2.8 GT 2868 Full Build!

[2380S4]

The Car:
2001 Silver S4 currently has 138K on it.
Currently running GIAC 93 tune, AWE S-FLO intake, Draintake mod, AWE twin 2 exhaust, Vogtland CO's, Sterns ADJ control arms, AWE DTS and all maintaince 150% uptdate.
Time line is to have this up and tuned by June/July 2012.
All final assembly and installtion will be completed by Athans Motors.


Vendors used for parts:
Audis4parts:
For lots of the little parts on the engine build. Bryan's the man.
034motorsports:
Head gaskets, intake gaskets, head bolts, aux water pump delete, bi-pipes red crinckle, billet fuel rail drop in kit here shortly.



The Build:
Engine:
2.7 block bored out to 2.8
2.8L crank
JE pistons
Crower Rods
All new bearing
2.8 Heads fully re-built
Full Super tech valve train, Iconel exhaust valves
new lifters, guides etc.
3 degree valve job
2.8 Cams
Compression dropping HG's should put me at 9.1-1 compression
Heads were completed by VE Motorsports
Bottom end was completed by SDP Motorsports




Turbo setup:
GT2868(GT28RS Hybrids with HTA 68mm
compressor wheels/billet aluminum) turbos
with stainless steel v-banded Tial 0.64 turbine
housings
ARD Schedule 10 stainless Tubular exhaust
manifolds with merge collectors and v-banded
tial discharges to turbine inlets
3" downpipes with test-pipe tail sections/all
v-bandeds(2 ea)
Turbosmart Comp 40 wastegates, 17psi(2)
Wastegate dump tubes(2)
Wastegate hardware(fittings, plugs, clamps)
9' of 3/16" silicone wastegate hosing
3/16" brass tees(2)
2' of 1/2" firesleeving
turbocharger inlet piping(aluminum/4-pieces)
2" silicone couplers(3" long each) qty. 2
40-60 clamps(4)
50-70 clamps(4)
1/8" NPT-3/16" barbed fittings(2)
2.5"'x2.25" silicone reducing couplers(2)
2" silicone coupler/4" long(1)
coolant feed lines to turbos(2)
oil feed lines to turbos(2)
12mmx-4AN oil feed fittings(2)
T25 turbo oil feed restrictors/-4AN inlet(2)
T25 oil return line gaskets(2)
M8x1.25x16mm oil line flange bolts(4)
12mm oil line crush washers(4)
14mm coolant line crush washers(8)
v-band clamps from turbos to manifolds(2)
v-band clamps from turbos to downpipes(2)
v-band clamps from downpipes to tails(2)
o2 sensor bung plug(1)
exhaust manifold gaskets to heads(2)
exhaust manifold nuts to heads(18)
1/4"x11' zip ties(qty. 10)
powdercoating on turbo compressors; ceramic
coating on: headers, downpipes, discharge
tubes, turbine housings, compressor inlet
piping




SMIC's:
Wagner




Clutch:
Leaning towards Tilton twin disc




Mounts:
Sterns tranns
Sterns Engine
Apikol dif mount




Fuel pump setup:
Will most likely be a new custom setup.




Fueling/tuning:
EPL or something else??




Meth:
Aquamist.




Most if not all engine censors will be replaced as well.

I will update as we make progress.

Here are just a few pics to get things started.

[Crispy222]

Cool build! Should spool nice with the billet wheels. Why not go with Tial 770 kit? I think that is 2871's. EPL tune? EPL fueling? Since you're doing pistons, rods and crank, why not go 3.0L? GL and keep the updates coming.

[CC Lemon]

Looks like a pretty thorough build... should be pretty nice once it's all finished.

Is the completion date a conservative goal? Depending on how many parts you already have or have already ordered, I can't imagine it would take that long to be up and running, and even tuned.

[sherbet]

Very cool. Im super interested to see what the HTA setup on a 2.8L does.

[2380S4]

Cool build! Should spool nice with the billet wheels. Why not go with Tial 770 kit? I think that is 2871's. EPL tune? EPL fueling? Since you're doing pistons, rods and crank, why not go 3.0L? GL and keep the updates coming.

I was debating between Tial 770's and a GT setup, but the full GT setup kinda popped up and I couldn't turn down the deal I got. Since the 770's are 5K just for turbos and inlets it just made more sense budget wise to go this direction. Fuelingtuning wise I am between EPL & VAST(nobody shoot me for that). On the 3L aspect I actually had a 3L crank ready to go and started doing some research. I felt the 2.8 would just fit a little better and without the oil consumption, stroke length & piston issues of a 3L setup.

I will keep updating as we assemble it. Should start this coming week or the week after.

Looks like a pretty thorough build... should be pretty nice once it's all finished.

Is the completion date a conservative goal? Depending on how many parts you already have or have already ordered, I can't imagine it would take that long to be up and running, and even tuned.

The finish date is a conservative. The engine it self shoule be completed in the next 4 weeks or so. Turbo setup will be here most likely end of December with the Holidays and such. The remaining items I'm just going to pick up as I can find good deals. The semi custom fuel pump system, fuel lines, fuel rails and custom catch can are being developed by a fellow AZ'er so as that nears completetion that will be going in as well, which can take some time. Also I work in retail so I am going into my crazy time of year so I won't have a ton of time until after January to really work on things, yes I have a shop doing the work but I am there when any of the major parts are put on/installed and do a little wrenching myself. I would love to have it completed by the beginning of April, but everything I am doing on this build I'm taking my time and double checking and researching as much as possible.

Very cool. Im super interested to see what the HTA setup on a 2.8L does.

You and me both very interested to see.

I am hoping to come out somewhere 550-600AWHP once it's tuned and ready to go.

Thanks for the imput and enthusiasim around this. I am hoping to use this build thread as a sounding board but also give reviews on the products that I use from various vendors and such.

[diabolical1]

sounds promising. i'll be keeping an eye on this.

[Evilevo]

Why are you using compression dropping headgaskets if you are doing JE pistons? You should drop the compression properly with the pistons and not with larger HGs.

I would also drive the car to EPL for the tune. VAST has proven that they can NOT tune high powered S4s. They are fine for K04s and such, but not for larger stuff. Do it once and do it right. I wasted a lot of time and money trying to get VAST to get everything out of my car and then I switched to EPL.

You should be able to hit 600whp pretty easy on 93/meth at around 29psi or so. That is what my car did on a 2.8L 2871R.

Also if that 550-600whp is your power goal. Skip everything fancy and just hit up AMD about their inline dual FP kit. Run 1 044 in the tank and 1 044 in line. Stock lines and everything else. Same setup I have. Simple, reliable and cheap.

As far as SMICs, either ER or AMD. I switched from the JHM FMIC to the ERs and love it.

[sherbet]

^ To be honest, regarding the fueling and tuning, I would go EPL if I were between the two. I have NOT dealt with either, but based simply on what I have heard/seen, EPL is really a no brainer on a build of this stature. As of late, there have just been too many horror stories around VAST for me to really consider them, but to each his own. I like this build because when I go with some larger turbos, Im thinking about doing an HTA 2868 setup...good luck with everything man should be an awesome product whichever path you choose.

[2380S4]

Thanks for input and advice. I've been on vacation all week so not much has been completed. I have a few odds and ends coming this week to get the motor together and wrapped up. Then once the turbos are good to go they be shipped and on the engine they go.

[shorterthanrich]

I'd love to see some updates.

What are you hoping your powerband will look like? I see a lot of conflicting information on how the HTA2868 will perform on a 2.7 or 2.8 motor...

I'm considering these as well.

[foxhound720]

Keeping my eye on this. Good luck. Make the right decisions the first time.

[2380S4]

Here's a quick update. Working retail this time of year dosen't leave much time for the build.

We've gotten upper oil pan on with new oil pump assembly installed, new rms is on.
Heads had to be tweaked just a bit so they will be going on this week (figures crossed). Also order some needed odds and ends from Bryan at Audis4parts that should be here tomorrow. Then we should be working on those items this week as well.

Turbos kit should be here in 3 weeks or so, once here that'll be put on the engine.

Looking into fueling/tune options over the next couple weeks. Leaning towards EPL since there is shop here that has a dyno and has worked with EPL before. Also that lovely new replica CF RS4 y-pipe from 034 has me thinking about upgrading.

SMIC I've decided to go Wagner's, but that be one of the last purchases.

I will post pictures of the progress later

As for the powerband I'm hopping for smooth and even once in full boost. I know everyone's dream. We will see I guess.

[wdbdy2000s4]

I'd love to see some updates.

What are you hoping your powerband will look like? I see a lot of conflicting information on how the HTA2868 will perform on a 2.7 or 2.8 motor...

I'm considering these as well.

Ask Z-tuned how his 2868 kit is running.

[Evilevo]

Ask Z-tuned how his 2868 kit is running.

Pretty sure it isn't running.

[wdbdy2000s4]

Pretty sure it isn't running.

That's the joke. See what I did there?

[Evilevo]

That's the joke. See what I did there?

You could have just said VAST had the car. Same effect.

[davenew]

EPL did a great job with my car and their GT maf is very accurate at high flows. You might want to consider the AMD inline 044 pump kit that goes in place of the stock fuel filter. It made it very straightforward as far as installing a 044 in the tank and adding the inline pump with relays. The 044's are known/reliable and two in series actually surprised me and flowed enough to support running E85. No way I'd do all that work and not throw in aquamist.:)

[2380S4]

EPL did a great job with my car and their GT maf is very accurate at high flows. You might want to consider the AMD inline 044 pump kit that goes in place of the stock fuel filter. It made it very straightforward as far as installing a 044 in the tank and adding the inline pump with relays. The 044's are known/reliable and two in series actually surprised me and flowed enough to support running E85. No way I'd do all that work and not throw in aquamist.:)

thanks for input on the fuel pump setup! I'm going to be reaching out to EPL next week one this madness of the weekend is over. They have the best track record up to date.

As for meth my builder said the same thing! That's one more thing to add to the list of to buy items.

no current progress made on the build this week. should have the engine together end of next week and have a tb kit on its way as well. once that together I'll update with some pics.

Everyone have a great and safe turkey day!

[Sales@EPL]

Sounds like a great build so far! We look forward to hearing from you next week, enjoy the holiday

[judeisnotobscur]

I like the turbo choice, looking forward to seeing some logs/track results/ videos of car running hard.

[davenew]

I like the turbo choice, looking forward to seeing some logs/track results/ videos of car running hard.

Agreed. The engine build is *very* similar to what I did. I believe the turbos are bigger than mine. The exhaust is likely better than my awe twin 2. If the turbosmart wastegates are good and depending on the other details (like ICs and WI) I think he's on track to beat my numbers.:)

[julex]

Everything looks awesome but these JE pistons... Is that old gear's block with 10.5 (or was it 10.0?) compression pistons installed? Hence why you have to use compression lowering gaskets now?

[2380S4]

the block is from guru's engine builder. it was a fresh rebuild all together when purchased. so yes that is why I'm running co dropping gaskets.

[Jurjen]

Curious to see how this turns out. Been thinking about swapping out my gt25's for 2868 hta's down the road.

Hows the car coming along?

[01xSilverS4]

Definitely following every step of this build. GLWB!!

[2380S4]

Not much progress over the past couple weeks. Running a retail store takes most of my time up during this time of year. I also like to be at the shop when 75% of the work is being done on the build, like to be hands on, that slow things down as well.

I'm hoping to have the heads on and most of the accessories on by the end of next week. The turbo setup should be on its way 2nd or 3rd week of December.

I've been looking into clutch setups. Liking the spec clutches so far, so that maybe my choice.

[Crispy222]

ClutchMaster 850. The only thing that could hold the Tial 770 car on a launch. And this should put out more power sooner than that.

[Cadiburns]

Where is the work being done? At a friend's shop? Sounds like it's going to be a beast when finished.

[2380S4]

The build assembly and install in the car are being done at Athans motors. Billy's done almost all my work on my car for me over the last 5-6 years.

I don't regularly launch the car on the current setup, maybe a total of about 30 times since owning it. I'm sure that will change! But I'm focused on getting the best all around clutch.

[BUSAfREAkA4]

Not much progress over the past couple weeks. Running a retail store takes most of my time up during this time of year. I also like to be at the shop when 75% of the work is being done on the build, like to be hands on, that slow things down as well.

I'm hoping to have the heads on and most of the accessories on by the end of next week. The turbo setup should be on its way 2nd or 3rd week of December.

I've been looking into clutch setups. Liking the spec clutches so far, so that maybe my choice.

Im a b6 guy, but stealing an engine from you guys...lol. Hence why I'm creeping the build. First, this looks sweet. Second, spec clutchs are GARBAGE. They cant hold power and make the most aggravating sounds under load. Throw that out the window. I'm running a spec now and cannot wait to get the 850ss CM clutch. Just my honest opinion and first hand experience. It could be different in the b5 world but I dont think things changed too much in the trans department. I know I have an 02X and I am assuming you guys have the 01E...please correct me if I am wrong. Be gentile...I'm still learning/researching. Lol

Sweet build tho.

[cjk]

Is this Ken? If so...good luck on the build man!

[2380S4]

Yes it is! Thanks!

[davenew]

Im a b6 guy, but stealing an engine from you guys...lol. Hence why I'm creeping the build. First, this looks sweet. Second, spec clutchs are GARBAGE. They cant hold power and make the most aggravating sounds under load. Throw that out the window. I'm running a spec now and cannot wait to get the 850ss CM clutch. Just my honest opinion and first hand experience. It could be different in the b5 world but I dont think things changed too much in the trans department. I know I have an 02X and I am assuming you guys have the 01E...please correct me if I am wrong. Be gentile...I'm still learning/researching. Lol

Sweet build tho.

The CM850 holds great but there are drawbacks. It sounds like rolling a can of pennies with the clutch in at idle. It's also not as care free when trying to drive easy. I have the all metal friction discs with no springs. I like it and the issues don't bother me much but there are differences.

[jibberjive]

Nice Ken! Looking forward to following it. And I've got that solenoid, it'll go out possibly tomorrow.

[2380S4]

Nice Ken! Looking forward to following it. And I've got that solenoid, it'll go out possibly tomorrow.

Thanks I appericate that!

[BUSAfREAkA4]

It sounds like rolling a can of pennies with the clutch in at idle. It's also not as care free when trying to drive easy.

I like it and the issues don't bother me much but there are differences.

great...i love that sound....

I hear nothing but good things about it. Plus i dont think he's going to daily this car,(correct me if my assumption is wrong) so my theory that I have had beaten into me from here and by my father is do it right or do it twice. Hence why I suggested something that I am/will be using shortly. I cannot want to have b5s4 power with b6 looks...no offence to you guys, I am just partial to the b6

[2380S4]

The car will be a summer only car and will be driven pretty regularly during that time.

depends on what new dd car I purchase.

For the clutch I've been looking at a tilton setups, looking to have decent street driving and be able to beat on it when provoked to do so!

[Max@034]

Very excited to see this thing come together! Going to be a great all around setup when its tuned and finished.

-Max

[Evilevo]

The car will be a summer only car and will be driven pretty regularly during that time.

depends on what new dd car I purchase.

For the clutch I've been looking at a tilton setups, looking to have decent street driving and be able to beat on it when provoked to do so!

I had a Tilton setup. It only lasted 10k miles before it failed. Tilton said it was installed wrong, but Vast wouldn't take responsibility so who knows.

If you are going twin disc, I would just get a CM FX850. If you want a single disc, hit up Scotty about a Southbend stage 4 extreme, that is what I have now. Holds 600whp and I have about 25k on it so far.

[2380S4]

Went to the shop today!!! Here's a few pics of the updated work. Have to order more odds & ends from Bryan at Audis4parts......
Heads are on. New TB kit on, valley pan on. Few more things to wrap up before the turbo's get here!!! We'll see how much time I get to work on this over the next 4 weeks.
Enjoy the pics... Not as pretty as Jibberjive's but getting there.






Evilevo
I haven't seen anything bad about Tilton's. I'll keep looking into it some more.