Project Frontrash GT3071R :)

[A4ringedONE8T]

Well guys, my order is in and now just a wait till the parts get here! Everything ships tomorrow and hopefully won't take too much extra time with the holidays!

While there are a few people who have gone beyond the normal BT's, I believe I will be the first with FWD!! To my knowledge, no one has ever outlined exactly what was needed to step to the next level! Hopefully this will be helpful for those of you that decide to do this as well!

I also wanted to tell you guys I have finally got into the German tuning scene!! [wrench] Got the opportunity to start up a new shop with a partner and things are going strong after just a short time! Look forward to bringing some specials to AZ and helping you guys with anything you should need! www.b-p-design.com is our shop, not alot on the site as of now but it will grow! (Anthony hurry up and reply to one of my many emails about the AZ Advertiser stuff)

What brought me to the 3071R project, we just recently set up our ATP account and couldnt help but take the opportunity to upgrade my car and hopefully bring some attention to our shop using a more affordable solution (and not custom) to the tubular mani's, etc that are popping up all over the place! Everything I plan to run is from ATP, one stop shopping! As we know ATP has had some hickups but I very much believe you can make power with all of their products, Im hopefully going to prove that!

A quick description of my new setup:

GT3071R (.63 a/r, 3.0" Vband Exhaust Housing, 4" Inlet w/ Antisurge and polished compressor housing)

ATP T3 Manifold

ATP 3" VBand Downpipe

Tial 38mm External Wastegate with open dump

I know the people that have gone BAT have jumped right into the motor but I want to take everything in stages to show what can be done and also to iron out tuning along the way!

My first setup will include everything I have coming running off Genesis 430's and the stock 2.75" MAF. I want to get any tweaks required and recorded for those of you who would like to do this in the future and not have to "experiment" with anything!

Second, Im going to upgrade to 550's and a 3" MAF, again get the tuning tweaked and record any changes required via lemmiwinks!

Hopefully this will bring me around April-May when I plan to pull the motor. My exact motor build Im still thinking about, I think running this setup on the stock motor will give me an opportunity to see if I want to keep a 1.8 with the build or if I want to jump up to a 2.0 for a quicker spool!

I also plan to dyno on each of the setups so I have an accurate number for each setup!

I think thats enough rambling for now [:)] Should be a start to a great project!

Frontrash FTW! [wrench]

Shawn

[SinisterA4]

Looking forward to reading this thread as your car progresses. Someone should buy his GTRS kit!

[IronAudi]

Should be very sick WHERE ARE THE PIC'S

[A4ringedONE8T]

Should be very sick WHERE ARE THE PIC'S

I dont have anything to take pictures of yet! [:(]

[mtbrider]

Sounds good Shawn!!

[Papachristou]

you think you will be able to take down an rs4 then?

[A4ringedONE8T]

you think you will be able to take down an rs4 then?

I have no doubt [;)] On stock bottom end Im going to tweak the car out for about 320whp on pump, about 25whp more than I have right now on conservative pump settings

[Ill 3.0]

Nice looking website. Good luck with the shop and project, looking forward to seeing what you can offer once you're an Advertiser.

[dougyfresh]

Awesome. Good to see the website up and running. Looks like you guys got a good bus. plan. [up] [wrench]




convert your car from front-wheel drive to all-wheel drive,

Golf to R32 conversion or is your car going to become Quattro?

[tuned A4]

i picked up a couple of things from shawn. he did good on the pricing and he is easy to do business with. [up] good luck with your shop, i am sure it will do well. now lets just hope our parts get here fast!! [race]

[Papachristou]

I have no doubt [;)] On stock bottom end Im going to tweak the car out for about 320whp on pump, about 25whp more than I have right now on conservative pump settings

i hope so.... i hate snobby people...


u going to get us a good snub mount then? i need one soon!

[A4ringedONE8T]

i picked up a couple of things from shawn. he did good on the pricing and he is easy to do business with. [up] good luck with your shop, i am sure it will do well. now lets just hope our parts get here fast!! [race]

Thank you sir!! You were my first ... AZ customer [:D]

[A4ringedONE8T]

i hope so.... i hate snobby people...


u going to get us a good snub mount then? i need one soon!

Yes I am working on a Snub GB just awaiting word back from Apikol (and Anthony [headbang])

[A4ringedONE8T]

Awesome. Good to see the website up and running. Looks like you guys got a good bus. plan. [up] [wrench]

Golf to R32 conversion or is your car going to become Quattro?

Nope its staying the frontrash it deserves to be! [:D]

[Papachristou]

some said the apikol is the same as APR just blue instead of red?

tell me it isnt so!

[HeymyA4]

Goodluck hope it all works out!

[A4ringedONE8T]

some said the apikol is the same as APR just blue instead of red?

tell me it isnt so!

Not that I know of, the only other choice is Neuspeed which I know has inheirant vibrations. I was hoping the 034 would fit but thats a definite no! [down]

[Don Supreme]

4" inlet and anti-surge huh? 4" seems a little large for a 3071, also are these turbos prone to surging?

Is ATP providing a down pipe?

[A4ringedONE8T]

4" inlet and anti-surge huh? 4" seems a little large for a 3071, also are these turbos prone to surging?

Is ATP providing a down pipe?

My reason for going with the 4" is I might try one of the ATP 3.5" MAF housings down the road. I think the 3.5" MAF and 550's would be as close of a match as possible to 2.75" and 440's ratio. I think it may run better that way rather than a VR6 housing and 550's with lemmi tweaks. Just one of the things I thought about. So because of that I ruled out the 3" inlet. When I ordered everything yesterday, they highly recommended the anti surge housing with the 4" inlet on a smaller 4 cyl. He said it would be fine without it but he would recommend I do it. For a small extra charge figured why not, what could it hurt?

Yes I got a 3" ATP Vband Downpipe

[Don Supreme]

Well goodluck on this project. I wish I had gone 3071 from the get go and skipped the eliminator. The only problem is you have to be committed to building the bottom end to handle it.

The 3071 should be an excellent street turbo on the 1.8t (Where BT / BATS are concerned).

I am concerned on your choice of ATP as your hardware supplier. I especially want to know how that down pipe works out for you.

[winston@podi.ca]

I look forward to seeing your build.

Mine should be completed in the next 48 hours and we can compare notes. [up]

[A4ringedONE8T]

Well goodluck on this project. I wish I had gone 3071 from the get go and skipped the eliminator. The only problem is you have to be committed to building the bottom end to handle it.

The 3071 should be an excellent street turbo on the 1.8t (Where BT / BATS are concerned).

I am concerned on your choice of ATP as your hardware supplier. I especially want to know how that down pipe works out for you.

I am extremely concerned as well but if everything bolts up as Im hoping I think it will be a great alternative (and more affordable) than the many tubular setups that are popping up now. I will tell you it was a complete pain to get all the pieces to have it be "bolt on." My order consisteed of 27 items I believe as every nut, bolt, adaptor, and fitting has to be ordered seperate. If everything fits as Im hoping I am going to setup a "kit" with them so it will be a buy and bolt on like the Elim's. I know most people dont give ATP the time of day but I really do think you can put together a respectable kit with there hardware. Should be installing Jan. 1st so we will see very soon!

[A4ringedONE8T]

Another thing I was thinking about is look at all the Active Turbo'd BMW's, they ALL use a log style manifold similar to the ATP and push upwards of 800-1000whp through them. While their quality might be slight better, I doubt the flow characteristics can be much different

[AudiA4_20T]

Shawn the flow characteristics are much different lol....

but anyway YGPM again hah

[A4ringedONE8T]

I look forward to seeing your build.

Mine should be completed in the next 48 hours and we can compare notes. [up]

You almost made me go to a 3076R but I really think the 3071R is a better match for our engine! Cant wait to see your car finished up and what #'s she puts down! [up]

[QuattroRocket]

Good luck mate. I will watch with interest as my GT28r is sitting on a garage floor till spring so there is still time for me to change my mind :-)

[A4ringedONE8T]

Shawn the flow characteristics are much different lol....

but anyway YGPM again hah

And you've seen flow tests for each or is that just speculation??

[x1rider]

Shawn, do you think you'll sell carputer kits like you have in your car (all ready to install) through your business eventually?

[dirtybrd]

Shawn and Winston both had to wait for the Trendsetter! J/K.

[Silence]

Hmm, kudos on the project, but ATP stuff has been used already with poor results. THe manifold is an EXTREME PITA to get on and off, and additionally, because of the stress the bolts take, being hoizontal, they are prone to get loose often and even break. That is why so many new log manis have popped up on the scene in the VW world.

[A4ringedONE8T]

Just got off the phone with ATP, the more I deal with them the better feelings I get! My stuff was about to ship and someone caught a possible problem. I had ordered the Vband exhaust housing to try and keep things as clean as possible. I guess with the design of the Vband housing it places the turbo out a bit more away from the manifold. They were concerned about the downpipe mating up because of that. They werent sure if it WOULDNT fit but they havent tried it. They recommended that I go with a 5 bolt exhaust flange with a 5 bolt to Vband adaptor plate, which will mate to the Vband downpipe!

And with that, my stuff is shipping today, ahead of schedule!

GO ATP! [wrench]

No worries of bolts loosening, I will have Nordlocks on the four turbo to mani bolts with this one as well!!

[A4ringedONE8T]

Shawn, do you think you'll sell carputer kits like you have in your car (all ready to install) through your business eventually?

Thats something I can very much consider or if you would like one, I would gladly get the pieces and put it together for you and ship it to you without dealings of the business. I really doubt I would get any deals on the stuff just because of the nature of it. If you would like to look into it let me know what you would like. Check out www.mp3car.com and www.mini-box.com

[x1rider]

Thats something I can very much consider or if you would like one, I would gladly get the pieces and put it together for you and ship it to you without dealings of the business. I really doubt I would get any deals on the stuff just because of the nature of it. If you would like to look into it let me know what you would like. Check out www.mp3car.com and www.mini-box.com


Great, thanks a lot, I'll have a look at the websites!

BTW if you're not happy with the lines you get and want to make your own, here is a great website, they have a lot of braided stainless steel hoses and all the fittings you could ever want.
http://www.holley.com/categories.asp?division=Earls

[A4ringedONE8T]

Great, thanks a lot, I'll have a look at the websites!

BTW if you're not happy with the lines you get and want to make your own, here is a great website, they have a lot of braided stainless steel hoses and all the fittings you could ever want.
http://www.holley.com/categories.asp?division=Earls


I took ATP's recommendations on oil/coolant lines, I hope they gave me the correct stuff!

[Silence]

Just got off the phone with ATP, the more I deal with them the better feelings I get! My stuff was about to ship and someone caught a possible problem. I had ordered the Vband exhaust housing to try and keep things as clean as possible. I guess with the design of the Vband housing it places the turbo out a bit more away from the manifold. They were concerned about the downpipe mating up because of that. They werent sure if it WOULDNT fit but they havent tried it. They recommended that I go with a 5 bolt exhaust flange with a 5 bolt to Vband adaptor plate, which will mate to the Vband downpipe!

And with that, my stuff is shipping today, ahead of schedule!

GO ATP! [wrench]

No worries of bolts loosening, I will have Nordlocks on the four turbo to mani bolts with this one as well!!

Tons of people have used the nord-locks on this manifold, to no avail. The problem isnt the bolts, it's the stress they get and vibration of motor, be horizontal as opposed to vertical. If you're fine with fiddling with it iften, you'll be ok, but from what I gather, you're more of a do it once, and do it right person, which then this manifold will bother you. Just a friendly warning. [:)]

[A4ringedONE8T]

Yes I am very much a do it right first person but if I have to fiddle I will fiddle. My motor is coming out in April-May and also by that time our shop will have a welder/fab guy for anything we need. I plan then to switch over to a tubular mani and new DP. If the ATP is that bad Ill just have to deal with it until then

[A4ringedONE8T]

And people acted like it was something space age with the Nordlocks on the Elim mani. I know the experiences with the T25/T3 mani were before that, I cant imagine too many people tried them

[A4TUNE]

sweet good luck on the project and business, i'm sure i'll be following it as well. your setup just keeps getting bigger and better, just don't ever sell those hre's haha. let me know when that apikol GB goes down.

[A4ringedONE8T]

HRE's may possibly already be on the chopping block [eek] We'll see after the turbo [:D]

[400HPA4]

And people acted like it was something space age with the Nordlocks on the Elim mani. I know the experiences with the T25/T3 mani were before that, I cant imagine too many people tried them

Nordlocks work well for the OEM type setup but the T25/T3 flanged ATP manifold does not really have issues with coming loose, what you will see is bolt shear.

The bolts shear off one by one because the physics of the longitudal motor put extreme stress on them.

Fortuntely they are not too hard to replace, wrenching on a BT setup is normal.

[A4ringedONE8T]

Nordlocks work well for the OEM type setup but the T25/T3 flanged ATP manifold does not really have issues with coming loose, what you will see is bolt shear.

The bolts shear off one by one because the physics of the longitudal motor put extreme stress on them.

Fortuntely they are not too hard to replace, wrenching on a BT setup is normal.

Excellent, thanks Greg, Ill be sure I carry spare bolts in the trunk, they can keep the spare coilpacks company [:D]

With your experience, do they all 4 break at once? This applies to the 10mm studs on the T3 mani as well? I know the T25 uses only 8mm

[400HPA4]

No, they break one at a time...

Use the friggin search newbie...

I have been there, done that and have posted up every single solution known to mankind.

Basically this is how it works...

The four holes on the turbo that the bolts pass through are bigger than the bolts, because of this the top two bolts bear all of the weight of the turbo (I can draw a picture if you need)

Since the motor has a tendency to lift in the front, the upper bolt closest to the firewal breaks first.

The second bolt that breaks is the upper bolt closest to the radiator.

The lower bolts will not break, if they do you are an idiot for driving around at 6PSI with a fat ass exhaust leak.

I engineered a workaround that eliminates bolt breakage, hit me up on AIM if you want it.

[A4ringedONE8T]

No, they break one at a time...

Use the friggin search newbie...

I have been there, done that and have posted up every single solution known to mankind.

Basically this is how it works...

The four holes on the turbo that the bolts pass through are bigger than the bolts, because of this the top two bolts bear all of the weight of the turbo (I can draw a picture if you need)

Since the motor has a tendency to lift in the front, the upper bolt closest to the firewal breaks first.

The second bolt that breaks is the upper bolt closest to the radiator.

The lower bolts will not break, if they do you are an idiot for driving around at 6PSI with a fat ass exhaust leak.

I engineered a workaround that eliminates bolt breakage, hit me up on AIM if you want it.

In process [hail]

[dirtybrd]

I re-threaded my mani. to fit the biggest studs I could get to get thru the turbo. I'm sure to replace them after a while, they're not hardened or grade 8, but so far so good. I don't remember the size/thread, but the nut is 17mm. I need to get an 034 turbo support bracket, cheap insurance!

[A4ringedONE8T]

Greg has a great fix, might want to PM him as Im not sure if he wants it spread here [;)]

[dirtybrd]

Pmed

[A4ringedONE8T]

Back at ya!

[A4ringedONE8T]

Chris any chance your available tomorrow or Saturday night? Would like to come see your car!

[dirtybrd]

Chris any chance your available tomorrow or Saturday night? Would like to come see your car!

I'm going to dinner with my dad tomorrow night, call me Sat.

[A4ringedONE8T]

I'm going to dinner with my dad tomorrow night, call me Sat.

Will do [up]

[mtbrider]

Good luck on the project!!

[A4ringedONE8T]

Can somone verify for me, VVT can be put in an AEB head correct?

[dougyfresh]

Greg has a great fix, might want to PM him as Im not sure if he wants it spread here [;)]

I'm Pm'ing you. I would like to see that as well.

[mtbrider]

^^ Me too

[A4ringedONE8T]

Replied [up]

[mtbrider]

thanks, interesting fix

[A4ringedONE8T]

Wooo the first picture for my BAT thread!

4ft long piece of 2" samco hose to get from the compressor outlet to my IC pipe (I only need about a 12" piece, if anyone needs the spare for anything let me know)

I <3 Pics [:D]

http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b156/a4ringedone8t/Misc/DSC01998.jpg

[mtbrider]

and so it begins!!

[A4ringedONE8T]

and so it begins!!

Just called ATP for a tracking number, looks like delivery isnt until Jan 2nd [:(] That puts install off until the next week [=(]

Stupid holidays!!! [headbang]

[SinisterA4]

and so it begins!!

Obviously you mean the pic whoring! [:D]

Just kidding Shawn, the more pics the merrier!

[AudiA4_20T]

Shawn why are you doing an AEB head? Its not needed at all with a 3071R... Youll probably just lose some low end, a good built small port would be perfect

[A4ringedONE8T]

I dont need an AEB head, just found a core in the classifieds for cheap and thought about picking it up to have built up and then just drop on my bottom end. Would save some time

[A4ringedONE8T]

Obviously you mean the pic whoring! [:D]

Just kidding Shawn, the more pics the merrier!

Of course, pic whoring FTW (at least it will all be in the same thread hence the reason I started this [:)])

[A4ringedONE8T]

Need some more opinions, talked to a few people about fueling. 550's are not big enough to fuel a 3071R on high boost once my motor is done. Genesis then jumps up to 750's which are too big. Any suggestions on injectors? Greg recommended some 630's or slightly bigger from Bosch Motorsports, but I havent been able to get ahold of Scott to see whats available.

Maybe a 3.5" MAF is the answer as the injector ratio will be easier to keep constant with the 25% adjustability by the ECU

[dirtybrd]

I have a RS4 3.5 MAF also, 100 miles on it.

[A4ringedONE8T]

hmmm, how much?

[Don Supreme]

630 will be 100% fine for the 3071... Shoot, I run 630s @ 4 bar (probably works out to 715 or less) on my setup...

but I want to upgrade to 870s.....

AEB and or cams FTW plus you live in FL!............ More flow won't hurt..... Less boost, more power.

VVT in AEB is pretty common on the VW side.


How do big injectors run on the b6 fuel system though?

[mtbrider]

Are you going to upgrade your fuel pump or have you already?

[A4ringedONE8T]

Just got off the phone with Scott, always a pleasure to work with him!! We decided to stick with the 550's for now, they should easily get me to the 380-400whp mark and maybe a bit over with the water/meth. My only other option was Seimens 630's and I really didnt want to go back to the single spray cone after dealing with the Greentop 440's. He said they are most definitely better than Greentops as the spray cone is much wider but I still feel more comfortable with the Genesis injectors. I guess I will push these as much as possible and if they fall short I will have to upgrade again!

[A4ringedONE8T]

Are you going to upgrade your fuel pump or have you already?

Not yet, that will happen with the motor build. What fuel pump works with the returnless system?

[mtbrider]

greg is running a bosch motorsport fuel pump, i cant remember the numeric for it, 044 i think

[A4ringedONE8T]

I remember someone posting a link to one but couldnt find it with a search, if anyone knows what pump works in the B6, post up!

[mtbrider]

I think i might be wrong, It might be the walbro 255, man i'm too young to be this forgetful

[A4ringedONE8T]

haha I know

Just talked with Scott again, it is a Bosch Motorsports 044 Pump

http://www.usrallyteam.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=10_45&products_id=124

In addition there is a fitting kit that is needed for the B6 ~ $175

[Don Supreme]

I run the 044 pump..... sounds like a jet muwhahaha...

630 idle like butter. I had greentops and they (630s) are better.

[dirtybrd]

I paid $100 for the MAF, so I'd like to break even. Stock pump w/95k and no FP loss.I love my 630s. No issues. I'm running them @89.7% I believe on 22psi, I'm sure I'll have plenty of fuel when I go meth and 32psi. That'll for sure be 400whp, if not...maybe after cams.

[A4ringedONE8T]

You have Siemens 630's?

[A4ringedONE8T]

Just ordered this:

http://treadstoneperformance.com/product.phtml?p=319&cat_key=10&prodname=Silicone+Hose+1%22+T+Adapters

Was thinking about the TIP and questioning how to get everything connected. So my plan is to use the 4" to 3" elbow out of the turbo and straight down towards the ground. Then this T piece with the DV return as well as the two vac connections I need. Then the MAF and the filter right on the MAF

I think Ive got everything now to be "bolt on," ahead of the game as well now that the injectors are on there way!

[wrench]

[400HPA4]

haha I know

Just talked with Scott again, it is a Bosch Motorsports 044 Pump

http://www.usrallyteam.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=10_45&products_id=124

In addition there is a fitting kit that is needed for the B6 ~ $175


It is no big secret...I posted these up for sale about a year and one half ago when I installed mine (which I purchased from USRT).

[A4ringedONE8T]

It is no big secret...I posted these up for sale about a year and one half ago when I installed mine (which I purchased from USRT).

I know its not a secret just couldnt find the link or what it was with a search

[Don Supreme]

I paid $100 for the MAF, so I'd like to break even. Stock pump w/95k and no FP loss.I love my 630s. No issues. I'm running them @89.7% I believe on 22psi, I'm sure I'll have plenty of fuel when I go meth and 32psi. That'll for sure be 400whp, if not...maybe after cams.

Blah!

If you are already running @ 90% you are past the recommended limit...

Obviously you will be running high octance fuel @ 32 psi, but @ 90 - 100 percent the injector is not only past giving you any safety margin, but is just like a open garden hose......... you want the pulse, not the continous flow.

[Greg@DTH]

What he is saying is that he has them tuned back with lemmiwinks...not the duty cycle.

[Silence]

Siemens 630's are awesome injectors. Don't even compare to green tops. I have six of them and they idle and coldstart awesome.

[dirtybrd]

You have Siemens 630's?

Yes. They have a very wide single spray. Idle is perfect.

Blah!

If you are already running @ 90% you are past the recommended limit...

Obviously you will be running high octance fuel @ 32 psi, but @ 90 - 100 percent the injector is not only past giving you any safety margin, but is just like a open garden hose......... you want the pulse, not the continous flow.

I'll be running 32psi on meth. I'm after everyday, repeatable power. I will most likely never run race fuel. I don't care about how much it can make one or two times, thats just bragging rights. If I can make 400@the wheels on pump/meth, I'm pretty sure it'll do 430 on race.

[A4ringedONE8T]

Yes. They have a very wide single spray. Idle is perfect.


I'll be running 32psi on meth. I'm after everyday, repeatable power. I will most likely never run race fuel. I don't care about how much it can make one or two times, thats just bragging rights. If I can make 400@the wheels on pump/meth, I'm pretty sure it'll do 430 on race.

Lets see a dyno!!!! [up]

[dirtybrd]

I'll be spending alot more time tuning it after I get my income tax back. Meth. and I'm re-doing the exh. from the turbo back, maybe cams, then a few dyno pulls. I'll kick myself in the ass if I don't get 400.

[A4ringedONE8T]

As much as I hate to say it I think thats wishful thinking without a file for your exact setup!

And thanks everyone for the feedback on the 630's, like I said I already ordered the Genesis 550's so we will see how they do. Good thing about FWD is I can put down more power with less [:)]

[A4ringedONE8T]

Chris you still available to meet up tomorrow evening?

[dirtybrd]

We'll see, I'm being optimistic, even though I know better when it comes to power output. It's never what you think. And yes, call me. What time are you thinking. Are you working at the scuba shop tomorrow?

[A4ringedONE8T]

Yea Ill be at the shop till 6, I can be in Lakeland around 7. Another question, how long does it take for the tails tint to dry?

[mtbrider]

Everyones set-ups seem pretty badass, I can't wait to get mine up and running

[A4ringedONE8T]

Everyones set-ups seem pretty badass, I can't wait to get mine up and running

I know and what I like about the BAT setups is no ones are the same. Unlike all Elim's, 3+, ... they are all a crap shoot as to who has 5 more hp

With our new setups, it will really show who has their tuning/tweaks figured out and what hardware steps up to the plate and puts down power!

Very curious to start seeing dyno's, Chris's, Winston's, and mine. Very interested to see how high we can push. Also curious to see how this turbo does on the 1.8l and how far I can push on stock bottom end. Almost to the point where I dont care if it blows, as I get closer to my build date, I might just push it and see what happens [drive]

[dirtybrd]

Maybe I'll run over there during the day. As for tint, it takes about 4-5 hours to do a set, that includes preping, tinting, wetsanding and buffing.

[mtbrider]

I might just push it and see what happens [drive]


I like that attitude..hopefully my smaller turbo will get some good numbers, we'll see soon

[A4ringedONE8T]

I like that attitude..hopefully my smaller turbo will get some good numbers, we'll see soon

Very interested to see what you do as well!

[mtbrider]

^^^soon, I think everyone will have their set-ups finished at about the same time, aside from winston who should be up and running this weekend

[A4ringedONE8T]

Maybe I'll run over there during the day. As for tint, it takes about 4-5 hours to do a set, that includes preping, tinting, wetsanding and buffing.

Id like to get a ride in your car if you dont mind, if you want to come closer to 6 or like I said I dont mind driving to Lakeland. Maybe we can get some GTRS vs 3071R runs (as long as your not on stupid boost [:)])

And 4 pages in 2 days [eek] [:D]

[dirtybrd]

I run on 22psi daily, but I might have to juice up a bit more...just to be safe.[:D] Just call me. Maybe we'll meet halfway in Plant City.

[mtbrider]

i wish i lived in florida, good thing i have property in west palm

[A4ringedONE8T]

I run on 22psi daily, but I might have to juice up a bit more...just to be safe.[:D] Just call me. Maybe we'll meet halfway in Plant City.

Will do and just to be safe? 2.0l 3071R vs a GTRS ... you think my FWD has that much DT advantage [:D] I guarantee it will still suprise you though!

[A4ringedONE8T]

i wish i lived in florida, good thing i have property in west palm

Come on down, Ive got a spare room [:)]

[dirtybrd]

We'll just have to wait and see. Is it cool for one Audi to beat another? Isn't that cannibalism?

[A4ringedONE8T]

We'll just have to wait and see. Is it cool for one Audi to beat another? Isn't that cannibalism?

Ive already been beat by another Audi (the RS4) so it wont be the first time. I promise you I will be closer than you think though [drive]

[mtbrider]

haha, i might have to take you up on that offer shawn

[A4ringedONE8T]

And damn I want my stuff

Shipping updates:

ATP Stuff Jan 2nd, Injectors Dec 28th, DV T piece Dec 28th, already got my long blue thingy [:D]

[dirtybrd]

I was more worried about myself.

[A4ringedONE8T]

haha, i might have to take you up on that offer shawn

As long as you stay away from my Finacee your welcome to come down [;)]

[A4ringedONE8T]

I was more worried about myself.

O come on, if I were in your shoes and lost to a GTRS, I think I would drive directly to Tampa Bay .... and leave my car in the middle of it [:D]

[mtbrider]

And damn I want my stuff

Shipping updates:

ATP Stuff Jan 2nd, Injectors Dec 28th, DV T piece Dec 28th, already got my long blue thingy [:D]

I hear you on that, I got stuff coming from CA as well and with x-mas next week it is going to be delayed as well

[A4ringedONE8T]

Yes the Holidays suck, I dont see why Fedex and UPS shouldnt work on Xmas and New Years, whats the big deal? lol

[mtbrider]

As long as you stay away from my Finacee your welcome to come down [;)]


I promise, my girl would kick my ass and then beat on my car

[dirtybrd]

O come on, if I were in your shoes and lost to a GTRS, I think I would drive directly to Tampa Bay .... and leave my car in the middle of it [:D]

I've never ridden in one, so I have nothing to compare too. The only car I "really" raced is a buddies 300zxtt. Full exh., frt. mount @ about 18psi. It's always a drivers race. Also, don't expect a show car. It has 95k on it and and shows it, plus I got rushed on the DP, etc. so it's not pretty.

[A4ringedONE8T]

I promise, my girl would kick my ass and then beat on my car

LMAO, bring her with you, sure she wouldnt mind the FL sun. Thatll give us more time to mess with the cars and they can go shopping

[A4ringedONE8T]

I've never ridden in one, so I have nothing to compare too. The only car I "really" raced is a buddies 300zxtt. Full exh., frt. mount @ about 18psi. It's always a drivers race.

The only reason I really want to run is to see what boost in your car is equal to mine, that should give me a basis of how to tune without having to go to the dyno at first

[mtbrider]

LMAO, bring her with you, sure she wouldnt mind the FL sun. Thatll give us more time to mess with the cars and they can go shopping


I might have to take you up on that sometime during the first week in March, we'll have all of our cars up and running by then and I'll have some time off, I'll keep you posted, but I'll work around your schedule of course, plus my girl will be in France so as far as I'm concerned I'm a free man!!

[AudiA4_20T]

Hey Shawn can I get in on this and bring the 2.0 K03 down? lol

[Don Supreme]

Damn... I wish I was in Sarasota, FL now. I was going to fly down on the 27th, but doesn't look that way... not a good time to make last minute vacation plans if you know what I mean.

Also, please don't blow the motor... The b6 motor will blow in a heart beat.

[AudiA4_20T]

Damn... I wish I was in Sarasota, FL now. I was going to fly down on the 27th, but doesn't look that way... not a good time to make last minute vacation plans if you know what I mean.

Also, please don't blow the motor... The b6 motor will blow in a heart beat.

Why are you up so late? Way to respond to my PM

[A4ringedONE8T]

Damn... I wish I was in Sarasota, FL now. I was going to fly down on the 27th, but doesn't look that way... not a good time to make last minute vacation plans if you know what I mean.

Also, please don't blow the motor... The b6 motor will blow in a heart beat.


Im not going to try but Im not going to cry if it happens. It should at least be in my mind with the turbo Im about to put on [;)]

[SinisterA4]

You are not doing any motor right away right? Are you just going to run a conservative tune instead?

[A4ringedONE8T]

You are not doing any motor right away right? Are you just going to run a conservative tune instead?

Motor comes out in April, Ill be on stock bottom end until then. And yes going to run conservative. Even after the build Im not looking for a ton of power, I just wanted a change and wanted to do something different as far as turbo setups go. On stock stock bottom end Ill probably get it tweaked out at 315whp on pump which should be around 18psi. After the build I would like to get it around 350whp on pump and at least one 400+ pull on a dyno

[A4ringedONE8T]

Alright, biggest decision since ordering the stuff, I have an opportunity but need opinions!

Just got word, we have a certified VW tech (who is going to start working for our shop) who could help me put rods in my motor now.

Is it worthwhile to pick up a set of IE rods and put them in my block now with everything else OEM?? (Obviously still with the plan to do a complete build in 4-5 months) I know its about a 12-14 hour job for rod swap with the block in the car. Just wondering if its worth the time/effort and few extra dollars for the rods or should I just wait??

[dirtybrd]

It's better than scattering a motor. But then again, he could source you a Passat block from his work...sludge motors.

[A4ringedONE8T]

Another option (of course assuming a 1.8l spools this turbo like Im hoping) is to just put the rods in it now and just leave the bottom end. Then get a spare head and drop it on whenever I get it done. Any reason a bottom end with just IE rods wouldnt take 400whp or just slightly over and up to 8500rpm?

[A4ringedONE8T]

It's better than scattering a motor. But then again, he could source you a Passat block from his work...sludge motors.

Yea he works at Suncoast in Sarasota right now, Ill have to talk to him about that as well. We dont have 40hrs of work a week for him yet so he would stay busy doing my bottom end [:)]

[400HPA4]

You've gotta remove the heads to change the rods, might as well do the valves and springs while you are at it.

Chris (dirtybrd) has experience with changing out the valves, not a fun task on the 20 valve head but it can be done.

[mtbrider]

seems like you might be getting your engine built afterall

[A4ringedONE8T]

You've gotta remove the heads to change the rods, might as well do the valves and springs while you are at it.

Chris (dirtybrd) has experience with changing out the valves, not a fun task on the 20 valve head but it can be done.

I know but I dont have infinite money right now, new business + new BT project = not a ton of spare money. 2k for a head job (lol) is not in the budget right now. At least this gives me access to someone who I know can do my motor build correctly and within my view, also has access to all the tools he needs from the dealer. Only thing I need is a motor shop to do any machine work.

So Im staying cheap if I touch the motor right now, drop the rods in for less than 300 bucks or leave it alone

[400HPA4]

Sell your wheels

[A4ringedONE8T]

BTW did I mention that he drives a 600hp R32 that he built all himself, made a tubular mani and everything. This is the guy that we planned to have in the shop right around when I was going to pull my motor. Also the source for my tubular mani and everything else. Looks like he is joining us earlier than expected though [:D]

[A4ringedONE8T]

Sell your wheels

And lose my ass ... I was thinking about getting something different but definitely not something cheaper

[400HPA4]

There are plenty of people on here that will offer $2500

[A4ringedONE8T]

There are plenty of people on here that will offer $2500

haha LMAO, and for that they can have 2 [:D]

[400HPA4]

At $2500 for two you would still lose your ass...

[A4ringedONE8T]

At $2500 for two you would still lose your ass...

Good point [headbang] Glad that expense is over!

[A4ringedONE8T]

My GTRS has a new owner and will be making its way into a B5 Avant!! [:)]

[Hamann]

damn, that was a 20 minute read. Good luck Shawn...and, I'll be selling my wheels for $2500 soon enough...

[A4ringedONE8T]

damn, that was a 20 minute read. Good luck Shawn...and, I'll be selling my wheels for $2500 soon enough...

Getting a new car already?

[Greg@DTH]

Is it done yet?

[A4ringedONE8T]

Is it done yet?

I gotta have the stuff first, wont be here till the 2nd

[Hamann]

Getting a new car already?


nah...not yet. just not sure how long I'll keep the HRE's...

[A4ringedONE8T]

nah...not yet. just not sure how long I'll keep the HRE's...

Why'd you buy them then lol

[SinisterA4]

I'm glad that someone bought your kit, Shawn. Now that helps you not only with the car budget but the business budget as well.

[A4ringedONE8T]

I know, I was really surprised no one had jumped on it yet!!

Bump for what I still have for sale:

Carbonio V2, ER Testpipe, Genesis 430cc Injectors (http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php?t=178865)

Neuspeed Xtreme TIP (http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php?t=177198)

[Hamann]

Why'd you buy them then lol

I love them, don't get me wrong. At the same time, I get terribly bored and wouldnt mind another A4 early next year. Probably an 06, under 20k miles...would these fit? Haven't even researched the bolt pattern...if so, would just swap out the wheels and koni's...maybe exhaust too?

[A4ringedONE8T]

Wheels would swap as long as they clear the brakes, Coils will fit, exhaust wont

[1-CLEAN-A4]

bump for fellow seller

[A4ringedONE8T]

Nice meeting you today Chris, riding in your car makes me want my new setup even more!!! [hail]

Anyone that hasnt been in a 30 series or bigger turbo'd A4, your missing out!!!! [drive]

[A4ringedONE8T]

O yea, and IE rods are enroute, no way I can live with 20psi on this turbo for more than a week [:D]

[dirtybrd]

You too. Let me know if you need any help, but I doubt it. You seem to have everything under control. It'll be nice, you can go 30psi right out of the box.

[A4ringedONE8T]

Well the rods will follow by a few weeks, I would rather get everything running correctly before I get power crazy [:)]

[dirtybrd]

I was thinking on the way home, why don't you just fully build a different motor, overtime, and as money allows and then just put it in the car? I'm sure your buddy could get you a block, then get a crank, then pistons, etc. You could put it together over the next 3-4 months and the girl will never know. That way you save a bit of money, downtime and it'll be the way you want it and not adding this and adding that. If I had the money and was going to build a motor, that's how I'd do it. See what Winston wants for his motor. Shipping is only about $120. Page 6 FTW!!!!!

[mtbrider]

sick Shawn, I had a feeling you would get everything built soon

[A4ringedONE8T]

I was thinking on the way home, why don't you just fully build a different motor, overtime, and as money allows and then just put it in the car? I'm sure your buddy could get you a block, then get a crank, then pistons, etc. You could put it together over the next 3-4 months and the girl will never know. That way you save a bit of money, downtime and it'll be the way you want it and not adding this and adding that. If I had the money and was going to build a motor, that's how I'd do it. See what Winston wants for his motor. Shipping is only about $120. Page 6 FTW!!!!!

I havent talked to him at all about it really, mentioned it to my partner in the company and he said that if I got the rods, he would do it. We are paying him salary so better to keep him busy even if its on one of our own cars. I will bring it up to him next time I see him. See if he can get the spare parts from the dealer as well. I should have just bought yours when I had the chance [headbang]

But your right, it would be nice to have a running car and a complete motor I could work on in the garage as time and money allows. This would also give ME a chance to do it all, might be a good learning experience. [wrench]

And my finacee doesnt have much to say now that I own half of this shop, whenever she has said anything recently, I just tell her Im doing it for the shop to get more attention to the business [:D] Havent lost an arguement yet!!!

[dirtybrd]

I personally think its the way to go. In and out in a weekend. Plus it's a tax write off! I'm sure you buddy has access to a sludge block

[A4ringedONE8T]

I personally think its the way to go. In and out in a weekend. Plus it's a tax write off! I'm sure you buddy has access to a sludge block

Thats exactly what I was thinking!

[dirtybrd]

It'll end up being sweeter if you do it this way! Plus...you won't be fucking up my glory so soon![:D]

[mtbrider]

Do it Shawn, just write it off and tell your girl its a business thing like you said, you'll be happier in the end.

[dirtybrd]

He's not posting right now...he's calling his VW/Audi buddy!

[A4ringedONE8T]

haha, actually trying to do some stuff with the carputer so its ready for what I need it to do with the new setup. Computers are bad enough when they are stationary in your house/office. Mobile desktop thats is 1/100 the size = [headbang]

Who wants a carputer? Its really pissing me off right now!! [:(]

[/leaves to bust out the Alcohol]

[winston@podi.ca]

If you can get a guy to do the rods for cheap then get it done as your lead foot won't handle being held back.

But I would suggest sourcing a spare block, build the engine once and build it right, install it and forget about worrying if it will grenade on you.

When I sit behind the wheel the last thing I am worried about now is blowing up the bottom end.

Peace of mind is worth the $$$

[dirtybrd]

What are you doing with your old motor?

[winston@podi.ca]

I'm holding onto it as insurance until the new engine breaks in and Murphy and his stupid Law decides to take a vacation.

After that it will be on the move to a new owner.

[dirtybrd]

You'll be fine.

[A4ringedONE8T]

I'm holding onto it as insurance until the new engine breaks in and Murphy and his stupid Law decides to take a vacation.

After that it will be on the move to a new owner.

When will that be?

[winston@podi.ca]

When?

Next year! [:D]

[A4ringedONE8T]

When?

Next year! [:D]

Alright, talk to you next week [:D]

[A4ringedONE8T]

Chris, what tweaks did you have to make with lemmi other than correcting for the bigger injectors and MAF. If Im running on stock MAF and 430's to start, I shouldnt have to touch anything correct? What about timing?

[Don Supreme]

stock tiny maf feeding a 4" inlet ..hmmm?

[A4ringedONE8T]

stock tiny maf feeding a 4" inlet ..hmmm?

Obviously you didnt read my first post in this thread. Ive got a 3" MAF housing and 550's, and also access to an RS4 3.5" MAF if I want it.

I want to get the car running on each level and make note of any tweaks needed for anyone that may do this in the future that doesnt want to have to mess with it. My plan is stock MAF and 430's, get it running correctly and all the tweaks noted. Then switch to the 550's and 3" MAF, again get it tuned correctly and any lemmi tweaks needed recorded for future reference. From there hopefully my motor will be done or at least the bottom end and I will do whatever works best for MAF and injectors to get over 400whp

[A4ringedONE8T]

[Thinking out loud]

Since Im stuck at work today really looking into all the motor components, heres my thinking (for today [:D])

I think I might just put in some IE rods right now. I wont have to worry about popping the motor if I get boost happy and really for what my power plans are (400 or a little over on race gas) those rods are more than sufficient in the bottom end. Also, this would give me extra money to put into the head sooner which I think has more of hidden gain than going any further with the bottom end. In order to get new pistons in the bottom end, Im looking at 600 or so for the pistons plus that much in machine work. Really what for, what is that going to do BETTER than just the IE rods? If I was planning on going up to 500whp or near it, ok, but for 400-425, is there really a reason? With that money saved on the pistons/block machine work, the head could be half rebuilt. This also brings me to a question, while the IE rods are good for planned HP range, what is there limit on RPM? Obviously a 8500rpm head isnt worth anything if the rods arent strong enough for it. Again, just thinking out loud, any comments welcome!!

[Greg@DTH]

I think this is an incredible idea...you should not have an issue spinning them to 8,000 rpms.

[mtbrider]

Yeah Shawn, with you running a 30 series turbo, head work is really going to help you out, especially if you stay 1.8

[A4ringedONE8T]

Yeah Shawn, with you running a 30 series turbo, head work is really going to help you out, especially if you stay 1.8

Chris's 2.0 with the .86a/r 3071 was incredibly responsive IMO. I think my GTRS feels more laggy than his car. With the .63 a/r on my 3071R, I think spool will be fine on the 1.8. My only justification right now for going any further with the bottom end is if I decide I want to go up in displacement. If the spool is acceptable with the 1.8, IE rods it is and onto the head!

[A4ringedONE8T]

Anything else needed (upgraded for the bottom end) while Im in there? Bearings or anything?

[Greg@DTH]

APR main studs [:)] Your bearings should be fine.

[A4ringedONE8T]

APR main studs [:)] Your bearings should be fine.

Do I have to wait 2 weeks to get those? [:D] So ARP main studs ... please tell me what that is, motor build noob, sorry [:(]

[A4ringedONE8T]

And my bearings as in reuse them or get new OEM ones?

[A4ringedONE8T]

Got a few more pieces [:D] ... which means more pics!

As usual Scott @ USRT is as helpful as can be with fueling!! Genesis 550's with the new adaptors

http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b156/a4ringedone8t/My%20Car/DSC02014.jpg

3" MAF housing from Chris (dirtybrd)

http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b156/a4ringedone8t/My%20Car/DSC02015.jpg

[Don Supreme]

If you think walking through the maf setups is worth it then by all means go ahead...

Without supporting mods a bigger turbo is hardly worth it.... Speaking from experience I ran my 35r with a 3" od (vr6) maf for a while. I eventually opened it up to full 4" and the difference was significant......

P.S. I am all about the head work. If I could afford 2.0 + headwork I would do that, but I decided to stay 1.8 and go buck wild on the head.

I plan on starting my head work around march +- and I am hoping to pick up an additional 100CHP over my current power level....

[A4ringedONE8T]

If you think walking through the maf setups is worth it then by all means go ahead...

Without supporting mods a bigger turbo is hardly worth it.... Speaking from experience I ran my 35r with a 3" od (vr6) maf for a while. I eventually opened it up to full 4" and the difference was significant......

P.S. I am all about the head work. If I could afford 2.0 + headwork I would do that, but I decided to stay 1.8 and go buck wild on the head.

I plan on starting my head work around march +- and I am hoping to pick up an additional 100CHP over my current power level....

Everything Ive ordered so far is paid for, I hate using CC's for anything. As soon as I sell my testpipe, Carbonio, injectors, and TIP that money is paying for the IE rods as well as a few head components. Been talking with Scott about building up a head for me. Think Ive got everything squared away except for cams. I think I might try a set of Euro cams from the 190hp A4, I guess they are a tad more aggressive. Since Im sticking with the 1.8 bottom end and just putting the rods in, hopefully I can get the head done by April, May at the lastest. Just depends on how much money Ive got to keep putting into my new shop.

The MAF changes really doesnt bother me as I cant get anywhere close to the max of this turbo until I get the rods in anyways. Good to have something to tinker with until that time comes!

[Saturnine]

Is it the 2nd yet?

[Don Supreme]

What exactly do you plan on doing to the head?

[A4ringedONE8T]

Is it the 2nd yet?

No [:(]

[A4ringedONE8T]

What exactly do you plan on doing to the head?

Port and polish, oversized valves, titanium springs and retainers, ported intake runners and an AEB intake mani, and most likely the Euro cams

[Don Supreme]

Blah on the euro cams, gets some cat cams.

[A4ringedONE8T]

Blah on the euro cams, gets some cat cams.

The recalled ones [rolleyes]

[Don Supreme]

^ no..........

There is a fix.

[A4ringedONE8T]

^ no..........

There is a fix.

And whats that?

[AudiA4_20T]

The recalled ones [rolleyes]

FYI BobQ has a fix for the cams as well as a few new kinds... those euro cams are a big waste of money. Listen to Sean (Don Supreme) he has done a ton of research on everything

Also, when spending 11 hours doing rods youre gonna want new bearings and things so add another 400 or so.. I would do it all at once because doing it twice is dumb IMO

[A4ringedONE8T]

FYI BobQ has a fix for the cams as well as a few new kinds... those euro cams are a big waste of money. Listen to Sean (Don Supreme) he has done a ton of research on everything

Also, when spending 11 hours doing rods youre gonna want new bearings and things so add another 400 or so.. I would do it all at once because doing it twice is dumb IMO

Bearings are 100 bucks, whats the other 300?

[Don Supreme]

FYI BobQ has a fix for the cams as well as a few new kinds... those euro cams are a big waste of money. Listen to Sean (Don Supreme) he has done a ton of research on everything

Also, when spending 11 hours doing rods youre gonna want new bearings and things so add another 400 or so.. I would do it all at once because doing it twice is dumb IMO

Thanks Clint.

Shawn is doing research on things that I have already done and things I have researched to death, but he doesn't want to listen to my advice.... oh well.

[A4ringedONE8T]

Thanks Clint.

Shawn is doing research on things that I have already done and things I have researched to death, but he doesn't want to listen to my advice.... oh well.

What am I not listening to?

[A4ringedONE8T]

And also, why do everything like everyone else, the point of doing this setup was to be different and try new things. I know this has all been done in the B5 but not in a B6. The reason I choose ATP was because it was more budget friendly and I would like to either prove it sucks or that its a great more affordable option which can still make power! There are plenty of people who are ready for bigger turbo's and more power, more than a GTRS or APR 3+ can ever give. Unfortunately there are tubular mani kits popping up all over the place but tell me where to buy one [rolleyes]. I would love any guidance people can give me but no matter who says it, Im still going to put my research and input into it before doing it! I would like to figure out each "stage" of this new setup rather than throwing everything together at once. I dont want a setup like everyone else has, I want something different that can be just as effective. While Im not cheap, a more budget friendly BAT setup would greatly influence the tuning scene IMO. If I can get a cheaper setup running and making power, as well have various stages for it, I think it can be a great attention getter to my new shop and perhaps bring us some business! I have a reason for what I do, my ATP choice was for a very specific reason as well as my head build will be!

[AudiA4_20T]

Bearings are 100 bucks, whats the other 300?

- rod bearings
- main bearings
- front seal
- rear seal
- main bolts
- head bolts
- head gasket
- timing belt
- water pump
- oil pump

thats what Im doing and it gets up there

[Don Supreme]

Here is the problem with ATP.... There 'ish doesn't fit and is generally a PITA to install.

I know everyone wants to be a pioneer with B6s, but the only difference is your returnless fuel system.

You want to be unique, but why not build smart at the same time. You don't have to run what everyone else is running, but why run shit that IS KNOWN not to work or work well.....?

Luckily, Greg has provided you with a fix for the flaw in the turbo to manifold design.

I am sure your setup will work. I am interested to see your results. You should hit 350 FWHP pretty easily, but getting to 400 is going to be a challenge.

In fact, I dare say hitting a reliable 400 fwhp on pump gas will push the cost past your nominal cost goal (due to recommended headwork).

[AudiA4_20T]

Here is the problem with ATP.... There 'ish doesn't fit and is generally a PITA to install.

I know everyone wants be a pioneer with B6s, but the only difference is your returnless fuel system.

You want to be unique, but why not be smart at the same time. You don't have to run what everyone else is running, but why run shit that IS KNOWN not to work or work well.....?

Luckily, Greg has provided you with a fix for the flaw in the turbo to manifold design.

Sean, I think since he has a hookup with ATP he wants to do it cheap with them first and eventually upgrade to a tubular mani, etc etc when he gets the motor built

[dirtybrd]

Here is the problem with ATP.... There 'ish doesn't fit and is generally a PITA to install.

I know everyone wants to be a pioneer with B6s, but the only difference is your returnless fuel system.

You want to be unique, but why not build smart at the same time. You don't have to run what everyone else is running, but why run shit that IS KNOWN not to work or work well.....?

Luckily, Greg has provided you with a fix for the flaw in the turbo to manifold design.

I am sure your setup will work. I am interested to see your results. You should hit 350 FWHP pretty easily, but getting to 400 is going to be a challenge.

In fact, I dare say hitting a reliable 400 fwhp on pump gas will push the cost past your nominal cost goal (due to recommended headwork).

I call BS. I'm not one to brag, so I won't. But, with WI, cams and on 30-32psi, my car will most likely hit 400awhp. Money is the only thing holding me back, the returnless fuel system has not been an issue as everyone thought. I heard many statements about this a year ago when I said I was putting 630cc injs. and was going outside the box with a GT30. Fuck the nah sayers, I did it and it works. Plus I know that Gregs car put down 350awhp with a 28 series on a stock motor, so why wouldn't someone be able to do 400whp/awhp on a modded motor and 30 series?

[AudiA4_20T]

Yea Sean I agree with Shawn on this one, 400whp is easily done with FWD cars on a 3071R

[A4ringedONE8T]

Yea Sean I agree with Shawn on this one, 400whp is easily done with FWD cars on a 3071R

Thank you sir! [up]

Ill bet money I get close to if not at 400whp on pump with the meth with JUST drop in rods! Same bottom end with the head that my car is going to get I will hopefully get to 450 if not over on race gas before Im done!!

As Clint said, I got a great deal on everything ATP hence the reason Im doing it. Even at retail, it is much less than any of the tubular setups the B6 guys are running ... AND STILL not putting down any power. Chris is the closest to hitting the 400whp mark and I have no doubt he will do it very very soon!

Eventually and probably at the time of my head build the ATP mani and downpipe will be gone and my own tubular mani will take its place [wrench]

[AudiA4_20T]

Thank you sir! [up]

Ill bet money I get close to if not at 400whp on pump with the meth with JUST drop in rods! Same bottom end with the head that my car is going to get I will hopefully get to 450 if not over on race gas before Im done!!

As Clint said, I got a great deal on everything ATP hence the reason Im doing it. Even at retail, it is much less than any of the tubular setups the B6 guys are running ... AND STILL not putting down any power. Chris is the closest to hitting the 400whp mark and I have no doubt he will do it very very soon!

Eventually and probably at the time of my head build the ATP mani and downpipe will be gone and my own tubular mani will take its place [wrench]

Hey Shawn soon enough, 400awhp on pump gas is going to be fun [cool]

[A4ringedONE8T]

Hey Shawn soon enough, 400awhp on pump gas is going to be fun [cool]

Cant wait to see the results of your build! Get that thing done and a big turbo bolted to it!!!

[Don Supreme]

I call BS. I'm not one to brag, so I won't. But, with WI, cams and on 30-32psi, my car will most likely hit 400awhp. Money is the only thing holding me back, the returnless fuel system has not been an issue as everyone thought. I heard many statements about this a year ago when I said I was putting 630cc injs. and was going outside the box with a GT30. Fuck the nah sayers, I did it and it works. Plus I know that Gregs car put down 350awhp with a 28 series on a stock motor, so why wouldn't someone be able to do 400whp/awhp on a modded motor and 30 series?

Seriously, 32 psi dude?

I don't exactly call that reasonable boost for everyday driving.

[A4ringedONE8T]

Seriously, 32 psi dude?

I don't exactly call that reasonable boost for everyday driving.

If the motor is built for it why not? I know a few guys that DD 900-1,000whp Supra's that run boat loads of boost everyday. If the car takes it whats the problem??

[dirtybrd]

I going for everyday power, thats what the WI is for. Pump gas power. I have the motor for it just need money. This thing already cost me about 8k and I have a baby on the way. Oh and its a girl. We just found out yesterday!

[Don Supreme]

Yea Sean I agree with Shawn on this one, 400whp is easily done with FWD cars on a 3071R

I have seen tons of 3071 dynos on gtis and guess what, I can only think of one past 400 FWHP and that was on race gas.


I know the 3071 can put down 400 to the ground, but to use the term EASY is simply mis-leading. We don't have SRT4s here.

[A4ringedONE8T]

I going for everyday power, thats what the WI is for. Pump gas power. I have the motor for it just need money. This thing already cost me about 8k and I have a baby on the way. Oh and its a girl. We just found out yesterday!

Congrats [up]

[Greg@DTH]

Is it done yet?

[dirtybrd]

I have seen tons of 3071 dynos on gtis and guess what, I can only think of one past 400 FWHP and that was on race gas.


I know the 3071 can put down 400 to the ground, but to use the term EASY is simply mis-leading. We don't have SRT4s here.

But I didn't build those cars.

[A4ringedONE8T]

I have seen tons of 3071 dynos on gtis and guess what, I can only think of one past 400 FWHP and that was on race gas.


I know the 3071 can put down 400 to the ground, but to use the term EASY is simply mis-leading. We don't have SRT4s here.

I did 300 with the GTRS, 23psi with a POS leaking DV. That was on pump settings and meth, nothing special. I know my car is around 315 now on those same settings. Im sure I could get around 340 on race gas with alot of timing. Theres no reason with 8-10lbs more boost on a 30 series turbo that I wont be knocking on the 400whp mark. If I can run 350-360whp daily that is all I care to do. My car will never put down 400+ whp on the road because it would be absolutely useless. Anything close to 400 or over will be strictly for a number and to say I did it

[A4ringedONE8T]

Is it done yet?

Is it the 2nd? [:)]

[Greg@DTH]

I have seen tons of 3071 dynos on gtis and guess what, I can only think of one past 400 FWHP and that was on race gas.


I know the 3071 can put down 400 to the ground, but to use the term EASY is simply mis-leading. We don't have SRT4s here.

ATP's T-28 flanged 30-71WG made 400AWHP on shitty Mika tuning, motor was a built 2 litler on a B5A4...

On the B6 it made about 350AWHP.

[dirtybrd]

How long ago was that?

[A4ringedONE8T]

ATP's T-28 flanged 30-71WG made 400AWHP on shitty Mika tuning, motor was a built 2 litler on a B5A4...

On the B6 it made about 350AWHP.

I remember seeing a setup on ATP's site when I first got my car, believe it was a 3076R with a built motor did over 400whp in a B6. This was before the Elim's were even a thought

[Don Supreme]

If the motor is built for it why not? I know a few guys that DD 900-1,000whp Supra's that run boat loads of boost everyday. If the car takes it whats the problem??

You are talking about slapping in rods, how does it constitute a motor built for 32 psi day in and day out.

I am not even going to talk about 1000 AWHP Supras, because there is more to that story I am sure, They probably don't run @ 1000 on 93 octane or have a low boost and high boost setting. Additionally, those engines will not last 100K without a rebuild.

Mike Hood has more money in his engine than anyone on here and it has been rebuilt @ least 3 times and he doesn't even drive it everyday.

You have to remember @ lets say 475 CHP thats over 118 HP per cylinder; thats a lot of stress. This is especially compared to a 500 HP Z06 which is only 62.5 HP per cylinder.

Now couple that with high boost pressure which is probably pushing cylinder pressure to astronomical levels @ 32 psi........... dear god.

[dirtybrd]

What's your point?

[A4ringedONE8T]

You are talking about slapping in rods, how does it constitute a motor built for 32 psi day in and day out.

I am not even going to talk about 1000 AWHP Supras, because there is more to that story I am sure, They probably don't run @ 1000 on 93 octane or have a low boost and high boost setting. Additionally, those engines will not last 100K without a rebuild.

Mike Hood has more money in his engine than anyone on here and it has been rebuilt @ least 3 times and he doesn't even drive it everyday.

You have to remember @ lets say 475 CHP thats over 118 HP per cylinder; thats a lot of stress. This is especially compared to a 500 HP Z06 which is only 62.5 HP per cylinder.

Now couple that with high boost pressure which is probably pushing cylinder pressure to astronomical levels @ 32 psi........... dear god.

I was referring to Chris's motor as it is more than built for that boost level, as I said my car is going to get tweaked for about 350whp once the rods are in, anything higher than that is going to be on a dyno and thats it, I never plan or planned on running stupid boost everyday with a motor with only rods in it!

[Don Supreme]

Theres no reason with 8-10lbs more boost on a 30 series turbo that I wont be knocking on the 400whp mark. If I can run 350-360whp daily that is all I care to do. My car will never put down 400+ whp on the road because it would be absolutely useless. Anything close to 400 or over will be strictly for a number and to say I did it



In fact, I dare say hitting a reliable 400 fwhp on pump gas will push the cost past your nominal cost goal (due to recommended headwork).


What's your point?


My point is:
8 - 10psi + 23psi = Too much boost to be considered reliable.

P.S. Congrats on the baby girl.

[Greg@DTH]

I ran 30PSI for two years straight on a stock block...I now run 22PSI on an 71R eliminator (small turbo but it sure looks emissions legal).

Never tossed a rod yet. It is all about the tuning.

[A4ringedONE8T]

I ran 30PSI for two years straight on a stock block...I now run 22PSI on an 71R eliminator (small turbo but it sure looks emissions legal).

Never tossed a rod yet. It is all about the tuning.

I hope I have your luck! [hail]

[Greg@DTH]

FWIW a motor almost identical to Chris' (built by Eurocode) put down 402FWHP at last years ETGP.

Trust me, Chris' motor is built way stronger than that. The GTI made 402FWHP on the OEM ECM using APR Stage 3+++ programming (just a 28-71R .64).

I would not think twice about spinning Chris' motor to 10,000 if he built his head correctly.

[dirtybrd]

Motor= love!

[Greg@DTH]

I hope I have your luck! [hail]

It is not luck...

[A4ringedONE8T]

It is not luck...

Can you and David build me a head for a reasonable amount? If he has a core to do it up, when I put it on my car I will send him mine as a replacement.

[dirtybrd]

Yo know what would be cool, just build a head and dyno it before and after still on the GTRS. I'd like to see the difference just headwork does.

[Greg@DTH]

Can you and David build me a head for a reasonable amount? If he has a core to do it up, when I put it on my car I will send him mine as a replacement.

Shawn he should have a core and I am sure he will build one. I will call him right now and get the details for you.

Let me know up front...do you want to provide the parts and have them do the assembly or to you want David to source everything?

There is about 5 hours of labor installing the valves and what not ($400), it is not fun to do, Chris can vouch for that.

[dirtybrd]

My cheek can. It's like rebuilding an eng. through the tail pipe.

[Greg@DTH]

Yo know what would be cool, just build a head and dyno it before and after still on the GTRS. I'd like to see the difference just headwork does.

I'll probably do a head and IE rods in February. I am not going to change a thing with the turbo setup except add a HFC.

Maybe we will dyno before and after. I'll probably add a 100HP wet shot for the drags too.

[dirtybrd]

Damn, I thought you were done with your car. It seems like its been forever since you've done something to it. IEs, interesting.

[Greg@DTH]

I am done...sorta...

Tracee wants to hit up all of the track events this year. I will not be home but every other weekend so I need to make it turn key reliable for her (just add fuel, log the car and go).

I do not like other guys looking at my shit....

[dirtybrd]

That'd be the way to go then. How far are you going on the head?

[Greg@DTH]

Exhaust valves, springs and Schrick camshaft. I'll spin to 8K on spray.

[Don Supreme]

Shawn he should have a core and I am sure he will build one. I will call him right now and get the details for you.

Let me know up front...do you want to provide the parts and have them do the assembly or to you want David to source everything?

There is about 5 hours of labor installing the valves and what not ($400), it is not fun to do, Chris can vouch for that.

You will gain revs, but not power.
What about cams and P&P job?

[dirtybrd]

Why not meth?

[Don Supreme]

Exhaust valves, springs and Schrick camshaft. I'll spin to 8K on spray.

nice....

How much for the Schrick? I am shooting for 8K myself.... I really really need it.

[Greg@DTH]

You will gain revs, but not power.
What about cams and P&P job?

P&P is useless on FI. the turbo will stuff as much air in the cylinders as possible.

Fuel, Air and Ingnition = Power

[Greg@DTH]

nice....

How much for the Schrick? I am shooting for 8K myself.... I really really need it.

Probably a Kidney these days...the dollar to Euro sucks. The last set I bought was about $500.

I could see it being $800 easily now. The full kit prolly runs $1400 (used to be $1100)

[Don Supreme]

P&P is useless on FI. the turbo will stuff as much air in the cylinders as possible.

Fuel, Air and Ingnition = Power

Completely disagree here.....

P&P makes significant gains especially on FI. You think that a 80 CFM increase will not yield HP? Its all about flow, the more you can get in and get out the more power you will make.....The same reason you are getting cams....... Longer duration, more lift = more air in and more air out where it counts in the rev range.

Audi folks sleep on the head waaaaaay too much.


Probably a Kidney these days...the dollar to Euro sucks. The last set I bought was about $500.

I could see it being $800 easily now. The full kit prolly runs $1400 (used to be $1100)

indeed.

[zemun2]

Completely disagree here.....

P&P makes significant gains especially on FI. You think that a 80 CFM increase will not yield HP? Its all about flow, the more you can get in and get out the more power you will make.....The same reason you are getting cams....... Longer duration, more lift = more air in and more air out where it counts in the rev range.
I think what Greg ment to say is that by raising boost some 2-3 psi you can make same power as with p&p.
So save money and raise boost.
Or just buy bigger turbo, its sure cheaper then head work

[Greg@DTH]

There are 3 intake valves and 2 exhaust valves hardly any material to work with even if you wanted to port the intake side. Gasket matching is all I have done and it seems to be fine.

Flow increase will only help off boost and the motor will not make any power off boost anyways.

The only reason I am getting Shrick cams is to shift the powerband into the upper RPMs and open up the exhaust flow. Other than gasket matching and porting the exhaust manifold for increased flow (which I already have), there is no real work to be done to head.

Once you toss spray into the equation everything changes. Nitrous is an oxidizer, expands to pure volumetric efficiency and it also has cooling properties. Spray will take over where the 71R eliminator wears off.

Perfect for the long straights at Thunderhill or 4th gear at the QM.

[Don Supreme]

^ Yeah I have hard that argument too.....

Unfortunately, thats not an option for me. My turbo blows more air than my engine can ingest past 24 psi............... You should see my boost guage when I run 30 psi!!!

[Don Supreme]

There are 3 intake valves and 2 exhaust valves hardly any material to work with even if you wanted to port the intake side.

Oh yeah?
http://qedpower.com/index_files/image009.jpg
http://www.qedpower.com/qedDataII_files/image003.png

Keep in mind stock small port flows about 167CFM and stock AEB 200cfm on intake.

[Greg@DTH]

I respect what you have done...there are always many paths to the final destination. I will never run H20/Meth....

Race gas and soon to be Nitrous for me...

I always know when I want to go fast...I have no issue planning for it. It is very easy for me to either let my tank go empty by a Friday night ( to pump 5 gallons of MS109 in it from my handy dandy 54 gallon barrel in the garage) and then I drive down to Sunrise ave in CH if I want some fun.

Tracee knows what's up when we go to dinner...she can smell the fuel, feel the power as knows we are going to have a little stoplight to stoplight fun.

[GTMRS4]

Does anyone know if the GT3071R fits the APR Manifold?

[Greg@DTH]

The 30-71WG will if you get the T-2 flange on it. APR can tune for it as well. They will not do it unless you have a built bottom end though.

EuroCode did one for a customer that has a built 2.0L, puts down 350AWHP on pump gas, 8,000 RPM redline

[GTMRS4]

greg - can you get me more specific details and costs for this? Dave never called and if you got me an invoice that would be terrific.

[A4ringedONE8T]

Shawn he should have a core and I am sure he will build one. I will call him right now and get the details for you.

Let me know up front...do you want to provide the parts and have them do the assembly or to you want David to source everything?

There is about 5 hours of labor installing the valves and what not ($400), it is not fun to do, Chris can vouch for that.

If David will supply the parts and give them to me from wholesale, I will let him do and get everything. If not I can buy the parts myself, save some money, and send them to him. Remind him that as soon as I get get the new head, I will swap them and send him mine back complete. Thanks!! [hail]

[A4ringedONE8T]

greg - can you get me more specific details and costs for this? Dave never called and if you got me an invoice that would be terrific.

I just went over all of this with Lee (RXREP) a few days ago as well. Its very well possible and if you get the 3" inlet and 5 bolt flange, it will bolt up to everything else APR!

[Don Supreme]

You should try the pag parts special! It will bolt up and makes good power.

[A4ringedONE8T]

You should try the pag parts special! It will bolt up and makes good power.

???