing. Make the power up top with modest boost and aggressive timing.

    I will follow your thread. Keep us informed of the progress.
    Last edited by MSq5; 01-30-2018 at 07:55 PM.
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  4. #4
    Veteran Member Four Rings walky_talky20's Avatar
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    I somehow missed your original thread about the S10. That's super cool. I hope you take it to some low key car shows and steal all the attention from the tire shiners you park next to.
    ^Don't listen to this guy, he's not even a mechanic.
    2001 Laser Red A4 1.8TQM, 5-Speed Swapped, 4.11 Final Drive, APR 93, 2.5" Exhaust, ST Coilovers, 034 RSB, A8 Brakes Front & Rear
    2006 Passion Red Volvo V50 T5 AWD 6MT
    2000 Satin Silver Passat 1.8T FWD Wagon, Slippy Tiptronic, 15" Hubcaps
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  5. #5
    Established Member Two Rings
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    Quote Originally Posted by MSq5 View Post
    My "other car" is an '08 Speed 3 bought new in '08 and maintained and modded by me ever since. I am tuned on a K04 and running a 3" catless dp/rp into the stock MS3 CBE, which I recall is about 2.60". The turbo benefits from the 3" free flowing dp/rp, but in the Mazdaspeed community we found no real power gains on the K04 by increasing the size of the CBE. By the time the exhaust gas gets that far back it has cooled and compressed enough to flow freely through the stock CBE.

    Not suggesting you shouldn't try going larger, just don't expect any real gains on pump gas.

    The K04 flows much better than the K03, but is subject to center shaft failure if exhaust gas temps get above 1500 degrees F. That limits boost to about 15 psi from and above 6,000 rpm. You can go as high as 20-22 psi on pump gas down low if you gradually taper beginning at 4,000-4,500.

    We had a lot of K04 failures on the Mazda MZR engine due to center shaft seal failure. That was not a fault of the K04, but rather due to excess crankshaft pressure caused by a design flaw in Mazda crankcase ventilation system. You will not have that problem adapting it to the 2.0T Audi engine. But, a used K04 from a Speed 3 may have damaged seals. These "smoking turbos" can be rebuilt, so you might want to get a kit and take care of it on the front end. It did us little good to rebuild, as the high crankcase pressure would just cause the rebuilt turbo to start smoking.

    We resorted to aftermarket fixes, some working, some not. One solution, which has worked for me is a hybrid turbo using Garrett GT28 series CHRA modified to fit in the K04 snail. Again, you'll not have that problem if you replace the seals.

    BTW, I have a K0422-882 that I will give someone for free if you pay for shipping. It smokes and will need seals, but is otherwise in very good shape. It was replaced by a BNR stage 1, which is the K04/Garret GT28 hybrid with much more stout center shaft journal bearings and seals, but identical flow.

    The K04 is good to about 310-320 whp on pump gas, after which it is outside its compressor map efficiency and just turns into a hot air flame thrower.

    It has very rapid spool, incredible low end grunt and nice power to about 6,200 rpm if you taper boost, keep AFRs relatively rich and crank up timing. Make the power up top with modest boost and aggressive timing.

    I will follow your thread. Keep us informed of the progress.
    what rebuild kit did you use? the turbo i got is supposed to only have 81k on it. what mods do you have to do to fit the gt28?

  6. #6
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    turbo flange to manifold adapter made. ecu, injectors, and 3" maf housing are here. i ordered a 5bolt to 3" vband adapter but the holes dont line up. so i'll probably just make one. a friend at work runs a laser. the s10 is in the garage ready to be pulled apart. still waiting on the clutch stuff.








  7. #7
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    so i spent all that time making an adapter to find out the control arm occupies that area. honestly, i knew it prob wouldnt fit. so im gonna do a 90 degree weld el from the mani to turbo. also ordered a 3" thick fmic. all the clutch parts are here.

    this is the new location




    ended up welding the adapter on. didnt want to waste it.





  8. #8
    Veteran Member Four Rings walky_talky20's Avatar
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    I'm loving the "make it happen" nature of this build. Nice job.

    I'm sure you know this, but you want to make sure you make sure you brace the turbo to the motor pretty well somehow so you're not breaking stuff or having constant loosening/leaking issues.
    ^Don't listen to this guy, he's not even a mechanic.
    2001 Laser Red A4 1.8TQM, 5-Speed Swapped, 4.11 Final Drive, APR 93, 2.5" Exhaust, ST Coilovers, 034 RSB, A8 Brakes Front & Rear
    2006 Passion Red Volvo V50 T5 AWD 6MT
    2000 Satin Silver Passat 1.8T FWD Wagon, Slippy Tiptronic, 15" Hubcaps
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  9. #9
    Veteran Member Four Rings GOODBYNAAIR's Avatar
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    Jeez thats alot of work ! sure your saving a buck and making something cool but . Nice work will like to see how this ends.
    SOLD the GOINHAM A4 ---> GT2860 Project

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by walky_talky20 View Post
    I'm loving the "make it happen" nature of this build. Nice job.

    I'm sure you know this, but you want to make sure you make sure you brace the turbo to the motor pretty well somehow so you're not breaking stuff or having constant loosening/leaking issues.
    thanks. i make do with what i got. it will be braced once i get it locked in for sure.

    Quote Originally Posted by GOODBYNAAIR View Post
    Jeez thats alot of work ! sure your saving a buck and making something cool but . Nice work will like to see how this ends.
    this is fun for me. making things that arent supposed to be together go together. fabbing makes me think out of the box.

  11. #11
    Veteran Member Four Rings
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    I love seeing any posts to do with this truck. It is awesome in every way.

    I also like seeing other people still getting creative with the 1.8t
    Stupid drift A4

    R.I.P RWD-converted '99 A4 Avant 1.8T

  12. #12
    Veteran Member Four Rings GOODBYNAAIR's Avatar
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    I dont know about the truck whats the story behind it?
    SOLD the GOINHAM A4 ---> GT2860 Project

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by GOODBYNAAIR View Post
    I dont know about the truck whats the story behind it?
    not much of a story, but i traded a quad for this truck in pieces. re-assembled and daily drove it. a friend of mine one day says " hey, i know where you can get a b5 running and driving with no title for $500." jokingly i said, that would be a cool motor swap into the s10. then a few others said i couldnt do it. me and the friend that found it paid $400. so its bagged, body dropped and drags frame. 1.8 swapped, 15" blow-through system, and just overall a fun truck to drive. im 6'4" climbing in and out of this when its rockers are grounded and i live in a farm town of less than 1000 people. nobody round here knows what to think about it.

  14. #14
    Active Member Two Rings kjames1270's Avatar
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    15"? Videoo

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  15. #15
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    final turbo placement is set. the k03 flange and the ms3 flange are welded together along with the 2" weld el 90. factory oil feed fits, coolant feed fits, oil return cut, turned and extended, and coolant return re-routed. 3" aluminum maf housing with aem dry filter. the hosing will get fittings welded on for dv and n75. ended up getting a 3" intercooler so when i go bigger later, its there. since this is a body dropped s10, the front frame is what they call z'ed. so both the rad and ic are offset to the drivers side leaving this hole right to the air filter. gonna pie cut the ic pipes in a few spots and get them tig'd.










  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by kjames1270 View Post
    15"? Videoo

    Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk
    no video.









  17. #17
    Veteran Member Four Rings ZimbutheMonkey's Avatar
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    Great job so far man!

    I like the idea of repositioning the turbo. It may make it a lot easier to get around some of the inlet/discharge piping issues I ran into when I used the stock location.

    As others have said, keep us all posted as to how your progress goes.

    Remarkably satisfying to consider the possibility that you can yourself a 270-290 WHP turbo setup for $1300 including all the accessories isn't it

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZimbutheMonkey View Post
    Great job so far man!

    I like the idea of repositioning the turbo. It may make it a lot easier to get around some of the inlet/discharge piping issues I ran into when I used the stock location.

    As others have said, keep us all posted as to how your progress goes.

    Remarkably satisfying to consider the possibility that you can yourself a 270-290 WHP turbo setup for $1300 including all the accessories isn't it
    thanks. i hope to be at atleast 250 whp. i will dyno it when its all done. the 3" ic piping is being tig welded right now by a friend. trans is out for the clutch swap. just about done.

  19. #19
    Active Member Two Rings kjames1270's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by josh baker View Post
    thanks. i hope to be at atleast 250 whp. i will dyno it when its all done. the 3" ic piping is being tig welded right now by a friend. trans is out for the clutch swap. just about done.
    What clutch setup did you go with? I'm gonna tackle all this when I do the trans swap

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  20. #20
    Veteran Member Four Rings GOODBYNAAIR's Avatar
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    250w will be awesome and if its on a sad dyno ill be mad, thats all I made on a heart breaker with GT286rs. well 254 in the summer heat. good luck look forward to it.
    SOLD the GOINHAM A4 ---> GT2860 Project

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    Quote Originally Posted by kjames1270 View Post
    What clutch setup did you go with? I'm gonna tackle all this when I do the trans swap

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    ECS ra4 flywheel with a stock luk s4 disk and pressure plate from rock auto

  22. #22
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    is this enough of a brace? the 2 flanges are welded together on both sides as well as the weld el obviously. so this is just a little extra. also got my ic pipes done. and a new coolant reservoir








  23. #23
    Veteran Member Four Rings walky_talky20's Avatar
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    The brace isn't overkill, but I think you'll be ok. Worst case, you just have trouble with the bolts backing out and gasket failing early. In that case, you can do something more extravagant.

    I see you've got a flex section in the exhaust, which is good. It would be ideal to have the downpipe mounted to the transmission somewhere - ahead of the flex section. This takes the load off of the turbo hardware as the engine moves around.
    ^Don't listen to this guy, he's not even a mechanic.
    2001 Laser Red A4 1.8TQM, 5-Speed Swapped, 4.11 Final Drive, APR 93, 2.5" Exhaust, ST Coilovers, 034 RSB, A8 Brakes Front & Rear
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    2000 Satin Silver Passat 1.8T FWD Wagon, Slippy Tiptronic, 15" Hubcaps
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    Veteran Member Four Rings ZimbutheMonkey's Avatar
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    One thing I might suggest if you're on the stock exhaust manifold is to take it off and port it out a bit. I was going to try it on my own A4, but I ended up putting all my resources into my S4 sedan at the moment.

    Not sure how much the stock exhaust manifold holds you back (if any) compared to an aftermarket one, but it would likely net some free HP .

  25. #25
    Veteran Member Four Rings GOODBYNAAIR's Avatar
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    I feel like you could do all most the same swap\ setup with the GT25xx that come stock in the Saab turbo aero cars. There are a tone of them in the junk yard.

    Nice work.
    SOLD the GOINHAM A4 ---> GT2860 Project

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by GOODBYNAAIR View Post
    I feel like you could do all most the same swap\ setup with the GT25xx that come stock in the Saab turbo aero cars. There are a tone of them in the junk yard.

    Nice work.
    what year cars?

  27. #27
    Veteran Member Four Rings GOODBYNAAIR's Avatar
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    I have not taken them apart but just looking throw the yard most are turbo 9.3s and 9.5s from maybe 97 ish- 2005 seem to have almost the same setup. 9.3 being 2.0L and 9.5 being 2.3L. I know they run a stock Garrett turbo looks like a GT25xxx\ saab hybird with maybe a T25 exhaust mani. Note I dont follow saabs this is just me walking around the yard being a car guy. lol I may be way off.
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  28. #28
    Veteran Member Four Rings ZimbutheMonkey's Avatar
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    Problem with the SAAB turbos are that unless it's off something like a late mode Aero or Viggen they won't flow as much as the Mazdaspeed K04.

    In terms of plentiful junkyard turbos, I can't really think of many which are as well suited to a stock 1.8T as the K0422-822 in terms of both spool-up and flow rates.

  29. #29
    Veteran Member Four Rings GOODBYNAAIR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZimbutheMonkey View Post
    Problem with the SAAB turbos are that unless it's off something like a late mode Aero or Viggen they won't flow as much as the Mazdaspeed K04.

    In terms of plentiful junkyard turbos, I can't really think of many which are as well suited to a stock 1.8T as the K0422-822 in terms of both spool-up and flow rates.
    10 -4 it was just a thought? That maybe it could be used in a similar way, But its all good.
    Last edited by GOODBYNAAIR; 03-02-2018 at 02:17 PM.
    SOLD the GOINHAM A4 ---> GT2860 Project

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    Veteran Member Four Rings ZimbutheMonkey's Avatar
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    Oh yeah, not saying that it's not worth considering. More of just an editorial on my part.

    (PS: Just did some checking and it looks like most of the SAAB stock turbos max out around 25-28 lb/min, however, you DO have the advantage of using a Garrett outline which of course gives you more upgrade options).

  31. #31
    Veteran Member Four Rings GOODBYNAAIR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZimbutheMonkey View Post
    Oh yeah, not saying that it's not worth considering. More of just an editorial on my part.

    (PS: Just did some checking and it looks like most of the SAAB stock turbos max out around 25-28 lb/min, however, you DO have the advantage of using a Garrett outline which of course gives you more upgrade options).
    HHHMMM, maybe if I get around to that B5 beater rally car one day. I'll fab up a $75 Saab yard turbo and see what is does. Thanks for the impute Monkey.
    SOLD the GOINHAM A4 ---> GT2860 Project

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    so i'm still working on this slowly. waiting on ic clamps still. everything is hooked up and it idles. im getting a p1545 code. i think i need a tb relearn, but i dont have vagcom yet. also have an oil leak on the return i gotta fix.










  33. #33
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    Is the hex-v2 what i need?

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    Veteran Member Four Rings walky_talky20's Avatar
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    This is such the sleeper-est thread title ever. It should be "DOPE S10 1.8T Swap / Legit Fab Skills Thread FTW" or something like that.

    Nice pipes, sir.

    Also, I feel bad for whomever has to change the rear coolant flange in the future. Somehow the truck install has appeared to make it even harder. lol
    ^Don't listen to this guy, he's not even a mechanic.
    2001 Laser Red A4 1.8TQM, 5-Speed Swapped, 4.11 Final Drive, APR 93, 2.5" Exhaust, ST Coilovers, 034 RSB, A8 Brakes Front & Rear
    2006 Passion Red Volvo V50 T5 AWD 6MT
    2000 Satin Silver Passat 1.8T FWD Wagon, Slippy Tiptronic, 15" Hubcaps
    2001 Aluminum Silver Metallic A4 Avant 1.8TQM (winter sled)

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by walky_talky20 View Post
    This is such the sleeper-est thread title ever. It should be "DOPE S10 1.8T Swap / Legit Fab Skills Thread FTW" or something like that.

    Nice pipes, sir.

    Also, I feel bad for whomever has to change the rear coolant flange in the future. Somehow the truck install has appeared to make it even harder. lol
    haha, thanks. you can have it changed to that. the coolant flange is actually no bad to get to. i also put in the metal one when i first put this engine in. that cover is hiding a little space to get to it

  36. #36
    Veteran Member Four Rings walky_talky20's Avatar
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    Ooh, the metal one! Ebay or UroTuning?

    I actually own a couple of the metal ones but have not yet installed one. How was fitment and sealing in your opinion?
    ^Don't listen to this guy, he's not even a mechanic.
    2001 Laser Red A4 1.8TQM, 5-Speed Swapped, 4.11 Final Drive, APR 93, 2.5" Exhaust, ST Coilovers, 034 RSB, A8 Brakes Front & Rear
    2006 Passion Red Volvo V50 T5 AWD 6MT
    2000 Satin Silver Passat 1.8T FWD Wagon, Slippy Tiptronic, 15" Hubcaps
    2001 Aluminum Silver Metallic A4 Avant 1.8TQM (winter sled)

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by walky_talky20 View Post
    Ooh, the metal one! Ebay or UroTuning?

    I actually own a couple of the metal ones but have not yet installed one. How was fitment and sealing in your opinion?
    i think it was from euro tuning. fit great, seals fine. i did the "porting out" i saw on the thread here somewhere. i bought it cause i didnt want to have problems after the swap
    '93 S10--bagged and bodied, 1.8T swap, speed3 k04, UM stage 2, genisis 415cc, 3" maf housing, 3" fmic, 3"dp to 2.5" exhaust, JHM short throw, no p/s a/c or mechanical fan, icm delete and push down coils, welded center torsion, ECS ra4 flywheel and stock s4 clutch, DD 15" sub in a blow through box with a Crescendo 1500.1 powering it

  38. #38
    Veteran Member Four Rings ZimbutheMonkey's Avatar
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    Mar 27 2010
    AZ Member #
    56705
    Location
    solar system

    Josh, looking at your intake setup, I would strongly advise making it longer to allow for at least a 3-4 inch straight piece of piping in front of the MAF sensor.

    The way you have it set up it's going to be highly likely that your MAF won't be reading properly. The sensor needs a straight section in front of it otherwise it will read either high or low.

    I'd put a 90 degree bend in front of the turbo, then run the intake along the front of the rad.

  39. #39
    Established Member Two Rings
    Join Date
    Feb 02 2014
    AZ Member #
    142983
    Location
    nw mo

    Quote Originally Posted by ZimbutheMonkey View Post
    Josh, looking at your intake setup, I would strongly advise making it longer to allow for at least a 3-4 inch straight piece of piping in front of the MAF sensor.

    The way you have it set up it's going to be highly likely that your MAF won't be reading properly. The sensor needs a straight section in front of it otherwise it will read either high or low.

    I'd put a 90 degree bend in front of the turbo, then run the intake along the front of the rad.
    so i bought the hex v2 and did the tba. then it wouldnt even idle. after consulting some facebook peeps, they said my maf was to close to dv, needed air straightner, and needed to be mounted vertically. so i temporarily blocked the maf hole off and added the plastic 3" housing on the end. now it idles fine. i also found out i've been running my water pump backwards due to deleting the ps and fan. so im fixing that issue and have new belts on the way.

    '93 S10--bagged and bodied, 1.8T swap, speed3 k04, UM stage 2, genisis 415cc, 3" maf housing, 3" fmic, 3"dp to 2.5" exhaust, JHM short throw, no p/s a/c or mechanical fan, icm delete and push down coils, welded center torsion, ECS ra4 flywheel and stock s4 clutch, DD 15" sub in a blow through box with a Crescendo 1500.1 powering it

  40. #40
    Established Member Two Rings
    Join Date
    Feb 02 2014
    AZ Member #
    142983
    Location
    nw mo

    bought a silicone 90 and added a 5-6" piece in front of the maf. running real good so far. hit 20psi in fourth once. just wanted to see what i was working with. got to get this clutch broke in. hope to hit dyno day here on april 15, i think it is. thanks everyone for the help and suggestions.
    '93 S10--bagged and bodied, 1.8T swap, speed3 k04, UM stage 2, genisis 415cc, 3" maf housing, 3" fmic, 3"dp to 2.5" exhaust, JHM short throw, no p/s a/c or mechanical fan, icm delete and push down coils, welded center torsion, ECS ra4 flywheel and stock s4 clutch, DD 15" sub in a blow through box with a Crescendo 1500.1 powering it

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