Deciding which stage 3 fueling kit to go with...suggestions?

**Porkibear** · 02-02-2012 11:02 PM

Hi there, kinda new posting here but an old timer when it comes to different Audi forums. I am finally going stage 3 on my B5, and have been stagnant as far as modding my car for several years. I haven't done much research about stage 3 kits because I honestly didn't think it was going to happen.

I have K04's brand new sitting around waiting to be installed, and now I'm going to bite the bullet on a full stage 3 fueling kit as well as get some maintenance stuff out of the way since the engine is going to get pulled anyway.

I've been doing research on fueling kits, but google searches only get me YouTube comparison runs of certain stage 3 B5's or dyno runs without any horsepower numbers. So far ASP seems like a good kit, but wanted to get input from other stage 3 owners. What kind of horsepower numbers are we looking at for K04 stage 3 cars? How is the EPL fueling kit? Which kit is the most reliable for track use? My B5 will end up being mostly for track use and only a few times a month on the street.

**BlkdoutA4** · 02-02-2012 11:15 PM

Hey, I have a JHM stage 3 fueling kit for sale right now. Its perfect for someone in CA since its for 91 octane. I made 400whp with the tune and meth. PM me, I am willing to sell everything for much less than I paid for it, only reason I'm selling is because i'm switching to bigger turbos.

**Porkibear** · 02-02-2012 11:28 PM

Originally Posted by BlkdoutA4

Hey, I have a JHM stage 3 fueling kit for sale right now. Its perfect for someone in CA since its for 91 octane. I made 400whp with the tune and meth. PM me, I am willing to sell everything for much less than I paid for it, only reason I'm selling is because i'm switching to bigger turbos.

Hey, thanks for the offer. I will consider it. That brings me to another question: i see a lot of used fueling kits for sale in the classifieds. Is there a drawback from buying a used fueling kit versus a new one? The only concern I would have is the injectors being worn after certain number of miles...

**BlkdoutA4** · 02-02-2012 11:36 PM

Originally Posted by Porkibear

Hey, thanks for the offer. I will consider it. That brings me to another question: i see a lot of used fueling kits for sale in the classifieds. Is there a drawback from buying a used fueling kit versus a new one? The only concern I would have is the injectors being worn after certain number of miles...

It all depends. My kit only has 25k miles on it and everything is in like new condition with absolutely no problems when removed.

**Sole_** · 02-03-2012 03:50 AM

In my opinion, piece the fueling kit together instead of getting an OTS fueling kit. You will have better results and you can get the car tuned to your liking.

The things you'll need :
Hitachi MAF if you dont have yet
Bigger MAF, I'm guessing for you an 85mm
Injectors, I would go with 52LB EV 14s
4Bar FPR
Possibly a better fuel pump

**sqitis** · 02-03-2012 04:00 AM

It really does depend on supporting mods but I would talk to Max at 034 or call up Tony at EPL.

**morris400** · 02-03-2012 05:17 AM

Im going with jfonz. Ive heard alot of good things about jfonz. Also epl is another great road to take.

**durfA4** · 02-03-2012 05:38 AM

It depends on what your goals are, cheapest is Jfonz, tune, and self source parts, the 52lb injectors from gt500 are $228 for 8, adapters are $40 for 8, they eBay mafs were a good deal for $45, and 034 hose is $75, so about 800-900 depending on where you can source the maf housing. EPL is about $800 for tune and then hardware varies, but they want you to use thir parts which makes sense they know they can trust products, dyno time also helps.

If you want to do it your self,then Jfonz, if not then go to a off the shelf tune from a major shop.

I also did not mention nefmoto, you can learn and tune yourself for free.

**DiscoPotato** · 02-03-2012 07:04 AM

Originally Posted by Sole_

In my opinion, piece the fueling kit together instead of getting an OTS fueling kit. You will have better results and you can get the car tuned to your liking.

The things you'll need :
Hitachi MAF if you dont have yet
Bigger MAF, I'm guessing for you an 85mm
Injectors, I would go with 52LB EV 14s
4Bar FPR
Possibly a better fuel pump

This

**splatt** · 02-03-2012 07:12 AM

I'll be going with epl whenever I sack up and pull the trigger. It's a relatively short drive (day trip) if I need any support. I would see who your local shops are dealers for and make your decision that way.

**FlyboyS4** · 02-03-2012 07:42 AM

Originally Posted by Porkibear

I've been doing research on fueling kits, but google searches only get me YouTube comparison runs of certain stage 3 B5's or dyno runs without any horsepower numbers. So far ASP seems like a good kit, but wanted to get input from other stage 3 owners. What kind of horsepower numbers are we looking at for K04 stage 3 cars? How is the EPL fueling kit? Which kit is the most reliable for track use? My B5 will end up being mostly for track use and only a few times a month on the street.

I think HP numbers (assuming higher is generally preferred) and reliable track use are opposing attributes. You get higher HP by pushing the systems, and track use also pushes the systems, so combing the two is going to up your chances for component failure. My suggestion would be to contact a tuner that will be able to customize something for you, and from my experience I would suggest EPL. ASP is another good option, and possibly 034, though I don't know much about their tuning options. I don't see Jfonz as being as strong an option as EPL when it comes to tuning experience, and if I were pushing my motor at the track I'd want to know the tune was coming from a source that has a lot of experience. VAST is another option but they are moving to a volume model, pushing out tunes quickly to move onto the next, and their customer support is a complete crap shoot whether they help you or add you to the growing list of unhappy customers.

An 85mm MAF housing, Hitachi MAF sensor, 52# or 72# EV14 injectors, and possibly a higher capacity fuel pump are pretty typical fueling hardware bits. Being able to get the car tuned on a dyno is a plus.

**phila_dot** · 02-03-2012 07:50 AM

I would suggest you contact Wicked Motorsports or Raven Motorsports for local support.

**A62TURBO** · 02-03-2012 08:02 AM

I picked up EPL's stg 3 fueling kit along with a set of K04's, haven't installed yet but I've heard great things.

**Sales@EPL** · 02-03-2012 08:05 AM

Thanks for the support guys! PM coming your way OP

**Kai@EliteMS** · 02-03-2012 08:15 AM

Go with EPL or ASP. Whatever is closest to you. Good luck!

**Fiyacracka** · 02-03-2012 08:38 AM

I wouldn't go with ASP. They're still using Siemens injectors. I switched to J-fonz and couldnt be happier

**Porkibear** · 02-03-2012 08:39 AM

Originally Posted by phila_dot

I would suggest you contact Wicked Motorsports or Raven Motorsports for local support.

Thanks for all the input, everyone. Sounds like I have some major decision making to do. Wicked and Raven seem to be the only local tuners who do custom tuning. Wicked has their own in-house tune from what I hear. Or do they sell both ASP or EPL? Raven I believe sells EPL fueling. Both will tell me they won't warranty their work if I source parts on my own, so that would make it hard for me to go with the option of piecing the stg 3 parts myself.

Are Wicked and Raven the go-to installers in SoCal? I know Eurotech motors does turbo swaps, but they are charging ridiculous pricing now.

**Don Supreme** · 02-03-2012 08:39 AM

As has been made clear by this thread. The B5 S4 has so many good tuning options these days.. How far we have come.

**Porkibear** · 02-03-2012 08:45 AM

Originally Posted by FlyboyS4

I think HP numbers (assuming higher is generally preferred) and reliable track use are opposing attributes. You get higher HP by pushing the systems, and track use also pushes the systems, so combing the two is going to up your chances for component failure. My suggestion would be to contact a tuner that will be able to customize something for you, and from my experience I would suggest EPL. ASP is another good option, and possibly 034, though I don't know much about their tuning options. I don't see Jfonz as being as strong an option as EPL when it comes to tuning experience, and if I were pushing my motor at the track I'd want to know the tune was coming from a source that has a lot of experience. VAST is another option but they are moving to a volume model, pushing out tunes quickly to move onto the next, and their customer support is a complete crap shoot whether they help you or add you to the growing list of unhappy customers.

An 85mm MAF housing, Hitachi MAF sensor, 52# or 72# EV14 injectors, and possibly a higher capacity fuel pump are pretty typical fueling hardware bits. Being able to get the car tuned on a dyno is a plus.

I actually completely agree with you on this. I'm not looking for crazy quarter mile times. After researching tial kits and some of the other big horsepower kits, I decided that it wouldn't be a good fit for road racing. I want a good balance, and I'm actually looking into a center 4:1 diff as well as a rear LSD ($$$). That's why my stage 3 upgrade isn't "just" the turbo and fueling install. I'm looking to get my car towards a reliable track-car at the same time. I guess my question is whether certain tunes have much differing horsepower gains between different fueling kits.

**Porkibear** · 02-03-2012 08:47 AM

Originally Posted by Fiyacracka

I wouldn't go with ASP. They're still using Siemens injectors. I switched to J-fonz and couldnt be happier

Hmmmm...what's wrong with Siemens injectors?

**Porkibear** · 02-03-2012 08:49 AM

Originally Posted by Don Supreme

As has been made clear by this thread. The B5 S4 has so many good tuning options these days.. How far we have come.

Yup...it's funny because I own a 2010 335i sedan as well, and ppl on the 335i forums went through exactly what the B5 S4 owners went through back in the day.

**mjacksons4** · 02-03-2012 09:00 AM

EPL!

**RedB5S4** · 02-03-2012 09:55 AM

Originally Posted by phila_dot

I would suggest you contact Wicked Motorsports or Raven Motorsports for local support.

This. Stay with a local company. It's going to be a pain in the ass ordering different things from different places, going some place else to get the car tuned, and then trying to deal with companies that are on the other side of the country.