Whats up guys, my name is Kristian, been lurkin in the forums for a while, decided its time to start a thread. I bought a 2001 A4 Avant 1.8TQM last may with a BT already installed. Bought it with 182k and a STOCK MOTOR. Now has 190k and still running strong @ 24 psi.
Der patient:
Motor
Garrett t3/t4 60 trim
Unitronics 630cc file
Siemens 630cc injectors
AWM Block
AEB Head
AEB Pistons
IE Rods (144x20)
IE Manual T-Belt Tensioner
Ferrea SuperAlloy Exhaust Valves
CAT Gold Valve springs
OEM Main Bearings
OEM Rod Bearings
ARP Head Bolts
ARP Main Studs
ARP Crank Bolt
ARP Cam Pulley Bolt
ARP Flywheel Bolts
Drivetrain
SM Flywheel
ACT 6-puck unsprung
4:1 Center Diff Mod
Ebay Short Shifter w/ "Modifications"
Suspension
Stasis Tracksports
OEM Sport Front sway
OEM Sport Rear sway
Very nice. I drove my buddies 60 trim VR6 gti and it put down 290fwhp. Horrible turbo lag but his new bored over motor with built bottom end should solve that.
You should see 350whp easily.
ATW 1.8TQM | SCAT | FX400 | GTcougaR | AEM Standalone | Meth
PM ME: Parting out all Stage I parts
If you don't like his B5 Avant then maybe post about it in the B6 forum and not his thread, this is about his car and what he is doing to it. The B5 is a great looking car and obviously this guy likes it so lets keep the comments on the positive side. The looks great and the new parts should make it a lot of fun even though it is no slouch as it sits. Best of luck on the build and keep us posted.
- 2000 Audi A4
- 1994 Corrado VR6
- 1991 Jetta Coupe Syncro
Looks very nice, couple questions/suggestions though. If you're set up to rev to 8500, have you considered a 60-1 instead of the 60 trim? Also, you may want to consider going with a divided turbine housing setup.
Unless anyone else has any good evidence that a divided housing won't help low end spool, then I say go for it. I'm pretty much convinced I'm going go to a .78 Divided housing on my 60-1. I'll have to modify my manifold, but I figure since I made the whole damn thing myself, I should be able to manage setting it up for a divided setup I have buddy that owes me about $700 for my old 058 AEB long block so I'm thinking divided housing with supertech or Rosten springs and Ti retainers. With a housing that size and the ability to rev out to 8000+ RPM's, it's going to be a nasty little beast.
All that said, good luck with the build, if you're doing it yourself, triple check everything and if you find fuck-ups that's a good thing. It just means that it isn't going to go all FUBAR once you're running it. Oh, and one more thing, paranoia is your best friend. Listen to it, it's just the eerie sensation of knowing that you're right. (Just don't listen to it if it tells you to burn things)
Looks very nice, couple questions/suggestions though. If you're set up to rev to 8500, have you considered a 60-1 instead of the 60 trim? Also, you may want to consider going with a divided turbine housing setup.
Unless anyone else has any good evidence that a divided housing won't help low end spool, then I say go for it. I'm pretty much convinced I'm going go to a .78 Divided housing on my 60-1. I'll have to modify my manifold, but I figure since I made the whole damn thing myself, I should be able to manage setting it up for a divided setup I have buddy that owes me about $700 for my old 058 AEB long block so I'm thinking divided housing with supertech or Rosten springs and Ti retainers. With a housing that size and the ability to rev out to 8000+ RPM's, it's going to be a nasty little beast.
All that said, good luck with the build, if you're doing it yourself, triple check everything and if you find fuck-ups that's a good thing. It just means that it isn't going to go all FUBAR once you're running it. Oh, and one more thing, paranoia is your best friend. Listen to it, it's just the eerie sensation of knowing that you're right. (Just don't listen to it if it tells you to burn things)
Funny you say that actually. I knew the housing was a twin scroll but I was not sure of the AR. When I pulled it off earlier, I discovered it was a .78 AR. I plan on building a twin scroll manifold when I get back to school in January. What exactly is the difference between a 60-1 and a 60?
And thanks got the advice. I plan on double checking everything I do. I pulled the motor earlier today so I'll get some pics up ASAP.
Funny you say that actually. I knew the housing was a twin scroll but I was not sure of the AR. When I pulled it off earlier, I discovered it was a .78 AR. I plan on building a twin scroll manifold when I get back to school in January. What exactly is the difference between a 60-1 and a 60?
And thanks got the advice. I plan on double checking everything I do. I pulled the motor earlier today so I'll get some pics up ASAP.
60 trim is a T04E rated at 53 lb/min, 60-1 is a T04S rated at 61 lb/min.
Originally Posted by ZimbutheMonkey
Looks very nice, couple questions/suggestions though. If you're set up to rev to 8500, have you considered a 60-1 instead of the 60 trim? Also, you may want to consider going with a divided turbine housing setup.
Unless anyone else has any good evidence that a divided housing won't help low end spool, then I say go for it. I'm pretty much convinced I'm going go to a .78 Divided housing on my 60-1. I'll have to modify my manifold, but I figure since I made the whole damn thing myself, I should be able to manage setting it up for a divided setup I have buddy that owes me about $700 for my old 058 AEB long block so I'm thinking divided housing with supertech or Rosten springs and Ti retainers. With a housing that size and the ability to rev out to 8000+ RPM's, it's going to be a nasty little beast.
All that said, good luck with the build, if you're doing it yourself, triple check everything and if you find fuck-ups that's a good thing. It just means that it isn't going to go all FUBAR once you're running it. Oh, and one more thing, paranoia is your best friend. Listen to it, it's just the eerie sensation of knowing that you're right. (Just don't listen to it if it tells you to burn things)
Divided T3 on a non twin scroll manifold is pretty much the same as going with a smaller A/R open housing since all your doing is decrease the area inside the housing. A B6 owner ran a T3 divided housing on a GT30r IIRC, he has since sold that car and bought a S4.
60 trim is a T04E rated at 53 lb/min, 60-1 is a T04S rated at 61 lb/min.
Divided T3 on a non twin scroll manifold is pretty much the same as going with a smaller A/R open housing since all your doing is decrease the area inside the housing. A B6 owner ran a T3 divided housing on a GT30r IIRC, he has since sold that car and bought a S4.
I've got a plan to divide the manifold. It's kind of complicated to explain since I'll have to do it without hacking up the manifold, but I have a way to partition the manifold sides. The only question I have is regarding the firing order. If it's 1-3-4-2 would a vertical partition do any good anyway? Seeing as you wouldn't be getting alternating pulses from either side? Instead, you'd be getting 2 consecutive pulses on either side. Has anyone actually tried a .78 divided housing on a 1.8?
I've got a plan to divide the manifold. It's kind of complicated to explain since I'll have to do it without hacking up the manifold, but I have a way to partition the manifold sides. The only question I have is regarding the firing order. If it's 1-3-4-2 would a vertical partition do any good anyway? Seeing as you wouldn't be getting alternating pulses from either side? Instead, you'd be getting 2 consecutive pulses on either side. Has anyone actually tried a .78 divided housing on a 1.8?
Wont change much since the firing order wont be correct which is the point of doing a divided manifold. Just like running a open T3 .63 A/R housing.
I always wondered about people who run the T3 TS exhaust housing on a regular T3 flanged manifold. Would the little divider flange on the TS housing cause turbulance? But I have seen people run this with no issue, so it had me rather confused. Or is the divider just too small to even be considered to hinder from performance?
And OP, very nice list of parts. But it isn't a stroker (listed in your sig) if using AEB pistons.
I hate it when my car acts like a little bitch, treating me like the bitch
FS:Brand New K&N Air Filter RU-3700 (3" inlet, 5" base, 4" tall, 4 5/8" top), Brand New 3" Injen (Amsoil) Dry Filter Setup with Heat Shield, Brand New OEM 06A Oil Pump, Used Greddy Intercooler...throw me some offers
I always wondered about people who run the T3 TS exhaust housing on a regular T3 flanged manifold. Would the little divider flange on the TS housing cause turbulance? But I have seen people run this with no issue, so it had me rather confused. Or is the divider just too small to even be considered to hinder from performance?
And OP, very nice list of parts. But it isn't a stroker (listed in your sig) if using AEB pistons.
The first turbo that went on my Full-Race manifold was a twin scroll S300. I had no issues with that turbo till the CHRA cracked and I then changed to a GT35r.
I dont think he has posted any info on his stroker build, his main post was of the motor that is in it now.
So mike, I checked that link and I don't know if he ever actually tried the .78 housing. Do we know of anyone that has actually tried one on a vertically (width wise) divided manifold and posted some kind of before and after data?
Oh, thought that was the list of parts he was collecting for his stroker.
I hate it when my car acts like a little bitch, treating me like the bitch
FS:Brand New K&N Air Filter RU-3700 (3" inlet, 5" base, 4" tall, 4 5/8" top), Brand New 3" Injen (Amsoil) Dry Filter Setup with Heat Shield, Brand New OEM 06A Oil Pump, Used Greddy Intercooler...throw me some offers
So mike, I checked that link and I don't know if he ever actually tried the .78 housing. Do we know of anyone that has actually tried one on a vertically (width wise) divided manifold and posted some kind of before and after data?
Read page 3, post #94 he says he is running the divided housing.
Originally Posted by Condo
I have a twin scroll housing so the A/R is .78. I would have gone with .82 if I didn't have twin scroll. I'm running the 3658s as well.
Originally Posted by Seerlah
Oh, thought that was the list of parts he was collecting for his stroker.
I hope not because stock pistons can't be used with a longer stroke crank.
Yeah I know that, but then he never said anything about it again. So how do we know if it worked or not? Maybe he took it off for other reasons like space constraints?
One thing I did get thinking about though, is that even if the pulses aren't alternating that still shouldn't render it useless by any means. The point is (and I think it was you that mentioned it) is that the actual turbine size internally is closer to a .63. The difference is though, is that unlike a single port opening .63, the gases never have to expand past the size of the halved section of the volute they're entering. Nor, do they ever expand past the halved section of the manifold that they're passing though. Seems to me that ups the gas velocity significantly. And I think we all know what that does for spool up. It seems odd to me that no-one has ever thought of this or brought it up before.
Honestly, even if it get's cut down to a .63 ish A/R size I would think the higher gas velocities would improve the spool to something close to a .48. (Which still hits full boost pretty late on mine (around 4800-5000 RPM depending on the ambient temps). That's why I'm reluctant to go to a single port .63 at my elevation. Hitting full boost at 5300-5500 RPM is kinda lame IMO (Sorry dan )
Yeah I know that, but then he never said anything about it again. So how do we know if it worked or not? Maybe he took it off for other reasons like space constraints?
One thing I did get thinking about though, is that even if the pulses aren't alternating that still shouldn't render it useless by any means. The point is (and I think it was you that mentioned it) is that the actual turbine size internally is closer to a .63. The difference is though, is that unlike a single port opening .63, the gases never have to expand past the size of the halved section of the volute they're entering. Nor, do they ever expand past the halved section of the manifold that they're passing though. Seems to me that ups the gas velocity significantly. And I think we all know what that does for spool up. It seems odd to me that no-one has ever thought of this or brought it up before.
Honestly, even if it get's cut down to a .63 ish A/R size I would think the higher gas velocities would improve the spool to something close to a .48. (Which still hits full boost pretty late on mine (around 4800-5000 RPM depending on the ambient temps). That's why I'm reluctant to go to a single port .63 at my elevation. Hitting full boost at 5300-5500 RPM is kinda lame IMO (Sorry dan )
Well you could just get a .36 a/r T3 exhaust housing. lol
Better option would be to get a smaller turbo that spools up quicker while running the larger a/r.
Well you could just get a .36 a/r T3 exhaust housing. lol
Better option would be to get a smaller turbo that spools up quicker while running the larger a/r.
Believe it or not, there's a tuning shop owner in town who runs a .36 on a 3076. I asked him if he had any EGT, surge or choke problems, to which he said no. I then asked him if I could buy some of the drugs he was on, which is why I'm in the clouds Dan
But back on point, can anyone see any issues with my logic regarding faster spool due to the gas velocities in the smaller space? If anyone has a well reasoned counterpoint, please let me know. I'd hate to go down the wrong path with this. But the more I think about it, the more it makes sense.
PS: OP, sorry about the thread jack, your project looks like it's going to be a sick ride. I just figured if a guy can make this divided housing thing work, it may work to your advantage as well, seeing as you're running a 60 trim.
Believe it or not, there's a tuning shop owner in town who runs a .36 on a 3076. I asked him if he had any EGT, surge or choke problems, to which he said no. I then asked him if I could buy some of the drugs he was on, which is why I'm in the clouds Dan
But back on point, can anyone see any issues with my logic regarding faster spool due to the gas velocities in the smaller space? If anyone has a well reasoned counterpoint, please let me know. I'd hate to go down the wrong path with this. But the more I think about it, the more it makes sense.
PS: OP, sorry about the thread jack, your project looks like it's going to be a sick ride. I just figured if a guy can make this divided housing thing work, it may work to your advantage as well, seeing as you're running a 60 trim.
Well if he isn't maxing out the turbo then he shouldn't have a EGT or choke problem and being that high in elevation it isn't like the turbo is going to move enough air in the lower rpm's to have a surge issue.
Maybe you should ask him to take you for a ride in that car that has the .36 a/r.
I always wondered about people who run the T3 TS exhaust housing on a regular T3 flanged manifold. Would the little divider flange on the TS housing cause turbulance? But I have seen people run this with no issue, so it had me rather confused. Or is the divider just too small to even be considered to hinder from performance?
And OP, very nice list of parts. But it isn't a stroker (listed in your sig) if using AEB pistons.
Nope, no stroker yet. Not in my budget for this build. It is still coming, but probably not until next year.
Well if he isn't maxing out the turbo then he shouldn't have a EGT or choke problem and being that high in elevation it isn't like the turbo is going to move enough air in the lower rpm's to have a surge issue.
Maybe you should ask him to take you for a ride in that car that has the .36 a/r.
I'm sure it spools lightening quick, but let's face it, if you've got a 3076 and own a shop to replace it if it blows, I can pretty much guarantee that he's pushing it hard.
As for not maxing those housings, I can promise you it's choking. Christ, I'm sure I'm maxing out at 25 PSI on the .48. I mean don't get me wrong, it goes like a bat out of hell, but if I can get a divided housing essentially for free, I've got it set up so that I can remove the manifold partition pretty easily if I ever wanted to go back to a single opening housing.
That said, just to stir the pot a bit, what do you 'yall think a Ball Bearing 60-1 would be like? If it drops spool like Garrett says it does, I could probably go to the .63 without much of a difference. Or keep the .48 and drop the spool time.
Funny thing is, I've looked on forums of all kinds and haven't found much on BB T3/T4, never mind a comparison. I understand that the T3/T4 combo is usually a value thing, but replacing a CHRA and not having to change a damn thing will save you $200-300 bucks too.
EDIT: It may be because ATP wants $1110 for just the CHRA. For christ sakes Garrett, get with it, BB technology is not anything new any more. Drop the pricing to something like $700-800 and maybe you'll actually sell a few instead of having to justify your pricing with 'new and improved GTX wheels' (end rant)
Last edited by ZimbutheMonkey; 01-01-2012 at 09:08 PM.
UPDATE: Got the motor stripped down to the bare block today. Main/Rod bearings look GREAT for having 190k on them. Tomorrow I'm gonna try to pull the AEB motor and get the pistons/head from it. Here's some pictures:
Previous set up
Front end off
motor out:
My TOB was on its way out, and my pilot bearing is completely trashed.
motor on hoist with ACT 6 puck and turbo still on
turbo off. notice the .78 AR divided housing. it will be put to good use next year with a custom TS manifold.
This worries me though, I noticed a small crack in my SPA manifold.
What do you guys think i should do? It doesn't look like it leaks much but IDK.
Various stages on the engine stand:
please excuse the messy garage, lol.
I'll get some more pics tomorrow of the bearings and whatnot.
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![Dan[FN]6262's Avatar](customavatars/avatar32962_26.gif "Dan[FN]6262's Avatar"){kind=avatar}
Originally Posted by Dan[FN]6262
I have buddy that owes me about $700 for my old 058 AEB long block so I'm thinking divided housing with supertech or Rosten springs and Ti retainers. With a housing that size and the ability to rev out to 8000+ RPM's, it's going to be a nasty little beast. 
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