FRONT MOUNT INTERCOOLER (FMIC) Upgrade

[martin0079]

Also I have read that article not much there other than good for minor upgrades but hey when I get the intercooler I am only in CT and ur in jersey and my sister goes to school at rutgers we can meet up and compare.

[kristokes]

It wouldn't be hard to find a B7 owner here in Socal to be the test car, it isn't like I am not well known in the Audi community.

Yes, I'm well aware of who you are and your previous Audizine username (mike-2ptzero), in which that account has been Terminated for numerous violations including Spamming and Trolling. So yes, you are very well-known..

Do you go running around saying you are the world champ if you did not compete against anyone?

True, but answer me this.. do you go running around saying you're the Heavy Weight Champion when you currently hold the Cruiser Weight Championship belt? That's basically what Evolution Racewerks did on their website. Mind you that this claim was made without any proof or data except from past experiences with a different car.

An excerpt from Evolution Racewerks website:

The long awaited B7 intercooler applications are here! We introduce our new 2006+ Audi A4 (B7) Competition FMIC! With every single intercooler application we have introduced, every single one has been hailed as the undisputed best intercooler available. From our Competition Series FMIC for the B5 and B6 A4's, to our Dual SMIC Upgrades for the B5 S4, this application will be no different. This same proven formula is now being brought to your 2006+ Audi A4.

Do we even want to know that that suggests. Answer this, did you pay for the AWE FMIC like any normal customer off the street would? If not then every single word you say about this product is paid for, which is odd seeing that you are a Moderator.

Here's a photo of my invoice from KMD tuning (not directly purchased from AWE tuning):



If you're wondering about the final price of $1076, it was during the Holiday Season sale at KMD tuning and/or AWE tuning's new website launch (it's one of the two). You can call KMD tuning directly and inquiry to the exact reason. You may use the invoice number and date as a reference.

[kristokes]

Also I have read that article not much there other than good for minor upgrades but hey when I get the intercooler I am only in CT and ur in jersey and my sister goes to school at rutgers we can meet up and compare.

I would like to meet with you to compare data logs!! Would you mind paying for your own dyno pulls? If so, PM me your information and contact me when you install your Evolution Racewerks FMIC. I live in North Jersey so I'm a lot closer to CT than Rutgers.

[martin0079]

I would like to meet with you to compare data logs!! Would you mind paying for your own dyno pulls? If so, PM me your information and contact me when you install your Evolution Racewerks FMIC. I live in North Jersey so I'm a lot closer to CT than Rutgers.

Sounds good and I wouldnt ask for you to pay for my pulls on the dyno wouldnt be right for me to even ask

[mr shickadance]

Can I get in on this? I was planning on getting a dyno done in the next month or so at efi since they're in my backyard it would be cool to meet up with you guys

[kristokes]

Sounds good and I wouldnt ask for you to pay for my pulls on the dyno wouldnt be right for me to even ask

Sounds good to me

Btw when do you plan on ordering your ER FMIC?

[kristokes]

Can I get in on this? I was planning on getting a dyno done in the next month or so at efi since they're in my backyard it would be cool to meet up with you guys

I still want to compare your eBay FMIC to the factory DSMIC with upgraded intercooler piping. But sure, the more the merrier: AWE FMIC vs ER FMIC vs eBay FMIC

[mr shickadance]

Two people in ct.... Efi is a huuuuuge highly well known scooby tuner in bethel ct ..... There is a great breakfast lunch place there to bethel is adjacent to Danbury which is right off 684 if you want I can call them up and we can make this happen

Edit -so that's my vote for efi as a testing place 100 for 3 runs

[Operator]

I still want to compare your eBay FMIC to the factory DSMIC with upgraded intercooler piping. But sure, the more the merrier: AWE FMIC vs ER FMIC vs eBay FMIC

Just to clarify, he has the CX Racing FMIC, as you keep mentioning ebay FMIC, there have been 3-4 FMIC's on ebay that have been posted all with different dimensions so I'm not sure if it's legit to lump them all together.

[kristokes]

Just to clarify, he has the CX Racing FMIC, as you keep mentioning ebay FMIC, there have been 3-4 FMIC's on ebay that have been posted all with different dimensions so I'm not sure if it's legit to lump them all together.

AWE Tuning's FMIC vs Evolution Racewerks' FMIC vs CX Racing FMIC

^ Is that better?

[Operator]

AWE Tuning's FMIC vs Evolution Racewerks' FMIC vs CX Racing FMIC

^ Is that better?

Whoa...... I was just attempting to make sure they people knew exactly what was going to be compared...... Even in your OP you listed the CX separate from the "ebay FMIC" (#4, #5) but have recently started lumping them together. Wasn't trying to instigate anything!?!

[kristokes]

Whoa...... I was just attempting to make sure they people knew exactly what was going to be compared...... Even in your OP you listed the CX separate from the "ebay FMIC" (#4, #5) but have recently started lumping them together. Wasn't trying to instigate anything!?!

It was the emoicon huh? Maybe I shouldn't have used that one, lol but no pun intended..

[Operator]

It was the emoicon huh? Maybe I shouldn't have used that one, lol but no pun intended..

Kool. And give me a few weeks, and I may join the fray to make things even more diverse. Though I'm NOT coming up to the north east for the testing .

[kristokes]

Kool. And give me a few weeks, and I may join the fray to make things even more diverse. Though I'm NOT coming up to the north east for the testing .

Uh oh, elaborate please..

[Operator]

I'm still debating what FMIC I'm going to go with, so i can't be too indepth. But I "plan" to also be adding w/m about the same time so hopefully whatever FMIC I go with I should be able to provide a decent amount of data.

[mr shickadance]

i seriously can not believe you wont take the short 30 minute drive to the northeast to dyno with us ....(i assume you fly jets via your avatar) duct tape your ride to your jet and meet us there....no excuses

[jimrobbington]

This thread is turning out very well, IMO. Because of this thread, actual proven information is finally going to be released that will be helpful to the entire B7 community.

Operator, there is another Denver guy with a B7, and he has the ERSMICs. It would be awesome, if at the same time you did your test he would come and compare these. His name on here is ViperDSA I think, and his name is Kyle. I will definately wait for all this data before making my choice.

[viperdsa]

Yup I do indeed have the ER SMICS. I actually met Operator a few weekends ago at a GTG up here in foco. If you want to see my temp logs they are the ones on Evolution Racewerks website since I helped beta test them.

[Operator]

Yup I do indeed have the ER SMICS. I actually met Operator a few weekends ago at a GTG up here in foco. If you want to see my temp logs they are the ones on Evolution Racewerks website since I helped beta test them.

What tune were you using at the time, as it says "stock Turbo" but I figure you weren't on a stock map. How much were you charged to get the temp logs?

[viperdsa]

I was Revo stage 2 at the time if I remember right. I actually just had a friend with a vag-com do the temp logs.

[M-Hood]

Yes, I'm well aware of who you are and your previous Audizine username (mike-2ptzero), in which that account has been Terminated for numerous violations including Spamming and Trolling. So yes, you are very well-known..

LOL, yes the famous ban for "offering" a AZ member a set of used 415cc injectors I bought from 034 with my own money and that they wouldn't take back because they had been placed in the fuel rail and allowed to touch fuel eve though the motor was never fired up. Wow I didn't know selling used injectors I had paid for was breaking the rules. Do you ban everyone else that sells their used parts they paid with their own hard earned cash? Yeah I dont think so.

I know who you are too. This isn't exactly the first time you have started a thread as the AWE poster child. I got to read it on a few other threads started by AZ members that were trying to get a GB started for the ER Dual SMIC kit, well thats before you had both threads deleted. lol

True, but answer me this.. do you go running around saying you're the Heavy Weight Champion when you currently hold the Cruiser Weight Championship belt? That's basically what Evolution Racewerks did on their website. Mind you that this claim was made without any proof or data except from past experiences with a different car.

An excerpt from Evolution Racewerks website:

The long awaited B7 intercooler applications are here! We introduce our new 2006+ Audi A4 (B7) Competition FMIC! With every single intercooler application we have introduced, every single one has been hailed as the undisputed best intercooler available. From our Competition Series FMIC for the B5 and B6 A4's, to our Dual SMIC Upgrades for the B5 S4, this application will be no different. This same proven formula is now being brought to your 2006+ Audi A4.

You do understand that they are talking about all of their B5/B6 kits for the A4/S4 which have in fact been proven many times over by plenty of paying customers that their products were the best on the market for those cars.

Now all it takes is plenty of paying customers to compare both kits and see who comes out on top or setting up a nice dyno/pulls B7 Aftermarket FMIC shoot out.

[Alex/AWE]

This is really starting to drive me up a wall. Would someone provide some real data, you cant trust the company making the intercooler to provide true data. I am thinking I will wind up with the ER comp FMIC because they actually provide the core volume and I cannot seem to find anything on the awe as to the volume and from the comparison pic on awe's website I can only see maybe another 120cubic inches for a total of 500ci over the SDSMIC(380Ci) which puts it down 160 cubic inches from the er intercooler (660Ci) just guessing based on pics. So I am going to get the ER more cooling area better temp drop. If any one want to give me exact demensions of the awe I would be interested to see how close I am. For now I would say the ER intercooler beats the awe all day.

We don't publish our core dimensions because they aren't something we are usually asked for. Our core is 18" x 17" x 2.25" which equates to 689 cubic inches.

That being said, it's not just about volume but frontal area and core thickness.

An intercooler becomes less effective as you move away from the front face, so it is best to minimize thickness and increase frontal area as much as possible. Our B7 A4 FMIC does this.

Also, unlike other intercoolers on the market we are using a custom made core. We don't use a generic "hp rated" core found in many different intercooler core catalogs. We specified the width, height, depth, fin count and charge row dimensions of this core design based on power characteristics of the 2.0T engine. We also spent hundreds of hours optimizing the end tank design through CFD data, dyno data, road data and track data collection.

For those comparing our B6 A4 1.8T FMIC and our B7 A4 2.0T FMICs, they are two completely different kits.

[kristokes]

Now all it takes is plenty of paying customers to compare both kits and see who comes out on top or setting up a nice dyno/pulls B7 Aftermarket FMIC shoot out.

Since you've generously volunteered to set up a B7A4 FMIC comparison shoot-out between AWE tuning and Evolution Racewerks, we all look forward to seeing your generosity bear fruit in the upcoming weeks.

Please keep us posted!

[mr shickadance]

with all this fmic talk i should mention im selling my godspeed kit for super cheap! check it out in the classifieds or my link in my signature!

[swoardrider]

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't the crash bar need some space behind it, so that if it hits something it can crumple correctly, absorb impact energy correctly, and deploy the airbags correctly? If this is true, then I'd think that putting any FMIC behind it, whether requiring the bar be modified or not, would not be good in an impact situation.

Also, roughly how much does an FMIC weigh?

^^Just bumping my question above^^

[mr shickadance]

my godspeed kit altogether in a carboard box ready to ship weighs about 20-22 lbs

bc most kits use aluminum piping and aluminum cores, they are very light

[M-Hood]

^^Just bumping my question above^^

It wouls till be pushed back in an impact, it isn't like the FMIC is attached to the car frame itself and most FMIC's will have brackets attached which would pretty much snap when the FMIC is pushed back into the radiator.

[Operator]

(If you're one of the few who upgraded to a FMIC just for the look, please disregard this as this does not pertain to you)

FMIC: (available for the B7A4 2.0T)

1. ATP
2. AWE
3. Custom FMIC attempt
4. CX Racing
5. eBay brand
6. Evolution Racewerks
7. GReddy
8. VF Engineering Air/Water charge-cooler

#5 is just the Godspeed FMIC. The picture is wrong as are the dimensions listed. Lesson learned............

[viperdsa]

kristokes you forgot racetec. http://www.racetec-us.com/b7a4.html

[kristokes]

#5 is just the Godspeed FMIC. The picture is wrong as are the dimensions listed. Lesson learned............

I'm sorry to hear that. What did you end up doing with your Godspeed FMIC?

kristokes you forgot racetec. http://www.racetec-us.com/b7a4.html

Thanks, I added it.

[Operator]

I'm sorry to hear that. What did you end up doing with your Godspeed FMIC?

I'll decide after my w/m install. Should be in a week or two.

[kristokes]

I'll decide after my w/m install. Should be in a week or two.

Sweet, a W/M kit.. Btw what went wrong with your Godspeed FMIC?

[jayphil82]

A dyno session to show comparison of different car with different IC is not a really good test. Real life (highway) VAG COM intake temp logging would be a better comparison because it considers real air flow and not dyno blowers. Also HP / torque between two A4 with same mods can be sinificantly different.

I am part of the VAG COM group by going on right now and I will be able to do a before and after my intercooler upgrade (IAT logging).

I will keep you posted but should be not really before May when the temp raise a little.

[Operator]

Sweet, a W/M kit.. Btw what went wrong with your Godspeed FMIC?

Nothing per say with the Godspeed FMIC, I just had a sour taste in my mouth from the seller, after they sold me a different IC than they advertised. The auction stated: Core Size : 23.5"x11.5" x 3.5" with 2.75 Inch Inlet/Outlet, End To End Length:32.5 but the FMIC I received was core length: 24"x7.5"x 3" with 2.25 inch Inlet/Outlet end to end length: 30" (Godspeed deminsions). No where does it say it's a Godspeed FMIC in the ad. This was all after numerous emails and messages to the seller before hand. Like I said lesson learned. I've made hundreds of purchases off eBay before, and 98-99% of the time I'm happy with the transaction. That time, not so much.

[kristokes]

A dyno session to show comparison of different car with different IC is not a really good test. Real life (highway) VAG COM intake temp logging would be a better comparison because it considers real air flow and not dyno blowers. Also HP / torque between two A4 with same mods can be sinificantly different.

I am part of the VAG COM group by going on right now and I will be able to do a before and after my intercooler upgrade (IAT logging).

I will keep you posted but should be not really before May when the temp raise a little.

You're advertising that VAG-COM like it's the holy grail on multiple threads. You're not the only one with access to VAG-COM my friend.

And I would accept any type of comparison, whether on a dyno or highway. I'm still waiting for M-Hood on an update (hopefully he lives up to his word)

[kristokes]

Nothing per say with the Godspeed FMIC, I just had a sour taste in my mouth from the seller, after they sold me a different IC than they advertised. The auction stated: Core Size : 23.5"x11.5" x 3.5" with 2.75 Inch Inlet/Outlet, End To End Length:32.5 but the FMIC I received was core length: 24"x7.5"x 3" with 2.25 inch Inlet/Outlet end to end length: 30" (Godspeed deminsions). No where does it say it's a Godspeed FMIC in the ad. This was all after numerous emails and messages to the seller before hand. Like I said lesson learned. I've made hundreds of purchases off eBay before, and 98-99% of the time I'm happy with the transaction. That time, not so much.

Sorry to hear that. Hopefully you don't have an S-Line front bumper or you might lose your foglights like mr shickadance. But keep us updated on the W/M project.

[M-Hood]

You're advertising that VAG-COM like it's the holy grail on multiple threads. You're not the only one with access to VAG-COM my friend.

And I would accept any type of comparison, whether on a dyno or highway. I'm still waiting for M-Hood on an update (hopefully he lives up to his word)

I said it would happen if I can find a car that already has the AWE kit on it, getting the kit from ER and setting up dyno time is the easy part.

[jayphil82]

You're advertising that VAG-COM like it's the holy grail on multiple threads. You're not the only one with access to VAG-COM my friend.

And I would accept any type of comparison, whether on a dyno or highway. I'm still waiting for M-Hood on an update (hopefully he lives up to his word)

Sorry for that, I know many people have access to it but I rarely see dataloging posted in here. Also maybe I was too happy with my purchase... I will stay calm to avoid facepalm in the future.

Still I agree that any type of camparision will be better than what we have right now (nothing).

[kristokes]

I said it would happen if I can find a car that already has the AWE kit on it, getting the kit from ER and setting up dyno time is the easy part.

Where are your located? I'll search for a B7A4 with the AWE FMIC kit near you.

[M-Hood]

Near Temecula which is where Purems used to be. IIRC one of their good customers has the AWE FMIC and turbo kit on his B7, the one that was in a few magazine articles.